It is for us the living, rather, to be dedicated here to the unfinished work which they who fought here have thus far so nobly advanced. It is rather for us to be here dedicated to the great task remaining before us — that from these honored dead we take increased devotion to that cause for which they gave the last full measure of devotion — that we here highly resolve that these dead shall not have died in vain — that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom — and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth.
Abraham Lincoln
November 19, 1863
Those who have died in service to the US from 29 May 2017 to 28 May 2018:
Private First Class Hanson B. Kirkpatrick
Specialist Christopher M. Harris
Technical Sergeant David Board
Specialist Allen Levi Stigler, Jr.
Sergeant Roshain Euvince Brooks
Staff Sergeant Aaron R. Butler
Specialist Alexander R. Missildine
Staff Sergeant Dustin M. Wright
Chief Warrant Officer Jacob M. Sims
Sergeant First Class Stephen B. Cribben
Chief Warrant Officer 2 Lee M. Smith
Sergeant First Class Hughton O. Brown
Sergeant First Class Mihail Golin
Sergeant Christina M. Schoenecker
Sergeant First Class Maitland D. Wilson
Ruckus
Adam, I read this as a 7 or 8 yr old and this part of this speech has stuck with me for most of my life. It took me a long time to understand that no one wants to go there, but sometimes that’s not your choice.
I also want to say that I know someone who deployed on Saturday.
Adam L Silverman
@Ruckus: Yep.
Patricia Kayden
May they all R.I.P.
Elizabelle
The soldier I will never forget from 2017-18 is Sgt. La David Johnson. I guess his little son or daughter has been born by now. Yes — baby girl La’Shee. From the Miami Herald: He died on duty in Niger. Miami Gardens wants to make sure he’s never forgotten.
Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/community/miami-dade/miami-gardens/article211930274.html#storylink=cpy
Jager
In ’93 my girlfriend and I were invited to her nephew’s wedding in Virginia, we flew down from Boston to DC on November 11th. We got our rental and I said let’s go to the Vietnam Memorial, before we check into our hotel. We drove to the monument, parked a few blocks away and walked over. It was around 9 at night. I’d never been, neither had she. It wasn’t crowded, but there were plenty of people there on a cool misty night. I found Roger’s brother’s name, a guy from my hometown, Cliff Cushman, an Olympian who was one of the first AF pilots killed. I found Johnson, Renteria, Lund, LaVoie, McDaniels and Martinez. It was peaceful, solemn and heartbreaking. The next day after the wedding, my girlfriend’s older brother, a retired Master Chief, talked and we decided to get drunk in our comrade’s memories at the reception. Nobody gave us any shit, none at all.
SiubhanDuinne
Always makes me cry. These words chill, and inspire. Thank you, Adam, for reminding us of the beautiful rhetoric and this profound message.
Damn.
oldgold
From Lincoln’s First Inaugural Address:
Joy in FL
Thank you, Adam, for posting names and the links.
Mike in NC
Important parts of our history that Donald Trump has never laid eyes on:
Declaration of Independence
Bill of Rights / United States Constitution
Gettysburg Address
Any memorable speech or statement from any prominent American patriot, living or dead (i.e., Eisenhower’s farewell address).
But he’s still steaming over not executing the Central Park 5 and denouncing our longtime allies and trading partners as moochers and losers.
“Happy” Memorial Day indeed to Putin’s poodle. Sad!
debbie
Just once I’d like to see a blank list.
guachi
These are not low ranking service members who died in the past year. Three Master Sergeants, two Air Force (E-7) and one Army (E-8). Five Staff Sergeants, two Air Force (E-5) and three Army (E-6). Four Sergeants First Class (Army E-7). Eight Sergeants (Army E-5). Two Warrant Officers, and three Officers.
Mary G
Of 33 people, 19 are Sargeants. Why such a high percentage? Do they do more dangerous work? I know a lot of Special Forces are Sargeants.
That might be the lowest number of deaths in my lifetime. Not sure, but not willing to look it up.
NJDave
Found on the electric Twitter machine today:
Executive Mansion,
Washington, Nov. 21, 1864.
Dear Madam,
I have been shown in the files of the War Department a statement of the Adjutant General of Massachusetts that you are the mother of five sons who have died gloriously on the field of battle.
I feel how weak and fruitless must be any word of mine which should attempt to beguile you from the grief of a loss so overwhelming. But I cannot refrain from tendering to you the consolation that may be found in the thanks of the Republic they died to save.
I pray that our Heavenly Father may assuage the anguish of your bereavement, and leave you only the cherished memory of the loved and lost, and the solemn pride that must be yours to have laid so costly a sacrifice upon the altar of Freedom.
Yours, very sincerely and respectfully,
A. Lincoln.
Cacti
You’d think that Memorial Day would be a little awkward for righties, now that they consider Germany the good guys of World War II.
Mr Stagger Lee
New York Times posted a story, that at the rate, burials are done at Arlington National Cemetery, the grounds will be completely filled, in 25 years, there is talk to limit burials do those who died in combat and awardees of the Medal of Honor.
raven
At least 2 of them were actually killed engaging an enemy.
Steve in the ATL
@debbie:
Damn straight!
ETA: formatting fail. Too tired to fix!
NotMax
Call it a quibble, but amending that to read:
have died in active military service
would be preferable. There’s a myriad of ways to provide service to the country.
JPL
@Steve in the ATL: So you return to soggy ATL.
I blame Betty Cracker
raven
@NotMax: whatever
raven
@JPL: It’s about to get a hell of a lot soggier. We had 2 big trees go down up the street this morning.
Mary G
Another general not happy with the president’s tweet today:
It’s really unusual for generals to do this, isn’t it?
Amir Khalid
@Mary G:
I think these were career soldiers, whose rank reflected their years of service.
hilts
@Mike in NC:
The only thing Trump gives a damn about is how he can profit from the presidency. Every person who voted for this putrid monstrosity deserves to burn in Hell for Eternity.
raven
@Mary G: (ret)
Ruckus
@Mary G:
People are staying in longer I think. Also the pay is not nearly as bad as it was 50 yrs ago. It’s not good mind you but better. The fellow I know who deployed on Saturday says he gets regular pay, combat pay and some sort of incentive pay based upon his MOS, if I remember correctly. There were 3 segments to his pay as he explained it, he’s an E3, up for promotion, and it was a lot better than I got as an E5 decades ago. A lot better. His living costs are nil, his pay is pretty good for his age/education. Of course he doesn’t have the same job/danger level he’d have working in the states. So what I’m betting is that some might be staying in for the money.
JPL
@Mary G: We live in strange times.
raven
Staff Sergeants are E-6’s and they are not “Senior NCO’s”.
mainmata
@NJDave: Was that the original inspiration for “Saving Private Ryan” since that was also about 5 sons (the last being saved at great cost in the movie))?
Villago Delenda Est
@oldgold: It was a profound mistake to consider the vanquished friends, because they never returned the sentiment. Instead, they became even more dedicated to their wrongness.
This mistake will not be repeated.
raven
@mainmata: Also the Sullivans.
Mr Stagger Lee
@hilts: I think it will be sickening to see an American Flag covering his casket when he assumes room temperature. Knowing the fool he will demand a Taj Mahal style tomb either in Manhattan or DC, I say make a Porta-Potty.
Mr Stagger Lee
@raven: IIRC the Sullivan Brothers where about to be seperated at the earliest moment, but the USS Juneau was sunk before that could happen.
gammyjill
I picked a couple of names in the list and was taken to an interesting website about these soldiers, their lives and their deaths. But also interesting is the list in the upper left corner of the page that lists the different battle phases and they have the worst names. “Operation Enduring Freedom” is one of the better ones…
Elizabelle
@Mr Stagger Lee: Since it’s such a prominent spot, I think they should severely limit burials in Arlington National, to save space for the future. It’s an incredible history lesson, and better it go on longer.
Also, I would support legislation that DJ Trump’s carcass, and those of his grifting family, never, never ever lie in those grounds. He demeans the place just by showing up.
FWIW, I guess John McCain will be there before too long?
Elizabelle the hypocrite, whose parents are already safely buried there
raven
@Mr Stagger Lee: Here’s a rock and roll song about them.
Villago Delenda Est
@raven: It’s second nature to you and me (and of course Adam and John, and all our vets here) to comprehend in an instant what rank is senior and what is not.
Lower ranking, E-1 to E-4. Privates, Privates First Class, Specialist 4s, and Corporals.
E-5 and E-6, Sergeants and Staff Sergeants, are low ranking NCOs, and junior leaders.
E-7 to E-9, Sergeants First Class, Master Sergeants, and Sergeants Major, are high ranking NCOs and perhaps the most important people in the Army.
Then you have idiot officers (such as myself) all the way through general officers. Warrant officers in-between and aside from, as they are essentially super specialized soldiers.
raven
@Villago Delenda Est: I made E-4 twice!!!
raven
Fucking frog choker knocked out my Dish feed, no game 7 for me!
opiejeanne
@Elizabelle: I thought burials in Arlington were already severely limited. I remember my dad musing about whether he could be buried there, back in the 80s and deciding a few years later that he wouldn’t qualify by the time he died because they were already discussing restrictions. Of course, the upside is that he lived to 94 and didn’t take his leave until 2012. He’s buried in a small cemetery in LA County, with Mom and near his parents.
Villago Delenda Est
@raven: One does not do this without some sort of story involved…
Adam L Silverman
@guachi: A couple of Special Forces/Special Ops teams. A couple of downed rotary wing aircraft. And that’s pretty much the total.
opiejeanne
@Elizabelle: Isn’t Poppy Bush back in the hospital? His and McCain’s funerals are two that I hope the tapeworm president is barred from attending, that he is succinctly disinvited.
SiubhanDuinne
@debbie:
Oh yes. Wouldn’t it be loverly?
raven
@Villago Delenda Est: I even made E-2 out of basic. I was E-4 in Korea when something about some 5kw generators got me a special and down to E-1. When I shipped to the Nam I got promoted back to E-4 but got busted for herb about 3 months in. I guess I actually made E-4 three times cuz that’s what I ETS’d as.
raven
@opiejeanne: Purple Heart gets you in.
Adam L Silverman
@Mary G: Special operators and US Army aviation personnel count for the bulk of those on the Army side – sergeants in the former group, aviators in the latter group. The couple of captains were US Air Force aviators. The remainder of NCOs were their flight crew and/or personnel they were transporting.
JPL
@Mr Stagger Lee: The fighting Sullivans. The first time I saw the movie, I was young but the horror of the family being notified has never left me.
randy khan
The Gettysburg Address is so perfect. Every sentence. It all connects, seamlessly, and it’s so profound. So beautiful and so sad. The perfect eulogy for the fallen.
Adam L Silverman
@raven: All four on the ODA in Niger.
Adam L Silverman
@Steve in the ATL: Fixed it for you.
raven
@Adam L Silverman: So 8 then?
Elizabelle
@opiejeanne: Here’s a PDF on options Arlington is considering.
The FTF NYTimes story, and it’s a good one: Arlington Cemetery, Nearly Full, May Become More Exclusive
To preserve space for future war heroes in the country’s premier national cemetery, the Army is considering new rules that would turn away many currently eligible veterans.
Elmo
@raven: My Dad used to say he made E-5 three times: twice from the bottom and once from the top.
He retired as an E-7, Navy Chief. Korea and Vietnam. He was a SAR swimmer and then an aircraft electrician.
Elizabelle
@opiejeanne: Yes. GHWBush will (eventually) be buried in Houston.
Tonight HBO is doing its documentary/hagiography on John McCain.
raven
@Elizabelle: I’m pretty sure that is for a grave, I think it’s easier to get in a columbarium there.
SiubhanDuinne
@opiejeanne:
Yes, he was admitted for low blood pressure, I think, over the weekend, at Kennebunkport. Poppy was in hospital for a couple of weeks in Houston, right after Bar died last month. I don’t mean to be ghoulish, and don’t at all like the traditional media Death Watch, but I’d be rather surprised if either GHWB or John McCain lives to see 2019, and, not to rush them along, but I have a sense that neither of them would be unhappy to go ahead and check out. In any case, it does my heart good to know that Tapeworm Prez is unwelcome at either service.
Adam L Silverman
@Mary G: Yes. And interestingly enough, GEN (ret) Dempsey, as the previous immediate Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, quietly put the word out among the retirees to be less political during the election. LTG (ret) Lynch’s behavior at the GOP convention and Gen (ret) Allen’s role at the Democratic one, though polar opposites in tone, bothered him. Since then, however, he has pretty forcefully, though politely, been one of the more leading public retired general officers/flag officers pushing back against the President. LTG Hertling, who was also a 1AD commander (when I was attached to a 1AD brigade) and retired from commanding US Army Europe (prior to my being temporarily assigned as their cultural advisor) has been exceedingly vocal. As has MG Eaton. What I find even more interesting is the polite, firm, nuanced pushback, often as subtweeting, by the actual Service Chiefs. Especially Gen. Goldfien the Air Force Chief of Staff.
I can’t prove it, but given his role as the Special Envoy for Middle East Peace and then as Special Envoy for the Coalition Against ISIS, I always reckoned that had Secretary Clinton won, that Gen (ret) Allen would have been named Secretary of State.
Adam L Silverman
@Ruckus: Base pay, danger pay, and hazard pay. So the base plus, if it’s the same as it was when I deployed to Iraq, 15% for danger and 15% for hazard.
raven
Here’s a couple of the Gold Star Mothers who were denied entry into Arlington in April,71.
randy khan
@opiejeanne:
It is limited, but among other things anybody who retires from military service is eligible.
kattails
My Dad’s ashes were interred at Arlington in 2004. He was a WWII vet, enlisted at 17, swore he only cut hair for military brass but I have his PT boat pin. He did come back but could not know that he would, nor could anyone going in.
I’d never been to Arlington before that. So many acres of graves, it is stunning in the sense of Oh dear God, no. I’m crying now remembering the deeply respectful ceremony given us by the honor guard. But Dad was in his 70’s and you (Adam) have listed people younger and it–what the hell am I trying to say? Dad made it through, he made it to old age, our ceremony was moving but so different than those of the ones you’ve listed who were torn away too soon from their lives. And those who are serving now, who have given up their lives to daily uncertainty in hopes that they can somehow protect my right to keep track of blogs like this, to buy cat food in peace, to paint and plant my little garden.
raven
@Adam L Silverman: “Danger Pay” damn. NIck Danger Third Eye!
Elmo
@raven: My Dad was fond of saying he made E-5 three times: twice from the bottom and once from the top.
He retired as an E-7, Navy Chief. Korea and Vietnam.
He was a SAR rescue swimmer and then an aviation electrician. Retired in 1972.
oldgold
From Lincoln’s second Inaugural Address:
opiejeanne
@raven: He didn’t have one and had no desire to have earned one.
He was a Sergeant 1st Class in WWII, first in Bradley’s army and then in Ike’s army. He landed in France about 5 days after the landing at Normandy, but up-river (he couldn’t remember the name of the river) at Camp X, with a radio truck and a bunch of other guys with similar equipment.
I figure he saw some bad stuff but he only ever told funny stories or slightly scary ones and when I was little and asked if he’d ever shot anyone during the war he told me the closest he came was when he was on guard duty one night and a snot-nosed Lieutenant didn’t think he needed to give the password.
He had passes to the Nuremberg trials but didn’t have the stomach to attend and my grandfather was pissed off at him because this was an historic moment. We’ve still got the passes as well as a photo of Eisenhower coming out of the peace talks. Note how plainly he’s dressed:
Ike coming out of the schoolhouse during the peace talks
raven
@kattails: Here’s my buddy Andy. He was 19 when he was killed almost 50 years ago.
raven
@opiejeanne: No one has a desire to get a Purple Heart.
Jager
@raven: I had an E-5 Sgt, a cadre in AIT who lived in the barracks, he had shirts with everything from E-3 to E-7 on the sleeves. He’d been in in since Korea, this was ’67. He told me in a moment of weakness he felt like he was on “the fuckin’ Army elevator plan” then immediately said, “You ready for them black hatted mother fuckers, cause I’ve busted my ass to get you and your pussy buddies ready for them..” I said, “you can bet your ass on it Sarge.” I loved the guy.
E
There’s something wrong, I think, with quoting a substantial part, but not the whole, of the Gettysburg Address. It’s a unit, a single thing, a whole. And it’s short.
Adam L Silverman
@gammyjill: Those names aren’t battle phases. They are the names for the theater operations. Operation Enduring Freedom was the name given to the US, NATO, and Coalition operations in Afghanistan.
Phases of operation refer to different states of, not to sound tautological, operation. There are five phases of conventional warfare and seven phases of unconventional warfare. These are not the same as operational phases.
raven
@Jager: This was my DI at Campbell in 66. He was the originator of the USEUR Drill team and a Korea grunt. He kicked our fucking asses and then said “the politicians are sending you to war and I hope what you have learned in 8 lousy weeks high hell you stay alive”. SSG Dallas A Pinkney.
Adam L Silverman
@raven: That’s either E8 or E16 depending on the math!
Elizabelle
@raven: 19. RIP Andy.
OK, the whole of the Gettysburg Address. It is perfection.
Abraham Lincoln
November 19, 1863
raven
@Adam L Silverman:
These are battle phases?
Advisory 15 March 1962 – 7 March 1965
Defense 8 March 1965 – 24 December 1965
Counteroffensive 25 December 1965 – 30 June 1966
Counteroffensive, Phase II 1 July 1966 – 31 May 1967
Counteroffensive, Phase III 1 June 1967 – 29 January 1968
Tet Counteroffensive 30 January 1968- 1 April 1968
Counteroffensive, Phase IV 2 April 1968 – 30 June 1968
Counteroffensive, Phase V 1 July 1968- 1 November 1968
Counteroffensive, Phase VI 2 November 1968 – 22 February 1969
Tet 69/Counteroffensive 23 February 1969 – 8 June 1969
Summer-Fall 1969 9 June 1969 – 31 October 1969
Winter-Spring 1970 1 November 1969 – 30 April 1970
Sanctuary Counteroffensive 1 May 1970 – 30 June 1970
Counteroffensive, Phase VII 1 July 1970 – 30 June 1971
Consolidation I 1 July 1971 – 30 November 1971
Consolidation II 1 December 1971 – 29 March 1972
Cease-Fire 30 March 1972 – 28 January 1973
Adam L Silverman
@raven: I’d have to go back and look.
raven
@Adam L Silverman: Not on my account, I’m going to bed!
Mary G
@opiejeanne: I always like this quote from Ike:
Best Republican president of my lifetime.
Ben Cisco
@oldgold: I wonder how much better off the nation would be had he not been assassinated.
p.a.
Graham Parker & The Rumour
Arlington’s Busy
opiejeanne
s no@raven: my cousin Danny looked about like that only skinnier. He was 19 when he died in 1967. We got the call just before I got on the band bus for the final playoff football game.
A few months later we lost a high school friend who had graduated the year before, another 19 year old. He trumpet in the band, which is how I knew him.
There are three monuments on my HS grounds to grads who died in Vietnam, and I’m pretty sure all three were 19.
raven
@opiejeanne: Andy was an incredible gymnast, he went to Oklahoma on a scholarship a, balled and joined the Marines. It’s hard to see how small he was in that picture but it speaks to his strength that he was an M60 gunner. They announced his death at a meet at our high school but I was in the Nam too so I didn’t even find out until xmas.
Adam L Silverman
@raven: Yes and no. The terminology keeps changing. So you’ve got the standard six operational phases for planning purposes: Phase 0/Shape, Phase 1/Deter, Phase 2/Seize the initiative, Phase 3/Dominate, Phase 4/Stabilize, Phase 5/Enable Civil Authority.
Then you’ve got the phases of war. So for conventional warfare you’ve got: Phase I/Steady state (peace), Phase II/Pre-conflict, Phase III/Conventional war, Phase IV/Post-conflict, Phase V/Transition back to steady state.
The 7 phases of unconventional warfare: Phase I: Preparation, Phase II: Initial contact, Phase III: Infiltration, Phase IV: Organization, Phase V: Buildup, Phase VI: Employment, Phase VII: Transition.
Phase VI unconventional is roughly equivalent to Phases III and IV conventional.
raven
@Adam L Silverman: Huh, what phase was the “Total Clusterfuck”?
NotMax
Just finished watching “The King’s Choice.” Covers the situation surrounding and decisions of King Haakon VII of Norway in the time leading up to and during WW2 German mounting pressure and aggression there. As portrayed, he sort of alternates between well-meaning aristocratic lunkhead and canny bureaucrat overwhelmed (but not cowed) by circumstance. Expect that in reality he was somewhere more in the middle.
Manyakitty
Thank you for this post. It’s a useful reminder.
raven
@opiejeanne: Here’s what I looked like 2 weeks after my 17th birthday. Tell me it doesn’t strike fear in your heart!
Adam L Silverman
@raven: All of them Katie!
Jager
@raven: The guy had the perfect name for an Infantryman: Sgt. Manley, he had a drinking problem and when it surfaced he had one hell of a mouth on him. He never faltered when he was on duty though. “If you bastards can do 50 push ups fast, at least 15 pull ups and run for 30 minutes at a crack you’ll be just fine.” he was right. As rough and tough as those guys were (and are) they gave a shit about their troops. A great friend of mine retired as a Battalion Chief of EMTs in Fort Lauderdale, he’d been an Army Medic in Vietnam and he can quote his senior NCO’s talk when he joined his Infantry unit, something like, “you’re their best friend, their confessor, they’ll tell you shit they wouldn’t tell their mothers, they’ll love and respect you if you take good care of them and they’ll take good care of you, so don’t fuck it up, understand?”
Ruckus
@Adam L Silverman:
Seemed like more than that from what I was told by the man himself. It could be his MOS as well, I can’t remember what it’s called but he specializes in some nasty weapons.
We’ve had a few discussions about the army and his deployment, I’m the only other person at work who’s served. And I’m about 45 years older than him. So lots of things may have changed just a tad bit, what with me being in a different branch and all.
Adam L Silverman
@Ruckus: There may be some additional incentive pay because of his MOS. Most personnel and HR stuff is outside my areas of expertise.
Ruckus
@kattails:
I think because of my age I’ve known quite a few men who served in WWII. Some in combat some doing other things. A friend passed away in 2007, he was a radioman in a C47 flying the hump in Burma. A character and a half his left arm was useless from an accident way after the war, docs wanted to remove it but he said no. He could play golf one armed better than a lot of people could with 2. I flew in and then drove a truck with him to events for a year after his wife, childhood sweetheart, passed away in the late 80s. He struck me as pretty normal for a lot of the combat vets that I’ve met from WWII. And I’ve met quite a few my age, vets from Vietnam. There is a difference, maybe generational, maybe because of the war they fought.
oldgold
@Ben Cisco:
Had Lincoln not fallen to an assassin’s bullet, our nation would be much better today than it is.
I think the difference would not be in terms of degree, but in kind.
The loss of Lincoln resonates in our politics after over 150 years.
kattails
@raven:Thank you so much for posting that.
Ruckus
@oldgold:
Do you think the racists would have gotten as far as they have if he hadn’t been?
I do, I think he might just have been able to help the nation heal rather than split. I’m also almost as not sure Lincoln could have made it happen but since then no one has tried so it’s a fools bet. 150 too long yrs may be too much to change the culture of racism we have here though. I hope that I’m wrong and would love to see the country grow up while I’m still here to see it. But it won’t happen until the death of the current republican party.
Ben Cisco
@oldgold: Agreed.
Ben Cisco
@Ruckus: This is absolutely right. They must go down, and they must go down HARD.
Ruckus
@Ben Cisco:
Yes that’s obvious, but how?
Their own racism, greed and stupidity? That’s going to be why they fail, but how to kick that ball rolling down the hill. drumpf? A fear I have is that he’s so toxic that the rats are fleeing the ship now, hoping that they will be able to miss the fireworks, not be taken down with him. And it might work for some of them. And with the noise machine at their back they might just come roaring back. They have created a pretty deep divide in this country, trying to hang on so far. People at work not talking to each other without absolute need, families split up, faux news bullshitting 24/7, even a lot of the rest of the MSM, racist political gangs beating/killing people. the NRA……..
kattails
@Ruckus: I am (late) Vietnam war era myself. I dated a vet who was infantry from that war not too long after the fact. One night he dropped me off at my front door, late at night, and at the same time there was a loud crash from the back of the house. I thought “Damned raccoons getting into the garbage cans again”. Turned to him to make a joke about it but he was on the ground. Rather telling.
Ruckus
@Ruckus:
To help answer my own question, I think that the huge tax cut might just be an opening. That’s going to hurt a lot of people and help what a dozen or so, hell even if it’s 100 it’s still bullshit of the tallest order. Get that across and then that most of the red states take in far more federal money than they put in. The just blatant unfairness of it might get something going. Once it flips it will gather speed and knock out their power. I hope.
Ruckus
@kattails:
I’ve seen that reaction. Quite a bit in fact.
I met a man at the VA a couple yrs back. 30ish, so current conflicts. I didn’t get where he had been, the situation didn’t allow for it. But based upon my limited understanding and exposure to a ward of earlier suffers during Vietnam, I’d call PTSD. It’s still going on and always will with combat vets.
And even non combat vets have issues. For a long time after I was discharged I’d never sit with my back to the room, always to a wall so I could watch whatever was happening. Big crowds made me nervous. I may have had a bit myself. Funny thing was, working in professional sports helped with that. Well that and time.
oldgold
@Ruckus: Yes that’s obvious, but how?
With resolute moral leadership suggested by these words:
“With malice toward none, with charity for all, with firmness in the right as God gives us to see the right, let us strive on to finish the work we are in, to bind up the nation’s wounds, to care for him who shall have borne the battle and for his widow and his orphan, to do all which may achieve and cherish a just and lasting peace among ourselves and with all nations.”
Omnes Omnibus
@Mary G: MG Eaton is very political now that he is retired. I get a couple of emails from him every week.
Ben Cisco
@Ruckus: @Ruckus: You’re right; it is pretty bad at the moment, but you’re also right in how it can play out. One thing we know is that whenever a GOPer “gets it” about anything, it’s usually after THEY or their loved ones are affected. That tax cut and the ramifications from it are going to land a LOT of people in that category. The same goes for all the other nonsense that is being inflicted on us – 45s voters having family members deported, etc. Just gotta keep chipping at it.
Omnes Omnibus
@Adam L Silverman: Jump status pay.
opiejeanne
@raven: The idea that you were in uniform so young does strike fear in my heart. I watched friends and family changed forever by that war and usually not in good ways.
Adam L Silverman
@Omnes Omnibus: Most likely.
kattails
@Ruckus: It was just that his reaction was So. damned. fast. I was putting my key in the lock FFS. It’s stayed with me for many years. I should be getting to bed, feeling a cold coming on, (s–t) but what did you do in professional sports?
Omnes Omnibus
@opiejeanne:
What war changes people in good ways?
Procopius
I suppose few civilians even notice, but the soldiers in this clip are from the 3rd Infantry. They have bayonets affixed to their rifles. This is not usual. The unit (I suppose all three battalions) performed some heroic bayonet assault during the Mexican War of 1843, and ever since have had the honor of being allowed to march with fixed bayonets. They spend most of their time in ceremonial duties, but are required to pass unit proficiency tests every year, so they also spend some time training as regular soldiers.
Ruckus
@Omnes Omnibus:
That would be additional for this guy. He’s not a jumper.
I’m not sure they even us airborne in the middle east.
Ruckus
@kattails:
You might not see this till morning but I’d prefer not to discuss it. I started posting here and other place anonymously because I was still working in it and telling what I did might make me instantly recognizable to some people. And then, some of them you don’t want around here. And that could have been difficult on my job. I was a somewhat public figure within the sport. Not famous at all but exposed because of my job. I’ve left enough clues over time that someone who knew me well would have been able to figure it out if they wanted to. But I think it’s best to leave that mystery alone. Of course since then I’ve been to a few meet ups and people do know who I am. Maybe after I retire I’ll come clean.
opiejeanne
@Omnes Omnibus: Positive changes can come from the worst situations, although no one would wish for that kind of transformation. A handful who were not very engaged before were inspired to become involved in volunteer work, in politics, in the anti-war movement, etc.
One guy, my HS boyfriend, came back wounded and with that 1000 yard stare (I was told by mutual friends who saw him right after he got home) and I was afraid Vietnam had destroyed him, but when he got in contact with me a few years ago it was apparent that he’s great now, and he works with registering voters in his very red district, among other activities.
J R in WV
I wasn’t in combat, but working with other serving men (almost all men back then) at difficult and dangerous tasks gave me self confidence, and confidence in those other guys, who also didn’t to blow up the ship, harbor, and everyone around us.
I worked with black sailors, latino sailors, rednecks from the ‘Bama piney woods, and mostly everyone could work together, all of which I learned more about. I am acquainted with local guys who never served, thus never worked with people different from the neighbors here in the rural county. So never worked with black guys from Newark, had to count on the black guy from Newark to guide that torpedo down the hatches into the storage decks.
He hates all people of color. I have worked with people from all over the world, from everywhere, with success. Billy-bob will never have that chance to learn, will always hate blacks, latinos, etc. Maybe, if he had spent 4 years living with and working with black guys, latino guys, women of all those groups, maybe he wouldn’t be a hater of peoples he knows nothing about.
I felt like I should have given him a lecture about it, but it was a New Years Eve party, I didn’t want to be a violence breaks out at party statistic. With any luck I won’t see him again, ever. Young assholes often get themselves killed off, Darwinly.