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Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

When do we start airlifting the women and children out of Texas?

American history and black history cannot be separated.

So it was an October Surprise A Day, like an Advent calendar but for crime.

The rest of the comments were smacking Boebert like she was a piñata.

Thanks to your bullshit, we are now under siege.

I’ve spoken to my cat about this, but it doesn’t seem to do any good.

Give the craziest people you know everything they want and hope they don’t ask for more? Great plan.

I have other things to bitch about but those will have to wait.

Stop using mental illness to avoid talking about armed white supremacy.

A thin legal pretext to veneer over their personal religious and political desires.

Since we are repeating ourselves, let me just say fuck that.

Too often we hand the biggest microphones to the cynics and the critics who delight in declaring failure.

Never give a known liar the benefit of the doubt.

The arc of the moral universe does not bend itself. it is up to us to bend it.

Lick the third rail, it tastes like chocolate!

Not loving this new fraud based economy.

There are some who say that there are too many strawmen arguments on this blog.

Is it negotiation when the other party actually wants to shoot the hostage?

The Supreme Court cannot be allowed to become the ultimate, unaccountable arbiter of everything.

If you don’t believe freedom is for everybody, then the thing you love isn’t freedom, it is privilege.

If ‘weird’ was the finish line, they ran through the tape and kept running.

The revolution will be supervised.

Seems like a complicated subject, have you tried yelling at it?

This chaos was totally avoidable.

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You are here: Home / Civil Rights / Women's Rights / A Woman's Place Is In The House / Saturday Morning Open Thread: Let This Be A Good Omen

Saturday Morning Open Thread: Let This Be A Good Omen

by Anne Laurie|  January 18, 20205:54 am| 116 Comments

This post is in: A Woman's Place Is In The House, Election 2020, Open Threads, Television, Warren for President 2020

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Hillary Clinton: “Try to vote for the person you think is most likely to win because at the end of the day that is what will matter. And not just the popular vote, but the electoral college too.” https://t.co/QhhGevxfoT

— Ruby Cramer (@rubycramer) January 17, 2020

… Clinton appeared at the press tour in support of the Hulu four-part documentary series “Hillary,” which details the former U.S. Senator and Secretary of State’s time on the 2016 Presidential campaign trail through never-before-seen footage. The series also features interviews with Bill and Chelsea Clinton, as well as friends and journalists.

She fielded a range of questions from the audience, including what she feels the most important message of the series will ultimately be.

“I think the most important message is we are…in a real struggle with a form of politics that is incredibly negative, exclusive, mean-spirited, and its going to be up to every voter, not only people who vote in Democratic primaries to recognize that this is no ordinary time,” she said. “This is an election that will have such profound impact so take your vote seriously. And for the Democratic voters, try to vote for the person you think is most likely to win because at the end of the day that is what will matter. And not just the popular vote, but the electoral college too.”…

“It wasn’t so long ago that we actually had a President that we didn’t have to worry every morning when we woke up about what was going to happen that day, or what crazy tweet would threaten war or some other awful outcome,” she said.

“You can disagree with the facts, but there are facts,” she continued. “You can choose not to vaccinate your children but there are facts. You can choose not to believe in climate change, but there are facts. And somehow we’ve got to shoulder that responsibility not only at a political leadership level but literally at the citizen, activist, concerned human being level.”

 
Elsewhere, the end of the beginning.…

Voting in the 2020 election has begun / someday this war will be over. https://t.co/R1w2tR02Z0

— laura olin (@lauraolin) January 17, 2020

A few hearty Minnesotans spent the night in an RV outside the Minneapolis Early Voting Center Thursday night so they could cast the first votes in the nation at 8am for Elizabeth @ewarren @DaviSense @jared_mollenkof @toreyvanoot story https://t.co/hwwBTB4ECs pic.twitter.com/sogOXN2dsk

— Glen Stubbe (@gspphoto) January 17, 2020

Voting begins in Minnesota’s first presidential primary since 1992 https://t.co/hwwBTB4ECs

— Glen Stubbe (@gspphoto) January 17, 2020

… The deadline for voting is still over a month away. But the chance to participate in the state’s first presidential primary since 1992 — and cast a ballot before first-in-the-nation contests have their say — was enough to motivate some voters to brave frigid temperatures and a looming snowstorm to show support for their candidate of choice.

“We can’t afford to wait,” said Sean Duckworth, a Joe Biden supporter who attended an early vote rally for a range of Democratic candidates in Ramsey County. “We need change now, and he’s the person who is best able to do it, so I’m here to vote for him.”

Votes in Minnesota won’t be counted until after the polls close March 3. And some other states, including New Hampshire, have already started accepting absentee ballots for voters who can’t make it out on Election Day. But Minnesota’s election calendar and early voting laws mean the state can “confidently say we’ll be the first state in the country to open up the presidential contest to all eligible voters,” said Secretary of State Steve Simon…

“There’s some kind of special magic to the idea of getting to be one of the first people to cast your vote,” said Mitchell Walstad, a Warren supporter. “I thought it would be kind of fun, to go make a tweet out of it … and have an opportunity to show my support and do it in a loud fashion.”

In Duluth, City Council Member Arik Forsman joined a handful of Klobuchar supporters who showed up at City Hall right as early primary voting opened Friday morning.

“I think she has a really great track record in Minnesota of bridging that rural/urban divide,” Forsman said.

In South St. Paul, two local officials showed up at the polling place early Friday to not only cast ballots for the primary but to symbolically mark the city’s legacy as the first place in the U.S. where women voted after the 19th Amendment went into effect in 1920, officials said…

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Reader Interactions

116Comments

  1. 1.

    satby

    January 18, 2020 at 6:10 am

    Glad to see they ditched the caucus system for a more democratic voting system.

  2. 2.

    Baud

    January 18, 2020 at 6:21 am

    @satby: Agreed.  Someone said there were about only a handful of caucus states left.

  3. 3.

    eclare

    January 18, 2020 at 6:24 am

    @satby: I wondered what that meant, first primary since 1992.  Yes, good decision!  Sounds like IA has the potential to be seriously effed up.

  4. 4.

    satby

    January 18, 2020 at 6:28 am

    I just don’t like any voting system that relies on people having hours to blow on casting a vote. Caucuses are another voter suppression tool.

  5. 5.

    satby

    January 18, 2020 at 6:32 am

    I’ve been up since 3:30 but I’m procrastinating on going out the door into the icy rain. The temps have been going up, just edged above freezing, so if I wait maybe it’ll be less icy. ?

  6. 6.

    rikyrah

    January 18, 2020 at 6:33 am

    Good Morning, Everyone ???

  7. 7.

    Aleta

    January 18, 2020 at 6:37 am

    But a nation that made Hillary Clinton’s use of a private email server front-page news for years is so numb to Trump’s extravagant abuses of power that everything he does just rolls by as if we were watching a movie about another country with a dysfunctional political system and a corrupt, madcap leader. In a rambling campaign speech Tuesday night in Milwaukee, Trump elevated our discourse by describing Pelosi’s district in San Francisco as “filthy, dirty.”

    The heartbreak for democracy here is that Republicans, who would have held years of hearings if President Barack Obama or Hillary Clinton had been accused of watching Netflix on government computers, cover their eyes and ears when it comes to very nearly everything Trump does. It’s what we expect from authoritarian political systems in which the ruling party does whatever is necessary to maintain power — including, by the way, packing the courts. It’s not what we thought could happen here. (EJ Dionne Wash. Post)
    ‏,

  8. 8.

    Baud

    January 18, 2020 at 6:41 am

    @rikyrah: Good morning.

  9. 9.

    Baud

    January 18, 2020 at 6:42 am

    @satby: Agree.

  10. 10.

    OzarkHillbilly

    January 18, 2020 at 6:47 am

    Blech.

  11. 11.

    Baud

    January 18, 2020 at 6:48 am

    Sanders overwhelmingly won the March 26 caucus which had about 230,000 participants, winning 72.7% of the state’s legislative district delegates to Clinton’s 27.1%, giving Sanders a net gain of 47 pledged delegates.[1]

    Later, the state also held a non-binding primary vote on May 24, in which Clinton received about 52% of the vote – although this has no actual bearing on the delegate count for the nomination.[2]

    Washington Democratic primary, May 24, 2016
    Candidate Popular vote Estimated delegates
    Count Percentage Pledged Unpledged Total
    Hillary Clinton 420,461 52.38% 27 10 37
    Bernie Sanders 382,293 47.62% 74 0 74
    Total 802,754 100.00% 101 17 118

  12. 12.

    Chyron HR

    January 18, 2020 at 6:53 am

    @satby:

    But pwimawies are wigged against Boo-nie because most voters don’t like him. :(

  13. 13.

    sab

    January 18, 2020 at 7:09 am

    @satby: I agree.
    I was so politically active that I volunteered on campaigns in every election all through high school. When I got out of grad school and moved to Michigan ( a caucus state) I stopped voting altogether. The caucuses were dominated by bullying big older white men, and those were the Democrats. And the other side was Reagan. It seemed pointless to even vote.

    I didn’t reregister to vote again until I saw Jesse Jackson’s people at a little table in a grocery store parking lot.

  14. 14.

    JPL

    January 18, 2020 at 7:35 am

    How do we know who will win?    It’s easy to assume those who have a disadvantage, but that’s it.   Today is going to be a good day.   I didn’t wake up until six.

  15. 15.

    Baud

    January 18, 2020 at 7:41 am

    @sab:

    Now that was an interesting primary.

    Total popular vote results from primaries and caucuses:[65]

    Michael Dukakis – 10,024,101 (42.37%)

    Jesse Jackson – 6,941,816 (29.34%)

    Al Gore – 3,190,992 (13.49%)

    Dick Gephardt – 1,452,331 (6.14%)

    Paul M. Simon – 1,107,692 (4.68%)

    Gary Hart – 390,200 (1.65%)

    Unpledged delegates – 252,285 (1.07%)

    Bruce Babbitt – 85,749 (0.36%)

    Lyndon LaRouche – 74,728 (0.32%)

    David Duke – 45,290 (0.19%)

    Other Candidates – 36,232 (0.15%)

    James Traficant – 30,879 (0.13%)

    Douglas Applegate – 25,068 (0.11%)

  16. 16.

    Betty Cracker

    January 18, 2020 at 7:48 am

    There’s a disturbing story on CNN about Trump glorying in his remote-control kill power at a high-dollar donor event at his tacky-ass FL club last night. He boasts about ordering the strike on Soleimani and then drools over the details of listening in as it was carried out:

    “They’re together sir,” Trump recalled the military officials saying. “Sir, they have two minutes and 11 seconds. No emotion. ‘2 minutes and 11 seconds to live, sir. They’re in the car, they’re in an armored vehicle. Sir, they have approximately one minute to live, sir. 30 seconds. 10, 9, 8 …’ ” “Then all of a sudden, boom,” he went on. “‘They’re gone, sir. Cutting off.’ ” “I said, where is this guy?” Trump continued. “That was the last I heard from him.”

    Shades of the bizarre “crying and whimpering in a cave” thing about the ISIS dude, plus a festival of “sirs,” which is always a tell. Trump is a fucking psycho, no news there. But I’m thinking a malignant narcissist with blood lust and remote-control assassination capabilities might be an international menace, you guys. What if he just starts randomly whacking people on the US naughty list just because he enjoys it so much? I am not confident anyone would stop him.

  17. 17.

    Gvg

    January 18, 2020 at 7:48 am

    I picture caucuses as useful in pioneer days when people weren’t in instant constant communication and national candidates might never set foot in a state. So people who knew more and got newspapers could tell everyone what they had heard and people who didn’t know could spend 1 night learning then deciding. Obviously it was always subject to bias but it seems far more outrageous in modern time when time is wages and hurts the working classes more than the comfortable.

  18. 18.

    sab

    January 18, 2020 at 7:49 am

    @Baud: I had forgotten that Traficant was in it. Tim Ryan’s mentor.

  19. 19.

    low-tech cyclist

    January 18, 2020 at 7:49 am

    Hillary Clinton: “Try to vote for the person you think is most likely to win because at the end of the day that is what will matter. And not just the popular vote, but the electoral college too.”

    With all due respect for the woman we’d be addressing as “Ms. President” in a better world, this advice sucks.  The electoral college? It may come down to Wisconsin.  Do I have any idea who’s got the best chance of winning in Wisconsin? Hell, no! And I’m not going to spend my time between now and Maryland’s primary trying to suss that out.

    I think that, nationwide, we’re far better off making sure persons of color can vote, and nominating a candidate that motivates them to turn out in higher numbers than they did in 2016, than in trying to increase our vote share of blue-collar men who voted for Obama, then voted for Trump.  But whether that’s going to be the case in Wisconsin, I can only guess.

    But especially given global warming and the limited time we have to start making a big difference there, I think making simply winning in November the be-all and end-all is a big mistake.  We need to maximize the chances of success in 2021, taking into account the reality that if we lose in 2020, we also lose 2021.  In probability terms, we need to  choose the candidate that maximizes

    P(candidate wins in 2020)*P(Dems pass big legislation|candidate won in 2020).

    Vote for the candidate that you think maximizes that.

  20. 20.

    Aleta

    January 18, 2020 at 7:50 am

    @Baud: Thanks for this.

  21. 21.

    debbie

    January 18, 2020 at 8:01 am

    @satby:
    Why can’t there be pre-election caucuses to meet candidates and discuss positions with others and then have elections on a different day?

  22. 22.

    OzarkHillbilly

    January 18, 2020 at 8:08 am

    Pro-gun activists threaten to kill state lawmaker over bill they misunderstood

    Virginia’s only socialist state legislator said he has been the target of multiple death threats over a bill that pro-gun activists misinterpreted as a potential threat to their rights.

    The legislation introduced by Lee Carter, a 32-year-old Bernie Sanders-endorsed socialist, would allow public school teachers to strike without being fired, and has in fact nothing to do with guns. But some gun rights activists wrongly interpreted it as an attempt to fire law enforcement officials who might refuse to comply with gun control laws introduced by Virginia’s new Democratic legislative majority.

    The result, Carter said, has been a torrent of threats and abuse on social media, from promises to vote him out of office, to claims that “this is tyranny and you know what we do to tyrants,” to explicit threats of murder, like, “I’m going to make sure you don’t live through this legislative session” or “I’m going to kill this guy, y’all make sure you don’t forget my name.” Carter, says he has been so concerned about the death threats that he has started openly carrying a handgun to protect himself.

    On Monday, when tens of thousands of gun rights activists will converge on the state capitol in Richmond for what is expected to be a volatile demonstration against the new gun control bills introduced by Virginia Democrats, Carter said that he plans to be in hiding, at an undisclosed location, concerned that he might be a target of violence even in his own home.

    Among the threats against him, Carter said, there had been frequent mentions of Monday’s pro-gun protest, “and a lot of people saying, ‘We’re going to kick off the second American civil war. This guy is going to be the first one to die. Make sure you show up armed.”

    Yeah, somethings not right with these people. they are example #1 of what is wrong with our gun laws in this country. One would think, OK I would think, that the fact that we have allowed for the arming of people as unstable as them is exactly why we need to change the laws.

    But no.

    “[The extreme right] has been saying for years that an assault weapon ban is going to be their excuse to start killing people,” Carter said. “I tried to have this conversation with my colleagues, but, frankly, a lot of my colleagues don’t want to believe that that’s out there.”

    “I won’t even say it’s like a landmine, because a landmine you can’t see. There’s a big button on the ground that says, ‘If you step here, it will explode’ and Democrats just stomped on it, because they didn’t want to believe that it exists.”

    Instead, he said, he believed Democrats had an “head in the sand” mentality, he said, “that we can enact this policy, and that it will be fine”.

    “Their faith in institutions is so strong that they refuse to believe it’s not shared by everyone.”

    I understand he is receiving threats from random wackjobs who really mean what they say when they make these calls or write these letters, that he has no idea of who or when or where he might run into these lunatics. Over the years I have been thru some shit but nothing like what he is living thru. I have no idea what that is like, of how bone marrow deep is the fear he is feeling not just for himself but his loved ones too.*

    Chances are real good some people are going to die because of this shit. Some people already are. Ask a Jew how safe do they feel right now. Ask an African American how safe they feel right now. Ask a Latino how safe they feel right now.

    I just don’t think surrendering to fear is the answer.

    * for the record: I DO know that even as I wear my heart on my truck, and my head and my back, there is a limit to what I will say because if I ever said or did something to cause a target to be painted on my wife’s back, to inflict fear upon her, I am not sure I could forgive myself. There are times when, despite my self censoring, I am driving home and there is somebody who has been on my tail since I left the Walmart or Orschelns or the MFA, and I get a hinky feeling. I don’t know why, it’s probably nothing more than somebody feeling a little impatient with my doing 45 in the crooked and steep instead of the 48 they are used to doing. I’ll be looking in my rearview mirror as I am nearing my drive, trying to get a hint of what it is that is nagging at me. As I come around the last bend I won’t put on my turn signal, and I won’t pull into my drive. I’ll keep going till I get to the conversation area and turn in there. Once the person is past and no longer in sight I’ll turn around and go home.

    Because some of these people aren’t wound too tight. Some of these people would shoot you for shitting in their yard. Literally.

    So call me a hypocrite. Call me a coward. I will not see my wife, who spent way too many years living in fear, live in fear again.

  23. 23.

    debbie

    January 18, 2020 at 8:08 am

    @Betty Cracker:
    He’s always been a menace. It’s just shifted to the world stage.

    I know which narrative I want to be true, but I’d like clarification as to which is true: the decision was spontaneous vs. the decision was made weeks earlier.

  24. 24.

    debbie

    January 18, 2020 at 8:10 am

    @sab:

    The only man in politics with worse hair than Trump.

  25. 25.

    debbie

    January 18, 2020 at 8:14 am

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    I’ve done that too; better safe than sorry. I have been in that situation a few times; usually because I resist people cutting in front of me. I usually wind my way to the police station, just in case. They always disappear.

  26. 26.

    Betty Cracker

    January 18, 2020 at 8:31 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: As a fellow out liberal who is surrounded by twitchy gun-humping morons, I sympathize. My county recently declared itself a “2nd Amendment sanctuary.” Since Republicans hold every elected office in the county and there’s a Republican governor and Republican majority in the statehouse and a Republican president, there’s no threat to their Precious. There wouldn’t be if a Democrat was president, etc., either.

    They seem to get off on pretending to be persecuted as much as they love to intimidate others. Like you, I worry sometimes about the unhinged 1% or so of ammosexuals who might act out their fantasies. The vast majority are cowards; I’m confident I could shoo them off my porch with a broom.

    Of course, President Kerosene made the Virginia situation worse on Twitter. He’ll get more innocent Americans killed before he’s out of office, the fascist prick.

  27. 27.

    trnc

    January 18, 2020 at 8:35 am

    @low-tech cyclist: Yeah, I also thought it was odd advice because we already know anyone is tuned in enough to know politics at that level. IMHO, the more useful advice is “Vote for the dem nominee in November, even if he or she is not your preferred candidate.”

    IOW, electability isn’t the problem – turnout is the problem.

  28. 28.

    trnc

    January 18, 2020 at 8:40 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: So call me a hypocrite. Call me a coward. I will not see my wife, who spent way too many years living in fear, live in fear again.

    I understand. This is what makes that brand of gun nuts terrorists – violence aimed at shutting us up or limiting what we say and where we say it.

  29. 29.

    chris

    January 18, 2020 at 8:41 am

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    our gun laws in this country

    I think I see the problem. No idea what the nonviolent solution might be.

  30. 30.

    Princess

    January 18, 2020 at 8:42 am

    @low-tech cyclist: I agree — it’s stupid advice. The one who is most electable is the one most democrats are most excited/contented voting for. If everyone voted for their favourite, that’s who we’d get.

    It may be that all of them are electable. It may be that none of them are. Or some are and some aren’t. None of us knows who and the people I mistrust the most this cycyel are those who tell me “Only X is electable because…”

  31. 31.

    Kay

    January 18, 2020 at 8:47 am

    Funny NYTimes story about Trump screaming at the low quality hires because his health care polling is awful and Bloomberg runs ads attacking him on health care- he sees the ads:

    The call occurred during an evening meeting the president held in the Oval Office with a large group of campaign advisers, according to the people familiar with the events.
    After one of Mr. Trump’s pollsters, Tony Fabrizio, described the importance of health care as an electoral issue, Mr. Trump reached for the phone on the Resolute Desk and called Alex M. Azar II, the secretary of health and human services.
    “I never should have done this vaping thing,” Mr. Trump said, adding an expletive, according to two of the people familiar with what happened.

    I could have told him the Trumpsters are all vapers.

    He’s mad prescription drug prices haven’t “come down”.

  32. 32.

    OzarkHillbilly

    January 18, 2020 at 8:49 am

    @Betty Cracker:

    The vast majority are cowards; I’m confident I could shoo them off my porch with a broom.

    Yeah, I could carry, don’t even need a permit here, but I don’t because the likelihood of even the craziest among them confronting me is pretty damned small, smaller than the wee possibility I might blow my own damned foot off. But I once read of a gun laws activist, a woman who had been shot and paralyzed from the waist down, who was confronted on her own front porch from the shadows by a man with a water pistol. Just to say, “Yeah Bitch, I own you.”

    That’s the caliber of people we are dealing with. They always go for the weakest. Not gonna happen to my wife, not if I can help it.

  33. 33.

    OzarkHillbilly

    January 18, 2020 at 8:53 am

    @chris: Yep, the nonviolent solution is voting for sane candidates, which might well end in violence.

  34. 34.

    Kay

    January 18, 2020 at 9:00 am

    Trump watching anti-Trump political ads may be the only time he sees or hears anything about his administration that is true. We read that he reacts insanely defensively to the ads and starts screaming at the low quality hires and maybe this is understandable, since all he watches is Fox and the people he hires spend all day everyday desperately trying to curry favor him, so lie to him (and us) constantly.

    It’s all new to him and it just comes at him, unfiltered by the babysitters, when he’s watching his 6 or 8 hours of television daily.

  35. 35.

    Immanentize

    January 18, 2020 at 9:00 am

    @Princess: I agree, I don’t mind appeals to personal electability.  Biden does that by talking about his past, Kobluchar does that by talking about the rural/urban divide and Warren is doing that by expressly describing how she can best bridge the left/right divide.  What I hate is people arguing why their opponent is not electable.  Hate it! I’m looking at you, __________.

    (Madlib!)

  36. 36.

    Immanentize

    January 18, 2020 at 9:01 am

    @chris: oh, you see a violent solution to the problem?  Or did you mean something else?

  37. 37.

    sab

    January 18, 2020 at 9:03 am

    @Princess: I may be overinterpreting, but I think Clinton means let’s not go all purity pony this time. My second and third choices are already gone (and my second choice was just a notch below my first choice). If my first choice is gone before our primary then I will still be voting for my fourth choice.

  38. 38.

    Immanentize

    January 18, 2020 at 9:05 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: As long as guns are basically unregulated, there will be gunplay.  Even when they are there is.  What needs to be reversed is the idea of maximal access and unlimited firepower.

    I still like my idea “Get RIL about guns”
    Register sales
    Insure ownership
    License automatic and semi-automatic weapons.

  39. 39.

    debbie

    January 18, 2020 at 9:05 am

    @Kay:

    He’s mad prescription drug prices haven’t “come down”.

    And yet, what exactly has he done about it? //

  40. 40.

    Chris Johnson

    January 18, 2020 at 9:05 am

    @trnc: This. I don’t want to bitch about Clinton: that was her message the whole entire time, and she got my vote and in fact won the popular vote. But it’s gaming the system, and the system is failing if it’s giving us people like Trump. The system’s set up with both the extreme right and left co-opted by a hostile foreign power and she knows that full well.

    You CANNOT just say ‘vote for who is most likely to win (hint: comforting establishment figures and same old same old)’. When shitloads of people are disenfranchised or being imprisoned, exterminated, it’s gone beyond ‘politics as a game to win’.

    Hell, I don’t know what I’m saying. it gets so complicated. I wish Hillary would say ‘GTFO Twitter and Facebook’ or something useful like that. But she’s not thinking in those terms. Warren has a plan for it. I don’t know if it’s too late.

    ‘Vote for who you think is most likely to win’ is damned dangerous advice when Russian (okay, and Iranian/Israeli/Chinese/Korean/etc) trolls are flooding the information sphere. It’s like letting yourself get stampeded to right where they want you. Maybe ‘fearlessly vote for who is most likely to fix the jam we’re all in’?

    ‘persist’ works for me, too :)

  41. 41.

    joel hanes

    January 18, 2020 at 9:06 am

    @low-tech cyclist:

    this advice sucks

    I think it’s a diplomatic way of saying “Don’t vote for Bernie or Gabbard or Williamson or Pete”, or maybe even “Let’s all get behind Biden”

    Not saying whether I think that advice sucks or not.

  42. 42.

    Immanentize

    January 18, 2020 at 9:07 am

    @sab: My first and third choices are out — Harris and Castro.  Booker never registered on my list.  So I am left with my first, my fourth or fifth, my in case of fire (Biden) and must I?

  43. 43.

    debbie

    January 18, 2020 at 9:08 am

    @Kay:

    My RWNJ friends from high school are all flipping out about Colbert’s show. Because I don’t feel like getting into a trolling fight, I’ve held myself back from posting that I think he’s the best thing on television. Though I think they already know that since they see my posts and know my political views.

    I’ll be the bigger person and not gloat. //

  44. 44.

    Kay

    January 18, 2020 at 9:09 am

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    Right wingers themselves worry about it, they just lie and say they don’t. We used to hold mediations in a bank conference room – for decades- and they quietly moved them to the courthouse where they have to pass thru a metal detector and security. It’s less convenient for the parties because courthouse space is often at a premium and they use the room for other things. It takes 6 weeks to get in where it used to take one or two.

    They’re all a bunch of phonies, covering their own asses while loudly proclaiming that it “isn’t the gun”. If it isn’t the gun why are they running everyone and their sister thru a metal detector and a search? Are they patting them down for mental illness?

  45. 45.

    debbie

    January 18, 2020 at 9:09 am

    @sab:

    I agree. She’s referring to BS.

  46. 46.

    Baud

    January 18, 2020 at 9:10 am

    Y’all getting worked up over a single debatable line is reminiscent of the CDS of 2016 that gave us Trump in the first place.

  47. 47.

    debbie

    January 18, 2020 at 9:11 am

    @Immanentize:

    Make that RILA: Accountability for all of the consequences from firing the weapon.

  48. 48.

    eclare

    January 18, 2020 at 9:12 am

    Nancy was on Maher last night.  She was good and got a standing ovation.  IMO Maher was respectful.

  49. 49.

    joel hanes

    January 18, 2020 at 9:14 am

    @Kay:

    If the gun-humpers believed their own rhetoric, they’d allow open carry at the NRA convention.

    Instead it’s no guns allowed.

  50. 50.

    Immanentize

    January 18, 2020 at 9:14 am

    @Kay: That’s why I thought it would be fun/evil not to run anti-Trump ads on FOX, but something like anti-Pompeo suggesting he is usurping Trump’s power.

    Narrator Voice: Why is Secretary Pompeo giving orders to the military instead of our President? 
    Woman in front of tractor: I don’t trust that man with anything, especially not my son’s life. Pompeo acts like he should be President instead of the man I voted for.
    Another man in a diner:
    No one elected Pompeo to anything, the man can’t even manage his own people
    Narrator: Keep Trump great.

  51. 51.

    rp

    January 18, 2020 at 9:16 am

    I think it’s her discrete way of endorsing Biden.

  52. 52.

    Kay

    January 18, 2020 at 9:17 am

    I do worry a little about canvassers re: Trump gun nuts and we had canvassers express some concern in 2018. Since I don’t think there’s any point in approaching someone who still supports Trump in the general and it’s a waste of canvassers (limited) time donation I hope we have “good” lists that don’t send our people to those addresses at all. Solves that problem.

  53. 53.

    Nelle

    January 18, 2020 at 9:17 am

    @Immanentize: My first and second choices, Harris and Castro, are out.  Warren is coming to the school about four miles away on Monday so if The Cough allows, I will go (predicted high temp will be 7, coming up from predicted low of -7).  I’ve offered housing to Warren volunteers and my husband will be a caucus wrangler for Warren.

    Ever since we moved here, presidential candidates have been thick on the ground.  I expect them to disappear on Feb. 4 (and the senators sooner).  We’ll turn our attention to ridding Iowa of Joni Ernst then

    The DNC endorsed a candidate within a few days of her announcing.  We’re drawn to Michael Franken, though.  Plus making sure that our Dem Rep to the House keeps her seat.  The Kochs are coming after her.  And the local county party is working hard on state and local elections.  Plenty to do.

  54. 54.

    Immanentize

    January 18, 2020 at 9:17 am

    @Kay:. That is so true. For a while, being a Judge on the divorce docket was the most dangerous job in Northern Texas. Friggin crazy violent armed husbands….

  55. 55.

    Immanentize

    January 18, 2020 at 9:19 am

    @debbie: That is what the Insurance is for.  If we could make insurance a requirement for gun ownership, this shit would sort itself out in a hurry because, actuaries.

    (Also RIL sounds like “real” when said out loud)

  56. 56.

    Immanentize

    January 18, 2020 at 9:22 am

    @Nelle:

    We’ll turn our attention to ridding Iowa of Joni Ernst then

    Happy thought, indeed!

  57. 57.

    sab

    January 18, 2020 at 9:23 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: One of the reasons I don’t have a gun is I probably WOULD shoot a human I caught crapping on my lawn. On the other hand, dogs do it all the time and I don’t even yell at them. I just encourage my dogs to crap on theirs. Thus following the norms, since I still believe in doing that.

  58. 58.

    Kay

    January 18, 2020 at 9:23 am

    @Immanentize:

    That would go to his ego but I think Trump does understand his base. I think it’s the only thing he understands. I think he lays out what he’s vulnerable on every day. He tells us. He knows as well as any Democratic operative that his voters rely on either government-provided health care or government regulations and programs on health care.

    So I would run ads on cutting Social Security. He ran on protecting it for a reason. Unlike the Ayn Rand/Paul Ryan wing of the party he knows exactly who supports him.

    He tells us what to attack him on. Over and over. I knew the vaping ban would enrage his base because I live among his base. He knew it too. He delayed and diddled for months. Trump is an expert on Trump devotees.

  59. 59.

    OzarkHillbilly

    January 18, 2020 at 9:25 am

    @Immanentize: It is illegal to own an automatic weapon without the proper permit (IIRC, a Gun Dealer’s license) Bump stocks are how they get around that particular fly in the ointment. I don’t understand how they remain legal. The numb nut Base whack job fugitive from Canada who was recently arrested? One of the charges against was modifying a semi auto to make it fully auto. By definition, that is what a bump stock does, it modifies a semi auto and turns it into a gun with limited auto capability by allowing it to fire 3 round bursts.

    I don’t think needing a license for semi-autos is feasible, there are too many different types. I think it is more feasible to limit the capacity of magazines. After all, for decades nobody ever had a semi auto long gun that held more than 6 rounds, or a handgun that held I think, 11 rounds.

  60. 60.

    Kay

    January 18, 2020 at 9:28 am

    @Immanentize:

    Everyone says divorce but no one mentions probate. The only time I have seen actual property damage occur at a mediation was at one involving siblings competing for a piece of farmground. It can be really ugly and just as personal.

  61. 61.

    sab

    January 18, 2020 at 9:28 am

    @Kay: Yeah. I have never been afraid canvassing in the neighborhoods full of crack houses in my city. Those  guys are mostly asleep on weekend days. But a couple of times in Republican neighborhoods I have been charged by big dogs. If one ever actually bites me I will identify it and report it to police, animal control and the ER doctors.

  62. 62.

    OzarkHillbilly

    January 18, 2020 at 9:31 am

    @Immanentize: Heh, he’d blow an aneurysm on the spot.

  63. 63.

    chris

    January 18, 2020 at 9:33 am

    @Immanentize: Well, we’d be more than happy to let you copy our gun laws but I have no idea how you would enforce them without bloodshed.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearms_regulation_in_Canada

  64. 64.

    Immanentize

    January 18, 2020 at 9:35 am

    @Kay:. So true, when I took my Mom to get her will written, the lawyer said it shocked her how people may not argue about dividing 5 or 10 thousand dollars, but fistfights broke out in the office over the dining room table left behind. Even things that small would trigger long held family animosities

  65. 65.

    sab

    January 18, 2020 at 9:36 am

    @Immanentize: In my misspent youth I was a divorce and bankruptcy lawyer. Accounting is so much safer, and actually not nearly as boring.

  66. 66.

    trnc

    January 18, 2020 at 9:38 am

    @Chris Johnson: Yup. At this point, the best candidate will be able to fix some of DT’s damage the worst candidate not named Tulsi will be able to at least stop the hemorrhaging.

  67. 67.

    OzarkHillbilly

    January 18, 2020 at 9:39 am

    @Kay: We had that problem in Crawford County in ’08. I was the only one who would go door to door in Steelville (Isn’t that no longer allowed? A canvasser working by themselves?) All the other volunteers (and there were only a handful of us door to door folks) thought I was either brave or nuts. Probably both.

    That said, I never had a problem beyond curtness, which I am the King of Curt so it didn’t bother me. I’d apologize for bothering them and move on.

  68. 68.

    sab

    January 18, 2020 at 9:41 am

    @Immanentize: After my mom died one of my cousins and I reunited several matched chair sets that had been split up 50 years ago when our grandmother died. Everything was divided precisely equally between my dad and his sister. My mom died  still mad that they got the piano, even though the recipient played much much better than I ever could.

  69. 69.

    Immanentize

    January 18, 2020 at 9:43 am

    @sab:

    divorce and bankruptcy lawyer.

    Quite a natural, but fraught, combination. Actually way more dangerous than being a criminal defense attorney — I took the safer path.

  70. 70.

    OzarkHillbilly

    January 18, 2020 at 9:44 am

    @sab: Heh, I got charged by a pair of pitbulls sleeping under the porch. A hasty retreat is one way to describe my reaction.

  71. 71.

    Omnes Omnibus

    January 18, 2020 at 9:48 am

    @Immanentize: I specifically did not take Family Law when I was in law school so that I could plead ignorance of anything to do with divorce or child placement/support/etc.  This decision has served me well over the years.

  72. 72.

    germy

    January 18, 2020 at 9:50 am

    @Chris Johnson:

    I wish Hillary would say ‘GTFO Twitter and Facebook’ or something useful like that.

    Twitter is great if you can't afford therapy but you also don't want to get any better.
    — Michael, the Man Who Tweets ? (@Home_Halfway) June 15, 2019

  73. 73.

    OzarkHillbilly

    January 18, 2020 at 9:51 am

    @Immanentize: Those things have emotional connections, memories attached, money doesn’t. After my mother’s death all us kids (and grandkids who could) went thru the house putting post it notes on stuff we wanted. A lot of things had 2 or 3 post it notes on them. They would engage in a little amicable horse trading and that was it. No fights.

    My mother always said the best thing she gave her children was each other. She was right.

  74. 74.

    Jinchi

    January 18, 2020 at 9:58 am

    @JPL: How do we know who will win? It’s easy to assume those who have a disadvantage, but that’s it.

    I believe in the wisdom of crowds, the nominee will be the strongest candidate in the general, but only if everyone is selecting their own preferred candidate. It all breaks down once people start projecting and making decisions based on what they think their neighbors will do. The whole Bernie-Warren argument the other night came down to a conversation where he basically said, “I’d love to vote for a woman president, but the rest of the nation is to sexist to allow it.”

    This is why I hate the “electability” argument. We’ll know who’s most electable when that person wins the primary.

  75. 75.

    Chyron HR

    January 18, 2020 at 9:59 am

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    Has Mr. Carter tried explaining to the Messiah Bernie that America cannot necessarily implement every progressive policy that has been successfully instituted in other western democracies, and that there are reasons why that is the case other than Democratic feculence?  Because it seems to me that this negates the central thesis of Messiah Bernie’s entire religion.

  76. 76.

    sab

    January 18, 2020 at 10:02 am

    @Omnes Omnibus: Family law experience has stood me in good stead as step-parent, since I am aware of a lot of the pitfalls and triggers. I try to defuse situations instead of always standing by my man. And I never ever let the kids hear anything bad about their mom from my lips.

  77. 77.

    OzarkHillbilly

    January 18, 2020 at 10:06 am

    @sab:

    And I never ever let the kids hear anything bad about their mom from my lips.

    Big time No no. What ever one thinks of the ex, no matter what they may have done to their children, s/he is still their parent and they love them anyway.

  78. 78.

    zhena gogolia

    January 18, 2020 at 10:14 am

    @Baud:

    I know.

  79. 79.

    Betty Cracker

    January 18, 2020 at 10:24 am

    @Baud: & @zhena gogolia: Can y’all elaborate? I don’t see it.

  80. 80.

    mad citizen

    January 18, 2020 at 10:30 am

    @debbie: Are they upset over a particular segment, or just in general, regarding the Colbert show?  He is definitely on Trump all the time.

    On canvassing, I saw a poster inviting people to sign up to Census (pics of young people, so I guess that’s their target demo).  Hope there are no incidents with any Census takers this year.

  81. 81.

    Omnes Omnibus

    January 18, 2020 at 10:33 am

    @Betty Cracker: We parse everything to death.

  82. 82.

    artem1s

    January 18, 2020 at 10:33 am

    be careful about taking her quote out of context and remember this part of the interview…

    “You can disagree with the facts, but there are facts,” she continued. “You can choose not to vaccinate your children but there are facts. You can choose not to believe in climate change, but there are facts. And somehow we’ve got to shoulder that responsibility not only at a political leadership level but literally at the citizen, activist, concerned human being level.”

    my take away is she’s speaking to the A Idiots who have been caught up in certain candidate’s lies about our government, political leaders (Pelosi) and country (deep state) that threw away their vote on Jill Stein and Johnson in some a vain attempt to ‘prove’ we need a third party or some such nonsense.

    The Dems have been victims of chasing the ‘independent’ voter fallacy for decades now.  There is no such thing as an independent Party or Green Party at the National level. On the other hand, if you are looking at a local race and there is a choice between a guy who promises everything your heart desires and a regular guy who is boring as fuck but you know will show up and hire competent people to work for him, be realistic about what you are voting for.  Especially if the third guy in the race is a bugfucking crazy conservative who can benefit from a split vote.  Louise Gohmert has effectively killed the last vestiges of the fact based GOP because he found away to get his base to vote against the facts and their best interests.

    As Democrats, she saying we have a responsibility to take the high road in campaigning on the facts – and as voters we have the responsibility to vote for the facts.  She’s imploring the cultists to be reasonable in the end and deal with the facts – sometimes your guy can’t win but you can still vote for and support the facts even if you aren’t voting for your preferred candidate.

  83. 83.

    Anya

    January 18, 2020 at 10:33 am

    @Kay: In 2012, in Ohio, some crazy rightwing guy who was on the “get out the vote” list held a guy to my face and threatened to shoot us if we didn’t leave his porch. Imagine how much more insane that dude it these days. It was the first time in my entire life, I saw a gun.

  84. 84.

    kindness

    January 18, 2020 at 10:39 am

    In the primaries I’ll vote my preference which is now Warren but in the general election I’ll be voting for the Democrat.  And if any of my BernieBro friends start the whole Jill Stein (fill in the blank) vote I will not take that shit.  I had a hard enough time with them in ’16.  I honestly heard them say we would deserve Trump because we chose Hillary.  I just don’t understand people like that.

  85. 85.

    debbie

    January 18, 2020 at 10:40 am

    @mad citizen:

    Knowing them, it’s making fun of Trump in his opening monologue. He covers other things, especially in the second half of the monologue, but any slight is reason for outrage.

    Neither ever complained about criticism aimed at his predecessor, surprisingly. //

  86. 86.

    J R in WV

    January 18, 2020 at 10:44 am

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    After our father died, we got together at the family home, my brother and I flipped a coin to see who would go first, then we took turns picking things by putting little round colored dots on them.

    Then, everything left went in a Saturday afternoon auction, books went for $300-400… bidders said “They don’t know what they have here!” They were local history books written by my great-uncle, and we had plenty of them. We each got pristine copies and sold marked up copies.

  87. 87.

    rikyrah

    January 18, 2020 at 10:53 am

    @satby: 
    Don’t go out ??

  88. 88.

    OzarkHillbilly

    January 18, 2020 at 10:57 am

    @J R in WV:  I am not a very materialistic person so I just don’t understand fighting over that kind of stuff. I think I wanted less than a dozen items. A couple of my siblings noticed and started putting my name on a couple things they thought I should have. After thinking about it I decided to keep them in the thought that if later I decided otherwise I could always give them to one of my sons or nephews/nieces.

  89. 89.

    Steeplejack

    January 18, 2020 at 11:00 am

    Hmm, the “Ben Afquack” respite thread seems to have disappeared, at least for me (Win10, Firefox).

    Here’s my reply to MomSense about Mike Bloomfield:

    I know it’s [“Killing Floor”] not the original, but there are songs where you just get imprinted on one version. When “Killing Floor” comes up, I always think of this.

    Bloomfield was great, and that album, A Long Time Comin’, is a great showcase. I especially like his solo in “Another Country,” starting at 4:00 and shifting gears at 5:45. (The whole song is good; the squeamish can skip the chaotic bit from 2:25 to 4:00.)

    That album deserves a remix to bring out the guitar a bit more.

  90. 90.

    WaterGirl

    January 18, 2020 at 11:08 am

    TaMara, if you see this, can you please check your email and contact me?  thank you

  91. 91.

    chris

    January 18, 2020 at 11:09 am

    @Steeplejack: Weird, the right side arrow was there for a moment but it just went to a blank page.

  92. 92.

    Steeplejack

    January 18, 2020 at 11:09 am

    Has there been a disruption in the Force?

  93. 93.

    OzarkHillbilly

    January 18, 2020 at 11:11 am

    @Steeplejack: I’ve been having problems with that thread all morning. Now all I get is a blank page. The only reason I know it’s Balloon Juice is because of the address bar. Really weird.

    And yeah, also Firefox and Win 10.

  94. 94.

    OzarkHillbilly

    January 18, 2020 at 11:11 am

    @chris: I’ve lost that side arrow entirely.

  95. 95.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    January 18, 2020 at 11:12 am

    @eclare:

    Nancy was on Maher last night.  She was good and got a standing ovation.  IMO Maher was respectful.

    I haven’t watched him in years, but that might be one to seek out.
    He’s so thoroughly obnoxious himself– even if he occasionally gets off a great line, and then even when he has a guest I’m curious about, he adds in some right-winger or Bernista who’s as obnoxious as he is

  96. 96.

    Steeplejack

    January 18, 2020 at 11:12 am

    @chris:

    That thread was up for quite a while, although comments took a long time to load (for me). Then it disappeared when I tried to post that last comment. I wonder if it had something to do with the embedded video. When the page was laboriously loading, there was a long “waiting for YouTube” stretch.

    And this thread didn’t show me any new comments upon refresh until I posted my “disruption” comment.

  97. 97.

    OzarkHillbilly

    January 18, 2020 at 11:13 am

    Alyssa Nakken becomes first female coach in MLB history

    For San Fransisco, Assistant Manager, in uniform and in the dugout.

  98. 98.

    MomSense

    January 18, 2020 at 11:14 am

    @sab:

    He had a national program to teach students to register people to vote that I joined in 1987.  I remember we started by registering college students to vote and then we fanned out.

    My mom always complained that so many of the lower wage employees she talked to at the nursing home, hospital, and other places around Akron were not registered to vote and were sort of set on not voting.  Do you find that to be the case, too?

  99. 99.

    WaterGirl

    January 18, 2020 at 11:15 am

    Everyone

    The Ben Afquack post was causing an issue with the server. There’s no need to be concerned about the “it’s there and then it’s not” post.

    For now, p0lease think of this post as the latest post until we get the issue resolved.  Carry on. :-)

  100. 100.

    OzarkHillbilly

    January 18, 2020 at 11:16 am

    @Steeplejack:

    Then it disappeared when I tried to post that last comment.

    Aha! So you’re to blame!

    This thread has been pretty much dead. I have replied to folks w/o any problems at all. No funny business.

    ETA: Heh. I’ve been refreshing the Afquack thread about once every 5 mins or so and always have to hit resend for my last attempt at commenting. This last time I got:

    You are posting comments too quickly. Slow down.

  101. 101.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    January 18, 2020 at 11:20 am

    My mom has a whole bunch of knick-knacks and tchotchkes she loves, I think some of it might be valuable if we could find a buyer. It would break her heart to know most of it is going to some version of goodwill, or those shoestring cousins who will take anything as long as it’s free. I think I’d rather have it go to charity.

  102. 102.

    debbie

    January 18, 2020 at 11:21 am

    @Steeplejack:

    Try again. I just refreshed and TaMara has fixed the thread.

  103. 103.

    trollhattan

    January 18, 2020 at 11:21 am

    @Betty Cracker:

    Did he also say, “Died like a dog”? Trump, famously dog-averse, thinks that’s a clever turn of phrase.

  104. 104.

    debbie

    January 18, 2020 at 11:22 am

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    I got a message like “You already said that” and found myself apologizing to the screen.

  105. 105.

    kindness

    January 18, 2020 at 11:22 am

    @WaterGirl: I’m sure glad I got to see the video.  So cute.  But we all love duck/critter pics/videos here.

  106. 106.

    Steeplejack

    January 18, 2020 at 11:22 am

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    Technical difficulties.

  107. 107.

    WaterGirl

    January 18, 2020 at 11:24 am

    @TaMara (HFG): TaMara, can you please get in touch with me?  There are still issues with this post.  I sent 4 email messages but I suspect you haven’t seen them yet.

  108. 108.

    Amir Khalid

    January 18, 2020 at 11:27 am

    The duck-and-kitty respite post has disappeared. So has its fixed version.?

  109. 109.

    OzarkHillbilly

    January 18, 2020 at 11:32 am

    @Amir Khalid: Well I’m glad I watched the video before it did.

  110. 110.

    delk

    January 18, 2020 at 11:39 am

    There’s a canard joke waiting to be made.

  111. 111.

    WaterGirl

    January 18, 2020 at 12:03 pm

    Yes, the duck was adorable and it sounds like the video was even better.

    There was a serious problem within the post itself.  Cuteness overload?  Posts gone wild?  I’m sure it was nothing that Tamara did.

    The developers finally had to delete the post itself so the site could return to normal.  Which it did.

    THE END.

  112. 112.

    Bill Arnold

    January 18, 2020 at 12:11 pm

    @Betty Cracker:

    There’s a disturbing story on CNN about Trump glorying in his remote-control kill power at a high-dollar donor event at his tacky-ass FL club last night.

    This is pretty bad. He has a new toy.
    He has no f-in clue how vulnerable he, personally is. And how vulnerable all public figures are, if assassination becomes normalized.
    Gah.

  113. 113.

    Another Scott

    January 18, 2020 at 12:27 pm

    @low-tech cyclist: Yeah, as a sound bite, Hillary’s remark has lots of potential problems.

    I prefer to think of it as advice not to do a Purity vote for some spoiler.  And never, ever, vote 3rd party when the election is on the line.  That kind of thing.

    Dunno.

    Cheers,

    Scott.

  114. 114.

    Barbara

    January 18, 2020 at 5:38 pm

    @Baud: I’m still angry at Gary Hart. 

  115. 115.

    Procopius

    January 18, 2020 at 10:47 pm

    @Betty Cracker:

    But I’m thinking a malignant narcissist with blood lust and remote-control assassination capabilities might be an international menace, you guys.

    Well, I’m sorry to bring this up, but do you remember who started with the “remote-control assassination?” It goes back to George W. Bush. Actually, Bill Clinton was urged to use a cruise missile to hit Osama bin Laden, but he refused because the probability of hitting OBL was very low and lots of “collateral damage” was assured. Then Obama increased the drone program roughly ten times over GWB, and added the provision that American citizens could be targeted without due process. Apparently Trump has authorized more drone strikes in three years than Obama did in 8, but get used to it. All presidents from now on are going to be doing it.

  116. 116.

    Procopius

    January 18, 2020 at 10:50 pm

    @Gvg: It used to be considered disgraceful for a candidate to actually go out soliciting votes. I really wish we could return to those thrilling days of yesteryear. I wish there was some way to restrict the election to two or three months. I might as well wish I had a pony.

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