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You are here: Home / Politics / Republican Venality / IT’S. WHO. THEY. ARE.

IT’S. WHO. THEY. ARE.

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Fear not, we might be reaching the end of this horrible policy of separating families seeking asylum at the border, because inspirational leader Ben Sasse has introduced a strong bill in the Senate um introduced a Senate Resolution condemning the policy my bad I mean issued a strongly worded public statement written a tepid facebook post:

1) Family separation is wicked. It is harmful to kids and absolutely should NOT be the default U.S. policy. Americans are better than this.

2) This bad new policy is a reaction against a bad old policy. The old policy was “catch-and-release.” Under catch-and-release, if someone made it to the border and claimed asylum (whether true or not, and most of the time it wasn’t true), they were released into the U.S. until a future hearing date. Many folks obviously don’t show up at these hearings, so this became a new pathway into the U.S.

And blah blah blah he’s not going to do shit about it but wants people to separate himself from the monsters, which he can’t because by doing nothing he’s FUCKING ONE OF THEM. Even the god damned language we use is dehumanizing- “catch and release.” These are people, not an undersized fucking trout, you assholes. At any rate, there’s a reason Republican’s won’t do anything or sign on to the Democratic bill that has 40 something cosponsors. It’s who they fucking are:

This nonsense about there being some sort of true conservatism and Republican party separate from Cheeto Benito is insane. This is who the Republican party is. A bunch of real life monsters.

Also note the regrettably predictable appearance of the crazification factor. Thirteen years old and still holding strong. Peak wingnut, on the other hand, had it not been strangled in the crib a mere few hours later, would be ten years old.

Reader Interactions

147Comments

  2. 2.

    Tilda Swintons Bald Cap

    Hey guess what?

    The Hill
    ✔
    @thehill

    NEW POLL: More Republicans view Kim Jong Un favorably than they do Pelosi

  5. 5.

    the Conster

    It’s absolutely mind blowing how spineless they are, when they’re not being monstrous. Every morning, outside of whatever bilge Fox pumps out, there is an entire pundit industry wondering what happened to the Republican party, and they DESPERATELY would love to highlight a brave truth teller who they could pretend would put the party back on the track to some kind of normalcy, whatever that even looks like anymore. Instead, NOT ONE REPUBLICAN, not even those who are retiring, have a testicle or a vertebra between them to step up and say they’re going to caucus with the Dems, or introduce a bill, or challenge McConnell or Ryan. Jello has more substance than Sasse, Flake, McCain and Collins put together, yet, they could be a “hero” tomorrow in the eyes of the media.

  6. 6.

    Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (formerly Mumphrey, et al.)

    I just posted on Facebook that this is now who we are. This is what the U.S. now has become. This is what we are. All the weeping and wailing about how we’re better than this, about how blah, blah, blah, blah, is horseshit. This is what we’re doing, and what we do is what we are. Full stop.

    Maybe we don’t want to be this. Great. Most of us, it seems, don’t want to be this. Hooray. But for now, this is what we’re stuck being. We won’t be this when we choose as a society, as a country, to do something else, something that treats these people as people, who are worthy of respect and of being treated like, well, fucking people. Until then, well, get used to being a citizen of a country that puts six month old children in concentration camps.

  7. 7.

    ruemara

    The amount of liberals on my FB feed praising this as if it’s momentous… We have such low standards for republicans and such insane standards for Democrats. I’m in awe of how easy the actually smarter people are to manipulate.

  10. 10.

    lowtechcyclist

    Sasse: “This bad new policy is a reaction against a bad old policy.”

    Like they’re even remotely comparable.

    The old policy may have been ineffective – but then, Dubya and Obama each took a stab at comprehensive immigration reform, were in both cases blocked by the wingnuts, and the old policy was about the best that could be done in the absence of reform.

    The new policy, as Sasse says, is wicked. I’d add: cruel. Inhumane. Evil.

    So fuck you, Sasse, until you’ve got the guts to DO something. Switch parties long enough to make Schumer the majority leader and pass the Feinstein bill, then switch back and put Mitch back in charge.

    Put up or shut up.

  11. 11.

    Barbara

    As a nation we have sent so many mixed signals to people from Central America in particular regarding our policy for humanitarian visas that they believe, in the end, it will work out, and what’s the worst that can happen if it doesn’t? They will be mostly undeterred from trying to enter the U.S. Most people do not understand the legal standards for asylum, they simply know that they face many crises in their daily lives and their government is unwilling or unable to address their safety and poverty. Sometimes this meets the standard for asylum, and sometimes it doesn’t. No doubt Congress could come up with an immigration policy that, among other things, provides more resources for asylum processing, which now has something like a two year wait for the interview arising out of an affirmative petition. But they won’t. They don’t care about asylum or asylum seekers beyond screaming about illegals coming into the country.

  12. 12.

    JaneE

    I called my GOP congresscritter today. I got a spiel about how not separating families is giving them amnesty. I said that just wasn’t American. Not that it will matter at all, but at least I got to let them know how I feel.

  13. 13.

    Mnemosyne

    Given that we’ve spent the last couple of years talking about how Trump is a classic toxic narcissist, it’s striking how closely his Trumpistas are sticking to the classic abuser’s technique of DARVO for blaming their victims for their own abuse:

    Deny
    Attack
    Reverse Victim and Offender

    Deny: We are not separating families. Period. — DHS Secretary Nielsen on Twitter

    Attack: They shouldn’t have broken the law if they didn’t want their kids taken away! — every asshole and bot on Twitter

    Reverse Victim and Offender: This is Obama’s policy! The Democrats are forcing us to do this! — every Trump defender in the government

    It’s kind of astounding just how textbook they are, and I’m not even a psychologist, just a layperson who’s read some stuff about narcissists and abusers.

  14. 14.

    ? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?

    I wonder if part of the reason people like Sasse haven’t done anything serious about this yet is that they’re afraid someone’s going to try to kill them if they do?

  15. 15.

    Josie

    Called my two senators’ local offices – Cruz and Cornyn – for all the good it’s going to do. Also called my rep, Henry Cuellar (D). I told them I was really disappointed that he was not on the front lines of this thing and that he missed the march to Tornillo yesterday. The young lady told me she was not at liberty to discuss it (whatever that means). Maybe tomorrow I’ll call the Washington offices.

  16. 16.

    dmsilev

    Who we were:

    Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,
    With conquering limbs astride from land to land;
    Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand
    A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame
    Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name
    Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand
    Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command
    The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.
    “Keep, ancient lands, your storied pomp!” cries she
    With silent lips. “Give me your tired, your poor,
    Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
    The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
    Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
    I lift my lamp beside the golden door!”

    Who we currently are:

    “The United States will not be a migrant camp and it will not be a refugee holding facility,” he said. “It won’t be. You look at what’s happening in Europe, you look at what’s happening in other places, we can’t allow that to happen to the United States. Not on my watch.”

    Trump also continued to blame the Democrats for being “obstructionists” and suggested that all the immigration “problems that we’re having” are Democrats’ “fault.”

  18. 18.

    ? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?

    @JaneE:
    What did they sat in response, since you were implying they were un-American? Did hands come through the phone receiver?

  20. 20.

    Miss Bianca

    @ruemara:

    The amount of liberals on my FB feed praising this as if it’s momentous… We have such low standards for republicans and such insane standards for Democrats. I’m in awe of how easy the actually smarter people are to manipulate.

    This. A thousand times THIS. I may have to drastically prune my FB “friends” list because I see THIS all the time with people I keep thinking should know better, and it’s making me crazy. Well, crazier.

  22. 22.

    different-church-lady

    Meanwhile 17% are like, “Oh, uh, I guess I gotta go have further thoughts on the issue.”??!

  23. 23.

    randy khan

    “Slightly”?!!??!!??!!!

    27 pro/56 percent con among the general population versus 46 pro/32 con among Republicans is not a slight difference.

  24. 24.

    hilts

    @Josie:

    Called my two senators’ local offices – Cruz and Cornyn

    My sympathies to you for having 2 massive assholes as your senators.

  28. 28.

    Mnemosyne

    @JaneE:

    I think Omnes got his congresscritter’s intern to stumble by asking him how he could defend ripping kids away from their parents.

    We probably need to better prepared to counter DARVO talking points from Republicans like the ones you encountered. They’re going to blame the victims and claim they’re helpless to do anything because they’re hoping their voters are dumb enough to believe them.

    If they’re already claiming that keeping families together is “amnesty,” they know they’re in trouble. That’s one of the scare words that anti-immigrant assholes just love to seig heil to. ?

  29. 29.

    SFAW

    I especially liked the highlighted quote re: Rethugs favoring it “slightly more” than don’t.

    46 percent is “slightly more” than 32 percent? Fucking morons. I guess that means driving 85 in a 60 zone is driving “slightly more” than the limit. And so on.

    Fuck Ben Sasse, fuck the Rethuglicans, fuck this Maladminiastration, fuck the racists in chatrge, and fuck all the RWAs.

    ETA: I see I’m late to the party again (re: randy khan)

  30. 30.

    rikyrah

    @ruemara:

    The amount of liberals on my FB feed praising this as if it’s momentous… We have such low standards for republicans and such insane standards for Democrats. I’m in awe of how easy the actually smarter people are to manipulate.

    He hasn’t signed onto sponsor Feinstein’s bill.
    Until then, it’s nothing but bullshyt.

  31. 31.

    cokane

    It’s who we are. Trump is gaining popularity, if you believe opinion polls. Things like the Mueller investigation are losing popularity.

    I’m afraid we’re probably entering a generation-long political struggle against, for lack of a better word, Trumpism. It’s not going away even after he leaves office. The Republican party, as now constituted, is going to be a challenging force in our politics for decades.

  32. 32.

    rikyrah

    @JaneE:

    I called my GOP congresscritter today. I got a spiel about how not separating families is giving them amnesty.

    Not separating is AMNESTY?
    Oh, how soon before we hear that floated by the Huckabeast.

    I hope you told them, no…separating families is pure, unadulterated evil.

  33. 33.

    LAO

    @? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?: Because I’m not willing to give a Senator that has a 100% rating from Freedom Works, Club for Growth and Americans for Prosperity — the benefit of any sort of doubt. Source. Also the ACLU rates him at 5%. Any particular reason why you believe he is honestly appalled by what the Trump Administration is doing?

  34. 34.

    Mnemosyne

    @cokane:

    Trump is gaining popularity, if you believe opinion polls.

    Actually, he isn’t. He crept up within the margin of error after his “summit” with Kim Jong Il and then went right back down to the 40 percent he’s been hovering around for months.

    Anyone who tells you that his popularity is on an upward trend is lying to you.

  36. 36.

    cokane

    It’s still amazing to me that Jim Jeffords and Arlen Specter left the Republican party because of W. Bush. I know there’s a cynical view that they did it to save their skin, though Jeffords did leave only shortly after the 2000 election, when Bush was still quite popular. I say this only to note that zero prominent Republican politicians have left the party because of Trump. I think that speaks for itself.

  37. 37.

    Calouste

    @dmsilev: When that poem was put up on the Statue of Liberty, the Chinese Exclusion Act was already the law of the land.

    This is what the United States has always been.

  38. 38.

    opiejeanne

    I’m so proud of mr opiejeanne right now. He’s on the phone with Suzan Del Bene’s office asking ‘WHERE ARE THE GIRLS???”

  40. 40.

    trollhattan

    @SFAW:
    And then there are those 22% who “just can’t quite decide.” Like they’re waiting for “all the facts”? More likely wondering why there isn’t a third way–Gitmo!

  41. 41.

    Mnemosyne

    Also, too, I bet that Miller and the rest of Trump’s low-quality hires (h/t Kay) assumed that this would be a good time to roll out this policy since Trump would still be basking in the massive acclaim of the North Korea summit and nobody would notice. Whoopsie! ?

  44. 44.

    Wyatt Derp

    By the way, “Catch and Release” is a fishing term. I’m sure it’s a pure coincidence that it is being used by Republicans to refer to brown people.

  46. 46.

    TenguPhule

    Peak wingnut, on the other hand, had it not been strangled in the crib a mere few hours later, would be ten years old.

    At what point does peak wingnut cross over into true Nazi?

    Looks like we get to find out.

  47. 47.

    Mai naem mobile

    I called Flake’s Phx and Tucson offices because the intern at the Phoenix office just got me pissed off by basically saying nothing. She just kept on repeating that the senator hasn’t said anything and unjust hung up. The Tucson office said that the Senator doesn’t believe splitting up families. So I asked what’s he going to do about it and why he hadnt signed onto DiFis bill and she just hemmed and hawed said she would pass on the message.

  50. 50.

    Yarrow

    John Cole, yesterday:

    Who is making money off housing the children and families. That’s who we need to go after since Republicans clearly have no morals.— Dirty Computer (@Johngcole) June 18, 2018

    Hit them where it hurts. Find out who’s making money off all this, find out which Congressmembers are taking money from those folks. Just like the Parkland kids are doing with the NRA. Follow the money.

  51. 51.

    germy

    “A man with a long history of racial discrimination, who traffics in dark conspiracy theories drawn from the pages of supermarket tabloids and the far reaches of the internet, should never run our government or command our military.”
    —Hillary Clinton, August 2016

  52. 52.

    Mnemosyne

    @Another Scott:

    See the second graf of the story I just linked to. I said that he saw a small rise in his popularity because of the NK summit, and he did.

    Last week’s events have not been polled yet. Shall we make a bet payable to the ACLU that his numbers are going to go back down this week?

  53. 53.

    TenguPhule

    @Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (formerly Mumphrey, et al.):

    I just posted on Facebook that this is now who we are. This is what the U.S. now has become. This is what we are. All the weeping and wailing about how we’re better than this, about how blah, blah, blah, blah, is horseshit. This is what we’re doing, and what we do is what we are. Full stop.

    Maybe we don’t want to be this. Great. Most of us, it seems, don’t want to be this. Hooray. But for now, this is what we’re stuck being. We won’t be this when we choose as a society, as a country, to do something else, something that treats these people as people, who are worthy of respect and of being treated like, well, fucking people. Until then, well, get used to being a citizen of a country that puts six month old children in concentration camps.

    No. This is not us. This is them. Republicans own this shit. All of it. And there will be a reckoning for it.

    It may be us, it may be Canadian military troops or EU liberation forces, but they are going to pay for this. One way or another.

  54. 54.

    Mai naem mobile

    You know i get that we don’t have to accept everybody who is trying to come here but has anybody mentioned that treating people like this as kids is what can develop resentment in those kids that can be exploited and radicalized to become terrorists.

  56. 56.

    condorcet runner-up

    I know that this was Sen. Sasse’s FB feed, so he posted it himself, but I am frankly sick and tired of the media giving these monsters cover by reporting on how “torn” or “uneasy” they are with the new regulations, or how “tough” administration officials are finding it working for this president*. It’s like John says, this is who they are. They can pretend they’re not, but we don’t have to.

  57. 57.

    James Powell

    @ruemara:

    No lie. I re-tweeted Hillary Clinton addressing family separation in the debate. Third reply was “she was a flawed candidate” and I can’t even . . .

    @Miss Bianca:

    I may have to drastically prune my FB “friends” list because I see THIS all the time with people I keep thinking should know better, and it’s making me crazy.

    This is exactly why I got off facebook during the election. I couldn’t take it anymore.

  59. 59.

    Sloegin

    Donny Moscow will offer up the kids for the wall. The Dems should just flat out state “we don’t negotiate with hostage takers”.

  60. 60.

    TenguPhule

    @Mai naem mobile:

    You know i get that we don’t have to accept everybody who is trying to come here but has anybody mentioned that treating people like this as kids is what can develop resentment in those kids that can be exploited and radicalized to become terrorists.

    I fully expect that excuse to be used by Trump to justify the ovens and his solution to the problem.

    Yes, its coming.

  61. 61.

    Baud

    @James Powell:

    Based on my feed, a front pager at GOS recently decided to use the recent IG report to dedicate a post to talk about Bill Clinton’s conduct during the election. I didn’t click.

  62. 62.

    lowtechcyclist

    @TenguPhule:

    No. This is not us. This is them. Republicans own this shit. All of it.

    Absolutely. This is not who we are – this is who the Republicans are. And we need to make them own it, duct-tape it to their sorry asses.

  63. 63.

    bluefish

    This would be a good moment to rewatch I, Claudius maybe. Though Trump is no John Hurt. Actually, that’s a terrible idea. These folks aren’t playing — that’s clear. Watching K. Nielsen doing her thing this morning on TV was totally chilling. So buckle up — Fascism came pretty damn fast to the USA. Life can come at you hard.

    I remember Peak Wingnut from back in the day. Sorry it got smothered on the eve of its birthday. I expect to see it revived, feeling much worse for wear. Thanks to all who made calls. My guy here in NoVA is Don Beyer. Doing what he can, presumably, and tweeting the outrage. Did call to say, hey — Thanks for what you’re doing. May we have some more? Once more with feeling? Would like to see you tremble and sputter on the tv machine.

    I’m 65 now. The thought of going into my last chapters watching this happen to our country totally totally pisses me off. Walter Shaub is trying to get a big march going. We’ll have moved beyond enthusiastic gathering and opposition to what I hope is a resounding, overwhelming NO. To all of it. Fuck these people. Badly. And then throw the baggage out.

  64. 64.

    rikyrah

    One way to help families at the border is by donating to the Refugee and Immigrant Center for Education and Legal Services (RAICES) in Texas:t.co/zXKpvtw4uY
    They have a Family Reunification and Bond Fund and need help.
    CC. @JeffLieber — signal boost?

    — Stephanie S. Thompson ?? (@Stefaniya) June 18, 2018

  65. 65.

    germy

    Last month, I reported on a meeting at DHS in August, 2017, in which Administration officials advocated for family separation to deter migrants, including asylum seekers, from Central America. Guess what was also on the agenda in that meeting?

    Ending the Flores Agreement, which mandated that the government meet minimum requirements for how to treat immigrant kids in government custody.

    Since the late 1990s, the terms of Flores got shored up and strengthened, through a 2008 law and subsequent direction from the courts. To those in the Admin who advocate separation of families, putting an end to these protections was a priority, too. Why?

    Stephen Miller, Gene Hamilton, Jeff Sessions—they all thought that ending these protections would discourage families and kids from migrating north to seek asylum. Without Flores, etc, kids could be held in detention longer, under tougher conditions.

    Family separation. Curbing asylum (e.g. sessions’ decision last week). Chipping away at Flores. All are of a piece.

    twitter.com/JonathanBlitzer/status/1008400706561347584

  66. 66.

    Yarrow

    @condorcet runner-up:

    I am frankly sick and tired of the media giving these monsters cover by reporting on how “torn” or “uneasy” they are with the new regulations, or how “tough” administration officials are finding it working for this president*.

    Me too. I’m kind of Yoda-esque about it. I evaluate them by whether they Do or Do Not. They Feel Really Torn and Uneasy About It is irrelevant to me. Fuck their feelings. They are not elected to feel. They are elected to legislate. Do or Do Not. That’s all that matters here.

  68. 68.

    gene108

    Republicans built this. They could’ve slapped down all the Birther nonsense in 2008, but it was a good way to rile up their voters and get them to the polls, so they let it become gospel among many of their constituents. They can tell Alex Jones to STFU about people in mass shootings being crisis actors.

    There are tons of conspiracy theories on the Right that Republicans are happy to let their constituents marinate in, as long as those conspiracy theories keep those voters engaged.

    And when something truly horrible is happening, they cannot let reality intrude into the minds of their voters, because otherwise they will lose those voters, who are conditioned to not get any pushback from Republican politicians for all the crazy ass theories the voters espouse.

    Republicans truly have become Party over country.

  69. 69.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    @Mnemosyne:

    If they’re already claiming that keeping families together is “amnesty,” they know they’re in trouble.

    Suggested reply – “That’s the kind of thing a two bit commie dictator like Kim Dumb Sum would say, but this is America and the greatest democracy on earth” Shove it back on them.

  70. 70.

    bluehill

    “America is better that this.” No it’s not. If it were, this wouldn’t be happening. This is right up there with “thoughts and concerns.” Just another excuse for doing nothing. America as an idea is exceptional, but it depends on its people and right now we are failing.

  72. 72.

    TenguPhule

    @Baud:

    I would trade wall money for DACA + no kidnapping.

    Even if they did go for it, you know the GOP fuckers would keep doing exactly what they’re doing despite agreeing not to. You pay the Danegeld and you get the Dane.

  75. 75.

    TenguPhule

    @gene108: Truth and Retaliation Commissions.

    Proof of Republican party membership for the last 12 years shall serve as proof of guilt.

    No appeals, no clemency, no quarter.

  76. 76.

    James Powell

    @? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?:

    Sticking together no matter how bad the policy is, no matter how much democratic norms are violated, no matter how immoral, has been a very successful policy for the Republicans. They came back from the debacle of the 2008 election to take control of all three branches of the federal government and almost 2/3s of the states.

    They may continue to believe that it is a winning strategy (and nobody has shown it isn’t) or they may just not have another strategy to offer. Whatever the reason, they aren’t going to change unless and until they have another debacle election.

  77. 77.

    Kay

    @Mnemosyne:

    Imagine how poorly run it is- remember- they’re not just cruel, they’re also unqualified and incompetent.

    I can’t figure out why they would put 16 kids on a plane at 2 in the morning and take them from Arizona to Florida- one of the flight attendants is tweeting about it. What possible reason could there be to take them from where they were snatched and fly them to a different state? How is anyone supposed to find them?

    The Trump people are running it. You just know it’s a chaotic mess.

  78. 78.

    gene108

    @the Conster:

    there is an entire pundit industry wondering what happened to the Republican party, and they DESPERATELY would love to highlight a brave truth teller who they could pretend would put the party back on the track to some kind of normalcy, whatever that even looks like anymore. Instead, NOT ONE REPUBLICAN, not even those who are retiring, have a testicle or a vertebra between them to step up and say they’re going to caucus with the Dems, or introduce a bill, or challenge McConnell or Ryan. Jello has more substance than Sasse, Flake, McCain and Collins put together, yet, they could be a “hero” tomorrow in the eyes of the media.

    The MSM doesn’t pay as well as the Wingut Welfare Circuit. Cozying up to the MSM has limited value. Keeping the right-wing faith means you will richly rewarded after politics by billionaires shoveling money at your face and money at the faces of your kids and grandkids.

  79. 79.

    TenguPhule

    @Kay:

    What possible reason could there be to take them from where they were snatched and fly them to a different state?

    Sex slaves in the international distribution network. Not trafficking US citizens, no paperwork trail and lots of money to be made.

  80. 80.

    condorcet runner-up

    @Yarrow:

    They are not elected to feel. They are elected to legislate. Do or Do Not. That’s all that matters here.

    That’s exactly right. And any reporting should start with this premise. “Sasse claims opposition to this policy, but refuses to sign onto Feinstein bill addressing same policy” is much more informative than, “Sasse opposes admin policy.”

  81. 81.

    cokane

    @Mnemosyne: The gallup poll actually includes respondents from even yesterday (6/17), so again, you don’t care to check your facts… ever? It’s no surprise we’re facing a political crisis

  82. 82.

    FDRLincoln

    Called Lynn Jenkins’ office, my Kansas congressional representative. She is a conservative Republican. Staffer said Jenkins opposes administration actions to separate families and wants to work on a bipartisan bill to keep families together.

    I said, that’s good, I’m glad to hear it, so why doesn’t she hold a press conference and make her position clear? Why isn’t she out there making a big stink about this? Has she pressured Ryan? Called out the administration?

    Staffer had no answer to this, other than she would pass along to the congresswoman that I wanted her to be more aggressive.

    Got recordings when I called Senators Moran and Roberts. Will try them again tomorrow.

  83. 83.

    the Conster

    @TenguPhule:

    I’ve been saying that’s what’s at the bottom of the Trump sewer ever since I heard about Pizzagate. We’re being “governed” by members of an international cartel of pedophile rings – it’s what the Russian mob does best – maybe even better than money laundering.

  84. 84.

    Steve in the ATL

    @? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?:

    I wonder if part of the reason people like Sasse haven’t done anything serious about this yet is that they’re afraid someone’s going to try to kill them if they do?

    I don’t think so, but what the hell do I know? Putin kills people around the globe, but he has no dog in this fight. American gun nuts are cowards and disinclined to shoot a republican anyway, especially when there are so many women and brown people who are better targets.

  85. 85.

    the Conster

    @FDRLincoln:

    Got recordings when I called Senators Moran and Roberts. Will try them again tomorrow.

    Tell him “to get a brain! Moran”

  86. 86.

    Stan

    @TenguPhule: The problem with democracy is that even idiots get to vote. No one’s figured a way around that yet.

    Make it illegal for white people to vote.

    I know, I know, there are a few white people who aren’t idiots, but hey, enough of them are, and you can’t make an omlette without breaking a few eggs.

  87. 87.

    Steve in the ATL

    @JaneE:

    not separating families is giving them amnesty

    As you noted, this is not American. Furthermore, it’s not even English. That statement is full of words I understand, but the conclusion does not in any way flow from the premise.

  88. 88.

    opiejeanne

    @rikyrah: He sent a message to Rachel Maddow, right afterward. Meanwhile, I’ve written a letter to Suzan DelBene, Patty Murray, and Maria Cantwell. Those are our Congresswoman and two US senators.

  89. 89.

    rikyrah

    @Kay:

    I can’t figure out why they would put 16 kids on a plane at 2 in the morning and take them from Arizona to Florida- one of the flight attendants is tweeting about it. What possible reason could there be to take them from where they were snatched and fly them to a different state? How is anyone supposed to find them?

    Nothing good, Kay.
    NOT.A.DAMN.THING.THAT.COULD.BE.CONSIDERED.GOOD.

  90. 90.

    Roger Moore

    @trollhattan:

    And then there are those 22% who “just can’t quite decide.” Like they’re waiting for “all the facts”?

    Most likely they’re people who simply don’t pay attention to the news and genuinely don’t know enough about what’s going on to form a sensible opinion. There are a lot of people who remain blissfully ignorant of what’s going on in the country.

  91. 91.

    Calouste

    @randy khan: What it really means is that 68% of the Republicans is on board with the policy. 22% of them just don’t want to say so in public.

  92. 92.

    Dorothy Winsor

    This is who they are. The question is: Is this who America is? Someone on twitter said “This is not America” is the liberal equivalent of thoughts and prayers. If we don’t act to stop this, then this is who we are.

    The problem I have is that beyond protesting to my congress critter, I don’t know what to do.

    My fellow citizens put these sadistic people in charge.

  93. 93.

    Steve in the ATL

    @Stan:

    Make it illegal for white people to vote.

    I’m willing to take one for the team. I’ll gladly give up my vote if my blood red neighbors do the same!

  94. 94.

    gene108

    @cokane:

    I’m afraid we’re probably entering a generation-long political struggle against, for lack of a better word, Trumpism. It’s not going away even after he leaves office. The Republican party, as now constituted, is going to be a challenging force in our politics for decades.

    After every political loss, in the last 50 years, Republicans tack further and further to the right. After Ford lost, we got Reagan. After Bush, Sr. lost, we got Gingrich. After the 2006 losses, we wound up getting the Tea Party. And now we have Trump.

    After Trump loses, god only knows how fucking crazy the next batch of Republicans will be, but they will be further right than what they are now.

  96. 96.

    TenguPhule

    @the Conster: We’ll know for sure if it gets to the “We can’t seem to find the girls anywhere in the system” with ICE. Because that means they’re either sex slaves or dead and disposed of.

    There is always paperwork. Unless you don’t want people to find out about your victims.

  98. 98.

    Roger Moore

    @Kay:

    What possible reason could there be to take them from where they were snatched and fly them to a different state? How is anyone supposed to find them?

    They aren’t supposed to be able to find them. That’s the point. They’re trying to lose those kids, and heaven knows what’s going to happen to them once they’re lost from the system. It’s going to be really ugly, though.

  99. 99.

    gene108

    @Sloegin:

    Donny Moscow will offer up the kids for the wall. The Dems should just flat out state “we don’t negotiate with hostage takers”.

    Dems should agree to the wall, but say it must be at least 1000 feet high and 1000 feet deep. Make it so preposterously huge that Trump either has to say the wall is too big and we aren’t in that much trouble from people crossing the Southern border or agree to build it.

    The only funding the Dems will allocate is a special office in the State Department, whose only job is to get Mexico to pay for it.

  100. 100.

    bluehill

    @Dorothy Winsor: This is America. The sooner people accept it the sooner things will change. What TPM calls “the middle of the road voters” is America. To them “It’s simply not happening. There is no family separation policy. It’s literally not happening at all or if it is happening it’s being forced on us and families were separated under Obama too.” They won’t show up at the polls in November and this will continue.

  101. 101.

    The Ancient Randonneur

    @Kay: I’ll see if I can find the source again but someone confirmed the story and also confirmed the flight attendant was confused about the actual time of the flight. But those girls were on that plane.

  102. 102.

    Fair Economist

    @Kay:

    I can’t figure out why they would put 16 kids on a plane at 2 in the morning and take them from Arizona to Florida- one of the flight attendants is tweeting about it. What possible reason could there be to take them from where they were snatched and fly them to a different state?

    So they could be “lost” and handed over to human traffickers. I’m entirely serious about this – they are corrupt as **** and I guarantee George Nader is not the only pedophile working with or for them.

  105. 105.

    Yarrow

    @Kay:

    I can’t figure out why they would put 16 kids on a plane at 2 in the morning and take them from Arizona to Florida- one of the flight attendants is tweeting about it. What possible reason could there be to take them from where they were snatched and fly them to a different state?

    Cheryl front paged my comment yesterday about flying kids around the country to various detention facilities. The article is from 2014 and it certainly hasn’t gotten any better since then. You can read it here at the bottom of the post.

    I certainly wouldn’t rule out human trafficking, though.

  106. 106.

    frosty

    @Mnemosyne: DARVO. Thanks for sharing this and your other info on narcissism. I learn a lot on this blog that (thankfully) I don’t have any experience with.

  108. 108.

    Calouste

    @gene108: Reagan got 52%, Dubya got 49%, and Donnie Dementia got 46%. So the next Republican will get 43% in 2028, but will win because 87 year old Wilmer will be there as an independent to split the vote

  109. 109.

    germy

    @Mnemosyne:

    I understand narcissistic personality disorder like the back of my hand. Trump is as familiar as an old movie, so let me share some intel.1/— The Hoarse Whisperer (@HoarseWisperer) July 9, 2017

    Interesting thread

  111. 111.

    Roger Moore

    Republican’s won’t do anything or sign on to the Democratic bill that has 40 something cosponsors.

    The last I heard, it’s up to 49 cosponsors, i.e. every Senator who’s not a Republican.

  112. 112.

    opiejeanne

    @ruemara: I have a couple of friends like that left on my Facebook pages, but most are firebreathers. I prefer the firebreathers.

  113. 113.

    scav

    Trusting our neighbors and co-Americans may be a luxury we can no longer afford. Too many seem passively, when not actively, complicit in entirely horrific actions. Passivity is effectively endorsement. Ignorence or faint breath-only whispers of discomfort are no defense in certain corcumstances and the current state of affairs seems to qualify.

  114. 114.

    jacy

    @germy:
    If you’ve ever had to deal intimately with someone with NPD, it’s easy to recognize. You can’t not see it. The thing I find frustrating is when people keep ascribing complex motives to Trump. THere are no complex motives. That thread is accurate. I firmly believe when the pressure is inescapable, Trump will either have a massive breakdown and completely, publicly lose it, or he’ll declare victory and try to leave. BUt what’s going on inside him now is untenable over the long run.

  117. 117.

    O. Felix Culpa

    Stolen from a fb post:

    Left: Stop taking children from their parents!
    Right: But Obama started it!
    Left: I don’t think that’s true, but it’s irrelevant right now. It’s happening NOW. It needs to stop NOW.
    Right: It’s been happening for years!
    Left: Okay so it’s about time to stop it, right?
    Right: Democrats are blocking attempts to stop it
    Left: The GOP controls Congress and the WH, they could stop this tomorrow. Put a bill on the floor of both houses and see who votes for it. If it passes, see if Trump signs it. At least TRY.
    Right: But you didn’t complain about it six years ago.
    Left: Either I didn’t know about it or it wasn’t happening. Either way, can we please stop taking children away from their parents now! We can argue about who to blame for it later.
    Right: The parents are being put in jail for illegally crossing the border. It’s wrong to put kids in jail with them.
    Left: Don’t put these people in prison with murderers and rapists then.
    Right: But it’s a deterrent!
    Left: This is the US, not North Korea. It’s barbaric, stop it now.
    Right: Not up to us.
    Left: You run the government.
    Right: The Bible says…
    Left: JUST FUCKING STOP IT.
    Right: We don’t want to.
    Left: Bingo.

  118. 118.

    JGabriel

    Laura Clawson @ DKos:

    In line with Homeland Security Secretary Kirstjen Nielsen’s insistence that these families are only “posing as families,” the administration isn’t bothering to keep track of which child arrived with which adult. We’ve already seen cases of parents deported while their children remain in the United States … somewhere.

    Someone with access, working in Homeland Security, is going to start identifying these kids and selling them into child trafficking, if they haven’t already. Trump has been besties with several registered sex offenders (child molesters), cf. Jeffrey Epstein. I certainly don’t put it past Trump himself to get involved in child trafficking.

  119. 119.

    celticdragonchick

    @gene108: No longer a matter of them going “right”. Fascism borrows freely from both left and right as needed at any moment. We are in “blood and soil” territory now and actual conservatism went out the fucking window like Martinice and Slavata in 1618 Prague.

  120. 120.

    Ruckus

    @gene108:
    What’s that old saying?
    It didn’t work means they aren’t conservative enough.

    So their shit doesn’t work, and/or is illegal, and/or is fucking stupid, and/or is racist, and/or is….. and what they do is double down. Which of course draws in the insane, the morons, the easily led, and they keep doing this till they either win or destroy. And those who double down or who are “concerned” and do nothing, go along. They become crazier, dumber, and more dangerous, like a rabid animal. Which of course they are, they don’t understand economics, liberty, freedom, equality because the disease they have, conservatism, is like rabies, it makes one insane and dangerous and takes away the ability to reason or learn, leaving only the ability to lash out and scream incoherently.

  121. 121.

    opiejeanne

    @Steve in the ATL:

    not separating families is giving them amnesty

    It’s as if they don’t own a dictionary. Or maybe they’re trying to be like the caterpillar in Alice in Wonderland: who is the master, you or the word?

  122. 122.

    Calouste

    @JGabriel: So the regime is now arguing that these people, who take like a month to travel from say Honduras to the US border, are willingly making their trip more difficult by bringing along someone else’s kids?

  123. 123.

    opiejeanne

    @rikyrah: Two of those were teenage girls who had been moved several times before being sent I think back to Arizona, or maybe it was back to Florida. Moving them so much makes it easier for them to get “lost in the system” or, if you want a darker analysis, easier to dispose of.

  124. 124.

    Roger Moore

    @JGabriel:

    I certainly don’t put it past Trump himself to get involved in child trafficking.

    I don’t put it past Trump to be a customer of child trafficking. He’s already shown an unhealthy interest in underage girls; there’s no particular reason to think he’d stop there.

  125. 125.

    Mnemosyne

    @cokane:

    Allow me to repeat GALLUP’S OWN WORDS:

    Improved views of Trump last week may stem from his high-profile meetings with North Korean leader Kim Jong Un held early in the week.

    So who am I supposed to believe, you or the people who did the actual poll? ?

  126. 126.

    NorthLeft12

    My expectation is that Dopey Donald and his bigoted band of deplorables will double down on this policy. The people that they were elected by and who they work for, love what they are doing. Many of the Repubs have made it clear that the people this is happening to, are less than human and that in the long run this will be a huge win.

  127. 127.

    Ruckus

    @celticdragonchick:
    Beg to differ.
    This is conservatism. Plain and simple.
    Conservatism has always been about protecting the few, the chosen, and the old way.
    The time they want to retreat to changes, but what never does. And it is the same around the world. Throughout humanity. Over the centuries conservatives have always lost at some point, and then regrouped. If given the choice they will always chose the most barbaric and loathsome policies and attempt to justify them with bullshit. And that is exactly what they are and have been doing for the last 75 yrs. And the 75 yrs before that……….

  128. 128.

    opiejeanne

    @TenguPhule: On this one I am with you.
    mr opiejeanne pointed out to me that the girls had disappeared from the discussion during one of Rachel Maddow’s shows last week. She had an interview with a priest who had visited the 10-17 yo boys at one facility and he was telling how the boys were happy to come to his church, happy to have outings, and that the girls had been happy too but they had stopped coming after they were moved… somewhere.
    Nearby.
    Probably.
    There was almost a helpless shrug when he said he didn’t know where they were.
    The girls in that age group are not discussed. It’s almost as if they’ve disappeared, or are disappearing.
    Moving them around a lot makes it easy for them to disappear, to get lost in the system, to be disposed of.
    I’m sorry this is so dark but this is a dark subject. What happens to girls and women in a society that does not value them as humans, that does not want them here, and is run by misogynists and fascists under a horror like Trump?

  129. 129.

    TenguPhule

    @opiejeanne:

    What happens to girls and women in a society that does not value them as humans, that does not want them here, and is run by misogynists and fascists under a horror like Trump?

    Handmaid’s Tale, updated for INCEL’s worst fantasies.

  130. 130.

    Mnemosyne

    @cokane:

    Also, I’ll make the same bet with you that I offered to Another Scott, payable to the ACLU. If his overall numbers go up again in next week’s poll, I will donate $25 to the ACLU. If they go down, you make a donation in the same amount. Deal?

  131. 131.

    Ruckus

    @Calouste:
    Logic is not, nor has it ever been a conservative strong point.
    It’s almost like logic escapes them entirely.
    One might assume that it is either a mental flaw or a deliberate direction. But seeing as how they seem to be willing to never use logic in any manner, I’m assuming that they think it’s like kryptonite and will rob them of all their manly essence so they fight against it with all the remaining brain power they have. I’ll leave it to your imagination as to how much is remaining.

  132. 132.

    J R in WV

    @Kay:

    ….The Trump people are running it. You just know it’s a chaotic mess.

    Yes, chaos, and these prisoners, these children, depend upon these Nazis for everything, food, water, medical care.

    How long before a contagious disease hits one of these concentration camps, and without any medical care? I can’t imagine what the fascists will say, probably use it to attack the weak and sickly foreigners…

    Every dead baby is a murder, on top of the already committed kidnapping crimes. This is criminal, and child protective services everywhere these camps exist should be filing arrest warrants.

    The owners of the companies contracted to run these concentrations camps should be in jail right now awaiting trial for child abuse. If that implicates Republican office holders, which I am certain it will, I’m OK with that.

  133. 133.

    MisterForkbeard

    @Mnemosyne: …Do you mind if I just cut to the chase and give $25 to the ACLU? I say this as someone who agrees with you that Trump’s numbers will probably go down (though not much), but the ACLU is a damn good way to spend your money.

  134. 134.

    J R in WV

    @cokane:

    @ Mnemosyne:

    Also, I’ll make the same bet with you that I offered to Another Scott, payable to the ACLU. If his overall numbers go up again in next week’s poll, I will donate $25 to the ACLU. If they go down, you make a donation in the same amount. Deal?

    I got a better deal: BOTH of you make a contribution, don’t wait!! I’m on a monthly schedule, myself …

  135. 135.

    opiejeanne

    @J R in WV: damn! I forgot to consider how many or few of these kids have been vaccinated for anything. One kid with measles or chickenpox or whooping cough, just one, could cause some to die, and the number of dead could be increased by the incompetence of management.

  136. 136.

    Redshift

    I posted a reply on Twitter to a “just enforcing the law” wingnut which seems to have been pretty effective in shutting him up:

    Unauthorized border crossing is a misdemeanor. This administration *chose* to establish a “zero tolerance” policy of charging and jailing everyone who does it. There is discretion in our legal system to allow for what is humane and what is an effective user of limited resources.

    Unless you believe that jailing everyone suspected of shoplifting and sending their children to a detention center would also be “just enforcing the law,” there is no way to pretend the Trump Administration is not responsible for these inhumane acts.

  137. 137.

    cokane

    @Mnemosyne: i dunno why you have to turn things into a dick measuring contest. again, you made several statements in this thread that were misinformation. i proved they were misinformation and now you’re pulling the “wanna bet?” frat boy move. look, you posted misinformation. stop doing that.

  138. 138.

    Redshift

    Trump’s approval fluctuations are basically just statistical noise. He never breaks out of a narrow range, so there’s really no point to claiming anything “caused” a change, or that any action should be taken in response. If he ever goes outside that range, then we can talk.

  139. 139.

    Felanius Kootea

    @cokane: Interesting language. When did she grow a dick?

    Why are you so invested in Trump’s popularity in polls? How does that change what you do in opposition to him?
    Are you unaware of the fact that Democrats have been winning special elections and are poised to take back the House in November
    if we focus and have a turnout similar to or better than that of the primaries (thus far)?

    It would be nice to also take back the Senate, difficult though that might be, but it doesn’t help to have people telegraphing the message
    that things are hopeless because “Trump is popular” among people polled by Gallup. There is a war online to sway people into giving up hope
    of changing the current situation (FB, twitter, blogs). Careful what you choose to contribute to.

  143. 143.

    Another Scott

    @Mnemosyne: Meh. :-)

    That Trump has always been underwater in major polls (like Gallup). His disapproval ceiling seems to be around 60%, his approval floor seems to be around 35%. He’s been bouncing around between there for, what, 2+ years?

    But the eyeball recent trend line on Gallup since around early March has been up. He’ll probably bounce back off that 45% approval wall (his maximum in January 2017), but maybe he wont.

    Either way, IT IS NOT IMPORTANT.

    What IS important is doing what we can do flip to House and Senate and state governments.

    Eyes on the prize, folks. We have the makings for a huge wave. Let’s not discourage each other. We have to do what we can – together.

    141 days to go.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  147. 147.

    patrick II

    @JGabriel:

    In line with Homeland Security Secretary Kirstjen Nielsen’s insistence that these families are only “posing as families,”

    If they are just posing as families, those are some of the youngest and most accomplished child actors I have ever seen or heard. When they cry “mama” or “papa” with such immense heartfelt sadness or look up for help with tears streaming down their cheeks with such abject misery in their face that it bores into their heart of every decent person, I have to admit I was fooled. Such manipulative babies and children should be jailed if we are cruel enough to do it.

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