Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

The GOP couldn’t organize an orgy in a whorehouse with a fist full of 50s.

When someone says they “love freedom”, rest assured they don’t mean yours.

Impressively dumb. Congratulations.

Only Democrats have agency, apparently.

if you can’t see it, then you are useless in the fight to stop it.

Russian mouthpiece, go fuck yourself.

Motto for the House: Flip 5 and lose none.

The poor and middle-class pay taxes, the rich pay accountants, the wealthy pay politicians.

Republicans do not pay their debts.

It may be funny to you motherfucker, but it’s not funny to me.

Just because you believe it, that doesn’t make it true.

You don’t get rid of your umbrella while it’s still raining.

Tick tock motherfuckers!

If you’re pissed about Biden’s speech, he was talking about you.

They’re not red states to be hated; they are voter suppression states to be fixed.

I’d hate to be the candidate who lost to this guy.

Is it negotiation when the other party actually wants to shoot the hostage?

A last alliance of elves and men. also pet photos.

Never entrust democracy to any process that requires republicans to act in good faith.

I’ve spoken to my cat about this, but it doesn’t seem to do any good.

Hot air and ill-informed banter

Pessimism assures that nothing of any importance will change.

I like you, you’re my kind of trouble.

Too often we hand the biggest microphones to the cynics and the critics who delight in declaring failure.

You are here: Home / Past Elections / 2020 Elections / Election 2020 Open Thread: Cross-tabs

Election 2020 Open Thread: Cross-tabs

by | 134 Comments

This post is in: , , ,

We jackals may not be representative of all Democratic voters… but from what I see in the comments, we’re pretty close to the average for donors. I’m actually really happy that people are cross-donating — especially to the women I prefer, of course!


Reader Interactions

134Comments

  1. 1.

    germy

    The MSM tried their darndest to push Williamson (for shits and giggles) but she remains at the bottom of the polls.

  3. 3.

    Baud

    We jackals may not be representative of all Democratic voters

    It’s why Baud! 2020! is struggling.

  5. 5.

    rikyrah

    I have a new piece up. @PeteButtigieg’s Only Problem with Black Voters is They Don’t Know Who He Is

    OR

    Why Low Name ID Ruins Everything About Polling The Early Primary https://t.co/AcCWXjieCM pic.twitter.com/8J4P8Zhsft

    — Rachel “The Doc” Bitecofer ???????? (@RachelBitecofer) August 8, 2019

    Why do you think Black voters don’t know who Pete is?

  9. 9.

    Nicole

    Yeah, the biggest takeaway I got from reading my low-information liberal friends on FB post-debate is that most of them really aren’t paying attention yet.

    It’s nice to see donors cross-supporting the women candidates, since the women Senators seem to all also really like each other. I will be shocked to see bitterness from any of them as the field narrows.

  10. 10.

    rikyrah

    This is what I mean: racism is a national security vulnerabilty. The racism is real. Russian-based forces are amplifying it to deepen division. @Twitter must clean these bogus accounts. But we must address the root – the racism that is so easily manipulated by foreign powers. https://t.co/HpI1M4aqcJ

    — Sherrilyn Ifill (@Sifill_LDF) August 9, 2019

  12. 12.

    rikyrah

    Peak Caucasity???

    “Don’t discriminate against me! You don’t know who I am, you don’t know my connections. I’m gonna make an international incident!” pic.twitter.com/ARtqGejAXR

    — chris evans (@notcapnamerica) August 8, 2019

  13. 13.

    rikyrah

    RIP :( :(

    I’ve said it before and I will keep saying it, racism literally kills people.

    “I just don’t understand why I matter so little to them,” she said. “I haven’t been feeling like living and this just confirms that I don’t want this life anymore.”
    https://t.co/09FWX8ZPe7

    — Bodak Red ??? (@AFarray) August 7, 2019

  14. 14.

    zhena gogolia

    @rikyrah:

    I was reading a Grantchester mystery to my husband last night, set in the 1950s with a Cold War spy theme. I just stopped and said, “All the people who struggled and died for this, and Putin took us over without firing a shot. He just leveraged our racism against us.” It’s the biggest tragedy I can think of.

  16. 16.

    NotMax

    @zhena goglia

    Russian society may include many shortcomings, but having the patience and inveterate stubbornness to play the long game aren’t among them.

  17. 17.

    rikyrah

    @zhena gogolia:

    “All the people who struggled and died for this, and Putin took us over without firing a shot. He just leveraged our racism against us.” It’s the biggest tragedy I can think of.

    Clinging to their whiteness.

  23. 23.

    Kelly

    @Spanky: No but this is the class for poly sci majors. Non poly sci majors can take Election 101 where they don’t have to write a term paper.

  25. 25.

    Brachiator

    @germy:

    The MSM tried their darndest to push Williamson (for shits and giggles) but she remains at the bottom of the polls.

    Really? I have never seen many stories about her, or anything that suggests that she is a serious candidate. I’ve never seen a story about her rising or falling in the polls. Has any reporter or pundit pushed hard for her?

  30. 30.

    catclub

    @Nicole:

    Yeah, the biggest takeaway I got from reading my low-information liberal friends on FB post-debate is that most of them really aren’t paying attention yet.

    There were amazing stories on “The Reveal” last night on how Facebook allows casino like games that charge money for gamecoins
    to hook and keep gambling addicts. One woman interviewed blew through $400k. They had ‘coaches’ assigned to her, with the job of keeping her hooked.

    that was after the same game companies get kids to spend lots of their parent’s money on those same games – there is no “You are making another purchase” notice in the games. and certainly no “What is your credit card number?” because they already have it.
    and Facebook gets a 30% cut. So facebook doesn’t want to fix the problem.

    And charge backs to those games are twice as high as the FTC qualifies as fraud red flags.

    So I am NOW strongly considering getting a FB account.

  31. 31.

    Betty Cracker

    @rikyrah: The data embedded in the tweet says Buttigieg has low name recognition among black voters. Maybe that’s bullshit, but that’s what Bitecofer is basing her analysis on.

  32. 32.

    germy

    Meanwhile… Yang.

    Washington DC feels very detached from the daily lives of most Americans. One way to change this – relocate Federal agencies that don’t need to be in DC to other parts of the country. Would save tons of money too as DC is one of our most expensive cities. https://t.co/owX9qa8yeo— Andrew Yang (@AndrewYang) August 8, 2019

  35. 35.

    rikyrah

    @germy:

    Washington DC feels very detached from the daily lives of most Americans. One way to change this – relocate Federal agencies that don’t need to be in DC to other parts of the country. Would save tons of money too as DC is one of our most expensive cities. https://t.co/owX9qa8yeo— Andrew Yang (@AndrewYang) August 8, 2019

    Phuck outta here.

    This kind of shyt that doesn’t impress me in the least with Yang.

  36. 36.

    the Conster

    @rikyrah:

    Don’t forget the sexism! Putin weaponized racism and sexism against us by demonizing Obama and Hillary, and guess who came out and said 2 days before the election that he didn’t think the folks who were thinking of voting for Trump were racist or sexist? Mr. BS who also got help from the Russians himself, knew it, and didn’t tell anyone including, and most importantly his supporters who he led down a deadend thinking he had a shot at the nomination, while picking their pockets.

  37. 37.

    J R in WV

    @Ivan X:

    I’m voting for her [Williamson]. This country needs love.

    How is the weather in St. Petersburg, Komrade Ivan X?

    Or are you dumb enough to be an American prepared to support a religious nut who doesn’t believe in modern medical science?

    Geexz, sometimes I lose all hope for the future of the species!

  40. 40.

    kindness

    We’re political junkies. It isn’t fair to suggest that other (ostensibly) sensible moderate to liberal folk should be putting as much mojo into the race now as we are. Many of those folks have lives that take up their whole time. This isn’t where they are in their lives. So criticize if you will, but cut them some slack. It is still early. The poll leaders will still be the leaders. The poll losers (1% or less) won’t be there shortly. I almost envy them as they aren’t spinning their wheels over abject unelectables.

  41. 41.

    JGabriel

    @Baud:

    BTW, unless we’re electing the next Caesar, you’re missing a number in your title.

    Well. the current occupant thinks he’s Caesar, so …

  44. 44.

    Nicole

    @catclub: There were some articles a few months back about the casino stuff on FB. Yeah, it’s awful.

    My kid is a Fortnite addict (less so lately, as the novelty wears off, thank the FSM because hearing about his theories about what’s going to happen during Season X during all waking hours is really BORING) but I made sure to set up his account so that I have to enter the password (twice) and manually enter my credit card if he wants to purchase anything. He’s not the sort to do anything impulsively, but best to make spending $ on games as hard as possible because the companies themselves have an economic interest in making it as easy as possible.

  46. 46.

    A Ghost To Most

    I’m watching, not listening, to Pus-olini at his Gaggle. He looks especially creepy dripping sweat.

  47. 47.

    J R in WV

    @zhena gogolia:

    “He’s snarking.”

    Ya think? I guess I dunno, then, cause I didn’t think so at all….. won’t be my first misunderstanding! I’m a little face blind too, have trouble with names, often write a “b” for a “d” but don’t have trouble with p’s and q’s.

    Lucky I can count and read ;-)

  48. 48.

    Brachiator

    @germy:

    David Brooks and a few other opinionators wrote “think” pieces about her.

    David Brooks. Isn’t that kind of like the kiss of death? I never read or watch Brooks unless someone is complaining about something extra deeply stupid that he has said.

    But I see your point.

    @JGabriel:

    Brooks and other wingnuts pretending to be moderates.

    Brooks pretends so many things.

  50. 50.

    JR

    Esp after 2 prime time debates?

    I disagree with this assertion. Why should the electorate watch the primary debates?

    Because they’re entertaining? Certainly not.
    Because they’re informative? Don’t make me laugh.

  52. 52.

    Betty Cracker

    @A Ghost To Most: Jesus, you weren’t kidding! Just saw a short clip on Twitter, and he looks like he’s going to stroke out any second. Of course, he’s disappointed me on that score more than once…

  53. 53.

    Major Major Major Major

    @rikyrah:

    Why do you think Black voters don’t know who Pete is?

    His 28% name recognition among black democrats in the linked poll analysis.

    I don’t agree with the conclusion that this would be the sole reason for low support among black democrats, but it’s certainly a large factor at this juncture.

  57. 57.

    A Ghost To Most

    @Betty Cracker: We have a new OLED tv, and his large sweaty high-resolution visage made me nostalgic for when Noxin was just a tiny face on a tiny tv.

  58. 58.

    Betty Cracker

    @germy: Here’s President Flopsweat insinuating that children crying on the news because ICE scooped up their parents is a good thing:

    I know it would make Pence president, but I sincerely wish Trump would drop dead right there in front of the copter. And even though the laws of physics forbid it, that event would be especially satisfying if the chopper blades created a vortex that sucked in his carcass and distributed it in chunks all over the lawn. I really hate that fucker. Can you tell?

  59. 59.

    geg6

    @Betty Cracker:

    Bet he’s freaking because of the banks handing over all those financial records to NYS and congressional committees. They can’t get him to Bedminster fast enough at this point, I’m sure.

  65. 65.

    catclub

    @germy: Mick Mulvaney is the present Trump admin guy pushing this -as a way to get rid of pesky government employees. Does Yang know he is hitching his wagon to Trump and Mulvaney?
    (I am working at the Stennis Space Center – forced on the government by Mississippi senator John Stennis lo these many years ago. So it is an old tradition.
    But Mulvaney is doing it to USDA at the moment in extremely half-assed fashion.)

  66. 66.

    MJS

    @germy: I don’t presume to know how people of color view these gaffes, but I do know how the media will portray them, and I know the false equivalencies are being written as we speak. I hope Joe has a good corner man screaming in his face right now, and that Joe is capable of taking it in and changing. But I’m not confident that’s the case.

  67. 67.

    Kay

    @Ivan X:

    This country needs love.

    We do though. Not from her, but we do need love. Michelle Obama is going to turn out to be right, you know, as usual.

  70. 70.

    A Ghost To Most

    @catclub: Be thankful they are so incompetent. Think of the damage they haven’t succeeded at because of arrogant incompetence.

  71. 71.

    PJ

    @germy: This is partly the rationale that Mick Mulvaney uses to send Federal government offices to the hinterland. The real reason, of course, is to cut the number of Federal workers and reduce the numbers of those with experience (also thereby weakening their union), give more business to contractors, and increase the general level of incompetence (making it all the easier to argue for dismantling the agency in question.)

    The reality is that, for various reasons (not the least, the need for Congresspeople to bring pork to their districts), federal offices already are spread around the country, but executive level offices need to be near the decision-makers (Congress and the White House), and nothing Republicans and technocrats advocate for or do will change that. But they can obviously reduce the effectiveness of government.

  72. 72.

    cliosfanboy

    @rikyrah: it’s idiotic. It’s not like employees of the different agencies dont have to coordinate and work together.

  74. 74.

    Kay

    @Just One More Canuck:

    Well, it’s not ALL we need. But we do need it. The country is as hateful and small minded as I’ve seen it. I know everyone hates this idea because pundits ruined it with their silliness where they made it a kind of celebrity, but we really do need a generous and optimistic influence at the top. BIG, not small. Ultimately Trump is petty with his self-centered world view and nasty vindictiveness. That’s not all he is- he’s more dangerous than that because he’s so powerful in that position, but I do think people are craving someone positive and expansive and generous. As a person.

    Trump’s a wall. We need a road.

  75. 75.

    James E Powell

    Anecdotal recollection: 2003-2004 I was a Deaniac, went to Iowa and Arizona. I was amazed and depressed to discover that the first and only thing my non-political junky friends and family heard about him was The Scream.

  77. 77.

    Kay

    Marianne LeVine
    @marianne_levine
    Barrasso said Friday he has concerns about red flag laws and expanded background checks

    They’re not going to get jack done on guns. I knew it the minute they shoved it off until after break.

    If you’re keeping score, the single legislative accomplishment Donald Trump and Republicans have in the last 4 years is their massive tax cut for rich people. They traded everything and everyone for that tax cut and they haven’t done a day of real work since it passed.

  78. 78.

    Kay

    @Formerly disgruntled in Oregon:

    I’m serious about this. There has to be some unifying national idea, and it can’t be “shut the place down and hate other people more” – he’s a horrible PERSON. If we have a good person then that piece is in place and we can get back to Jake Tapper misrepresenting our health care proposals. If we can have both pieces – the personal piece and the policy part, why settle for just one? No reason to leave “Donald Trump is a horrible human being” off the table :)

  80. 80.

    StringOnAStick

    @germy: So Yang is endorsing what tRUMP did to gut the ARS and BLM by suddenly transferring these professionals to KS or wherever? Great job there Yang, pat tRUMP on the back for “saving money” by gutting these agencies via forced relocations.

  81. 81.

    Ruckus

    @Ivan X:
    That isn’t love, it’s rapture. It’s Jonestown. Rube City. It’s as much like love as saying I look like Harrison Ford. BTW I don’t. We would never, ever be mistaken for each other. Not in any possible way in the world.

  83. 83.

    Betty Cracker

    @Kay: I fully expect a bumper crop of peer-reviewed studies on the psychological damage Trump did to the country after we’re rid of him. Not the obvious victims, though the attention should be on them, of course. Just regular people. I know I’m a worse person just for having had that hateful shithead, his horrible family and his loathsome toadies in my face every day for the last three years.

  85. 85.

    Ruckus

    @FelonyGovt:
    Reduce it? Hell eliminate it 100% People around the world would pay to see that. I’D PAY TO SEE THAT.
    @Betty Cracker:

    I really hate that fucker.
    Can you tell?

    Really?
    If you really hated him you wouldn’t care if he had the HA first.
    Just the blades.
    And the pilot redlining the throttle.

  87. 87.

    Ruckus

    @Baud:
    Why thank you for that bit of truth!
    We do look different though. It took a lot of surgery to make sure that we would but it was worth it.

  89. 89.

    Ruckus

    @Kay:
    You just described a human being. A good one mind you but a human being.
    trump is the exact opposite of that. Yes he’s human. But he’s the example of what not to do, what not to be. He’s the anti human example. Every bad trait magnified. That’s why his supporters like him. He’s their goal, every bad human trait exemplified, every decent human trait cut out or buried so deep no one would ever even know it existed.

  91. 91.

    Searcher

    Am I reading that last graph correctly that more people never heard of Biden than Sanders?

  92. 92.

    Kay

    @Ruckus:

    That’s why his supporters like him.

    I don’t agree. If that were true they wouldn’t make him into a different person, and they do. Trump’s biggest supporters actually believe that he went down to ground zero after 9/11 and helped first responders. I’ve seen it on Trump twitter. It was widely spread on Facebook. They actually believe Trump and Mueller were working on a secret plot to stop child sex trafficking. If they loved how horrible he is they wouldn’t create a wholly imaginary Donald Trump, and they do.

  93. 93.

    Major Major Major Major

    @Kay:

    If you’re keeping score, the single legislative accomplishment Donald Trump and Republicans have in the last 4 years is their massive tax cut for rich people. They traded everything and everyone for that tax cut and they haven’t done a day of real work since it passed.

    They also killed thousands by axing the individual mandate.

  94. 94.

    Ruckus

    @rikyrah:
    It’s almost like he doesn’t know how shit works.
    Everything is reduced to a number or an idea. I see this in manufacturing all the time. People who don’t understand the ins and outs of the process want to reduce it to the simple numbers. Of course nothing is that simple and the simple numbers don’t take that into consideration.
    Like conservatives don’t think that government can do anything right or positive. And while the shear size can be an issue it can also be an asset. Conservatives think that if everyone just made their own decisions about everything we’d be better off. When plainly “Hold my beer!” is not a good governing concept. Of course with laws and control it is harder to get away with things like pay day loans with 30% interest or building houses that fall down/apart, racism, no/shitty healthcare, etc, etc.

  95. 95.

    Kay

    @Ruckus:

    Have you seen the Trump artists? They made a whole different person. In the paintings he’s crying looking at a disabled veteran, or standing serious and solemn at attention n a boat surrounded by Democrats who are in a “swamp” beneath him, or weeping because the flag is all frayed or something. They invented this whole person. That person has human emotions. If they liked the real person they wouldn’t have to do that.

  98. 98.

    Brachiator

    @schrodingers_cat:

    David Fucking Brooks for starters. He spews his garbage in the Vichy Times and on the Snooze Hour.

    Yep. An op-ed piece in the NY Times would be prominently positioned. Doesn’t seem to have helped Williamson much.

    I have been reading and watching political news since high school, but I don’t think that I have ever seen more than a handful of Snooze Hour episodes. The hosts and guests are usually boring and encouraged to come across even more seriously somnolent. Everything about the program, down to the sets and the lighting, remind me of a white bread funeral parlor.

    ETA. The news, or lack of news, coming out of Kashmir is sad. I don’t know if you have written anything about it, but can understand if you have not. Many are clearly heartbroken. India. The US. Hong Kong. These are momentous times, a challenge to everyone who believes in goodwill and democracy.

  99. 99.

    rikyrah

    @Ruckus:

    Every bad trait magnified. That’s why his supporters like him. He’s their goal, every bad human trait exemplified, every decent human trait cut out or buried so deep no one would ever even know it existed.

    And, it’s why, as you pointed out Kay, that their vote for him shows THEIR lack of character.

  100. 100.

    Soprano2

    @Betty Cracker: My doctor put me on a diuretic for blood pressure this summer. I wanted to tell him my BP would go back to normal if only we could get Trump out of the WH.

  101. 101.

    Betty Cracker

    @Kay: I think y’all are both right. There are Trump supporters who know he’s an asshole and love it when he says crazy and offensive things because they are assholes themselves. And there are Trump supporters like that woman at a rally who was actually sobbing on camera about how badly the media treats Trump. Probably many Trump supporters have elements of both mindsets.

    @debit: That would be great, but it’s not going to happen. He really might just drop dead though. Like so many other things, he seems to have escaped the health scrutiny other presidents get.

  102. 102.

    Ruckus

    @Kay:
    Well they are delusional. I thought that was obvious.
    I think it works this way:
    1. They like him for all the reasons I stated.
    2. They don’t want him or themselves to actually be mistaken for horrible people.
    3. Bullshit. They live it, they breath it, they create it. So much and so often because it’s a sales pitch. A con. They really are like an old time snake oil salesman. Every thing is a pitch, every one else is a rube, lying isn’t part of the game, it is the game.
    You probably don’t see how this works because you aren’t them. Not every one is a chump or a rube, or a grifter. I’m not either but I’ve watched/studied this for decades. I’ve owned my own businesses, I could have gone down this road. Fortunately I was raised better and wanted to be better. It’s cost me money, to not be a selfish ass, but the reward is worth it. And I’ve seen people who made a fair bit of money not being this way but it takes lots of effort not to get sucked into the money is the only thing bit.

  103. 103.

    zhena gogolia

    @Betty Cracker:

    Like so many other things, he seems to have escaped the health scrutiny other presidents get.

    Just randomly, I saw a clip on somebody’s tweet of him from two years ago. His deterioration (mental and physical) is shocking. (This is not to say that he looked mentally or physically healthy two years ago, but he’s far worse now.) You’d think some enterprising reporter would be right on the case. But crickets.

  105. 105.

    Kay

    @Betty Cracker:

    like that woman at a rally who was actually sobbing on camera about how badly the media treats Trump.

    It’s mean but I find that amusing. I’m trying to be a non-judgmental “ear” for the Trumpsters who are ready to leave the fold. I had one yesterday. You really don’t have to say anything. All I said in a 20 minute conversation is “he lies all the time”. She had this long list of grievances with him and she didn’t need my help. I don’t really believe people are “persuaded” anyway. I think they’re ready to buy (or sell, in this case) and they’re just talking thru the process of getting there.

  106. 106.

    sukabi

    @zhena gogolia: Washington press corps is an organization of folks who are invested in maintaining the illusion of a functional presidency and government. They’ve been at center of maintaining the illusion through Reagan, George W. and drumpf…

  107. 107.

    Kay

    @Betty Cracker:

    I think of it like when you’re in a horrible relationship but you are the only person that is allowed to admit the person is horrible.

    You can’t join in if you’re listening. You can’t be “God, obviously, WTF is wrong with you, he’s a HORROR and we all know it and said it behind your back, FOR YEARS” :)

  108. 108.

    Uncle Cosmo

    @Formerly disgruntled in Oregon:

    Or a bridge. Perhaps “a bridge (back) to the 21st century”.

    I’ve been thinking a lot about Adam’s post awhile back where he asserted that (I paraphrase) there’s no going back, only going forward.

    IMHO we are standing on a riverbank. It’s a wide river, so wide we really can’t see the far bank. And it’s deeper than anyone can ford.

    And it’s running with blood.

    Even if there’s no going back – & frankly I dispute that, because it might become necessary – to plunge right into that bloodbath would be madness.

    At best – at best – we will find ourselves, come the morning of 4 November 2020, with a Democratic President-elect & major gains in both Houses of Congress, standing on that riverbank. Even were the GOP vote reduced to the “crazification factor,” it will still amount to 45 million votes – many if not most of whom will be mad as hell, convinced the “DemonRats” stole the election, ready to exercise their 2nd Amendment “rights”. Including much of the military, most of the multiple gun-owners, & practically all the LEOs.

    Instead of wading into a possible Civil War II, maybe we should do like the Allied Armies on the lower Rhine in March 1945: Fan out up & down the banks – if necessary, draw back to roads that will let us move fast – in search of at least one bridge, however rickety, left intact. Then get as many of our forces across as possible before it crashes into the current. And hope they’ll be enough. The alternative, again IMO, is just too horrible to contemplate.

    The question is, Who among the Democrats running for President is (or will be) best able to lead us in the quest for that bridge?

  109. 109.

    Jeffro

    @Betty Cracker: I think there are a lot more of the former than the latter. These folks are glad – thrilled, even – that trumpov is such a colossal a-hole. He gets to vent everything they’ve been thinking/wanting to say for years. ‘He don’t take shit from nobody’, right? And so he’s their own raging id right up there on those dumb stages, spouting away, consequence-free.

  110. 110.

    Betty Cracker

    @Kay: That makes sense, and you’re right — people in that situation need a listener, not a persuader. I’ve found myself in a similar situation with Trumper relatives who are disillusioned with him, and it’s VERY hard to keep my mouth shut and not say, “FFS, HOW DID YOU NOT SEE THAT ALL ALONG?” But that would be counterproductive. My daughter had a romantic partner we disapproved of once, and my husband and I gave each other pep talks to STFU and let her figure it out for herself, which she did, thank dog. The situation is like that.

  111. 111.

    rikyrah

    Jeffrey Epstein ordered books on Amazon about how to use sex slaves, court documents allege

    Michelle Mark
    •August 9, 2019

    Jeffrey Epstein ordered books on Amazon about sadomasochism and how to use sex slaves, court documents unsealed Friday alleged.

    The documents included a photo of an Amazon receipt for the titles “SM 101: A Realistic Introduction,” “SlaveCraft: Roadmaps for Erotic Servitude,” and “Training with Miss Abernathy: A Workbook for Erotic Slaves and Their Owners.”

    Giuffre’s attorneys alleged in the filing that the “disturbing 2005 purchase” from Amazon corroborated Giuffre’s — and other victims’ — accounts of being sexually exploited by Maxwell and Epstein.

    https://www.yahoo.com/news/jeffrey-epstein-ordered-books-amazon-152418460.html?.tsrc=fauxdal

  112. 112.

    rikyrah

    This is madness. ICE tried to raid a *homeless shelter* in NYC on Tuesday night. Lied that they had a warrant. Thankfully, security guards knew their rights & asked to see it. They showed a random photo. They didnt have a warrant. They were forced to leave.https://t.co/OSQjpV6UTZ

    — Scott Hechinger (@ScottHech) August 8, 2019

  113. 113.

    Steeplejack (phone)

    @rikyrah:

    I’m so old I can remember when ICE was only going to go after MS-13 and hardcore gangsters, not my Mexican restaurant owner who’s been here for 20 years.

  114. 114.

    rikyrah

    Jeffrey Epstein Accuser Names Powerful Men in Alleged Sex Ring
    In newly unsealed documents, Virginia Giuffre claims that Jeffrey Epstein and Ghislaine Maxwell trafficked her to politicians, princes, and a high-flying financier, among others.

    Updated 08.09.19 2:10PM ET / Published 08.09.19 12:49PM ET

    A young woman who says financier Jeffrey Epstein and socialite Ghislaine Maxwell kept her as a sex slave also accused a host of high-powered men of being involved in Epstein’s alleged sex-trafficking ring, according to court records unsealed Friday.

    Virginia Giuffre, who says that Epstein and Maxwell trafficked her to powerful people for erotic massages and sex, claimed in a 2016 deposition that Maxwell directed her to have sex with former New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson, Britain’s Prince Andrew (whom she has accused before), wealthy financier Glenn Dubin, former senator George Mitchell, now-deceased MIT scientist Marvin Minsky, and modeling agent Jean-Luc Brunel, as well as “another prince,” a “foreign president,” and the owner of a “large hotel chain” in France.

    None of the men named in the deposition have been charged with a crime or even sued in civil court in connection with the Epstein case. The deposition represents accuser Giuffre’s allegations, and the court documents unsealed on Friday did not contain any corroboration or further details, though many documents remain sealed.

  115. 115.

    ola azul

    @Kay: @Betty Cracker:

    Old saying, of sales origin, I believes:

    Peeps never change their mind, but sometimes they make new decisions based upon new information. Don’t nobody wanna admit they were (specially spectacularly and obviously) wrong, or gulled, or been rolled. This is why I think your observation, Kay, is so important. A joyful warrior, a positive humane (woman, I hope) is such a stark contrast from the unceasing misery and rancor of the Trump years. Among those who are willing to flee their self-imposed ‘Murican Jonestown, and I expect it’s a not-insignificant number, think it’ll make the departch that much easier.

    Puts less onus on justifying the unjustifiable (having voted for Trump) by presenting a viable alternative to our American nightmare.

  118. 118.

    zhena gogolia

    Wow, I’m in a back-and-forth with Dean Baquet, if it really is him. I don’t think I’m getting through to him, though. I need TenguPhule or Baud to take the wheel.

  123. 123.

    ola azul

    @zhena gogolia:

    That they have been as tough on Trump as anyone else. And that it’s not the role of the press to save democracy.

    First part is objectively wrong, and second part demonstrates Bacquet misapprehends both the role of the press *and* the critique being made.

    I’d be content if the NYT would simply accurately describe the Trumpian field as it, ahem, lies and leave the saving of democracy to them’s that actually, you know, give a shit.

    We don’t need that vainglorious motherfucker to “save democracy”. What we need is his fucking paper to stop aiding and abetting a criminal degenerate by refusing to state, openly and plainly, basic fucking facts w/o resorting to Trumpian/Republican apologia and both-sidesing the fuck outta everything to make the Republican shit-show more palatable to peeps who only give a shit about their tax cuts.

  124. 124.

    ola azul

    @ola azul:

    Shorter, simpler: The NYT isn’t shit cuz it won’t save democracy. The NYT is shit cuz it refuses to tell the truth.

  127. 127.

    ola azul

    @zhena gogolia:

    Understood. And understandable. But, a subtle point:

    Imploring Bacquet to save democracy gives him an out to say that’s not the paper’s brief. Imploring Bacquet to accurately describe the national scene is a rabbit-hole down which he cannot seek refuge.

  130. 130.

    sdhays

    @zhena gogolia: And when they break lies, leading to immensely destructive wars or immensely destructive electoral results, I guess that doesn’t matter because at least they “broke stories”.

    I’m at the point when if I see “the NY Times is reporting…”, I ignore it until I see the story has been picked up/confirmed by a reputable news source. Their credibility is completely shot at this point.

  131. 131.

    Aleta

    @zhena gogolia
    Still, good on you. I believe it’s good to follow an impulse like that. Going on record matters, and making an effort counts a lot. ‘Why bother’ is the most useless of all. Anyway we can’t predict all the effects of an action, esp in numbers over time.

    I’d love to know their mail volume of complaint. If you got a canned response, it still shows they’re aware they need to respond with that statement (like Stephen Ross just did) and they’re counting. Like businesses are compelled to do for damage.

  134. 134.

    Uncle Cosmo

    @sdhays: Late responding, just signed back on.

    Good question, and I mean that literally. Let me explain where I see things ending up in the near-best of all possible imminent outcomes from this near-worst of all possible presents:

    IMO there are 3 basic constituencies in the USA. There are the stone-cold unreconstructed (& unreconstructable) white bigots. There are the POC and the “woke” whites, IOW your typical jackal.

    And then there are the people in between. The kind of whites who tell themselves they can’t be racist, since they have black & Latinx friends, & bristle when you tell them that doesn’t qualify. Who say they favor equal rights & all that, so long as it’s not at the expense of them & theirs. Who say, “My people never owned slaves, & they had it just as rough when they came over.” Etc.

    If there is a “bluenami” building it will largely be due to those inbetweeners – many of whom likely voted for tRump in 2016 – coming over to our side in great numbers in the voting booth.

    There are a lot of people out there who regret their vote for Trump. We can get their support next year – hell, Fat Bastard is practically driving them into our arms – but we’ll need it for much, much longer. Because that’s only the first part of the running battle we need to win, & it may be the easier part. We need to put civil society back together, by (re)fashioning a general agreement that (at least the overt forms of) racism & bigotry are unacceptable in the public sphere. We’re not going to reconstruct the unreconstructable – but by reestablishing an overall consensus that their sort of crap doesn’t fly, we can send them slithering back under their rocks, & we can recruit a supermajority to help keep them there.

    My idea of a “bridge” is something on the order of a new POTUS whose Inaugural Address goes something like this:

    My fellow citizens, we are – I hope and believe – beginning to emerge from a treacherous & terrifying period in our history. It was a time when a small fraction of our population seem to have lost their collective mind. [Details of Trumptrocities follow.] I know the great majority of Americans agree that it is unacceptable to treat our fellow citizens and our fellow human beings that way. This is America! We’re better than that!

    But you know – you all know – a very large number of our fellow citizens went a little ways around the bend. They were frustrated in their lives & their prospects – they wondered how the promise of this great nation had gone so sour for them & their loved ones. Day after day it was shouted at them to blame those who didn’t look like them or speak like them or worship like them or love like them, who allegedly were getting all the consideration that should have gone to them. Day after day after day they heard this.

    It was obvious. It was easy. It was wrong. And I think – no, I know – that most of those folks knew, in their heart of hearts, that there was something wrong with that. Because they knew folks like those they were told to blame – and they knew they weren’t like that at all. But many people, many otherwise righteous & upstanding people, find it tough to connect the upstanding & righteous individuals they know with the large, faceless, sometimes menacing groups they’re part of. We’re human. It happens.

    But it doesn’t have to be that way. We’re human and we can learn. We can change. And we can rebuild our society so that the content of a person’s character matters more than the color of their skin or the tongue they learned at their parents’ knees (ETA: or the gender of the loved one they hold in their arms).

    To all those people I say, Have the patience to hear from your fellow citizens what they have faced in their pursuit of our common American dream. Have the wisdom to learn from them what is behind their struggles. They are anxious and eager to tell you truths that perhaps you never noticed. They are waiting to welcome you into a society where all people are created equal, where they are endowed by their Creator with the inalienable rights of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. They hold out their hands. Take them. Help form the bridge over the troubled waters of our recent past that will bring us to the America we all believe in.

    Congresswoman Ocasio-Cortez said something much briefer but more or less equivalent: Come home. (I’m a logorrheic, sue me.) And I was overjoyed to see it.

    IMO we need a President who can make that kind of speech & make it stick. It may not provide immediate and total redress for those who have been most under the gun since 1/20/2017, but (again IMO) it’s the best way to keep this country from tearing itself to bloody bits. YMMV.

Comments are closed.