.@BernieSanders makes a compelling case on how Trump voters are unfairly painted as racists. What they need is decent health care, a good job and a fair playing field. He says he can uniquely reach out to Trump country. #SandersTownHall
— Kyung Lah (@KyungLahCNN) February 26, 2019
Thanks so much, CNN media person, for your clarifying insight!
.@wolfblitzer "Will you release 10 years of your tax returns?"@BernieSanders: “Yes.”
Blitzer: When do you think we’ll be able to see them?
Sanders: “Soon. … They’re very boring tax returns." #SandersTownHall https://t.co/n2hqMm3i6W pic.twitter.com/CjzpHTCTtp
— CNN (@CNN) February 26, 2019
Shallow impression: Unless CNN’s makeup crew is moonlighting from their Industrial Light & Magic gig, Somebody seems to have had some work done. But has he, as they say, done the work?
Well, he’s had two years to come up with a better response than ‘My wife ate my homework does our taxes, also: printer glitch!’… and yet, here we are…
#QuestionForBernie Wtf?!
“Taxes are boring.”
“Mechanical issue”
“We don’t have accountants at home”
“my wife does most of them” pic.twitter.com/EVeBVWEMgV
— ??????Lisa Talmadge ???????? (@LisaTalmadge) February 26, 2019
You can literally get past filings by asking the IRS for copies. Anyone who has gotten a mortgage knows this. The man has three houses. This is not hard or time consuming.
— Lissa Guillet (@lissaguillet) February 26, 2019
Bernie Sanders had two years to drive down to his local Kinko's, and make copies of his tax returns. The excuses are not only no longer believable, but they're getting downright lame. #SandersTownHall
— Bill Madden (@activist360) February 26, 2019
Sounds like the current Republican Squatter-in-Chief, yes?
Klobuchar was asked about guns. Harris was asked about guns. Even Schultz was asked about guns. But the one candidate with a mixed track record on the issue of gun safety wasn’t asked about guns. ??#sanderstownhall https://t.co/l4UAS7bZ77
— Shannon Watts (@shannonrwatts) February 26, 2019
Also: Nothing says I’m the real progressive! like screaming at a young woman who *dares* question you about your campaign’s history of mishandling sexual harrassment issues…
Wow. Bernie just dissed the young woman asking about his staff sexual harassment scandal. Now he's screaming at her. This is truly ugly.
— Tom Watson (@tomwatson) February 26, 2019
"Sexual harassment? Look, the real problem is economic, cuz if I crap on capitalism – point out a woman works for me – Hi Nina! – the anti-capitalists will forget this question is one identity politics issue, & I hate distractions from my glorious economic revolution!!!" https://t.co/sRvzIttaVS
— Kristi Winters /Trump inspires domestic terrorists (@KWintie) February 26, 2019
Bernie Sanders tells young woman at #BernieTownHall that his remark about being too "busy" to notice sexual harassment was taken "a little bit out of context." Here's the exact context. pic.twitter.com/8lyZkup6mS
— Tommy MMXIXtopher (@tommyxtopher) February 26, 2019
Racism is economically solved. I wasn’t mean to Hillary. pic.twitter.com/MbR2AbpSPl
— ?️?Lisa Talmadge ??️? (@LisaTalmadge) February 26, 2019
Watch his eyes go out of focus as he’s asked about reparations. Once again: Sanders got universally dinged for that NYDN interview back in April 2016, where his economic “plans” came off as bearing a strong resemblance to those of the Underpants Gnomes. If he hasn’t managed to find a more coherent explanation, either there isn’t one… or he just can’t be bothered.
Oh shit, I almost felt bad for Bernie when Wolf Blitzer just KEPT ON WRECKING HIM on reparations. Seriously, watch to the end, it is brutal. #BernieTownHall pic.twitter.com/xaZD2SzqDu
— Tommy MMXIXtopher (@tommyxtopher) February 26, 2019
Sanders is now citing Jim Clyburn's 10-20-30 plan for distressed communities, widely touted by Hillary Clinton in 2016, as an alternative to reparations.
— Joan Walsh (@joanwalsh) February 26, 2019
In 2016, Bernie was presenting all kinds of shit without considering how they would get paid for, but once someone asked him about reparations, he talked about how unrealistic the whole idea was. Funny how that works.
— TheAfrocentricAsian (@jmood88) February 26, 2019
Media keeps telling me he’s working to do better on these issues and I’m just not seeing it
— Shannon ?? (@TheStagmania) February 26, 2019
I promise you Trump/GOP want to run against sanders BADLY after watching the awfulness that is #SandersTownHall
This is like watching a crotchety even older Richard Nixon debate Kennedy
— T. Fisher King (@T_FisherKing) February 26, 2019
Hey, Senator Sanders, do the right thing — give the Repubs a chance to choose a real populist for their candidate. You’re obviously only interested in serving the precious White Working Class(tm) (straight male) voter; if you’re giving up your precious ‘Independent’ status anyways, might as well go where those voters are!
Tim C.
As a general rule, the GOP has been pushing the Underpants Gnome model of taxation and economics since 1980, so Bernie would be a pretty good match over there. Likewise, I want to scream at the Berne fans who don’t actually seem to know much about the real Berne and have filled in the gaps with their own fantasies of “true socialism”
Brickley Paiste
Didn’t someone post recently on the fro t page about how Russian bots and avatars are busy making posts on social media trying g to sow dissention and discord among liberals and progressives by attacking various candidates?
How are such posts different from this one?
Humdog
Hate is such a tiring emotion. I have never had this much hate bubbling up before in my life. Shitstain, Wilmer, the traitor tots, even basic R voters. I am exhausted from hate. I’m gonna go look for cute dog videos or something.
ETA: while I am still here, fuck off, Paste eater.
Bobby Thomson
“Trump voters aren’t so bad” = “I care so little about women, POC, and LGBTQ people that I will gladly piss them off in a quixotic attempt to woo people who will literally never vote for a socialist.”
Read the room, dumbass.
Bobby Thomson
@Brickley Paiste: well, troll account, this is certainly ironic.
Brachiator
Sanders actually screamed at the woman? He wasn’t just his usual gruff self?
Jeez. What a dope.
Bobby Thomson
@Brachiator: what could go wrong with electing a thin skinned narcissistic bully who refuses to disclose his tax returns?
Adam L Silverman
@Brickley Paiste: Anne Laurie is neither a bot nor a troll.
Sab
One thing about Wilmer. At least with his voice we don’t ever need to worry about him sounding shrill.
Plato
@Brickley Paiste:
Typical trollish bs projection.
Gelfling 545
I have a few much younger acquaintances who are still rabidly pro Bernie. The one thing they have in common is relatively low little understanding of how government functions. The other thing is little knowledge of the real, as opposed to their idealized image, Sanders.
MattF
Sanders is the American version of a backbencher. His lifelong experience in policy is being ignored. Changing his mind is not part of his behavioral repertoire. His policy repertoire consists of assuming that the questioner will soon go away and ask someone else who has a more interesting anwer. It’s a puzzle why this works, but maybe the current occupant of the White House will offer a hint.
Mike in NC
Bernie is a 77 year old with anger management issues and a tenuous grasp on reality. In other words, excellent fit for the Trump demographic.
Major Major Major Major
Wow, that tax answer is uh, yeah. Wtf
Kay
I’m amazed they don’t hire someone to do their taxes. I would if I were him. It’s not that expensive and one would think he would want an arm’s length review, knowing they’ll be public and discussed. It just seems dumb. There’s a whole range of tax preparers. If it’s not complicated he doesn’t need the most pricey expert but since his wife works on his campaign she shouldn’t be doing them. We don’t have “accountants at home” either. We just hire one, like tens of millions of other people.
Adam L Silverman
@Sab: I keep waiting for him to stop what he’s doing, say “Excuse me, but I’d like a turkey on marble rye with schmaltz, the parve cole slaw, a half sour pickle, and Dr. Brown’s cream soda.”
MattF
@Adam L Silverman: You mean celery soda.
--bd
@Brickley Paiste: Gore Vidal’s ghost called. He wants his character’s nym back.
Dorothy A. Winsor
re-upped from the thread below because this was the one I meant to post in:
The dental hygienist and I were talking about the Oscars this morning, and I said I’d seen only “Black Panther” and “Vice.” She said, “I just love Dick Cheney. I’m a huge fan.” I had no idea what to say since I’ve never met a Cheney fan before. She said she admired how he managed things after 9/11 and loved how smart and competent he is. I still don’t know what to say.
Adam L Silverman
@MattF: Hell no. That stuff’s vile.
germy
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/us-cyber-command-operation-disrupted-internet-access-of-russian-troll-factory-on-day-of-2018-midterms/2019/02/26/1827fc9e-36d6-11e9-af5b-b51b7ff322e9_story.html?utm_term=.0aeab686c781
Bruuuuce
@Adam L Silverman: Half-sour pickle and marble rye (doubtless without seeds)? That doesn’t play in Brooklyn.
MattF
@Adam L Silverman: Heh. When my sister orders a Cel-Ray in a deli, the waiters give her ‘the look’.
Betty Cracker
Kamala Harris was asked about reparations and offered her LIFT Act as an alternative. That might not be justice, but it’s smart politics. If the Democratic nominee advocates reparations, Trump would win re-election in a fucking landslide.
Adam L Silverman
@Bruuuuce: Fortunately I don’t live in Brooklyn.
Adam L Silverman
@MattF: She’s lucky they don’t call the food police on her!
Gin & Tonic
Wilmer will never be on the right side of the gun issue since he owes his very existence in national politics to Wayne Lapierre.
piratedan
he’s Miracle Max without the humor and the magic…..
Bruuuuce
@Adam L Silverman: Nor does Senator Trelaine, fortunately for him and his diluted ways. (Speaking as a mostly nonpracticing — religiously or culturally — Jew myself.)
Brachiator
@Bobby Thomson:
Sanders ain’t my guy, but he also ain’t no Trump.
If I were his political strategist, I would tell him to get those tax returns out as quickly as possible. He keeps this shit alive.
I would also tell him that he needs to cut out all the crap that is insulting to women.
If he can’t adjust, he deserves to be roasted.
Gin & Tonic
@Bruuuuce: Pro-tip: half-sours are better, every single time. It’s no contest.
Redshift
@Dorothy A. Winsor: He certainly was smart and competent in pursuit of extremely evil ends. But yeah, missing that second part is a big blind spot.
germy
Jim, Foolish Literalist
I was gonna have a quinoa bowl for lunch, now I really want a good deli sandwich
and Wilmer can choke on his
Brachiator
@Betty Cracker:
This is very true.
Gin & Tonic
@germy: Like somebody said on Twitter, that’s suspending the troublemakers on the last day of school.
Bruuuuce
@Gin & Tonic: I disagree. There are good and bad of both full- and half-sours (generally the bad ones tend to be TOO sour for full, and insufficiently flavored for half). I grew up on the half-sours, and developed a taste for the full sours later in life (after age 30).
Plato
The puppet needs his master to act.
Amir Khalid
I read both Wilme’s NYDN interview and Hillary’s. I remember how vague his answers were, and how detailed hers were. And, of course, I remember The Young Turds complaining afterwards that the New York Daily News had done a hatchet job on Saint Wilmer.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
He speaks in complete sentences in a deep voice and wears suits well. Hard to overstate the effect of affect in American politics. Also cromulent to discussions of Wilmer, and Biden, who I gather is hiring people in New Hampshire.
Adam L Silverman
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Sorry…
sdhays
Bernie was a thing in 2016 because no one really challenged Clinton and he initially ran as an issue candidate – not actually interested in being President but using the campaign platform to push ideas that the mainstream ignored. He lost his way after someone convinced him he could actually be President, and now he’s just further embarrassing himself.
Adam L Silverman
@Bruuuuce: I like both, depending on what I’m having them with.
tobie
@Plato: Cheezus…the Russians are not even trying to hide that they’re the puppet masters. MSNBC will run with this story. Will others follow????
J R in WV
Anyone ever ask Sen Sanders about his connections to the NRA?
Has the Senator ever voted in favor of any strict background check requirements?
How much money has Sen Sanders received from the NRA and its life members? Tough question to answer, I guess… you would need to cross the NRA membership roll with Sanders contributors.
And where are those tax returns? Been 4 years since he started to get ready to prepare to almost release those puppies!! Not yet, then?
Finally, Brickeley Paiste, your pie expertise is sadly lacking in real expertise!! Fuck you so much for supporting everything that might not help a real Democratic candidate!!
Archon
@Brachiator:
There is obviously something in those tax returns that Sanders believe will seriously tarnish his brand or he would have released them already. My guess is his wife probably maximized their write offs (fairly or unfairly) so that they are paying an very low effective tax rate.
My guess is Bernie releases his taxes from the past 3 to 4 years and comes up with some weak excuse on why he can’t release the entire 10 years.
Brachiator
@Amir Khalid:
Yep. This was exactly when Sanders lost me.
Also I lost all respect for Sanders supporters. It was no hatchet job when you could read the transcript of Sanders’ own words.
Sab
@Dorothy A. Winsor: Lucky for her she didn’t still have her hand in your mouth near your teeth.
Kay
I can’t believe they all got sucked into the reparations question. Of course political media love that question. They hate health care and taxes- too boring. Thank God for Harris, who came up with an answer.
She really seems to be the best politician in the bunch, which would be important, in a campaign and all.
cmorenc
@Adam L Silverman:
My theory is that Annie Laurie is actually a brilliantly executed progressive bot designed to be constructive to the cause – so brilliantly executed we can’t tell she’s a bot. :=) Her intermittent posting of pictures of her alleged flower/veggie garden is a nice touch to make “her” all the more convincing to us that she’s a real person. Absolutely brilliant!
That’s my theory and I’m sticking to it. She might post in awhile to reassure us that she is, in fact real – but isn’t that exactly what a cleverly programmed bot would do? :=)
Adam L Silverman
@Plato: It may just be old style disinformation and provocation for normalization. As in the Russians haven’t provided advice, the President didn’t ask for it, but Lavrov, on behalf of Putin, wants that message out there. And he knows if he gets it out there and just goes to Hanoi this week even if all he’s going to do is much of nothing, is provocation – it’ll further enflame the cleavages in the US over the President. And since the President won’t say anything about it, nor will his team, then it has the added benefit of normalization – making all of this seem routine and just how the US does business under the current president.
Gin & Tonic
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Sure.
chopper
if the tax returns are so fucking boring, why have you been deliberately hiding them from the voting public?
eclare
@Dorothy A. Winsor: Wow, I bet that was not the response you were expecting! Was the movie nice to him?
MJS
@Brachiator: There is a reason those tax returns haven’t been release yet, and it’s not because Wilmer is politically tone-deaf or too busy.
Adam L Silverman
@tobie: Maddow spent about 30 minutes on it last night, which is what Putin wanted to happen.
Lapassionara
@Dorothy A. Winsor: She has an advantage in any conversation with you, since your mouth has to stay open and she is working on your teeth.
If it were a different situation, I might consider asking “do you still think we should have invaded Iraq?” If she says yes, no further point in talking.
Kay
@Archon:
It could be worse if they do them themselves, though. Two words: Timothy Geithner. He had a conflict. The conflict was he was doing his own taxes and he didn’t want to pay any.
I don’t understand the extreme cheapness, myself. My God, you tightwads, just pay someone. It’s both easier and better for a political person.
schrodingers_cat
You can crash at my place if you want to campaign against BS in NH.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@eclare: LOL. No. He starts bad and degenerates throughout the film, so in the end, he betrays his gay daughter, which he refuses to do earlier.
Brachiator
@Archon:
Who knows. I don’t need to guess or speculate.
If he doesn’t release them, it should become a bigger issue than Clinton’s emails.
Also, I don’t care if he is legitimately paying a lower tax rate. I think that some dopes complained that Gore wasn’t giving enough to charity, based on his returns. I just care about transparency and a degree of honesty.
Adam L Silverman
@Archon: It is that the Sanders are far wealthier than they want anyone to know, which, to be honest, is not surprising among prominent men who espouse his political and economic beliefs. The preeminent political scientist arguing for something between solid socialized democracy to soft Marxism, was a full tenured professor with a second paid position as a senior fellow and a third paid position as a professional consultant who had two houses. The primary was the equivalent of a mansion for the college town where he taught and the second was a beach home for winter and summer breaks. It is far easier to lead the vanguard of the proletariat if one has a comfy lifestyle.
Adam L Silverman
@Gin & Tonic: He was on his way back from a Packers’ game.
chopper
@Mike in NC:
he seemed calmer and nicer on the trail in ’16, but that’s because he wasn’t being pressed much. things are different now. he’s going to be getting difficult questions for the duration, and he’s not showing much of an ability to handle them.
good side is, he’s more likely to flame out by super tuesday at this rate.
trollhattan
@Amir Khalid:
Hillary was that annoying kid who always did her homework and then the extra credit problems and then would sit an explain them to you if only you asked.
We evidently did not want* that. I have to restrain myself each time I’m schooled that Wilmer would have won easily. As if.
*Except, by popular vote we wanted that by quite a large margin.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@Brachiator: #buthistaxreturns!
tobie
@Adam L Silverman: I’m late to the party, then. The past few days have been hellish work-wise so I’m behind on the news. I did catch your post on escalating tensions between India and Pakistan yesterday, for which I was grateful, and saw in Ha’aretz that the Israeli right is in a tizzy now that Israel’s settlement policy is a theme in the US Presidential campaign. And then of course there’s no deal on Brexit. And Trump in Hanoi. Any other foreign policy stories I missed?
Brachiator
@Adam L Silverman:
Ha! Very true.
Friedrich Engels’ father was a wealthy factory owner.
gwangung
@Brachiator:
This.
It’s just basic politics, and the least we can expect from a competent candidate.
I said Sanders could have gotten in front of the harassment thing and established himself a leader. It just looks like he doesn’t care about things like that.
Kent
@Archon:
My guess is that they show him as part of the 1%. He probably has a bunch of dividend income or some such from which it is possible to extrapolate wealth. Say, for example, his returns show $100,000 of dividend income from muni bonds that yield 3%. Simple math $100,000 / 0.03 tells us that he would have to hold $3.3 million in bonds to generate that sort of annual dividend. That’s just a hypothetical example. But if he has any kind of dividend income on his returns one can easily make an educated guess as to his actual wealth.
He probably also has some “aggressive” deductions out there which is tax lingo for “shady”
katdip
@Betty Cracker: “If the Democratic nominee advocates reparations, Trump would win re-election in a fucking landslide….” I agree,while this is an important issue to (some) African American voters, it’s a head-scratcher / turn off for the suburban middle class voters we need to win in 2020. Yes, they are buried in their own privilege and don’t understand the deep history and enduring needs of the AA communities. But the last thing those communities need is another 4 years of racist 0.1% ers further stacking the economic, legal, and policy deck against them and the rest of us. I think Harris and the other candidates need to have a good answer to the question, focusing on policies that address income inequality and systemic racism without specifically going toward reparations.
Matt McIrvin
@sdhays: About 12% of his primary voters voted for Trump, and another 3 or 4% for Gary Johnson, so he definitely benefited from anti-Hillary crossover voters on the right.
chopper
@Major Major Major Major:
i’m still pissed at wilmer over his tax dodge in 2016. he said he’d release them once he won the primary. as if voters don’t give a shit about a candidate’s finances during the primary, only the general.
TaMara (HFG)
This pretty much sums up my feelings.
Brachiator
@tobie:
You scared me for a minute. I’m reading that some MPs are trying to get a delay. A “no deal” BREXIT is something else, and something to be avoided.
Adam L Silverman
@tobie: Bibi brought the Kahanists into his coalition in exchange for the housing and education ministries. This led a lot of non-Likud focused Jewish American groups to let him have it. Then both the American Jewish Congress and AIPAC made tepid responses that pushed back on the Kahanists, not on Bibi or Likud, and Likud’s spokeswoman went ballistic on them.
The President physically mocked Xi’s staff.
I’m sure there’s something else going on.
trollhattan
@chopper:
How is that any different from Trump pre-declaring “the election is rigged; unless I win of course.” Wilmer and all that superdelegate shit. Admit I simply loathe him.
trollhattan
@Adam L Silverman:
I first read “Kahanists” as Kardashians and was greatly amused.
No One of Consequence
@cmorenc: I’ll take Turing Tests for $300, Alex.
Peace,
– NOoC
lofgren
“Trump voters are unfairly maligned as sexists and racists, but among the Democratic field I am uniquely qualified to reach out to them FOR SOME REASON.”
gwangung
Frankly, I would think less of him if he WASN’T that affluent. With his and his wife’s job, you need to be a prudent person to become part of the 1%.
chopper
@Gin & Tonic:
uh, no. also, most marbled rye is a joke.
Adam L Silverman
@Brachiator: May has promised, as PM, that if Parliament votes down her plan and then votes down a no deal Brexit, then she’ll immediately bring a resolution to the floor and let Parliament vote for a delay. And Labour has come out and said it is now backing a second referendum.
tobie
@Brachiator: You’re right. Words really matter here. Delaying Brexit is the right phrase. Will the EU accept this?
@Adam L Silverman: Thanks for the context. If even AIPAC is resisting this move–however cautiously–it is truly toxic.
Adam L Silverman
@trollhattan: I’m honestly not sure which would be worse.
Rusty
@MattF: Through sad part is he has almost no understanding of policy other than slogans. Go back to his interview in banking right before the NY primary. His big issue and he was clueless. You can look up his legislation on big banks on his own Senate site. The meat of it is 4 poorly thought out sentences. He his no better on healthcare or anything else.
Bruuuuce
@trollhattan:
Yep. I have not yet been provoked sufficiently to post Trelaine (from Star Trek, whining “I woulda won! I woulda!”) to the Wilmerites who have been doing their rehashes of 2016 over at Facebook. But soon…
chopper
@trollhattan:
oh yeah, that too. railing against the superdelegates, calling it all rigged, while also trying desperately to wheel and deal them into swinging your way. what a schmuck.
bemused
@Dorothy A. Winsor:
Oddly, today Bruce Bartlett tweeted about his dental hygienist. She was very worried about AOC abolishing airplanes. Bartlett said a freshman congress woman has no more power than a dental hygienist but she is still worried. And she doesn’t watch Fox.
I hope this isn’t a common trait among dental hygienists.
dmsilev
Huh. Bernie Sanders’ Top Campaign Strategists Quit:
not-Dem in disarray!
chopper
@bemused:
orly?
Ohio Mom
The last few days, I’ve been surfing around the twitters of lefty (well there are no righties) disability activists — you know how that goes, you click on one name, read some their twitter feed, then click on another name, and on and on until you have no idea where you are.
My god, we Ballooner Juicers are hard core Bernie fans compared to disability activists.
Yesterday I was reading tweets by a disability attorney who has rather complex medical needs and he was tearing Bernie’s approach to Medicare for All to shreds. In detail that perhaps only David Anderson could fully appreciate.
Disability activists know they do not register at all in Bernie’s world view (when he insists it’s economics not racism, at least he is recognizing that racism exists even as he is discounting it, while he never brings up disability issues). They want no part of him. It’s another reason I admire them so.
Adam L Silverman
@tobie:
Slight clarification:
satby
@dmsilev: they probably told him release the damn tax returns.
tobie
@dmsilev: I feel guilty about the waves of Schadenfreude that washed over me when I read that post.
schrodingers_cat
@Ohio Mom: There is no minority group he won’t shit on. Women, immigrants, black people and according to what you say disability activists, we are all fair game to his (Ass)Holiness
Brachiator
@tobie:
Don’t know. UK reporters, including those on the EU beat, are scrambling to try to read the signs.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@bemused: That is odd. It’s like the people who think because Booker is vegan, they’d all be forced to become vegan too if he won. It’s like they walk through the world without ever noticing anything.
Brickley Paiste
@Adam L Silverman:
But that’s not the question. I asked how this post attacking Sanders is different to one by a bot designed to attack liberals and progressives seeking to sow discord
Adam L Silverman
@dmsilev:
Translation: We’re not getting paid what we want to be paid, so we’re out of here!
Roger Moore
@Brachiator:
As far as the tax returns I can see three possibilities, all bad:
1) He simply doesn’t understand why anyone thinks it’s an issue, thinks it’s a distraction, and refuses to release them because he’s stubborn.
2) There’s nothing anyone else would think is disqualifying, but that Bernie is unwilling to reveal because it hurts his self-image.
3) There’s something in his taxes he can’t reveal because it would blow up his candidacy.
Any of these is bad, and I don’t want the kind of candidate who would be willing to let people believe 3 because of 1 or 2.
Chyron HR
@schrodingers_cat:
Hey, he sneers in contempt at the LGBT community, too.
Adam L Silverman
@Brickley Paiste: Because it wasn’t designed by a bot or a troll. And it isn’t citing or referencing a bunch of bots and/or trolls. Democrats are who are going to be attacked by bots and trolls. And they’ll do so to build Sanders up as they did in 2016. And Sanders is not a Democrat.
bemused
@chopper:
I’ll be seeing my dental hygienist this week. She’s pleasant but talks too much and stops working on my teeth to talk when I’d just like to get out of there and do my errands. It’s annoying. If she said something politically dopey as well, I’d be more than annoyed.
Sloane Ranger
Open Thread so I’m going a little off piste. I’m taking a Futurelearn course on the History of the US and the online tutor has directed us to a website about the US Constitution. I noticed that the site was supported by the American Constitution Society and the Federalist Society and was financed by the John Templeman Foundation.
I know all about the Federalist Society but nothing about the other 2. Their websites are full of the usual bromides about impartiality and research but I notice the John Templeman Foundation makes a big thing about the importance of having a spiritual input into decisions and actions.
So question for any jackals who might know, are these groups RWNJ’s like the Federalists or not?
Thanks for any responses received.
schrodingers_cat
@Chyron HR: I didn’t know that, but it doesn’t surprise me. Crazy Hair is the Leftie mirror image of Barbie Doll Hair in the WH.
tobie
@Adam L Silverman: Thanks! Rabbi Benny Lau seems like a figure to watch.
dmsilev
@Adam L Silverman: Possibly the case, though I seem to remember that Sanders’ media consultants got a larger-than-normal percentage of the gross in 2016, so you’d think they’d be lining up at the trough for a second go-round.
Joe Falco
@Plato:
Good lord, any sane administration would have said hell no to that statement. It’s humiliating if true, but not only that, if I was China, I would be more than a little peeved that Trump would go to Russia first for advice and not the nation that practically keeps the Kim family’s personal kingdom afloat.
bemused
@Dorothy A. Winsor:
Ha, I think they actually do walk around without noticing a thing. How boring that has to be.
HinTN
@Adam L Silverman: Le mot juste
chopper
@bemused:
i was making an orly taitz joke actually. tho she was a full-on dentist, right? crazy as fuck tho.
Ohio Mom
@schrodingers_cat: Disability is yet another area in which Hillary shone — she made sure to include people with disabilities at the convention, and to include disability issues in her platform.
Sigh…
bemused
@chopper:
Oh, Orly Taitz! I had forgotten that lunatic who has seemed to drop out of sight long ago. If only the whole damn WH and GOP would do the same.
Kent
@Dorothy A. Winsor:
Neither Trump nor Bush 2 drank. Yet no one seemed to think that meant we were going to see Prohibition 2.0
Why does this stuff only reflect on the left and not the right?
West of the Rockies
I think St. Bernie will fade fast this time. The disheveled, avuncular outsider thing is just not as relevant now. More astute, energetic voices are speaking. B helped move the party in a good, new direction, a thing that should be recognized. But we need someone else to be the standard bearer. That’s just, like, my opinion.
Yarrow
@Adam L Silverman: Wait, Tad Devine was with his campaign again this time? Hmmm….
Gelfling 545
@Brachiator: Maybe why some of them quit.
“NBC News reported on Tuesday that Tad Devine, Mark Longabaugh, and Julian Mulvey left the campaign over “creative differences.”
Kent
@Roger Moore:
Tax returns (along with minimum poll numbers or fundraising or some such) should be the minimum required for participation in Dem Party sponsored debates.
I would also say Dem Party membership but I guess that ship has sailed. And in the grand scheme of things, better to have Wilmer inside than pulling a Nader and running from the outside.
schrodingers_cat
@West of the Rockies:
I disagree with this. The party was already moving there. We didn’t need his finger wagging (Ass)Holiness to lead us to the leftist nirvana. All he had even in 2016 was slogans.
Redshift
@Sloane Ranger: The “About Us” page for the American Constitution Society says:
and that it was formed after Bush v. Gore, so it looks like they’re not all RWNJ sources.
schrodingers_cat
@Dorothy A. Winsor: Was she pulling your leg?
bemused
@West of the Rockies:
I hope so. I agree with who posted that last round, Get Off My Lawn Bernie didn’t get challenged as much as he should have with questions he’d rather not answer. He sure seems a lot more crabby.
immanentize
Look, people should do whatever they want with their bodies. As Robin Hitchcock sings — “I believe in surgery, that’s a fact, I believe in making it easy.”
This morning, after watching some clips, I thought he looked so much older than he did in 2016. It might be the work he has had, but it sadly reminded me of the gaunt pulling back of skin associated with cancer. It freaked me out a bit.
But if it is just some plastic surgery, well, I think he shoulda given it the pass
trollhattan
Not a dime’s worth of difference, Tories and Republicans edition:
Do go on….
A Ghost To Most
@Gelfling 545:
Tad quit to spend more time with his rubles.
StringOnAStick
@Dorothy A. Winsor: I responded to your comment in the last thread, but as a dental hygienist all I can say is going that political with a patient who hasn’t signaled they want to talk about politics is a big no no; maybe the boss is a winger too. Most offices have a website where you can leave comments, often anonymously.
gene108
Big improvement for Sanders over 2016, he got a hair cut, and doesn’t look as rumpled.
Sab
@Kay: Geitner had paid a friend do do them who was apparently way over his head.
I did a similar tax return and I really had to jump through hoops to get the software to do it correctly. Correctly being that if you have earned income and they don’t withhold self-employment taxes, you better have a strong statutory justification for not paying them yourself.
Unfortunately, a lot of the software thinks if it comes through on a W-2 then you aren’t self-employed so no SE taxes. It doesn’t know you work for an international agency not subject to normal rules.
kindness
Bernie has a problem. Unless Bernie releases 10 years of tax returns, he can’t appear on California’s Super Tuesday Primary ballot. Unlike last year, he gets no pass this year.
Somehow I’m thinking he thinks he will get that pass. Nope. Fool me once……
bemused
@Dorothy A. Winsor:
Maybe it will become a thing, you wouldn’t believe what my dental hygienist said while she was flossing my teeth.
MattF
@Sloane Ranger: And the Templeman Foundation has provided support for advocates of Intelligent Design, which is not a good sign. From what I can see from a cursory look around, the Foundation is known to be ‘idiosyncratic’ so support from them isn’t obviously good or bad.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@schrodingers_cat: Not a chance. She’s deeply earnest.
I just so hard to take in. I love Dick Cheney? I’m a huge fan?
immanentize
@kindness: He will likely sue because California may not be able to add that as a ballot requirement under the constitution. It would look really bad if he was the one to sue, though.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@StringOnAStick: It was Oscars talk. Until it wasn’t.
ETA: Thanks for answer last thread too. That was interesting.
bemused
@Dorothy A. Winsor:
I can’t even imagine how surreal that must have been. Are you good at showing a poker face?
gene108
@Sloane Ranger:
If the website is talking about the spiritual basis for why the Constitution is the way it is the other groups must be conservative as well.
Wikipedia would probably give you a better rundown of what went on in Philadelphia during the Constitutional Convention. Link is below.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constitutional_Convention_(United_States)
Sab
@Dorothy A. Winsor: Does your dentist shoot elderly lions on his vacations?
trollhattan
@immanentize:
“I am filing this suit in protest of the rigged system trying to force me to release documents that are personal, mine alone and nobody’s damn business! I may have promised to release them but believe this issue is more important, not just for myself but for future candidates who will be treated this unfairly.”
Or something like that. Optics, how do they work?
VeniceRiley
1) I can speculate that the litigious Senator from Vermont is weighing whether to challenge the new tax return transparency laws in several states in order to appear on the ballot.
2) if he decides not to go that road, I would bet cash money they’re going through their options on filing amended returns before putting them out.
3) They will release them at the last possible second in order to appear on the ballot. When is that? Does California’s new rule mean for the primary, or just the general? If primary, that means well before Iowa Caucus, because that’s when our early voting starts.
4) No matter how far behind he is in delegates, he is going to the convention without conceding: He’s got too much monthly donation cash to rake in, and an ego that prevents as well.
StringOnAStick
@Dorothy A. Winsor: I responded to your comment in the last thread, but as a dental hygienist all I can say is going that political with a patient who hasn’t signaled they want to talk about politics is a big no no; maybe the boss is a winger too. Most offices have a website where you can leave comments, often anonymously. @bemused:
Dorothy A. Winsor
@bemused: My face was half frozen at the time so it was probably less expressive than usual. Thank goodness, because I have no poker face.
@Sab: LOL. Not that I know of.
bemused
@StringOnAStick:
I will if it the talking gets to be a bigger issue.
geg6
@Dorothy A. Winsor:
I know what I’d be saying. It would be “Can you refer me to a dental hygienist who isn’t completely immoral and insane?” Of course, I don’t much give a damn who I piss off these days. YMMV.
Adam L Silverman
@Sloane Ranger: The Templeman Foundation is one of the standard right wing/conservative funding sources. Similar to the David Koch Foundation or the Olin Foundation.
trollhattan
@Dorothy A. Winsor:
Struggling to imagine America’s Top Cheney Fan having her hands in my mouth. “Keep that scraper away from the gum lin…AAAAAGH!”
bemused
@Dorothy A. Winsor:
Ah, Novocaine to the rescue!
geg6
@Brachiator:
He’s had three years to adjust. He has chosen not to. Roast the motherfucker.
bemused
@trollhattan:
At least she aimed correctly and didn’t shoot the novocaine in Dorothy’s face.
Mart
@West of the Rockies: I voted for Bernie in Missouri knowing Hillary would crush him. Thought being move the centrist left, where the people are – on wealthy folks taxes, SS, healthcare expansion, etc. I think he has done some good there. Now he needs to go away.
StringOnAStick
@bemused:
Um, I’m a dental hygienist and super liberal with a liberal boss and liberal co-workers, but that is also super rare. Dentistry in general is conservative, and hygienists can often be very conservative. Remember the right wing nut Jan Brewer of AZ? Dental hygienist. If I didn’t work for the guy that I work for now, I’d probably change professions. I had a tea party nut try to hire me when I was working as a temp. He told me how he was going to evade paying the temp service their finders fee, or course before he even asked me if I wanted the job, which I certainly did not based on how dysfunctional the entire office was and the fact that I wasn’t sure they were actually sterilizing the instruments. As usual, no understanding of consent.
burnspbesq
@Brickley Paiste
Because Bernie is the intended beneficiary of the ratfucking, not an intended victim.
catclub
@Archon:
and why not. Trump released zero, Romney released about 1 year’s worth. The press might be interested but it shows no sign of being
a problem with too many voters.
bemused
@StringOnAStick:
Interesting. I wonder why dentistry in general is conservative. A good friend is a dentist and pretty liberal especially in the last few years! I have no idea about my own dentist and probably best I don’t know how conservative he is.
Sloane Ranger
@Redshift: @MattF: @gene108:
Thanks all. I will probably have a root around the website and read the Wikipedia article as well.
Adam L Silverman
@Sloane Ranger: @Redshift: The American Constitution Society was created to be the liberal equivalent of The Federalist Society. They mean well, but they’ve neither got the equivalent of Leonard Leo’s dark money network backing them, nor a liberal equivalent to Leonard Leo running things.
catclub
@VeniceRiley:
I don’t see what the problem is for someone who has no intention of disclosing their real returns, just fake up something and release that.
Since the IRS is not going to call your bluff, why worry? The amended return route is another way to go for this years taxes. Submit a nice form now, then amend later.
catclub
@trollhattan:
Is it safe?
The Moar You Know
@StringOnAStick: This is straight-up why I fired my last dentist. And I told him straight out that I did not expect him to fire his hygienist, as she was REALLY good at what she did, but I wasn’t going to sit around and listen to her bullshit either. I don’t know if he was a winger or not; I do know he was not at all happy about losing a patient.
She thought because I was a military contractor I was on the Fox train. She was very wrong, but it’s hard to argue with a person when they’ve got a drill in your damn mouth.
StringOnAStick
@bemused:
Wow, that really saddens me. Then again, I’m a real outlier for this field (I have an MS in hydrogeology from way back, and got tired of the up and down nature of the field). I make it a point to read my patients and I can tell who doesn’t want a lot of talk, who needs calming, who needs to vent, etc. I also, never, ever stop what I am doing in order to talk; if you are doing a complete job then there simply isn’t time for such crap. I also can’t handle doing this job more than 2 days a week because it is physically and definitely emotionally draining. I will admit though that about half the young ladies I went to school with (as the oldest person in our class) were button-nosed perfect little WASPs with little experience of the outside world. The competing school’s graduating class that year looked like 23 blonde clones, with one POC who I’m sure was very aware of the “class diversity”. I temped for 6 years and so many offices hire based on looks and youth.
Brachiator
Eight or more military copters flying overhead in Los Angeles.
What is up?
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@Brickley Paiste: Upset the front pagers are stepping in your own trolling turf?
Enhanced Voting Techniques
So with the Burnsters “Independent is just a Republican whose to embarrassed to admit it” strikes again I see.
Gin & Tonic
@catclub: Took long enough for somebody to make that reference.
Gin & Tonic
@Adam L Silverman: Don’t know about the other two, but Tad Devine has expensive tastes.
StringOnAStick
@bemused: You know, I don’t really know why dentistry tends to be conservative but it’s probably a combination of things like small businessman, tax stuff. I temped for 6 years so I worked at a lot of offices in the Denver area and I found it was more often right leaning in general. One office even played FOX news in the waiting area. Dentists who want to stay in business usually try to keep the overt politics out of it and that is sure what the industry magazines that push profit improvement always say.
I wonder if it is changing though because the average dentist getting out of dental school owes about $500,000 in loans, and often can’t buy into an existing practice so they end up working in the corporate part of the field. Newly minted MD’s are trending the same way politically. New dentists now tend to end up as employees of a chain (with big profit incentives for higher production); that trend has its upsides and downsides, but in general I find it to be a bad development and have seen some aggressive over treatment because some guy needed to make his monthly quota on root canals in order to make the bonus level. It’s making ethics too flexible for some. It’s just one more place in our society where the mom and pop shop is getting run out of business by the big corporate money.
West of the Rockies
@catclub:
Classic scene!
The Moar You Know
@kindness: Not true. Brown vetoed it. I was stunned, myself.
Another version of the same bill is slowly making its way through the state Senate, but won’t be signed in time for the 2020 election.
StringOnAStick
@The Moar You Know: I’m glad you fired your last dentist,because I can guarantee you that if the RDH was talking FOX crap, he’s a believer as well. My boss is Mr. Mellow and hates confrontation but that shit would NOT fly with him. I’ve noticed with wingers though that they just assume everyone agrees with them and spout off, because that’s what all the talking heads on FOX do so they are just mirroring their social group!
VeniceRiley
@StringOnAStick: Felling great that I work for an FQHC that has several dental offices. I use them as my dentists and the difference is night and day with the for profit offices I used to use. Oh, and all of the dentists and hygenists and fo staff I’ve had here are Hispanic and bilingual. Of course, I am semi-legendary in the dental division for having, unasked, purchased under counter am/fm/cd for one of our offices after having seen them take a clock radio from one exam room to another. I did this because they gave me the white fillings upgrade in my whole mouth and didn’t charge me extra. I also recc’d a dentist of ours to the CEO and he promoted her to the DBoss.
bemused
@StringOnAStick:
I’m just in a snarky mood. Insomnia kicked my butt last night so I get punchy and fall into dark humor.
Roger Moore
@Kent:
Because everyone knows that the left are a bunch of angry scolds interested in pushing their lifestyle on everyone, while the right wing believes in freedom to do as you choose.
Manxome Bromide
@dmsilev: I’m perfectly happy to have Tad Devine as far away as possible from every campaign in the Dem Primary.
I don’t know anything about the other two.
Bobby Thomson
@Brachiator: he won’t do it. He’s dirty. If the returns were innocuous they would have been disclosed in 2015.
Sloane Ranger
@Adam L Silverman: Thanks Adam, at least I know the tutor’s not pushing us into a right wing propaganda site. I’ll still read other articles just to get a few other perspectives.
Yarrow
@Manxome Bromide: Just because he’s leaving the BS campaign doesn’t mean he won’t end up on some other Dem candidate’s campaign. Ugh. It would be nice if Dems are skeptical of him because of his work in Ukraine and relationship with Manafort, but time will tell.
StringOnAStick
@VeniceRiley: You’re a good person, thank you for that. Yeah, I’ve got a really bad taste in my mouth for the new model of push profit over everything else. My boss is old fashioned in that he doesn’t push treatment hard and he’s conservative in his treatments too. The chains will fill the slightest thing that really could be handled with some extra fluoride, self care skills improvements, etc; those guys just see dollar signs. We had a patient return after having grown up in our practice and her new job’s insurance only covered one of the local big chains. They told her she needed a root canal and crown, that the tooth was severely decayed. She came back to us for a second opinion and the decay was only halfway through the enamel and needed just a small filling. Obviously some chain dentist needed to make his root canal and crown quota. This isn’t the first time we’ve seen this either, it’s very common with the places that lure you in with the $29 free exam, X-rays, and cleaning for new patients promotion. It sucks and makes the whole profession look bad when it is a subset thereof, but unfortunately that kind of office is in a booming growth phase. The days of a 1 ,2 or 3 dentist office that isn’t part of a for-profit chain are becoming endangered. Dentistry should be part of health care, not a luxury service!
Jerzy Russian
@eclare:
I don’t think it was, but then again I am not in a Fox News bubble.
Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho
@Dorothy A. Winsor: To your dentist:
Is what I’d say
Adam L Silverman
@Brachiator: Probably just moving equipment around.
Adam L Silverman
@Gin & Tonic: I’m sure. The political consultant/campaign professional class all do.
Brachiator
@The Moar You Know:
Fortunately, never had a dental hygienist who talked politics. Had a couple of dentists with quirky political or social views, but they were funny and the remarks were off hand, not preachy.
Barbara
@StringOnAStick: My cousin is a dentist and his office manager wife is always complaining about having to meet environmental regulations for disposal of biohazards. I remember him once turning to her and telling her that we (cousins visiting for the holiday) were the wrong target audience for her kvetching. I don’t know his political leanings.
Kathleen
@Yarrow: Not manager. Some kind of adviser
Adam L Silverman
@Sloane Ranger: While it’s been a while, I’ve taught American Federal politics when I was a professor at civilian universities, as well as lesson blocks/modules on American government and on the Constitution as part of the core National Security Strategy and Policy course at USAWC. This requires a lot of US history. So if you’ve got concerns about something on the syllabus, feel free to shoot me an email.
Archon
@catclub:
The idea Bernie could win a Democratic primary without releasing tax returns is wishful thinking. He might release his newest ones and try to message the issue as “he’s released enough” but he absolutely has to release something.
rikyrah
Ian Sams (@IanSams) Tweeted:
NEW via exclusive interview with @TheRoot >>
@Russian_Starr: Is President Trump a racist?
@KamalaHarris: I don’t think you can reach any other conclusion.
Starr: So you definitely agree that he’s a racist?
Kamala: I do, yes. Yes.
https://t.co/JZAo8C3uhk https://twitter.com/IanSams/status/1100428222666338304?s=17
SFBayAreaGal
I want to see the B-man go down, down, down…
Bobby Thomson
@dmsilev: the irony is that Devine was a moderating influence. This will end badly.
bemused
@StringOnAStick:
The dentist I had for years retired and a young guy bought his practice. Then there was development (probably with some finance grants or help) of several businesses with new buildings near two small lakes in the small town and new dentist now has a partner or two in a lovely building, fireplace but thankfully no fox news. Dentist has a large family, at least 4 kids, but must be doing fine as I noticed the office is closed on Fridays.
There is also another dentist practice in the same area plus an eye clinic in one building (also with a fireplace) and an out patient office next to it where I had cataract surgery.
We use a family owned pharmacy in a tiny town which is a lot more pleasant than the chains. We know everyone who works there. The pharmacist retired and two of his children became pharmacists and took over. Love it.
Health care is a booming business and a plus to the communities. Yonkers left the Miller Hill Mall in Duluth, MN and Essentia Health is moving into the space with a health and fitness center. Essentia Health is also planning a big expansion and reno in their downtown Duluth location.
Captain C
@Archon: That, plus a combination of higher income than he’d like to admit to his followers and low to non-existent charitable donations would be my guess. Of course, if he or Jane has some dodgy income, that might be a reason, too.
Captain C
@Brachiator: Yeah, I’m not sure how DN: “How will you enact your signature issue, legally?” Wilmer: “Um…I don’t know. Mebbe we’ll ask the banks to break themselves up…” is a gotcha question or unfair.
Brachiator
@rikyrah:
I appreciate the honesty, but it’s not going to help her win the election, and makes it a little easier to attack her.
Bobby Thomson
@Captain C: or he’s invested in stocks that make his 2016 sloganeering and negative attacks . . . problematic.
Bobby Thomson
@Brachiator: I disagree. That kind of clear speech against Trump is exactly what I want in a candidate. As long as she doesn’t step on any deplorable rakes and confines it to Dipshit Donnie she’ll be fine.
The Midnight Lurker
Trump never released his tax returns and Putin wanted him to run.
Sanders never released his tax returns and Putin wants him to run.
Hmmmm.
StringOnAStick
@Barbara: No offense, but everyone I know in this field has horror stories of working for husband and wife teams; I know I do. I once temped at a husband and wife dental office (both were DDS’s) and they brought their pit bull to the office and let it wander around in the waiting area! It was a nice dog but I have friends who would flee in panic at any dog, much less a PB. They were also super aggressive in making us push as many extra expense treatments as possible, something I HATE doing; I think it is unethical. Other H&W teams I’ve worked for have been the same, the office and $ are the center of their professional and social life, and the employees are just the cogs used ( and used up) to support their lifestyle. I’m not saying your cousin is a bad guy, just that if you are hearing that from his wife you can be reasonably sure he agrees with her. Running a dental office is expensive, and a dentist can accept that this is just part of the deal of running a practice or they can whine and moan about the thumb of The Man interfering with their Galtian imperatives (Ayn Rand is popular with dentists, as is the Bible, sometimes on display in the waiting room).
One thing I love about my boss is he never ever complains about things like the costs of biohazards disposal because to him that is just the cost of doing business and proper disposal of biohazards is the right thing to do. He doesn’t penny pinch on proper practice like biohazard disposal, sterilization costs (a big part of the overhead), bimonthly testing of the autoclave and waterlines, shredding personal information documents, stupid crap like making employees count how many pairs of gloves they use each day, limits on how many squares of gauze to use with each patient, etc. All of these are things I saw in offices I either worked at or temped at. My boss makes a nice living without skimping on the things necessary to be an ethic practice, which is why I drive so damned far in order to work for him and it’s why all his employees are so loyal to him. He’s a good guy and a pleasure to work for; he treats us like fellow professionals, not like his “hen collection”.
Doug R
@Brickley Paiste:
Using a candidate’s own words against him: UNFAIR!
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@Brachiator: Yes, if she waffles about it like that she is flinching. The correct answer is “What are you dense, of course Trump is racists as you can get. Every program from his administration as been nothing less deliberate attacks on some minority group or another. The only reason we don’t have outright death camps in this country right now is his admin is way to lazy for that.”
VeniceRiley
@StringOnAStick: Yikes. That’s bad. My brother dated a retired white button nosed dentist. She voted for Trump. Rich AF now and her go-to line was “I’m from Whittier!” like she grew up in the damn ghetto or something. Probably seems like it when you live in a McMansion in Newport beach LOL.
Doug R
@dmsilev: Tad’s staying one step ahead of Mueller indictments.
Barbara
@StringOnAStick: Oh no, I agree, spouses probably should not manage each other’s medical or dental practices. Too much can go wrong.
StringOnAStick
@bemused: I’m glad to hear of a case of the used-to-be-typical situation where the old DDS took on an associate, who eventually took over the practice. We’re headed in that direction as well, plus having to move our office to a new location since our entire block is slated to be demolished and more downtown high rises built. We’re doubling the number of chairs but the guy next door will be renting those from us for a few years until he retires (soon) and then my boss will start interviewing associate candidates. Selling your practice is how dentists traditionally fund their retirement.
It’s typical for a single dentist office to only see patients 4 days a week, and 4 days is considered full time for dentists and RDH’s because of the physical toll the work takes on our bodies (necks, hands, backs). The dentist needs the 5th day to do the business management stuff, see after hours emergencies, etc. I don’t see my boss having much spare time and he works hard; it can be overwhelming. A well managed office makes for a good living for the dentist and good wages for his employees; the opposite of course is, well, the opposite!
Wapiti
@katdip:
I’m a fan of much higher marginal rates on the ultra rich, and more tax brackets to separate out the rich, really rich, and ultra rich from the mere 1%. I’m also a big fan of a wealth tax. (If you have more than $10 million in net worth, assume an 8% rate of return on your net worth. Pay your income tax based on that rate of return rather than actual income.)
I think addressing income and wealth inequality might have close to the same impact as reparations, given the differences in household wealth between white and black Americans. Symbolically, something is lost, but it’s a way to get closer to a more equal union.
tam1MI
@kindness: Do you have a cite for the California rule you can provide? I am constantly getting demands for that from WilmerBros on other boards.
Robert A Hamilton
https://getyarn.io/yarn-clip/4b9b9e00-fc2e-444b-b222-c2c1d0be41c1
LOL the 2-minute version of this 5-second clip is actually sponsored by Bernie for Prez :)
Adam L Silverman
@rikyrah: And her office didn’t wait for The Root to publish that, they put the video out themselves.
sdhays
@Brachiator: The first dentist I went to after moving back to the US was a total right-wing loon. He did everything himself, no dental hygienist for him, and he was very proud of how perfect he was as a dentist. He wouldn’t shut up. I seem to recall him muttering about how proud he was about never being sued and complaining about patients being able to sue.
I was shocked by the rank unprofessionalism he displayed. I hadn’t been to a dentist in a few years, and the dentists I’d gone to before back home never mentioned anything remotely political. I only went there once, but I don’t really understand how someone like that stays in business. Maybe he was a skilled dentist, but I sure didn’t want him anywhere near my mouth again.
Betty Cracker
@Brachiator: It’s not going to hurt her either, probably. Folks who’d be so offended by her stating the obvious about Trump that they wouldn’t vote for Harris because of it weren’t going to vote for her anyway.
Brachiator
@StringOnAStick:
This reminds me of how many barbers operate.
trollhattan
@StringOnAStick:
Except for the commute sounds like an ideal job situation.
I’m super-lucky, got my dentist on referral after moving here and have been with him decades now. He’s a Valley Italian who went to USC from the oil patch town of Taft, CA and landed in our metroplex to set up his practice. He’s engaging and importantly, laughs at my jokes while jousting about Trojans v. Huskies. His staff, especially the hygienists, have always been top-notch and I still fondly remember Joy, who was amazing while masquerading as Liv Ullmann’s better-looking sister. I paid out of pocket for about fifteen years and doc would waive his exam fee, only billing for the cleaning. He made up for it when I had a root canal and crown.
His son joined the practice a few years ago and is every bit as qualified and engaging as dad, so I figure I’m good to go until my teeth fall out. Dad’s cutting back his hours to spend more time at their Tahoe place. Can’t say I blame him.
He’s had more than a few well-known patients. I got to share the waiting room with Willie Brown, who kept coming back even after he became SF mayor.
tobie
@Wapiti: I’m amazed that with the news that Google, Netflix, and Amazon paid no federal tax in 2018 the Presidential candidates are not talking day and night about the need to revise the corporate tax code.
Raising marginal tax rates is fine with me but won’t generate significant revenue for the Treasury. CEOs and hedge fund managers have found ways to avoid reporting their compensation as income (carried interest, stock options, etc). As for the wealth tax, it does give me pause that in the past twenty years Germany, Luxembourg, Sweden, Finland, Iceland, and France all repealed their wealth taxes. Maybe there’s a lesson to be learned there? Some kind of VAT on luxury items like jets, yachts, precious gems and metals, might work better. I get the desire to eat the rich, but policy should be based on broader constitutional and fiscal concerns.
bemused
@StringOnAStick:
Yup, selling your business, whatever it may be, is how many get to finally retire. My dentist friend hasn’t completely retired yet as one of his kids went into dentistry and will be taking it over eventually.
Our rural, small town area was hurting for dentists as most were retiring or close to retirement. Happily, more young dentists are finally filling the void.
Otoh, we could use more decent assisted living places. A relative has been living in a certain corporate assisted living place that has changed a lot in the 5 years she’s lived there and not positively. She agreed with her daughter that it’s time to move to a better place nearer her family and clinics. As the corp builds more, the quality of care seems to be going down.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@bemused: One of the selling points for over-55 place where I live is that the owners live in the building. They’re retired and their son runs the place now, but they live here.
Brachiator
@Betty Cracker:
I don’t know. Trump is immune from a lot of the “he is a bad man stuff,” but you might be able to reach people by citing his crappy record and incompetence.
And yeah you can point out that his policies are racist, ineffectual and harmful and let people connect the dots about his character.
Also, I want Trump out, and don’t mind getting votes from some of his Deplorables. But I also know that some voters are in denial about racism, but still might vote for a Democrat.
kindness
@tam1MI: Sadly it was pointed out to me earlier in this thread that I was wrong. California’s Senate and Assembly passed a bill requiring any Presidential candidate to release 10 years of tax returns in order to appear on the Primary ballot. But Governor Brown vetoed the bill. I have no excuses about not knowing that last part. It’s a bill I would support.
germy
So Mark Harris will NOT be running in the North Carolina election
“Health reasons”
Just One More Canuck
@dmsilev: ‘meeting of the minds’ meaning that Wilmer wanted to reduce their share of the grift?
Brachiator
This is interesting
germy
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2020-election/bernie-sanders-staff-shakeup-top-strategists-leave-his-presidential-campaign-n976221
Nelle
@StringOnAStick: my husband is a hydrogeologist… very up and down life. 6 states, 2 countries. Maybe we’ll slow down on the moving upon his retirement (in one month).
Yarrow
@Kathleen: I didn’t say manager. But he was still with the campaign.
Don K
@Mart:
I voted for him in Michigan for the same reason. Now, I’d vote for Gabbard next year before I would vote for Bernie.
Brachiator
@StringOnAStick:
Great story. I think my dentist is pretty good. I recall once an assistant saying “We didn’t do that (or use that) where I used to work,” with some admiration. It made me more comfortable.
Kay
I’m hoping political media are on the reparations beat and voters will be like they were in 2018- on a completely different beat- “could we just get some damn healthcare, please?” :)
This is entirely possible! Even likely! What they ask is sometimes…not the question.
dogwood
In 2009 I had surgery, and as the anesthesiologist was tranquilzing me before, putting me unde, he started in on Barack Obama. Birtherism, sociopathy, Machurian candidate etc. it was the Full Monty. In the recovery room, I complained to a nurse and she asked if I would be willing to relate the incident to an administrator because nurses had complained but had no clout when it came to doctors. I gave the administrator and earful and she sent the dude in who go the same. I told both of them that being forced to listen to crap I found vile and disgusting knowing full-well there was a small chance they could be the last words I’d ever hear was beyond the pale for me. First and only time in my life that I refused to accept an apology.
Dan B
@bemused: I hope Green New Deal types shift their message to “leading or winning the future economy”. Banning airplanes fits with the meme of we are here to save you. Boeing and Airbus and Jet Blue are investing in electric and hybrid air transport. It’s the future. It’s quiet, fast, clean, and big time jobs.
People probably want a bright future more than they want to be saved by elites and experts. We need more focus group testing of global warming solutions. I’ve only got a hint but when dental hygienists are afraid that AOC will outlaw airplanes we need a better response.
Brachiator
Woman who has been given everything complains about politician who wants to give ordinary people a break.
I would love for a pundit to note that Trump’s children are ignorant boobs who should not comment on anything.
West of the Rockies
@germy:
Yeah, he’d get slaughtered.
TriassicSands
@Kay:
What struck me most about 2016 Bernie was that he was running for president but he was totally unprepared to be president. His campaign was constructed of slogans. He had no ideas that had been thought out and shaped into workable policies. “Medicare-for-All” is just a slogan and a poor one at that. (Medicare is an inadequate program to provide universal health care — you need either a Medi-gap plan or some form of supplementary government assistance to make Medicare adequate. If all you have is Medicare, you can still go bankrupt due to medical bills.) But when questioned Sanders showed just how shallow he is. I don’t care much about his tax returns. They aren’t likely to be as interesting as those of, say, DJT, but the fact that it’s 2019 and Sanders doesn’t have his returns ready for release is just another sign that he’s incapable of doing what a serious candidate — that is, one we should take seriously — should do to be president.
Look at Warren. She’s a thoughtful, smart candidate who may be more prepared policy-wise than any candidate I can think of — ever. She, like Sanders, decided to run for president some time ago. Unlike Sanders she has been busy with substance. Admittedly, that probably won’t help her with voters (who mostly aren’t interested in anything beyond slogans) but it should. We can hope that her depth will encourage other serious candidates to follow her example.
Medicare-for-All and the GND are not plans ready for implementation. And from what I’ve seen of Sanders he’s little better prepared than Trump to turn aspirational dreams into workable policies.
sdhays
@germy: Good. I’m tired of doing a double-take when I see a headline about “Harris”.
evodevo
@MattF: It’s TempleTON Foundation, isn’t it? And if so, they are the religious equivalent of “both-siders”….. “there are two sides to the evolution debate!!” “why exclude religion from the political arena??” He was also a “free markit” maven who was an evangelical Xtian . My quibble with them is over their support of “intelligent design” and also their funding of projects to research the interaction of prayer and healing…
jl
Sad that BS seems to be living inside AL’s head 24/7. Maybe AL should see a professional about the problem, which has long concerned me.
Why the obsession? A lot of 2016 BS primary support, at least from people I talk to around here, and for me, is going to Warren. I wanted to Warren to run in 2016 anyway. I think BS has a pitch that will do well, but he won’t be the dominating force among the lefties he was in 2016. Will be much more difficult for him to wander off and go independent. Less voter share in primaries, and Warren will regulate a large chunk of the reasonable left strictly during the 2020 general, whether she wins the primaries or not.
Edit: and why the carping about BS’s statements on Trump supporters? Very similar to what HRC said herself during the 2016 campaign. It’s just some bizarre obsession with BS, a person, who unless he can stop sounding like a tape loop, will not be nearly the influence he was 4 years ago in the primary.
sdhays
@TriassicSands: Ironically, this is what made his campaign sort of work in 2016. It was clear that he wasn’t a serious Presidential candidate (although he eventually got confused on this when the campaign turned out a bit too successful), but these slogans still represent ideas that the mainstream wouldn’t even dignify with a debate, and lots of people, myself included, were frustrated by that. Hillary needed someone to talk to for the media conversation to not be Trump and not Trump all the time, so why not have her debate the best way to get to universal coverage with a guy who seriously wasn’t a threat? “I’m tired of talking about Hillary’s damn emails” was Bernie earlier in the campaign.
That didn’t work out so well, but that was a lot of the support in his campaign – Clinton was a juggernaut crowding out anyone with an actual shot and that was robbing the party of the chance to have a debate, so vote for Bernie to give these general ideas some air and demonstrate support. That’s manifestly not the case now, so if he’s going to run the same campaign in 2020, he’s in for a big surprise.
Dan B
@Kent: Right wing think tanks and media have spent 40 years branding the “left”, vegans, ecologists, and most any rational scientist (there are nuts: see Heartland) as snobbish elites who feel they are morally superior and as scolds. This despite the Christianists who are the real deal. “Christians” are nice quiet people who love you… and are under attack by the “weird” vegans and “scary” socialist eco-nazis. Ignore the scary spittle flecked preacher and the nazis attacking the socialists and brown people… Cory Booker needs to address his being vegan the way JFK addressed being Catholic. Put it up front or drag that chain for months.
Raven Onthill
But, without Bernie, where would the Democrats get their policy ideas? (Except for Warren.)
I like Warren, but expect that the charges of racism, however unfair, will stick. I think we are likely to get Harris, but I think she’s going to turn out to be another austerian. Still better than Trump, though.
Bernie is wrong about Trump supporters in an interesting way; he’s giving the benefit of the doubt to people most of us have given up on.
I expect Bernie will release his tax returns late some Friday evening.
Anyone taken a look at the Jayapal Medicare for All proposal yet? Disability activists wrote part of it.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/us-policy/2019/02/26/more-than-house-democrats-back-medicare-all-plan-presidential-candidates-spar-over-health-care/
The GND is a plan to make a plan. We should have done that 25 years ago, but we definitely need to do it now.
https://adviceunasked.blogspot.com/2019/02/reflections-on-green-new-deal.html
“To put it bluntly: in US popular culture, greens are seen as humorless, sanctimonious, uptight moralists who find fault in every little thing, who are incapable of relaxing & enjoying things, and who, however noble their goals, are insufferable to be around. … It seems pretty self-evidently true to me that the ubiquity of this social stereotype is bad for environmentalism & environmental causes.” – David Roberts, at https://twitter.com/drvox/status/1099778909950754816.
Dan B
@Sloane Ranger: I second Adam about Templeman. I was with a group trying to get progressive people of faith to use modern communication and none of the ministers liked Templeman. They occasionally funded a good project but it was usually right leaning.
Miss Bianca
@Dorothy A. Winsor: If she’s working on your teeth, probably best not to say anything at all.
Chris Johnson
@Brachiator: Tad Devine and apparently the other two are the Russian operatives.
If they’ve been kicked out, expect the vengeance to be swift and sure. Watch the BernieBros evaporate as if like magic. I don’t know where they’ll go: they won’t go to Warren, because she’s actually good. Devine worked for Dukakis, Gore/Lieberman, Kerry/Edwards, and now Sanders. Devine’s not good, except he’s awful good at losing and making a hell of a disaster out of it.
Watch where he goes. He brings defeat wherever he goes, as if by accident.
If Bernie ditched him, that’s nice but too late. Bernie will not be President. For one thing, I’m betting the reason he hides his taxes is that he is also a millionaire and got tainted by the very same Washington he bitches about. Given that he was friendly with Russia before it was twice as capitalist and bad as US, I think that rather’n take money from corporations, he took money from Russians who talked a good lefty game, and then he was fucked, and got to have his own personal Tad Devine as he got run like a stalking horse just so Putin could have his personal puppet installed.
One day we’ll be able to read the whole story and man, what a story it must be.
Bernie’s out of the story. If he’s ditched Tad Devine, it’s because he thinks he can stand alone and rebels against his Russian helpers now that he’s ever so slowly clued in to what they are. Unfortunately, they are much much bigger than him and will squish him like a bug for trying to discard his handlers.
Y’all can drop the ‘Wilmer’ alt-russian playbook, trollskis: it’s no longer needed. He’s done.
bemused
@dogwood:
Dead thread but good for you! I mean, what a way to go under before surgery. I would have been spitting mad too.
The Pale Scot
@Brickley Paiste:
UHmm.. Wilmer’s not a progressive, he’s a liberal by a very dated “nationalize the means of production” metric. Look at his record, the only five bills that he has sponsored that have been passed consist of naming a post offices in Vermont and one bill raising VA benefits. That’s in what, twenty years? Real fuckin’ heavy weight he is. An American Jerry Corbyn, with dismissive racial attitudes subbed in place of anti-semitism. He has NO political power base in DC, and obviously no ability to persuade those who don’t already agree with him. Like others here have said, his proponents don’t seem to know what his positions really are.
bemused
@Dan B:
Sure, but people have to want to get a clue by four. Not much you can do to reach folks who can’t be bothered to listen to anything but their peers or family. Lazy.
TriassicSands
@Dan B:
I’m afraid the risk in 2020 is the same one that gave us Trump. Bernie has a solid base of support. With so many other candidates dividing up the rest of the vote, Bernie could keep winning primaries or at least staying in the race. Unlike a lot of people, I’m not a fan of having fifteen or twenty or more Democratic candidates running. That’s just too many. And it could give a lousy candidate like Sanders the situation he needs to win in the end. I believe that would be a disaster for Democrats. Not because Sanders couldn’t possibly beat Donald Trump, but because if he does beat Trump that leaves us with someone who will be a poor president, who will only be good for one term, and who will set the stage for Republicans to re-take the White House in 2024. A Sanders victory would squander Democratic possibilities.
bemused
@germy:
Good. It looked like he was very tempted to try to brazen his way through despite his sons words.
I hope the “health” reasons include a moral checkup for the once minister.
rikyrah
@Doug R:
LOL
MisterForkbeard
@rikyrah: Like others, I’m not sold on whether or not saying this was a GOOD idea, but it absolutely is true and I admire Kamala for saying it.
I’d be lovely if someone asked her “why do you think this?” and she just handed them a huge list of racist things he’s done and said. Maybe then it would actually be covered.
bemused
@TriassicSands:
I agree. Plus I’m sick of the crabby pants.
MisterForkbeard
@Raven Onthill:
Was that sarcastic? Warren’s been the most out front about this, but Sanders isn’t exactly an idea machine. Most of the other candidates (and in 2016 too) had considerably more and ‘real’ fleshed out policy ideas than Sanders did.
Not Amused
There was more to that townhall than meets the eye. See here:
https://twitter.com/respecteconomy/status/1100297372481904640
rikyrah
@katdip:
The people for whom reparations is so important don’t vote anyway, because ” the system’??
rikyrah
@Ohio Mom:
Maybe you could hook him up with Mayhew and they could publish the piece at BJ
J R in WV
@bemused:
Everyone is OK at their poker face when tools are in their mouth, and that bright light, “You may rinse now!” – etc.
J R in WV
@StringOnAStick:
Heh — hydrogeology… and… the up and down nature of [that] field… heheh! Thas a joke, and a good one, heh, heh!
Thanks! ;-)
me.
Elie
Just another Russian agent. Nothing to see here.
SHOW ME YOUR TAXES, COMRADE!
Feckless
We are screwed.
Because idiots like the writers here do the GOPs work for them.
Historically people only renounce racism when they are bribed to., but u go replay 2016 and tell us that demographics matters more than $.
Reparations as a campaign platform is the stupidest most self defeating idea in the history of us politics.
You want 8 years of tRump? Keep talking about taking tax money from poor white people and giving it to black people.
Morons the lot of you.
BLM seattle and Kaepernick told me not to vote in 2016, now they tell me to vote for reparations and race war.
Yeah sure.
O. Felix Culpa
@Feckless: You might wish to give these books a whirl, tovarish.
cokane
These posts about Sanders aren’t good. You may prefer a different candidate, but the man has a non-trivial chance of winning the nomination. And he wouldn’t be a bad president. The well-poisoning of these posts is going to help engender the same kind of petulance that divided liberals after Clinton’s nomination. People need to seriously cool off.
And these attacks? Sanders should run in the GOP? LOL Look at his makeup job! You sound like a child, Anne.
SteverinoCT
@bemused:
This is a great straight line, but I don’t know you and don’t want to risk offending.
Ruckus
@gwangung:
It doesn’t just look like it. Because if he cared, he’d fix this. He hasn’t done that, and he shows no intention of doing so. He gets pissed that people even ask the questions. Have they no respect for his expertise and sparkling personality, his whiteness, his experience in getting up everyday for 77 yrs, his just plain wonderfulness?
David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch
@cokane: I don’t see how he wouldn’t be a bad president. 7 months into office he would turn 80 years old. He would be 10 years older than Reagoon when he took office.
David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch
@Raven Onthill:
Funny how Wilmer obsesses over Drumpf’s voters but has given up on black voters, saying primaries with a majority black vote “distort reality” and saying their vote should be suppressed by moving them to the back of the
buscalendar.Hmm, I wonder what the difference could be.
cokane
@David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch: his age is concerning and one reason he wouldnt be my first choice among the candidates, but i see no evidence that he’s affected by any impairment and i see no reason why it necessitates him being a bad a president. and other folks have shown themselves to take on executive roles just fine at roughly his age with both Jimmy Carter and his nonprofit works and Jerry Brown in California.