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You are here: Home / Economics / C.R.E.A.M. / Tuesday Morning Open Thread: Even A Prince Is Not Above Mueller’s Law

Tuesday Morning Open Thread: Even A Prince Is Not Above Mueller’s Law

by Anne Laurie|  June 26, 20184:43 am| 128 Comments

This post is in: C.R.E.A.M., Foreign Affairs, Open Threads, Russiagate, Assholes

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NEW: Special counsel obtains Trump ally Erik Prince's phones, computer https://t.co/DIpPrp8RBH

— Yashar Ali ? (@yashar) June 25, 2018

Prince is another dangerous Banana Republican grifter who I’d be happy to see frogmarched, so this story met my requirements for Happy Daily Uplift:

… Prince, America’s most famous private military contractor, acknowledged last week that he “cooperated” with Mueller’s investigation of Russian interference in the 2016 presidential election after falling under scrutiny amid questions about an alleged effort to establish a backchannel between the Trump administration and the Kremlin, something Prince has vehemently denied.

ABC News has since learned that Mueller is also reviewing Prince’s communications, a sign that Mueller could try to squeeze Prince, as he has others, probing potential inconsistencies in his sworn testimony in an attempt to pressure him to turn into a witness against other targets of the investigation. In response to questions from ABC News, a spokesperson for Prince released a statement noting that Prince has provided Mueller with “total access to his phone and computer.”…

In April 2017, the Washington Post reported that Prince, whose sister Betsy DeVos is President Donald Trump’s education secretary, had traveled to the Seychelles in January following Trump’s election for a secret meeting with a Russian official with close ties to Russian President Vladimir Putin.

Prince testified before the U.S. House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence in November that he hadn’t made the trip “to meet any Russian guy” and described his meeting with Kirill Dmitriev, the Putin-appointed head of Russia’s sovereign wealth fund, as a chance encounter “over a beer.”

ABC News reported earlier this year that Mueller has obtained evidence that calls that testimony into question…

And that’s not the only potential inconsistency in Prince’s testimony before the House Intelligence Committee that appears to have caught the attention of investigators.

Prince had a simple answer when asked by Rep. Eric Swalwell, a Democrat from California, whether he ever had any “investments” or “business partnerships with Russian nationals.”

“Zero,” Prince replied.

Two of Prince’s former business associates, both of whom asked to remain anonymous, told ABC News they have been contacted by investigators probing a pair of proposed business deals between the Hong Kong-based security firm Frontier Services Group, of which Prince is the founder and chairman, and Russian nationals.

One former business associate, who has worked with Prince since the 1990s, recounted a recent conversation with FBI agents from Mueller’s office.

“Are you aware of any falsehoods in the testimony that Erik Prince gave to the House Intelligence Committee?” the associate said agents asked him.

The associate said he told the agents about Prince’s previously undisclosed alliance with Dimitriy Streshinskiy, a former Russian special forces soldier turned arms dealer and manufacturer…

Another former business associate told ABC News that he was approached by the FBI about Frontier Services Group’s dealings with the Russian state-owned energy firm Rostec. According to the former associate, Rostec asked Prince’s Frontier Services Group to work on logistics for a proposed refinery operation in Tanzania and Uganda.

“Frontier Services Group was trying to build a relationship with Rostec to be the logistics guys,” the associate said, “and Rostec met with Erik.” …

…[F]or Rep. Swalwell, a Democrat on the House Intelligence Committee, the renewed focus on Prince is a welcome sign.

“I have a lot of questions about whether he was being straight with us,” Swalwell told ABC News. “I’m heartened to hear that the special counsel is doing what Republicans on the committee were not willing to do … and follow up and not take Mr. Prince at his word.”

 
Of course, Prince has his own private fortune to stand between him and justice…

“The legal fees were suffocating.” https://t.co/ACakwMjMsk

— VICE News (@vicenews) June 25, 2018

every single one of them has vastly more resources to secure a legal defense than 99% of people who come into contact with the justice system. And 100% of people who get their kids stolen from them at the border.

— zeddy (@Zeddary) June 25, 2018

Yeah, I can well remember when all the finest Repub media outlets were encouraging Ken Starr’s hopes of bankrupting the Clintons over Watergate Whitewater even if they’d done nothing wrong (beyond being Democrats, that is). Also relevant, threatening crushing lawsuits has been Trump’s go-to tactic for not paying contractors any time during the last forty years. So my sympathy for the “suffocating fees” punishing these weasels is somewhere well into the negative numbers.

(So UNCIVIL!)

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Reader Interactions

128Comments

  1. 1.

    sukabi

    June 26, 2018 at 5:09 am

    If Prince voluntarily turned over his computers and phone to Mueller, you know damned well that they aren’t the ones with the dirt…

  2. 2.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 5:23 am

    Good Morning Everyone ???

  3. 3.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 5:24 am

    @sukabi:
    Uh huh
    Uh huh ?

  4. 4.

    The Ancient Randonneur

    June 26, 2018 at 5:30 am

    In that last paragraph you wrote Watergate. Did you mean to write Whitewater?

  5. 5.

    satby

    June 26, 2018 at 5:33 am

    @rikyrah: Good morning ?!

    @sukabi: pretty confident Mueller and his team would be aware of that.

  6. 6.

    Anne Laurie

    June 26, 2018 at 5:43 am

    @The Ancient Randonneur: Duh! Thanks — road trip is finally over, but brains have not yet returned to normal mode.

    Off to bed, for now!

  7. 7.

    The Ancient Randonneur

    June 26, 2018 at 5:45 am

    As Prince never paid a meaningful price for his employees murdering innocent Iraqis, I hope Mueller rolls him up and he ends up in a prison cell between Paul Manafort and Roger Stone.

  8. 8.

    The Ancient Randonneur

    June 26, 2018 at 5:48 am

    @Anne Laurie: Congratulations on surviving and you’re welcome.

  9. 9.

    OzarkHillbilly

    June 26, 2018 at 5:55 am

    acknowledged last week that he “cooperated” with Mueller’s investigation

    They all “cooperate”, right up to the point they get indicted. Then they cooperate. Except Manafort, but he has a preexisting condition that can be fatal if untreated.

  10. 10.

    Platonailedit

    June 26, 2018 at 5:58 am

    America’s most famous private military contractor infamous mercenary.

    Assholes.

  11. 11.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    June 26, 2018 at 6:00 am

    OT: I was going though some of my old Milky Way shots(the ones shot last year) to see if I could improve the look since I’ve learned a great deal since I took the pics. Here’s one that I think turned out well.

  12. 12.

    JPL

    June 26, 2018 at 6:02 am

    @Anne Laurie: Sweet dreams!

  13. 13.

    Mart

    June 26, 2018 at 6:02 am

    Remember when it was in very poor taste to call them mercenaries? So rude.

  14. 14.

    Platonailedit

    June 26, 2018 at 6:06 am

    "The enemy of the people," Trump says pointing at the free press at the back of the room.

    https://t.co/T1mBA0Gl2K— Steve Peoples (@sppeoples) June 26, 2018

    And yet they still kiss his fugly ass. Talk about codependency.

  15. 15.

    MagdaInBlack

    June 26, 2018 at 6:12 am

    @Platonailedit:
    Civility, what does it mean?

  16. 16.

    geg6

    June 26, 2018 at 6:14 am

    @Platonailedit:

    And they lecture us about civility.

  17. 17.

    J R in WV

    June 26, 2018 at 6:16 am

    @sukabi:

    If the devices Prince turned over to Mueller’s team aren’t the ones that Mueller’s team have files from, that would be a felony, akin to false swearing. Prince thinks he plays a swift game, but he’s dealing with the real counter-intel professionals now. They have a lot of data to compare new offerings with, and they had better match up with already recorded communications, or else!

    I can’t think of anyone (outside Trumpelstiltkin himself) I would rather see nailed by high-tech methods than Prince and his sister.

    PS… My Nym and email were gone again, although they were there before. Same session as I haven’t turned off my device lately.

  18. 18.

    J R in WV

    June 26, 2018 at 6:19 am

    @?BillinGlendaleCA:

    Billin, your photo looks great. Both the Joshua trees in the foreground and the starstruck sky. Do I see a tiny line along the edge of the hilltops? Is that where the two photos are merged? Could one of the focus-stacking tools do that a little slicker???

    Still, the photo is great!

    ETA: Now my Nym and email seem to be sticking again. No clue to what made them go away, maybe closing all my Balloon-Juice tabs?

  19. 19.

    JPL

    June 26, 2018 at 6:21 am

    @MagdaInBlack: Be Best bully you can.

  20. 20.

    Platonailedit

    June 26, 2018 at 6:23 am

    @MagdaInBlack:

    The thug knows the press cowards will not call him out.

  21. 21.

    Bruce K

    June 26, 2018 at 6:26 am

    I hope Mueller’s team is as skilled and professional and thorough as reports seem to indicate. And I hope I live long enough to see them make a movie of it – if all goes well, it’d be the Apollo 13 of political thrillers (in that the jarring, suspension-of-disbelief-breaking elements are true).

  22. 22.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    June 26, 2018 at 6:30 am

    @J R in WV: Actually it used part of the focus stacking workflow(auto align layers), but it didn’t work well in this case. I’d already fixed a problem on the right hand side, now I see there’s one of the left(possibly caused by what I did on the right).

  23. 23.

    J R in WV

    June 26, 2018 at 6:31 am

    It looks like when I edited comment 18, the Reply tag went away. For me at least. I’ll see if an update gets it back now.

    Nym and email are still there…

    ETA1 And when I posted this comment, the Reply tag reappeared on comment 18. I wonder if this edit will make it go away temporarily?

    ETA 2 the reply looks invisible after the first edit, I’m surprised I got to try a second edit.

  24. 24.

    Platonailedit

    June 26, 2018 at 6:33 am

    @J R in WV:

    As bill o’ racist says, it’s like tides, they come and go and we don’t really know why.

  25. 25.

    Kay

    June 26, 2018 at 6:48 am

    Matthew Yglesias
    ‏@mattyglesias
    11h11 hours ago
    More Matthew Yglesias Retweeted Amy Fried
    Once again the vast majority of mainstream political journalism has gotten played by an obvious bad faith con job.

    Republican Congressman on Monday introduced an initiative to censure California Democratic Rep. Maxine Waters and ask for her resignation after she encouraged others to confront Trump administration officials.
    Rep. Andy Biggs, R-AZ., introduced a measure calling on the congresswoman to apologize to the White House for “endangering their lives and sowing seeds of discord,” resign from her position, and release a public statement saying harassment or violence isn’t a form of protest.

    Why is Maxine Waters the only politician being punished for civility infractions?

    Good job, pundits and political news people. More excellent work. We now have two standards of behavior- a lower standard for the president and his administration and a higher standard for everyone who is not the president or a member of his administration. Literally everyone. Any random member of the public is now held to a higher standard of behavior than the President.

    This is ludicrous. It’s ridiculous. No one will follow this standard, this new “norm” they invented over the last 24 hours, because it will make no sense to people, and it shouldn’t. It’s never been applied to anyone except Donald Trump.

  26. 26.

    OzarkHillbilly

    June 26, 2018 at 6:56 am

    @Kay:

    Why is Maxine Waters the only politician being punished for civility infractions?

    Ummmm, let’s see: She’s Black. She’s a woman. She’s a DEM. Does that cover it?

  27. 27.

    Kay

    June 26, 2018 at 6:56 am

    The Prince family, including Betsy DeVos, have devoted their entire lives to funneling public money to private entities.

    They are people who espouse government contracting. Their business model depends on public funding. It’s not even an ideology. It’s just a contract. They are people who encourage, start, run and profit from public funding of private businesses. That’s the long and short of what they “believe”. They move money around- take it from public entities and transfer it to private entities. The only way they “make” money is to skim some of the government funding off the top.

  28. 28.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    June 26, 2018 at 6:56 am

    @Platonailedit: It’s lunacy.

  29. 29.

    Kay

    June 26, 2018 at 7:04 am

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    Is Sarah Sanders going to be held accountable for using her government account and official position to complain about a restaurant? What about Donald Trump using his position to try to put the restaurant out of business?

    Are there rules or not? Maxine Waters is the single politician who has to follow the two tiered standard of behavior?

    They’re not promoting civility. They’re discrediting the whole idea by applying it inequitably and (also) stupidly.

  30. 30.

    Kay

    June 26, 2018 at 7:11 am

    @ddale8
    Follow Follow @ddale8
    More Daniel Dale Retweeted Frank Pallotta
    Fallon says Trump was lying when he claimed Fallon called him to say his episode got big ratings. (Boy Scouts, president of Mexico, news anchors, probably US Steel — Trump is often lying when he says someone called or wrote him to give him a compliment.)Daniel Dale added,

    Lying to people is disrespectful. When Trump or Sanders or Kelly or Sessions lie to people, they are disrespecting those people. Tricking them. Making fools out of them. And they do it every day.

  31. 31.

    Thoughtful David

    June 26, 2018 at 7:15 am

    @J R in WV:
    I’m guessing Mueller has the phones and computers that were at the other end of some of the communications, and just wants to confirm MAC numbers and things like that from Prince’s. So it doesn’t matter much if Prince has scrubbed his devices.

  32. 32.

    OzarkHillbilly

    June 26, 2018 at 7:17 am

    @Kay: trump encourages his supporters to attack protestors at his rallies, but Chuck Schumer “strongly disagrees with harassing people who don’t agree with you” in a restaurant.

    This isn’t about disagreements Chuck. This is about blatant fascism and you need to grow some balls.

  33. 33.

    Kay

    June 26, 2018 at 7:21 am

    Amanda Carpenter
    ‏@amandacarpenter
    Follow Follow @amandacarpenter
    More
    One question: What 2020 Democratic presidential contenders have condemned the comments by Maxine Waters?

    I actually wondered about this, whether the “condemnation exercise” would reappear now that Trump has violated every single norm.

    I have my answer! It will be applied, but only to members of the public and Maxine Waters.

    This is worse. They actually managed to go from “no standards” to “standards, but for everyone but the President and the people who work for the president”. They made it worse. Now in addition to being uncivil it’s also horribly unfair.

  34. 34.

    Dorothy Winsor

    June 26, 2018 at 7:23 am

    My Happy Daily Uplift often comes from Lin-Manuel Miranda’s tweets. Here’s last night’s good night tweet

    Gnight.*DIVES into your subconscious like Neo in the Matrix, f*ckin evaporates any anxiety, stress, or Heffalumpian imagery that isn’t fun or sexy or both*Okay. The way's clear. Have good dreams.— ?? Lin-Manuel Miranda ?️‍? (@Lin_Manuel) June 26, 2018

  35. 35.

    Kay

    June 26, 2018 at 7:24 am

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    It’s kind of nice for Maxine Waters in a way. They’ve set this up so there’s two tiers- the public and Maxine Waters (higher expectations for behavior) and then all other “senior government officials” (lower expectations for behavior)

    She’s with us! She’s in our category! She’ll probably be more popular now, not less.

  36. 36.

    debbie

    June 26, 2018 at 7:26 am

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    FWIW, you’ve just nullified Michelle Obama’s “Go High” principle.

    I have to leave for work so I can’t continue the discussion, but I’m not sold on this public shaming. I’ll stick to my one-on-one humiliation. I agree that it’s no different from that crapcake baker, but that was also wrong.

  37. 37.

    J R in WV

    June 26, 2018 at 7:27 am

    @Thoughtful David:

    So it doesn’t matter much if Prince has scrubbed his devices.

    Except that it would be illegal for him to have destroyed evidence, or to be falsely claiming that the devices he turned over at the real ones if they’re not.

    And my Nym is gone… It was working for me while everyone else was going south, and now it’s broken for me. Darn it.

  38. 38.

    debbie

    June 26, 2018 at 7:27 am

    @Dorothy Winsor:

    I also follow him. He is relentlessly cheerful.

  39. 39.

    Platonailedit

    June 26, 2018 at 7:28 am

    @?BillinGlendaleCA:

    Well played.

  40. 40.

    Luthe

    June 26, 2018 at 7:30 am

    I saw the most hilarious bumper sticker yesterday. It said “MUELLER 2020”

  41. 41.

    JPL

    June 26, 2018 at 7:37 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: Chuck also said

    “But the president’s tactics and behavior should never be emulated. It should be repudiated by organized, well-informed and passionate advocacy. As Michelle Obama, a person who represents the same kind of fineness that we’ve always had in America … said, ‘When they go low, we go high,’”

    I disagree because going high has not worked out in the past, but he did call the pres.

  42. 42.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 7:38 am

    Uh huh
    Uh huh
    For the civility police

    https://twitter.com/jg_environ/status/1011475118760095744

  43. 43.

    Cheryl Rofer

    June 26, 2018 at 7:38 am

    Prince, America’s most famous private military contractor mercenary,

    FTFY

  44. 44.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 7:39 am

    @Kay:
    Keep on telling it, Kay.

  45. 45.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 7:40 am

    @Dorothy Winsor:
    He is pretty positive. Except when it comes to Dolt45 and Puerto Rico.

  46. 46.

    OzarkHillbilly

    June 26, 2018 at 7:42 am

    @Kay: She is certainly more popular with me. Also this:

    Ally Maynard
    ‏
    Verified account

    @missmayn
    Follow Follow @missmayn

    If I can’t go to Planned Parenthood for a routine pap smear without being screamed at and harassed by Christian protestors then Stephen Miller shouldn’t be able to eat his fucking salad without being called an asshole.

    11:43 AM – 25 Jun 2018

    via commentator<a href="@teve tory: “> teve tory at OTB.

  47. 47.

    Immanentize

    June 26, 2018 at 7:42 am

    @Kay:
    I saw this in the primaries as well. Trump pulls everyone down into the gutter. In the gutter he is King.

  48. 48.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 7:45 am

    @?BillinGlendaleCA:
    That was beautiful ?

  49. 49.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 7:46 am

    Maxine Waters brought receipts ??

    https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1011562214006935552

  50. 50.

    EZSmirkzz

    June 26, 2018 at 7:50 am

    Good morning AL. In general let me say:

    There is something to said for the wisdom of cutting off your nose to spite your face, and whether that applies to the current situation and you personally I’ll leave to y’all, because I can’t tell you how to respond to things such as Sanders and Trump puke up on a daily basis.

    But I refuse to be shaped in thoughts words or deeds by low life’s. I will not become the ying to their yang. Their’s is not the change I want to see or become.

    Having read many of the tut tutting voices of the ‘Very Serious People’ about public outbursts directed towards members of the administration only reinforces my opinion of them as either ossified relics of a bygone era, or the blind leading the blind. They would not have tolerated this behavior from the conservatives if they were not in fact sympathetic to their values, nor exposed their hypocrisy if they were not either blind or ossified.

    But I will say this, anyone, anyone, who is outraged by the policies along the border has and ally in me, and I welcome you whole heartedly to outrage at inhumane behaviors by our government towards those whom, like their own fore-fathers, left home and country behind because it was not safe for them and their families to remain among their own countrymen, under penalty of death.

    I refuse to be ruled by hatred, in my heart or theirs. It really is just that simple.

  51. 51.

    Platonailedit

    June 26, 2018 at 7:50 am

    @Kay: Who is this amanda? Another courtier media minion? More than the white men, it’s the women in media that stick up for this sexist fugly thug that are annoying.

  52. 52.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    June 26, 2018 at 7:50 am

    @rikyrah: Thanks, but J R in WV’s right, it’s not quite lining up right; I’ll fix it later today.

  53. 53.

    Kay

    June 26, 2018 at 7:52 am

    @JPL:

    He better get used to denouncing. Now that they know he’ll do it they’ll be back! The Ritual Denouncing is a pundit staple.

    Now, of course, it applies exclusively to Maxine Waters and the owners of one restaurant in Virginia, so now it’s completely nonsensical where it was merely boring before, but they’re sticking with it anyway.

    They don’t know how to deal with Trump. They keep going back to the well for the methods they’ve always used. None of them fit this situation but you know, when all you have is a hammer..

    They need to find a new approach. Everyone does. The old rules won’t work when the Trump Administration doesn’t follow them. That’s not fair and people won’t accept it.

  54. 54.

    OzarkHillbilly

    June 26, 2018 at 7:53 am

    @debbie: reasonable people (you and me of course) can reasonably disagree. The trump admin people are not reasonable.

    @JPL: I figured he had, but as sins go… well, separating children from their parents in the name of ethnic cleansing, oops, my bad, I meant “controlling our borders”, isn’t even in the same ball park as causing indigestion.

    I am all about treating people with the same respect as I would like to be treated with, however after I reach a point of being repeatedly treated like shit (lied to from day one) I no longer feel any desire to control my inner asshole.

  55. 55.

    Sanjeevs

    June 26, 2018 at 7:53 am

    Sir Alan Duncan, the foreign office minister, says the UK government is increasingly concerned about the health of Julian Assange, who has been in the Ecuadorian embassy evading arrest for almost six years. If Assange were to leave, he would be treated humanely, Duncan says.

  56. 56.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 7:54 am

    MLK had these muthaphuckas ? nailed 50 years ago ?

    https://twitter.com/BreeNewsome/status/1011387874061750278

  57. 57.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 7:57 am

    Joy Reid visited one of the internment camps

    https://twitter.com/JoyAnnReid/status/1011483987825524736

  58. 58.

    Kay

    June 26, 2018 at 7:57 am

    @Platonailedit:

    Well, this “norm” they’ve come up with won’t work. No one will accept a norm that only binds less powerful people. It’s unfair and ludicrous.

    They’re kind of bad at this. They might want to get out of the sociology business and go chase down some facts or something. No one turns to them for moral guidance. I wouldn’t, because they are such poor judges of character.

  59. 59.

    Platonailedit

    June 26, 2018 at 7:58 am

    @Kay:

    You literally petted that animal’s head in fucking teevee, jimmy. Now you are whining that it ate your face? Fuck off.

  60. 60.

    OzarkHillbilly

    June 26, 2018 at 7:58 am

    @rikyrah: Thank you.

  61. 61.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 8:02 am

    More from Joy

    https://twitter.com/JoyAnnReid/status/1011483987825524736

  62. 62.

    AlienRadio

    June 26, 2018 at 8:03 am

    If, He’s got everything tight enough to go for Prince, he’s got to be VERY close to the core conspirators, The only people left are the Mercers, Wayne LaPierre, Mitch McConnel, Paul Ryan, Devin Nunes and Rudy Giuliani. Maybe Scott Pruitt If he’s not just been running a massive Grift.

  63. 63.

    Kay

    June 26, 2018 at 8:04 am

    @realDonaldTrump
    Follow Follow @realDonaldTrump
    More
    Early this year Harley-Davidson said they would move much of their plant operations in Kansas City to Thailand. That was long before Tariffs were announced. Hence, they were just using Tariffs/Trade War as an excuse. Shows how unbalanced & unfair trade is, but we will fix it…..

    The President is attacking another private business, because they embarrassed him with a business decision.

    The norm police might want to release Waters and arrest this high-ranking norm violater. He’s dangerous. Will anyone have the balls to call him out for this? He’s using his office to harm this company. That’s not okay.

  64. 64.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 8:06 am

    Say it for the bleacher seats

    https://twitter.com/RAICESTEXAS/status/1011473040729755649

  65. 65.

    OzarkHillbilly

    June 26, 2018 at 8:06 am

    @AlienRadio: The only people he’s got left is the entire GOP.

  66. 66.

    Kay

    June 26, 2018 at 8:07 am

    Every single Republican should be asked to denounce the President’s decision to attack Harley Davidson.

    If they aren’t then this isn’t a “norm”, it’s a double standard, and no one should comply with it.

    Fairness is important. It’s where credibility comes from.

  67. 67.

    danielx

    June 26, 2018 at 8:12 am

    Once again, my man David Brooks sets out one of those pieces you don’t have to read. All you need is the title.

    Republican or Conservative, You Have to Choose

    One more piece of apologia in which Brooks draws an artificial distinction between your imaginary ideal conservative and Republicans, as though there is a difference between the two. This from a man who has spent the last three decades enabling teh crazy which has infected Republican brains like fucking rabies.

  68. 68.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 8:16 am

    More leaked footage

    https://twitter.com/rgoodlaw/status/1011419876076982272

  69. 69.

    Vhh

    June 26, 2018 at 8:20 am

    @Kay: Enemies list.

  70. 70.

    NotMax

    June 26, 2018 at 8:24 am

    Lady Macbeth’s hands are cleaner than are Prince’s.

  71. 71.

    OzarkHillbilly

    June 26, 2018 at 8:36 am

    Words I thought I would never type: The Missouri GOP shows the national party how to deal with an out of control cheif executive.

    The GOP-led Missouri House committee tasked with investigating allegations against Greitens found evidence that he engaged in “multiple acts constituting crimes, misconduct, and acts of moral turpitude,” according to a scathing Monday letter from committee chairman. A “super-majority” of the panel’s members would have recommended the governor’s impeachment on those grounds, Republican Rep. Jay Barnes wrote.

  72. 72.

    But her emails!!!

    June 26, 2018 at 8:45 am

    @rikyrah:
    I noticed this the other day, that the standard the media seemed to be enforcing was that it was only OK to shit down, not up. The rule doesn’t seem to apply to Republicans though.

    Case in point. The media is going on and on about how Maxine Water’s comments might somehow lead to a confrontation that escalates to violence. Seems sort of mum about the fact that Sanders’ and Trump’s comments have already led to vandalism and threats of violence against the Red Hen and several establishments with similar names.

  73. 73.

    MomSense

    June 26, 2018 at 8:53 am

    @Kay:

    Why is Maxine Waters the only politician being punished for civility infractions?

    This is the media and republicans telling Maxine she is too uppity. She needs to know her place.

    It’s racist AF and chilling to see how the media get rolled every time when their implicit bias impels them to accept bullying and authoritarianism. They also expect to never be held accountable which is why pundits and experts who are always wrong are still on my tv and in the papers every GD day.

    The other thing that is really causing me to want to smash things is the way the media and republicans keep focusing on the reactions to policies (another word that takes away agency) instead of the viciousness of the actions. Babies are ripped out of their mother’s arms while breastfeeding. That action is cruel. It is torture. It is a crime against humanity. These stolen children are then secreted away in the middle of the night to places unknown. It is not just some policy disagreement that can be debated civilly. The president suspended due process. That is a bedrock principle of democracy. The media and republicans are more upset about Huckabee Sanders being asked politely to leave a restaurant or Maxine correctly pointing out that we are each of us called to act to disrupt the authoritarian assault on human beings and our democracy than they are with a president asserting that he can unilaterally suspend the fifth amendment of our constitution. Seems like a fucking big deal that demands a response, no?

  74. 74.

    JPL

    June 26, 2018 at 8:54 am

    @But her emails!!!: You would think that calling the press the enemy of the people would be mentioned.

  75. 75.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 8:57 am

    @?BillinGlendaleCA:

    I dunno, Bill. It’s the combination of the plants/trees, combined with the Milky Way – that’s why it’s beautiful to me :)

  76. 76.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    June 26, 2018 at 8:59 am

    Off topic, but the next time a Wingnut whines about Trump officials being publicly shamed, point out they were just publicly servicing themselves over a cake shop refusing to make a cake for a gay couple. What goes around comes around.

  77. 77.

    JPL

    June 26, 2018 at 9:01 am

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques: Nothing is off topic at the place where we might not remember your nym.

  78. 78.

    The Ancient Randonneur

    June 26, 2018 at 9:02 am

    @rikyrah:

    Did you watch Maddow last night? Video of that little girl is still in my head.

  79. 79.

    OzarkHillbilly

    June 26, 2018 at 9:02 am

    Josh Marshall:

    When it comes to protests, mean words, civil disobedience, boycotts, public shunning, we may disagree when one or other is wise or called for. But these are entirely legitimate tools of political action, civic action. Many calls for civility are simply calls for unilateral disarmament from those protesting injustices and abuses of power.
    …………………………..
    One might further note that it is simply too comical to be lectured about social decorum by a party whose members shouted “You lie” at a President during a State of the Union address and made Donald Trump their party leader. But even that is really beside the point. What does matter is where we draw the lines of what’s legitimate and what’s not. Most of the civility talk isn’t about any real red line, any boundary that is critical to the kind of free society we want to preserve and build. It’s more a wet blanket meant to tsk tsk legitimate protest and legitimate resistance to corrupt government, misrule and injustice.

  80. 80.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 9:03 am

    @Bruce K:

    .

    And I hope I live long enough to see them make a movie of it

    Can’t be a movie. It will be a limited Netflix event, of about 12-15 episodes :)

  81. 81.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 9:06 am

    @Kay:

    The Prince family, including Betsy DeVos, have devoted their entire lives to funneling public money to private entities.

    They are people who espouse government contracting. Their business model depends on public funding. It’s not even an ideology. It’s just a contract. They are people who encourage, start, run and profit from public funding of private businesses. That’s the long and short of what they “believe”. They move money around- take it from public entities and transfer it to private entities. The only way they “make” money is to skim some of the government funding off the top.

    SAY IT AGAIN FOR THE BLEACHER SEATS!!

  82. 82.

    germy

    June 26, 2018 at 9:08 am

    I see a new political party is forming: SAM

    Serve America Movement: On June 18, 2018, former Syracuse Mayor Stephanie Miner, after expressing informal interest in the Working Families and Reform nominations, entered the gubernatorial race as a third-party candidate.

    Miner “plans to run under the banner of an upstart new group, the Serve America Movement, which calls itself SAM, formed by people disaffected by the existing party structure after the 2016 elections. She will be the group’s first candidate.” Miner intends to circulate petitions to create a SAM Party in New York.

    Nominee: Stephanie Miner, former state Democratic Party chairwoman and mayor of Syracuse
    Running mate: Republican Michael Volpe

    I’m suspicious.
    http://joinsam.org

    Their main focus right now seems to be “civility”

  83. 83.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 9:08 am

    @Kay:

    The norm police might want to release Waters and arrest this high-ranking norm violater. He’s dangerous. Will anyone have the balls to call him out for this? He’s using his office to harm this company. That’s not okay.

    No. It’s not Okay. But, will they say shyt?
    Hmmph.

  84. 84.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 9:11 am

    @MomSense:

    This is the media and republicans telling Maxine she is too uppity. She needs to know her place.

    Thank goodness Maxine Waters isn’t Corey Booker.

    Maxine Waters is an Elder Black Woman. It’s her makeup to absolutely, positively not to give one single, solitary phuck.

  85. 85.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 9:14 am

    @MomSense:

    It’s racist AF and chilling to see how the media get rolled every time when their implicit bias impels them to accept bullying and authoritarianism. They also expect to never be held accountable which is why pundits and experts who are always wrong are still on my tv and in the papers every GD day.

    Which is why, Kay, is correct. The ‘common man’ has seen this, and is fed up, and is taking steps – for himself – to fight on the ground. I have been gratified by social media lighting up the mushmouth muthaphuckas who thought they were gonna shame folks for cheering on those who have been going after the GOP. They have been told to sit down and STFU, cause nobody is playing with you. This HAS now morphed into good vs. evil, and the pundits seem to be the last to know, but nobody is playing with them.

  86. 86.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 9:16 am

    @The Ancient Randonneur:
    Maddow and LarryO.
    The pain in that child – multiply by thousands…
    and, they wonder why folks are done with civility.

  87. 87.

    The Ancient Randonneur

    June 26, 2018 at 9:16 am

    @germy:

    GOP stalking horse written all over it.

  88. 88.

    Neldob

    June 26, 2018 at 9:18 am

    Greg Gianoforte never seemed to be much of a problem for the civility enforcers.

  89. 89.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 9:18 am

    @germy:

    I’m suspicious

    Come sit by me.

    Side eyeing these muthaphuckas.

  90. 90.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 9:19 am

    What Rachel Maddow exposed on her show provided proof that the Trump administration is running a migrant child kidnapping ring with no thought of reuniting families. https://t.co/VdhC56UvsT pic.twitter.com/86ZHtuF4JB

    — Sarah Reese Jones (@PoliticusSarah) June 26, 2018

  91. 91.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 9:19 am

    @germy:

    WHO.IS.FUNDING.THEM?

  92. 92.

    germy

    June 26, 2018 at 9:21 am

    @rikyrah: Good question.

    They strike me as a bunch of republican centrists trying to rebrand themselves. I have a feeling they’re “pro business” and “concerned about the spiraling cost of entitlements” (I don’t see this on their website, but that’s the vibe I get)

  93. 93.

    Mike j

    June 26, 2018 at 9:21 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: He’s already gone. Pretty easy for them to stand up to him now.

  94. 94.

    EZSmirkzz

    June 26, 2018 at 9:21 am

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: Undoubtedly the universe is unfolding as it should. I think that’s an excellent shot, love the earth lighting juxtaposition with the alpha quadrant.

  95. 95.

    MomSense

    June 26, 2018 at 9:23 am

    @rikyrah:

    She is the leader of the resistance because she speaks the truth and claims her power.

  96. 96.

    germy

    June 26, 2018 at 9:23 am

    @The Ancient Randonneur:

    GOP stalking horse written all over it.

    Rotary Club types too embarrassed by trump to call themselves republicans?

  97. 97.

    Jeffro

    June 26, 2018 at 9:24 am

    @Kay: The Post’s article on this is so on-point, they oughta call it a, um, compass point. Something REALLY sharp, anyway! ;)

    Here you go, folks:

    Trumpov Threatens Harley-Davidson With Taxes ‘Like Never Before’

    President Trump on Tuesday threatened the iconic motorcycle company Harley-Davidson with severe taxes and a public revolt that would eventually put the 115-year-old firm out of business, blasting the Wisconsin firm for a plan to move some operations outside the U.S. as a way to avoid getting caught in the middle of an escalating trade war.

    Trump also accused Harley-Davidson, without providing any evidence, of intentionally misleading Americans by saying the firm was moving some operations out of the U.S. in response to new tariffs imposed by the European Union.

    The intensity of these attacks, which he typically only uses when referring to political opponents, came in a series of Twitter posts.

    (the Twitter posts are quite insane)

    I was feeling bold, so I had to tweak my RWNJ dad and brother over all this:

    Speaking as an American first and liberal second, I’m perfectly fine if Trump’s eventual intervention is led by America’s CEOs instead of Occupy hippies. Whatever works.

    (please read full article at link to see the prez’s actual tweets against an American company)

    <>

    Keep in mind this started with Trump’s broader tariffs slapped on European goods, which begat the targeted tariffs (such as on Harley-Davidson motorcycles) from the EU. Harley-Davidson moves to shift some production over there (so they won’t get hit with the tariffs) and voila…Trump slams H-D.

    I think we’re going to have to make Economics 101 a job requirement, starting in 2020…

    Catherine Rampell is also compass-sharp this morning (I think she’s enjoying writing about the economic aspects of politics quite a bit, imho)

    Factory Workers Aren’t Getting What Trumpov Promised

    A little more than a year ago, Trump invited executives and union representatives from Harley-Davidson to the White House. There he vowed that the motorcycle manufacturer would flourish under his economic stewardship.

    “Thank you, Harley-Davidson, for building things in America,” he said. “And I think you’re going to even expand — I know your business is now doing very well and there’s a lot of spirit right now in the country that you weren’t having so much in the last number of months that you have right now.”

    This week, Harley-Davidson became among the highest-profile casualties of Trump’s escalating trade wars.

    Trump’s steel and aluminum tariffs had already raised the company’s input costs, because those metals are among the primary raw materials it purchases. Worse, the European Union last week “punched back” against those metal tariffs with retaliatory countertariffs of its own, including an additional 25 percent tax on Harley-Davidson motorcycles shipped from the United States.

    On Monday, the company announced that it had no choice but to shift more of its production out of the United States.

    Harley-Davidson, whose U.S. factories are in Wisconsin, Missouri and Pennsylvania, is hardly the only firm buckling under the weight of Trump’s brilliant trade dealmaking. Don’t take it from out-of-touch East Coast elites like me; check out all the coverage from local papers and other news organizations around the heartland, documenting the damage.

    Mueller will put plenty of these clowns away for good, eventually, but it’s good to see Trumpov finding yet another way to be a drag on his and the GOP’s fortunes this fall.

  98. 98.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 9:24 am

    BREAKING: Republicans helped set up Putin’s lobbying operation in America. You heard that correct. You’re not seeing things. This is real. Republicans helped set up Putin’s lobbying operation in America. Putin’s tentacles are all over the GOP. #TrumpRussia https://t.co/UhQbVlI4Vo

    — Scott Dworkin (@funder) June 26, 2018

  99. 99.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 9:26 am

    BREAKING: Trump isn’t reuniting some refugee families, unless they sign an agreement to be deported. They are kidnapping refugee kids and using them as ransom. Forcing their parents to agree to be deported and drop their case for asylum. Or they don’t get their kids back. Evil.

    — Scott Dworkin (@funder) June 24, 2018

  100. 100.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 9:27 am

    YES…

    MEMORIZE THIS PHRASE:

    “If we are not prepared to defend a tolerant society against the onslaught of the intolerant, then the tolerant will be destroyed, and tolerance along with it.”
    – Karl Popper, 1945 pic.twitter.com/AcbLNz8jIH

    — Mikel Jollett (@Mikel_Jollett) June 26, 2018

  101. 101.

    Jeffro

    June 26, 2018 at 9:28 am

    @germy:

    They strike me as a bunch of republican centrists trying to rebrand themselves. I have a feeling they’re “pro business” and “concerned about the spiraling cost of entitlements”

    ‘spiraling cost of entitlements’? Fuck THAT. They can give me a call once they’ve repealed the GOP’s deficit-nuking tax giveaways to the rich and large corporations earlier this year.

  102. 102.

    Jeffro

    June 26, 2018 at 9:30 am

    @Neldob:

    Greg Gianoforte never seemed to be much of a problem for the civility enforcers.

    Or when Trumpov told a rally crowd it was okay to beat up protestors – he’d pay their legal bills.

    COME ON MEDIA, DO YOUR JOBS!

  103. 103.

    zhena gogolia

    June 26, 2018 at 9:34 am

    I saw last night on twitter (sorry I can’t remember where and don’t remember the exact wording), “One-sided civility is called servility, and it’s a step on the road to fascism.”

  104. 104.

    EZSmirkzz

    June 26, 2018 at 9:37 am

    @germy:

    @rikyrah:

    Good observations, third parties in America are distractions. There is no way Democrats, Republicans, or the media are going to let them get any traction.

    @rikyrah:

    The problem I have with any and all reports like this is the memory of the FBI’s counter intelligence programs, which sound very much like the KGB, and Russian trolling of the last election. I’m not saying I disbelieve the report, only that it sounds too much like what I want to hear. As to it’s veracity, never underestimate the stupidity of some Republicans.

  105. 105.

    Steeplejack (phone)

    June 26, 2018 at 9:39 am

    @germy:

    How about starting with dog catcher or town council and working their way up?

  106. 106.

    Scottspot

    June 26, 2018 at 9:41 am

    @germy: There’s already Third Way? Who needs another chorus to the same song?

  107. 107.

    germy

    June 26, 2018 at 9:42 am

    @Steeplejack (phone):

    How about starting with dog catcher or town council and working their way up?

    No, they want to start with Governor of New York State.

  108. 108.

    Platonailedit

    June 26, 2018 at 9:43 am

    @germy: Yet another nolabels weed that pops out just before election season.

  109. 109.

    Yarrow

    June 26, 2018 at 9:43 am

    @rikyrah: RICO the GOP. Tick tock, motherfuckers.

  110. 110.

    The Ancient Randonneur

    June 26, 2018 at 9:45 am

    @rikyrah:

    Yes and I am still asking:

    Where are the girls?

    Where are the toddlers?

    Where are the infants?

    Fuck civility. Publicly shaming and harassing government officials is not equivalent to putting children in concentration camps or screaming in the face of a private citizen entering a facility to receive her legal and necessary reproductive healthcare. It isn’t equivalent to the law enforcement arm of the government destroying black bodies, because–reasons. It isn’t equivalent to our LGBTQ+ friends, neighbors and family members fearing for their personal safety. Civility is for people who can choose to look the other way. For now.

    Finally, stealing from Yarrow:

    Tick, tock motherfuckers

  111. 111.

    Platonailedit

    June 26, 2018 at 9:52 am

    An Oregon federal judge has granted the ACLU a temporary restraining order against ICE, allowing 121 immigrant detainees in a Sheridan prison access to legal counsel. https://t.co/KSjbzbVF3C— Kyle Griffin (@kylegriffin1) June 26, 2018

  112. 112.

    Platonailedit

    June 26, 2018 at 9:53 am

    Trumpoholics should set their Harleys on fire to own the libs.— Tea Pain (@TeaPainUSA) June 26, 2018

    LOL. I wouldn’t be surprised at all if these numbnutz did it.

  113. 113.

    Platonailedit

    June 26, 2018 at 9:54 am

    For eight years, the far-Right posted pics of President Obama in a hangman's noose and Hillary covered in blood. Now that they've been caught puttin' little children in cages, they cry for #civility.

    Whoever called these snowflakes "deplorable" was right on the money.

    — Tea Pain (@TeaPainUSA) June 26, 2018

  114. 114.

    Platonailedit

    June 26, 2018 at 9:56 am

    Conservatives’ biggest nightmare is bein’ treated like they treat others.— Tea Pain (@TeaPainUSA) June 25, 2018

  115. 115.

    Calouste

    June 26, 2018 at 10:04 am

    @rikyrah: And what does “Sam” mean in Russian?

  116. 116.

    weavrmom

    June 26, 2018 at 10:05 am

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: your picture is sublime! Thanks for posting it.

  117. 117.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 10:05 am

    @Yarrow:

    Tick tock, motherfuckers.

    Never gets old.

  118. 118.

    rikyrah

    June 26, 2018 at 10:06 am

    @The Ancient Randonneur:

    Where are the girls?

    Where are the toddlers?

    Where are the infants?

  119. 119.

    zhena gogolia

    June 26, 2018 at 10:11 am

    @Calouste:

    “myself” (or “himself”)

  120. 120.

    Platonailedit

    June 26, 2018 at 10:13 am

    @Calouste: screw amurka maliciously?

  121. 121.

    germy

    June 26, 2018 at 10:15 am

    When incivility comes from white people it’s economic anxiety. When incivility happens to white people it’s a threat to democracy.
    ?— Marcus H. Johnson (@marcushjohnson) June 25, 2018

  122. 122.

    Calouste

    June 26, 2018 at 10:20 am

    @zhena gogolia: “Myself” is quite appropriate.

  123. 123.

    Ruckus

    June 26, 2018 at 10:21 am

    @OzarkHillbilly:
    First, I can’t like Maxine any more, I’m already at 100% like.
    Second that tweet is perfect.
    I get a possible reason why people would want Maxine to be quiet right now. Not saying I agree, I just can see why that might be better. OTOH fuck civility. They want civil they need to start. They work for us. We pay them. We have an entire enforcement arm of the government to insure that the plebes pay up. But bottom line politics is public employment. We are their employers. We have the right and duty to call them out when they are doing a shitty job. And boy are they doing a shitty job. Which figures, they are shitty people.

  124. 124.

    Blehmann

    June 26, 2018 at 10:38 am

    @rikyrah:

  125. 125.

    cintibud

    June 26, 2018 at 10:40 am

    @Bruce K: Late to the thread, as usual but when I saw your post

    I hope Mueller’s team is as skilled and professional and thorough as reports seem to indicate. And I hope I live long enough to see them make a movie of it – if all goes well, it’d be the Apollo 13 of political thrillers (in that the jarring, suspension-of-disbelief-breaking elements are true).

    I couldn’t help but think of the highlight scene when the Apollo 13 crew made contact after re-entry – they made it! All the people in mission control sprang to their feet and cheered but the stone cold Gene Kranz sank in his chair and wept.. I picture the same think happening when trump is convicted – the nation cheers while Robert Mueller weeps in relief.

    NASA Director: This could be the worst disaster NASA’s ever experienced.
    Gene Kranz: With all due respect, sir, I believe this is gonna be our finest hour.

  126. 126.

    Steve in the ATL

    June 26, 2018 at 11:30 am

    @Kay: written by someone else, though. NFW trump knows the word “hence.”

  127. 127.

    J R in WV

    June 26, 2018 at 12:26 pm

    @AlienRadio:

    If, He’s got everything tight enough to go for Prince, he’s got to be VERY close to the core conspirators, The only people left are the Mercers, Wayne LaPierre, Mitch McConnel, Paul Ryan, Devin Nunes and Rudy Giuliani. Maybe Scott Pruitt If he’s not just been running a massive Grift.

    You think he’s already got “Bishop” Pence the unwary? ‘Cause getting rid of Trump is no good without getting rid of Pence. And I’m not sure he’s “after” Prince as opposed to looking for more nails for Trumpelstiltskin and the white house magats.

    Also, copied from a good man on twitter:

    I was skeptical until I verified these clippings at @nytimes. In 1934, influential religious figures in US argued that Germans did not hate Jews but only supported Hitler out of economic anxiety, & that Jews would be fine if they’d just be civil to Nazis & show good will.

    Chuck Schumer, you need to know this!!!

    my Nym is gone

  128. 128.

    J R in WV

    June 26, 2018 at 12:40 pm

    @?BillinGlendaleCA:

    @rikyrah:

    It is beautiful, well shot, well composed, the Joshua Trees, the distant light from humanity, the very distant remote galaxy we live in, that we can never get much closer to than we are right now. Great philosophically, as well as artistically.

    No one should think I was negative when I see something, as an artifact, in a photograph. Critical as in an opportunity to repair an unwanted artifact of post processing. Bill will fix that tiny line and it will be that much closer to perfect.

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