Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

The worst democrat is better than the best republican.

Just because you believe it, that doesn’t make it true.

Authoritarian republicans are opposed to freedom for the rest of us.

New McCarthy, same old McCarthyism.

When I decide to be condescending, you won’t have to dream up a fantasy about it.

It’s time for the GOP to dust off that post-2012 autopsy, completely ignore it, and light the party on fire again.

Republicans choose power over democracy, every day.

Republicans: slavery is when you own me. freedom is when I own you.

American History and Black History Cannot Be Separated

Since when do we limit our critiques to things we could do better ourselves?

You can’t love your country only when you win.

Damn right I heard that as a threat.

Let me eat cake. The rest of you could stand to lose some weight, frankly.

The republican caucus is already covering themselves with something, and it’s not glory.

Motto for the House: Flip 5 and lose none.

And now I have baud making fun of me. this day can’t get worse.

The poor and middle-class pay taxes, the rich pay accountants, the wealthy pay politicians.

Too often we confuse noise with substance. too often we confuse setbacks with defeat.

Shallow, uninformed, and lacking identity

We’ll be taking my thoughts and prayers to the ballot box.

Thanks to your bullshit, we are now under siege.

“Everybody’s entitled to be an idiot.”

Republicans in disarray!

“Jesus paying for the sins of everyone is an insult to those who paid for their own sins.”

You are here: Home / Past Elections / 2020 Elections / Election Year Open Thread: Update on Some Local Races

Election Year Open Thread: Update on Some Local Races

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So it’s back to his original career plan – Rush Limbaugh, but from the ‘Left’...

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232Comments

  3. 3.

    Redshift

    A friend of mine did camera work for Cenk back when he was a cable access host. Apparently he used to have guests on and not think to ask them anything, so they just got to sit there while he talked the whole time.
    Seems like not much has changed…

  5. 5.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    after refusing for the better part of (I think) a year, Steve Bullock is running for Senate in Montana. The path gets a little wider.

    Kyle Griffin
    @kylegriffin1
    Gov. Steve Bullock of Montana is poised to reverse himself and run for the Senate, three Democratic officials tell NYT, a decision that would hand the party a coveted recruit who could help reclaim a majority in the chamber.

  9. 9.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @debbie: oh yeah. IF you click on the embedded video at the end, which I do not necessarily recommend, you can see. I made it about 40 seconds.

  10. 10.

    Frankensteinbeck

    The Maine news pleases me.  The blue wave of the last three years has lost no momentum.

  13. 13.

    Martin

    There’s a good idea in there, though. Can we pass a law that says you can’t be a political commentator unless you’ve at least won a city council race?

  18. 18.

    NotMax

    @Martin

    Careful. Your contempt for those who don’t happen to live in a locale where there exists such an elected body is showing.

  24. 24.

    clay

    @MattF: I cannot wait to take my daughters to see them in concert! They haven’t released dates yet, but my wife and I agree that we would travel far to see them.

  25. 25.

    Martin

    @NotMax: I would substitute something similar. What do people in the woods do? Is militia leader an elected position? Wet t-shirt judge? I know that there are FBI (Female Body Inspector) agents – I’ve seen those uniforms. Are they elected?

  26. 26.

    feebog

    I’m next door to CA 25 and have supported Christy Smith for her Assembly run and now congressional run.  We are in for a battle as Mike Garcia is a much better candidate than Steve Knight.  Gunna be some blood on the streets before this one is over.

  29. 29.

    Uncle Cosmo

    Dunno if anyone’s noted this, but “cenk uygur” literally means “young Turk” in Turkish, if you stretch the definition of “Turk” just a tad:

    The Uyghurs, alternately Uygurs, Uighurs or Uigurs, are a Turkic minority ethnic group originating from and culturally affiliated with the general region of Central and East Asia. The Uyghurs are recognized as native to the Xinjiang Uyghur Autonomous Region in Northwest China.

    But from all evidence I can dig up, it’s his real (birth) name. Go figure (in Turkish that’s şekil ver)./trivia

  32. 32.

    MisterForkbeard

    Cenk even SOUNDS like Rush Limbaugh. Not to mention he spent time there lying and comparing Bernie to Obama. Glad to see him go down.

  33. 33.

    RoonieRoo

    MJ Hegar, my choice, did very well in our primary for taking on Cornyn.  There will be a runoff with Royce West.  MJ being able to take out Cornyn will 100% depend on the coattails of the presidential nominee.

  35. 35.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    @feebog: On thing I noticed about Garcia that was odd, he served for ALMOST 20 years in the Navy.  Don’t they usually retire(if they’re not being promoted further) after 20 years, rather than just separate?

  38. 38.

    NotMax

    @Roger Moore

    It’s a take-off of the slang phrase Young Turks, referring to younger people impatient for change, which dates back at least to the 1920s.

  39. 39.

    David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch

    Cenk conned his suckers viewers into giving him $1,044,595.   He had almost the same amount as Democrat Christy Smith ($1,147,446).   He had his “tee vee show” promoting him 24/7 and he still only got 3 measly percent of the vote.

     

    HA!

  40. 40.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    @rikyrah: Actually I did see ONE ad for Joe on the Monday 11pm news here in LA.  Bloomberg, Steyer, and Bernie had been on the air for about a month with one or two ads in the 35 minute newscast.  Warren started running ads the weekend before the primary here.

  41. 41.

    Josie

    @rikyrah:

    I was so glad to hear Nicolle make this point.  She said she would repeat it every time someone accused Biden of being pushed forward by the establishment.  We should all follow her example.

  43. 43.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    Jonathan Chait@jonathanchait
    This is the first time I have ever seen a press secretary make the case that people are voting against his boss solely to spite him.

    David Sirota @davidsirota
    “I cant stand the thought of Sirota having an office in the basement of the OEOB so I’m voting for the health care industry’s candidate while thousands die because they can’t afford medical care” is a take that I cant believe exists in the world, but alas, it does on this website

  45. 45.

    Roger Moore

    @NotMax:

    Sure, I’m familiar with the historical Young Turks, who actually got going pre-WWI.  I’m just suggesting that if Cenk’s name might be loosely translated as “Young Turk”, it would give him one more reason to choose that name for his show.  OTOH, given that the government ushered in by The Young Turks was responsible for the Armenian Genocide, I’m not sure I would be so eager to apply that name to my attempt to overturn the existing order.

  46. 46.

    David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch

    People won’t say it but the truth is that many voters in SC are low information voters. Which is a nice way to put it. Proof is that Bernie is killing Biden nationally and leading with black voters now too. But he is supposedly getting killed with blacks in SC.
    — MikeUnleashed ? (@CaccioppoliMike) February 28, 2020

    This aged well.

     

     

    It’s been fun watching the mask come completely off Bernie world this time around. The racism went from subtle to just overt.
    — Ilovelampstill198 (@Ilovelampstill1) February 28, 2020

  47. 47.

    feebog

    @?BillinGlendaleCA:

    Don’t know why he would get out short of 20 years.  I know he relied heavily on his service record and we see the results.  Christy Smith has a journalism background, if there is something to be sniffed out I’m sure she will find it.

  51. 51.

    Suzanne

    @Archon: SERIOUSLY. I firmly believe that progressive policies make the world better. But GOD some of these people are terrible.

  54. 54.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

     

    Dear Christ. I ignored your advice, and I’m incredibly regretful that I did. I’ve heard of this guy, but don’t think I’ve ever seen or listened to him. He is really toxic. Holy shit.

  58. 58.

    West of the Cascades

    How many people voted “Cenk Uygur” because they thought it was a joke candidate, like Screaming Lord Sutch?

  59. 59.

    dmsilev

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Being slightly familiar with Mr. Sirota’s writings, I can actually believe that the “voted against Sanders because he employs David Sirota” set of voters is not empty. Not huge, mind you, but nonzero.

  61. 61.

    Geminid

    @RoonieRoo:

     

    @RoonieRoo: I saw Texas polling a couple months ago that showed John Cornyn at ~33% positive, 33% negative, 33% no opinion. His seat can be taken. M. J. Hegar projects a cheerful toughness that will resonate with Texans, especially women. Her announcement video is available on you tube, and is worth checking out. She has quite a biography.

  62. 62.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Baud: twitter dot com

    @SiubhanDuinne: I used to hear his show occasionally, I can’t even remember how long ago, on whatever followed Air America on XM. He wasn’t always that way, as I recall

  63. 63.

    NotMax

    @Roger Moore

    IIRC in American political slang it had nothing to do with Turkey or with being Turkish but was applied as a label to a freshmen class of Republicans elected to Congress. Similar to how the phrase Young Guns was more recently employed.

  64. 64.

    dmsilev

    @?BillinGlendaleCA:

    Report from WaPo that Warren and Sanders “allies” are in talks about joining forces.

    Are they going unite under that “don’t tread on me” snake banner?

  67. 67.

    Feathers

    Kimberly Hardy, a professor of social work running for the NC House of Representatives, defeated Elmer Floyd in the primary. He was a 77 yo Democrat who voted with the Republicans on many of their NC shenanigans. Learned about her on Sarah Taber’s feed. Taber has a lot of good info on building a local, racially diverse, progressive coalition on the ground. How it isn’t easy, but worth it. Taber’s feed is mostly on farm policy and how “family farms” = “landed aristocracy.” Recommend.

    Link: https://www.kimberlyhardyfornc.com

  69. 69.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @dmsilev: I swear my memory of Sirota is the guy who was always  in search of a more moderate white hope to run against Obama, like Schweitzer or Webb. Am I wrong about that?

  72. 72.

    NotMax

    @SiubhanDuinne

    Ben Mankiewicz, now TCM host, used to be a member of that gang when they were on Air America. And I presume is now eternally grateful to have left them behind.

  73. 73.

    Brachiator

    @David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch:

    Cenk conned his suckers viewers into giving him $1,044,595.   He had almost the same amount as Democrat Christy Smith ($1,147,446).   He had his “tee vee show” promoting him 24/7 and he still only got 3 measly percent of the vote.

    This was Katie Hill’s seat. I don’t care about Cenk. But this seat and a couple of others may fall back to the Republicans.  That’s the problem.

  74. 74.

    WaterGirl

    This is distressing, from the Washington Post

    DETROIT — Top surrogates and allies of Sens. Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders are discussing ways for their two camps to unite and push a common liberal agenda, with the expectation that Warren is likely to leave the presidential campaign soon, according to two people familiar with the talks.

    The conversations, which are in an early phase, largely involve members of Congress who back Sanders (I-Vt.) reaching out to those in Warren’s camp to explore the prospect that Warren (D-Mass.) might endorse him. They are also appealing to Warren’s supporters to switch their allegiance to Sanders, according two people with direct knowledge of the conversations who spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss delicate discussions that are supposed to be confidential.

    Warren associates and the camp of former vice president Joe Biden also had talks about a potential endorsement if she drops out, according to two people familiar with the conversations.

  76. 76.

    The Thin Black Duke

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: What could possibly go wrong? If this is true, I owe Schrodinger’s Cat an apology. What a fucking terrible idea. And I was feeling so good these past few days.

  77. 77.

    Steeplejack

    Can someone point me to that famous (but apparently not enough) article or blog post that laid out the whole history of the politicization of abortion as a post-segregation right-wing GOP strategy in the ’70s? A friend was asking me about the Schumer-Roberts dust-up today, and I found myself grasping for some of the details of that.

  78. 78.

    Uncle Cosmo

    @Roger Moore: Whoopsy, was I mistook – the Turkish word for “young” is genç. I had been under that misapprehension since I met the guy at Netroots Nation 2008 in Austin. And I actually know a little bit of the language. Never mind….(slinks off in embarrassment…)

    It must be then purely for the historical connotations: the original Young Turks were “a political reform movement in the early 20th century that led a rebellion against the absolute rule of Sultan Abdul Hamid II in the 1908 Young Turk Revolution.”

  83. 83.

    Barb 2

    The Bernie bots are out in force. Being real nasty towards and about Warren and Biden.

    So I like the out comes of both races mentioned above. That kid with the beard sure has the Bush look.

    Oh boohoo to all the Bernie bots. Of course Biden will do his best to protect the Credit card companies. He has a record of doing that – seeing how many Credit Card Companies are incorporated in his home state. For this reason alone Warren needs to stick it out. The press will continue to ignore her. Just like the press and the Russians got Trump elected. The press reported on Trump more often than Clinton. BUT – email her email guilty etc.

    Not the best choice voters. But better than – makes my skin crawl – Sanders. The Dem primary system is really screwed up when people of color didn’t make it to the first vote.

    Anyone getting questionnaires from the DNC. Who are you voting for Trump or Biden. Have you voted in the primary yet? If so who did you vote for? Who are you going to vote for. Who should be the VP nominee? Then the request for money.

  86. 86.

    trollhattan

    @WaterGirl: I can vouch neither my kid nor I, motivated Warren voters, are taking that jump and she’s one of the youngs conventional wisdom claims are so enamored of him.

    Sure hope she doesn’t endorse.

  87. 87.

    Eljai

    @WaterGirl: That article is pretty vague.  It could just mean that Ayanna Pressley, who endorsed Warren, is having lunch with Alexandria Ocasio Cortez.

  88. 88.

    Baud

    @WaterGirl:

    The headline is for clicks.  But the story you excerpted said both Biden and Bernie were reaching out, which makes sense.

  89. 89.

    Poe Larity

    Wait, is Cenky not a rock ribbed Republican who drinks lattes now? If we could forgive the John Coles of the Internet, can we not find room for him? Does he hate cats?

  90. 90.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @NotMax: I think Paul Ryan was the only “Young Gun” younger than I when they started using that phrase, and I was comfortably north of forty. Google tells me McCarthy and Cantor were the other two, I would’ve sworn there was a fourth. I went looking for the hilariously un-self-aware, soft-focus video they made of themselves like a middle-aged wannabe boy band (my dudes, my mom used to tell me I was good-looking too, I stopped believing her when I still believed in Santa), and I found this parody.

  91. 91.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Baud: Looks like the three TVs are all tuned to different cable networks. I expect he was monitoring them all, and the FOX photo just worked better visually. There’s a lot to criticise about Bernie, but I don’t think this is it.

  92. 92.

    Barb 2

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: yes in my dad’s day – retirement from the Navy with benefits was 20. My dad stayed in longer. He then was in the “Fleet Reserve” . Which is retired in military speak.

  94. 94.

    Baud

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    It’s small potatoes, but you’d think that if it were an internal photographer, they would know to send a better message.  It’s just odd.

  96. 96.

    WaterGirl

    @Baud:

    But the story you excerpted said both Biden and Bernie were reaching out, which makes sense.

    Yes, I knew that… I actually read what I copied and pasted in. :-)

    But you had to get pretty far down the article, past several images, etc, to see that she was even talking with both sides.

    Really, though, I would think much less of Elizabeth Warren if she endorsed Bernie.  That would be very short-sighted.

    I’m kind of freaked out by the lasted coronavirus info Martin shared, so everything seems like a struggle tonight.

  98. 98.

    Brachiator

    @Barb 2:

    The Bernie bots are out in force. Being real nasty towards and about Warren and Biden.

    It’s sad that these people don’t learn from their mistakes.

  99. 99.

    Uncle Cosmo

    @NotMax: See my mea maxima culpa post at #78 supra – I was wrong about Cenk’s name. But the “slang term” came to be used for “young people eager for change” based on an actual organization in Turkey that rose up against the Sultan in 1908. You could look it up.

  102. 102.

    David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch

    Where’s Michael Moore to tell me “South Carolina doesn’t represent the Democratic Party”.

    Where’s Susan Sarandon’s husband to tell me “winning South Carolina is like winning Guam”.

  104. 104.

    FelonyGovt

    It occurs to me that so many Americans are just tired of having someone so unpleasant in power. Why then would they want to elect Bernie, another unpleasant person? Joe Biden has his faults but he  appears to be sunny, kind and genuine. (So does Elizabeth Warren.But if she endorses Bernie I’ll be real sorry I voted for her).

  105. 105.

    Martin

    Here’s Warren’s challenge: she wants her agenda. And she’s only going to get her agenda by furthering the work of the party. She can’t afford to piss people off now. If she’s got no path, she needs to drop, not because she doesn’t have something to add, but because she needs to be heard by Democratic administration and helping that administration get to power is how you get heard.

  106. 106.

    piratedan

    @WaterGirl: considering the idea that both camps have reached out…. I will not be surprised that this has been spun this way and that the Sanders cadre are treating it as a done deal…its how they roll… i will wait until I hear Sen Warren say that its so..

  108. 108.

    MisterForkbeard

    @WaterGirl: I don’t know how well the Sanders reachout to Warren will go. My Warren friends are getting increasingly anti-Bernie as his online people literally send them hate tweets and constantly tell at them to move over to Sanders because Warren is a traitor for not bowing out, etc.

    I’m not seeing it succeed too well.

  109. 109.

    NotMax

    @Uncle Cosmo

    Well aware of the history, was specifically referring to its co-option and initiation into American political slang. Never claimed it was invented here.

  110. 110.

    Poe Larity

    Pierce Bush clearly fails the “could drink a grapefruit flavored IPA with”

    What’s W’s nickname for him?

  111. 111.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @NotMax:   Interesting. The only people on AA I listened to with any regularity were Al Franken and Rachel Maddow. And occasionally to a woman whose name I don’t quite recall — Randy Rhodes or something? I don’t remember ever hearing the Young Turks — I think I’d remember that screaming and ranting!

  112. 112.

    The Thin Black Duke

    @Martin: Trouble is, other than keeping his seat in the Senate warm for 30 years, there’s no evidence of Sanders being able to Get Things Done. It’s not a skill he has and he doesn’t want to learn how to either.

  113. 113.

    Uncle Cosmo

    @NotMax: Never said (or meant to imply) you did, just wanted whoever’s paying attention to be clear that the term in fact originated in Turkey.

  114. 114.

    Gravenstone

    @WaterGirl: If it’s Sanders backers reaching out via back channels, let’s not leap to conclusions about Warren will automatically accept. Were she or her people making the overtures, I’d be more concerned.

  115. 115.

    Eljai

    @MisterForkbeard:  A Bernie supporter posted a message on my local organizing group’s facebook page.  He was pleading with Warren supporters to vote for Bernie on Super Tuesday.  Most of the replies were of the “pound sand” variety.

  116. 116.

    Kent

    I’m late to this thread and not very up on California politics, but wasn’t this Cenk one of Bernie’s guys?  That was my impression.   Wouldn’t that make Bernie about 0-23 in proxy election fights since 2018?

    Oh, and Liz….P L E A S E don’t get in bed with the Bernie folks.  I can’t imagine she will, but still.  That would be a major disappointment after yesterday.  Although I can see her waiting to endorse Biden until the race is more locked up and it is time to unify and move on.   If Biden wins, then Warren is going to want to play a MAJOR role in the shaping of any major legislation emerging out of a new Congress and new Administration.   Endorsing Bernie is not the way to get there.

  117. 117.

    Mike J

    @?BillinGlendaleCA:Don’t they usually retire(if they’re not being promoted further) after 20 years, rather than just separate?

    He stayed in the reserves as a flight instructor. That time will count towards retirement.

  118. 118.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @MisterForkbeard: My Clinton-to-Warren sister– donor and volunteer– hates Bernie as much as I do. She’ll vote for him, won’t contribute. She thinks he’s a misogynist at his core.

  119. 119.

    Roger Moore

    @Suzanne:

    I firmly believe that progressive policies make the world better. But GOD some of these people are terrible.

    The worst of Bernie’s supporters believe they’re doing the right thing, and that justifies any means of accomplishing their goal.  It’s one more example of how the self righteous person is far more dangerous than one who knows he’s doing something wrong.

  120. 120.

    Redshift

    @Baud:

    Who TF refers to Twitter as a website? 

    People on Twitter who are griping about the kind of garbage that gold much of Twitter, generally. I guess it’s meant to be ironic, or something.

  121. 121.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @NotMax: Ben Mankiewicz, now TCM host, used to be a member of that gang when they were on Air America.

    I’ll be damned. I did not know that. Comcast took TCM out of my package and I haven’t added it back in yet.

  123. 123.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @NotMax:

    Ben Mankiewicz, now TCM host,

    Fun fact: his father, Frank Mankiewicz, was president of National Public Radio during several of the years I worked for a couple of the member stations. I like to think he’d be horrified at NPR’s rightward, corporatist drift.

  125. 125.

    Martin

    BTW, we will probably get a Covid vaccine out of China much faster than out of the US. There are reports that Chinese doctors and scientists are bypassing the normal animal/human trials and are testing a vaccine on themselves.

  126. 126.

    Roger Moore

    @dmsilev:

    Being slightly familiar with Mr. Sirota’s writings, I can actually believe that the “voted against Sanders because he employs David Sirota” set of voters is not empty. Not huge, mind you, but nonzero.

    The problem is that it isn’t just Sirota.  Bernie seems to have identified the most toxic pro-Bernie trolls on Twitter and hired them to run his campaign.  It says terrible things about his judgment and makes me wonder how he would staff his administration if he were somehow elected.

  127. 127.

    Elizabelle

    @WaterGirl:   That’s Camp Bernie trying to deep six EWarren, is my guess.  WaPost:

    The conversations, which are in an early phase, largely involve members of Congress who back Sanders (I-Vt.) reaching out to those in Warren’s camp to explore the prospect that Warren (D-Mass.) might endorse him. They are also appealing to Warren’s supporters to switch their allegiance to Sanders, according two people with direct knowledge of the conversations who spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss delicate discussions that are supposed to be confidential.

    Warren associates and the camp of former vice president Joe Biden also had talks about a potential endorsement if she drops out, according to two people familiar with the conversations.

    I would bet more on allying with Team Biden.  Bernie is a shouty old man whose path got harder on Super Tuesday.  What is in it for Elizabeth?  Who is a Democrat.

    I was guessing she would endorse the actual Democratic frontrunner no matter what.

    Martin Longman in a blogpost on Bernie’s problems (and they are considerable)
    I Don’t Enjoy Being the Bearer of Bad News 

    …  I’ve already talked about how the pundits totally mischaracterize Biden and Sanders’ true bases of support. But this is equally true for a lot of white progressive college-educated Sanders supporters. They actually think college-educated women will leap from Warren to Sanders, when that couldn’t be further from the truth.

    I’ve talked incessantly about the Democrats’ suburban strategy. At first, I lamented it because I knew it was a death knell for progressivism. But once the Democrats won the House using that strategy, I had to accept that this is where the party is, and anyone who wants to lead it has to respect that the majority is built on the support of white suburban college-educated professionals, including especially women. It’s not built on the white working man anymore and that’s not where Biden is getting most of his support.

  129. 129.

    Baud

    @Kent: For all we know, this story was put out by Warren to gauge how her supporters would react.

    I found out the next debate isn’t for another two weeks, so I’m not sure Warren is going to stick around much longer.

  132. 132.

    Steeplejack

    @WaterGirl:

    Why should I (and other potential readers) have to Google it? Providing a link is polite Internetting. Which I saw you did later with GIGANTIC TEXT.

  133. 133.

    Elizabelle

    Elizabeth Warren’s supporters were way more interchangeable with Kamala Harris’s supporters.  Especially WRT her women supporters.

  134. 134.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Roger Moore: today he deplored and denounced “online vitriol”. Two days after he dismissed Joe Biden’s supporters as “corporate Democrats” and one of his top surrogates went on TV to declare them “not representative” of Democrats. It wasn’t an off-the-cuff comment, Emo Mike wasn’t caught flat-footed and just grasped at a straw in his head. He went out of his way to say that on television, called Ari Melber last minute to beg for some air time to communicate that message.

  135. 135.

    Mr. Kite

    The only fact in that Bernie-Warren article is that somebody in Bernieworld left a voicemail or something. As told by the person who did it.

  136. 136.

    The Thin Black Duke

    @Roger Moore: Bernie had horrible people on his staff in 2016 and he has horrible people on his staff now. I think you and me and everybody else who isn’t dazzled by his bullshit knows exactly how horrible the people in his administration would be.

  138. 138.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Baud:

    Sounds like both sides are wooing Warren.

    If Warren is as smart as I think/hope she is, she’ll recognise that she can be far more influential in a Biden campaign (and administration) than in a Sanders campaign (I don’t say a Sanders “administration” because I think that is a most unlikely scenario).

  139. 139.

    Elizabelle

    FWIW, I was talking up voting for Warren or Biden at the doors yesterday.  Anything to stop Bernie.  Who will be too heavy a lift for our courageous new Congresswomen who switched formerly red districts.  You want the shouty old guy from Vermont at the top of your ticket?

    Hard pass.

  144. 144.

    Amir Khalid

    @Roger Moore:

    Thing is, Cenk’s name literally means “young Uyghur”. There are of course Turks of Uyghur heritage, but I don’t think they identify ethnically as Turks. If The Young Turks is a translation of his name, then he kind of elided that fact.

  145. 145.

    Mathguy

    As someone pointed out on Twitter, you gotta say that Pierce Bush is a great porn name.

  146. 146.

    Redshift

    @Redshift:

    People on Twitter who are griping about the kind of garbage that gold much of Twitter, generally. I guess it’s meant to be ironic, or something.

    Grrr, that fills much of Twitter, I meant.

  147. 147.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Baud: I have no idea. It might have been taken by a press photographer, though, rather than a Wilmer staffer. Or it might be carelessness. Or sabotage.

  148. 148.

    trollhattan

    Ya-no, norovirus is enough to keep me from ever taking a cruise but Princess Line seems to have upped things.

    The person was an elderly Rocklin resident with underlying health conditions, and it was the second confirmed case of COVID-19 in the county. The patient tested positive on Tuesday and had been isolated at Kaiser Roseville in “critically ill” condition.

    According to health officials, the person was likely exposed to the the virus while overseas on a Grand Princess cruise ship that departed from San Francisco on a roundtrip voyage to Mexico between Feb. 11 and 21.

    Princess Cruise announced Wednesday that a “small cluster of COVID-19 (coronavirus) cases in Northern California connected to our previous Grand Princess voyage” is currently being investigated by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

    The patient began showing symptoms while on the cruise Feb. 19 and arrived in San Francisco on Feb. 21, said Placer County Health Officer Dr. Aimee Sisson during a Wednesday news briefing. They had “minimal community exposure” after returning but called 911 and arrived at the hospital by ambulance less than a week later.

    The patient died early Wednesday.

  149. 149.

    Kent

    @Baud:@Kent: For all we know, this story was put out by Warren to gauge how her supporters would react.

    I would actually guess the opposite.  The Bernie folks are floating the idea in an attempt to make it a reality.  Warren has no need to play those sorts of games and hold her finger up to the wind like that.  She is her own woman, and not trying to create some sort of independent revolutionary movement like Sanders that must be coddled and cultivated.  She doesn’t really need to care what her supporters think.  She just goes back to the Senate and gets back to work

    And besides, how does someone like Warren ‘join forces’ with Sanders short of getting on the ticket with him?  Does he really expect her to join him in his quest to tilt at windmills and the “Democratic Establishment” of which she is a card-carrying member?

  151. 151.

    WaterGirl

    @zhena gogolia: Did Martin ever answer your question about the train on the previous thread?

    No one can tell you what you should do.

    The way I look at it, if we all travel less and are out in public places less, then that should at least slow the transfer of the virus.

    At Christmas, there were 13 of us.  From 7 different locations around the country.  4 college students, different colleges. Two kids 7-10, etc.  If we fast forward, and 1 of those people had the virus and didn’t know it, think about everywhere that could spread from just 1 person.

    So you could take your trip, and say what the hell, is anybody safe,  I could do everything right and still get it, and go on about your life and take your trip.  You could skip the train trip because you’re worried about getting the virus.  You could skip the train trip as a public health measure to help slow the spread of the virus.

    I know what I would do.  But only you know what’s best for you.

  153. 153.

    Elizabelle

    Looking at that WaPost story WaterGirl posted.

    Annie Linskey is Elizabeth Warren’s very own Amy Chozick.

  157. 157.

    NotMax

    @Redshift

    Gird thine digital loins for fleets.

    @SiubhanDuinne

    Could always tell it was Friday because she’d open her program on that day by playing “Bounce Your Boobies.”

    Did you listen to Thom Hartmann when he was on Air America?

  159. 159.

    zhena gogolia

    @WaterGirl:

    Best for me would be to stay home. But it’s important to a family member that we go. So I guess I’ll go, since there’s no outbreak here yet.

    What would you do?

  160. 160.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @NotMax:

    Did you listen to Thom Hartmann when he was on Air America?

    He wrote a book about being on Air America!

  161. 161.

    glory b

    @MisterForkbeard: I think you’re right. I said the other day that Warren’s African American female surrogates we’re getting savaged on social media by Bernie Bros. I wonder how they would feel if she endorsed Bernie?

  162. 162.

    Martin

    @trollhattan: So, the story is a bit bigger than that. Apparently, the ship then headed off to Hawaii and has returned to SF where the Governor has quarantined it off the coast as guests and staff have developed symptoms. Tests are being sent to the ship.

    It made 4 stops in Hawaii.

    So, in summary, guests on the ship during the Mexico trip came down with the virus. There was no testing at the time. The ship went off to Hawaii during that time, and now people on the 2nd cruise are likely sick.

    And the biggest outbreak thus far was a cruise ship, suggesting that maybe we should accelerate testing of cruise ships.

    But we did none of that. Because Obama, or whatever today’s excuse is.

  163. 163.

    WaterGirl

    @Elizabelle: That doesn’t tell me much because I don’t typically read articles at the NYT or the Post, etc.  So I don’t know names of writers and who would be out to sabotage whom.  I shouldn’t have asked because I’m sure it would take too long to explain.

  164. 164.

    MagdaInBlack

    @NotMax:

    I listened to Randy and Al Franken and Thom Hartmann, but couldnt stand Young Turks. Thom is on WCPT here in Chicago.

    Randy was my evening commute including the Friday Booby song.

  165. 165.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    I really wish I had seen this exchange

    Elie Mystal @ElieNYC
    – Oh my goodness… is that…@JoyAnnReid ’s MUSIC AT SEVEN O’CLOCK??? Good look, @MSNBC!
    – Already paying dividend: she directly asked a Sanders surrogate why Bernie skipped Selma… which I’m still shocked he did… and it’s exactly the kind of question that gets asked when you put black people on TV.

  166. 166.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @NotMax: Heard him occasionally, I think. I only listened in the car, and didn’t really seek out particular programs or people.

  169. 169.

    Ohio Mom

    Steeplejack: Bex’s hint makes it easy to google a slew of articles on why and how the Right took up anti-choice politics — I typed in “Paul Weyrich and abortion.”

    I took special note because there have been several occasions when I went through the same thing, wondering where I read that. Now if I can just remember Weyrich was involved, I’m set for life.

  170. 170.

    WaterGirl

    @zhena gogolia:

    Best for me would be to stay home. But it’s important to a family member that we go. So I guess I’ll go, since there’s no outbreak here yet.  What would you do?

    That would depend on a million things that I don’t know.  Is the trip to say goodbye to a beloved family member who is dying?  Am I in a wedding party?  Is it a family reunion?

    I’ll tell you a quick story that may help.  Years ago I was in a car wreck that totaled my car, so I got a ride to work every day with a coworker.  There was a potluck at work, I made my famous chili.  We put in on the floor of her car in the backseat. I thought we should take the “crock” part out of the part with legs, so it would be more stable.  She said, “no, it’s fine.” Chili spills ALL OVER THE CAR on the way to work.  Who was the most upset?  The person whose car it was or the person who knew better, saw the potential problem coming and let herself be talked out of her own better judgment?  Hint: it was me, the one who could draw the dotted line and knew better and substituted someone else’s judgment for my own.

    Shorter answer:  On something that is this important, you need to keep your own counsel. Play out all the various outcomes.  What action on your part leaves you with the fewest potential regrets?

    edit: with risk assessment, you have to weigh the likelihood of whatever it is occurring AND the severity of the consequences if that does occur.

  171. 171.

    NotMax

    @SiubhanDuinne

    Liberal radio broadcaster I miss most (not on Air America) is Michael Jackson.

    Guy had an astonishing Rolodex. At a moment’s notice, if something warranted it, he could get (random made up example) the finance minister of Tanzania on the phone. And a plummy British accent to boot.

  172. 172.

    Mary G

    I almost deleted it, but I told off a BernieBro on Twitter today for assuming I’d switch to Bernie. The first response from Bernlandia was three or four snake emojis, but the second was a person who said to the first “Grow. Fucking. Up. Emojis aren’t the same as a well-thought-out argument.” And that was the end. I can’t decide if Berners are doing better or I’ve blocked or muted so many they don’t see what I say.

  173. 173.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Ohio Mom: was Weyrich the one who (allegedly?) said “Jerry Falwell couldn’t spell abortion when I met him”, or something like that?

  174. 174.

    glory b

    So, I’m confused. Yesterday, they said the states coming up would be hard for Bernie to win. Just now, Rachel Maddow said Bernie Sanders is poised to do very well next week. What’s up? Also, he just said that he may win the overall count for super Tuesday after they finished counting California. He said he’s confident he’ll have more votes than Joe Biden and being the lead again.

  175. 175.

    CarolPW

    @zhena gogolia: If I felt it was really important to go I would take the train, get a sleeper and wipe down the surfaces, and then clean off my hands. You can go through the whole trip seeing very few people, and sleeping car passengers in many stations have a separate lounge often sparsely occupied. Costs a lot more though.

  176. 176.

    Jeffro

    @Elizabelle: I don’t have time to Google all those names.  Jesus, this blog gets inside baseball-y sometimes.  =)

     

    Ok since as usual we’ve covered a dozen topics here:

    – don’t the Bush heirs have any other line of work that interests them?  They have the money…go open a taco truck, or a gym, or go get a degree in physical therapy or something.  Geez.

    – Warren’s supporters are at best going to split 50-50 between Sanders and Biden (I think it’ll be more like 30-70, respectively)

    – I’m SO glad my family and I took our long-awaited Alaska cruise last summer…one and done there, no matter how COVID-19 shakes out.

    – What’s the over/under on when Anthony Fauci is dismissed or quits?

  177. 177.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @glory b:

    . Just now, Rachel Maddow said Bernie Sanders is poised to do very well next week. What’s up?

    I’m a Rachel Maddow fan but she will butter up her guests, sometimes embarrassingly. Part of being, as Mr Pierce calls her, Kindly Doc Maddow.

    If you’re going to watch that mess, could you let me know if she asks him how Black voters in the South are the corporate wing of the Democratic Party? then again… that wouldn’t be kindly, I guess. Joy Reid would.

  178. 178.

    zhena gogolia

    @CarolPW:

    There aren’t any sleepers — it’s Connecticut to Philadelphia. I got first-class tickets, so I assume it will be less densely populated. But two big train stations.

  179. 179.

    Martin

    @WaterGirl: Oh, right, thanks. I forgot to respond to that.

    I can’t tell people what to do, but as I’m working on our Covid response for my employer, I’m working from home. I’m virtually certain people at work have it. I’m guessing now 10s of thousands of cases nationally (many won’t be diagnosed). I’ve stopped eating at restaurants (restaurant workers get no sick leave and therefore almost always work when sick).

    Personally, I would not get on a train or plane and certainly not a  cruise ship until there was comprehensive testing and containment protocols in place. Take temperature of every person boarding, every person debarking, track manifests so if someone does develop symptoms you know who else was exposed, etc.

    We’re at least 2 weeks from that and the feds haven’t figured out that so long as they do nothing, people will just cancel travel. So, they’re doing exactly the opposite of what they should be doing to encourage people to travel.

    I don’t think there’s a huge risk of travel today, but assuming things don’t radically improve on the containment front, we’ll have 8x as many cases in 2 weeks. 64x as many cases in 4 weeks.

    Humans have a really strong tendency to assume everything follows linear trends, but this is a geometric trend.

  180. 180.

    Jeffro

    Oh and Hugh Hewitt’s latest insightful ‘hot take’ on Biden’s roaring comeback is…it’s just like McCain in 2008, and therefore Biden’s gonna lose the general election.

    Sure thing Hugh.  No difference between the parties, the incumbent president (and his party), the issues of the day, or the unifying appeal of the candidates in question.  Exact same thing.  Carry on!

    I’ll admit, even I have been surprised…a little, but still surprised…at how the blue wave continues to grow across these past four years.  Turnout is just unbelievable on the D side.

  181. 181.

    Brachiator

    @NotMax:

    Liberal radio broadcaster I miss most (not on Air America) is Michael Jackson.

    Guy had an astonishing Rolodex. At a moment’s notice, if something warranted it, he could get (random made up example) the finance minister of Tanzania on the phone. And a plummy British accent to boot.

    He had great dance moves, too.

  182. 182.

    MisterForkbeard

    @Martin: Tomorrow is the last day I’m going into work for awhile. In the SF Bay area, so we’ve got a large chunk of the diagnosed cases nearby.

  184. 184.

    Reboot

    @WaterGirl: The first para sets up a Warren/Sanders connection, but the second para, if I’m reading correctly, says only that the Sanders camp contacted the Warren camp, followed by the 3rd para of the excerpt saying there have been feelers extended by the Warren camp to the Biden camp. It makes me wonder if that 1st para was written with an eye to the headline (which would not be reflected by the rest of the article). I guess we’ll find out soon enough what the story actually is.

  186. 186.

    FelonyGovt

    @Martin: We had intended to take a vacation in Paris in September with a boatload of travel points we’ve accumulated. Now I’m not so sure. We’re not getting any younger and who knows if we’ll be able to go (or even be around) next year, but as older folks it seems stupid to travel unnecessarily.

  187. 187.

    Brachiator

    @Martin:

    And the biggest outbreak thus far was a cruise ship, suggesting that maybe we should accelerate testing of cruise ships.

    Wouldn’t you then have to take the passengers off the cruise ship? Otherwise, wouldn’t the risk increase that healthy passengers would get sick?

  188. 188.

    A Ghost To Most

    @Jeffro: Fugh Fuckwit is on my do not click list, along with all the other Roycohnican apparatchiks at WaPo.

  189. 189.

    Roger Moore

    @Martin:

    And the biggest outbreak thus far was a cruise ship, suggesting that maybe we should accelerate testing of cruise ships.

    Cruise ships seem to be epidemics waiting to happen.

  190. 190.

    Barb 2

    Biden can’t cover up his sexist record. Politico has a long article about Warren’s and Biden’s long battle over the bankruptcy bill. Biden was supportive of the Credit Card Companies on this bill. Warren pointed out that this bankruptcy law would harm women – which it has. Biden was best buddies with lobbyists – one was in the room when Doctor Warren attempted to explain how real people are driven into bankruptcy. The Senators writing this new law never bothered to talk to the real people who were forced to declare bankruptcy. Heading were held when no working folks could come. Warren’s version of what happened is in her book. Google the politico article.

    Neither of the old boys has a positive record on women. They don’t considered women when they vote. Biden is sort of taking it – but he is still an old boy with an old boy network.

    I live in a blue state. I’ll never vote Republican ever. But with Biden and Sanders????? Old boy sexist pigs. So in the general we have a choice between two sexist pigs?????? Well they are better than Trump. Excuse me while I vomit.

  192. 192.

    Martin

    @MisterForkbeard: I stopped 2 weeks ago. I’ve gone in for 3 meetings, but I leave immediately.

    Understand I work at a university with joint institutes with both Italy and China, with over 1000 students from China, Iran, and South Korea and with another 1000 students who are first generation from China, Iran, and South Korea (so they have parents and other family members going back and forth with some regularity). I usually have (or did have) at  least one coworker going to a CDC Warning Level 3 nation daily. We usually have at least one person flying up to the bay area daily (thankfully not me any longer).

    So, I have a VERY high risk of transmission workplace.

  193. 193.

    Another Scott

    @zhena gogolia: My personal view (I have no more evidence than anyone else) is that if it’s in New York (and it is), then it’s in Boston, DC, and every place in between on I-95.  Too many people are moving back and forth in the megalopolis for it not to be elsewhere.  Especially since there hasn’t been a sensible amount of testing.

    So, I would say that the answer depends on your health and that of those around you.  If you have any of the discussed existing health issues, then you should be very, very careful.  If you don’t, you should be very careful.  But all of us have to live our lives.  It won’t seriously affect most people – apparently.  An effective vaccine is probably not going to be available for a year or more – if it is even possible to create an effective one in the near term.

    In a week or so, my J is flying to Texas to visit her sister.  She’s worried, but she’s going.

    Good luck with whatever you decide.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  194. 194.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    @Martin:

    How likely do you think it could be we will see Wuhan-like situations around the country in a few weeks to 1 month? We’re not doing enough testing, frankly. Most people will be fine. The danger has always been millions becoming infected and that increasing the odds of a lot of vulnerable getting it and requiring hospitalization all at once

  195. 195.

    Martin

    @FelonyGovt: Yeah, my wife is supposed to go to Amsterdam in July. She asked me if there was an outbreak there which might cause travel restrictions. I said no, but I’d be willing to bet the US fails so badly at containing this that the EU bans travel from the US.

  196. 196.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    @Another Scott:

    Do you think cases could exist in smaller metropolitan areas as well, such as the Mahoning Valley? I wonder how badly hit places like it could be hit by this thing in a few weeks/months

  198. 198.

    Brachiator

    @Martin:

    BTW, we will probably get a Covid vaccine out of China much faster than out of the US. There are reports that Chinese doctors and scientists are bypassing the normal animal/human trials and are testing a vaccine on themselves.

    I get an image of a dark humor comedy skit in which a thousand Chinese doctors are in a room testing the vaccine on themselves.  One by one, thy drop and are wheeled out of the room until there is only one left standing, exclaiming, “Eureka! I found it!”

  199. 199.

    MisterForkbeard

    @Chyron HR: It’s the same sort of thing from 2016 where people would say “Hillary isnt a feminist because she wanted wars and wars hurt women” or “Hillary didn’t demand <Arabic nation> immediately change policies on women or get their foreign aid revoked, so therefore she’s not an ally to women”.

    It’s silly and it will probably work on some people.

  200. 200.

    different-church-lady

    I once got a time out at Daily Kos for telling Cenk to do something along the lines of a solo unnatural act. It was at a time they were treating him like a progressive hero. It was my first inkling of a phenomenon where I started to distrust anyone who was a shooting star in the on-line progressive-sphere.

  202. 202.

    Another Scott

    @Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): As I’ve said, I’m no expert. I’m not an MD or an expert on pandemics.

    I look at the WHO daily summary.

    https://www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2019/situation-reports/

    Four new Member States (Argentina, Chile, Poland and Ukraine) have reported cases of COVID-19 in the past 24 hours.

    There are new countries every day. Apparently there are now people in China who were infected by people visiting from Italy.

    It’s obviously moving all over the planet. There’s no reason (in my opinion) that it won’t end up being just about everywhere by the end of the year unless things change quickly.

    Now, just because it is in a country, or a city, or a nursing home, doesn’t mean that everyone there will be exposed. And it doesn’t mean that everyone exposed will be infected. And it doesn’t mean that everyone infected will get horribly sick. There’s a lot that the experts don’t know yet.

    My view is that people have to live their lives. Everyone should take sensible precautions – stay home if you’re sick, wash your hands, keep a decent distance from people (especially if they’re sick), etc., but life has to go on.

    Just my $0.02. Not medical advice, I don’t know anything, etc…

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  203. 203.

    Martin

    @Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): I think you already have it in Washington. At least late Dec/early Jan Wuhan.

    The issue is how do we contain it? We can’t do what China does. We neither have the tools to do what China did (things like national IDs that allow you to lock down apartment buildings and national electronic payment systems that let you track people’s movements) nor would the public tolerate it.

    Singapore used a technocratic solution – they tracked everyone. Everyone who came in contact with anyone. And they did a person by person quarantine.

    The US can’t do either. In fact, I have no fucking idea what we can do. But we start by shutting down institutions and mass transit, events with 100 people or more, and begging employers to help.

    It also remains to be seen if China’s solution will work over time.  Sure, you can grind everything to a halt  for 2 weeks, but you can’t stay in that state forever. Does it just return as soon as you open things back up again? I feel like Singapore has a more sustainable approach.

  204. 204.

    Shalimar

    @dmsilev: I would totally vote against Bernie because he employs Sirota, if I didn’t already have 4 or 5 other reasons for voting against him.

  205. 205.

    Ohio Mom

    Maybe in this age of the Corona Virus, we should take up wearing gloves when out and about.

    I remember Jackie Kennedy looking very fashionable in her white cotton gloves, though dark colors would probably be more practical.

  206. 206.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Ohio Mom: Have you encountered people refusing to shake hands yet? I have not. I went to a new dentist today and shook hands with him and the hygienist. Only thought about it after I left the office.

  209. 209.

    Another Scott

    @Martin: Isn’t Wuhan still on lock-down?  Beijing looks like a ghost town in BBC News reports.  Yeah, those “solutions” won’t work in the US.  It’s not even clear that they’ve worked in China.

    Here’s hoping that the wizards at the CDC and NIH and elsewhere have some breakthroughs in cheap, effective tests and greater understanding of this thing soon.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  210. 210.

    Ken

    @zhena gogolia: Better sexism than fascism.

    More precisely, better sexism than sexism and fascism. And racism and narcissism and Dunning-Kruger syndrome and corruption and…

  213. 213.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    @Martin:

    I’ve been doing a much better job of remembering not to touch my face as well, unless I just washed my hands, too

    Since it’s been more or less proven to have been spreading at least in the PNW for the last 6-7 weeks, late Dec/early Jan Wuhan sounds about right. I’d like to say lower population density and more automobile commuting will help slow down transmission as well, but we also have people living paycheck to paycheck and not having the sort of sick leave that many other nations have going against us, as well as the other factors you discussed. Many Americans tend to have underlying health conditions as well

    I don’t want to sound like a doomer, but I seriously don’t think people understand how bad things can get if this spreads unchecked. My parents over the last week have become more concerned, but not enough to prevent my 59 y/o mother from taking my 85 year old grandmother out to lunch today. She thinks that just because there are not any confirmed cases in my state, that means there’s nothing to worry about; that there’s no immediate risk

  216. 216.

    different-church-lady

    I’M TOUCHING MY FACE! DO YOU HEAR ME? I’M TOOOOUUUUCHING MY FAAAAAAAAAAAAACE!!!1!

  217. 217.

    Ken

    @The Thin Black Duke: Bernie had horrible people on his staff in 2016 and he has horrible people on his staff now.

    It’s almost like the campaign decided on negging as their main voter outreach strategy. Which, I suppose, fits with other aspects of the campaign.

  218. 218.

    hitchhiker

    I’m in Seattle, about 3 blocks away from the trauma center where a virus patient died yesterday. That trauma center is exquisitely familiar to me, b/c it’s where mr hitchhiker spent 3 months after a catastrophic injury some years ago. I know all the floors, all the elevators, all the back staircases, where they stash extra supplies on the rehab floor, and so on. Every day when I’m out walking hitchhiker dog, I see people who work at that trauma center doing their errands in their scrubs. I stand next to them at the coffeeshop and in the pharmacy line. I ride with them in the elevator.

    If the virus lives on surfaces for 9 days, a LOT of people in this very dense neighborhood have it.

    Today I got an email from my MoC, Pramila Jayapal, who is a Sanders surrogate. She’s telling people who might have been planning to come to public events in the next week that they’re not going to happen, because of the virus. Because our primary is next Tues, and because WA is supposed to be a strong Bernie state, I’m guessing his campaign is anxious about the rally/gotv situation here.

    I’m glad I saved my ballot. Sorry, Elizabeth Warren. I’m voting for Joe, but if I’d filled it out when I got it the bubble next to your name would have been filled in.

    Finally, Randi Rhodes and the booby song! I forgot all about that. I remember singing it with my tweens, back in the day.

  219. 219.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    @Another Scott:

    Now, just because it is in a country, or a city, or a nursing home, doesn’t mean that everyone there will be exposed. And it doesn’t mean that everyone exposed will be infected. And it doesn’t mean that everyone infected will get horribly sick. There’s a lot that the experts don’t know yet.

    True, but that’s also what’s very concerning

    @Another Scott:

    My view is that people have to live their lives. Everyone should take sensible precautions – stay home if you’re sick, wash your hands, keep a decent distance from people (especially if they’re sick), etc., but life has to go on.

    Good advice, but this is complicated by symptoms being virtually indistinguishable from the cold/flu, as well as being signifcantly more deadly to older people and those with underlying health conditions. I think a lot of events are going to be canceled.

    I also haven’t seen it discussed how this pandemic will affect the Easter holiday

  220. 220.

    Another Scott

    @Ohio Mom: You may be remembering something I posted here a few times.

    Jill LePore at the NewYorker – Birthright:

    In the late nineteen-seventies, the Republican strategists Richard Viguerie and Paul Weyrich, both of whom were Catholic, recruited Jerry Falwell into a coalition designed to bring together economic and social conservatives around a “pro-family” agenda, one that targeted gay rights, sexual freedom, women’s liberation, the E.R.A., child care, and sex education. Weyrich said that abortion ought to be “the keystone of their organizing strategy, since this was the issue that could divide the Democratic Party.” Falwell founded the Moral Majority in 1979; Paul Brown, the founder of the American Life League, scoffed in 1982, “Jerry Falwell couldn’t spell ‘abortion’ five years ago.”

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  223. 223.

    beef

    @Barb 2:

    Something I learned recently:  Biden was the principal sponsor of the Violence Against Women Act.  He did the work to get it through Congress.  It was the first federal legislation to recognize domestic violence and sexual assault as crimes.  I’m not going to claim Biden’s perfect, but that’s about as ‘ally’ as it gets.

  224. 224.

    J R in WV

    Wife and I are both about 70 years old. I’m pretty healthy, she not so much. We really want to travel some more, but not with this going on. Who wants to be trapped somewhere if quarantines are imposed and you don’t even speak the language?

    Instead, I’ve been trying to stockpile supplies. 240 pounds of dog food, 30 pounds of cat food, 20 pounds of rice, case of canned tomatoes etc, etc. Will go to town tomorrow or the next day to see Doctor for a couple of prescriptions, then pharmacy to buy extras regardless of insurance idiocy about not refilling until you’re officially down to 3 days remaining.

    We live in a very rural area, no one here travels to Europe or Asia, many never leave the county, much less the state. Of course the mail could be contaminated. Or the cans of ham. I guess if I was really OCD I would wipe everything down with bleach when I bring it into the house… but I’m not that bad.

    Regarding the election… We supported K Harris at first, and then E Warren. Not going to Marxist Bro, ever. Hoping he doesn’t stand a chance at the nom! He’s a flaming ass in every way, as bad as Trump just on the other end of the political spectrum. Can’t imagine electing a Dem as bad as Trump, but Sanders is proof it can happen!

    It could be that the epidemic will cancel the election…perhaps we could demand vote by mail nationwide? I’m not crazy for that as a solution, as in a family with a domineering member those ballots will all be completed to the dominant person’s requirements — there are reasons we have ballot secrecy, and just because your boss can fire you if you don’t vote for his candidate is only one reason.

  225. 225.

    Barbara

    @Another Scott: I read an nteresting memoir by the son of one of the prime movers in the original anti-abortion movement, named Frank Schaeffer (his dad was also Frank or Francis). He became alienated and turned to writing full-time, mostly novels. At any rate, it is a first person account that is fairly unsparing about the cynicism and greed that underlay the movement. The book was called Crazy for God.

  226. 226.

    Martin

    @Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): Yeah.

    I mean, I do data science and I have a lot of experience with mathematical modeling including modeling of population dynamics, disease transmission, etc.

    I have a fairly intuitive sense from doing this – that, the math is almost always far more dire than you think it should be. But most people don’t. It’s normal to assume if there were 10 cases last week that there would be 10 more this week. And when it goes to 30 and then 70 and then 150 and then 310 and before you realize it it’s 10s of thousands. And look at the cruise ship case. The guy didn’t go to the hospital until a week after he got off the ship. How many people at the concert you’re attending are contagious but aren’t sick enough to give up concert tickets?

  228. 228.

    J R in WV

    @Roger Moore:

    Cruise ships seem to be epidemics waiting to happen.

    We took our one and only cruise so far a year ago, a National Geographic Lindblad whale watching trip to Baha California. Flew down, bused to a fancy hotel, next day on buses to the ship, when they stopped in the middle of a blasted desert.

    We were informed that the ship had an outbreak of Norovirus, and they intended to sterilize the ship while we spent a night, on them, at the resort we had been at the night before. Dinner and drinks on them.

    We had a great trip, no one had any health issues, there was a doctor on board, they passed out motion sickness meds when we sailed out into the Pacific from a very calm bay where whales reproduced. As far as whale watching went, they were curious and interested in people in little Zodiak boats, and came right up, put their noses into the boat. Amazing.

    But norovirus on board a ship can go wild, obviously. Spreads by contact, alcohol doesn’t phase it at all. Tiny toilets in small cabins, more like summer camp afloat than luxurious cruise with casinos and night clubs. Good food, good bar with educational presentations and local musicians, but not fancy. Whcch was good for us. Norovirus would have been horrible.

    But Norovirus is very seldom a fatal illness, just disgusting. My two cents worth, don’t plan travel right now. Hole up and stay away from people as much as you can.

  230. 230.

    J R in WV

    @Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):

    Good advice, but this is complicated by symptoms being virtually indistinguishable from the cold/flu, as well as being signifcantly more deadly to older people and those with underlying health conditions. I think a lot of events are going to be canceled.

    Next door neighbor and close friend for 40 years played old time music in a local nightclub last Saturday night, then Sunday he started with symptoms. Went to his Doc Monday morning, Type A Flu, taking Tamiflu, doing well. But a perfect example of going somewhere with lots of people and catching a viral disease, even here in W Va.

  231. 231.

    Ruckus

    @feebog:

    It could be any number of things, it isn’t normal for someone to get close to 20 and walk away but he was an officer and they can resign their commission. Now maybe it was advised to him that it would be a good idea, or his next duty station was crap, I saw that happen to a medium level officer that had been the flotilla commander for my first ship and was crap at the job so was sent sideways rather than promoted, to be the captain of the ship I spent my last month in the navy assigned to. He didn’t lose rank but it was as much an obvious demotion that the brass could give him. He didn’t stay much longer.

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