.
Is this going to be the pattern from now till November 2020? "Amid Outcry, President Spends Weekend Tripling Down on Racist Tweets"?
— Julia Ioffe (@juliaioffe) July 28, 2019
1. In 1971, Richard Nixon got a call from Ronald Reagan, complaining about African delegates at the UN. "To see those, those monkeys from those African countries—damn them, they’re still uncomfortable wearing shoes!” https://t.co/SZmPj8omUy
— Yoni Appelbaum (@YAppelbaum) July 30, 2019
I'd be interested to know what definition of "privacy" embraces "hiding the racist views of public figures" | "the racist portion was apparently withheld to protect Reagan’s privacy" https://t.co/ZPoAbe3pPD
— Eric Rauchway (@rauchway) July 31, 2019
Answer: A vestigial sense among the keepers of St. Ronnie’s legacy that the time for public celebration of blatant racism was not yet ripe.
Historical documentation is always nice, but anybody with the most nominal political awareness knew Ronald Reagan was a racist. He famously started his campaign in a Mississippi town best known for the KKK murder of civil-rights activists. It was widely reported during the campaign that his father-in-law’s John Bircher cronies deliberated groomed Reagan as a prettier, more trainable version of Pat Buchanan or Bill O’Reilly — the ‘old-fashioned blue-collar working-class guy’, aka, someone who’d promote racism as a public virtue.
By the time he was in the Oval Office, the openly racist ‘conservative’ media like National Review were publicly exulting that ‘Morning in America’ was code for ‘send the colored and their commie-liberal supporters back where they belong’, and the squishy-moderate publications like Fred Barnes’ New Republic were half-heartedly suggesting that Ronnie wasn’t *really* a racist, he just pretended to be one to please the ‘hardcore’ Republican voter.
Nixon’s infamous ‘Southern Strategy’ was the HIV infection of the Republican party; Reagan’s success, followed by the Bush terms, was the emergence of full-blown political AIDS; Trump is just the Kaposi’s sarcoma that announces the disease in the most public way possible.
Noteworthy: @WSJ has joined @washingtonpost in calling Trump’s “go back” tweets simply “racist.” Not “allegedly.” Not “opponents say.” Just, these are racist. pic.twitter.com/N4NI5ow1xX
— Jack Newsham (@TheNewsHam) July 28, 2019
It is also jarring to see @WSJ news stories call Trump’s tweets racist, without qualification, and for @WSJopinion to run things like this in the meantime: pic.twitter.com/akgrS5fLvP
— Jack Newsham (@TheNewsHam) July 28, 2019
******
Interesting. And why would overt racism be appealing to his base? https://t.co/r4zkAq3Icz
— Soledad O'Brien (@soledadobrien) July 27, 2019
When — not if — he says the N-word, or it comes out that he did, he and his enablers will find a way to say that the target deserved it, or that it’s justified. It will then become a rally chant. There is no red line, people. The only line left is each individual’s moral compass. https://t.co/Bd0UBNd1YC
— Asha Rangappa (@AshaRangappa_) July 18, 2019
It's always been wrong to argue that Trump's racism took over the GOP; the correct interpretation is that Trump is a culmination of extant racism. However, w/ every tweet, every statement, Trump is entrenching his party &, indeed the whole country, even deeper in this evil muck.
— Mangy Jay (@magi_jay) July 27, 2019
It’s interesting that after all the hot takes, Trump and his team are very clear that they believe racism (rather than anything to do with the economy) is the core of his electoral appeal. https://t.co/fcAzeusVmu
— Matthew Yglesias (@mattyglesias) July 27, 2019
No, it's because Trump is a fucking racist who holds a wide variety of overtly racist beliefs and who who says racist things.
Try to keep up, you slackwit. https://t.co/Xa2K0MUom4
— Rick Wilson (@TheRickWilson) July 27, 2019
Re upping given the racist demagoguery by Trump. https://t.co/O7hQ5Rsind
— Neera Tanden (@neeratanden) July 29, 2019
JPL
Pence will be put out to pasture and Nicky Haley will save the day.
Jerzy Russian
Jesus, this is exhausting. Had a coworker rant about the “religion” of diversity the other day. The good news is that being accused of bias makes them uncomfortable, so progress I guess.
schrodingers_cat
@JPL: Nicki Haley may offer a fig leaf to the I-am-not-a-racist crowd but that will win over negligibly small # of minority/immigrant votes. We are not that stupid. Kthx bai.
Jerzy Russian
@JPL:
As long as he does not have to graze alone with a cow it should be fine.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@JPL: I don’t think Haley wants the job. She and Christie have a strategy of being– for lack of a better phrase– a little bit pregnant with trump. Never going all in on either side, but clean enough for Chuck Todd and Jake Tapper in 2024
Jeffery
@JPL:
They will pick Ben Carson to run with trump.
Yarrow
Of course he’s doubling down on the racism. The cruelty and hatred are the point.
@schrodingers_cat: Nikki Haley who said, “I can’t say enough good things about Jared and Ivanka. Jared is such a hidden genius that no one understands.” The campaign ads practically write themselves.
Steve in the ATL
@Jerzy Russian:
And at work there can be actual consequences to that, which is good
Anonymous At Work
Small detail about Reagan’s Mississippi speech on “states’ rights” (ghost-written by Lee Atwater): Mississippi voted DEAD-LAST in the Republican primary that year. Smallest state on the last day and you give your first speech there? Hmmm…..
Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho
Re: Applebaum on twitter: if anyone ever doubted Reagan’s bone deep racism, his first speech after becoming the GOP nominee should have destroyed all doubt. Philadelphia Ms as the location was a less than subtle dog whistle, regardless of how abstract Atwater claimed to have altered the message to become.
MattF
@Jeffery: Very unlikely, IMO. More likely is some hard-right Freedom Caucus congressperson.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@schrodingers_cat: it’s not about minority and immigrant voters, it’s about the white suburban college-educated people who voted for trump in ’16, are getting squeamish, but theoretically could tell themselves, “How can I be racist if I voted for Nikki Haley?” But like I said, she’s smart and cynical and I don’t think she wants the job.
Cathie Fonz
The Washington National Cathedral has a “response to trump” open letter:
https://cathedral.org/have-we-no-decency-a-response-to-president-trump.html
Dare I think that the response might finally FINALLY be turning against Trump?
David Hunt
I’d argue that Goldwater’s campaign showing that racist positions could get you the Southern states would be that point. Then again, it seems that there’s always another racist moment the further back you go. It isn’t turtles, but racists all the way down.
jl
“Trump’s advisers had concluded after the previous tweets that the overall message sent by such attacks are good for the president among his political base – resonating strongly with white working-class voters.”
Really? Do they really believe that? Or are they just saying it because they know Trump is going to tweet out racist and bigoted garbage every time a Fox News segment riles him up, and that is what they need to say to themselves to get through the day without getting boozed up to ease the pain and stress. Or maybe the ‘Trump’s advisers’ was Miller and his gang, who think exactly like Trump does.
One reason Trump’s GOP approval rating stays very high is that the GOP is shrinking to be just the hard core Trump base of nutcases and hard core bigots and xenophobes. And as I noted in previous thread, if I understand recent polls correctly Trump is underwater with every major demographic group except poorly educated young Whites, and that is slim, only 52 percent approve.
Thing is, among Trumpsters, this stuff can’t be limited to racial and ethnic minorities. It will spread to Jews first, then anyone who does not slavishly believe every toxic and false fantasy that Trump spews out. It is very dangerous and ugly, but if they are telling themselves this nonsense, I guess that is the silver lining, for us, to dark clouds that they are summoning.
schrodingers_cat
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: So the NPR totebagger crowd that likes movies like Green Book and Christopher Kimball appropriating immigrant recipes. Has anyone noticed how he usually has white people as experts on Vietnamese, Chinese and other cuisines on his Milk (White) street show?
Adam L Silverman
@schrodingers_cat: Nikki Haley, Kash Patel, Bobby Jindal, Ajit Pai, Avik Roy, Seema Verma, Dinesh D’Souza, etc, etc, etc.
Your community does indeed appear to be that stupid.
Kay
I just don’t understand why we all have to pretend this isn’t a political strategy. They had a dilemma, a choice, after their 2012 loss. It was widely discussed and covered by all the major media outlets. They could 1. enlarge their base by attracting a more diverse set of voters or 2. boil down their base by driving up white GOP turnout. Trump picked #2, won by a hair, and they all went along with it. Except Amash. One person defied the rest.
Trump is a perfect spokesperson for them because he is 1. a racist and 2. he has no inner character or ethics or decency to get in the way of blurting out hateful and mean-spirited things, and neither do any of his bottom of the barrel hires. They earned Donald Trump. He is, in fact, their leader.
Emerald
At this point, whoever agrees to run as his veep has to know that s/he’ll be tarred with the association forever in History.
If there is history. Which may be what they’re counting on.
Suzanne
If the Trumpy people and/or the media think that “it’s not racist, it’s just appealing to his base!” is exculpatory….. that is telling AF.
Eric U
It was pretty obvious at the time that Reagan was racist. I never bought the amiable shtick, his nastiness was also pretty evident.
I can be slow on the uptake, but I didn’t realize until Bush the lesser that all Republican policies are racist at their core. Particularly lower taxes and smaller government.
bemused
@jl:
They’ve got nothing else.
Suzanne
@Jerzy Russian:
Are you kidding? They think being called racist is about the worst thing that could ever happen to anyone ever.
schrodingers_cat
@Adam L Silverman: No more stupid than Adelson, Steven Miller and company. As a demographic South Asians vote about 70 to 80 percent D. These careerist assholes are not representative although they are indeed in your face and visible.
You are judging an entire demographic on the basis of a few R assholes.
rikyrah
‘He was pure happiness and pure joy’: The Descendants stars Dove Cameron, Sofia Carson, and Booboo Stewart talk about Cameron Boyce following his tragic death at age 20
Cameron’s co-stars and the show’s director Kenny Oretga appeared on Good Morning America on Thursday
They talked about what a beacon of light and happiness the late actor was
‘This was the first time I ever dealt with anything like this,’ said Booboo, 25
‘If you could bottle up happiness, that was Cam,’ added Sofia, 26
Cameron died unexpectedly from an epileptic seizure on July 6
By CARLY STERN FOR DAILYMAIL.COM
PUBLISHED: 11:08 EDT, 1 August 2019 | UPDATED: 11:44 EDT, 1 August 2019
laura1
Preznit Ham Head is just this election cycle’s pageant winner. As much as I despise Bush the lesser, I think (and I could be wrong) that he’s the sole non-racist republican elected official.
Racists all the way down, infecting the body politic since for freaking ever.
jl
@Adam L Silverman: Every group has a few ruthless cynics or nutcases (or both) who decide to go grifter. Doesn’t say much about the majority of the group. And Avik Roy is not stupid, he has to really and thoroughly understand the stats and case studies in health care to twist them so completely in order to give a plausible veneer to outlandish conclusions.
Adam L Silverman
@schrodingers_cat: I’m all too aware. The problem isn’t the reliable and self aware 70 tp 80% it’s the lickspittle 20 to 30%.
rikyrah
Her mother’s double her age and looks better than her…..
Tiffany Trump, 25, swaps her billionaire boyfriend for mom Marla Maples and soaks up the rays on a Mallorca beach as she continues her European summer break
Tiffany Trump, 25, and her mother Marla Maples, 55, are spending time together on the Spanish island of Mallorca
The duo were spotted heading to the beach with friends on Wednesday, before Marla took to Instagram to gush over her only daughter
Tiffany is making the most of her well-earned summer break before she resumes her studies at Georgetown Law School in the fall
The blonde socialite has been jetting back and forth between Europe and the United States since she finished her second year of classes back in May
By ANDREW COURT and CHARLIE LANKSTON FOR DAILYMAIL.COM
PUBLISHED: 02:29 EDT, 1 August 2019 | UPDATED: 09:10 EDT, 1 August 2019
jl
@Adam L Silverman: There’s that 20 to 30% in every group.
I’ll try to dig up some stats on the political leanings of the body builder community.
Adam L Silverman
@jl: Actually if you’ve read anything he’s written or listened to any of his media hits it is very clear he has no understanding of the analyses he’s referring to. It is all ideologically driven gish galloping.
Adam L Silverman
@jl: I’m not a body builder.
MattF
Gun store billboard:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/08/01/how-hell-is-this-not-inciting-violence-gun-store-erects-billboard-with-minority-lawmakers-faces/?utm_term=.1dafd892f858
Yarrow
@Adam L Silverman: To be accurate, it’s 27%.
john not mccain
They won’t just be chanting “nwords!” The word “kill” will immediately precede it.
Adam L Silverman
@jl: Also:
A Ghost To Most
@schrodingers_cat:
You need to spend some time with the “common clay of the new West”.
jl
@Adam L Silverman: OK, guys who spend more time than average working out in the gym. IIRC, Mark Penn ID’d that as an up and coming critical voter demographic.
@Adam L Silverman: Thanks. But too early in the day for that. I’ll listen to it before I go to bed, and have 8 hours for he disorientation to wear off.
Edit: couldn’t resist. Now I am trouble. I have to do some counting for my job today, and now I’m in trouble.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
and what those trump-supporting minorities and Jews and white suburbanites have in common: Most of them wouldn’t want trump in their houses, they think he’s a short-fingered vulgarian, and worse. But he gets all those quaint people who go to those odd churches and drive old cars and brag about not having passports vote for our tax cuts.
Patricia Kayden
I love Neera’s tweet. Defeating Trump will take another huge blue wave to compensate for the voter suppression tactics and foreign interference that will be unleashed on the electorate. We should all be donating to organizations which are engaged in registering voters and protecting our voting rights. That’s how we win.
Adam L Silverman
@MattF: It’s not incitement because there’s no call to action or explicit threat. It is also protected 1st Amendment speech, no matter how stupid.
Jerzy Russian
@Suzanne: Well yes, there is that too.
Adam L Silverman
@jl: I don’t know Mark Penn.
rikyrah
@jl:
can’t stand him, and I wish that Joy Reid would STOP HAVING HIM ON TO DISCUSS HEALTHCARE!
Adam L Silverman
@jl: It’s a hysterical forum. You had two chuckleheads fighting over, based on how they were dividing their splits, how many days were in a week. And they were talking completely past each other. One was arguing because of his workout/versus non workout days per week, that a week was not seven days. The other was arguing that it doesn’t matter how you divvy up your workout verses non workout days, a week is always seven days. In some ways it was really a conversation about two separate things, but neither would let it go.
MattF
@Adam L Silverman: A fine line. When the chants get to ‘Shoot them’ is it merely owning the libs?
jl
The signs are, since Trump can’t help himself from going on insane hate tweet binges for days on end, he’s going to single handed drag the GOP into tripling and quadrupling down on their failed 2018 strategy of smearing immigrants. Except the next nets of fear loathing and hate they throw out will catch ever expanding groups of people that Trump perceives as being unfair or opposed to him.
It is very dangerous and ugly, of course, but it has also failed in the past and I think will fail even more in the future. The Trumpster flunkies will have to spin ever more transparent BS excuses and explanations for Trump’s racism and bigotry that look just bad or worse than the racism and general bigotry itself. Not a good look for winning elections.
Adam L Silverman
@MattF: I’m not saying it isn’t stupid, especially given the current conditions in the US for someone acting out, I’m just explaining why it isn’t technically incitement.
Adam L Silverman
@jl: Expect the violent parts of our long running low intensity domestic war to spike a lot between now and inauguration day 2021.
Timurid
@Adam L Silverman:
The bigger problem is that for white people those ratios are almost completely reversed…
rikyrah
GOP’s Kennedy helps prove Buttigieg’s point about Republican rhetoric
08/01/19 09:21 AM—UPDATED 08/01/19 09:29 AM
By Steve Benen
At a presidential primary debate this week, Mayor Pete Buttigieg made an argument that generated some applause from the audience. “It is time to stop worrying about what the Republicans will say,” the candidate said. “Look, it’s true that if we embrace a far-left agenda, they’re going to say we’re a bunch of crazy socialists. If we embrace a conservative agenda, you know what they’re going to do? They’re going to say we’re a bunch of crazy socialists.”
Buttigieg added, “So let’s just stand up for the right policy, go out there, and defend it.”
I don’t know if Sen. John Kennedy (R-La.) saw the mayor’s comments, but soon after, the Republican lawmaker helped demonstrate Buttigieg’s point.
jl
@Adam L Silverman: dude, to give a detailed analysis like that of that batshit insane discussion, you got at least a tiny bit of body builder in your psyche. Not that there is anything wrong with that.
But I do too, Takes one to know one.
JPL
@rikyrah: You mean that she is dating a foreigner… hmmm
Frankensteinbeck
@Eric U:
Yes. Race started the abortion war, and continues to be a major part of it because of demented stereotypes evangelicals believe about black women. Race drives a lot of stuff about cutting regulations and handing more power to the rich to abuse their workers, because the racists want no restrictions on the ability of the strong to hurt the weak. Plutocrats and white supremacists are an easy alliance to make. Of course, it helps that racism flourishes thick and hot in the economic upper classes.
Just One More Canuck
@Suzanne: Yes, being racist is okay with them, but being called a racist is beyond the pale
Steve in the ATL
@rikyrah: translation: her grades are so bad that she couldn’t get a 2L summer associate job
Martin
To play off of Andrew Gillums wonderful statement “Now, I’m not calling Mr. Desantis a racist. I’m simply saying the racists believe he’s a racist.”
We don’t need to say we believe Trumps base is racist, Trump believes his base is racist. He wouldn’t be saying these things and claiming that it’ll turn out his vote if he didn’t think they were all racists. It’s up to voters to demonstrate whether they agree with him or not.
Roger Moore
@JPL:
Count me among those who thinks that if Pence is put out to pasture some member of the Trump clan- either Ivanka or possibly Jared- will replace him on the ticket. Trump wants to turn the Presidency into a monarchy, and I don’t expect him to accept anything less than being succeeded by his progeny as the end state of the process.
germy
@JPL: Isn’t the Daily Mail sort of a racist, far-right newspaper?
MattF
@Adam L Silverman: I understand what you’re saying. But it raises the oddly quantitative question of just how many idiots need to be motivated to action before it becomes incitement. After all, there’s always a group who have just quit taking their meds.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@rikyrah: I remember presidential daughters going to Spain with their mother and it was a scandal…. what’s different now? trying to remember….
jl
@Frankensteinbeck: IMHO, most of major longstanding public debates in US are twisted by racism, often on both sides. Hard to thnk of a major political movement in US history over last 140 years, that at one time or another, has not been influenced by racism and bigotry. Racism and bigotry is the social and political sea we all swim in, sadly.
Martin
That can be implemented as a racist policy, a sexist policy, or tons of other variations. I sometimes wonder if the GOP has so deeply internalized the proposition that when you point out the particular implementation they get angry because they could have chosen other formulations that would be called something other than racist.
Roger Moore
@schrodingers_cat:
This. Whatever group you’re talking about, there will always be a few opportunists who are willing to take the benefits from being the token member of their group to stand with the people oppressing them. Those people should be seen as the tokens they are, not as representative of the group.
Ladyraxterinok
@Suzanne: Family member during GOP 2016 primary said ‘I’m a racist and proud of it!’
Came as no surprise!
Immanentize
I thought it was interesting how Joe Biden argued about criminalization of border crossings. He got rather passionate and said something like “it’s a crime, they are criminals.”. This just tells me internally he believes -+ deeply — that the criminal justice system is the best way to handle unwanted people, just like he did in 1992. No change internally regardless of his soften language on mass incarceration (“unintended consequences”).
Who will be the first to say, “Joe, those are old ideas and this country needs new ideas if we are going to advance”?
ETA emphasizing, “OLD.” I wish I had time to scour his record for comments on those with HIV or AIDS.
The Moar You Know
@Adam L Silverman: That…that bodybuilders thread is the most unbelievable thing I’ve ever read. We are fucked as a nation. Those people can (and hopefully don’t) vote.
JPL
@germy: It’s seldom that I click to them because I thought it was similar to the enquirer.
Roger Moore
@jl:
Not in every group. It’s more like 5-10% among blacks.
The Moar You Know
@germy: By British standards, yes. By ours, it would be banned and burned as liberal filth.
JPL
@Immanentize: In the past if an immigrant crossed illegally and turned themselves in they could ask for amnesty. Joe’s comment concerned me, not as much as trump’s desire to return to pre World War II immigration policies though.
Mike in NC
Saw some poll just today where 83% of Fat Bastard’s cult think using the N word is perfectly A-OK.
Yarrow
@Steve in the ATL: Does she need or even want a summer job? She’s the daughter of the president born into a family of grifters and dating a 25 year old billionaire. Doubt she’s going the regular route when she graduates from law school.
Brachiator
@Martin:
Huh? Trump has been saying shit like this all his life.
Trump is a racist who, beginning with his father, has worked all his life to hurt, denigrate, oppress and mistreat people of color. As president he has pursued a racist, nativist agenda because this represents his core beliefs.
His racism resonates with and is the same as his base. This is not political opportunism. There is no alternate reality in which Trump would not be racist, or would even downplay it.
Worse, as a president without any sense of morality or ethics, he encourages white people to be as openly racist as they like.
chris
Holy crap!Have you seen this? Tulsi needs to go. Now. Far away!
Ladyraxterinok
@Roger Moore: Have said for a long time that if I were black and wanted to make it big in politics I’d become a hard-right activist/spokesperson
jl
@Immanentize: Besides the mind set, I see two problems with Biden’s answer that puts into question his understanding of the issues.
First, if I understand the law correctly, the physical act of crossing the border without proper authorization is a criminal offense, but once they get across, undocumented residency is almost always a civil offense. We gonna go try to try criminal cases for crossing the physical act of illegally crossing the border for the vast majority of immigrants who probably did that in the past? No, it is an infeasible and ridiculous idea.
Second, under Trump, the big issue is with asylum seekers. The majority of them who committed the criminal offense of physically crossing the border without authorization did so, because the Trump administration itself was not following the law in refusing to follow established lawful procedures for admitting asylum seekers at ports of entry. So Biden’s response misses the critical point that the complete entirety of the current immigration crisis is fraudulent. It is entirely due to Trump administration lawlessness and malfeasance, used to create a fraudulent crisis for partisan political purposes and not one single thing more.
Several of the big fights in the very bad no good waste of time night 2 debate yesterday was due to moderators throwing out red herring issues, that are minor points in the bid policy debates, and trying to make a big deal out of them. I don’t know if that was due to moderator incompetence and ignorance, or attempt to work up sensational gotchas, or laziness (they just repeat what some motivated and interested suggestion some pundits or GOP operative fed them).
Biden was supposed be a sophisticated knowledgeable wonk-nerded out expert dude like Obama, but maybe not so much. Some have attributed Biden’s flat footedness to age, but to me, it’s just the same old pre-Obama Biden, who has been that was his whole career.
Chief Oshkosh
@Jeffery:
Maybe. But if he was REALLY a stable genius, he’d pick Clarence Thomas, so that he could then seat yet another USSC Justice. Of course, he’d have to sweeten the deal for Thomas. Maybe a new mega-motorhome gilded in gold?
Southern Goth
@Kay:
There might be a lesson there about discounting persuasion in favor of base turnout.
Then again, it worked so I’m not sure the right one will be drawn.
Yarrow
@chris: Tulsi has a primary challenger, Kai Kahele. You can donate to his campaign.
MattF
@chris: There’s a not-entirely-absurd claim that Gabbard is a Russian troll. I guess this makes that claim somewhat less absurd.
JGabriel
Anne Laurie @ Top:
I’ll say the same thing to this that I say to people who suggest Trump, and Republicans in general, are just “pretending” to be racist to appeal to racist voters, which is:
Any politician who is indifferent enough to racism to “pretend” to be racist … isn’t pretending.
Adam L Silverman
@Timurid: Unfortunately.
Immanentize
@Yarrow:
You are right. Tiffany will probably go from graduation straight to clerking for Alito.
Adam L Silverman
@The Moar You Know: It’s something.
chris
@Yarrow: Nah, my donation would only get him in trouble. Canadian, eh?
Adam L Silverman
@Yarrow: The divorce settlement, provided her mother maintain’s the NDA, gave Maples a couple of million plus child support until Tiffany was 21. I have no idea if the President is paying for her to go to law school.
JaySinWA
@Yarrow:
That is more precise, not necessarily more accurate. /pedant
JPL
@Immanentize: Think big! If Thomas retires next year, trump could nominate her to the Supreme Court.
jl
@JGabriel: More Whites than we like to think bought the rubbish ‘research’, on inherent inferiority of some minorities that was being pushed out back them. That includes supposedly high minded and sophisticated people who didn’t know enough to see that stuff like ‘The Bell Curve’ was very poor quality research.
Another Scott
@Chief Oshkosh: If you believe LOLGOP, Pence is already President. Kinda like Donnie supposedly promising Kasich that he could run the government and domestic policy if he’d agree to be VP.
Donnie wants all the trappings of being God-Emperor. He doesn’t want to actually do the work – so he doesn’t.
Anyone Donnie picks to replace Pence will have some governing experience. It won’t be Thomas (and probably not Carson[)]. I don’t think it would be one of his kids, either (it’s easier for them to steal stuff working in the background). I would expect it to be another boring “Christian” white guy. Maybe Scott Walker. (Shudder!)
My $0.02.
Cheers,
Scott.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Adam L Silverman: Man, he’s a cheap, broke-ass fuck. Wasn’t there something in the Cohen tapes about covering up his divorce settlement with Ivana?
Until proven otherwise, I will continue to believe that Melania used the election to renegotiate her pre-nup, and she’ll get a fat pile of cash when she only files for divorce after he leaves the White House. Or maybe there’s a separate maintenance clause that includes haute couture widow’s weeds. Slightly tin-foil hat corollary: That’s where that missing inauguration money went.
Bill Arnold
@chris:
At the very least, be seriously probed for Russian and/or Republican ties.
Steve in the ATL
@Yarrow: good point, but then what’s the point of going to law school? What will be an unsuccessful attempt to gain respectability?
Chief Oshkosh
@Another Scott: Uh, I was joking about Unka Klarence…
But interesting thought that Dence is actually running the Executive. I don’t see it. Dence is just as dumb and lazy as Donny. I’m pretty sure that nobody overall is running the Executive. I think there’s a handful of self-dealers that are setting policy in their very narrow areas of interest (e.g., Miller on immigration/torturing POC) and then a general office pool that sit around all day screaming at each other because they’ve been tasked by one of the overlords with fixing the latest fuck-up. They come up with mediocrity, start down the road of executing, but Dumb Donny blows it all up with the next tweet. Lather. Rinse. Repeat.
sdhays
@chris: They should start calling her Twitter-bot Tulsi since that’s her only constituency.
SFAW
@Adam L Silverman:
Good Christ, “TheJosh” (in that bodybuilders string) is a fucking moron. I’m amazed we haven’t read about him “winning” a Darwin Award. [Not that we’d know, of course.]
Immanentize
@Steve in the ATL: I ask myself those questions every day.
Matt
@Jerzy Russian:
I’d bet a hundred dollars that same cow-orker thinks businesses should be able to discriminate “because mah religimous FREEDOM”.
SFAW
@Chief Oshkosh:
Umm …
Another Scott
@SFAW: No, no. Gilded in Radner.
Cheers,
Scott.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
as twitter Nixon often reminds us, Jackie Robinson was a Republican stalwart until 1964
in the linked screenshot, “Reagan– even more so than Nixon–” is the candidate of “white backlashers”
jl
@Immanentize: lawyers? Respectability? I don’t get that one. Good lawyer jokes have been big hits at least since Shakespeare’s time. Probably back to ancient Rome and Athens, but I’ll have to go check.
rikyrah
???
Charlotte Alter (@CharlotteAlter) Tweeted:
Talked to a gentleman last night who said he supports Biden but could never forgive Hillary for creating mandatory minimums and 3 strikes laws.
When I told him those policies were actually in Biden’s 1994 crime bill, he said “We all make mistakes in life.” https://twitter.com/CharlotteAlter/status/1156934702193958912?s=17
jl
@SFAW: “gilded in gold?”
Just shows that the commenter really understands Trump. Gilded in gold is a lot classier and more terrific than just gilded. Just gilded is for betas, cucks ad losers.
Edit: I thought I typed the correct word, ‘crassier’, but I’ll let the typo stand.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@rikyrah: among Bernie supporters, polls show their second choice is Biden.
TBF, this was before Warren went all in on single payer, so that may change. I wouldn’t bet on it, but it might.
ETA: This is from June 10, but googling to find it I see some headlines suggesting that is changing. We’ll see in a week or so where things shake out.
clay
@john not mccain: If the Dems were truly willing to go down into the muck, they should send some people to infiltrate a Trump rally and see if they could get an “n-word” chant to start in the crowd.
Just One More Canuck
@The Moar You Know: That was ….. special.
I hope they don’t breed
Betty Cracker
@jl: I was just running an errand in town and heard live coverage of Biden talking to reporters in Michigan. Twice, he used the not-word “expedentially” when he meant “exponentially.” Then, he was talking about getting a benefit for veterans whereby they don’t have to prove exposure to “acid rain.” From the context, I’m sure he meant “Agent Orange,” but again, he said the wrong thing, twice.
Gotta admit, it shook me a bit. Biden has always been gaffe-prone, and I never got the impression he was the sharpest knife in the drawer, but he was affable and capable enough, and I didn’t worry he was going to fuck up a consequential election. I thought he sounded okay on the stage last night. I didn’t agree with much of what he said, but he seemed fully in control of his faculties.
Today, he sounded addled. That worries me. A lot.
Brachiator
@Yarrow:
According to the Daily Mail (quoted earlier here), she has that most envied and coveted non-job: socialite.
JPL
@Chief Oshkosh: Stephen Miller..
Another Scott
@Yarrow: Thanks for the pointer.
Donated.
Cheers,
Scott.
joel hanes
@Eric U:
It was pretty obvious at the time that Reagan was racist.
It was very obvious while he was Governor of California, and was part of his appeal to California Republicans of the time.
Dogwhistled, mostly.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Oy. That is not good. And I’m one who’s been dismissive of concerns about Biden’s age.
People age differently. I hate Bernie, but I don’t see any signs of slow down or fatigue, and he’s a year older than Biden. I have seen grief, in particular the grief of a parent losing a child, take a physical toll.
JPL
@Betty Cracker: IMO Biden will put forward a sharp team, so the worry should be whether or not he listens to them.
Villago Delenda Est
This is an excellent analogy, Anne. Bravo!
Martin
@Brachiator:
Trust me, I know. But only now does he claim that saying it is what will bring his voters to the polls. Before the argument was that Republicans would vote for him despite his racism. Now his argument is that they’ll vote for him because of the racism. There’s a big difference in attitude there.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@JPL: I think Ron Klain is Biden’s brain, and from what I read he’s a legend among DC staffers. When people give Biden credit for implementing the ARRA, or when they say the ‘glitches’ in the ACA launch wouldn’t have happened if Biden had been in charge, they’re talking about Klain.
Whoever’s talking to Biden when the doors are closed, they couldn’t get him to stop talking about James Fucking Eastland (as I believe his headstone reads), so who knows….
And I am far from being never-Biden, but this shit– the stubbornness, the senior moments, some degree of entitlement– is worrying
Martin
@Eric U: What you think launching his campaign in Philadelphia, Mississippi might have had motives other than securing the votes of the [Googles] 7,400 residents of that fine town?
joel hanes
@JPL:
In the past if an immigrant crossed illegally and turned themselves in they could ask for amnesty.
In the past, asylum-seekers were allowed to enter legally at ports of entry.
Trump/Border Patrol seek to close off that course, diverting would-be immigrants into illegal crossing, since that’s the only avenue that is available from where they stand. The Trumpists have deliberately created this “crisis” to use as tinder for the flames of xenophobic demagoguery.
jl
@Betty Cracker: Could be age (though whether you like him or not, don’t hear many flubs like that from Sanders) , or we need to go back and look at old clips of Biden to see exactly how mediocre his performances were in the past.
OTOH, it could just be lack of preparation. I think he thought he could run and win no prob on his Obama era ‘Uncle Joe’ persona and a cover band nostalgia tour campaign. Biden camp didn’t put out any policy proposals until they were more or less forced to because of all the attacks on his record, which I think in large part were due to fact that there really wasn’t anything else to talk about wrt to his campaign. And his proposals are not all that impressive or innovative compared to several other candidates, in addition to Warren. A couple of them look stuck in the 90s. Lack of preparation will mess a person up good during extemporaneous talks.
But, what you heard is concerning, whatever the reason.
TenguPhule
Wheeeeeee!
Chetan Murthy
@joel hanes:
Furthermore, IIRC the mere fact of having crossed at a not-official-port-of-entry does not debar an an immigrant from claiming asylum. The method by which they arrived on our soil is irrelevant to the claim of asylum.
TenguPhule
Called it. Trump lied about everything. Now China is going to eat our lunch.
SFAW
@jl:
To-MAY-toe, po-TAH-toe
joel hanes
@MattF:
a not-entirely-absurd claim that Gabbard is a Russian troll
In my estimate, an unwitting tool.
It is quite noticeable that, immediately after she’s in the news, comment sections and social media threads are flooded by Gabbard stans with very very short comment histories.
TenguPhule
But I’m sure we won’t regret giving Trump and McConnell what they want. //S
germy
@Immanentize:
Too much work. She’ll got right from graduation into her new role as Television Political Pundit.
gene108
Unapologetic use of the N-word in public has already begun.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.wral.com/i-would-say-it-again-says-woman-who-used-racial-slur-in-north-hills-restaurant-confrontation/18530118/%3fversion=amp
joel hanes
@Another Scott:
Donnie wants all the trappings of being God-Emperor
Ah. I’m in favor of conducting the biological experiment in which he tries to incorporate sandworm tissue into his exterior surface.
SFAW
@TenguPhule:
My head just done a-sploded. Powell’s probably already did.
I keep waiting for someone to tell the Dumbfuck-in-Chief that Obama NEVER drank antifreeze, because he believed it would harm him.
Martin
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: To me, it’s the attitude that the political fights of the 80s and 90s are still the fights we’re having today. We have an entire generation of people afraid to have kids because they don’t think there will be a habitable planet for them to grow into.
Not only are the politics very different, the urgency of those politics is completely different. Michael Moore was on MSNBC last night and I think got it completely right. 40 million young people have turned into voters since Obama got elected. 20% of the electorate has no concept of politics pre-2008. Over a third of the electorate couldn’t vote on 9/11. They don’t give a single fuck about how compromise was reached in 1978, or how incrementalist approaches worked post-war. Their entire political experience is trillions dumped into unjust wars, and ideological wars fought over the free market and role of government that can be measured in human lives. They want healthcare. They don’t fucking care how it happens.
Generally I like Joe, and I’m not saying he isn’t liberal enough or whatever, I’m saying he has no understanding of how half the 2020 democratic electorate and all of the 2040 democratic electorate see the world. He thinks his DC experience trumps the world these people have seen through their own eyes. It doesn’t.
TenguPhule
@SFAW: DOW looks like an iceberg off of Greenland.
Chief Oshkosh
@Another Scott: Gave me a chuckle, thanks. Hey, they’re not ALL home runs. Or even bloopers.
joel hanes
@jl:
I would have to fake being upset if Trump were to be crowned with a golden crown — in exactly the same manner as was Viserys Targareyn
WILLY WONKA : Stop. Don’t. Come back.
Villago Delenda Est
@joel hanes: Ayup.
JPL
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: That along with labeling anyone who crosses the border as a criminal is worrying. If he is the one that can beat trump, I’m all in.
joel hanes
@Martin:
To be scrupulously fair, Reagan spoke at the Neshoba County Fair, which is a huge deal, one of the premier yearly events for white people in that entire region of Mississippi.
Bill Arnold
@SFAW:
Mine too. I was sorta-hoping that they’d back off a bit from trade war with China once they got a rate cut from the Fed.
No such luck. Now, it’s either just breathtaking DJT[or ear-whisperer] stupidity or [Trump or some Trump ear-whisperer] with a short position on the US economy. Or maybe both. Any alternate explanations?
Who (if anyone) has DJT’s ear on trade war matters these days? I’ve lost track.
JPL
@TenguPhule: Home construction is once again gonna stall because of the cost of goods, isn’t it.
Frankensteinbeck
@joel hanes:
Thankfully, we now have audiotape of Reagan calling African UN delegates monkeys, so we don’t have to be fair at all.
joel hanes
@Chetan Murthy:
having crossed at a not-official-port-of-entry does not debar an an immigrant from claiming asylum.
You are arguing the law.
Trump/BP/ICE are bellowing while pounding
the tablebrown people.I’m pretty sure that, now, in practical reality, illegal entry is treated as completely disqualifying, at least until that day, years from now, when an immigratinon “court” gets a chance to rule on the application (assuming that the would-be immigrant is even allowed to apply).
TenguPhule
@JPL:
Magic 8-Ball says: Outlook Cloudy.
Martin
@TenguPhule: So, here’s a realtime take on Trumps actions.
My wife and I have been discussing selling off a bit of our investments to buy a new car as they’ve been up the last two weeks. We were chatting about it 2 hours ago, probably would make the decision this evening. Since 2 hours ago, our investments fell $35K, so now we’re not buying a new car.
Sorry Ohio blue collar workers, no money going your way after all.
TenguPhule
@joel hanes:
You haven’t been keeping up. They’re dispensing with due process. No courts, just straight to deportation.
Chetan Murthy
@JPL:
Not sure what you mean, but I remember all those stories right after the last boom, about the shitty shitty Chinese gypsum drywall that outgassed H2S and had to be ripped-out.
Another Scott
@Bill Arnold: Donnie’s idea of negotiation is for the other guy to completely capitulate.
Remember his supposed “10 times harder” mantra.
He’s not going to give up on attempting to punish China, Huawei, European auto exporters, Amazon/Bezos/WashingtonPost, Iran, etc., etc. He thinks that he has the stronger hand, and doesn’t care if the US and world economies are damaged by his petulance. He wants fealty – that’s all he care about.
Of course, other countries have their own interests and power centers that he doesn’t understand…
Grr…
Cheers,
Scott.
joel hanes
@Frankensteinbeck:
I was being sarcastic.
Please note the words “white” and “Mississippi” in my comment.
Should have used the font or the tag. apologies.
Martin
@Bill Arnold:
Peter Navarro. He’s a fucking idiot, and has been a fucking idiot for decades. He’s the Art Laffer of trade policy.
Frankensteinbeck
@joel hanes:
I completely missed your sarcasm, so you have MY apologies.
Just One More Canuck
@jl: @SFAW: how about “gelded in gold”
joel hanes
@Another Scott:
He wants fealty
This.
Trump wants everyone else to bend the knee, and surrounds himself with Kettleblacks and Slynts who are only too eager to do so.
He’s a much-less-intelligent Cersei.
Bill Arnold
@joel hanes:
The God-Emperor in Dune at least had some deity-like capabilities, namely the ability to select/bake-in history in a not-inconsiderable part of the universe. D.J. Trump has no such talent. (He thinks he does have some such talent, though. Which is amusing; not sure the Abrahamic monotheistic fundamentalists truly realize this.)
Chetan Murthy
@joel hanes:
I thought that was plennnty obvious. No need for sarc tag.
joel hanes
CerseiJoffreyfixed
Omnes Omnibus
@Immanentize: Biden did draw a very clear line between asylum seekers and ordinary immigration.
JPL
@Chetan Murthy: True.. Maybe it won’t be too bad because most lumber and steel comes from Canada..right?
kindness
I’m not shocked to see Trump running on racism & white nationalism (and fascism). I’m shocked that our media is so caught up in ratings they aren’t paying attention to the actual racism, white nationalism and neo-fascist behaviours of not only Trump but the entire Republican party. They are giving this a pass as they proclaim Democrats are trying to make a campaign issue of it.
This isn’t going to end well. The only way we come out of it OK is if there is a massive landslide against Trump and Republicans. That media of ours? They want to appear as ‘balanced’, no matter that one of the points of balance is the Klan.
jl
@TenguPhule: The Fed chair Powell (whom Trump chose because a competent person was slipped past him somehow) also stated that interest rate cuts could not beat additional tariff war nonsense, and trying to compensate for them would create a dangerous situation in the next downturn. Also, Powell’s rationale for the interest rate cuts (downturn in investment and weakness in manufacturing, and lack of increase in real worker compensation) is another way of saying that the Trump rich man’s tax cut did not do one damn thing the GOP claimed it would in terms of increasing US productivity or increasing workers’ income.
Not sure if Powell was so explicit because he wanted to make public dig at Trump. I think Trump is too oblivious and ignorant to notice, but let’s watch his tweets. But then Trump also may not notice because he will be still rampaging around with his race hate tweets.
germy
https://www.theroot.com/warped-flip-flop-tomi-lahren-apologizes-for-tweeting-se-1836883780
Villago Delenda Est
@kindness: I’m not surprised about the media reaction at all. They’re all ratings whores, and all should be summarily deported to the sun on Space-X.
Frankensteinbeck
@Another Scott:
Under the thumb of a pathological liar who changes his positions every five minutes, we have had time and a chance to see what Trump actually believes and cares about, by the things he is consistent on and indeed doubles down on over time. He wants concentration camps, specifically wants children separated from their parents at the border, and wants to end all Southern border immigration. He believes tariffs, and specifically punishing tariffs, are the best tool for trade negotiation. He likes murderous dictators on a personal level. He likes Nazis on a personal level.
Bill Arnold
@Martin:
But does he whisper sweet trade-war-related-praises in D.J. Trumps’s ear?
I’d managed to forget about this (from 2018):
After Defeating Cohn, Trump’s Trade Warrior Is on the Rise Again
(Peter Coy 2018/03/08) (bold mine>
TenguPhule
@Villago Delenda Est:
Once again, Venus is closer and more affordable.
opiejeanne
@rikyrah: That poor child takes after daddy, in looks anyway.
TenguPhule
This outsourcing of asylum processing will not end well at all.
TenguPhule
Fingers crossed.
Betty Cracker
@germy: IMO, the whole thing was staged — Tami’s dumb tweet, her Fox colleagues’ fake outrage, and now the phony apology.
JPL
@TenguPhule: What?
(((CassandraLeo)))
@Frankensteinbeck: For future reference, “to be Scrupulously Fair” is usually used both here and on LGM for bits of “mitigating” evidence that don’t actually mitigate a thing. It’s almost always a sign of sarcasm, much like // at the end of posts here or monospaced text on LGM.
germy
@Betty Cracker:
germy
TenguPhule
@JPL: Asylum seekers passing through that country will be sent back there for processing should they be picked up at the US border.
Yes, its as bad as it sounds.
Betty Cracker
@Martin: I turned to MSNBC briefly after the debate and saw Michael Moore babbling about Michelle Obama running for president, so I changed the channel. I can’t stand that fucking gasbag. But I agree with your paraphrase of his remarks about how younger folks see politics. It’s true of my daughter, who barely remembers the GWB era at all (except her father and me cursing at the TV) and has zero memory of the 20th century, which she caught the tail end of as an infant.
Matt McIrvin
@jl: Trump’s overall approval isn’t dropping, though. It’s pretty much flat. (Right now it appears that both his approval and disapproval are rising slightly– the few who hadn’t taken sides are taking sides– but the movement is so small it could just be noise.)
JPL
@TenguPhule: Trump still won’t hand over documents. He’ll let it play out and court and count on Kavenaugh to save him.
Ellen R
@Martin: Where is this quote from? Who and when? Thanks –
chopper
@germy:
wow, harris ‘slept her way’ into the AG job? that’s a hell of a lot of voters to have sex with.
Another Scott
@Chief Oshkosh: Joke here often go over my head. ;-)
For completeness, LOLGOP’s opinion piece at USAToday (from June 9):
FWIW.
Cheers,
Scott.
chris
So I go out for a walk in the heat, come home to get my swimming gear on the way to the river and see that the shitgibbon has mangled the markets again. On the bright side, cheaper gas, RBOB gas futures off 10 cents a gallon, crude oil off $4+ a barrel. Can someone subpoena the stock trading records of Wilbur, Mnuchin, Jarvanka et al? Some folks made out like bandits the last couple of days.
germy
@chopper: You know how republicans project. Every accusation… etc.
eclare
@Betty Cracker: He fucked up naming his own web site last night. I’m sorry, going from 74 to 76 is not like going from 68 to 70, as most people get older, aging is not linear. At least that is what I observed with my parents.
sdhays
@TenguPhule: I find it bizarre and really fraudulent that we call them “courts” when they’re actually Justice Department tribunals and aren’t part of the actual Federal court system. It’s a lie. If the Attorney General gets to fire you if you don’t interpret the law his way, you’re not actually a judge.
David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch
@Martin: They tried to pass single payer in deep, deep blue Vermont three short years ago and it failed. They replaced the Democratic governor with a …. wait for it… a republican. It used to be a liberal value that those who do not heed history are condemned to repeat it.
Martin
@Ellen R: Comment here: http://crookedtimber.org/2018/03/21/liberals-against-progressives/#comment-729288
The whole comment is spot-on.
joel hanes
@germy:
There are now 117 members of the House who favor starting an impeachment inquiry
So only 111 (at least) to go before a resolution will pass, and we’d want a couple more for safety.
It’s no wonder that whip-count Pelosi has not been publicly enthusiastic about an immediate assault on the citadel.
Martin
@David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch: It failed because Vermont is too small to pull it off. That is not a condemnation of the idea.
The Moar You Know
@Martin: Used to hear him on KNX a lot. He was your typical conservative economist. Made sense most of the time, within the genre of course. Then in late 2008, FOR NO REASON, he seemed to go completely insane. I quit listening to KNX a few years later, because oddly enough, most of the other folks at the station seemed to go from straight news to one step below Fox, FOR NO REASON I AM SURE.
Last time I heard him, and I stopped listening to KNX for good right after the 2012 elections, he was one step below Glenn Beck in the “lost my shit completely” department.
It’s a damn tragedy what happened to KNX. Their old management would never have allowed them to become what they are.
Sab
@Yarrow: chris is Canadian. He cannot legally donate and they cannot legally accept his money.
Baud
@Betty Cracker:
Whether your daughter understands it or not, the old days still hamper us through the mechanism of high-turnout old people.
germy
@The Moar You Know:
Hmm. What was it that happened in late 2008? I’m stumped. What sent him around the bend?
sdhays
I don’t understand why the fraudulence of our current medical system doesn’t get more discussion. There are no prices for anything. Everything is about gaming the system. Supposedly it all evens out eventually, but it’s expensive and EXHAUSTING (and it doesn’t even out for everyone). The insurance companies won’t tell you what you have to pay for something, even though they know. There is so much skimming waste that makes the system difficult to navigate and clearly wasteful that it’s just disgusting. Why does it have to be this way? It’s not even clear who benefits from it because many times it’s not the hospitals or the insurance companies even pocketing the waste. But they protect it. Why?
I would think a simplification argument could be compelling for a lot of people.
Roger Moore
@Another Scott:
I think there’s another mistake buried in the whole “if we impeach Trump we’ll have President Pence” nonsense: the assumption that Pence wouldn’t be politically damaged by the process. Seriously, if Trump becomes so politically that Moscow Mitch and 19 other Senate Republicans vote to throw him out of office, everyone around him is going to be untouchable, too. The only way Trump leaves office before the election that doesn’t damage Pence is feet first.
sdhays
@Roger Moore: Yep.
LeeM
@Steve in the ATL: To be fair, she had lined up a job at Cohen & Associates.
Shana
@rikyrah: What kind of law student doesn’t have a summer associate job? Especially after the 2nd year of law school when everyone’s trying for a prestigious summer job that they can hopefully turn into an offer of a real job after their 3rd and final year of law school?
catclub
@Sab: establish a corporation, have corporation give to National chamber of commerce, or NRA, and tell them to send it where ‘it isn’t legal for non-US citizens to contribute’
Brachiator
@Omnes Omnibus:
And Trump is trying to shift the terms of the debate. Pushing it further than even anti-immigrant Republcans originally wanted.
TenguPhule
Wapo headline.
Barbara
@schrodingers_cat: Agreed — it’s definitely painting with way too broad a brush. I mean, seriously. I think what Seema Verma, Nikki Haley and Bobbi Jindal have in common is that they are ambitious, believe in the free market, and realized pretty quickly that given the states they live in, the only path forward was through Republican politics. I don’t think by any means they are guarding some kind of secret liberal view of the world, but they have also tried to cultivate a reputation for being policy wonks and pragmatists not barn burners. I almost never agree with the logic of their policy positions, and tolerating racism in their midst underscores their lack of moral courage. But they aren’t stupid.
Roger Moore
@sdhays:
My gut feeling is that a lot of the waste in our medical system is an example of a market failure. There’s a whole arms race between medical offices trying to figure out how to maximize their billing and insurance companies figuring out how to refuse to pay. The net result is that every medical office needs to hire a billing specialist and every insurance company needs an office full of counter-specialists. It’s incredibly inefficient and completely a result of the inherently adversarial nature of the relationship between medical practices and insurance companies. IMO it’s one of the huge advantages of integrated payer/provider organizations like Kaiser.
Betty Cracker
@Baud: Neither group can afford to treat the other as irrelevant.
@eclare: Oof, you’re right — I forgot about that.
Brachiator
@Betty Cracker:
This makes me feel so old!
But you’re exactly right. My niece and nephew are children of the 21st century. What came before is ancient history.
EthylEster
@laura1:
which is the lesser?
I thought the earlier one was better than his clueless son.
Baud
@Betty Cracker:
Agree. It’s why I think intergenerational warfare is counterproductive for people on the left. (The right doesn’t really have this because they are unified by a common hatred of us.)
TenguPhule
What could possibly go wrong? //s
Matt McIrvin
@Betty Cracker: My daughter is almost a teenager; the first President she remembers is Obama, and 9/11 is a historical event from before she was born that she learned about in school, roughly equivalent to my experience of the JFK assassination.
Hoodie
@Martin: Said something to the same effect on LGM a few days ago. The comment you cite says “anti-conservatism” could be boiled down to “The law cannot protect anyone unless it binds everyone; and it cannot bind anyone unless it protects everyone.” That really amounts to justice, right? I’ve been thinking that the straightest road to beating Trump and what he represents is attacking corruption, and everything else is a bit of a sideshow. Sanders and Warren seem to be channeling that theme the most, but they seem to get caught up in the details of particular plans.
Another Scott
One for OO and the lawyer-types – GovExec:
Good, good. We have to support push-back on every attempt by Donnie’s minions to destroy previous norms.
Cheers,
Scott.
David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch
speaking of the budget, just two weeks ago bloggers were saying it was the worst deal evah! Turns out AOC, Tlaib, Barbara Lee, Sherrod Brown, Merkely all voted for it. Bunch of neoliberal sell outs
Brachiator
@Martin:
This was denial. This was part of the lie that Republcan voters were economically anxious. Also, people didn’t know full Trump. So, people were going to vote for him despite his racism, sexism, lack of real religion, etc. Some Republicans weren’t even sure that he was a “true” conservative.
The pundits and Republican politicians pretend that they don’t know what is happening, but Trump is more blatantly racist than before. Neither Trump nor his base have to pretend any more.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
I didn’t even know Waddles was having another 60 Minute Hate tonight (in Cincinnati)
MSNBC just said trump said on his way out of the White House (have they stopped live coverage of his lie-filled driveway bloviations?) that he said when asked about chants, if they do it, “we’ll see what happens”. Yamiche Alcindor reporting that attendees say they like the chant.
Ruckus
@Kay:
I’d use spokesperson rather than leader, but that’s just details.
Mike in NC
Wrapped up our quicky coach tour of Dublin today without so much as a glass of Guiness or a souvenir T-shirt. The tour guide was great, however, and had us singing along to “Molly Malone” before we finished up.
Underway shortly for the Welsh port of Holyhead (pronounced Holly Head) 500 nm directly across the Irish Sea where some tour options offer 20-50 mile drives to check out castles and/or ruins. Uh, no. We’ll stick closer to the port. Then on to Belfast and Liverpool. I’m a bit too young to remember the Beatles, so will they be on hand to sign autographs? /s
Brachiator
@Matt McIrvin:
I guess I am an old geezer. I was a school kid, in Dallas, when JFK was assassinated. This event is a memory, not history.
EthylEster
@Martin:
I guess I missed that memo.
An entire generation, you say?
David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch
hoooooooooooooooooocoooonode that tariffs were a bad idea.
Tehanu
That quote leaves out “white suburban voters with fairly decent jobs and assets who pretend even to themselves that they’re not racists.” There are letters in the LA Times practically every day from these people, who mostly live in affluent pretty-much-all-white areas like Santa Clarita and Newport Beach, decrying the “unfairness” of calling Dump a racist and claiming there’s no “real evidence” for it. (And I use the word “people” advisedly….)
Steve in the ATL
@Mike in NC: I thought Liverpool was best known for Echo and the Bunnymen. I’ll have to look into this Beatles outfit; maybe they’re on Spotify.
Dorothy A. Winsor
A Ghost To Most
@Brachiator:
Oh yeah. I was in 2nd grade.
Many memories have faded, but not that one.
Omnes Omnibus
@Steve in the ATL: Gerry and the Pacemakers.
Martin
@The Moar You Know: I’ve known him for 25 years. He’s always been batshit. The econ dept disowned him ages ago. He just knew how to put on a good show on the radio.
When he was announced everyone here cheered, and then realized what the cost of getting rid of him was. Sorry y’all.
PaulWartenberg
By the by, around 1:30 PM today trump announced a $300 billion tariff on China starting on September 1.
You can see the exact moment the word reached the New York Stock Exchange by how steep the drop on the Dow tracker is.
Remember when people laughed at George Lucas’ writing about the start of the Star Wars saga was a trade war over Naboo in the Phantom Menace? We are living in the Clone Wars phase of the Fall of the Republic, people.
TenguPhule
@PaulWartenberg:
This is how a democracy dies, to thunderous applause.
Lucas was shit at writing plot, but he managed some epic quotes.
PaulWartenberg
@Brachiator:
By the time we get to high school, it’s ancient history to us.
I was born in 1970 but by the time I was in the 11th grade we were learning the Moon Landing and Woodstock like they were happening closer to World War II than the Iranian hostage crisis.
chris
@Sab:
Are we sure about the legal thing any more? I mean, it’s not like I’m a Russian.
EthylEster
@Martin:
I guess I missed that memo/article.
An entire generation, you say?
Omnes Omnibus
@Brachiator: I am not sure how that relates to my comment.
EthylEster
@germy:
There was an election in November of that year, IIRC.
But maybe you’re snarking.
lurker dean
@Adam L Silverman: that’s pretty hilarious. i’d hate to be his employer trying to figure out vacation days :D
Martin
@Roger Moore:
It is the definition of a market failure. The whole theory behind the free market is that the lightly or unregulated market, open to any and all, will generate a collective wisdom and efficiency through experimentation and failure. If after a century the medical system can’t get its shit together, then it never will. And it never will for fairly apparent (once you learn to look for them) reasons. For one, half the industry is rent seeking on human lives.
A fundamental element of a free market is one that consumers are free to not participate in. Consumers are not morally or in some cases legally free to not participate in the health care system. Try not taking your kid to the doctor when they’re sick and see how long they remain your kid. Because we can’t opt out, it’s a captive market which hospitals and some other providers can basically charge whatever they want for care. Basic free market principles say that the health care market cannot function, and it has had all of the room it needs to prove them wrong, and failed.
That’s why single payer is inevitable. Either we’ll discover the political will to do it, or we’ll bankrupt ourselves avoiding it.
James E Powell
@Omnes Omnibus:
I see your Ferry Cross the Mersey and raise you Space Age Love Song
Yarrow
@Sab: Others may find the link interesting and useful even if chris cannot donate.
@chris: But are you a billionaire?
The Moar You Know
@Brachiator: You’d be right about my parent’s age. I wasn’t born for six more years. I know about Kennedy for two reasons: the “we shall put a man on the moon before this decade is out” quote, and him getting shot. That’s it.
If you can put your head into the lived experience of an 18 year old kid today, you’d have a lot fewer reasons to be hopeful about the future of this country and the world then we do.
Ruckus
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
It’s really worrying this far away from the election and thinking about 4yrs after that……
Joe isn’t much older than me and I see me slowing down. Sure some are great over a decade older than Joe but that’s a pretty small sample size to risk the chance that he’s in it. And BS? All he does is shout. That could be just a case of bad hearing. Hmm…. He was really doesn’t listen much at all does he?
Martin
@EthylEster: https://www.businessinsider.com/millennials-americans-worry-about-kids-children-climate-change-poll-2019-3
The Moar You Know
@Martin: None of these things surprise me. The people who lost their shit when Obama got elected just didn’t suddenly decide to become racists.
Ruckus
@The Moar You Know:
How much of that is exposure of modern life, against a far slower and less wide exposure of 50-60 years ago?
David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch
So about 11 million watched on tee vee and another 3 million watched online, with another combined 10 million watching the first night. That means 24 million watched the combined debates. Pretty good.
Betty Cracker
@David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch: God willing, we’ll all still be around to marvel about that deal’s awesomeness when Congress dumps a load of shit on Madam President’s head in 2021.
David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch
@germy: it’s well know that tan suits trigger people.
The Moar You Know
@lurker dean: I have had an unbelievably shitty last couple of weeks and your comment about Josh’s vacation days is the first thing that has made me laugh out loud in quite a while, so thank you.
MisterForkbeard
@David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch: Not quite, right? There’s going to be a substantial overlap between the audiences for each debate. Probably only 12-14 million unique viewers.
CarolDuhart2
@Martin: It can’t be for another reason. There’s no way to calibrate it to income. If I need a car, I don’t have to buy a Porsche. A used Subaru or Toyota is fine. And of course, in a lot of places, there’s still a transit system of sorts. But if a heart transplant is needed, there’s no substitute for that., no cut rate possible. And the need is indifferent to income, age or any of that. Also a lot of medical stuff is immediate-there’s no way to shop around even if it were a thing. And you have to trust your providers that they are reasonable competent.
Now there way be something in primary care. In long-term stuff where one can compare and ask around for quality. But cost? Who knows? And a lot of cases are different and have complicating factors as well.
chris
@Yarrow: Nope, but for few more days I’m a hundredaire.
The Moar You Know
@Ruckus: I’m not sure how to answer this and will probably not say it properly, but here’s my go:
I don’t think that they’re suffering cognitive overload, let’s put it that way. They’re better at tuning things out than people my age, which is good. They need to be good at that. They have different challenges but not more of them. Just different.
Sab
@Yarrow: I agree. Thank you.
Gelfling 545
@Adam L Silverman: When I was teaching the school district was in a quandary about state mandates requiring x number of minutes weekly for “special” subjects, i.e. not English & math. They would have had to hire additional teachers to meet the mandate. What to do? What to do? Easy. They redefined the week as having 6 days – A-F instead of Mon-Fri. Got away with it too.
David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch
@Betty Cracker: Increasing discretionary spending by $324 Billion over 2 years used to be awesome.
What’s that FDR quote, “judge me by my opponents”. Bill must be awesome if it’s opposed by Tom Cotton and Rick Scott.
Sab
@chris: That’s why you can’t donate.
Brachiator
@The Moar You Know:
I don’t know. The McCarthy era was a time of fear and oppression. This was followed by an era of activism. By many measures, 1968 was one of the most pivotal years in the modern era, and not just in America, but globally.
This miserable era of Trump, and now Boris Johnson, is a very challenging time. And even though I think he is an annoying piece of crap, I find it interesting that so many young people are still drawn to Bernie, and are fired up. And a lot of young women have been and continue to be energized and politically active.
The kids are still alright.
pinacacci
@rikyrah:@rikyrah: love you but must call you out on this one: Don’t looks-shame a girl who’s chunkier than her mother. Just don’t do that.
David Evans
@jl: It’s in Shakespeare too. King John Act 4 Scene 2
To gild refined gold, to paint the lily,
To throw a perfume on the violet,
To smooth the ice, or add another hue
Unto the rainbow, or with taper-light
To seek the beauteous eye of heaven to garnish,
Is wasteful and ridiculous excess.
Betty Cracker
@David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch: It’s pointless to argue about it now; just pointing out (since you brought it up with customary graciousness) that this bill that was negotiated from a position of maximum leverage expires just in time to hog-tie the newly inaugurated Democrat. We damned well better get Congress too.
Mandalay
Nobody could have predicted the first 20 minutes of Wolf Blitzer this evening: Why do all the Democratic candidates except Joe Biden hate the legacy of Barack Obama?…
burnt
Delurking to write I avoided reading the body-builder days-in-a-week thread. I tried. I really tried. However, after reading all the comments referencing it I dived in. It was worth it. I think my understanding of the world has been fundamentally altered–and I laughed as well. Thank you TheJosh. I believe body building is not your calling. I believe the construction of koans is your one true path. I was never a body builder but as someone who lifted a lot in the service of other sports I must say TheJosh made more sense to me than he might have otherwise.
Kay
4 years later the Cincinnati Enquirer still believes Trump and the low quality hires will actually do some work:
He’ll probably lie and say he replaced the bridge.
Suzanne
@Brachiator: Tiffany is looking to marry well. She doesn’t need need a summer job for that. There are lots of women who have rich parents who go to law school and never have significant careers. Maybe they work until they get married, maybe they never work at all. It has nothing to do with intellect or grades. They go to law school to expand their social network and to stay busy in a status-y way.
Shit, this actually sounds like a great life path. If I could just go to school and then be a full-time home person, I would do it in a heartbeat.
Kay
Cincinnati Trump supporters are still waiting for “the builder” to build them a bridge. “In 2 weeks!” For the last 4 years.
That contractor you hired isn’t coming. You paid him upfront and he’s down the road.
debbie
@JPL:
I think it’s Ivanka.
Kay
The complete failure of the low quality Trump hires to do infrastructure is really the dumbest thing. Had they passed an infrastructure bill something would have gotten built, even despite their incompetence and corruption. They could point to projects all over the country and even if you hated them the thing would EXIST- there would be no denying it.
Instead they did tax cuts and racism and corruption, and 44,000 tweets.
Steve in the ATL
@Suzanne: my college roommate’s mother did this!
J R in WV
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
How about because Nikki doesn’t have even that single drop of African blood, being the child of parents from the south Asian nation of India? Just a wild guess on my part…
Omnes Omnibus
@Suzanne: There were several people following that path in my law school class. It gave them something to do while their fiancé finished his residency and the announcements in the paper look better too
Steve in the ATL
@Sab: what if I were Chinese? I don’t recall St. Reagan getting in trouble when Chinese nationals brought suitcases containing millions of dollars in cash to his campaign headquarters in California.
Roger Moore
@CarolDuhart2:
What’s supposed to happen in our system is that consumers shop for insurance and the insurance companies shop for medical providers. That kind of indirect comparison shopping can work, provided there is reasonable regulation. It seems to work in countries like Germany that achieve universal coverage by requiring everyone to buy it. I don’t think it’s as efficient as single payer or NHS, but it certainly can work.
frosty
@Steve in the ATL: Echo and the Bunnymen? Never heard of ’em. Gerry and the Pacemakers, now, they’re totally Liverpool. Ferry Cross the Mersey and all that.
ETA I think these Beatles chaps might have had a Liverpudlian song or two. Wasn’t Penny Lane somewhere around there? /s
MisterForkbeard
@Suzanne: Yep. I knew a child development major who was basically doing this. She went to a really good liberal arts & business college, and her plan was to learn something useful for her life as a wife/mother while she met additional people and broadened her social circle to find a good husband.
Her fallback in case of not finding anyone was to work with children with disabilities and keep up the social aspect with the connections she’d made at school. She was very open about it. It worked, too – she married a pretty cool dude and they’re living in Chicago last I heard.
Roger Moore
@Kay:
It’s amazing how greedy they are. For well over a century, machine politicians have understood there are two parts to the equation. First, you do stuff the public wants done. Second, you find ways to skim money from the process and use it to pay for your political machine. People will put up with it as long as you actually get worthwhile stuff done. But Trump couldn’t bother with anything that complicated. He just wants to steal everything that isn’t nailed down and doesn’t realize the importance of actually providing something to his constituents.
Brachiator
@frosty:
Really? Never heard of them? Good group.
1960s Gerry and the Pacemakers
2019 Gerry’s got a Pacemaker
I checked and saw that Gerry Marsden is still with us. He had a long career and even started a couple of new bands. He had a couple of heart surgeries and retired in November 2018.
zhena gogolia
My little tour of twitter and youtube seems to indicate that the Russians are directing their efforts against Harris and for Gabbard. There are a lot of tweets and comments from “black people” that are in a kind of Amos-and-Andy-in-Vladivostok patois.
Ruckus
@The Moar You Know:
Certainly life is different today than 60 years ago, but how really different is it? The big change in day to day life, in my experience is far faster communication and far denser information. In the bigger picture what else has really changed? Healthcare has saved people from diseases and injuries that would most likely have killed them then, myself included and more infants and moms died young, the civil rights act and Medicare happened.
J R in WV
@Immanentize:
You think he is aware of the difference between those with HIV and those with AIDS? I think the mission of looking into Biden’s record on HIV/AIDS would be wasted time. He’s probably unaware of his own record on HIVAIDS, or of any facts about HIV/AIDS, except to vaguely recall that both are icky sex diseases of gay men. I’m being harsh here, but there it is.
Sad, but that’s my suspicion. Similar to his suspicions about “them illegals,” which don’t really exist as seeking asylum isn’t illegal. Not that he appears to know that, which is sad as he must have voted on the treaty regarding asylum that the US adopted while Joe was a Senator.
SFAW
@Just One More Canuck:
If only Fred Trump Sr. had tried that on himself 80 years ago.
J R in WV
@chris:
I don’t find it creepy and weird at all. It’s a string of lies from beginning to end. Mueller said himself, under oath AND in the report, that the investigation didn’t look into collusion because there is no such concept under law.
Mueller also said the reason Trump wasn’t indicted was because there is DoJ policy that prohibits the indictment of a sitting president, and that Trump could be indicted after leaving office.
Nothing weird about it, it just proves that Congresswoman Gabbard is bought and paid for by Russian interests and supports Trump more than she supports the American system of government. I guess that part is pretty creepy, really.
But she’s just as big a Russian tool as Mike Flynn, Jilil Stein, Bernie Sanders, and Donald Trump or the Russian NRA woman. Maybe a little more open than some of those, but still… She’s a little cuter than the Russian NRA woman, but way more treasonous, she’s working for Russia while posing as a loyal American member of government. Prison time, baby!!!
ETA: to add
That video is one hell of a good piece of propaganda work. She had a ton of professional help with the script and delivery of that piece of Trumpian propaganda!! I’m glad she has no chance of winning a democratic primary as a Trump candidate in disguise.
Ye gods people, she’s running as a Trump delegate to the DNC.
Amir Khalid
@The Moar You Know:
Well, it’s just the one moron vs. a bunch of people trying to teach him that two weeks =/= 15 days.
karen marie
@rikyrah: I have to respect Tiffany insofar as it appears that she has not had plastic surgery to fix the unfortunate Trump features, unlike her half sister who’s had her entire face reconstructed.
Also too, why are you picking on her in the first place? She’s the only one who isn’t begging to be booked into The Hague.
karen marie
@Adam L Silverman: Thank you!
Mandalay
@J R in WV: I don’t know about Biden’s knowledge of HIV and AIDS, but I found this recent comment about cancer borderline offensive:
Now of course “curing” cancer would be a wonderful thing, but just the fact that he chose those words suggests that he has no clue about the nature of what he is promising. And while campaign promises are made to be broken, like Trump’s “cheaper, better healthcare”, there’s something odious about promising to “cure” cancer when it’s just not going to happen, and doubly so when the implication is “President Biden, and only President Biden, can oversee cancer being cured by 2024!”.
Biden is just as free as any other politician to make silly promises he won’t deliver on, but he really shouldn’t be promising stuff he can’t possibly deliver.
TenguPhule
@Kay:
You are seriously underestimating their incompetence and corruption.
karen marie
@Steve in the ATL: Why would she need to ruin her summer with “work experience”? She’s going to finish law school and then hired by the Trump organization for a no-show job.
TenguPhule
@Kay:
Fuck Cincinnati.
Amir Khalid
@Mike in NC:
I hear John and George are not currently available, but Sir Paul and Sir Ringo might be.
@frosty:
A few years ago, it came out that Penny Lane is named after a slave trader, John Penny, and some people said it should be renamed. Also, Gerry and The Pacemakers’ most Liverpool song has to be their cover of You’ll Never Walk Alone. At every one of the annual memorial services for the Hillsborough 96, held from 1990 to 2016, Gerry Marsden led the singing of YNWA.
TenguPhule
@David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch:
That was before the Supreme Court ruled that Trump doesn’t actually have to spend that money the way Congress tells him to.
Karen
I think one of the issues is that there is the red line of the N word. As long as they don’t cross it, they can claim they’re not racist. The narrowness of that definition is the point. What will happen when he says it in public or tweets it?
I would like to think it will be straw that breaks the camel’s back. I know better.
Jinchi
@Yarrow: Wait Tulsi is running for president and the House at the same time?
Miss Bianca
@Adam L Silverman: Dear God, my brain started to hurt trying to follow all that.
J R in WV
@jl:
“…stuff like ‘The Bell Curve’ was very poor quality research.”
IT wasn’t really research at all. When you form your conclusions first, and spend all your time looking for support of those conclusions, that isn’t what we call “research”…
Omnes Omnibus
@TenguPhule: That’s not what the ruling was.
karen marie
@germy: “Unwashable mayonnaise stain” is the best!
SFAW
@Amir Khalid:
Well they ARE equal (within an order of magnitude).
zhena gogolia
@chris:
That is horrifying!
SFAW
@J R in WV:
Well, technically, I believe it’s called “The Jonah Goldberg Method of Research.”
TenguPhule
@Omnes Omnibus:
Its the effective result of the ruling since nobody can challenge Trump’s actions without both House and Senate in agreement.
J R in WV
@Martin:
I was born in 1950, and wife in 1949, and we didn’t have children because we believed we were all going to die in a nuclear holocaust. I was 11 during the Cuban Missile Crisis, and attempted to dig a shelter in our crawl space, in hard sandstone ridge top caprock.
Can’t be done, but I made progress every evening after, what, 5th grade let out. Kind of resented Dad not helping, but figured he had knowledge that led him to give up already, which was probably correct.
I think JFK saved the world that time. Don’t know who is going to do it this time, if at all. Then in 7th grade I got to see my science teacher grin when he heard that Kennedy had been shot. Grim world back then too.
Not too late for that, either.
Ruckus
@Mandalay:
He can’t promise to go to the moon within the decade.
He can’t promise to pass a landmark healthcare bill, his ex boss already did that.
He can’t promise to come up with anything better because this is how he rolls.
He can’t promise, really anything else because they would all be as over the top stupid.
All he can do is the same as every other time he’s run, keep loosening the lug nuts till the wheels fall off. That’s his specialty.
J R in WV
@The Moar You Know:
You kids should really look up a good book about the Cuban Missile Crisis, which happened not long after JFK was inaugurated. Could have been the trigger of a nuclear war…. wasn’t.
Mostly because of JFK’s ability to stay calm and negotiate with the Russians, as opposed to allowing Curtis LeMay and SAC to destroy the world.
Also Bay of Pigs invasion, which was a CIA plot from stupid. Failed, may have been why Kennedy was shot… both were big events during Kennedy’s short term in office.
J R in WV
@Mandalay:
And of course, cancer is really a huge cluster of diseases that have little actual relationship to one another. Curing one type of leukemia has nothing to do with the other 1024 types of leukemia, same for breast cancer, same for prostate cancer, etc, etc.
A painful lie aimed at people either with cancer themselves or with loved ones with cancer.
SWMBO
@Steve in the ATL: Not even with Kavanaugh?