"Fear has more than 1.1 million copies through its first week of publication, the fastest opening in Simon & Schuster’s history, according to the publisher." https://t.co/edcT89LtkG
— Daniel W. Drezner (@dandrezner) September 21, 2018
Olivia Nuzzi, professional journalist-assassin, sizes up Bob Woodward, professional journalist-legbreaker, in NYMag — “Bob Woodward on the ‘Best Obtainable Version of the Truth’ About Trump”.
IMO, she did a really good job of getting past the old man’s practiced patter and demonstrating just how cozy the Beltway Media Village expected to be with this season’s Temporary Oval Office Occupants, whether or not that warmth is reciprocated — or deserved:
… Entering the author’s home required walking past a stack of the books on the floor. It’s a warm and colorful place, full of eye-catching paintings and, at this particular moment, lots of people and one medium-size dog. Woodward introduced me to his wife, the journalist Elsa Walsh, and then ushered me into a dining room. Over the course of 50 minutes, we discussed his philosophy and methods. But first, my tape recorder malfunctioned in front of America’s most famous journalist…
Nuzzi: I am but a humble newbie, visiting the Great Master…
I wanted to talk to you about how you decide who is credible. It is difficult for me, sometimes, to determine who is credible, even at the most senior levels of the administration at this White House. Mostly at the most senior levels in some ways.
Particularly if it is on the record and public. It is kind of a press release.I agree to a large extent. But I am curious how you decide who is credible. Because somebody like Rob Porter, he is obviously very present in this book. I won’t guess about your sourcing. There is a lot to suggest that his character is — there is a fundamental flaw there.
In what way?Well, by some personal accounts he is a very flawed human being. He is allegedly abusive. There is a lot to call into question his honesty.
Say that again.There is a lot to suggest that he may not be an honest individual, right? So why do you decide to trust somebody like that?
Well, I am not going into the sourcing but there are — you test it with other people and documents and notes and it makes a big difference when somebody tells you something and you get your hand on the document itself. So because I had the luxury of time, of essentially two years to work on this, not quite, even. Ever since Trump was elected you can cross-check and see…
Woodward: I review theatrical performances on the world’s most important stage. Why should anyone expect me to take an interest in the actors’ personal hobbies?
In a review, Isaac Chotiner at Slate asked if you were perhaps the last optimist.
Really? I have not seen this.He had a lot of criticisms of the book and one of them is there is this sort of view, a bias towards the people who cooperated, and they are presented in an almost heroic way.
But see, he does not know that. No one knows that except for myself and my assistant Evelyn.Do you think that is true?
I know it is true.
As a reader, there were a lot of moments in the book that it felt rather obvious — when you attributed feelings or thoughts to the person in question. Whether that was Dowd or Gary Cohn or Rob Porter or Reince Priebus or Dave Bossie, where it just seems rather obvious who they are and that they spoke to you.
As you know, people take notes, and as I said in the beginning it either comes from the person himself or herself or it comes from somebody who recorded it right afterwards…
Woodward: Trust me, for I am known to be a Great Man, and every bit as important as the Great Men whose performance I review with such authority.
I feel as though sometimes I’m checking the account of a White House official who is a known liar against another White House official’s account, and they are also a known liar. And it’s like, well, what do you do?
This is the zoo without walls…… I’m not going to spend a dozen hours or a couple of dozen hours as I did with some people involved without having a trust. And it’s not as you say one White House official who doesn’t tell the truth and another White House official … I think you can penetrate under that for something like a book…
There were times that I was reading it where I thought that I don’t know if I would necessarily trust the principal who appeared to be telling you something. That was mostly with the campaign stuff — but I’m not going to explain reporting to you.
A number of people have said they’ve heard some of these things off the record. Of course that’s the technique people use: “Oh, that’s off the record, we’re going to seal it away,” and not let the public know. And people would say, I want to say this off the record. I said no. No off the record…They don’t put up a fight.
But see then, this isn’t anonymity. This is really the source is confidential but the information and the players are not. So it’s …
Anonymity, even if they’re not removing themselves from the scene …
Well, it’s the wrong word. Because it suggests to people, oh, maybe the reporter doesn’t even know…
Woodward: Apart from the rare unfortunate aberrant person (*cough*Trump*cough*), ALL IS FOR THE BEST IN THIS BEST OF ALL POSSIBLE WORLDS. What part of ‘Media Village’ do you fail to understand, young padawan?
Yes, reporting has changed since the Deep Throat days… for the better, in many ways. Read the whole thing; I’m curious as to your thoughts.
Supplemental reading from Andrew Prokop at Vox, “Bob Woodward’s new book, Fear, explained”:
… [T]hough the book contains many new, never-before-reported details — Woodward reports that Trump wanted to assassinate Syrian President Bashar al-Assad, and considered sending a tweet his aides worried could cause war with North Korea — the book is unmistakably the product of the sources who talked the most to the Washington Post reporter. And those sources have their own agendas.
It’s barely a stretch to say Fear reads as Rob Porter, Gary Cohn, Steve Bannon, Reince Priebus, Lindsey Graham, and John Dowd’s account of the Trump administration. Woodward doesn’t explicitly identify any of these six people as his sources, but he provides pages and pages of their thoughts and motivations.
So yes, Fear offers insight into a dysfunctional policy process, with new details of President Trump ranting, raving, and clashing with aides behind the scenes. But it also tells the particular story that Woodward’s major sources have chosen to tell him, and reflects their points of view and priorities.
Woodward rose to prominence as half of the Washington Post’s “Woodward and Bernstein” reporting duo that helped expose the Nixon administration’s Watergate cover-up, with the crucial help of an anonymous source famously dubbed “Deep Throat.” The scandal led to Nixon’s resignation; it also made Woodward one of the most famous reporters in the country.
Since then, Woodward’s primary aim hasn’t really been to expose deeply hidden scandals (it’s tough to top Watergate, after all). Instead, he’s used his fame and decades of Washington connections to report and write books about what’s going on in the highest levels of the US government.
His past political books have covered the Supreme Court, the Federal Reserve, and several previous presidencies. The books have tried to put readers “in the room,” depicting what happens behind closed doors at these institutions. To do that, Woodward relies on the cooperation and anonymized accounts of top-level government officials — who speak under the shield of “deep background.” …
Cermet
Thanks to the fake news star (aka, fox, which put the “f” in fake) this orange fart cloud will remain in office until voted out in 2020. The real danger to democracy is the corporate ownership of the media. And here I thought banks posed the greatest risk.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
In the spring of 2013 or ’14, there was a Beltway flare-up of the idea that gridlock on Washington was Obama’s fault because he didn’t socialize with Republicans. My recollection is that Woodward was one of the instigators, citing a conversation he had had with Newt Gingrich on the importance of personal relationships in politics. The Grandest Old Man of the Washington Post, the would-be wise man, cited Newt Fucking Gingrich as an authority on importance of civility and good faith bipartisanship.
I’m glad the book is causing trump angst and I hope it causes him more, but Woodward is a self-parody
Baud
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Agree. It’s like how I feel about Comey.
Villago Delenda Est
Booby needs to be flushed down the hatch. Only Broder was more stereotypically Villager.
germy
Woodward is self parody, but I don’t trust olivia nuzzi.
James E Powell
I lack the vocabulary to express how much I despise these people. As one of our own expresses in the nym, Villago delenda est.
Thoughtful David
Woodward doesn’t report, he monetizes gossip. For the benefit of himself.
Suzanne
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
This is a pernicious and noxious idea in so much of public life. Ugh. Extroverts are the worst.
Aleta
The investigative journalist who wrote dialogue for his sources and called that book Bush at War.
And Bush’s reason for invading Iraq? No question, it’s true.
OK, it wasn’t true.
But Bush didn’t lie. He’s a nice guy.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
trumpsters and a few “centrists” have been citing that Woodward found no evidence of Russian collusion in his research among seven trump ex/staffers and Lindsey Graham
schrodingers_cat
@Suzanne: Have you noticed how the ghost of bipartisanship has died since T assumed office. I have yet to read an op-ed advising him to make nice with the Ds.
Steeplejack (tablet)
@germy:
Yeah, she’s a little too “insidery” herself.
patroclus
Bob Woodward’s stories might be accurate and they might not and we’ll never really know because he doesn’t reveal his sources. He purports to write history and, unlike professional historians who provide meticulous footnotes so you can check their work, he doesn’t reveal sources. Not for years or not ever. This is the opposite of professionalism. He takes a reporter’s tools and uses them at a different profession. Which is okay if he just wants to make money or be “interesting” but isn’t if he wants to be trusted. When he is accurate, he deserves accolades. But he is often wrong and when he is (the most notable are his hagiographical stenographies of the Bushes and his defense of Karl Rove), his work is just terrible. That, plus his sanctimonious unctuousness, are why I regard him as utterly slimy.
Sure, I’m pleased that his current money-maker is causing Trump and his cronies angst. But that’s it. I don’t trust Woodward and never will again.
germy
@Steeplejack (tablet): I watched a tiny bit of “The View” and saw Megan McCain mention Nuzzi as a friend of hers.
Nuzzi also thinks Milo is charming, so I wonder if her job here is to attack and discredit the person who wrote a book embarrassing to the PEETUS. Again, I don’t much like Woodward, but I dislike Nuzzi, too.
Mary G
Woodward has the same know-it-all allegedly all-seeing, all-knowing, how dare you criticize, you illiterate peasant attitude that FYFNYT political reporters do. They are so deeply embedded in the trees that they can’t see the forest.
Immanentize
If you all want to start puking with no ending in sight, I recommend you check out Frank Bruni’s paean to Michael Bloomberg as the antidote to Donald Trump. Do it.
As a dietary cleanse.
Steeplejack (tablet)
@germy:
Nuzzi used to be on quite a few of the MSNBC pundit shows but disappeared early this year after there was a sizable Twitter kerfuffle about her extreme coziness with Milo and (I think) Ann Coulter.
I think she may be making a “rehabilitated” comeback, because I think I have sighted her once in the last month.
Baud
@Immanentize:
I confuse my pundits. Is Bruni supposed to be one of those uber-progressives?
Immanentize
@Baud: He replaced Frank Rich and is supposed to be progressive because — Gay! On some issues (like LGBT issues) he is good, but he is talking now like an old man, writing about education as if it was his freshman year at Ol’ Fuckitall in ’82. Grumpy and “kids today!” Bloomberg love is the perfect ending for a once-progressive.
debbie
@schrodingers_cat:
I think that started back with GWB, after the country betrayed the GOP by voting for Clinton twice.
moonbat
@Thoughtful David: You nailed it.
Geoboy
@Cermet: Banks versus corporate ownership of the media. Porque no los dos?
Baud
@Immanentize: So many assholes.
Dog Mom
@Thoughtful David:
So true, about so many – I must remember this phrase and apply it as often as needed – Thank you.
Major Major Major Major
@Immanentize: Bruni should’ve stayed in food criticism.
Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (formerly Mumphrey, et al.)
Bob Woodward is my second cousin, though I’ve never met him. And while I’m thankful for the work he did to bring down Nixon, and I’m glad he put this book out, all the same, he’s monumentally overrated. He’s pretty much been coasting since 1973, it seems to me.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Baud: @Immanentize: wasn’t Bruni “Panchito” in the Bush nickname game?
tobie
A propos of nothing but if you need a pick me up, check out this video of Beto O’Rourke air drumming to The Who. He’s so charming, so relaxed in front of the camera. I’m embarrassed to admit that videos like this make me swoon.
The Thin Black Duke
@Immanentize: No.
danielx
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Irony is alive and well in Washington.
Aleta
Luthe
@Immanentize: I don’t understand how he got a gig as an op-ed columnist. He used to be a restaurant critic for Ghu’s sake!
p.a.
Maybe all of life isn’t Jr. High writ large, but it sure as hell seems DC is. Mean girls is a cautionary tale and documentary/instruction manual at the same time.
Chetan Murthy
@Baud: Bruni was a Shrub apologist, back in the day. I presume Imm is implying that he’s how a Bloomberg fanboi.
PST
@tobie: Yeah, Beto air drumming to The Who plays unbelievably well to at least some of us in our mid-60s. Is it calculated? Who knows. He sure seems relaxed. Truly the antiCruz.
debbie
@Major Major Major Major:
Bruni is the Fredo of journalism. Rich was far better at the restaurant gig too.
dww44
@Thoughtful David: So very apt. FWIW, I cannot abide listening to or watching him in interviews. For one thing, his delivery is so ponderous. He’s so afraid of offending those in his circle that he goes around the bend not to call a spade a spade. I cannot abide that. Haven’t like him for years.
Chetan Murthy
Completely OT, but I gotta point you guise at this amazing post by Maria over at Crooked Timber: http://crookedtimber.org/2018/09/23/owning-the-peanut-gallery/
“Owning the Peanut Gallery” is the title. Here’s a little amuse-bouche: “He may as well have pulled out his shrunken member and asked us to gently assess it.”
Read it all. Read it all. Do NOT be drinking beverages while reading it, or at least, have paper towels ready for cleanup. Read it all.
Another Scott
Via LOLGOP, here’s a thread with Blasey-Ford support rallies around the country today.
https://twitter.com/alexisgoldstein/status/1043713708306911232
It’s gloomy and rainy in DC today. Here’s hoping they get a decent turnout on such short notice and less than ideal weather.
Cheers,
Scott.
catclub
@schrodingers_cat:
That is NEVER the prescription when the GOP is in the Whitehouse. It is also never the prescription for the GOP when a Democrat is in the Whitehouse.
catclub
@Aleta: This is going too far. Next thing you know, there will be laws punishing the people who hire and employ illegal immigrants, (instead of just punishing those immigrants) and all the folks who hire Juan the lawn guy will be upset they have to pay more or run him through the Social Security lookup process first – plus risk punishment for just doing what everybody else does.
sukabi
@schrodingers_cat: Shirley you jest! Bipartisanship is ONLY dragged out for Democrats. The villagers only care about gop opinions / policies / people. But you know that. And I’ll quit calling you Shirley.?
zhena gogolia
@Immanentize:
Hard pass.
zhena gogolia
@Baud:
He’s the man who presented GWB (during the 2000 campaign) as the one you wanted to have a beer with. He will never be forgiven.
zhena gogolia
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Yep.
Frankensteinbeck
@sukabi:
The national press are overwhelmingly Republicans, and it is obvious to them that if everyone were to get together and discuss things with proper aristocratic friendliness, they would all agree that minorities need to be put in their place, the poor forced to work harder, and the rich to receive little gold medals for being almost as awesome as a television pundit. If these things are not happening, someone is being gauche.
sukabi
@debbie: it started with Carter, it was a bit different though, Carter was belittled by the press for “not playing the game”, he didn’t socialize and share cocktail weenies with the villagers, and his own party gave him shit for not following their game plan. He got quite a bit of flack from all sides because he was a “hick peanut farmer”.
Mike in Pasadena
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: One who does not look for evidence like that is unlikely to find it.
Steve in the ATL
@Aleta: Kushner and Russian Roulette? Well played, Councilman Torres.
sukabi
@Luthe: same way chuck Todd went from statistician to political pundit with his own show. What you say, who you know, asses you kiss.
JR
@Frankensteinbeck: I don’t know if they are obviously republicans but aristocracy is the right spin to put on it. They are the courtiers of the American body politic. Sure they’ll accept some liberal reforms here and there so long as the rabble are kept at footstool level.
rikyrah
@Immanentize:
When the Bloomberg runs as a Democrat came up a few weeks ago, I had three words.
Those words have not changed:
Stop and Frisk
Good luck with the Democratic base when you have this as a legacy.??
dimmsdale
Partially OT, but I just finished Sy Hersh’s book REPORTER. Loved it, read it at a gulp. Reads like a whodunnit, or rather a “how he did it”–so I’m a little less inclined to be suspicious of Woodward, provided he’s following source-checking and cross-checking. I will say he ought to keep his ass off the Sunday shows, though; punditry and good reporting don’t necessarily mix. No plans to read his book, though; I end every day feeling like I’ve been dunked in a puke trough as it is.
Ella in New Mexico
@tobie: He was rightfully pumped after that debate. The funny part: they were in line at the Whataburger drive through. Remember how Cruz criticized him for skateboarding in a Whataburger parking lot?
Oh, and apparently every time Ted Cruz releases another nasty attack ad, Beto’s campaign donations get some wings. Nine million in August alone.
catclub
@dimmsdale: Somebody else recommended the new Michael lewis book – The Fifth Risk that comes out in a week.
He is very readablef or me.
MoxieM
@Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (formerly Mumphrey, et al.): While we’re at it, I used to babysit Frankie Bruni from time to time, with the other neighborhood girls, at the summer place. Based on knowing many generations of the (lovely) family, no particular reason to think he’d be a hard core progressive.
Ivan X
@dimmsdale: Thanks for this tip — just bought it.
Anne Laurie
@rikyrah: I still think Mike Bloomberg uses these breathless ‘some people say, maybe this time he’ll run!’ interviews as a no-cost-to-him method for exploring the all-important Media Village Courtier zeitgeist. Worst case, he gets free media as a Macher to Whom Attention Must Be Paid; best distant-possibility case, things have somehow evolved to the point where the response is Well, in such parlous times, perhaps…
And you know that every time such a piece is published, it deeply irks all the other NYC finance-billionaire guys, actual or pretended, including the current Oval Office Occupant. Which has to be fun for Mike, since he’s still sensitive about being dismissed about some grubby little pencil-pusher from out of nowhere (Medford, MA).