Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

We still have time to mess this up!

The republican caucus is already covering themselves with something, and it’s not glory.

Take your GOP plan out of the witness protection program.

fuckem (in honor of the late great efgoldman)

Good lord, these people are nuts.

So it was an October Surprise A Day, like an Advent calendar but for crime.

“Squeaker” McCarthy

Our job is not to persuade republicans but to defeat them.

Authoritarian republicans are opposed to freedom for the rest of us.

Let’s finish the job.

When someone says they “love freedom”, rest assured they don’t mean yours.

We are aware of all internet traditions.

The worst democrat is better than the best republican.

The arc of history bends toward the same old fuckery.

Since when do we limit our critiques to things we could do better ourselves?

After roe, women are no longer free.

Not all heroes wear capes.

“Jesus paying for the sins of everyone is an insult to those who paid for their own sins.”

Second rate reporter says what?

Teach a man to fish, and he’ll sit in a boat all day drinking beer.

People are complicated. Love is not.

If you are still in the GOP, you are an extremist.

rich, arrogant assholes who equate luck with genius

No offense, but this thread hasn’t been about you for quite a while.

You are here: Home / Open Threads / The debate, dog help us…

Reader Interactions

204Comments

  2. 2.

    trollhattan

    Bar rag squeezing, bong water; bar rag squeezing, bong water; bar rag squeezing, bong water; bar rag squeezing, bong water; bar rag squeezing, bong water… Tough choice. Kiddo wants to watch so I’ll spend time along with her, poking sticks at Mayor Pete for laffs. #Parenting

  6. 6.

    zhena gogolia

    Here’s where I am on that.

    I can’t do an hour on medicare for all when I’m wondering if the current president conspired to have an American ambassador harmed or killed.— Adam Parkhomenko (@AdamParkhomenko) January 15, 2020

  8. 8.

    zhena gogolia

    As a former mafia prosecutor, this sure sounds like a mob hit was being planned on a public servant in a foreign country by associates of the POTUS. A POTUS who said she was “going to go through some things.” This takes Trump’s lawlessness & misogny to new level. https://t.co/Cx5S0u4vQP— Mimi Rocah (@Mimirocah1) January 15, 2020

  23. 23.

    Nicole

    We cut the cable cord this weekend, so I will probably be living the debate via everyone’s comments. Please keep them coming!

  25. 25.

    Dorothy A. Winsor

    @sab:

    It’s a beautiful movie. Loved the scenes in snowy Concord MA, contrasted to Italy and France. It might be hard to follow if you haven’t read the book. And if my sister ever burned the only ms copy of one of my novels, I’d be the one taking out a hit.

  29. 29.

    Immanentize

    But you know, we love our siblings. ..

     

    ETA my talented friend chose to burn his own.  Go figure!

  30. 30.

    Gin & Tonic, Duke of Tanqueray

    After an hour-long struggle getting two recalcitrant toddlers to go to sleep, watching the debate is about the furthest thing from my mind.

  31. 31.

    gene108

    I just tried watching the debate. Lasted 3 minutes.

    My state doesn’t vote till June 2.

    Don’t think my engagement amounts to much.

  35. 35.

    Ella in New Mexico

    We’re taping the debate and listening to Rachel Maddow right now to try and figure out what the FUCK this Parnas docs story is all about.

    I will say it’s so sensational that part of me worries it’s infected with lots of dezinformatsiya

  44. 44.

    Another Scott

    “ISIS is going to kill us in our beds if we ever leave the Middle East, right Bernie?”

    (sigh)

    Cheers,

    Scott.

  49. 49.

    Immanentize

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: Nice touch, I thought.  If one wanted to make sibling rivalry feel like something.  I think it was much more powerful than just stealing a lover.  Because it was her creation!!!  Hers!

  52. 52.

    Another Scott

    “We should stop asking our military to solve problems that cannot be solved militarily.” – SP Warren.

    +1

    Cheers,

    Scott.

  55. 55.

    trollhattan

    Pete pivots back to Trump, now reminds everybody he served. This is good news for John McCain.

  57. 57.

    emjayay

    Pete just told a prepared tugging on the heartstrings story from his own actual personal life, about someone else.

  58. 58.

    schrodingers_cat

    @Baud: Ask her any question and her answer is about evil corporations. She is one note.

    Pete B reminds me of annoying know-it-all classmates I have had. BTW  did you know he was a troop? He has the most annoying voice of all on the stage.

  63. 63.

    CaseyL

    I have a TV which is hardly ever on, and I’m damn well not going to watch the debate as it serves no purpose other than to fluff the moderators and give people something trivial to focus on in newscasts and Twitter.

    The only issue is getting rid of the mob-infested GOP, from White House to the last intern’s office.  If the debate questions aren’t going to bring up the importance of overturning the murderous regime currently in charge of the Federal Govt, they are irrelevant.

  66. 66.

    Another Scott

    “We’ve turned the corner so many times, we’re going in circles in these regions” – SP Warren.

    +1

    She cuts to the chase and refuses to accept Blitzer’s framing.

    Cheers,

    Scott.

  67. 67.

    SiubhanDuinne

    SPW: “We’ve turned the corner so many times, we’re going in circles.”

     

    Very nice.

  69. 69.

    lamh36

    ‘Sup BJ.

    Back from my first day of classes in my FINAL semeser of grad school (If ya didn’t know I was in grad school…where ya been… ;-)

    I’m not going to be able to watch debate with all the things I have to do to stay up on my classes, but I always try to follow along on social media and blogs.

    But with school back on and taking THREE classes (Tues, Wed & Thurs nights) to finish up this degree, my usual political obessesions will lose some focus, but I’m still keeping up on what’s happening

    Alright, let me see if I can suss out what I missed!

  71. 71.

    emjayay

    @CaseyL: This thread is a “debate” live blog.

    And we now know: they’re all more or less on the same page re: Middle East, etc.

  72. 72.

    Kent

    Steyer really doesn’t feel like he belongs on this stage.  Just feels like a lightweight on policy.

  75. 75.

    Ella in New Mexico

    @Gin & Tonic, Duke of Tanqueray: Awww, I remember those days. My kids are in their 20’s-30’s now, and as hard as those toddler nites were, I’d relive them in a heartbeat again just to see those little butts in their cute jammies.

    No debate is worth a second of your precious time with those little ones, promise. You can read the headlines tomorrow.

  77. 77.

    sab

    Husband has firm hold of remote and is watching a movie, because (he says) the cats are really enjoying it, and they cannot vote. So FO.

  78. 78.

    Immanentize

    @lamh36: You GO!  SO  close, but three classes is a load.  Stay focussed on you and then we can all come to your graduation!  ?

  80. 80.

    trollhattan

    @sab:

    Didn’t you follow the advice to remove the remote batteries?

    OTOH cats must be satisfied, lest revenge occur at 2:30.

  83. 83.

    emjayay

    By the way – re Des Moines Register’s Brianne Pfannenstiel: Her last name means pan handle, literally pan stalk. And her voice is almost as annoying as Margaret Hoover’s. Well, maybe half as annoying.

  88. 88.

    Kent

    I’m not really a Buttigieg fan. But he really does have a talent for speaking and explaining.  Perfect cadence, complete intelligent sentences.  He is really exceedingly good and I understand why he has been rising in the polls if he is always this eloquent in person.

    Biden, by contrast.  I know where he is going but I keep wanting to put words in his mouth because he is so in-eloquent.

  90. 90.

    Another Scott

    “Bernie – aren’t modest improvements better than no improvements?”

    Really, really good question (in the context of the NAFTA-II agreement).

    You’ll be shocked, shocked, to hear Bernie say “No”.

    (Maybe for some good reasons, but it shows his stubbornness.)

    Cheers,

    Scott.

  100. 100.

    Kent

    @Another Scott: Not saying he’s my candidate.  He would be my 3rd or 4th choice of those on stage.   All I’m saying is that I’m starting to understand how he has been rising in the polls in Iowa.  He is extremely good.

  102. 102.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    @Dorothy A. Winsor:

    GOP lawmaker accuses Rep. Matt Gaetz of creating ‘a game’ where politicians get ‘points’ for sleeping with interns and married colleagues

    Holy shit! Couldn’t have happened to a nicer asshole. I hope there’s some strong evidence of this. Gaetz should resign because of this (if true) but probably won’t

  106. 106.

    tobie

    Bernie seems to think that American workers compete with workers abroad for the exact same jobs. Guess he doesn’t subscribe to the theory of comparative advantage.

  115. 115.

    Another Scott

    “I’ve got 4 kids between the ages of 26 and 31…”

    Kids?

    Man o man…

    Cheers,

    Scott.

  116. 116.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    not watching: any mention of the courts from the moderators or the candidates?

  117. 117.

    Marcopolo

    @schrodingers_cat:Which is why she is for the new trade agreement?? Not a further left position; your comment makes no sense. Try parking your bias for the next couple hours or so.

    Btw, am I the only person who feels like the moderators are letting some candidates speak longer & more freely than others. Feel like Amy was shut off quickly while Pete & Bernie get to go on longer.

  119. 119.

    Kent

    @Baud: It’s a pretty easy position to take.  How many voters on the right or left think corruption is not a problem?  At least if your name isn’t Koch or Trump.

  127. 127.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    @Another Scott:

    “ISIS is going to kill us in our beds if we ever leave the Middle East, right Bernie?”

    Is that a question that was actually asked (in so many words)?

    Jesus Christ, those moderators really do suck

  130. 130.

    Ella in New Mexico

    @Gin & Tonic, Duke of Tanqueray: Oh-I had no idea! So now I’m jealous. My kids seem to think the world is such a terrible place that denying their Mom grandkids is actually an option. God we spend so much time drilling it into their heads in the teen years that they don’t want kids yet so be responsible then they’re 35 and you’re all “Dude, you’re getting old and besides, I need to babysit” lolol.

    Even so, if I had a couple here right now, not only would there have been no wine there would have been no tv news, just books and toothbrushing and snuggles. 

    Enjoy. <3

  132. 132.

    dmsilev

    Sanders vows to support whoever the nominee is.

     

    One good thing out of this asinine little “controversy”.

  134. 134.

    Another Scott

    @Omnes Omnibus: If he wants to make the point that future generations will suffer because we’re not doing enough on climate change, then referring to his 26-31 year old kids is jarring.

    My $0.02.

    Cheers,

    Scott.

  135. 135.

    patroclus

    I’m very impressed that Warren has backed off the ridiculous Bernie position on the MCA.  Previously, I thought that she was completely blind on the need for trade deals that increase jobs and international worker protections.  This is a very good sign for her.

  136. 136.

    trollhattan

    “Let’s talk about it. Only the women here have won all their elections.”

    Goddamn, bring it!

  141. 141.

    Elizabelle

    EW — why couldn’t you note that HRC won 3 million more popular votes? Missing from an otherwise excellent answer.

    Why not go after HRC’s voters. They are multitude.

  142. 142.

    dmsilev

    “You don’t have to be the skinniest person in the room”.

    Well, Klobuchar can write off the Taft-fan vote.

  145. 145.

    Elizabelle

    Wasn’t it 30 years ago?

    *snort*

    And BERNIE brings up that HRC won 3 million more votes.  Yea Bernie.  More people need to say that, because it’s a fact that is down the memory hole for not political junkies.

  148. 148.

    Mandalay

    @Immanentize:

    Too late!

    Maybe not?..

    Those lawyers had tried to convince a federal judge that the F.B.I. had ambushed him as part of plot by biased investigators, hoping that the case would be thrown out. But the judge rejected those accusations this month as baseless, and prosecutors reversed their stance, saying Mr. Flynn should be imprisoned.
    Because Mr. Flynn has already pleaded guilty twice, he cannot unilaterally withdraw from the plea deal. The federal judge in the case, Emmet G. Sullivan of Federal District Court in the District of Columbia, has to sign off on Mr. Flynn’s request and will most likely give prosecutors a chance to respond and schedule a hearing on the matter.

  150. 150.

    jk

    Warren’s answer to this question of can a woman win the presidency was a walk-off inside the park grand slam!!  It was the best answer given tonight. Sanders needs to stop digging.

  154. 154.

    sab

    @Ella in New Mexico:  my stepkids are denying us grandkids, and we are very relieved that they are making good choices. Stepdaughter didn’t, and now she is raising an autistic child as a single mom. Dearly  love the kid, but I am trying to imagine how their future is better than bleak, or at least where somewhat bleak is their less horrible option.

  157. 157.

    Baud

    Aside from Warren’s answer of women, no one is standing out tonight IMHO.

    I do like that there are only 6 people on stage.  Not necessarily these 6, but 6 is a decent number.

  158. 158.

    Immanentize

    @Mandalay: It’s not like he is about to plead guilty and pulls back.  He has already pleaded guilty.  Very overtly.  At least twice in front of Sullivan.  The standard is very high to withdraw at this point.  Trust lawyers over pundits on this.  Even if Judge S. lets him, the very next thing will be jury selection Monday.  And he has already said under oath that he did it all.  At least twice.  First pieces of evidence in his trial.

  159. 159.

    Marcopolo

    @tobie:I hear you but as someone who has persisted through watching all of these debates along with debates from previous elections I’d be hard pressed to identify any moderator who hasn’t tried to provoke confrontation (maybe Maddow this cycle). They & their employers believe conflict attracts the most eyeballs.

  160. 160.

    Another Scott

    So far, I think Warren is doing very well.  Amy is trying very hard, dunno how well she’s coming across.  I still don’t like Mayor Pete – I keep asking “Where’s the beef?”  Bernie is Bernie.  Steyer shouldn’t be there.  Biden’s Ok but he almost was in his too-many-Red-Bulls mode early on – trying to talk about too many things at once.  He was better once he hit his stride.

    My $0.02.

    Cheers,

    Scott.

  163. 163.

    Kay

    Stacey Abrams Fair Fight initiative will be in Columbus, OH tomorrow for the big state meeting of county voting officials. I’m really pleased it’s such a serious effort. People can yammer about voting rights a lot but it’s a state recording process, basically, and you gotta get in the weeds with the people who run it.

  168. 168.

    trollhattan

    Bernie reminds me of somebody with N paragraphs copied to a clipboard badly in the need to unload them, but in the order they’re saved. The schtick, it is old.

  171. 171.

    Mary G

    Back to healthcare. Sigh.

    Uncle Joe sounds a little hoarse and slow. Amy is doing well and Warren is doing great. Bernie is his usual shoutie self.

  172. 172.

    Aleta

    Slippery.  Bernie likely told her he doesn’t believe a woman can’t win this one (against Trump).  (“Kid, this ain’t your night.”)   So Bernie denies with  “Of course I believe a woman can win the Presidency.  Does anyone here believe a woman can’t win the Presidency?”

    Moderators  could ask everyone if  Trump’s misogynistic campaign helped defeat Hil. in the EC;  and how they will oppose his misogyny.

  173. 173.

    trollhattan

    Amy’s dad story reminds me of my MIL, for whom I crafted a “Reverend Roomba” strategy for marrying her senior care home boyfriend. It was a thing that was going to happen, until he peed on her floor one too many times.

  175. 175.

    Another Scott

    “We’ve got to get as much help to people as quickly as we can.” – SP Warren

    +1

    “And I will defend the Affordable Care Act.” – SP Warren

    +1

    “We’re going up against someone who is cutting healthcare for millions of people…”  Yup.

    Cheers,

    Scott.

  176. 176.

    Amir Khalid

    @Another Scott:

    It’s perfectly legit to speak of one’s “grown children”, even though they are grown and thus not children. Children here describes a relationship, not the age of the persons referred to. Kids is merely a less formal synonym of children.

    — Your friendly not-so-local pedant.

  177. 177.

    Marcopolo

    @Kay:So happy to read this. Fair Fight 2020 is one of the groups I’m sending ten bucks every month. I hope after Nov they change the name to Fair Fight 2024 & I’ll keep supporting them. We all know well have to keep working on this stuff pretty much forever.

  180. 180.

    planetjanet

    Ok, this is the first debate I have ever watched.  After two minutes, I want someone to tied Wilmer’s hands behind his back and see if he is still able to talk.

  182. 182.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    @zhena gogolia:

    Oh my god. I can totally see Trump willing to give the go ahead to assassinate somebody. The scary part is, with how lawless Trump is and how willing the GOP is willing to overlook his actions, I’m afraid if he’s reelected, he’ll be emboldened and eventually try to shit domestically

  186. 186.

    Aleta

    @Immanentize: Trust lawyers over pundits on this.

    Gladly.  With relief.

    (Lawyers and journalists have kept hope alive these three years;  forever grateful to the good ones.)

  187. 187.

    sab

    @Kay: Phuck! Why didn’t you tell me before about this.

    I had a very enjoyable but wet morning many years ago, standing in line in the pouring rain, telling older African American voters that yes I too had voted for Ken Blackwell because a black secretary of state wouldn’t restrict voting, but here we were standing in the rain in a long line waiting to vote.

  188. 188.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    @Amir Khalid:

    @Another Scott:

    Age really is relative to some people. I’ve witnessed it with my own parents who around 60. They think of people in their 30s-and even early 40s as “young people”.

    Not that that’s old or anything. I just think it’s funny how some older people tend to think of otherwise grown adults a few decades younger themselves as “kids”.

  189. 189.

    Kay

    @Marcopolo:

    It’s so important to reach those people, the bds of election and polling place employees. The US election process is fragmented and localized – you really have to drill down to each state and county. In Ohio half of them are Democrats, by rule. If we can even just educate our people on these boards and in polling places that will be enough.

  191. 191.

    Kay

    @sab:

    I don’t think it’s a public event. It’s their annual meeting. I just saw the email because they sent it to bds of elections members.

  193. 193.

    CaseyL

    @Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): Hey, I’ve gotten to the point of Old that anyone 30 or younger looks like a teenager.   I have indeed been attended to by healthcare providers who look like they should be in high school. (No, I do NOT say as much.)

  194. 194.

    Kent

    WE NEED TO TAKE ON THE CORPORATIONS WHO ARE ROBBING US BLIND

    is Sander’s answer to everything.  Why can’t a moderator ever ask him HOW??  and how you going to get it through Congress?

  195. 195.

    sab

    @Kay: I will try to get some of those adorable little Chinese embroidered mary janes for you. Even the soles are brocade.

  198. 198.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    @CaseyL:

    Hah! That’s one of my pet peeves. Some people tend to think I’m younger than what I am (mid 20s) and it pisses me off to no end most of the time. I work as a cashier at a grocery store and I occasionally get asked if I’m old enough. I’m sure I won’t mind when I’m 45, but in my early 20s It’s A Problem, especially if since I’m going to be an RN. I worry patients might have a hard time taking me seriously. I haven’t noticed as a student, but that might be because I’m a student

  199. 199.

    Mnemosyne

    @CaseyL:

    I still think that the anesthesiologist who took care of my surgery in 2018 was some kind of Doogie Hauser-type genius, because there’s no way he was more than 12 years old.

    But he did a really good job, so I didn’t say so to his face.

  202. 202.

    sab

    @sab: And I did actually vote for Ken Blackwell because I believed no black guy would do voter suppression  (also his webpage was very useful to lawyers and accountants wanting to know basic stuff about business and businesses in Ohio.)

    We all make mistakes. Hence, vicious vetting is okay. Sorry for the more timid jackals. This is life. You will probably survive.

  203. 203.

    Kent

    From the TPM blog

    A single exchange that captures a quality in Buttigieg that, anecdotally, turns some people off: Steyer dings him for his scant private sector experience — “Mayor Pete has three years as an analyst at McKinsey” — and Buttigieg simply cannot let the insult stand.

    “You demoted me, I was actually an associate but that’s okay,” he says, spelling out a distinction indistinguishable to all but his former McKinsey colleagues.

  204. 204.

    JAFD

    Look, when you get to be 69 (like me), the world is full of young people.  They look askance at your slang, your music is what plays on the supermarket’s PA system, and every politician now tries to be as young fresh and charismatic as JFK.

    I just try to talk to the yoots without boring them to death.  As an old T-shirt said “Love a history major – it will be a date to remember.”

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