Jonathan Swan has reported that the President’s planned compromise to end the shutdown includes:
The offer is expected to include Trump’s $5.7 billion demand for wall money in exchange for the BRIDGE Act — which would extend protections for Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA) — and also legislation to extend the legal status of Temporary Protected Status (TPS) holders, according to a source with direct knowledge.
CNN’s Jeremy Diamond’s sources have confirmed Swan’s reporting:
A source familiar with the 3pm speech confirms this @jonathanvswan scoop to me.
Trump is expected to propose a extending DACA & TPS protections (BRIDGE Act) in exchange for his $5.7 billion wall demand https://t.co/mQTp5EDQQe— Jeremy Diamond (@JDiamond1) January 19, 2019
The problem at this point is that the issue of immigration has escaped the lab, mutated, and taken on a life of its own.
ICE refused an order of supervision and is not budging. No criminal history. She also sees her MD weekly and the doctor's very concerned as well. Mother and child's life both may be in danger. @ICEgov – This makes no sense and could have tragic results. 2
— (((Greg Siskind))) (@gsiskind) January 18, 2019
Siskind provided further details on his blog:
On Wednesday we were contacted by Ricardo Loza, the husband of Carmen Puerto Diaz. Mrs. Puerto Diaz and her husband, a US citizen, were attending a green card interview at the US Citizenship and Immigration Services office in Memphis. At the interview, Carmen was informed that she had an in absentia removal order and was being arrested by ICE. An in absentia removal order means that she was ordered deported by an Immigration Court. Carmen was not aware that she had this order. She does not have any criminal history. The removal order is based on her being in the US without documentation.
Carmen is five months pregnant and is facing a high-risk pregnancy along with hypertension. She is on special medication and sees her obstetrician every week to two weeks. Along with being told to take her medication, she has been told to avoid stress. Carmen informed ICE in Memphis through an interpreter about her complicated pregnancy and the medication she takes every 12 hours which she had in her purse. The officer asked her husband to go and get Carmen’s her medical records and then they would release Carmen. When he returned less than an hour later, he was informed she was not being released.
After that, our office was contacted. Johnna Main Bailey at our law firm was in communication with the Memphis ICE office and requested Carmen be released on an order of supervision. ICE declined and she was transported to the Mason, TN detention center more than an hour from Memphis. We also worked with a Congressman’s office to no avail. As of this writing, Carmen is on an eight-hour bus ride to ICE’s La Salle Detention Center in Jena, Louisiana.
CARMEN HAS SPOKEN TO HER HUSBAND AND WE LEARNED SHE HAS NOT BEEN ALLOWED TO HAVE HER MEDICINE SINCE BEING DETAINED. She reports feeling dizzy and unwell, worrying symptoms that are consistent with her diagnosis. ICE actually forwarded the assisting member of Congress their policy that detainees are entitled to take their medications, something that they are ignoring. Furthermore, she is under obvious extreme stress. IN SHORT, HER LIFE AND THE LIFE OF HER BABY ARE AT RISK.
We have partnered with a firm in Louisiana to help on the ground there. Woody Scott, an excellent New Orleans-based attorney, has filed a medical parole application with the Jena ICE facility asking for Carmen’s release after she arrives. He has been told that this is unlikely.
So what can you do? While we are going to pursue action in court, every minute Carmen is in the detention center, she is at risk. We need to let ICE officials at Jena, at ICE’s district headquarters in New Orleans and ICE in Washington, DC know that Carmen’s situation is unacceptable and they need to release her to get proper medical care.
Because it’s Friday night, we think efforts are best focused this weekend on the La Salle detention facility in Jena. Their phone number is (318) 992-7800.
We also think letting the ICE New Orleans Field Office know the situation is unacceptable will help. Their phone number is (504) 599-7800 and their email address is [email protected].
Feel free to let ICE national know what you think. Their Twitter account is @icegov.
Thanks everyone. Greg Siskind
Here’s his latest update:
Update on Carmen – A few folks that have gotten through to ICE officials at Jena have said that due to all of the attention, they took Carmen to a physician this evening. Not confirmed, but good news if true. Hopefully the pressure will continue and she will be released soon.
— (((Greg Siskind))) (@gsiskind) January 19, 2019
Carmen's husband Ricardo was able to speak with her this morning and we learned that after 48 hours she got her medication (she takes it every 12 hours).We're working on getting her released and we believe your phone calls to ICE & letting your representatives know are helping. 1
— (((Greg Siskind))) (@gsiskind) January 19, 2019
But this isn’t the only egregious and out of control action taken by ICE this week. They’re in the process of deporting an amputee asylum seeker while his asylum case is still pending and they took away the potential asylee’s prostheses.
https://twitter.com/MatthewHoppock/status/1085983384545972224
ICE also scarfed up and held for deportation a US citizen born in and from Michigan who is a Marine Corps veteran suffering from Post Traumatic Stress.
A Marine veteran with PTSD was held for three days for possible deportation before authorities learned that he was a U.S. citizen born in Michigan, lawyers said. https://t.co/lzfMWmyJtv
— NBC News (@NBCNews) January 18, 2019
Back to Swan’s reporting:
The backdrop: A source privy to the negotiations told me the inflection point for Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell was the letter from Nancy Pelosi telling Trump not to deliver the State of the Union. McConnell had been saying all along that Pelosi and Trump needed to negotiate because one needed to put a bill on the House floor and one needed to sign it — two people with singular power.
- But after Pelosi’s letter, the source said, it became clear to McConnell she was “never going to get off her position and some other spark needed to happen.”
McConnell told the president that it was his view that Pelosi was never going to move. She would and could not negotiate on border funding because of her caucus, and Trump needed to be the one to put something forward he would sign so that McConnell would have the presidential backing to bring it to the floor.
- McConnell also encouraged Trump to make the offer tantalizing to Democrats; it couldn’t be something that only Trump would sign and Republicans would support, but something that could win over some Democrats.
- The Pence-Kushner-McConnell meeting on Thursday night solidified the plan. McConnell did not try to write the bill for them; this bill is the culmination of Kushner and Pence’s conversations with some Democrats and an inventory of proposals they discussed. Democratic whip Dick Durbin is Kushner’s closest Democratic ally in the Senate after they worked together on criminal justice reform, according to White House officials.
The big picture: Advocates for the plan argue that by offering the new proposal, Trump is showing he’s willing to negotiate while Pelosi remains unmoved. But even some top Republicans are skeptical Trump’s overture will be enough to break the logjam.
The real problem here is that there is no way for Senator McConnell to guarantee that by the time the President gives his speech, let alone by the time McConnell can get it to the floor of the Senate on Tuesday, then through an even expedited cloture process and over to the House by Wednesday or Thursday, that the President will not have changed his mind again under pressure from Stephen Miller, Anne Coulter, and Rush Limbaugh. There is also no way, even Speaker Pelosi and the Democratic caucus in the House were to agree on this, to easily put the wicked djinn that the President, Stephen Miller, Anne Coulter, Rush Limbaugh, Steve Bannon, and their fellow white supremacists, xenophobic, and nativist fellow travelers have released back into the bottle. It doesn’t matter that not only has ending DACA been enjoined by the Federal courts, but that the Supreme Court has punted on it for this year, meaning that the protections that the executive order that created DACA remain in place for at least another year. It doesn’t matter that Carmen, and immigrants like her, is here legally, has a green card, and isn’t supposed to be subject to deportation. It doesn’t matter that Lance Corporal Jilmar Ramos-Gomez was born in Grand Rapids, Michigan. It doesn’t matter that Valladarez Diaz is a double amputee with close relatives residing in the US who would be at extreme risk if deported back to his native Honduras. Even if the President were a reliable interlocutor, even if he could be relied on not to flip flop on what he will and will not sign again, even if he did actually sign it, as long as he’s President and the Republicans control the Senate, ICE and C&BP are not going to stop doing what they’re doing. The worst elements in each agency have been encouraged and empowered, just as they have within American society. And that empowering has, unlike tax cuts for the wealthy, trickled down.
https://twitter.com/2020fight/status/1086476619877765120
https://twitter.com/lulu_says2/status/1086552871674368001
https://twitter.com/lulu_says2/status/1086579888591536133
You’ll notice the adult chaperones of these fine, young parochial school students in the background. They were in DC for the March for Life.
No agreement with the President is going to actually bring relief to the Dreamers or to those who have fled to the US under Temporary Protected Status because no matter what legislation the President might or might not agree to sign, too many of the worst elements in ICE, C&BP, and American have now been empowered to just do whatever they like.
Open thread!
Adam L Silverman
I’m off to the gym and some other locations. I’ll catch up with you all and the comments later.
Cheryl Rofer
Baud
I don’t know what the terms of a good deal are, but Dems can’t hold out forever if Trump starts offering real things. Public opinion will turn against us, and we’ll be in even worse shape.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Cheryl Rofer: Good god, are they still chanting build that wall in the background
Major Major Major Major
And so of course J-Kush and Il Douche came up with nothing of the sort.
Baud
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Save that video for the next time people say the kids are all right.
hells littlest angel
Hard to understand how someone so young can be such a hateful shit-head.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Corner Stone
I would have paid good money for someone to step forward dressed like Janet Jackson and yelled, “Gimme a beat!” and someone tosses her a wooden baseball bat.
Cermet
@Baud: Yet if an acceptable deal is hammered out, and then the orange fart cloud turns around and doesn’t sign it, then the fault falls again squarely upon him. So, we’ll see if there is any real deal; if so, the dems can pass it and if the orange turd refuses to sign, the pressure hits the thugs and the public knows it. This all supposes they offer a real attempt at a deal.
Mary G
I trust Nancy SMASH to not get rolled, but Adam is right. The administration doesn’t care what the law says and will just keep doing what they are doing.
Corner Stone
Also too, why in the world couldn’t Team Mueller just keep their fucking mouths shut like they’ve doing for 18+ months now. *This* is what they feel the need to fight against? Assholes.
Cheryl Rofer
Here’s some advice from a lawyer. Apparently the school is well aware that they’ve got a problem – they’ve made all their social media accounts private. And I saw one report that the diocese has made a statement along the lines of “We’re looking into it.”
Citizen Alan
I don’t consider trump supporters to be functionally human. There, I said it. They might as well be orcs for all the benefit they give to the human race.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
This is from February, 2016. He wasn’t even the nominee yet, I think we were saying even that couldn’t happen. And if you google, as I did “build the wall high school basketball”, this is happening a lot. A lot. And, again, a Catholic school. This is the culture that produced Kavanaugh
debbie
@hells littlest angel:
Parroting their parents.
MattF
There’s a long record of Trump claiming he’ll make a very big (huuuuge) public statement about something and then not actually saying (or doing) anything significant. It’s most likely a con of some sort. That’s who he is and what he does.
Baud
@Cermet: Agreed on all points.
Baud
@MattF: This too.
rikyrah
You read these stories and inch closer and closer to the ABOLISH ICE position.
Please tell me what Congressional committee has oversight of ICE.
Who is the Democratic chair of said committee??
Thoughtful David
So, Nancy comes back and says ok, but DACA is made permanent, we’ll increase border security to $5.7 B but no wall, and we cut the $5.7 B from ag subsidies to keep the budget balanced, and no leases for oil can be offered in Bears Ears or the Arctic NWR until 2021 at earliest.
Baud
This supposed deal is probably a scheme by McConnell to take some of the increasing focus off of himself.
Mary G
Also, the fact that Twitler’s announcement keeps getting pushed back says to me that he’s throwing a tantrum and refusing to give that bitch anything, because he will look weak.
rikyrah
@Cheryl Rofer:
Phuck that shyt.
Doxx these muthaphuckas.
They were all big and bad.. Let them be big and bad?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Cermet: @Baud: maybe Nancy Pelosi should make an announcement that she’s thrilled to hear that the president is ready to compromise and she is too! and then as her counter offer roll out a bill first thing Tuesday (?) morning that ties the Dream Act (and more) to Wall, and let eminent domain stop Wall
MazeDancer
Covington Catholic put all their social media on lock down. Twitter is protecting them from trending higher because they will only count the full school name. Not the @ name most people are using.
David Farenthod tweeted that the Cincinnati Enquier was covering the story.
Thank you, Cheryl for tweeting Elder Phillips vid.
Nancy has to counter or the media will shift all blame to her. Full DACA, path to citizehship. $2 bil for border security incl fence repair,, no new wall.
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
Thanks to this shitshow, the Violence Against Women Act expired on December 21st.
The Midnight Lurker
THIS. JUST. MAKES. ME. SICK.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@rikyrah: they’ll be doxxed, or as good as, by other kids. This isn’t the first time this smarmy little bully has bullied. Live by Instagram, et cetera.
schrodingers_cat
I trust NP to do the right thing.
Dorothy A. Winsor
What kind of school is this that even the chaperones didn’t step forward to stop this? Aside from how ugly it is in the moment, cell cameras mean it’s going into the internet equivalent of this kid’s permanent record.
hells littlest angel
@debbie: Of course.
AlcoholFamily: the cause of, and solution to, all of life’s problems.Plato
Ugly american is not a stereotype.
Thoughtful David
@rikyrah:
Yeah, they all made the effort to get their MAGAt hats. This wasn’t spontaneous.
But I would give the school and parents until, say, 6 pm today to announce some serious punishment. After that and no clear sanctions? Doxx their asses.
Brachiator
A few random thoughts.
Trump sure seems to depend on Jared to be his roving counselor. Is this guy really that smart?
Trump tries to hold DACA kids hostage to get his way. But, as Adam points out, this is a loser strategy.
As long as Trump communes with the spirits of the demons of Fox News for advice and guidance, he ain’t never going to be a trustworthy negotiator.
What the Trump brain trust (Pence, Kushner and McConnell) is mighty thin. Are they really after something else?
Trump is truly a petty, cruel man, who enjoys hurting federal workers, immigrants, anyone he deems unworthy. And he inspires cruelty in his supporters. It is really disheartening to see some of the country reduced to this. Fortunately, there are people who will not let this stand.
PPCLI
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: @Thoughtful David:
And crucially Nancy should say: “This gives us a basis for negotiation. We are all agreed that border security is crucial, and we look forward to working together on it. But to get anything done, we first need to end the hostage situation, open the government, and stop forcing people to work for no pay while we negotiate.” Part of the Democratic position must be that the shutdown and the border negotiations are completely separate things, and they are happy to do the second, but the first has to happen now. Make sure that the shutdown part is still in the Republican corner.
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
@??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??:
Just so it’s clear, I blame Trump and the GOP for this.
hells littlest angel
@Plato: No, it’s more like an ethnicity, a subgroup of white.
germy
Aww. Won’t someone think of the young white racist boys?
The adults in their lives who saw them wearing red hats and swarming a Native American vet… those adults will deal with it, right?
geg6
Monsters. We live among millions of monsters.
sukabi
@hells littlest angel: probably raised in a house where there is alcohol or other drug abuse, abuse and lots of hate directed at “those people”.
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
Jesus fucking Christ! I have no words for this horrifying shit except that this is evil.
geg6
@germy:
Yeah, fuck them. If they get doxxed, they brought it on themselves.
Josie
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Not a good idea in Texas. As one who has fought the good fight, I can tell you that eminent domain will win.
FelonyGovt
@germy: Yeah, it’s hard to feel any sympathy for these little bullying shitheads. They put themselves out there and knew they’d be all over the Internet. Screw ‘em.
Doug R
I dunno.
The fact that Mitch has emerged from his shell and is willing to let his name be spoken makes me think this deal may stick. If trump flakes on Mitch, the stopwatch to the Senate no longer backing trump starts.
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
@germy:
Those little shits didn’t even know or care who he was or what he had done. All they knew was that he was a non-white enemy who didn’t matter; a joke to be mocked. I’m so disgusted right now, especially with that pasty-faced brat that was in that man’s face.
The video that panned around to show the surrounding mob was also disgusting. So many of then were dancing in a stereotypical imitation of Native American dancing. They’re scum.
Gelfling 545
@Brachiator: Smarter than Trump, which doesn’t mean much.
Baud
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: I trust Nancy. I have less faith in the million expert dealmakers on social media who think they could have done better than Nancy.
schrodingers_cat
@Brachiator: What has been disheartening for me is that whenever T or his team make some half-hearted noises about DACA, people give him the benefit of the doubt start acting like he is being reasonable. The DACA and TPS crisis are T created crises.
scav
I can feel the Christian western civilizing superior moral and family values from here. Such compassion, neighborliness and civility!
ETA: No doubt their school uniform is a brown shirt.
B.B.A.
Bash the fash.
gene108
@Baud:
Save thes videos the next time someone says the demographic wave will make Republicans extinct.
Baud
@schrodingers_cat: The media does that. Most of us here are just trying to figure out how to muddle through.
laura
They have been carefully taught.
Nuke every non-public school from outer space. This was the obvious result of working around Brown v. Board. This is the result of private school -so young Chad Douche doesn’t ever have to live among, relate to, respect or empathize with non-Chad Douche.
Private school -be it religious, charter, wealth-driven ought to be outright outlawed and in the meantime should not be siphoning off our tax dollars.
I have much hope that young Chad Douche gets a righteous comeuppance. I wish him karmic payback in his young lifetime.
Steeplejack
@hells littlest angel:
Naw, you’ll be fine once all us old racists die off.
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: Not just the media. Some commenters over here have been saying the same thing for the last several weeks, that the wall for DACA would be an acceptable deal to them. I can pull up the receipts if you want.
Baud
@schrodingers_cat:
I think that’s part of muddling through. People have legitimately different views about what an acceptable deal looks like. I don’t think anyone here thinks Trump is being magnanimous or is giving him the benefit of the doubt or doesn’t recognize that these crises are all his doing.
Baud
I didn’t click the link because NYT, but here’s what appeared on my feed.
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
@gene108:
I thought the point of that was that whites were becoming a progressively smaller part of the population and subsequently the electorate.
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: Okay I now see what you are saying. I am also glad that NP and her negotiators are made of sterner stuff and will not accept a wall for the crumbs T throws our away.
Brachiator
@schrodingers_cat:
This is true. As I said (I think), Trump holds the DACA kids hostage and pulls them out now and again to dangle in front of the Democrats.
But Trump’s position has not really changed. And some people don’t get it. And it’s not just that he is influenced by scum like Stephen Miller. Trump, like an idiot is fixated on certain ideas. The Wall is one. The other is the idea that certain nonwhite people simply do not belong here and must be pushed out. This includes people who are legal immigrants and even citizens. His demonizing of immigrants and claims of criminals and terrorists trying to get across the border is all in service of this vile idea.
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: @Brachiator: T’s offers about DACA are those of an arsonist setting fire to a house, and then offering a bucket of water to contain the blaze.
But Trump’s position has not really changed. And some people don’t get it. And it’s not just that he is influenced by scum like Stephen Miller. Trump, like an idiot is fixated on certain ideas. The Wall is one.
You get it.
JPL
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Add more money to wall unless they try to take the land through eminent domain.
Baud
@schrodingers_cat: Sure, but nearly half this country choose to give the arsonist and the accomplices in his party the match.
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
@Baud:
I think that the problem, is that even if Trump agreed and signed a deal that would protect Dreamers, for example, could we trust his administration to follow the law? CBP and ICE are increasingly acting in a lawless manner.
Baud
@??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??:
Depends on how strong the law is. The courts haven’t been completely ineffective in reining in his lawlessness.
Omnes 0mnibus
@JPL:
?????
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: True but they don’t need our help or encouragement to carry out their arson. And negotiating on T’s terms will just encourage more arson.
Baud
@schrodingers_cat: Right. Part of the calculus here is not encouraging hostage taking in the first place. That NYT clip suggests that the Dems understand that.
Omnes Omnibus
@Omnes 0mnibus: Oh, ffs.
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: Yes that they do. I have full faith in Nancy Pelosi.
Ruckus
@rikyrah:
I flew well past abolish ICE long ago.
They are storm troopers, nothing less. And even if some of them are not the middle and upper management is. We are all products of our environment, even if the product is reasonable opposition. If you work for a place like ICE where everyone is a suspect, until well after proof otherwise, and not always even then, you are either going to quit or belong. And quitting takes away a livelihood. And that doesn’t even mention whatever it is that is in the hiring protocol/interview process that probably weeds out a lot of the non stormtrooper segment.
Aleta
Exactly as Trump and Pence intended, ‘Build the wall’ is short for ‘US belongs to whites only’ ; these kids from Covington Catholic Boys High School are so transparently proud of their understanding that they’ve over-exposed their parents and school, which is scrambling now.
‘Right to life’ as practiced in their religion means ‘our right to degrade and attack.’
They believe their bible conveys their right to trash the Constitution. Pence openly sends that message.
schrodingers_cat
Whatever new plan the pain trust has come up with, should first be put to vote in the Senate. I believe the House has already passed several bills to open the government.
Omnes Omnibus
@JPL:
?????
HeleninEire
@Baud: I just said exactly the same to my Dad. I trust Nancy. She is the best political player in the last 30 years. She’s got this.
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
@Omnes Omnibus:
Your link doesn’t link to anything. Was it a troll that got banhammered? I noticed the second “O” was a 0.
Omnes Omnibus
@??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??: I know where my link was going.
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
@Baud:
I suppose you’re right. It’s just hard to Trust this administration to do the right thing or follow the law. Their MO is to find another loophole and evade accountability by hiding the truth from the public.
CindyH
@rikyrah: hear hear
Tired of these kids getting away eith this shit
Time for them to deal with consequences of their actions
MisterForkbeard
@Aleta: This is how I explain “Build the Wall” to people. It’s an incredibly expensive and incredibly ineffective solution to a problem that doesnt exist. The ONLY reason to push it is because it’s racist – theres no other reason to do it.
If these idiots were actually concerned about illegal immigration or “terrorists” theres much cheaper and better things to do. The only reason to do this is to give Mexico and Democrats the finger.
And most of these supporters know it.
JPL
@Omnes Omnibus: You cannot take land through eminent domain. Nancy could give a billion for the wall, but not to be built on land unless it is purchased through normal channels
lamh36
Tweet has four historical pics of teens “just being teens” and screaming and taughtinf CRM protestors and others
The Thin Black Duke
@Baud: The problem isn’t that these bigoted idiots vote, the problem is that it is so damned difficult for everybody else to vote. They know they’re outnumbered, that’s why they have to cheat to win.
schrodingers_cat
@MisterForkbeard: Its a giant fuck you to immigrants and their children. A mark of intimidation.
FlipYrWhig
Everyone involved here is stupid but I think I know Kushner’s angle. He’s looking for a way out that plays as “a win.” Any deal will get better coverage in the major media than continued impasse. But the sticking point is if whatever Trump does can get *conservative* media to shower him with praise. So imho it’s going to come down to which he cares more about: Praise for his ability to negotiate, vs. praise for his ability to scourge brown people.
Kent
Go after the parents and school administrators not the kids. Those kids didn’t buy those MAGA hats and expensive looking MAGA sweatshirts with their own money. They didn’t charter their own bus and take their own school time to go to DC for a protest designed to strip women of their constitutional rights. They are little pawns in a political fight to strip women of their rights. I’m willing to bet that not one of them really care about abortion.
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
@Omnes Omnibus:
Okay? I guess you don’t want me to know. Whatever. How have you been doing lately? Did you get buried by the snowstorm in Wisconsin? We’re supposed to be getting a foot of snow.
marklar
While extremely unlikely, is it possible that the ‘smirking’ kid in the front might be an autistic student who is enraptured with the music? Before WE jump to conclusions about any of the specific individuals, we should make sure we don’t become deplorables ourselves.
HeleninEire
@Kent: No. Go after the kids. That stupid fucker there is Brett Kavanaugh. We just didn’t have cell phones back then.
The Midnight Lurker
Here in Texas, down on the border, a lot of these land owners are amassing guns, money, and lawyers to fight Trump’s border wall tooth and nail. Some have even gone so far as to say that ‘imminent domain’ be damned, they are prepared to go Ammon Bundy to prevent seizure. And they have the support (mostly) of their surrounding communities.
If Trump gets his wish and proceeds with his plan, there will be bloodshed.
Unbelievably, a shit-load of these folks are (were) MAGA. Wonder whose side FOX will take?
lamh36
Lordt I’ve had a day. Finally home after going to urgent care this hours ago this morning. Urgent care said, I had a slight fever 99.5 and my tonsils looked big but they always have been that way. they never atrophied which they are supposed to do as an adult. I had some scarring in right ear and some fluid behind the ear drum but the left ear looked fine. Doc couldn’t really tell if it was viral or bacterial..so he gave me steroid for viral symptoms and antibiotic for bacterial infection along with a Z pack to knock it all out.
So I head to Walmart to be the Z pack Rx. all i wanted was to drop it off and pick up after i shopped in the store a bit. I dropped it off & came back to pick up the Rx and they tell me i need my Rx card? I’m like what? I’ve never needed a Rx card before??. So I ended up sitting at Walmart for over an hour trying to get the info they needed over the phone. apparently since I’ve got CVS Caremark Rx coverage and I can only fill Rx at CVS with ease. Otherwise I have to supply my Rx card???
I finally told the woman forget it can i just call and have the Rx transferred to CVS and be done with it. I’m home now after leaving my house at 9:30am for the trip to urgent care this morning
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
@MisterForkbeard:
Exactly. I linked to a story last night about hundreds of migrants tunneling underneath the current border wall. Trump’s wall, whatever form it would take, wouldn’t have stopped that. It’s a racist dog whistle as you and SC say.
Ruckus
@Brachiator:
Simple answer – Of course.
All the republican national politicians want no federal government. Not less government but none. They have enough money to protect them they think, with no government they think they can steal more and buy whatever they need/want. OK they may want the National Guard and president so they can Kent State the rest of us once in a while, to keep us in line. Any tax they pay is too much, any restrictions on them is too much. Not so for the rest of us but still, they want complete freedom. And fuck the rest of us. They think that all of the worlds problems are solved by getting rid of all the people they don’t like. And that list is growing every day. They have no understanding of anything except that picture in their warped little minds of perfection – them.
ET
The MAGA looser in the video was likely in town for the annual march against abortion rights. There are always hordes of kids this age in town for that though likely it is mostly just so that they don’t have to go to school.
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
@Ruckus:
It’s not hyperbole to say that these people are an existential threat to humanity. I don’t think the National Guard by itself would be enough to protect us from invasion, so they’re idiots if they believe that.
dmsilev
@??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??: I propose that we “build” a wall that’s strictly underground and out of sight to stop tunnels. Actually, I propose we do nothing and tell Trump that there’s a magnificent underground wall with his name on it.
trnc
@Mary G:
That will be true for everything, but there’s only so much we can do about whether DT follows the law. Regardless of our recognition about that behavior, we aren’t in a position to stop passing needed laws. We’ll have to depend on courts to rule against the administration when they clearly break the law.
Tehanu
@??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??:
:
What you said. I’m so angry at these people — no, these lizards masquerading as humans — that all I can think is “a la lanterne!”
@scav:
In high school, back in the Jurassic, approximately, I dated a boy from the local Catholic school — once; and I never went out with him or any other boy from there again. Apparently that great Western civilized tradition of being total assholes has continued.
@Ruckus:
I wish this was the country I was taught as a child to believe in. It’s so disheartening to see stuff like this. And I don’t think these “people” can be redeemed; they can only be opposed.
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
@The Midnight Lurker:
It’s interesting to note that Ammon Bundy himself recently spoke out against Trump’s immigration policies.
Knowing Fox News etcetera, they’ll try to portray these people as Antifa or something.
Yarrow
@lamh36: That sucks! Target pharmacy is now Caremark/CVS so that might also be easier for you. Hope you feel better soon.
Omnes Omnibus
@JPL:
Citation?
JPL
Cincinnati. com has more information on the school involved. link
debbie
@lamh36:
FYI, CVS operates in Targets too.
lamh36
@Yarrow: yeah Target is now part of CVS. I ended up eight back at my local CVS…but man it was an ordeal
JPL
@Omnes Omnibus: In response to the previous comment about what Nancy could agree to. She should include it as part of the funding bill. Is that illegal? hmmm
JanieM
@lamh36: Our glorious “health care” system at work.
Sorry you’re under the weather…hope you can get some rest now and get back up to speed quickly!
Dorothy A. Winsor
@lamh36: Oh wow. Put your feet up. I’d say have a drink too, but maybe you can’t with the meds.
Ian R
@HeleninEire: Why not both? The little proto-Kavanaughs should be publicly shamed so that this is the first thing to pop up if any future college admissions board takes 5 seconds to google them. That doesn’t mean that the chaperones shouldn’t also be called out.
Cheryl Rofer
JPL
@lamh36: I’m sorry because when you are sick, you just want to go home. Feel better soon.
I went to a CVS minute clinic for a tdap vaccination a few days ago, and I’d definitely use the service again if need be. It was easy.
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
@dmsilev:
Heh. I’m not sure he’s that stupid.
@Tehanu:
They’re the reptilians Alex Jones screamed about
The Midnight Lurker
@??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??:
I saw that too. Fuck him anyway.
lamh36
@Yarrow: @debbie: right I know. I usually go to CVS, but I just figured I need some sock people food so let me go to walmart and get my Rx filled while I shopped…ugh. now i know
BTW. I usually come down w/strep throat I at least once or twice a year cause of my tonsils. it might be time for me to go to an ENT to see about getting them removed
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
@lamh36:
At least you’re home now. Hope you get well soon!
JPL
@Ian R: Since it’s all over the Cincinnati news, it appears they will be shamed, but the chaperones need to punished also. The school has made their social media accounts private.
smintheus
@hells littlest angel:
Not so hard to understand if you went to a school anything like mine.
trnc
@Baud:
I agree. Now I’ll add my own take anyway. I hope that any agreement to fund wall will include a stipulation that a detailed design and build plan drawn up by the relevant agency (Army Corp of Engineers?) must be presented, and that it not be planned for areas that are privately owned and likely to induce court battles over eminent domain. Also, part of either the new wall or existing wall should include a new fully equipped and manned border crossing gate to give the agents a better chance of finding drugs that are being trucked in.
JPL
Covington Catholic School
Park hills, KY
lamh36
@??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??: thx. yip he now and in my bed… gonna sleep away this sickness if I can
Paulwartenberg
never trust an offer from trump. HE CHEATS.
Every person he’s dealt with, had a contract with, he’s cheated them out of their pay, broke whatever promises he made to get things done HIS way and that HE got most if not all of the money out of it he could. (except for, noticeably, Russians)
There is nothing to this offer that is set in stone. trump can betray any promise made here, and will gladly go back to taking hostages again secure in his belief he will get the other side – the suckers – to buckle under again.
No deals. Even when he gets dragged off in handcuffs. No goddamn deals.
Aleta
The wall money he wants from us is for a personal slush fund and billing sinkhole. The land seizures will, they hope, turn a profit for privately run, tax- sheltered structures on the new gov’t land, to house guards or detainees or drones or bulldozers and barbed wire or something. If not a wall he’ll at least built a road to be patrolled and guarded and in perpetual need of repair due to corrupt concrete. (This is speculation, with extreme bias of course.)
JPL
@trnc: Yes!
MomSense
He looks super constipated or something.
Also too he needs to go to the Derek Zoolander School for Kids Who Can’t Read Good.
HeleninEire
Does someone have a live feed?
JeanneT
@trnc:
AND will require a complete environmental impact survey to be done with complete plans to mitigate harm to local and regional ecosystems before funding is released.
debit
So far this is a retread of the prime time announcement. Boring. Low energy. Sad.
MomSense
@lamh36:
Sorry you don’t feel well. I hope you can rest now and try to heal.
Steve in the ATL
So as soon as I leave Cincinnati, the whole town falls apart? Jeez Louise.
patrick II
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: I believe andrean High School is where Justice Roberts attended, he and Kavanaugh make a fine pair.
Raven
@HeleninEire: Don’t bother
debit
See through steel barrier? What?
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
@MomSense:
He has a face only a mother could love that’s for sure
@lamh36:
That’s the best thing to do at this point, along with taking your medications. Also plenty of fluids for that mild fever.
HeleninEire
@Raven: I usually don’t. But I wanted to see his bullshit.
Quinerly
@debit: I was about to type the same thing. He’s low energy but seems a little bit more cocky. Mueller weighing in on that BuzzFeed article has emboldened him a bit, imo.
dmsilev
@debit:
Someone showed him the ‘transparent aluminum’ scene from Star Trek IV.
Cheryl Rofer
@debit: Same stuff they make the stealth F-35s out of.
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
@HeleninEire:
Here you go
MomSense
@HeleninEire:
He’s snorting, his face is all twisted up, and somehow his mouth looks like an anus when he says certain words. It’s strange stuff.
smintheus
@JPL: The racism in Cincinnati is so thick you can cut it with a knife. The moment you cross over into Kentucky it becomes suffocating. Probably the most racist and vile place I have ever lived.
Quinerly
@MomSense: and birth control pills! Did you catch that at the beginning?
japa21
I refuse to watch him or listen. Are all the networks carrying or just the cable ones?
Cheryl Rofer
James E Powell
@trnc:
I trust Nancy Pelosi to continue with her mastery of the art of the possible. We can expand the range of what is possible, somewhat, by contacting our respective members of congress and letting them know what we think is possible.
JPL
@Steve in the ATL: To be fair the school is on the other side of the river in KY.
Jeffro
he thinks he’s so fucking clever…”we’ll split the Dems!”…”they’ll have no choice but to surrender now!”
F.U. We don’t negotiate with hostage takers. Open the government and fund it through the 2020 election, and we’ll talk.
JPL
@smintheus: It’s unfortunate how easy it is to pollute our beautiful country. It appears that some students will face expulsion. It’s a private school so I assume they can just kick them out, unless their parents are big donors. duh
Nelle
@Corner Stone: My neighbor is here right now. He is Omaha and a relative of Nathan Phillips. There is quiet fury. His friend, also here, is Santee and more vocal about what would have happened had they been there. We’ve been fortunate having the neighbors we do. (They are helping my 75 y.o.husband load the UHaul for our move.)
Mnemosyne
@marklar:
Yeah, no. He’s wearing a fucking red MAGA hat. It’s insulting to people on the spectrum to even attempt to give him that excuse.
And unless you’re going to try and claim that the entire crowd of boys in MAGA hats cheering him on are also on the spectrum, your excuse dissolves as soon as anyone sees the wide shot.
Cheryl Rofer
Cheryl Rofer
rikyrah
@HeleninEire:
????
Salty Sam
@MomSense:
It IS an anus- there’s nothing but shyte coming out of it…
Cheryl Rofer
MomSense
@Quinerly:
Yeah what was that all about? I bet he got that bit from Pence.
@Salty Sam:
True.
Mnemosyne
@Quinerly:
It’s a nod to the forced birthers who just marched in DC. They claim that birth control pills cause abortions despite all available scientific evidence showing that they don’t.
JPL
@MomSense: TMI
Steve in the ATL
@JPL: yes, but so is the airport I flew in and out of!
JPL
@Quinerly: What about birth control pills? Are they coming over for birth control pills?
Jinchi
I keep seeing commentary predicting that the shutdown could last for months, and I think it misses a critical point.
Federal employees can be barred from striking, but they can’t be barred from quitting.
Trump and the Republicans have shielded most Americans from the consequences of the shutdown by forcing hundreds of thousands of people to work without pay. So you’ll still get your tax refund and the airports are still open and Mnuchin has ensured that IRS paperwork still gets done to keep mortgage industry running. But people making $40,000 a year can only put off paying their bills for so long. Missing one paycheck was hard, but I expect most assumed they just had to hold on a couple of weeks longer. Missing a second paycheck will have people looking for an exit and I doubt more than half of federal workers have the resources to go 2 months, unpaid, with the end still not in sight. When 10% or 20% of “essential” employees leave, we’re going to start having some real problems.
A worker on strike can be called back once a deal is made. A worker who quits is gone for good. Once they realize how bad the problem is, they may no longer be able to fix it, even when they do end this shutdown.
Cheryl Rofer
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
@Mnemosyne:
Yeah, that commenter is very ableist. They’re effectively making excuses for bad behavior and trying to use a real disorder that many people suffer from as a shield for those kids.
MazeDancer
Ann Coulter sceamed Amnesty. It’s a no.
Quinerly
@JPL: I missed the beginning. Something about mothers forcing birth control pills on migrant daughters since they will be raped on the journey. He’s just so vile. I’ll Google to find out exactly what he said. It was at the beginning.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@JPL: As always, Trump talked with relish about refugee women being raped so they give their daughters birth control pills in case they’re raped too.
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
@Jinchi:
That’s what I hate the most about them. They try to avoid the consequences of their own actions by doing shit like this. It won’t last forever, the longer this drags on.
Mnemosyne
@Jinchi:
They think the government already has too many employees, so having federal workers quit en masse is a feature, not a bug, for them.
Corner Stone
And I can’t stand this smarmy, smug faced fucking asshole Rep Carlos Curbelo. What a sorry excuse for a POS. Why oh why does MSNBC keep doing this? He’s out of Congress yet still shilling with both hands for R’s and Trump. Liar.
Quinerly
@Mnemosyne: not really what he was saying.
The Midnight Lurker
Contact the Diocese of Covington
covdio.org
1125 Madison Ave, Covington, KY 41011
(859) 392-1500
Ask them what Bible(?) they’re teaching their children from cause it sure as shit ain’t Douay-Rheims.
Dorothy A. Winsor
Trump went from saying this was a proposal to saying the Senate would have it to vote on next week. Leaving everything else aside, this involves funding and I thought funding bills had to originate in the House.
chris
@HeleninEire: Here you go. http://www.livenewschat.eu/politics/ Also has CNN and RTE.
BlueDWarrior
@Corner Stone: The problem is quite simply this: at some point news directors have to face the fact that the Republican party for the most part is consumed with crazy, so if you want a balanced discussion partisanship wise, you will necessarily introduce some deep stupid into the debate. If you want to have a frank discussion between both sides of a policy debate that doesn’t dovetail into stupid, then most Republicans would be disqualified.
And most news directors are simply unwilling to make that latter decision.
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
@Mnemosyne:
The godbothers never let a good talking point go to waste.
Jinchi
@Mnemosyne: It’s only a feature until they can’t fly home for the weekend. Once they and people they care about begin to suffer it will end.
MomSense
@JPL:
I don’t know why I torment myself by watching.
Actually I do. I want to see every grotesque and idiotic thing this traitor does so I can hold it over his supporters forevermore.
Quinerly
@Dorothy A. Winsor That’s the point I tuned in. Wasn’t the birth control pills reference at the very beginning? I found it quite jarring. Looking for the transcript on line.
eric
CBS Some conservatives also voiced their opposition to the deal. Right-wing commentator Ann Coulter tweeted: “Trump proposes amnesty. We voted for Trump and got Jeb!”
Baud
@Dorothy A. Winsor: They can amend one of the House bills that has already passed.
Quinerly
Pelosi’s statement:
https://www.speaker.gov/newsroom/11919/
Dorothy A. Winsor
@Quinerly: Yes, the birth control stuff was part of his description of humanitarian suffering he claimed his wall would alleviate.
The Thin Black Duke
Did it happen? Was this the moment Trump became “presidential”? (No, I’m not watching him, are you nuts?)
Mnemosyne
@Quinerly:
Well, I’m not watching him, so I’ll take your word for it. You have a stronger stomach than I do.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@Quinerly: It’s a sign of something that I noticed that Pelosi and/or her people know how to use quotation marks in a multi-paragraph quote. We used to be able to assume that our leaders’ public written statements were more grammatical than average. No more.
Debbie (Aussie)
@laura:
This This this a thousand X thus
lamh36
Mahn…fuq them MAGA kids!
https://twitter.com/washingtonpost/status/1086739479765938176?s=21
WaterGirl
@lamh36: One time when I was filling a prescription for an antibiotic, a youngish woman was at the pharmacy with her maybe 4-year-old son, who was sick. She didn’t have her insurance card. She had taken 3 buses and spent an hour getting there, and they wanted to send her back home on the fucking bus with her sick child to get the card, turn back around and come back to the pharmacy, and then take the bus back home again.
I said fuck this shit and just paid for her prescription out of my own pocket. Fuck these people who hate other people.
P.S. Very sorry you had all that hassle, let alone all that hassle when you feel like crap.
Mnemosyne
@The Thin Black Duke:
My husband does an impersonation of Trump that sounds almost exactly like Bill Murray in Caddyshack. It’s hilarious and horrifying at the same time.
Yarrow
@japa21: Don’t know about other networks but NBC didn’t carry it. They were showing golf.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Mnemosyne: Sure, until they try to fly or get their tax refund or….
The Moar You Know
@marklar: Eat a bag of salted dicks and die, Ivan.
jl
In any other administration, Trump’s statement could be taken as a sign that they were ready to negotiate. But this is Trump. He reneged on a far better deal, at least from the view point of getting Trump Wall entire with much more impressive price tag. If the Coulters and Limbaughs decide to make a fuss again, no guarantee that Trump won’t renege again.
But, the Democrats need to make a counter offer in good faith. Maybe package it up with some psychological and PR jiu-jitsu that Trump can’t resist. For example, a two part offer:
1) better deal on DACA, maybe doesn’t have to go as far as a complete permanent deal but something better than an mere extension
2) pack up all the stuff Democrats want on border secruity, including reform of ICE, and make sure the sticker value is greater than $5.7 billion, and call that ‘Wall’.
See if Trujmp bites. He might. His base won’t know, won’t trouble themselves to find out, and therefore won’t care..
Hell, if the border security package comes out to $10 billion ‘Wall’, let Trump have it. No one will care about come election time. Trump is electoral death to the GOP. Goofs like Cillizza will write up miles of tripe about the Trump win and Democrats in Disarray, but the mass of voters will never notice and won’t care about that, either.
That is IMHO two cents.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Dorothy A. Winsor: There’s a bill from the house, they’ll gut it and insert their own language. It’s become pretty common practice to get around the Constitutional requirement that funding bills originate in the House.
Mnemosyne
@lamh36:
The priest who was allegedly chaperoning the kids was posting self-righteous stuff on his Twitter account about the forced birth march until people started challenging him about what his students did. Then he took his account private, the coward. ?
The archdiocese sounds very unhappy, so hopefully that priest will be packing his bags for his next assignment very soon, like to a remote monastery in North Dakota where he’ll have plenty of time to scrub floors and think about how he failed as a spiritual advisor.
marklar
@Mnemosyne: @Mnemosyne:
I’m not sure what his hat choice has to do with his brain wiring, but yeah, I believe that autistic people should be granted the dignity to allow them to make their own choices, even if they choose to be MAGA-fools. Please don’t fetishize folks with disabilities by suggesting that it’s an insult to suggest that they might make poor political choices. They can be jerks just as much as we neurotypicals.
I work with young adults with disabilities. I’ve seen that smirk. If there is the slightest chance that he’s an autistic young adult (who happens to go to Convington Catholic), I think we should at least wait before we act like the POTUS who mocked that reporter with disabilities.
“And unless you’re going to try and claim that the entire crowd of boys in MAGA hats cheering him on are also on the spectrum, your excuse dissolves as soon as anyone sees the wide shot.: Red herring. I’m not talking about the others.
lamh36
@WaterGirl: they were willing to fill the Rx but i had to pay like $43 out of pocket with insurance it would only be $3.47!! I was feeling so bad I almost did pay the $42 but i was like no I’ll be damned if u get my $40
Quinerly
@Mnemosyne: I was listening to it, not watching. See Dorothy Winsor’s great comments for the explanation. I missed the lead in about “one in three women raped on the journey” (yes, just found the entire transcript) so Trump just blurting out “birth control pills” in a formal speech on the wall and immigration was a bit jarring to me at first. I did know immediately that for once he wasn’t nodding to the pro forced birth crowd… Figured he was just trying to scare Fox watchers with tales of rape and carnage. Everything is vile, dark, scary for them. Actually, now I’m rather sorry I even brought it up.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@jl: Open the government first, that’s non-negotiable, then talk about border security issues. We have to stop this continuing hostage taking.
jl
@jl: In fact, I wonder if Trump’s fairly explicit surrender on continuous ‘Wall’ is a signal he looking for deal just like that, or at least his semi-rational flunkies and handlers are signalling there is at least a 50-50 chance they can make Trump stick to it.
I think we are skirting very dangerous constitutional and lawful governance territory with ongoing partial shutdown, and I think threat of a bogus state of national emergency is still on the table. As Madison wrote, it is a case where ‘if anything can be hopee, everything must be tried”.
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
@marklar:
But you’re asserting without evidence that he has autism! Do you know if that kid has been diagnosed by a professional? No? Then why float it?
marklar
@The Moar You Know:
Gee, hostility and homophobia in one comment? Why not go for a trifecta? The sad thing is that politically, we’re likely on the same side, yet personally, I tilt toward, you know, knowing all the facts before I condemn somebody.
The Thin Black Duke
That’s it? Now we know how Stormy Daniels felt afterwards.
Quinerly
Rep. Emanuel Cleaver, “The president is trying to play us for fools.”
MSNBC… Rev Al Sharpton’s show
jl
@?BillinGlendaleCA: OK, that is a good position for now. Could become a bargaining chip later if Trump’s flunkies can offer a serious guarantee that Trump won’t renege for the third time on a deal, then maybe make it part of the package.
Whatever. Stuff like that is up to Pelosi and Schumer to decide how to maneuver.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@The Thin Black Duke: Heh.
WaterGirl
@lamh36: Yeah, I might have been too pissed to pay it if it had been my prescription, but not when it was for someone else. We humans are complicated creatures.
jl
I guess one good sign is that the vile skunk McConnell has seen enough cracks in GOP, and worried enough that this crisis might disturb is rotten little tinpot cesspit dictatorship, that he might be quietly working for a deal.
The Midnight Lurker
@Mnemosyne:
To hell with North Dakota. How about Honduras?
He can take that fucking punk with him too as an Altar Boy.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@jl: NO. Republicans have been pulling the shutdown hostage taking act since Bill Clinton was President, we need to take that away from them. We will be doing this again, probably this fall if we don’t.
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
@jl:
Too many people see McConnell as invincible. He’s not. I haven’t paying too much attention to the news the past few days, but has the narrative been shifting onto McConnell that he’s just as much to blame for the shutdown as Trump is? I’ve seen polls that show Republicans are getting blamed for it.
jl
@?BillinGlendaleCA: I find your ideas intriguing and would like to subscribe to your newsletter. I’m on board as soon as you tell me which mouse will put the bell on the cat’s collar.
So, the problem I see with your ‘NO’, is that while we may need to take shutdown power away from the GOP, and Trump, right now I don’t see a reliable method for doing that without some agreement with them. A policy and/or procedural solution to prevent shutdown hostage taking may have to wait until 2021.
So, sure, for short term, need to see if a end the shutdown first demand works, but if it doesn’t, what then? May have to include it in the deal itself.
debbie
@germy:
Who was it who said , “Aim high?” ?
jl
@debbie: “Aim high?” compared to what? For GOP and Trupmsters, that might mean shooting them in their junk. Not fit for an almost top 10,000 mommy and kds blog like BJ.
debbie
@schrodingers_cat:
I would like to see those receipts, please, because I haven’t seen anyone here posting such a thing.
zhena gogolia
@debbie:
I don’t have any receipts, but I saw the same comments she mentioned.
Chief Oshkosh
@Corner Stone:
Let’s not forget, that at the end of the say, Mueller is a Republican. Life-long.
JPL
@zhena gogolia: Maybe because I said Nancy should negotiate by giving him a billion with stipulations, she meant me. He would never agree to those stipulations though.
marklar
@??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??:
Please read what I wrote. I started off by saying that while it’s “Extremely unlikely”. How is that making an assumption without evidence that he’s autistic.
I’m simply floating the idea that unless you have all the information, you shouldn’t jump to the conclusion that the young man is deplorable.
Oh, and unlike the two other folks who showed hostility to my comment, at least you responded like a mensch. Thank you.
debbie
@trnc:
Don’t forget to protect the butterfly sanctuary!
JPL
@WaterGirl: That was such a sweet thing to do and just the comment made me happy. Thank you.
The Thin Black Duke
@marklar: They’re racist jerks. Sorry.
MisterForkbeard
Oh look, glad to see that the usual suspects (Coulter, red state, breitbart, others) are freaking out that Trump is proposing Amnesty and betraying the country. Looks like this “deal” will also go away. Or more precisely, he won’t fight hard on it once the Dems ‘officially’ shoot it down, and/or McConnell won’t actually bring it to a vote.
Aleta
The fund to finance the Indigenous Peoples March fell short by about $330 of their $30,000 goal.
The donation site is: https://www.gofundme.com/indigenous-peoples-march
jl
Actually, what Trump did today seems to me to make the Democrats job pretty easy. They just write the deal that they want, package it to make it look like a compromise. If Trump turns it down, then at least the Dems tried, and then they can see if real negotiations are possible.
I guess I am thinking that Trumpsters were signalling that they might go for anything that they could make look like a compromise that went somewhat more than halfway. So package up something that they can advertise like that, let them have it, even if the packaging is somewhat fraudulent.
Among the pundit class and political junkies on blogs like this will piss themselves fretting over it. Trump’s base will be in ecstatics. But I think > 2/3 of the voting voting public will not give a shit, and that actually may be the wise attitude as long as we make some progress out of the current mess.
WaterGirl
@debbie: I have seen a few people suggesting it, but if my memory is correct, that was immediately shot down be another commenter.
WaterGirl
@JPL: Thank you! I’m pretty sure that most of us here would have done the same thing, if they had the $30. (or whatever it was)
Cheryl Rofer
From the Diocese of Covington and Covington Catholic High School:
More at the link.
Gravenstone
@hells littlest angel: Not really. Just argues they’re the spawns of older ugly racist shitheads.
The Midnight Lurker
@Aleta: DONE! And thanks!
jl
@MisterForkbeard: OK, thanks for info. As long as Trump pays any attention at all to those vicious loons and cynical profiteering sociopaths, little hope this mess gets solved.
Also, I have to say that listening to Trump try to give a speech, and his general behavior, I have to wonder how far gone he is mentally. Trump reminds me more and more of out a very fat oldster uncle acted as his reasoning power slipped away after years of sleep apnia and general neglect of his health ate away at him.
Cheryl Rofer
schrodingers_cat
@zhena gogolia: @WaterGirl: Thank You.
Mnemosyne
@marklar:
Yeah, that sure sounds like an innocent misunderstanding with someone who’s on the spectrum.
Uh, you’re the only person here insisting that this kid must be a poor, misunderstood person on the spectrum who we are being unfair to. I’m pretty sure he’s a bog-standard neurotypical asshole doing neurotypical asshole shit. How, exactly, am I “fetishizing the disabled” by saying the dude is a neurotypical asshole of a type that I have encountered thousands of times in my life?
And you probably shouldn’t assume that other commenters have never encountered or interacted with any non-neurotypical people, because you just make yourself look dumb.
A Good Woman
@marklar:
The kid upfront in Nathan Phillips’ face has been doxxed, info is at Shaun King’s FB page. From all I can glean, he is not autistic. As the aunt of two autistic nephews, at different points on the spectrum, I can appreciate your concern. However, in this case it appears to be misplaced.
Cheryl Rofer
schrodingers_cat
@debbie: Do you want the receipts from the past two weeks or the last time this was floated, when the great deal maker wanted to cut down entire categories of permanent residency (green cards) in return for a “deal” on DACA.
marklar
@The Thin Black Duke:
“They”. Yes! Him? Likely so (especially based on recent reports).
My point is simply to make sure that we have all the facts before leveling a charge of being a Trump-supporter (one of the worst epithets out there). There ARE people who are neurodiverse among us, and their behaviors are often misinterpreted.
Mnemosyne
@The Midnight Lurker:
The weather in Honduras is too nice for the likes of him, and the people need help too desperately to inflict a lazy asshole on them.
Emma
@marklar: he continuously blocked the man’s way. He was cheered on by his fellow students and he reacted by smirking . The chaperones did not at any time interfered with his behavior or lead him gently away as one of my cousins does when her autistic child acts up. So, yeah, no.
JPL
@Cheryl Rofer: Bull Shit If the words had any meaning their students would not be wearing MAGA hats.
Immanentize
@?BillinGlendaleCA: Yes the Senate can “ammend” an already passed House bill and send it back to the GHouse for a vote. BUT! How will they get 60 votes? Na.Gon,Ha.Pen
Sab
@marklar:Give me a break.
I seriously doubt that school has autistic students. They don’t seem to be encouraging tolerance or diversity.
Also, autistic kids are also held to behavior standards. My five year old autistic granddaughter would be in a lot of trouble if she treated an adult stranger like that. If an autistic teenager behaved that way he probably wouldn’t be running around loose.
marklar
@A Good Woman:
Thank you, Good woman. I started out by saying that it was unlikely that he was neurodiverse, but given how people wired differently often have their behavior misinterpreted, we should wait before we jump to conclusions about people’s motivations. Heck, that applies to the behaviors of everybody. People should consider how the fundamental attribution error affects our social cognition (ironically, autistic adults rarely fall victim to this flaw!)
J R in WV
@marklar:
DIAF, Russian Troll …
The Midnight Lurker
@Mnemosyne: Fine. North Korea then.
Immanentize
@marklar: New here, huh?
WaterGirl
I don’t watch news on TV, but it sure feels like there’s not a lot of coverage of Trump’s offer in blog-land, and I’m not seeing links to a lot of articles from here. Maybe everyone is just yawning over the whole thing?
Frankensteinbeck
@Cheryl Rofer:
When I read her longer statement, I loved it. It advances ‘border security’ by making it easier for people to cross legally. Which, I mean, probably does advance border security, but she’s offering Trump a shit sandwich labeled ‘Delicious Pie’, in negotiation terms. And she’ll get away with it, because when you have to discuss them, Republican policies are unsupportable.
jl
@Cheryl Rofer: Thanks for into. My only suggestion is that they pack it all up into something called ‘Wall Bill’ and slap a price tag on of $6 billion or so. Announce that they met Trump’s demands. See what he does.
Will Trump even know? Will our rotten press even care? I doubt it.
schrodingers_cat
@WaterGirl: He offered nothing of consequence.
Immanentize
@MisterForkbeard: McConnell will say that he was ready to bring it to the Senate floor, but the Democrats blocked it and refused to act reasonably. They are just trying to change the blame vector. And it could work.
Mnemosyne
@marklar:
He’s wearing a MAGA hat in a cheering mob of other MAGA hat wearers. You yourself just made a passionate argument in favor of accepting that some disabled people are asshole MAGA supporters.
So what evidence do you have that this kid is not a Trump-supporting asshole who is (allegedly) also on the spectrum and was instead innocently blocking the way of an elderly Native American man while coincidentally wearing a MAGA hat in a group of other MAGA hat wearers?
You can’t have it both ways. You yourself said we shouldn’t “fetishize” the disabled by assuming that someone on the spectrum wouldn’t understand what wearing that hat means, so I’m doing him the courtesy of assuming that he’s just as much of a racist asshole as anyone else in a MAGA hat.
SFAW
@marklar:
You might consider stopping digging.
germy
I suspect a large group of black teenagers surrounding and taunting an elderly white man would not receive sympathy or understanding or benefit of the doubt.
Kayla Rudbek
@Cheryl Rofer: and as a Notre Dame alum, I want these bastards named, shamed, and their college acceptances rescinded (particularly if ND admitted them as the last thing I want is these troglodytes as my fellow alumni someday – I put up with more than my fair share of their ilk as it was and is).
Immanentize
@Cheryl Rofer: What I like about the Diocese statement is that it knows that when pro-life gets linked to racism it’s a bad thing. But anti-abortion efforts get linked to racism because — they are racist!
marklar
@Mnemosyne:
“Uh, you’re the only person here insisting that this kid must be a poor, misunderstood person on the spectrum who we are being unfair to.”
You discredit yourself with your premise. Since when have I insisted anything (unless, of course, the words “extremely unlikely” are synonymous with “insistence”. The fetishization comment was my inferring (possibly incorrectly) that because his behavior is boorish, he couldn’t be autistic. As for my looking dumb, I’ve been told that it’s a good look for me!
I’m actually quite disappointed in your aggressive misreading of my initial post and my replies. I’ve been a long-time lurker here at BJ, and have often found your comments perceptive. I’ve even picked up that you’re an ally with respect to the neurodiversity perspective on difference. How a simple comment that we should wait before passing definite judgement, intimating that neurodiverse people live among us and their behavior can be misconstrued, has generated such vitriol is puzzling.
Oh, and Sab, I can pretty much guarantee that a school with several hundred male students has a couple dozen kids on the spectrum. Regarding behavioral standards….sure! If the kid were autistic, he should be told that his crowding behavior makes people uncomfortable!
MisterForkbeard
@Immanentize: That’s possible, but I think NP will do a decent enough job of rebutting this. Especially since no one seems to like this deal: Not democrats, not republicans, and no one on twitter. I can’t even find positive media reaction to it (or much of a reaction at all, come to think of it).
But there is some risk there.
SFAW
@Mnemosyne:
No, he/she was just “asking the question.” Kind of like you — evil person that you are — calling a climate-change skeptic (i.e., someone asking completely reasonable questions because there is only 97 percent agreement, not 112 percent agreement, within the scientific community) a climate change “denier,” if they “ask questions.”
Or something.
J R in WV
@marklar:
Except, no, you don’t have any facts, you have your pet delusions about a very evil looking racist trying to mock and intimidate a Native American leader and hero. And the people who were supposed to be teaching that evil little bastard and his fellow bigots were also mocking that hero, instead of teaching those bigoted kids that mocking people for their differences is wrong, and you know, EVIL.
Also hoping the priest in charge on that mission of bigotry is sent to a lonely monastery in upper Idaho to wash floors on his knees for the next decade. Silently!
Immanentize
@Kayla Rudbek:
I am down with this.
Immanentize
@MisterForkbeard: 10, hell 5, years ago I would have said the risk of blame shift was in the 80%+ range. But the GOP seemingly has lost its voodoo to do do.
WaterGirl
@schrodingers_cat: Yeah, but that’s never stopped the media or the blogosphere from wall-to-wall coverage before. :-)
Jim, Foolish Literalist
I didn’t watch/listen to trump, but it sounds like his big move was a fart in a hurricane. Also
@ RadioFreeTom
Labored breathing is really noticeable on radio. Creeping me out.
also, the Other President has tweeted
Emma
@Chief Oshkosh: Jesus H. Felonious Christ. No wonder we democrats don’t ever get ahead. We turn on everyone at the drop of a hat.
WaterGirl
@Immanentize: Yep, I am nodding in agreement on that one!
germy
@J R in WV:
While extremely unlikely, is it possible that the kids who are making the “tomahawk chopping” motions might be autistic students who suffer from movement disorders? Mind you, I said “extremely unlikely” but I’ll keep insisting we withhold judgement until I see a medical report.
SFAW
@J R in WV:
I think we should “get all the facts” re: whether the possibly-neurodiverse MAGAt had actually dropped in from the planet Meepzorp, and just didn’t realize what he was doing, because … well, just because, OK? Until we find out that information, we may be condemning him/it for no good reason.
marklar
@J R in WV:
Well. J R in WV, perhaps one day I’ll have you near-psychic abilities to know the cortical wiring of an individual by looking at a 1 minute video clip of him. I hope you are capitalizing on your ability….it would be a loss to the world if you were not!
In the mean time, I’ll have to settle for living in a deluded existence that while I can come up with an educated guess (e.g., the kid is a disrespectful privileged bully, as are some BJ commenters, present company excluded of course), i can’t conclude much about a person from a short video clip.
Ohio Mom
@marklar: Not that it’s infallible, but that kid did not make my autism-radar go off.
In my experience as the mom of a 21 y.o. autie, schools are generally unenthusiastic about taking our kids on extended field trips; if our kids are allowed to join the trip, they are almost always heavily chaperoned, either with a Velcro aide or their parent.
Teaching kids on the spectrum to not be “space invaders,” is a big thing, and people responsible for them are usually quick to correct such behavior.
Also, Catholic schools generally do not like to accommodate disabilities past dyslexia. That’s what public schools are for.
So I’m betting this kid is typically-developing. Unfortunately, the category of “typical” includes bigots and assholes.
FelonyGovt
Sounds like this “proposal” by Trump was as momentous and constructive as his live TV address. And bottom line, 800,000 Americans are still not getting paid because Trump is an immature asshole.
Bill Arnold
@schrodingers_cat:
The proposals were AFAIK S. Millers, perhaps a few others. I don’t believe that DJ Trump knows enough to actually want such things; he wants adulation from his supporters and doesn’t care about and/or actively wants harm to everyone else. And S. Miller promises that his (SM’s) policies will help DJT in his goals.
How to bring him (SM) down/out of favor with DJT is the question, for years now. (IMO – this is partly a question since you’re very familiar with this collection of issues. FWIW, my entirely working life has involved >50% people (sciences/tech) who are not US citizens.)
The Dangerman
OK, just got back from a rocket launch at Vandenburg, have seen no “highlights” and read the post (but not the comments yet). Seems to me that Trump offered basically nothing but I’ll read the comments to see what I may have missed. But I’ll give you a change to vote on a reverse scale:
1 – Hot, surprisingly positive compromise(s) from him (I don’ t expect many 1’s)
5 – Lukewarm, maybe it ‘s a starter though
10 – Cold, what has he been sniffing/snorting, ITMFA
Mnemosyne
@marklar:
Because your “simple comment” is excuse-making for privileged white teenagers behaving badly.
If this had been a one-on-one confrontation, then I might have been willing to consider your interpretation. The fact that it happened inside of a larger group that surrounded the elderly man to taunt and jeer at him makes your interpretation look a hell of a lot more like excuse-making for a nice white teenager who shouldn’t have his life ruined just because he participated in mocking an elderly Native American man.
schrodingers_cat
@Bill Arnold: Miller and Kelly got him to reject the deal. That was the reporting from that time IIRC.
marklar
@Ohio Mom:
You’re probably right with your ‘radar’, and spot on with your general observations about private schools (although I’ve taught several autistic college students who did attend Catholic and Jewish schools). As for the smirker’s neurotype? I’d definitely make the same bet as you, but like all bets, I’d not be 100% certain that I’d win. Would you? And if we were wrong, wouldn’t we feel awful?
Gravenstone
@marklar: For someone who claims to tilt towards knowing all the facts, you sure seem well versed with wild assed speculation in support of some MAGAt fuckstain. Lovely impression that leaves here.
John Fremont
@Cermet: Yep. I remember when the ACA was passed and the Repubs said if this health care program is so great why won’t you guys sign up for it. The Dems then made Congress and their staff subject to the ACA.
Bill Arnold
@schrodingers_cat:
OK, then who’s idea was it?
Immanentize
@marklar:
That sounds like the horrible Catholic power shaming royal “we” bullshit I suffered as a child. I didn’t Know Sister Mary of Perpetual Torture was on the blogs.
And from what you’ve written, I am pretty positive I have worked with as many, if not more, people with mental disabilities than you have. Poseur. Priest? Friend of the teenagers who should all be required to send an explanation of their behavior to every college they applied to?
What a jackass.
marklar
@Mnemosyne:
I have no beef with your comment of ” excuse-making for privileged white teenagers behaving badly.” The sticking point for me is generalizing from the group to the individual. From the videoclip, we don’t know much about the smirker, other than he had this creepy looking smirk and was crowding the gentleman.
You jumped the gun in assuming that I was engaging in excuse making to let a White, privileged bully off the hook. If he is, indeed, a White, privileged bully, he should have to deal with the consequences. Suggesting we take a moment to get all the information BEFORE we condemn should be looked as a best-practices, not as excuse-making.
Oh, and please keep up with your pointed replies and comments, as long as they aren’t directed at me. Keeping up with you is exhausting!
Ohio Mom
@JPL: That’s their ultimate plan.
Starfish
@marklar:
Your line of conversation was completely pointless, and it is banned completely on one of the blogs that I read. Basically, speculating about the unknown facts of someone’s mental state does nothing to advance a conversation. Attributing their behavior to some cause or another is not helpful in any way.
Here at point #2, it explains why what you are doing is bullshit.
marklar
@germy:
Statistically speaking, you’re probably wrong. They wouldn’t all be on the spectrum. Most would be jerks. However, would you be surprised if ONE of them was on the spectrum (or some other way of being), and was engaging in behavior to get approval from his/her peers, without considering the racist nature of what he/she was doing? If so, would you say that THEY (as opposed to their behavior) were racist?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
he was also wearing a MAGA hat, which might suggest something, I don’t know
marklar
@Immanentize:
Sorry about your interpretation of the “we”. Nothing regal about it. It referred to Ohio Mom and me….i.e., “we”. Of course, if you want to misinterpret it as being applied to you as well to justify your misreading of my intentions, we, I mean I, can’t stop you. Oh, and thank you for your work in the disabilities community…we need people with passion in it.
schrodingers_cat
@Bill Arnold: T is a xenophobic bigot, he likes the idea of causing pain to immigrants, having them live in fear. He farms out the policy details to the likes of legislative aides of anti-immigrant senators like Miller, Cissna, and other hacks that have gathered around him from anti-immigrant Tanton founded network of think-tanks.
* Miller worked for Sessions and CIssna who now heads the USCIS worked for Grasseley.
The Dangerman
As for those Kentucky students, I say expel every fucking one of them and good luck getting into a good school with only a GED.
Fuck ’em.
SFAW
General request to you vicious jackals: please don’t bring any open flame(s) to this discussion. The “autism” straw man might combust, and the resulting conflagration would not be pretty.
Adam L Silverman
I’m back and will try to get caught up. I will say as someone who attended a Catholic high school, a Jesuit one to be precise, if I or any of my classmates had done that we’d have been expelled already. And the Catholic ones would be turned over to their diocesan and parish leaders for months of remedial penance.
SFAW
@The Dangerman:
Even the autistic ones? How cruel you are.
The Dangerman
@SFAW:
What did I miss about autism?
Starfish
@The Dangerman: That’s not going to happen because there are men in the community who are willing to stand there and be concerned and say that this is all about free speech. Just look how Barbaroo did not suspend a single student, but they are now going to go tour a Holocaust Museum because I am sure that will fix it. Look at the pastor who is making all the excuses in that story.
J R in WV
@marklar:
What a pile of crap!
You don’t know a dammed thing about that bigoted kid except what I know — he’s willing to attempt to intimidate a respected elder of another race, and grinning while he does so. If and when surrounded by other bigots, just like the Proud Boys who killed and beat people at UVa not that long ago. So not brave!i
I do have occasion to know about a wide variety of mental disabilities, although as a family member rather than a seer or shrink, and the only mental disability I see in the video is hate and evil. Hoping all of those kids are taught a lesson about humility, and need to enroll at a nearby Public High School in order to graduate and apply for admission to college, somewhere. Maybe somewhere like NC A&T U, or another traditionally black university. We have a couple good schools like that here in WV.
And thanks for you gentlemanly behavior towards other B-J participants, also, too.
Jerk. Russian Troll or Republican toilet bowl, hard to tell the difference from just the posting!
Take a long walk off a short pier — now that we’ve had the opportunity to discuss your opinions of both bigots and B-J Jackals, I no longer hesitate to recommend that as a new career choice for you.
The Dangerman
@Starfish:
Uh uh. Speech is still free, but free speech can have consequences. See Chicks, Dixie.
Adam L Silverman
@Brachiator: No, his dad had to spend $25 million in donations to Harvard to buy Jared into Harvard.
marklar
@Starfish:
Thanks for the link. Point #2 is well argued. It does, point out that the behavior may knowingly OR unknowingly occur. Here’s my question to you….does that make a difference? If it is the latter, should the consequences for the behavior be the same?
You also write “Basically, speculating about the unknown facts of someone’s mental state does nothing to advance a conversation. Attributing their behavior to some cause or another is not helpful in any way.” I. AGREE. 100%! That is what motivated my post. People were speculating (with reason, given the MAGA hat) of the smirker’s mental state (i.e., racist, privileged) based on limited information. The behavior of the mob was pretty clear, but I was pushing back on forming a conclusion on an individual.
I could flip your comment around by suggesting that “attributing their behavior to racism or privilege (i.e., some cause or another) is not helpful in any way.” I don’t want to do that because there clearly was race-based intimidation going on on the part of the mob, and very likely on the part of the smirker. However, as YOU POINTED OUT, particularly with regard to the smirker, that’s an “unknown fact about somebody’s mental state”.
Look, when all is said and done, I’d be willing to bet that I’m wrong about him. The point is, at the time this thread started, we didn’t know enough about his mental state to draw any conclusions.
WaterGirl
@The Dangerman: Or this person:
A black R&B artist hoped singing for Trump would build ‘a bridge.’ It derailed her career instead.
edit: I confess I had no sympathy for her.
Starfish
@The Dangerman: A lot of the defenders of free speech only come out to defend people attacking minorities, and any consequences are seen as stifling their free speech.
marklar
@The Dangerman:
It’s my fault. I wouldn’t spend any time catching up….you’ll just see a bunch of grown ups (with Ohio Mom as the exception) acting childish!
WaterGirl
@marklar: You really do not know when to stop digging. Or perhaps you don’t know how. Hint: Just drop it.
marklar
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Agreed! Which is why I started all of this with pointing out that my speculation is extremely unlikely.
Immanentize
I have never pied anyone, yet. I just should not feed trolls. I have the strength to refrain….
I just should not feed trolls. I have the strength to refrain….
Starfish
@marklar: Yes, you have a point. MAGA hat wearers are truly the forward guard on letting us know how to address racism in the community. Also, people who skip out on public schools to go to private schools are generally impoverished and suffering people.
Get out of here with your nonsense.
Immanentize
@WaterGirl: Really. Tears that will never be shed.
When did “I’m the victim!” become our national motto?
Omnes Omnibus
@marklar: Hey, I found a sea lion.
Immanentize
red hat = brown shirt.
red hat = hatred
jl
@The Dangerman: 6.5
Edit: but an 11 on Trujmp’s general affect.
debbie
@schrodingers_cat:
I don’t want to hear a fucking thing from Trump, frankly, or from those who have been noted as trolls. I have not seen a post from anyone suggesting that the slightest crumbs Trump has offered will be good enough. I will say I have not seen every single post in every thread, but I don’t think I’m missing that many.
Miss Bianca
@gene108: Or when someone starts up with that “Boomers Bad, All Boomers Bad, Da Yoot Should Just Take Over Cuz All Da Yoot Are Good” stuff
marklar
@WaterGirl:
@Mnemosyne:
“You can’t have it both ways. You yourself said we shouldn’t “fetishize” the disabled by assuming that someone on the spectrum wouldn’t understand what wearing that hat means, so I’m doing him the courtesy of assuming that he’s just as much of a racist asshole as anyone else in a MAGA hat.”
Thank you and Point well made about the MAGA hat. But trust me, I’ve seen that same look and crowding on the face of autistic people who are rapt in fascination, and I’ve seen young autistic adults wear emblems of their peers to try and fit in. I have also seen people falsely accused of holding despicable attitudes/opinions Given those personal observances, I just wanted people to take a breath before rending a final verdict about an individual (the mob’s behavior was clear).
Anyhow, I’ll take Watergirl’s advice and just drop it…It’s been nice making the acquaintance of the B-J community (and J R in W V, that is not passive aggressive politeness…I’ve learned a lot from you guys as a lurker over the years).
WaterGirl
@Immanentize: Perhaps they are mimicking Dear Leader without even realizing it.
debbie
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Amnestying now equals three years’ probation? The bitch is lying through her teeth. It’s a bullshit deal.
Ohio Mom
If the doxing I’ve seen is correct, and that MAGA-hatted kid fascinated by drumming is applying to Cincinnati State’s culinary school, he’s in for a time.
I don’t know the numbers, but a very large portion of the student body is African American, as is a good number of the staff. Plus for some reason, there is a more than a sprinkling of students from various African countries.
(Ohio Son takes classes there and I get to hang out in the cafeteria on days I’m the chauffeur).
If that isn’t the kid, I hope the actual drumming fan is exposed soon, so that the future chef is spared the shunning the actual asshole deserves.
debbie
@debbie:
ETA: The worst is that he formulated this “plan” on his still being around in three years. You just know he will kick all those DACA butts to the curb then. And there will be NO negotiating.
Miss Bianca
@Cheryl Rofer: Right on, Nancy SMASH!
debbie
@Bill Arnold:
Can Miller be compelled to testify before a House Committee?
SFAW
@The Dangerman:
See comment # 90.
His/her follow-up, after the viscous jackals responded viscously and jackal-like, has more-or-less been,”Hey, I was just asking a question! What’s the big deal?”
hilts
@marklar:
This is pure, unadulterated bullshit!
People who wear MAGA hats are unrepentant scumbags plain and simple. Don’t start making excuses for these ratfuckers.
SFAW
@marklar:
Wow, the self-pitying schtick is as endearing as it ever was.
SFAW
@marklar:
You really don’t know how to stop with the “I once knew someone who knew a shrink” psychobabble, do you?
Ohio Mom
@SFAW: So much for my efforts to stay young-at-heart!
Marklar, wait a bit, pick a new nym and try coming out of lurking again sometime later — You’ll get the hang of being here.
WaterGirl
@SFAW: He did say at #312 that he would stop digging, so maybe we can quit replying to earlier comments until/unless he digs back in.
SFAW
@Ohio Mom:
Sorry, kid. It was not my intent to have you become collateral damage.
Immanentize
@debbie: He will not be around to kick any DACA folks anywhere, if we do our jobs.
ETA In three years….
SFAW
@WaterGirl:
The “passive aggressive” usage was in that same comment (i.e., 312), after saying he/she would stop. I found it … ironic?
Miss Bianca
@Frankensteinbeck:
*snortle*
Great image.
Ruckus
@Cheryl Rofer:
Just got back to the thread but I have a bit of news for Sen Tom Udall.
drumpf never ever discusses anything in good faith. He has one approach, what he thinks is good for him, no one else. He never discusses, talks, compromises, or argues in good faith. Everything is one sided with him, it’s everything his way or nothing. He’s a bull in a china shop, wrecking everything around him if he doesn’t get his way.
Tehanu
@Adam L Silverman:
Thank you!
marklar
@Ohio Mom:
Thanks, Mom. I’ve got ‘cantaloupe skin’ as opposed to peach skin (a great metaphor to help kids learn to handle bullying BTW), so I’m fine with the barbs.
As a fellow parent of a neurodiverse child, I’m quite sensitive to assumptions being made about their behavior, and am somewhat defensive about that possibility.
Moreover, as an educator with a ‘growth mindset’, I believe that people like your very own John Cole can be deplorable at one stage in life, yet redeem themselves with the right kind of support. If people weren’t redeemable, there wouldn’t be a Balloon Juice.
Peace out.
The Midnight Lurker
Hey front pagers! How about a new post file title:
FUCKIN’ HITLER YOUTH
WaterGirl
@SFAW: You are correct. It’s like my sister last summer. I finally said “let’s agree to disagree” and she said “okay”. Then she couldn’t help herself; she added “but I’m right”.
Un-fucking-believable.
Miss Bianca
@Omnes Omnibus: Will NO ONE have compassion for the sea lion who barks, “I am just trying to have a civil conversation about how easily autism could be mistaken for racism, and you are all being VERY RUDE to me”?
Ruckus
@Miss Bianca:
Me. My compassion is to ignore his dumb ass.
SFAW
@WaterGirl:
Cole is your sister?
schrodingers_cat
@debbie: This is from Dec thread
From two days ago
Yes these comments are few and far between, but they exist. They were far more mainstream when Schumer offered $25B for the Wall in exchange for a DACA deal, which was rejected by the WH.
BobS
I’m shocked by that video- you’d think a church that essentially made “Thou shalt fuck children” an 11th commandment would produce more upstanding young adults.
debbie
@schrodingers_cat:
Thank you. Sorry I didn’t see this sooner; I got caught up in cooking.