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You are here: Home / Healthcare / COVID-19 Coronavirus / Declining to Succumb to Stupid

Declining to Succumb to Stupid

by Betty Cracker|  May 4, 20203:31 pm| 117 Comments

This post is in: COVID-19 Coronavirus, Domestic Politics, Open Threads, Politics

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Florida rolled out its phased reopening today in all but three counties. This happened before noon:

Pass-A-Grille Beach, St. Pete Beach getting crowded as of 10:45 am. @TB_Times #coronavirus @PinellasCoNews @SheriffPinellas pic.twitter.com/CXG6lhDTnY

— Scott Keeler (@SKeelerTimes) May 4, 2020

I’ve got concerns. It’s not that the phased reopening plan is bad. Our governor is a Trumpster and therefore an idiot, but he seems marginally less stupid than, say, Brian Kemp of Georgia or that bespectacled ham hock that leads the state of Mississippi.

As of today, restaurants, shops, museums, etc., in Florida can reopen but only at 25% capacity. People are still supposed to maintain their distance at beaches, parks, etc. But the thing is, there’s not been sufficient testing to know if it’s safe to move to this stage, and nothing I’ve read about the situation in Florida gives me confidence that the testing and tracking assets are in place to quickly detect and squash outbreaks.

THAT’S the problem, but the authorities have apparently decided it’s an insurmountable problem,* so here we are. I’m with Miami Herald columnist Leonard Pitts on the issue:

I get that businesses are suffering. But I refuse to eat in a crowded restaurant, sit in a packed movie house or fly on a full flight again until I feel I can do so safely. And I am emphatically not assured by TV carnival barkers, political halfwits and MAGA-hat-wearing geniuses.

No, I need to hear from serious, credible people. I need to know sufficient testing has been conducted and that they feel the virus is no longer a threat. If other people want to die of stupid, I can’t stop them. But if America wants its economy back — this part of its economy, at least — it better do whatever is necessary to persuade Dr. Anthony Fauci it’s time to give the all-clear.

Look for me two weeks after that.

Amen to that. It’ll be fascinating to see how people respond. Even well-meaning and reasonably intelligent people who don’t find Trump’s antics persuasive will find reasons to believe that what they want to be true (that it’s safe to resume “normal” life) is true, especially when there’s a ton of peer pressure.

Among the people I know, I’d estimate half are hanging back with Pitts and me and half are ready to believe the danger has passed. It mostly breaks down by party lines too. What’s happening in your area with regard to the rules being relaxed or maintained? What do the folks you know think about it all?

*ETA: FWIW, I think that’s true in the sense that the Trump administration’s criminally irresponsible mismanagement of testing development and capacity squandered the time the lock-down orders bought. So now we’ll get the worst of both worlds: economic catastrophe AND preventable deaths.

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Reader Interactions

117Comments

  1. 1.

    comrade scotts agenda of rage

    May 4, 2020 at 3:35 pm

    From a friend’s FB post:

    I’m not going outside until like 3 months after they lift restrictions. I’ll let y’all deal with the bugs and crashes and resurgences. I’m not really an early adopter. I’m gonna wait until they release Outside 4.2, The Stable Patch.

  2. 2.

    Matt McIrvin

    May 4, 2020 at 3:39 pm

    Here in Massachusetts, the restrictions are still getting stricter, because we’re stuck at a high plateau of new cases and our government is at least semi-rational. We just had a statewide order for masks in open essential businesses. There had been a local one in many towns for longer than that.

    Meanwhile, testing and tracking is still ramping up to a degree that most of the country hasn’t seen. I hope this has some positive effect.

  3. 3.

    Jeffro

    May 4, 2020 at 3:40 pm

    Virginia’s looking at moving to ‘Phase 1’ of re-opening

    “We re not entering Phase 1 today, nor this week,” Northam said after discussing the reality of the virus’ continued presence.

    However, Northam said, based on the data his team is monitoring, he believes Virginia can enter Phase 1 as soon as next week.

    In response, he announced that he is extending Executive Order 53, which was set to expire on May 8, until May 14.

    That order is the one that closed many non-essential businesses in Virginia and limited gatherings in Virginia to no more than 10.

    Northam said extending that order will give his administration time to monitor the latest data on Virginia’s cases, hospital bed capacity, and PPE supplies to be sure that the state can be prepared to enter Phase 1 of reopening.

    He anticipates, based on current data, that Virginia should be able to enter Phase 1 at that point, if numbers follow their current trends.

    The governor also announced that Executive Order 55, the Stay at Home order for Virginia, is being adjusted to reflect a ‘Safer at Home’ order for the future as the commonwealth can move into Phase 1.

    What will Phase 1 look like?

    Governor Northam said Virginia’s reopening plan will consist of three phases, each of which is likely to last two to four weeks. He said that duration is in accordance with CDC guidelines for states.

    When Virginia does enter Phase 1 on May 15, as Northam currently anticipates, it will come with continued physical distancing, enhanced cleaning and disinfection, and enhanced workplace safety.

    But Phase 1 will allow the businesses that were required to close to reopen their doors.

    However, every industry will need to continue following guidance on how to operate safely – with continued physical distancing, like spaced-out seating at restaurants; with enhanced cleaning, meaning more sanitation at the restaurant after someone dines there; and more workplace safety measures, like employees wearing face masks or plexiglass shields between a salon worker and a customer.

    WhatEVer.  Still not going out to restaurants, movie theaters, or concerts any time soon.  Still going to wear a mask when I go to the grocery store, and will keep limiting myself to 1 grocery run/week.

  4. 4.

    cain

    May 4, 2020 at 3:40 pm

    The thing is that – people are forced to go because they can’t get unemployment insurance. The thing that’s going to be coming is whether citizens can sue states for putting them in danger. That will likely go to the supreme court I reckon.

  5. 5.

    New Deal democrat

    May 4, 2020 at 3:42 pm

    “If you open it, they still won’t come.” That is going to be the lesson businesses in GA, FL and elsewhere learn this month.

    On the other hand, I did pass on to my local State Rep the articles I read about Vilnius opening its restaurants for al fresco dining in public areas with adequate spacing; and NYC’s similar plan. The closed restaurants I like are all sitting behind huge empty parking lots that could be spray painted or taped so that social distancing was maintained. I imagine I’d sanitize the table first anyway, and maybe bring my own paper plates and cutlery!

  6. 6.

    dmsilev

    May 4, 2020 at 3:45 pm

    California is talking about starting to loosen up. We have our share of protestors, plus some of the more conservative (and sparsely populated) counties are cho ping at the bit to reopen, but nothing yet statewide. Locally, LA County is saying that they might loosen up in about two weeks. Since this is the densest hotspot in the state, I’m not sure how realistic that is. Testing has ramped up a lot though; recently, they started testing asymptomatic people in various high-priority categories (health care workers, grocery workers, delivery folks, etc.), which is a good sign.

  7. 7.

    Doc Sardonic

    May 4, 2020 at 3:49 pm

    One of my favorite restaurants in my little corner of  Fl says thanks but no thanks to reopening inside dining.  They will be sticking to curbside pickup and delivery, reopening at 25% capacity for inside was not worth the costs involved for their staff or patrons.

  8. 8.

    Martin

    May 4, 2020 at 3:49 pm

    So, we’ve been having the debate about beaches here in CA. On the beach itself, social distancing isn’t hard – in fact, for a lot of people that’s the point – they don’t really want to be close to people. But people need to go to the bathroom, they wash their feet on the way off of the beach, often crowding around a handful of stations, depending on the beach they may need to group up on the way in or out of the beach to get through a chokepoint.

    But this attitude from Republicans is really starting to pay dividends with the murder of a security guard in MI for telling someone they had to wear a mask. Emboldened the wingnuts are.

  9. 9.

    Betty Cracker

    May 4, 2020 at 3:49 pm

    @cain: I have no opinion about the lawsuit angle, but you’re right about people being forced to take their chances. Weeks into this shit-show, this state’s unemployment system (purpose-designed to fail) has only processed a fraction of claims. About 40% were rejected, and the state told people to reapply last week. People got no money. Small businesses are going under. “Return to normal” is such wishful thinking, and reality is going to bite a lot of people on the ass and soon.

  10. 10.

    ET

    May 4, 2020 at 3:53 pm

    My brother lives in New Orleans and has a house on the Mississippi Gulf coast. When Mississippi started reopening the family went over to hang at the beach. Would it surprise you that the parents are Republican. He has 4 daughters – 2 are in high school and they definitely felt that going to Mississippi was safe. One of them has a friend that is not allowed anywhere near them because my brother’s family is not really quarantining.

  11. 11.

    Betty Cracker

    May 4, 2020 at 3:54 pm

    Had to share this with those of you who aren’t on the Twitter:

    Slap slap slap pic.twitter.com/StVSk7cxDn

    — Welcome To Nature (@welcomet0nature) May 4, 2020

  12. 12.

    MattF

    May 4, 2020 at 3:54 pm

    I guess Maryland, at this point, is following (Governor) Hogan’s lead. He’s been careful and rational, so it’s reasonable and safe to do that. Maryland is very blue, but Republican Hogan is very popular, approval around 80 percent. Much of the rest of the Republican party is loony, so Hogan needs Democratic support, and he’s getting it.

    My locality (Montgomery County) requires face masks in supermarkets and social distancing– I don’t expect any of that to change any time soon.

  13. 13.

    Matt McIrvin

    May 4, 2020 at 3:54 pm

    @Betty Cracker: I’ve assumed for a while that the real purpose of “reopening” is to force people to quit or be “fired for cause” instead of being laid off, so they can be screwed out of unemployment checks in the massive workforce attrition that needs to happen one way or another.

  14. 14.

    LuciaMia

    May 4, 2020 at 3:54 pm

    Think Maryland is staying on lockdown till the end of May.

  15. 15.

    bluehill

    May 4, 2020 at 3:56 pm

    @Martin: As usual it’s only about their rights and no one else’s. Tragic that this is an outcome. Will be interesting to see what happens if they try to fly. I know most major airlines are requiring people to wear masks in flight.

  16. 16.

    LeftCoastYankee

    May 4, 2020 at 3:56 pm

    Oregon’s extended the state of emergency to July 6th, and tied a phased re-opening to specific metrics.

    Governor Brown is estrogen-blessed and a Democrat with majorities in both houses of the legislature, so the stupid is limited to Manbaby theater on the capital-steps.

    The bothersome thing for me (aside from the federal government) is the growing acceptance that if something is hard or complicated it’s “un-possible”.

    It’s something in the corporate culture too.  If something is difficult and good, it’s un-possible.  If something is difficult for the help, and makes me look good, it’s a matter of will and leadership.

    We can now only pretend to build “Pyramids”, and only dream of moon-landings.  Even if it was often only PR bullshit, the attitude of “can do” was a defining attribute of what it meant to be American.

    Less depressing:  the sun is out and the flowers are in bloom.

  17. 17.

    Matt McIrvin

    May 4, 2020 at 3:56 pm

    @MattF: It’s a similar deal in Massachusetts, but I actually think Baker is getting more credit than he deserves–he went slower with the shutdown than Marty Walsh wanted him to, or than he should have.

  18. 18.

    dmsilev

    May 4, 2020 at 4:00 pm

    Via the LA Times just now:

    Gov. Gavin Newsom announced that some retail stores across the state can reopen with modifications as early as Friday amid growing pressure to ease the stay-at-home order that has cratered the California economy.

    “We are entering into the next phase this week,” Newsom said at his Monday news conference. “This is a very positive sign and it’s happened only for one reason: The data says it can happen.”

    Under the new guidelines, the governor said bookstores, music stores, toy stores, florists, sporting goods retailers and others can reopen for pickup as early as Friday. He said more detailed guidelines on the businesses that can reopen would be released later this week.

    The governor’s plan also expands decision-making at the local level, allowing some communities to move further ahead into the second phase of the order and open more businesses at their own pace instead of adhering to a uniform policy across the state. But if counties want to do more, they must first meet certain requirements for hospitals beds, testing kits and the ability to track infected individuals and trace their contacts, Newsom said.

  19. 19.

    Elizabelle

    May 4, 2020 at 4:02 pm

    The Pulitzer Prizes are out.  No howlers, like giving one to Kathleen Parker (for shame) … although the FTF NY Times leads with 3.

    Barry Blitt of The New Yorker won for Editorial Cartooning!

    So did Colson Whitehead for Nickel Boys.

  20. 20.

    debbie

    May 4, 2020 at 4:02 pm

    Not only did the cowardly protesters try to bully Dr. Acton (Ohio Health Director) at her home over the weekend, they tried to bully a local reporter while they were protesting because she was wearing a face mask. They accused her of trying to scare them! Poor dears!

  21. 21.

    hueyplong

    May 4, 2020 at 4:03 pm

    We’ll be watching the experiments in Georgia, Florida, and Texas from inside our house.  Nothing Mississippi does will in any way influence our behavior.

    Haven’t thought beyond that particular “you first” effort.  [We have the luxury of the spousal unit being told they’re working remotely at least through mid-June, and are grateful not to be put to an awful choice yet.]

  22. 22.

    trollhattan

    May 4, 2020 at 4:06 pm

    @Betty Cracker:
    Ohh, I thought you said snapping turtles!

    Hilarious. Who knew turtles were comedians? “Wise guy, huh? Why, I otta….”

  23. 23.

    azlib

    May 4, 2020 at 4:06 pm

    Here in AZ our Republican Gov is being fairly reasonable. He has been lambasted for going to slow in the reopening and there is a petition circulating to recall him from the far right here in AZ. And our local libertarian pundit of course want the economy to reopened as a priority.

    As for his phased opening, I think it is seen as reasonable by most people here, but I think it is too soon given cases are still rising.  On the other hand testing is being ramped up which is good.

    I still see folks going into enclosed places without a mask and not observing social distancing which I think is irresponsible.

  24. 24.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    May 4, 2020 at 4:07 pm

    @debbie: Nichole Wallace just said that trump called on Gretchen Whitmer to meet with the armed protesters who stormed the MI state ledge. I missed that. He’s encouraging armed violence. Someone is going to die from that.

  25. 25.

    MomSense

    May 4, 2020 at 4:07 pm

    I was under the impression that air conditioning is a virus spreading multiplier so I’m trying to figure out how it would be possible to open restaurants when it is necessary for air conditioning.

    I also don’t understand how restaurants can afford to be open at 25% capacity. They lose money at that volume.

    We are going to see spikes everywhere, including Maine, in a few weeks.  People up here were out and about without masks and without maintaining physical distancing.

  26. 26.

    Elizabelle

    May 4, 2020 at 4:07 pm

    @dmsilev:   Two LA Times writers won Pulitzers!  Christopher Knight for criticism; Molly O’Toole for audio reporting on immigration.  Lotta awards and nominations dealing with immigration.

    And Steve Lopez was a finalist, for the fourth time.  Someone, give that man a Pulitzer.  He has earned it, four times over.

    They gave a posthumous Pulitzer to Ida B. Wells.  But I want Lopez to get one, humous.

    WaPost won; so did ProPublica.  Pretty good round of selections, it seems.

  27. 27.

    trollhattan

    May 4, 2020 at 4:08 pm

    @debbie:

    …because she was wearing a facemask.

    I’m sorry, what?!?

  28. 28.

    artem1s

    May 4, 2020 at 4:09 pm

    I’m predicting Ohio’ governor will be pin-balling between the MAGA militia’s armed demand to reopen everything NOW; grifter evangelicals thoughts and prayers towards getting their collection plates full again and sending Pop-pop and Meemaw to a better world; and those of us who are just fine binge streaming the pandemic for another 6-8 weeks.

    I’m seeing the universities, schools and related government unions and employees being a force for taking things slowly.  No matter how many deplorables want to kill themselves and their relatives, most of Ohio was more than happy to work from home and stay put during the crappiest month in the year (March is the month of grey).  Now that spring semester is shot, I don’t see campuses eager to ramp things up for what would be their slowest time of the year anyway.

    As I recall, once the NBA called it quits, the rest of the US took notice and started taking this thing more seriously.  If the NCAA shows their typical lack of concern for the well being of student athletes, I expect them to fold like a wet rag once the sportsball coaches start whinging about not being able to hold summer practices and camps.  The NFL will be fine with their unofficial minor league clubs acting as canaries. So there will be some universities that will start to feel the pressure to start up football season and they will pass that on to the governors – thus I see DeWine reversing himself multiple times, over even the easiest and most obvious precautions, just as he did on mask wearing.

    But I don’t see the baseball union budging until they know they are completely safe – remember, they are typically fine with the World Series being canceled if the union decides to go on strike.  So it may come down to – does your village idiot care more about tailgating this fall than it does grandpa living to see his grandkids graduate from college next year?

  29. 29.

    Jay

    May 4, 2020 at 4:09 pm

    This exchange, between @SecPompeo and @MarthaRaddatz, is something to behold: pic.twitter.com/fzrVd74IjL— ? David Gura ? (@davidgura) May 3, 2020

  30. 30.

    Mary G

    May 4, 2020 at 4:09 pm

    #LIVE: @GavinNewsom announces a new virtual training academy with UCLA and UCSF to recruit and train people to help with coronavirus tracing. His first phase goal is 10,000 recruits. https://t.co/gdWfqBEB4s pic.twitter.com/MYphYeSx2M— ABC7 Eyewitness News (@ABC7) May 4, 2020

  31. 31.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    May 4, 2020 at 4:11 pm

    @trollhattan:

    “I asked this woman to respect my space after she was yelling and spitting in my face,” Robbins tweeted afterward. “She said i had no right to social distancing in public and continued to follow me. Complaining about my mask (that is meant to protect her and those around me).”

    I’m normally opposed to doxxing on principle, but I think these people should be named and shamed.

  32. 32.

    Betty

    May 4, 2020 at 4:12 pm

    @cain: Mitch is working hard to make sure there is no liability for forcing people back to work.

  33. 33.

    Rusty

    May 4, 2020 at 4:12 pm

    The official plan in New Hampshire is a slow phased reopening. The actual behavior is a good chunk of people have given up on quarantine, social distancing et al. Saturday I need to shop at Lowes , maybe half the customers had masks, same for staff. Those without were doing minimal or no social distancing. Whole families, mom, dad and the kids, no masks, kids running around. There and back, groups of people hanging out, looked like a regular day. Groups of cyclists at trail heads, too many to be single households, bikers gathered in parking lots. This was more north in the state, maybe it was better near the MA border. I and my family is with Pitts, it’s going to take a lot more before we even start engaging in the new normal, the old normal isn’t coming back any time soon, or at all.

  34. 34.

    different-church-lady

    May 4, 2020 at 4:15 pm

    Hey, if certain Floridians want to volunteer to form a human petri dish, I say let ’em at it — the data that results will probably be very very useful.

  35. 35.

    MattF

    May 4, 2020 at 4:17 pm

    Jennifer Rubin points out that the (partial) ban on travelers from China was ineffective due to travelers from Europe carrying the virus into the US for six weeks after the China ban was imposed. Sigh. I sure wish some Democrats were making emphatic, public observations like this.

  36. 36.

    Planetjanet

    May 4, 2020 at 4:19 pm

    Yesterday, I ventured out to the big box hardware store. I was dreading it, but I had a stopped drain and needed a plumbing snake. It was packed. Parking lot looked like a normal Sunday. I get really angry at everyone who doesn’t wear a mask. But doubly so when they work there. I try to give a wide berth to anyone without a mask, and some evil looks to those who got too close. I would be a lot more comfortable if masks were required.

  37. 37.

    jl

    May 4, 2020 at 4:20 pm

    I hope things go well. But to be honest, signs are that several states in the South are opening up before they should or at least much faster than they should. I don’t think individuals’ behavior should be judged as harshly as that of their political leaders. People want to get out of the house. We know that the vast majority of people still want to be cautious. My hunch is that some of those people out on the beach don’t care, and some just need to get out of the house, state political leadership said it’s OK. They get to the beach and the park, and all of them won’t turn around and just go home because there are more people than they expect. Most will probably stay and try to be careful, which may or may not turn out to be feasible. Partly depending on how many more people show up out of the blue.

    The behavior of the FL and GA state leadership is not promising. Both signaled that they may fiddle with the epidemic numbers to make things look better than they are. From data I’ve seen, their number of tests is going down and the rate of positives is going up. That may be good or it may be very bad.

    In South Korea tests are going down and rate of positives are going up because right now they seem to have the epidemic under control. That is the good possibility. What are the chances that FL and GA are in that boat? Not high IMHO.

    And, it is quite a trick to be able to control a stable low prevalence and low incidence situation, and prevent future outbreaks, when you are still in the middle of a big epidemic wave. FL and GA governors never explained how they will manage that magic trick.

    Several areas of the county are ready to try a gradual reopen. I don’t think FL and GA are in that category. And good luck to the people down there. That is my bottom line.

    Stay safe, BC!

  38. 38.

    Planetjanet

    May 4, 2020 at 4:20 pm

    @Jeffro: We still have 900 new cases everyday and the number keeps going up.  We are not ready.

  39. 39.

    Mary G

    May 4, 2020 at 4:21 pm

    Gov. Gavin also announced that if the numbers look OK, some businesses such as florists and bookstores can reopen for curbside service only on Friday. I’m thinking this is trolling the MAGAt protesters who don’t read.

     

    And huzzah and womp-womp for this:

    BREAKING: Andy Lack is out as NBC News chairman. Telemundo chief Cesar Conde will replace him, and will oversee NBC News, MSNBC and CNBC.— TVNewser (@tvnewser) May 4, 2020

    You know Twitler will hate to see a “Mexican” put in charge, and I’m glad the enabler of scumbags is finally out.

  40. 40.

    Brachiator

    May 4, 2020 at 4:22 pm

    You cannot maintain a lockdown forever. And in Southern California, even though the people were total idiots, I understand the temptation to want to go to the beach. Probably a similar urge in Florida and other places.

    I understand wanting to re-open restaurants and other businesses can’t just be a return to old days. I’ve seen proposals about social distancing, reduced seating, disposal single use menus. But it is difficult to cover all the bases. Here is a video that suggests that inadequate ventilation might have contributed to the spread of the virus. Sorry if the link doesn’t work, this is from my smartphone. Short video.

    Personal bottom line. I have some health issues that might make me vulnerable. Fortunately, I can work from home for a while. I love going out to restaurants, but will only be doing takeout for now. I might not eat dinner at a friend’s home unless I know that people have been tested.

  41. 41.

    Elizabelle

    May 4, 2020 at 4:23 pm

    @Mary G:   Andy Lack out.  Fab!!

  42. 42.

    schrodingers_cat

    May 4, 2020 at 4:24 pm

    Thought experiment: If we were being directly ruled by Putin what would he be doing different than the man currently in the WH?

    1. He would want to weaken the United States

    2. Damage the economy as much as he could

    3. Kill as many Americans as he could.

  43. 43.

    geg6

    May 4, 2020 at 4:24 pm

    Wolf has put Pennsyltucky (the northern border and the middle part of the state, or the T, as it is often called) into the first phase of reopening.  Allows some more retail openings for pick up only and more services open if they follow state guidelines, but no barbers, hair dressers and nail artists yet.  Still must wear a mask in public and schools are not opening anywhere in the state.  Dentists who can meet the state guidelines can open everywhere.  Talked to my dentist the other day and he has spent a fortune updating equipment, redoing all the floors to take up all carpeting in the building and training staff.  I’m still in the red zone, which is mainly Pittsburgh and it’s surrounding counties and Philly and it’s surrounding counties.  We’ve been told it would be mid-June at the earliest that we might be able to start going into the office, perhaps staggering the days if staffers being there.

    We’ve had quite a lot of cases for a fairly small county, though almost all deaths have occurred at one particular nursing home.  But people seem to be following the rules and not too much bitching.

  44. 44.

    cope

    May 4, 2020 at 4:25 pm

    Nothing but flaming progressive liberals as far as the eye can see in my family so even us Florida ones will remain in the house.

    Your point about testing applies to the country as a whole and is the limiting factor in making wise decisions.  Decisions made without the benefit of sufficient testing will be unwise decisions.

  45. 45.

    Elizabelle

    May 4, 2020 at 4:25 pm

    @Mary G:   I am hoping for a nice juicy scandal they’re trying to hide.  Andy Lack has allowed a terrible corporate culture at NBC.

    Saw a tweet from a Daily Beast reporter that he is curious about that too.

  46. 46.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    May 4, 2020 at 4:28 pm

    @Mary G: that’s interesting… I wonder if there’s a story behind that…

    I was at the grocery store Saturday afternoon, and the two people I saw not wearing masks– a woman in her twenties who seemed to be running in (literally) to get a twelve-pack and a smug looking dork of about 40– were getting a lot of turned heads. One old guy (meaning, older than me) in a Trump-Pence 2020 hat with a bandana tied under his eyes and tucked into his shirt collar

  47. 47.

    jl

    May 4, 2020 at 4:29 pm

    One troubling issue is that the shut downs in the US have not been as effective as they have been in other countries. From graphs I’ve seen of estimated state effective reproduction numbers show only four or five states definitely below 1 right now. No one has managed to get them down into the 0.5 to 0.6 level when it is possible to knock down the epidemic curve quickly  (‘crush the curve’ is the jargon I have heard from epidemiologists pushing for much more intense shut downs). Even the affected cities in China could only get it down into that range for short periods of time.

    So, horrible implication of that is that in most areas of the country, flattening the curve worked well enough to prevent the health care system from crashing, but not well enough to move to long term effective control through surveillance, contract tracking, self quarantine. And feds have shown no interest or ability in helping with that anyway.

    If that is the case, some regions of the country are in for a very long very miserable time. Which is a very bad thing. A series of bad epidemic waves, abortive reopenings and shutdowns that will be just miserable in every way. I hope I’m wrong, but that bad prognosis is likely, IMHO.

  48. 48.

    Bex

    May 4, 2020 at 4:33 pm

    Trump campaign is already screaming about “faux transparency.”  https://www.thegardian.com/us-news/2020/may/04/joe-biden-tara-reade-senate-records-request

  49. 49.

    Planetjanet

    May 4, 2020 at 4:33 pm

    @Mary G: Spectacular news!  Thanks.

  50. 50.

    Brachiator

    May 4, 2020 at 4:34 pm

    I posted part of this before, but I also wonder what post pandemic testing protocols should be. Yes, test as many people as possible but then what.

    If people self-isolate, how will they be able to make up for lost wages?

    If people subsequently get sick, how will medical costs be handled if they lack sufficient health insurance, or don’t have any insurance at all?

    How many local officials will be needed to track people and do follow up tracking and testing?

    We really need to think through what a post pandemic world should look like, how it should function.

  51. 51.

    The Moar You Know

    May 4, 2020 at 4:34 pm

    I got about six bucks in my wallet.  I’m saving that to buy a nice parcel of beachside Florida real estate when this is all over, at it looks like most of the owners will be deceased.  Should be easy to score a pretty beach home.

  52. 52.

    geg6

    May 4, 2020 at 4:35 pm

    The thing is, I have no idea how anyone thinks we’re just going to go back to “normal.”  We’re not.  Economically we aren’t and this virus will be with us for quite some time.  The researchers I have read and talked to said they have never seen anything like this virus and they still have no idea of all its symptoms and effects.  And until they can pin that down, it will be hard to find treatments or even, possibly, a vaccine.  Nothing is ever going to be the same, probably never in my lifetime.

  53. 53.

    sgrAstar

    May 4, 2020 at 4:39 pm

    @Elizabelle: yay LATimes! I agree wholeheartedly about Steve Lopez- he is a marvelous writer and such an asset to SoCal. Wright’s work on the awful LACMA rebuild was also really good. A great city must have a great paper- it’s thrilling to see the LAT steadying itself under its new ownership.

  54. 54.

    Tenar Arha

    May 4, 2020 at 4:41 pm

    My brain has always been fertile ground for disaster scenarios since youthful experience with Earthquake, Towering Inferno, & Lucifer’s Hammer etc. I’ve always understood there’s stuff you can plan for, but shit happens that you can’t control.

    Anyway, I went looking for this scene from the worse pandemic film partly bc I saw the COVIDiot demonstration in front of our State House today, and then scrolling my TL got annoyed & was thinking of replying to a reporter fishing for public reaction quotes on Twitter. Maybe I’ll just link this OpEd instead.

  55. 55.

    jimmiraybob

    May 4, 2020 at 4:42 pm

    CNN’s reporting a guard shot dead at a Family Value store in MI because he told a customer to wear their mask (store policy).  The shooting part of Trump’s liberation has apparently started.

  56. 56.

    Roger Moore

    May 4, 2020 at 4:44 pm

    @Brachiator:

    A couple of other things that make restaurants scary to me:

    1. You obviously can’t wear a mask while eating, so one of the possible barriers to transmission is unavailable.
    2. There’s some evidence (e.g. from the choir practice superspreading events) that people who are trying to project their voice spread the virus more.  Many restaurants now try to establish a very noisy ambiance, so people have to be very loud there.  Not a good thing.
  57. 57.

    debbie

    May 4, 2020 at 4:44 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    But it won’t be his fault! Fake news!

  58. 58.

    Elizabelle

    May 4, 2020 at 4:45 pm

    @geg6:

    Nothing is ever going to be the same, probably never in my lifetime.

    Wow.  I never thought about that.  Assuming, um, that we get what used to be considered normal lifespans.

    At least people might lay off pangolins and bats.  Leave them aloooooone!

  59. 59.

    JMG

    May 4, 2020 at 4:46 pm

    Baker REALLY doesn’t want to reopen here in Mass. So he set up an advisory board and directs all complaints to them, a time-honored device for ignoring people. There are two regions of the state, the Berkshires and Cape Cod, that are utterly dependent on summer tourism for their economies. It’s all service businesses in those places. My guess is they will be allowed to open by Memorial Day, with mass gatherings like Tanglewood or 4th of July parades, banned. Otherwise they really will be wrecked for keeps.

    Masks in public are now theoretically required in almost cities and towns. But out here in the burbs, people walking dogs, cycling, etc. mostly don’t because you can do so and not get within 15 yards of anyone else. In stores and such, mask-wearing is close to 100 percent. I did see one heavy set chap in his ’60s come out of the supermarket this morning and remove his mask in the parking in order to light a cigar. This was at 8:30!

  60. 60.

    Baud

    May 4, 2020 at 4:47 pm

    @Elizabelle:

    At least people might lay off pangolins and bats.  Leave them aloooooone!

    Stop infringing on my constitutional rights.

  61. 61.

    Brachiator

    May 4, 2020 at 4:47 pm

    @sgrAstar:

    it’s thrilling to see the LAT steadying itself under its new ownership.

    Sadly, the LA Times is losing a ton of money. They recently had a round of layoffs, just a few years into new ownership. They are a good paper, but fewer people buy or subscribe to either physical or digital newspapers. And the pandemic greatly reduced advertising revenue.

    I’m not sure how long they will be able to hold on. But they are definitely trying to do some good journalism.

  62. 62.

    debbie

    May 4, 2020 at 4:48 pm

    @trollhattan:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    Such a tough woman. If you’d seen the reporter, she’s a very petite, very young woman.

  63. 63.

    Matt McIrvin

    May 4, 2020 at 4:49 pm

    @Elizabelle: Or just exterminate them.

  64. 64.

    Mary G

    May 4, 2020 at 4:50 pm

    @Elizabelle:

    @sgrAstar:

    Also chuffed about the LA Times in general and Steve Lopez in particular. It was interesting to see several winners “advanced by the board,” which I assume means not nominated by their publications.

    This thread is fun:

    How @PulitzerPrizes celebrations look during a pandemic pic.twitter.com/pxGdVvaoND
    — Travis (@travislylesnews) May 4, 2020

  65. 65.

    debbie

    May 4, 2020 at 4:50 pm

    @geg6:

    I’ve had that thought a time or two. It’s not very cheering.

  66. 66.

    Richard Guhl

    May 4, 2020 at 4:50 pm

    This morning the worship committee of St. John’s UCC, Allentown PA had a discussion about what reopening our church for worship might look like. Given the age demographic of our congregation, we all agreed it wouldn’t be any time soon. We talked about the recommendations of the Wisconsin Council of Churches and the precautions the airlines are considering.

    The long and short is we decided to get whatever equipment we need to do livestream with just our Pastor and the Minister of Music in the sanctuary.

    Until there’s a vaccine, goodbye hymnals, and singing, and pew Bibles, and bulletins, and fellowship hour after worship, and hello roping off alternate pews, and sanitizing all touched surfaces,  and PPE for our Sexton, and no-touch offerings.

  67. 67.

    raven

    May 4, 2020 at 4:53 pm

    Been watching “World on Fire” on PBS? Imagine living in Europe and having that shit come down around your head. The world was never the same but it didn’t vanish either. Remember 50 years ago today? I honestly thought we were going to the barricades for full scale civil war.  Hang the fuck in there.

  68. 68.

    satby

    May 4, 2020 at 4:54 pm

    Pass-a-Grille was the beach closest to my mom’s condo, and  I’ve spend many happy evenings watching sunsets there (redheads don’t sunbathe if they’re smart). Too many people just exist in denial.  I’m really afraid for what could happen in the coming weeks.

  69. 69.

    artem1s

    May 4, 2020 at 4:55 pm

    FEMA burial funds

    this administration will do anything to keep the dead from being counted.

  70. 70.

    pat

    May 4, 2020 at 4:57 pm

    @Planetjanet:

    Here Menards (selling everything from garden plants to lumber to potato chips) requires everyone to wear a mask, and will sell one for $1 (cheap!) if you arrive without one.  One of the employees watching everyone who comes through the door.

    All employees wearing masks.

    Parking lot full in the afternoon on a lovely Sunday, everyone getting ready for spring.

    Two more cases in La Crosse county (WI) bringing the total to 28 or so.

  71. 71.

    Matt McIrvin

    May 4, 2020 at 4:57 pm

    @geg6: My impression is that the experts are far more optimistic than that about a vaccine. The virus is biologically similar to SARS and MERS (and to the coronaviruses that cause colds), and the main reason there isn’t a vaccine for SARS or MERS is that interest in the research subsided once the outbreaks ended, and the projects already in flight were suspended.

    The question is mostly how long it takes. Historically, it’s often taken decades to develop a completely new vaccine. Most candidates don’t work at all. But there’s a gigantic moonshot effort going on now, with many different candidates in development simultaneously to better the odds. The scale is actually unprecedented. But even if the eventual winner were already in human trials now, it’d probably be another year before mass vaccination can happen, and it’s possible that the pandemic could burn through us the hard way by then.

  72. 72.

    matryoshka

    May 4, 2020 at 5:00 pm

    Today is central Missouri’s first day of open salons and gyms. We have had social distancing measures in some grocery stores, none that I know of in pharmacies or big box stores. I live in a university town that fared well through wave 1 by sending kids home in March, but will be under increasing pressure to restart sportsball in summer and fall because “freedom” and “the economy.” I think wave 2 will be fairly hideous around here.

  73. 73.

    Elizabelle

    May 4, 2020 at 5:00 pm

    The FTF NY Times was such a dick in its original story.  Brayed about the 3 Pulitzers it got.  Also a shoutout to the Anchorage Daily News, for its Public Service Award (shared with Pro Publica), which is the “most prestigious” of them all.

    And:  no mention of the WaPost, or LA Times, or The New Yorker. Or the Baltimore Sun.  Or Reuters ….

    Just looked again.  They’ve put up photos about their wins.

    And still not a word about any other publications than those already named.  LOL.  Dicks, I tell you.

  74. 74.

    schrodingers_cat

    May 4, 2020 at 5:01 pm

    @raven: Agreed.  Was not around 50 years ago but have witnessed scary stuff myself IRL.

  75. 75.

    raven

    May 4, 2020 at 5:02 pm

    @schrodingers_cat: Kent State was 50 years ago today.

  76. 76.

    Salty Sam

    May 4, 2020 at 5:04 pm

    Here in Puerto Rico, today was the first day of some slightly eased restrictions.  Until now, post office, banks, groceries and gas were the only business options, with restrictions on numbers of people inside the store (3 at a time tops). Today hardware stores were allowed to open, along with professional services like lawyers, accountants, etc, but only by appointment, one client at a time in the office.

    Masks are required in public, and handwashing/sanitizing stations are in front of every place of business- your hands get spritzed with sanitizer before you can enter the store.

    The Governor took this seriously in early March, and still does.  Of course, Puerto Ricans have no illusions about how much help they are going to get from Trump’s administration, despite being American citizens.  “We’re on our own here” is the attitude.  Not one person here has yet received a stimulus check.

    But I’d rather be here than back in Texas.

  77. 77.

    Matt McIrvin

    May 4, 2020 at 5:06 pm

    One thing I’ve thought is that in the long-term steady state, the age profile of severe illness might help us even if this is uncontrolled. Suppose that infection really can lead to long-term immunity (we don’t know this). This might eventually become a disease that most people get as children or young adults, soldier through without a lot of trouble, then don’t have to worry about. But that’s assuming a lot of things that are unknown. It’s possible that the unserious childhood infections don’t lead to long-term immunity at all.

  78. 78.

    Another Scott

    May 4, 2020 at 5:13 pm

    Our big boss says that we’re going to be “fast followers” – we’re not going to be the pioneers who get killed off in the resurgent plague.  Even after things “open up”, lots of us are going to continue to telework as long as we can, at least until there’s a demonstrated effective vaccine. And too many people who do not have that ability will die – like one of the guards at my work place. :-(

    These people who deny reality and poo-poo the experts really don’t understand that once you destroy trust, you don’t easily get it back. Most won’t believe what Donnie says about a vaccine or a treatment after his continued lies and disinformation on COVID-19 and everything else he lies about…

    And Donnie isn’t just trying to get his mitts on all the PPE, possible treatments, and possible vaccines to reward his family and his cronies, increase his power, and somehow win re-election, he’s breaking the public health system to try to punish Democrats and those who don’t bow down to him.  He thinks the Strategic National Stockpile is his, to do with what he wants as God-Emperor, and that means confiscating stuff that the VA and other parts of the government have bought, stuff that states and localities and hospitals and all the rest have bought, is more than fair game – it’s his right.

    It’s infuriating.

    Hang in there and be safe, everyone.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  79. 79.

    Kay (not the front-pager)

    May 4, 2020 at 5:14 pm

    @MattF:

     

    @LuciaMia: Do either of you know if schools will remain closed for the rest of the year? At this point they are scheduled to reopen on 5/15, and we have not yet leveled off, much less decreased cases for 14 consecutive days.

    I’m not sure even Montgomery County is doing as well as you might think. People are getting tired of the restrictions on their lives, and are starting to rationalize away the need. And some of them never did think the restrictions applied to them. My son is an “essential” worker at an ice cream/coffee shop (I use scare quotes because really? Ice cream is essential?). There is a park across the street from the shop, and he says there hasn’t been a week when folks haven’t been over there playing soccer, touch football, etc, etc. Then, of course, they come over for an ice cream and spread their germs. When he’s managing the shop he keeps them out and only serves them through a window, but when the owner is there things are more lax. It’s nerve wracking, and it’s not getting better. The situation feels like Russian roulette. Same for my niece in NJ, who is a personal shopper at a grocery store where 2 personal shoppers have been diagnosed.

  80. 80.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    May 4, 2020 at 5:15 pm

    @Elizabelle:

    And Steve Lopez was a finalist, for the fourth time.  Someone, give that man a Pulitzer.

    Yes, S. Lo is a true treasure.

  81. 81.

    Elizabelle

    May 4, 2020 at 5:18 pm

    @?BillinGlendaleCA:   Born in 1953.  Don’t retire Steve!  I hope he does get a Pulitzer.  Next year.  The good work he has spurred …

  82. 82.

    Matt McIrvin

    May 4, 2020 at 5:19 pm

    @JMG:

    Masks in public are now theoretically required in almost cities and towns. But out here in the burbs, people walking dogs, cycling, etc. mostly don’t because you can do so and not get within 15 yards of anyone else. In stores and such, mask-wearing is close to 100 percent.

    That’s my experience too. It really took government ordinances declaring masks mandatory to get that to happen, though. Before that it was about 50-60 percent among shoppers and almost no staff.

    Yesterday, the weather was nice and we had the idea of walking around the trails in a park somewhere. But the first one we went to was closed by city order, and the big one in our town had its little parking lot full to overflowing and cars lined up down the road–we took one look at that situation and went home. I took a little walk around the neighborhood in the sun, much less scary.

    Mask-wearing seemed very low among people just hanging out in public squares and such, but they weren’t crowding together very closely. I saw one family in a little downtown park with a couple of little kids romping around masked in the grass, and their mother talking to them with her mask off and hanging around her neck. But they weren’t getting too close to any other groups.

  83. 83.

    opiejeanne

    May 4, 2020 at 5:20 pm

    @Elizabelle: Do they mention the Seattle Times? They got a Pulitzer for their coverage of the 747 MAX crisis.

  84. 84.

    Kay (not the front-pager)

    May 4, 2020 at 5:25 pm

    @artem1s: One of the things I find most disheartening is how anxious people are to have professional athletes risk their and their families’ health and lives in order to provide entertainment to the masses. It just seems so , I don’t know, unseemly. Crass. Inhuman.

  85. 85.

    Matt McIrvin

    May 4, 2020 at 5:26 pm

    @Rusty: The other day we were running low on dry cat food, since I’d neglected to put it in my last Petco delivery order, so I ordered it (and some cat litter) for curbside pickup from the local Petco, which is a few hundred feet across the state line, in New Hampshire. I was surprised to see that of the two people who came out to bring it to my car, one was unmasked, and she was the one who asked for ID (on the Mass. side she’d be required to mask up by state order at this point). I put my own mask on so I could open the door and wave my driver’s license in the air.

  86. 86.

    Kay (not the front-pager)

    May 4, 2020 at 5:29 pm

    @Mary G: Can we dare to hope this will mean an end to daily Chuck Todd? Maybe an end to Chuck Todd period?

  87. 87.

    Bill Arnold

    May 4, 2020 at 5:32 pm

    God Emperor D.J. Trump, and American human sacrifices being made to attempt to keep him alive politically:

    In Warhammer 40K, the emperor is on what amounts of magic life support and keeping him alive requires 1000 daily human sacrifices. This, in an empire that spans trillions of people, is considered such a horrifying state secret you can be executed if you learn it pic.twitter.com/vCsyAxWT0k
    — Gorilla Warfare (@MenshevikM) May 4, 2020

    The entire idea of Warhammer 40K was to create a universe so incredibly filled with authoritarianism and horrible ways to die that you won’t have to think about which character is the good guy and just get lost in its aesthetics, and it’s getting lapped by the American presidency
    — Gorilla Warfare (@MenshevikM) May 4, 2020

  88. 88.

    opiejeanne

    May 4, 2020 at 5:32 pm

    Governor Jay Inslee of Washington announced last week that instead of easing restrictions on May 15th he is extending them until the end of the month, at least.

    The grocery delivery app we’re using has been a boon in most cases, making it easier to stay home and so the garden is getting a lot of much-needed attention.

  89. 89.

    Jay

    May 4, 2020 at 5:32 pm

    Many of you have asked if I am willing to travel around Florida wearing Grim Reaper attire to the beaches and other areas of the state opening up prematurely. The answer is absolutely yes. Beginning May 1 we will hit the road here in state. Please retweet and spread the word. pic.twitter.com/UO7QKg161n— Daniel Uhlfelder (@DWUhlfelderLaw) April 22, 2020

  90. 90.

    Sab

    May 4, 2020 at 5:36 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: On the other hand, looking at that dye job, I can see why she wants her hairdresser back.

  91. 91.

    Scout211

    May 4, 2020 at 5:38 pm

    https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/briannasacks/costco-workers-coronavirus-social-distancing-measures

    This article about the new Costco safety requirements was kind of worrisome. Apparently the new requirement that all customers wear face coverings starting today is because they are now going to let more customers in the warehouse so social distancing will not be as easy to do. On the other hand, they do expect shorter lines to get into the store—but longer lines at the checkout.

    Senior hours are now Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday from 9-10.

  92. 92.

    Bill Arnold

    May 4, 2020 at 5:44 pm

    @JMG:

    In stores and such, mask-wearing is close to 100 percent.

    In New York State, we’ve had a mask-or-face-covering-in-stores order since (and including) April 17, and compliance (at least observed by me) is 100 percent.
    Some young men are using bandanas, but at least they have something blocking outgoing droplet sprays. (technical term is “source control”.) There is an enormous variety of masks and face coverings being used, and it’s no big deal. People just put them on before the get out of the car or at least before entering the store, and there is no fiddling, it’s just done and looks like the few weeks of practice that people have had.
    I’ve been eyeballing the NYS numbers and there is (to me) no clear-to-the-eye signal in the charts yet (but statisticians might be able to spot something), but am hopeful. There *are* a lot more people out shopping which is adding to people-to-people contact, but I feel somewhat safer that there are no Unmasked spewing into the air inside stores. Tested and reported infected in my counting is about 3% now.

  93. 93.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    May 4, 2020 at 5:47 pm

    @Kay (not the front-pager): Yeah, there were rumors in the before-times that he was going to be pushed out and Nicolle Wallace was going to get an extra hour. I would love to see him humiliated like that. Petty, but I own it.

  94. 94.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    May 4, 2020 at 5:52 pm

    @Scout211:

    Senior hours are now Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday from 9-10.

    Senior hours(60+) are Monday-Friday, 9-10am.

  95. 95.

    artem1s

    May 4, 2020 at 5:57 pm

    @Kay (not the front-pager):

    One of the things I find most disheartening is how anxious people are to have professional athletes risk their and their families’ health and lives in order to provide entertainment to the masses.

    It’s a weird thing.  I’ve seen the money that is in athletics ruin so much around it.  Our public schools that can’t afford a second math teacher or music program have no problem passing a ballot levy for an athletic director or football coach.  I’ve seen entire state universities close down their liberal arts programs so they can dump more money into the football program to pursue a chance to appear in bowl game.  Sometimes they even decimate the other athletic programs like cross country because football is where (they claim) all the money is.  Don’t even get me started on the folks who think you can’t get alum to donate unless you have a national championship title.  IMO the NCAA has wasted 3 or 4 generations of scholarships on athletics when those universities could have been recruiting minority students to STEM programs that would have meant a lifetime of opportunities, not just a one in a million chance to be the next NFL #1 draft pick.  And the injuries, brain trauma and steroid issues – don’t even get me started.  All so Monday Morning Armchair Quarterbacks and Sports Announcer Hairdos can relive their glory days. :P

  96. 96.

    Bill Arnold

    May 4, 2020 at 5:57 pm

    @Martin:

    But this attitude from Republicans is really starting to pay dividends with the murder of a security guard in MI for telling someone they had to wear a mask. Emboldened the wingnuts are.

    Fuck them. They are threatening peoples lives. A credible threat, in any high-infection area. In a stand-your-ground state, they could be killed.
    My phone does not play this loud enough, and The Unmasked are scarce in my area due to having a proper Governor (Cuomo), but tempting to play with them:
    Royalty Free Shotgun Reload/Pump Sound Effect

  97. 97.

    schrodingers_cat

    May 4, 2020 at 5:58 pm

    @raven: Indeed. Must have been a scary time to be alive.

  98. 98.

    Elizabelle

    May 4, 2020 at 6:00 pm

    @opiejeanne:   Of course not!  [ETA:  unless FTF NY Times has updated.  Have not looked for about 90 minutes…]

    Cool fact:  it appears the winning articles are available to read on the Pulitzer site.  The 737 reporting came up immediately for me, and does not seem to be a paywalled click.

    FYI:  Kentucky paper won for breaking news.  On Bevin’s weird ass pardons. I guess next year’s Pulitzers are going to be LIT!

    Staff of The Courier-Journal, Louisville, Ky.

    For its rapid coverage of hundreds of last-minute pardons by Kentucky’s governor [Matt Deplorable Bevin!!], showing how the process was marked by opacity, racial disparities and violations of legal norms. (Moved by the jury from Local Reporting, where it was originally entered.)

  99. 99.

    Scout211

    May 4, 2020 at 6:04 pm

    @?BillinGlendaleCA:

    Yes. Thanks for the correction.

  100. 100.

    RepubAnon

    May 4, 2020 at 6:04 pm

    @Matt McIrvin: If the workers are asked to perform their assigned tasks in an unsafe workplace, they may be able to claim constructive firing.

  101. 101.

    Bill Arnold

    May 4, 2020 at 6:05 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    . “She said i had no right to social distancing in public and continued to follow me.

    She was mortally threatening the reporter. In a zombie movie she would be shot. In a stand-your-ground state, one of them might yet be shot.

  102. 102.

    Bill Arnold

    May 4, 2020 at 6:06 pm

    @Betty:

    Mitch is working hard to make sure there is no liability for forcing people back to work.

    The Democrats cannot cave on this. if they do, they become honorary members of the Death Cult.

  103. 103.

    Bill Arnold

    May 4, 2020 at 6:09 pm

    @Planetjanet:

    I would be a lot more comfortable if masks were required.

    There are many who are simply not shopping because of a lack of mask requirements. Stores (essentials) in NY got a lot more business after Cuomo’s everyone-masked-in-stores order.

  104. 104.

    David ? ☘The Establishment☘? Koch

    May 4, 2020 at 6:12 pm

    Imagine if Blacks, Latinos, Asians were crowding beaches and violating social distancing rules.   Cops would be firing tear gas, going full Attica with tasers and pepper spray.

    But IOKIYAW

  105. 105.

    Bill Arnold

    May 4, 2020 at 6:24 pm

    @Roger Moore:

    There’s some evidence (e.g. from the choir practice superspreading events) that people who are trying to project their voice spread the virus more.

    Oh yeah. People who talk loudly, especially without a mask, are a physical threat, unless they can prove that they are not infected, at that instant.
    (I have my quirks, and liking quiet is one of them. :-)

  106. 106.

    Bill Arnold

    May 4, 2020 at 6:29 pm

    @Matt McIrvin:

    But there’s a gigantic moonshot effort going on now, with many different candidates in development simultaneously to better the odds.

    More like the Manhattan Project, which ran 3 separate methods of enriching Uranium in parallel, to improve the odds of success.

  107. 107.

    laura

    May 4, 2020 at 6:43 pm

    All we were going to get from the Trump led response was and is zip, zilch, zero. He made it clear that ignoring and keeping the numbers down was “The Plan” from day one. There’s never going to be sufficient testing. The federal response is to bugger this up 8 ways to Sunday. States are are their own. We’ll be lucky to get another round of stimulus – but Lindsay’s worried that unemployment is overly generous and leads to idleness by this people. I’m still a boiling rage over the Clown in Chief and his reelection campaign.

  108. 108.

    evodevo

    May 4, 2020 at 6:45 pm

    @Betty Cracker: The one with the long toenails is probably a male…they use them to hang on to the female’s shell when mating….that vid is a hoot.

  109. 109.

    evodevo

    May 4, 2020 at 6:51 pm

    @MomSense: It’s not necessarily the AC itself, it’s the fact that it blows  air currents, with virus particles, from an infected table to all the subsequent tables in its path…I don’t know how you would solve THAT problem…

  110. 110.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    May 4, 2020 at 7:17 pm

    @Richard Guhl: This morning the worship committee of St. John’s UCC, Allentown PA had a discussion about what reopening our church for worship might look like. Given the age demographic of our congregation, we all agreed it wouldn’t be any time soon. We talked about the recommendations of the Wisconsin Council of Churches and the precautions the airlines are considering.

    One of my friends parent’s church holds their service in an drive in movie. No one gets out of their car so everyone is safe.

  111. 111.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    May 4, 2020 at 7:18 pm

    @raven: Hang the fuck in there.

    Of course, just these Know Nothings are getting tedious now.

  112. 112.

    Cameron

    May 4, 2020 at 7:24 pm

    @Elizabelle: Is this the same Steve Lopez who used to write for the Philadelphia Inquirer?

  113. 113.

    MisterForkbeard

    May 4, 2020 at 7:41 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:  @debbie: I’m honestly waiting for them to try this in a stand-your-ground state.

    It’s a pretty clear case of feeling threatened. Both phyiscally threatening AND from the disease, someone wilfully flouting your request for distance during a pandemic without reason.

  114. 114.

    Another Scott

    May 4, 2020 at 10:01 pm

    @artem1s:

    https://mag.uchicago.edu/footballhistory

    In 1899 the University of Chicago won its first Big Ten championship in football. The Maroons won again in 1905, 1907, 1908, 1913, 1922, and 1924, for a total of seven titles.

    In 1939 University president Robert Maynard Hutchins famously got rid of varsity football. UChicago’s massive stadium—with space for more than 50,000 fans—was later demolished to make room for the Regenstein Library.

    It was one of the best things Hutchins ever did. More universities should do so as well.

    (Hi, Raven!)

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  115. 115.

    W. Kiernan

    May 4, 2020 at 11:08 pm

    I live in that county.  I like going to the beach, but I prefer to go at about 9:00 PM and stay for an hour or so, so I can walk along the water’s edge in the night.  This is absolutely the most pleasant thing you can do in Florida.  At least before the virus outbreak, I usually only see three or four people in the whole time I’m out there, and it’s rare that I ever get closer than twenty feet or so from any of them.

    But even though they’ve opened the Pinellas County beaches, I still can’t go to the beach, because the geniuses who came up with these plans decided that the county beaches would all be closed at 8:00 PM.  So the beaches are open when there are lots of people, but when there are practically no people, they’ve still got them closed down.

  116. 116.

    The Pale Scot

    May 4, 2020 at 11:59 pm

    @Tenar Arha:

    Lucifer’s Hammer

    Drags a bit, but it’s got CANNIBALS!!

  117. 117.

    JaneE

    May 5, 2020 at 12:40 am

    @Scout211: Costco is back to regular hours, seniors every day can enter at 9 am – starting today. I swung in tonight about 6:45 (they had been closing at 6:30), parked 3 slots out from the handicapped spaces and walked right in.  Not crowded at all.  Masks are required and everyone I saw had one. One person ahead of me at the checkstand. Cleaning supplies and food were sparse, especially poultry (none) and meat (two cuts of pork, only pork belly was plentiful, a few cuts of beef but mainly prime grade).  SoCal

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