What this asshole thinks doesn’t merit the front page of the Washington Post, but even a blind pig finds an ear of corn sometimes, and this visually impaired Chester White has a point: Trump’s immigrant booga-wooga scare tactics don’t work in the places where Republicans need them to work in the future, places like Texas and Arizona.
People like Bundy who live near the border are surrounded by immigrants and understand them. If you live in Arizona, for example, you’re used to being stopped by Border Patrol agents whenever you get within 20-40 miles of the border, and you know that immigrants play an important role in the economy that probably has nothing to do with you losing your job. You are also surrounded by law-abiding, family-loving, gentle and kind co-workers, neighbors and friends who are recent immigrants or have relatives south of the border. A rag-tag caravan of a few thousand men, women and children doesn’t scare you, and even though you might be a hater in general, you’re still bothered by watching kids that look like your neighbor’s children get tear gassed.
Trump is executing a strategy that simultaneously lowers the excitement of white males in border states, and energizes new, young women and minority voters. When even a useful idiot like Bundy won’t buy it, you need a new strategy.
Frankensteinbeck
I have seen no sign of this. Republican turnout in the midterms was excellent. Republicans running from Trump appears to be anecdata.
THIS has been crystal clear and gigantic.
OzarkHillbilly
@Frankensteinbeck: In my precinct turnout was noticeably down. Won’t venture as to why.
foucault swing voter mistermix
@Frankensteinbeck: Perhaps I should have said that his strategy doesn’t provoke white suburban females in border states to vote for Republicans out of fear.
Frankensteinbeck
@OzarkHillbilly: and @foucault swing voter mistermix:
Overall, Republican turnout was high. That does leave room for some Republican constituencies weakening and others strengthening.
The Moar You Know
My wife’s got relatives in that shithole nation of Ohio, who are literally sending her emails that run along the lines of “how can you live there, aren’t you scared?” They think 3000 women and children – and FWIW, it’s not 3000 but somewhere around 500 tops – are something to be terrified of. We have over 500,000 people (you read that right) who cross the border here every single day. You would not even notice an additional 3000.
She usually replies “yes, of icy roads and 5 degree highs”. More than 2/3rds of my life has been spent within 30 miles of the Mexican border. They’re just people. Even the Trumpies who grew up here speak some Spanish.
OzarkHillbilly
More suited to an OT, but I got to pass this on: Woman spends 3 months in jail when cops think cotton candy is meth
schrodingers_cat
@Frankensteinbeck: It has at least inspired 5 people I know IRL (myself included), six if I count BJer ruemara, to apply for citizenship. Its both to express solidarity with other immigrants and knowing that you could be next on the hate list, even if you are one of the “good” ones right now.
OzarkHillbilly
@Frankensteinbeck: For certain sure, not saying you are wrong, just that here in the heart of trumpistan, turnout was noticeably down. I was surprised.
balconesfault
I would have to think that the Bundy’s and their ilk realize that every step to crack down on immigration requires even more and more Big Government – and they far and away fear Big Gummint more than they fear some more brown people.
mark
The eastern part of Washington State, where I live, has a lot of Hispanics. Lots of big agriculture over there too. Wheat, apples, pears, etc. Lots of illegal workers. The government doesn’t do anything about it. The east part of the state is reliably red. Their economy would collapse if Trump started rounding up illegals.
Yarrow
@balconesfault: Building the wall involves eminent domain land seizure from white ranchers at the border. They are not happy about that prospect.
The Moar You Know
@balconesfault:
It’s far simpler than that. Who do you think is doing the labor on their “ranch”? THEM? Oh hell no, that is not how it works here, never has. Oh, I’m sure the old man feeds some of the horses, and Ammon probably drives around and yells at the few help, but nothing more.
Urban West/Southwest would work, albeit with huge disruptions and inconvenience, without Hispanics. The rural West cannot. The Bundy ranch would be a cleared spot that would be overgrown and indistinguishable from the rest of the desert it’s in within five years without the labor of Hispanics.
donnah
Good grief, “shithole nation of Ohio”? Come on.
I have lived in SW Ohio all my life. I’ve travelled all over the country, and have seen some beautiful places to live. But we have a good cost of living, my city is vibrant and friendly and my sons got a great education here. We have our roots here. We have had ups and downs as a city, but we keep going.
I’m disappointed in the election results, but we kept Sherrod Brown and he’s a good, solid man and an intelligent voice for us in the Senate. Yeah, we have a large number of assholes in Ohio, but we have good, smart people here, too. Show me a state who doesn’t have both.
Besides, everyone knows all the assholes are in Indiana. ;-)
Olivia
Of the people I know who live in Arizona and the southwest in general, it’s mostly the transplants from the northern states who are scared to death of the migrants. These people stick to each other in groups from the same little towns that they came from and never get to know anyone who looks or speaks differently from them. Most of them don’t realize that that whole section of the country was settled by Spanish speakers centuries earlier.
Ian G.
The MAGAts will be saying Soros got to him in 3….2….1….
This actually doesn’t surprise me much, not when you realize how little the Congresscritters who represent border districts want the wall. Even the wingnuts among them know it’s bullshit, and they (rightly) worry about eminent domain abuse.
schrodingers_cat
I know who will be happy with T’s rhetoric, my ex friend, the yoga teacher. Our estrangement actually began when she was scared of the central American children who according to her were in reality ISIS, bringing in Ebola. This was just before the 2014 midterms and I called her out on her bullshit.
raven
@Olivia: Yep, my old man was fucking awful about it when he moved out there . DuPage County Republican forever
Yarrow
@Olivia:
Also, The Villages in Florida.
Doug Gardner
@donnah: Hello fellow SW-Ohioan! I agree with your assessment of our state, though I certainly wish we were trending a bit more blue than we have been recently. I was stunned to see Dewine win, for example. In closing, as the son of Indiana natives who had the sense to escape to Ohio decades ago, your final comment (snark, I know) about Indiana is spot on!
Ceci n est pas mon nym
I get your general point but offer Sheriff Joe and the people who voted for him as counter examples.
The Dangerman
We’re gonna need all sorts of new workers to rake the forests, but we are gonna need Donald to show us the proper technique. I wonder if he could do an acre before crapping out?
FlipYrWhig
@schrodingers_cat: They were Spanish-speaking Middle Eastern terrorists spreading an African disease? Good lord.
Ocotillo
Of course Bundy will never be an ally but it is heartening to see the teeniest bit of erosion of Trump support happening. Make no mistake, Bundy will vote for Trump in 2020 but Trump’s margin of error is razor thin. He ran against probably the most damaged (by 25 years of right wing media harping) Democratic candidate he could have and only barely won with all of the other things helping him as well such as Russia, electoral college, voter suppression, Zuckerberg etc….
Unless the nation is suddenly overcome with apathy, he is toast in 2020. Democrats cannot be complacent though, they have to win other races down ballot so they can begin the process of “unrigging” elections the next decade.
If any good comes of the Trump years, my hope is it turns out that progressive voters are awakened to the need to participate in all elections no matter how far down ballot.
Kraux Pas
@FlipYrWhig:
It was right-wing, fear-mongering propaganda being pushed by the MSM. No one said it had to make sense.
FlipYrWhig
@Kraux Pas: Still that’s a rather tightly rolled ball of Otherness, isn’t it…
louc
@Yarrow: Yes, the Villages of Florida is a shithole nation.
Spanky
Alexandra Petri alone has returned to tell thee:
cain
@donnah:
Hey now! Us hoosiers are just fine out here. Maybe there are assholes in the rural places, but my home town of West Lafayette is awesome. I would put my city against any small town in America know that we are reliably awesome people who have produced some incredible talent that I think is unusual for a small town, and not just because we have Purdue here. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Lafayette,_Indiana and/or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lafayette,_Indiana.
Kraux Pas
@FlipYrWhig:
It is. Yet reading this phrase now has me more focused on putting together some sort of convoluted appetizer.
Ceci n est pas mon nym
@Kraux Pas: We just got back from stocking up at the produce store (I love retirement!) and I always stop at their box of lemongrass and wish I knew what to do with it. I love the flavor in Thai food but the actual grass is a little intimidating.
I’ll bet a really good cook could make a really wonderful ball of Otherness with the lemongrass, plus the plantains (green and ripe), jicama, cactus pears, and other exotic goodies at that store.
Kraux Pas
@Ceci n est pas mon nym:
I often see people simply put it in water and drink it.
I’d have to learn how to cook plantains, I was never a huge fan but I always come back to foods I didn’t previously like. Hadn’t tried the others. Man, I wish I could afford exotic goodies.
I was floating somewhere around basil leafs and mozzarella balls, but failing to find an addition to really give it some pizzazz.
Ceci n est pas mon nym
@Kraux Pas: I actually have worked with plantains a lot. The green ones you treat like potatoes, and if you boil them and mash as you would to make mashed potatoes, you get a classic Caribbean comfort food called mangú.
The yellow ones you let get really ripe, actually black. Then cut them up and fry them to make another classic dish, maduros. (If you do that with the green ones, it’s called tostones.)
You can tell if a store knows their plantains if they carry both ripe and unripe.
TenguPhule
@The Moar You Know:
Please stop finding good points in Trump’s evil doing. //
Ceci n est pas mon nym
@Kraux Pas: Jicama I never had till Thanksgiving. Apparently it’s popular with my daughter’s in-laws. Her husband grew up snacking on it. They put it out raw on the relish plate with the dip. Kind of a mild radish in flavor and texture.
Kraux Pas
@Ceci n est pas mon nym: I tried tostones in Puerto Rico in 2008. Wan’t a fan. Still, a decade is a long time, might as well give it another shot.
Man, that was the same week Obama was elected. I can’t believe it was that long ago. This was the only time I ever voted absentee. I love the way they do elections in PR. People were out in the streets waving candidate banners, shouting, and honking their horns in over-capacity open-top jeeps. There was so much excitement about it.
@Ceci n est pas mon nym:
Ooh, I’m into that. I do like me some root vegetables.
rikyrah
How Mueller can use the Manafort plea to get around the White House — if he wants
By Deanna Paul
November 28 at 7:00 AM
Special counsel Robert S. Mueller III on Monday accused Paul Manafort — President Trump’s former campaign chairman — of breaching his cooperation agreement. In doing so, Mueller may have created the opportunity to release information outside of grand jury indictments and a final report, sidestepping acting attorney general Matthew G. Whitaker.
Manafort’s attorneys disputed allegations that he had repeatedly lied to federal agents since entering the deal in September. Mueller vowed to file a detailed sentencing memo with the court “that sets forth the nature of [Manafort’s] crimes and lies, including those after signing the plea agreement.”
Now, the public could potentially see details from the special counsel’s investigation in the Manafort sentencing memo and its accompanying hearing, which will likely involve details about alleged contacts between Russians and the Trump campaign.
catclub
@Frankensteinbeck:
I still want as much reporting on GOP turnout efforts as Democratic turnout efforts. It is running under the radar.
Kraux Pas
@Frankensteinbeck:
This would only be true if it were between 0 and 27%
Big Mango
Even a blind squirrel touches his nuts from time to time…..
Suzanne
@Olivia:
It’s the Midwesterners and the LDS, actually. AZ is filled with New York, SF, and LA transplants, and most of them are cool.