Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

“Joe Biden deserved better than he got from some folks in his own party.”

We’ve had enough carrots to last a lifetime. break out the sticks.

If you voted for Trump, you don’t get to speak about ethics, morals, or rule of law.

Motto for the House: Flip 5 and lose none.

They’re not red states to be hated; they are voter suppression states to be fixed.

Accountability, motherfuckers.

The gop couldn’t organize an orgy in a whorehouse with a fist full of 50s.

Sadly, media malpractice has become standard practice.

… pundit janitors mopping up after the gop

They love authoritarianism, but only when they get to be the authoritarians.

When do we start airlifting the women and children out of Texas?

Accused of treason; bitches about the ratings. I am in awe.

Don’t expect peaches from an apple tree.

Some judge needs to shut this circus down soon.

There are no moderate republicans – only extremists and cowards.

The frogs are rarely mistaken.

If you cannot answer whether trump lost the 2020 election, you are unfit for office.

Maybe you would prefer that we take Joelle’s side in ALL CAPS?

President Biden is doing good where he can, and getting it done.

Only Democrats have agency, apparently.

They think we are photo bombing their nice little lives.

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In my day, never was longer.

A lot of Dems talk about what the media tells them to talk about. Not helpful.

You are here: Home / Open Threads / Women’s World Cup: USA vs. England

Women’s World Cup: USA vs. England

by | 174 Comments

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Valued commenter Trollhattan informed us of some potentially consequential changes in the lineup in an earlier thread:

Two big changes to US starting XI: Horan instead of Mewes and Press instead of Rapinoe. Horan isn’t a huge surprise (her yellow card is now cleared) but Press is. Pino injured, or is Ellis simply player-matching?

ETA Big changes for England, too: Goalkeeper Karen Bardsley is injured so Carly Telford comes in for only her second major tournament game, having played in the group game against Argentina. Rachel Daly is also in for Fran Kirby, while Beth Mead replaces Toni Duggan

I have no idea what this means, but I hope everyone is okay. May the best team win!

Speaking of our Pino, her girlfriend, WNBA star Sue Bird, wrote an essay for The Players’ Tribune:

An excerpt:

What’s it like to have the literal President of the literal United States (of literal America) go Full Adolescent Boy on your girlfriend? Hmm. Well… it’s WEIRD. And I’d say I actually had a pretty standard reaction to it: which was to freak out a little…

I mean, some of it is kind of funny….. but like in a REALLY? REALLY? THIS GUY??? kind of way. Like, dude — there’s nothing better demanding your attention?? It would be ridiculous to the point of laughter, if it wasn’t so gross. (And if his legislations and policies weren’t ruining the lives of so many innocent people.) And then what’s legitimately scary, I guess, is like….. how it’s not just his tweets. Because now suddenly you’ve got all these MAGA peeps getting hostile in your mentions. And you’ve got all these crazy blogs writing terrible things about this person you care so much about. And now they’re doing takedowns of Megan on Fox News, and who knows whatever else. It’s like an out-of-body experience, really — that’s how I’d describe it. That’s how it was for me.

It’s like that for all of us, Sue. But I have to keep believing that some day we’ll have a president who is fit to receive sports ball club members again. Such meet-and-greets must be among the simplest duties a president performs, but the orange clown fails even at that.

Anyhoo, open thread for the fútbol and other topics.

Reader Interactions

174Comments

  1. 1.

    David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch

    This ain’t gonna be easy.

    Rapinoe isn’t starting (presumably injured)

    England has superhero Lucy Bronze on their side.

  3. 3.

    Downpuppy

    I wouldn’t really call the Sue Bird piece an essay. It’s a love letter. Not mushy, but completely a love letter.

  7. 7.

    Tony Jay

    This should be a hell of a game. Mucho excited. The USA are a damned good team with skill and strength across the pitch. England may not have their whistle to whistle athleticism, but we have been getting better and better every game.

    Whoops.

  15. 15.

    Amir Khalid

    I am really unhappy wth the American commentators. No idea how to convey a sense of the flow of the game.

  19. 19.

    humboldtblue

    England are going to have to attack on the flanks, the US is deafening in 4-1-4-1 and they will find it hard going to push the ball through the middle.

  23. 23.

    humboldtblue

    I’m a fucking genius, what a cross-field pass and a lovely cross into the box. Well done England.

    And terribly defended by the US

  25. 25.

    Tony Jay

    @SRW1:

    England look flustered, nervous and out of sorts, while the US look up for it and…..

    Equaliser! Boof! Eat my goal!

    … will require a moment of quality to pry open.

  29. 29.

    Tony Jay

    Glad it’s picked up. The cameraman seems to be spending every moment the ball isn’t in play following Morgan around with “Secret Smile” playing in the background.

  30. 30.

    humboldtblue

    Dreadful defending by the left back for the US, Bronze turned her around and created a chance. Poorly done.

  32. 32.

    humboldtblue

    Julie Ertz has an athlete for a partner as well, Philadelphia Eagles tight end Zac Ertz.

  33. 33.

    Tony Jay

    Bugger.

    Lovely goal.

    The cameraman just fainted from lack of blood to the brain.

  39. 39.

    humboldtblue

    @SRW1:

    All three goals have been given up because the defender was not playing close enough to the attacker, far too much space and when you get excellent crosses the goals come.

  41. 41.

    humboldtblue

    Man, the US attack is spot on today, well done ladies, well done.

    Eight shots total and four shots on target.

  46. 46.

    Tony Jay

    England’s defence needs to get on the front foot and see the pass coming before the Americans deliver it. They know how the USA play and how good they are at putting it pinpoint into the box for the strikers to attack, they’ll have worked at countering that through smart positioning in training, but they’re just not getting to where they need to be in time.

    Still, plenty of time to go and the English front line are more than capable of hitting back whenever they get the chance. There’s more than one goal left in this game.

    Never a yellow card, btw.

  48. 48.

    Betty Cracker

    Pino sighting on the sideline. I guess she’s really not coming in. Damn.

  49. 49.

    humboldtblue

    @Tony Jay:

    Both.

    I was under the impression that this particular England team included women from Wales, but it appears they are all truly English.

  50. 50.

    Tony Jay

    With pace and aggression like that Lucy Bronze is more than welcome to come play for Liverpool (men) next season. Alexander-Armstrong could do with quality competition and Jurgen would love her.

  51. 51.

    Amir Khalid

    @Tony Jay:
    You’re watching this with a British commentator. Lucky you. American commentators suck at reading the game.

  52. 52.

    Comrade Colette Collaboratrice

    I’m following on the Guardian’s liveblog. I get confused when they talk about Bronze and White because it sounds like one of BJ David Anderson’s “You Be the Referee” hypotheticals.

  54. 54.

    humboldtblue

    @Tony Jay:

    You see where the Liverpool women’s team will travel with the men’s team to the United States for the preseason tour?

  56. 56.

    Steeplejack

    Talking heads saying Rapinoe out with pulled hamstring, not being held in reserve.

  59. 59.

    Burnspbesq

    The IOC member is Great Britain. Team GB will likely consist of about 18 England players, three Scots (who will be there on merit—Scotland qualified for this World Cup) and a token Welsh.

  60. 60.

    Martin

    @humboldtblue: Yeah. Great Britain is not a member of FIFA, and the individual nations are not part of the IOC. So Great Britain can, in theory, field up to 4 World Cup teams, but only one Olympic team.

  63. 63.

    Burnspbesq

    From the Guardian’s liveblog:

    Ian Copestake has another way of making pretty much the same point: “To think, the US have yet to play their Trump card.” He’s here all week, ladies and gentlemen, try the president’s cold and quickly congealing McDonald’s Happy Meal buffet.

  64. 64.

    Tony Jay

    @Amir Khalid:

    Can’t you completely legally stream the BBC coverage? Or turn the sound down and listen to coverage on the radio?

    Anything would be better than listening to Roddy Scarpetto and Chuck Malone (as I imagine they’re named) getting all excited about the wrong things.

  65. 65.

    Burnspbesq

    @Martin:

    Although they didn’t qualify, Wales did OK in qualifying. My ancestral homeland, not so much.

  66. 66.

    James E Powell

    @Martin:

    Odd that they are called Great Britain rather than United Kingdom. Northern Ireland is no part of Great Britain

  67. 67.

    Tony Jay

    @humboldtblue:

    I did not. That will be very cool for all concerned. The next step is getting them training together. Nothing improves like playing top quality opposition regularly.

  73. 73.

    Tony Jay

    @Burnspbesq:

    Somewhere out there, on a yet to be released podcast, this match has excruciatingly faux-PC rapidly descending into sub-Jeremy Clarkson oafish commentary by Alan Partridge.

    Someone missed a trick there.

  86. 86.

    Kent

    @humboldtblue:

    Is that where I got confused, the Olympic team is Great Britain?

    Great Britian is a geographic term like “North America” and refers to the Island.
    United Kingdom is the name of the country. The official name is the United Kingdom of Great Britian and Northern Ireland

    In common use the terms get confused and everyone just calls them the Brits.

  88. 88.

    Tony Jay

    @Burnspbesq:

    Surely oafs have a certain ‘too stupid to know they’re being offensive’ thing going on, compared to Morgan’s technique of being as sneeringly offensive as possible while hiding behind a wall of security?

    Get In!!!! 2-2

    Or was it offside? DAmn.

  93. 93.

    James E Powell

    England goal seems like the usual karmic result of USA blowing chances

    ETA – Oh really now?

  94. 94.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Tony Jay: Yes, it is for rugby. Apparently, not so for footie.

    @ Everyone else: I do understand that the UK splits into its component bits for many international sporting events including the the various World Cups. In rugby, the Lions/Lionesses are a touring side picked from the four nations of the British Isles (Ireland is considered one nation for these purposes.

  95. 95.

    humboldtblue

    No goal, she’s offside!

    Oh my, that was inches close. And yet again US center backs get split and left two yards from their mark.

  99. 99.

    Litlebritdifrnt

    Shit. Again. Offside. Of course the good part of that is we can claim “we wus robbed” for the rest of the year.

  103. 103.

    Tony Jay

    Good England pressure. They know they’ve got the beating of this IS defence, just need to keep the defence tight.

    Shakes gris-gris. No jinx!

  106. 106.

    SRW1

    @Litlebritdifrnt:

    Of course the good part of that is we can claim “we wus robbed” for the rest of the year.

    You’re obviously fluent in the essence of the game!

  107. 107.

    Kent

    Why England gets its own team in the world cup:

    https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2010/06/why-does-england-get-its-own-team-in-the-world-cup.html

    Bottom line. Soccer was invented in England and for the first 30 years the international competitions were between England, Scotland, Wales, and Ireland. As the sport gained popularity in the European continent and the World Cup was created in 1904, many European countries thought that a combined UK team would be too dominant so they let them continue playing as separate teams

  108. 108.

    SRW1

    @Raven:

    Not really. Three players can be substituted. If the game goes to 30 extra minutes, a fourth is allowed.

  109. 109.

    humboldtblue

    @Martin:

    Not so sure about that, now that VAR has been in use the linesmen have been trained not to raise their flags, under no VAR I’m pretty sure the linesman would have flagged that.

  110. 110.

    humboldtblue

    I am impressed with England’s attack.

    What a nice card to have in your deck late in the game, Lloyd coming on.

  111. 111.

    Steeplejack

    @Raven:

    No, you get three, that’s it.

    If you use them all and a player gets maimed, too bad, you play a man down. (Although I don’t think I have ever seen that happen.)

    ETA: Oh, yeah, one more for extra period, as SRW1 said.

  112. 112.

    Tony Jay

    Not complaining, because as soon as I saw the replay I knew that was offside, but with VAR coming in they’re going to have to look again at the offside rule. Playing at pace with human reaction times it’s more a matter of luck than judgement if you turn your body to run at goal a bare fraction of a second before the ball is passed your way. There’s no way the English striker gained enough of an advantage there to suggest that she wouldn’t have reached the ball first or scored anyway.

    It has to go back to clear daylight or at least a substantial advantage, not fractional milimetres.

  114. 114.

    SRW1

    Good god, invoking VAR that late after the games has continued is kind of farcical.

  115. 115.

    Tony Jay

    VAR has to give that. The rear shot shows her foot being swiped just as she’s going to put it down.

    Yes! Penalty!

  117. 117.

    humboldtblue

    That’s incidental contact no a penalty, that’s terrible. White tripped herself.

  125. 125.

    Tony Jay

    Bugger. She never looked confident.

    That’s why VAR exists. From every repeat angle it was hard to see contact, except for that one shot from the rear that shows her foot being caught just as she’s about to set it and shoot. Definite penalty.

  127. 127.

    L85NJGT

    The Home Nations are four of the eight votes on the IFAB, the global rules committee, with FIFA having the other four. There’s a history.

  131. 131.

    Martin

    I’m sorry, but that’s not a penalty on White. If I’m about to strike the ball and swing my leg back and strike a defender, I’m the one initiating contact, not the defender. Now, that’s not a penalty on me either.

  134. 134.

    Amir Khalid

    @Martin:
    I think the penalty was given because the defender got her standing leg as she was about to shoot.

  135. 135.

    Tony Jay

    7 minutes added on. nothing to lose by going for it. Just one chance needed.

  137. 137.

    Martin

    @Amir Khalid: I didn’t see that. It looks like her striking leg came back and hit the running defender, and that threw her balance off. It’s incidental contact. Now if the defender had hit the standing leg, then yeah, clear penalty. But I didn’t see that on the replay.

  140. 140.

    Tony Jay

    @Amir Khalid:

    USA just seeing the game out in an unsentimental, professional manner while England have few options to get up the pitch and overlap while down to 10 players.

    Need to get it up, hold it up and get lucky. Which isn’t happening.

    Oh well. Going out to the best team in the competition is one thing, but that penalty miss will haunt them.

  145. 145.

    humboldtblue

    That’s a win, close, but it’s a win and another trip to the final.

    Well done by England, they have established themselves as one of the best sides in the world.

  146. 146.

    Tony Jay

    @Martin:

    The defender ran into the attacker’s leg and the contact took her down. Not a card, but a penalty.

  147. 147.

    SRW1

    Apparently, for England the old penalty curse has been superseded by a general semi-final curse.

  148. 148.

    Kent

    Damn good game. Both teams just attacked relentlessly all match. That was leave it all on the field.

  150. 150.

    James E Powell

    @Tony Jay:

    Playing at pace with human reaction times it’s more a matter of luck than judgement if you turn your body to run at goal a bare fraction of a second before the ball is passed your way.

    We’ve seen the same kind of things with replay in other sports. For example, NFL’s rule on contact above the shoulders – very much a good idea – requires reactions that no human is capable of.

  151. 151.

    Martin

    Wow. Gotta say, if I was an England fan, I’d be pretty unhappy right now. That offsides call would never have been called in a prior WC, and that penalty miss has to really hurt. Did we not practice those this week?

  152. 152.

    Tony Jay

    Best team in the tournament and we – should – have beaten them, but it wasn’t to be.

    Well done, USA, that’s a hell of a team you’ve got there. Skillful, athletic, brilliant game management. No shame losing to that quality.

  153. 153.

    David Anderson

    Penalty luck is penalty luck but if you are going to complain about a VAR offside call, I don’t think you get to complain about a PK awarded on a VAR call.

    Video assistance has made the assistant referees less likely to put up the flag on a marginal run that could lead to goal scoring opportunities as FIFA has been instructing their ARs to lean towards offense and keep the flag down unless they are 100% sure. That was a pre-video review guidance and that is post-VAR guidance as well. If the AR popped her flag and video showed the attacker was clean, the AR would have a major mark against her for future assignments while she will be assessed as following procedure on keeping the flag down on a bang-bang play and letting the video clean up after the fact.

  155. 155.

    mrmoshpotato

    So – for those in the know – is a Dutch win or Swedish win better for the US?

  156. 156.

    Tony Jay

    @James E Powell:

    There’s a few things that VAR is going to show need changing. Offside rule, foot on the line for penalty rule, that awful new handball rule.

    I’d bet as much cash as you like, as soon as the elite European club teams start raising hell about them and they prevent big money teams getting through to big money games, they’ll change.

  157. 157.

    Martin

    @James E Powell: I agree with this. There’s so many situations where inertia, reaction time, visibility makes it impossible to avoid a contact but where video can capture it.

    We’re reaching a situation where it’s a bit unclear if the penalties are to correct intentional bad judgement or where something unexpected happened and it needs to be addressed. Layer the safety considerations on top of that. If the standard is ‘player x should have had a chance to shoot’ but was interrupted in some way, then we need to be calling a lot more penalties for a bunch of other stuff.

  158. 158.

    humboldtblue

    @mrmoshpotato:

    It doesn’t matter, both teams are very good and if I had to choose I’d choose Sweden. The Netherlands have an excellent attack. The U.S. will be favored over both but just like today’s game, both teams can run with the Yanks and make it a game.

  160. 160.

    SRW1

    @mrmoshpotato:

    Six of one and half a dozen of the other. The US is favorite against both of them, but both are very much capable of delivering a lucky punch.

  161. 161.

    trollhattan

    @mrmoshpotato:
    We already beat Sweden so Netherlands presents untested waters. I’d like to see them (the Dutch) advance because they’re a less known and still excellent team.

  163. 163.

    James E Powell

    @Martin:

    There’s a couple other things that frame by frame replay has shown us. In baseball, we learned that a runner sliding into second well ahead of the tag often bounces up for a split second because of the laws of physics and such. And in basketball, that if a defender slaps the ball out of an offensive player’s hands, the last thing the ball is touching is the offensive player’s fingers.

  165. 165.

    humboldtblue

    @mrmoshpotato:

    It’ll be another nail-biter most likely. The center of the US defense can be split as England amply demonstrated in the second half.

  166. 166.

    SRW1

    @mrmoshpotato:

    7 – 2 at most.

    Oh, and Piers Morgan has lost his shit and wants to go to war with Alex Morgan. Prolly a feud among relatives.

  167. 167.

    mrmoshpotato

    @SRW1:

    Oh, and Piers Morgan has lost his shit and wants to go to war with Alex Morgan.

    Haha. To hell with Piers Morgan.

  168. 168.

    Mart

    @James E Powell: Great game. Thought England played better, but US goalie had two amazing stops.

    Another problem with replay in the NFL, when is a catch a catch. Seem to tweak the rule every year in response to replay outrages.

  170. 170.

    VeniceRiley

    I love that Sue Bird love letter. I hope we all get a Sue Bird in our lives.

  171. 171.

    Sab

    Late to this now dead thread, but what a great game. Very sorry either team had to lose.

    Jackals, how do you all comment during soccer games? I always feel that if I blink or look at my computer screen I might miss something important, including the only goal of a game.

    That’s one of the things I liked about Sue Bird’s article. A penalty kick is not the same as a free throw. And if you look away for a second in soccer you miss the highlight, while in basketball they will score a hundred more points elsewhere.

    Also, I love that women don’t seem to flop. They only act injured when they can barely walk anymore.

    And these two teams were teams, not a bunch of talented egos cajoled into cooperating.

  172. 172.

    Steeplejack

    @Sab:

    I watched the match on my tablet on a little stand right next to the computer. So it was like looking at a two-monitor setup.

  173. 173.

    Sab

    @Steeplejack: You still have to take your eyes off the screen to comment.

    My husband says I am not an athlete, so slower reflexes explain my problem. I can walk all day forever, but the synapses fire slowly.

    He’s probably right. A lot of my reaction to the game was “….whoosh…whoa!…Wow!”

  174. 174.

    WaterGirl

    This is a test comment. Please disregard.

    I will use bold and italics.

    Here’s a link to something and I will add a quote below:

    There’s some ongoing events that we should probably take note of. The first is that the Vice President was recalled to the White House this morning requiring that he cancel his attendance at an opioid crisis event in New Hampshire. There are conflicting reports as to whether he was already in the air and Air Force 2 had to be turned around to return to Joint Base Andrews or whether he was still en route to Andrews and his convoy was turned around and he drove immediately back.

    I am going to strike this out.>/s>

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