Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Narcissists are always shocked to discover other people have agency.

Republicans: “Abortion is murder but you can take a bus to get one.” Easy peasy.

Republicans seem to think life begins at the candlelight dinner the night before.

I know this must be bad for Joe Biden, I just don’t know how.

Insiders who complain to politico: please report to the white house office of shut the fuck up.

Israel is using food as a weapon of war. Unforgivable.

Days Since JD Vance Insulted Women Across America: Zero

The truth is, these are not very bright guys, and things got out of hand.

Compromise? There is no middle ground between a firefighter and an arsonist.

Every one of the “Roberts Six” lied to get on the court.

The arc of the moral universe doesn’t bend itself. it’s up to us.

Oh FFS you might as well trust a 6-year-old with a flamethrower.

My right to basic bodily autonomy is not on the table. that’s the new deal.

If marriage is the equivalent of selling yourself into slavery, women with self respect should reject the offer.

How can republicans represent us when they don’t trust women?

It’s the corruption, stupid.

Republicans in disarray!

Fuck that bum, let’s go Joe!

Republicans don’t lie to be believed, they lie to be repeated.

The frogs are rarely mistaken.

Putin dreamed of ending NATO, and now it’s Finnish-ed.

I’d try pessimism, but it probably wouldn’t work.

No offense, but this thread hasn’t been about you for quite a while.

I was confident that someone would point it out and thought why not me.

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WTF Oscars Open Thread

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I thought it was Cole’s job to put this up every year, but I guess the bunnies have him enthralled.

This came out yesterday, and somebody said HOLD MY BEER…

Reader Interactions

224Comments

  2. 2.

    Jerzy Russian

    Who is that woman and why did she walk through the Tellitubbies’ yard on the way to the stage?

  3. 3.

    The Midnight Lurker

    I’m watching the season finale of True Detective, then I’ll switch over.

    “Time is a flat circle.”

    Although I always thought Schrödinger was the pessimist and Nietzsche was the optimist. At least, that was my takeaway from Philosophy 101.

  5. 5.

    Brachiator

    As I noted in another thread, I think 2018 was a great year for movies.

    I just hope the meretricious Green Book does not win Best Picture. It is well made and well acted, but makes the black character secondary to his own freaking story.

    For fun, here’s as Oscar voter on her ballot.

    https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/lists/2019-brutally-honest-oscar-ballot-2-cooper-perfect-green-book-offensive-1188021/item/best-picture-brutally-honest-oscars-ballot-21-1188031

  6. 6.

    raven

    Damn,
    Brian May was appointed a CBE by Queen Elizabeth II in 2005 for “services to the music industry and for charity work”.[8] May earned a PhD in astrophysics from Imperial College London in 2007,[1][2] and was Chancellor of Liverpool John Moores University from 2008 to 2013.[9] He was a “science team collaborator” with NASA’s New Horizons Pluto mission.[10][11] He is also a co-founder of the awareness campaign Asteroid Day.[12] Asteroid 52665 Brianmay was named after him. May is also an animal rights activist, campaigning against the hunting of foxes and the culling of badgers in the UK.[13]

  8. 8.

    NotMax

    2½ hours of mowing all accomplished. Ground still a bit spongy even a few days after the 13 days of rain, couple of spots were touch and go.

    Awards shows? To coin a phrase, blech*. The Oscars? More implants in the building than people.

    *(The Tonys are the exception that proves the rule, and also one of the less than a handful of awards shows not permitted to go so much as one minute over the time allotted by the network.)

  9. 9.

    Brachiator

    Roma won best foreign language film. Could it also win Best Film.

    Good mix of films, especially Shoplifters.

  10. 10.

    Amir Khalid

    I observe a tradition of not seeing the Oscars — it’s like watching video of a company’s annual staff dinner, only without food — but having Oscar winners bring the weirdness strikes me as a good thing.

  11. 11.

    Brachiator

    @NotMax:
    The telecast is fun this year. I don’t care that it goes over time.

    I don’t often watch the show, but a bad cold is kicking my butt, so I am at home.

    The show is a nice diversion.

  16. 16.

    NotMax

    @Brachiator

    The Oscars telecast is supposed to go long – it’s a given factored in by the network when they sell ad time. If it actually ended on the dot there would be moolah lost.

  18. 18.

    MazeDancer

    Watching the entire audience in their fancy duds leap to their feet and start rocking out to Queen + Adam Lambert was fun.

  19. 19.

    raven

    @geg6: I mean I’ve obviously heard all those dopey songs everyone loves but I was done with rock and roll when they were popular.

  21. 21.

    eclare

    @Brachiator: Seth Meyer had a bit this past week on a film called White Savior, based on that and other films where the white person is the hero in the African American person’s life. And of course lessons are learned. Even though I live in Memphis, I never saw The Blind Side for that reason.

  22. 22.

    Brachiator

    @raven:

    I assumed people knew that. Queen wasn’t in my wheelhouse so I’ll take your word for it

    I was not a big fan, but knew their hits.

    I watched their Live Aid performance on YouTube and some “reaction videos” and paid more attention to his guitar work. It was really good and often creatively reacted to Freddie Mercury’s vocals. The entire band was tight.

  24. 24.

    geg6

    Said it below, but Bohemian Rhapsody deservedly won all the major sound awards. That film was the most fun I’ve had in a theater in at least twenty years. Great music, Rami Malek WAS Freddie Mercury, and, despite some playing with timelines and such, captured the spirit of its subject beautifully. Movies often disappoint me, especially if based on someone or something I know a lot about. This one didn’t.

  25. 25.

    Mary G

    I almost never watch the Oscars since my mom died – we loved to drag the dresses – but I thought I would, to see Black Panther and Roma people, but none of the streaming services I pay for have it, so oh well. Twitter will do.

  27. 27.

    geg6

    @raven:

    That was my era. The posters on my teenage walls were Freddie Mercury, David Bowie, Mick Jagger, the MC5, and the New York Dolls.

  28. 28.

    Brachiator

    @eclare:

    Seth Meyer had a bit this past week on a film called White Savior, based on that and other films where the white person is the hero in the African American person’s life.

    Saw it the other day. Very funny. Also well acted and produced.

    Worth watching

    https://youtu.be/T_RTnuJvg6U

  33. 33.

    Brachiator

    Spidey wins for Best Animated movie. Damn right.

    Incredibles 2 wasn’t chopped liver, but Spidey righteously rules.

  35. 35.

    Anne Laurie

    @Omnes Omnibus: There aren’t many of us who can pull off full-length purple, and I agree Spike Lee isn’t in the minority.

    But my people were Gaelic, so I can’t find it in my hear to reject a man in an event-appropriate skirt. Console yourself that he wore it with a proper white shirt!

  36. 36.

    Mnemosyne

    @Belafon:

    That was one of my two award wishes for tonight. G called me into the room just in time to see my second one happen for Spider-Man: Into the Spider-Verse.

  45. 45.

    Mnemosyne

    @raven:

    There was a funny incident in England a few years ago when May was doing a protest with a bunch of young women dressed as badgers that somehow crossed paths with a neo-Nazi demonstration.

    May sicced the badger women on them and they had no idea what to do about being mocked by a bunch of young women dressed as badgers. ?

  46. 46.

    Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho

    @raven: Show off.

    I had comp tickets to a Who concert in 1979 at Riverfront Coliseum but an interesting guy I’d recently met invited me to dinner and I went there instead.

  47. 47.

    Brachiator

    Cool to see that women were the creators of best animated short and documentary short. Makes the lack of women best director nominees look especially stupid.

  48. 48.

    geg6

    @Mnemosyne:

    He’s a very interesting and pretty brilliant guy. Queen has been underestimated for decades. So happy to see them getting the kudos they deserve.

  51. 51.

    zhena gogolia

    When we were done watching Colin Firth Darcy and Victoria & Albert & the Crystal Palace, we turned it on. After about 1 minute 35 seconds I was bored out of my mind and turned it off.

  53. 53.

    NotMax

    How many people from PriceWaterhouse were tasked this year with checking and re-checking that the correct card was placed into each envelope? I’m guessing somewhere around a dozen.

  54. 54.

    Chacal Charles Calthrop

    True tale, I swear, from a friend of mine who was at a party in LA where the host was a sound engineer: at the party, a clueless guest spied the Oscar statuette on the mantle. Clueless guest apparently recognized it was an Oscar but didn’t seem to know that anyone besides actors ever got Oscars, because he actually asked the host “how did you get this?”
    Needless to say, he was never asked back to another party…..

  61. 61.

    Jeffro

    @geg6:

    The posters on my teenage walls were Freddie Mercury, David Bowie, Mick Jagger, the MC5, and the New York Dolls.

    those SHOULD have been my posters, my walls…alas, I had inferior friends who got me started on Poison, Ratt, David Lee Roth, and the like. It took a while to circle back for the good stuff ;)

  64. 64.

    Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho

    @Amir Khalid: Indeed the one I skipped was. I saw Townsend and Entwistle on the street a couple of times over the years when the lawsuits were ongoing.

  68. 68.

    Brachiator

    Green Book won for Best Original Screenplay.

    Bullshit

    Goddam, I hope this movie does not win Best Picture. But this win may be a bad sign.

    Need to weed out more old farts from the Academy

  69. 69.

    Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho

    @Gin & Tonic: Besides my good fortune of avoiding the stampede, the guy in question and I were together for a while, and remained friends until his suicide in 2017.

    @Omnes Omnibus: They probably played Tainted Love too.

    ETA: Over/under on whether anyone remembers that reference?

  71. 71.

    Mnemosyne

    Are all guys from Rhode Island assholes? I only have a few data points from Hollywood, but so far …

  73. 73.

    Jeffro

    @NotMax: That’s an interesting pairing! “Live long and share the wealth, capitalist running dogs?” (I kid, I kid)

    I think at one point in college I had up a Bowie poster, a Megadeth poster, and a (PG) one of some centerfold wrapped up in a red satin bedsheet. Confusing times…still confusing…

  78. 78.

    Nelle

    I’m not watching as I don’t Ha ave tv connections and usually don’t care but this year, I’ve got a friend up for adapted screenplay for BlackkKlansman. When we saw it, I told him, as we were walking out, that I thought he got his Oscar. Waiting to see if I was right.

  79. 79.

    geg6

    @Jeffro:

    I think I have a few years on you, so your posters would never have been in my walls. My boyfriend in high school played guitar in a pretty popular local band. He introduced me to a lot of things my peers, who were listening to Boston and Lynyrd Skynyrd, either had no idea about or disdained as “gay.” I loved that androgynous thing. Still do, a bit. Punk, androgyny and never fitting in was my wheelhouse.

  83. 83.

    B.B.A.

    Green Book is a Farrelly brothers movie…the same guys who made Dumb & Dumber and There’s Something About Mary.

    My inner teenage boy thinks it’s awesome they could win an Oscar. Like all teenage boys, he’s an obnoxious dipshit.

  86. 86.

    NotMax

    Forced to sip vodka pre-dinner. Only one decent sized drink left in the 1.75 liter bottle and tonight is trash night, so had to decant into that bottle the contents of the most stupidly designed bottle ever, the one for Kirkland brand French vodka*, so I can toss that into the trash barrel.

    /first world problems

    Before anyone says it, it is illegal here to recycle liquor bottles. Go figure.

    *per the label, gluten free. Sheesh.

  88. 88.

    Nelle

    Yay!!!! My kids went to school and played soccer with Kevin’s kids, and our families policies and picnicked together. He’s done a lot of good movies. I’m so pleased for him.

  91. 91.

    Mnemosyne

    I look forward to seeing other men trying to carry off a scarf and sequined evening coat and failing miserably because they’re just not as innately cool as Chadwick Boseman.

  93. 93.

    gwangung

    @Nelle: @: Apparently, I’m Facebook friends of friends of him (one of which is a playwright I’m exec producing later this year…..)(just Kevin Baconing here…)

  94. 94.

    NotMax

    Damn, Grand Hotel on TCM. Another of those movies can’t not watch even though have seen it dozens of times. Even went to see a Broadway production of it starring, of all people, John (Dukes of Hazzard) Schneider.

    @geg6

    Big Klaus Nomi fan, then?

    ;)

  100. 100.

    FlyingToaster

    @NotMax: Illegal to recycle liquor bottles? Wow. Our PIRG perennially tries to get hard liquor, cider and wine bottles added to the redemption (right now it’s carbonated = 5¢/container), rather than the recycling toter.

    The only stuff we can’t recycle is wires — earphones, power cords, cables (which can go to the recycling center, but not in the toter), styrofoam (no food containers; other styro can go to the 3x/annum drop-off), and plastic bags (groceries have bag bins).

  103. 103.

    mad citizen

    I think we’re in an era of crappy movies. I sometimes like and sometimes tolerate Wes Anderson movies, but tried watching Isle of Dogs the other night and fell asleep and fast forwarded it. We watched A Star is Born the other night, it’s well done but it doesn’t transcend. I look forward to watching the Favourite. They just called Blackkklansman a masterpiece–really?

  105. 105.

    Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho

    @Gin & Tonic: Oh, please don’t! We were a horrible couple but good pals (eventually) afterwards. I have several lifelong friends I met when we were together. And he’s not the only friend I lost that way.

    I provided TMI, and I apologize.

  107. 107.

    NotMax

    @FlyingToaster

    Plastic grocery/shopping bags been verboten here for a decade or more.

    In the can’t teach an old dog new tricks category, to this day have to occasionally double back to the car to grab a fabric bag before entering stores. Hell, still have to make a conscious effort to remember to engage the seat belt in the car. As for ‘dial 1,’ fuhgeddaboutit.

  110. 110.

    Jerzy Russian

    @Mnemosyne:

    I look forward to seeing other men trying to carry off a scarf and sequined evening coat

    I do that all of the time here at home (for what it is worth, I look like a cross between Sean Connery and Harrison Ford).

  111. 111.

    plato

    Great to see such great diversity in best actor and actress nominees. Diversity is so passe, so last years, so it’s business as usual, I guess.

  112. 112.

    Mnemosyne

    Wow, Gary Oldman is even shorter than I remembered.

    And Rami Malek was amazing in “Bohemian Rhapsody,” though I felt a little meh about the rest of it.

  114. 114.

    geg6

    @Mnemosyne:

    He made that movie, though I think the casting agent should get an Oscar for getting the band exactly right. They were uncannily like each band member.

  116. 116.

    hilts

    @Mnemosyne:

    Rami Malek was amazing in “Bohemian Rhapsody,” though I felt a little meh about the rest of it.

    Most of the reviews I read said the same thing.

  119. 119.

    Mnemosyne

    I feel like the Oscar producers are using John Lewis as a human shield for “Green Book” and it’s pissing me off.

  121. 121.

    Brachiator

    @mad citizen:

    I think we’re in an era of crappy movies. I sometimes like and sometimes tolerate Wes Anderson movies, but tried watching Isle of Dogs the other night and fell asleep and fast forwarded it.

    There are good and bad movies in every era. I think that 2018 was a very good year, but didn’t care much for Isle of Dogs. Enjoyed Anderson’s earlier Grand Budapest Hotel.

  123. 123.

    guachi

    Watched Bohemian Rhapsody while working out (Navy gets movies early on disc) and, sure enough, all the reviewers were correct. Mediocre biopic with great musical set pieces and Rami Malek was amazing.

    Spider-Man was the best animated feature, hands down.

  125. 125.

    Jerzy Russian

    @Mnemosyne:

    I feel like the Oscar producers are using John Lewis as a human shield for “Green Book” and it’s pissing me off.

    The only movies I have seen recently were “Vice” and “Aquaman”. I don’t have a TV and am pretty much disconnected to recent culture. Is there an executive summary on the (apparent) controversy surrounding “Green Book”?

  138. 138.

    Suzanne

    I don’t know who Olivia Colman is and I hadn’t even heard of the movie she was in, but holy crap was she adorable and charming.

    Sad for Spike Lee.

  139. 139.

    Mnemosyne

    @Suzanne:

    The Favourite is really good. It was not what I expected and is definitely not a stuffy “Masterpiece Theater”-type historical drama.

  143. 143.

    Suzanne

    Green Book? Fo’ realz?

    In more important news, I think Angela Bassett had the best look of the night. God DAMN does that woman look incredible.

  148. 148.

    Mnemosyne

    @NotMax:

    With 8 nominees, I’m guessing it was a very close vote. That’s part of the problem with giving too many options — it dilutes the vote.

  149. 149.

    MoxieM

    @raven: all I can come up with is 15th row center (floor), Boston Garden, 1976. Tix were about $20, which was a stretch! Saw Zeppelin in ’70 (I think) at the Yale Bowl….

    But soon after the Stone show, I was at scuzzy night clubs seeing the NY Dolls et al. And I do mean the kind where you stick to the floor.

    Ramones opening for Iggy, that was a night. Apparently some of us oldsters are losing hearing in certain frequencies from standing in front of the stacks.

    Anybody else here remember the bathroom at the Rat? or the Hoodoo Barbecue?
    The Club? Cantones?

  153. 153.

    mad citizen

    @Mnemosyne: Have not seen Blackkklansman yet. I liked Spike Lee back in the day, but can’t recall any recent ones I’ve seen. I’ll watch this one, it looks funny at least.

  157. 157.

    B.B.A.

    New rule: white people shouldn’t be allowed to make movies about race.

    Come to think of it, white people just shouldn’t be allowed.

  158. 158.

    Mnemosyne

    @guachi:

    Most likely, the vote split between several movies.

    Plus Academy members love crappy, white-centered movies about race. See also, “Crash.”

    Also, Peter Farrelly is a Hollywood insider with a lot of pull and goodwill. Many schmoozing opportunities.

  160. 160.

    James E Powell

    @MoxieM:

    Ramones opening for Iggy, that was a night. Apparently some of us oldsters are losing hearing in certain frequencies from standing in front of the stacks.

    I did that at one of Iggy’s shows at the Agora in Cleveland. My ears were ringing all the next day.

  163. 163.

    Mnemosyne

    @mad citizen:

    We just got it on DVD from the library. I usually like Spike Lee’s movies, but the Academy is still very biased against directors from New York, weird as that is. Yes, race is a factor, but the NYC thing plays into it as well. Look at how long it took Martin Scorsese to get a Best Director Oscar.

  164. 164.

    NotMax

    @hilts

    The rationale was to ensure inclusion of big box office blockbusters so as to try to stem the steady ratings erosion for the program.

  166. 166.

    CaseyL

    The Favourite is one of the few nominated movies that I saw (I just don’t go to movies much anymore). I’m always a sucker for a good period piece, and the trailer made it clear this was not your average period piece. Raunchy, clever, whipsnap dialog, suspenseful… and all about the women. Really excellent.

  169. 169.

    PaulWartenberg

    Green Book is just another example of Hollywood still thinking it’s winning a war on racism when it’s overlooking movies like Black Klansman – which should have won – that tells us the damn fight is not over yet.

    The REAL Best Picture winner is Spider-Verse. THAT’S the one everyone’s gonna remember five years from now.

  170. 170.

    PaulWartenberg

    Green Book winning Best Picture is another sign – like Crash’s undeserving win in 2006 – that the oscars needs a judge who reviews the votes and then tells them “ARE YOU OUT OF YOUR GODDAMN MINDS” before sending them back with new ballots for movies that are truly deserving.

  171. 171.

    Brachiator

    @Mnemosyne:

    Plus Academy members love crappy, white-centered movies about race. See also, “Crash.”

    Some movie goers loved Green Book. Hollywood knows that Magic Negro films often work for white mainstream audiences.

    Public radio station KPCC did a live Oscar show for listeners. Green Book was a clear audience favorite. I think it may still be in the box office top ten in the UK.

  172. 172.

    hilts

    @NotMax:

    I did not agree with the decision to expand the number of best picture nominees. As far as ratings erosion, maybe it’s time for the Oscars to go the way of the dinosaur.

  173. 173.

    Ruckus

    As it’s an open thread and I couldn’t care less about the oscars, I will relate that I went to Ikea tonight and there was a guy in a wheel chair, not a standard hospital one but one which is a seat and wheels. He went up the escalator sitting in his wheel chair. His buddy was behind him, hopeful that they both didn’t fall back down on the way up. He was pumped that it worked. Happiest black man I’ve seen in a very long time, especially one in a wheel chair, and I see a lot of men in wheelchairs at the VA. Bet it was better than the oscars.

  176. 176.

    Bess

    @Brachiator: I haven’t seen the movie. What magic did this negro perform?

    From the synopsis I assumed that the black character was an exceptionally talented person, both in the film and in real life. And over time the white guy was able to see past skin color and his prejudices and evolve a bit.

    That is not an uncommon occurrence for many of us who grew up in the segregated South. My “magic negro” was an uneducated black man who worked on the loading dock at the wholesale hardware warehouse where I went for stock for our store. While uneducated he had a lot of wisdom and kindness which was revealed to me over time. Getting to know him as a person helped me along my path past my racist upbringing. It helped to start seeing individuals and not just “them”.

  177. 177.

    gwangung

    @Bess: Well, that’s YOUR story.

    But the story behind the Green Book is intrinsically African American. It impacted black Americans the most; the conditions that created the Green Book made black Americans perform the most extreme actions. To center a white character to tell that story is enraging to the African American community and is more than a little racist.

  178. 178.

    Mnemosyne

    @Brachiator:

    I think the factor that put it over the top is that Peter Farrelly is well-known and well-liked in Hollywood. Academy members voted for their buddy Peter, who finally made that serious film he kept saying he wanted to make after all of those goofy comedies.

    Never underestimate how influential workplace politics are on the Oscars. Farrelly is an insider because he lives and works there. All of the other top nominees except “A Star Is Born” were made by outsiders.

    I half-expected “A Star Is Born” to win because the powerful actors’ block usually votes for their own, but Farrelly was being rewarded for his 20+ year career and and Cooper was a first-time director.

  179. 179.

    Mnemosyne

    @Bess:

    What magic did this negro perform?

    He got a bigoted white guy to see him as human. As you just testified, this is a pretty serious magic trick.

    And again: Farrelly took a story about African-Americans and told it through the eyes of a white dude. A brilliant, accomplished musician will be primarily remembered by moviegoers as the guy who taught his chauffeur to be less racist.

  180. 180.

    Yarrow

    I sort of came in halfway through. Lady Gaga and Bradley Cooper sure seem like they’re a thing. Or she has a thing for him. Their song together was lovely.

    Spike Lee was great and I loved seeing Samuel L. Jackson give him the award. That was one of the best parts of the night.

    I just saw “Bohemian Rhapsody” and really enjoyed it but Rami Malek was by far the best part of it. So glad he won. He deserved it for his performance as Freddie Mercury. Amazing.

    Haven’t seen “The Favourite” yet but really want to. I loved Olivia Coleman in “The Night Manager” so I’m guessing she’s just as excellent in The Favourite. Her acceptance…should it be called a speech?…was the best of the night. So funny and sweet.

    Glenn Close is such a good actress but she’s pretty much the Susan Lucci of Best Actress nominations at this point. Susan finally won. There’s still hope, Glenn!

  181. 181.

    gwangung

    @Mnemosyne: Yeah, displacing POC from their own story to star a white person pretty much incenses me. And the character assassination on Dr. Shirley follows from that (and, I think is the probable reason for it),

  182. 182.

    Bess

    @gwangung: Is the story of racism not told? Can black people be the only ones who tell the story? Is there some sort of exclusive right to pointing out the evils of racism?

    Might having the story being told by a white character increase the likelihood of getting through to white viewers? Do blacks really need to be told about racism?

    Might there be value in telling a story where the people who still harbor some racism watch someone racially like themselves learn to think differently?

  183. 183.

    Yarrow

    @Mnemosyne: I haven’t seen it but I have to say that I heard a movie about the Green book was being made and thought that was great. It would be an interesting film about a subject a lot people knew little about. Then I saw the commercials for it and I was sure I had the wrong film. Why was a white guy being figured so prominently in a film about the Green book? It seemed like they had mixed up the title with some other film. So even not having seen it, just from the ads it’s clear why there could be a controversy.

  185. 185.

    gwangung

    @Bess: In the 21st Century, no, no, and no.

    And to turn it to you, why do YOU need to have a story star a white character when the story concerns a marginalized community? It’s like asking, “And how was the play, Mrs. Lincoln?”

  186. 186.

    Brachiator

    @Mnemosyne:

    I think the factor that put it over the top is that Peter Farrelly is well-known and well-liked in Hollywood. Academy members voted for their buddy Peter, who finally made that serious film he kept saying he wanted to make after all of those goofy comedies

    There’s Something About Mary is a superior film.

    But who knows. I can see the Hollywood politics angle, but Hollywood and America often defiantly insist that white people be the dramatic center of a movie.

    The creators of Crazy Rich Asians noted that a couple of producers really loved the project, but also really really wanted the female lead to be a white woman.

    Green Book falls into that trap. One of the Oscar voters who discussed her ballot noted:

    I’m not a fan of Green Book, either — it felt kind of retrograde and borderline offensive with all the cliches, and then I read what the family [of Don Shirley] was saying and that didn’t help. My son said to me, “That movie is trash”; I wouldn’t go that far.

    It may be a generational thing with some of the older Oscar voters.

    A film like If Beale Street Could Talk is unapologetically black, and so also more universal.

  187. 187.

    Bess

    @gwangung: I have no need for the story told from the white character’s perspective. I haven’t seen the movie so I’m operating based on a lot of assumptions but if this is the story of one person’s transformation doesn’t it make some sense to tell if from their perspective?

    How would the story played if it was narrated by the inter-conversation of the black character? Would it be “What do I need to do next to get this cracker to make another little change?”.

  188. 188.

    Brachiator

    @Bess:

    How would the story played if it was narrated by the inter-conversation of the black character? Would it be “What do I need to do next to get this cracker to make another little change?”.

    This particular story didn’t need to be told at all.

  190. 190.

    Mnemosyne

    @Bess:

    Is there some sort of exclusive right to pointing out the evils of racism?

    In mainstream Hollywood films, only white characters are allowed to point out that racism is evil. So you are currently arguing that their exclusive right to do that should be maintained as-is.

    Academy voters had another choice with “BlacKkKlansman” of showing a multi-racial cast of characters led by a Black actor battling racism. But they chose the old, comfortable route they always follow. Again.

  193. 193.

    Mnemosyne

    @Brachiator:

    I can see the Hollywood politics angle, but Hollywood and America often defiantly insist that white people be the dramatic center of a movie.

    America is getting better about it — “Black Panther” and “Crazy Rich Asians” didn’t make huge amounts of money because only the people whose ethnic groups were depicted in those movies went to see them. But Hollywood still has its blind spots, especially when their buddy Peter has a dream project he wants them to produce.

    And I do think that Spike Lee is onto something: “Green Book” is a very easy movie to explain to audiences. It’s “Driving Miss Daisy” with the races reversed! It reassures people that they’ll leave the theater feeling that we’re on the right track with race relations, not unsettled about the future.

  194. 194.

    Brachiator

    @NotMax:

    If by superior you mean festering tureen of warmed over fecal matter, I’m with ya on that.

    No, I meant a great comedy.

    As always, your mileage may vary.

  196. 196.

    Bess

    It reassures people that they’ll leave the theater feeling that we’re on the right track with race relations

    Are we not on the right track? I’m not asking if we are moving as fast as many would like, but if we are heading in the right direction toward equal rights for all.

  197. 197.

    Brachiator

    @Mnemosyne:

    America is getting better about it — “Black Panther” and “Crazy Rich Asians” didn’t make huge amounts of money because only the people whose ethnic groups were depicted in those movies went to see them. But Hollywood still has its blind spots, especially when their buddy Peter has a dream project he wants them to produce.

    It’s a mixed record, and even film critics are part of the problem.

    There was, for example, Sofia Coppola’s abysmal remake of The Beguiled, which deletes two black female characters. Some critics hailed the film as a powerful statement about women.

  198. 198.

    Mnemosyne

    @Bess:

    Name a mainstream Hollywood movie where a Black protagonist directly convinces white characters in the film that racism is bad. Not that a white protagonist realizes the error of his or her ways, but that a Black protagonist convinces supporting white characters.

    I can think of exactly one from the past 10 years excluding “BlacKkKlansman,” and making a famous white character into a major antagonist was so controversial that it cost its writer/director deserved Oscar nominations.

  199. 199.

    Anne Laurie

    @Bess: Dude, from my perspective reading the comments, you started the day mansplaining building construction specs to a professional architect, and you’re finishing it lecturing an Asian-American professional playwright/director about how very very important it is for there to be more Oscars awarded to White Savior movies.

    This is sealioning at its most malignant. I don’t know if you’re deliberately trying to stir shite for the lulz, or if you’re so desperate for interaction that even negative attention feels like a ‘win’, but I would really prefer that you GET THE FUCK OUT OF MY POSTS and take your sad little puppetry-of-the-penis show elsewhere.

    Cole’s really tolerant about who derails the conversations here. Me, not so much.

  200. 200.

    Bess

    @Mnemosyne:

    Name a mainstream Hollywood movie where a Black protagonist directly convinces white characters in the film that racism is bad.

    You moved the goalpost from

    In mainstream Hollywood films, only white characters are allowed to point out that racism is evil.

  201. 201.

    Mnemosyne

    @Brachiator:

    Oh, mainstream film critics still have HUGE blind spots. Remember Manolha Dargis chirping about how much more awesome “Big Hero 6” would have been if the protagonist had been a white woman and not an Asian-American boy?

    But movie audiences are turning out to see films with more diverse casts, and that means that Disney and other big studios will keep making them because they make money.

  203. 203.

    Mnemosyne

    @Bess:

    Er, no, the goalpost is in the exact same place. I’m trying to make you look at it from the opposite side.

  204. 204.

    Brachiator

    @Mnemosyne:

    Oh, mainstream film critics still have HUGE blind spots. Remember Manolha Dargis chirping about how much more awesome “Big Hero 6” would have been if the protagonist had been a white woman and not an Asian-American boy?

    Thank goodness I missed that one, but Dargis has always been problematic.

  205. 205.

    Mnemosyne

    @Bess:

    She holds the keys. She gets to do that. And I say that as someone who’s been blocked by her before, so I’m going to take it as my cue to step away from this thread. Ciao!

  206. 206.

    Jay

    @Mnemosyne:

    You are sadly, wasting your time valiantly.

    The Green Book was a travel guide for African Americans that laid out paths and services, safe spaces in the US where the racism wouldn’t be right in their face all the time.

    The Green Book adaptation is about how Dr. Don Shirley hires a white chauffeur for his tour, to try to avoid some of the issues involved with “travelling while black”.

    The Green Book film is about the white chauffeur.

    Denial ain’t just a river in Egypt.

    But thank you for trying to inform the dense.

  207. 207.

    Ruckus

    @Mnemosyne:
    I’ve had enough of your sparing partner, my second addition to the pie filter since it became part of the site and not an add on. It’s just not worth it to put up with a guy who only wants to start fights. If I’d have wanted that I’d have stayed in my last job. It paid a bit better too.

  209. 209.

    Steve in the ATL

    @eclare:

    Even though I live in Memphis, I never saw The Blind Side for that reason.

    I went to MUS. No way I was going to watch a movie about Briarcrest!

  211. 211.

    Steve in the ATL

    @Jay: it’s 3 am, which is it not peak type mocking hour! Though there’s never a bad time for it….

  216. 216.

    Ruckus

    @Anne Laurie:
    I wonder if he tried to use best as a handle and either hit the wrong key or it was already taken. Seems that would occur to him – best.

  217. 217.

    Anne Laurie

    @Ruckus: See, I’m a more suspicious person than you. From past experience with sealions, I assume the only reason he didn’t use ‘Laquisha’ or ‘Tawana’ is that ‘Bess’ is harder to misspell when you’re retyping it over & over.

  220. 220.

    Anne Laurie

    @Jay: Well, if this turns out to be DougJ pulling a Borat… I’ll just say it’s unworthy of his talents!

  222. 222.

    JR

    @Mnemosyne: Out of Africa
    Driving Miss Daisy

    and they didn’t win best picture but Blind Side, Gran Torino*, etc.

    *This I hate more than all other white savior movies; not just for the offensiveness of its theme, but for its overall crappiness

  223. 223.

    Matt McIrvin

    @PaulWartenberg: My favorite pictures of the year were Sorry To Bother You, Into The Spider-Verse and Black Panther. Of those, only BP even got nominated for Best Picture, and it definitely wasn’t going to win.

    STBY got nominated for nothing; as Boots Riley explained, it was apparently because to get nominated at all you have to actively campaign for it, and this takes significant expense and effort.

  224. 224.

    Ruckus

    @Anne Laurie:
    Yeah, I’m not that suspicious – I’m sure some people are just assholes through and through and have to create shit wherever they travel. Have never figured out why though. Is it genes, upbringing, shitty outlook on life, mis-wired brains, got dropped on their heads as infants…….. all of the above?

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