I grab my first cup of coffee and sit down to catch up on the overnight news and immediately regret it. It’s all bad (except twitter has added a “Violated Twitter” banner over the shitstain’s latest call for violence against black people and he has melted down completely).
But this was fucking chilling. Absolutely dystopian. Minnesota has a police problem, they really do.
Minnesota police arrest CNN reporter and camera crew as they report from protests in Minneapolis https://t.co/oZdqBti776 pic.twitter.com/3QbeTjD5ed
— CNN (@CNN) May 29, 2020
And again, let me add to what others have said. If you’re angrier about the protests than you are about a man being killed in cold blood, on camera, well, you’re probably a Trump supporter.
I’m not even sure how to face today. I’ve felt completely helpless since George Floyd’s death murder. We are so broken and I have no idea what it will take to fix us.
Sorry, I know I’m usually here with some positive perspective. I just don’t have it right now. Maybe later today, I’ll get you some puppies and flowers.
Be kind today…
Baud
Baud
BellyCat
Totally with you, TaMara.
schrodingers_cat
CNN (and other respectable media) created this monster. Monster has turned against Frankenstein.
Cheryl Rofer
TaMara (HFG)
@Baud:
@Cheryl Rofer:
Looking at y’all coming with the positive Joe Biden vibes. Bless you.
Elizabelle
Was about to put this on the previous thread. The WaPost item on the CNN reporter/crew arrest, in full:
Baud
@TaMara (HFG):
We didn’t include the first one of the series.
lamh36
THIS!! Exactly this
WereBear
There are people who will always behave badly if they are allowed. It’s a depressingly significant chunk of the population.
Third Reich studies are filled with instances of “ordinary people” who take advantage of a social structure which encourages them to express their personal power in cruel ways. After WWII, almost all of them — especially the lower ranks and women — faded back into the woodwork.
Society changed. That kept them in check. Bad policemen get away with things until they are stopped. That’s who they are and what they do.
White suburbanites think the police are on their side when they indulge in their own bad behaviors. Like that woman in Central Park who threatened a bird watcher with the police, having the misconception that the police are her servants.
But really, the police are on their own side.
Lord Fartdaddy (Formerly, Mumphrey, Smedley Darlington Mingobat, et al.)
We’ll make it. We’ll make it somehow. We just have to put our heads down and plow ahead. It’ll take time, but we can do it if we choose to do the hard work.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
One of my over seas on line friends was asking me about this, I said Floyd’s death was the just the last straw, it’s really about the whole “the blacks should die” attitude from the Right and for the blacks, the choice is they can die fighting or die on their knees, at lest fighting they have a chance.
Krope, the Formerly Dope
Like I said last thread, it is shameful that we expect more composure and discipline from citizens dealing with the police than we do from the police. These are people entrusted with the power of the state, our state(s) that we ostensibly are supposed to have say over how it’s run.
mrmoshpotato
@schrodingers_cat: Five words – hours of empty Trump podium
mrmoshpotato
Doggos and duckos and gatos! Oh my!
Gin & Tonic
@schrodingers_cat: Totally OT, and sorry folks, but a while ago you mentioned some status or form for a spouse of a US citizen who has a green-card application in the pipeline, and I don’t recall what it was.
henrythefifth
Arrest the f&cking cop, already! The murder was caught on camera. JFC, this country.
Mary G
Add me to the number of people who are having flashbacks to 1968. Twitler is obviously running the Nixon playbook and the media are having fainting spells because looting. I can imagine a network of white supremacist cops all over the country planning to abuse black men until protests turn into riots, and it scares the shit out of me
ETA: Joe Biden, or his social media team, is impressing the hell out of me. What a contrast.
Raoul Paste
I hope Biden’s comments hint that Klobuchar is out for VP consideration
MattF
Trump clearly wants to change the subject to ‘race’, and security forces are ready to help him do that.
terraformer
There’s also a video going around that appears to show a white man dressed all in black, wearing a facemask and carrying an umbrella and hammer. He proceeds to carefully and deliberately smash windows.
Some of the people around him approach and appear to ask what he’s doing, and who he is. He then walks quickly away, and comments state that he then walked into or near the local police precinct.
This is nothing new, but damn if that was a cop or someone who sympathetic to them doing that to create a rationale for further police violence, then that’s just another nail in the proverbial coffin.
NotMax
@mrmoshpotato
In the meantime, a portrait of placidity.
Mary G
Bruuuuce
@terraformer: There’s a putative identification of that man as a St Paul cop, but because there’s so little of his actual face to see, that’s questionable for now. Plausible as hell, but not yet proved
lamh36
The reporter and crew were let go
mrmoshpotato
@NotMax: Why’s that duck yelling at me? :)
Mary G
germy
There’s always a tweet:
Cheryl Rofer
@terraformer: I’ve seen a claim that he’s been identified as a cop. I am being VERY careful and not retweeting any of this. Emotions running too high right now
ETA: I see Bruuuuuce beat me to it
germy
NotMax
@mrmoshpotato
It’s laughing with you, not at you.
Yeah, that’s the ticket.
;)
germy
Omnes Omnibus
@Mary G: If they rebuild, I will make a point of getting food there the next time I am in Mpls.
schrodingers_cat
In other news I got the mail-in ballot for my town election next Saturday.
germy
@terraformer:
Yes, this should be shown on every nightly news program.
AnneWith
I follow @greg_doucette on Twitter, & he tweeted a lengthy list of what needs to be done in order to rein in the police.
https://twitter.com/greg_doucette/status/1266055636229541889?s=21
Elizabelle
@Cheryl Rofer: It’s a leap to assume immediately it’s a cop. It undercuts the twitter crowd to suggest that, at this point.
Definitely an agent provocateur. You find them at most protests, but this one is especially well prepared and blatant.
Will be interesting to see if other protesters filmed his movements after; see where he headed off to.
And weird that the police can already affirm he is not one of theirs. That seems a stretch, too.
mrmoshpotato
@NotMax: Oh ok! :P
Pooch be scheming.
Mary G
Villago Delenda Est
Planting agents provocateurs among the ranks of the dissaffected is old Okhrana SOP.
MomSense
@Bruuuuce:
Is this the case where the ex-wife identified him? I haven’t seen it verified yet but I would not be surprised.
Dorothy A. Winsor
My equivalent of puppies and kittens offering: The book trailer for THE WYSMAN is now on You Tube. It’s 60 seconds of thrill for me. Feel free to share on social media if you do that kind of thing.
So I’m thrilled about the trailer and simultaneously worked up about all the events in Minneapolis. I can’t sit still. There’s just too much going on for me to process.
Villago Delenda Est
@Elizabelle: The cops are not operating in good faith. They seldom do. This is all thin blue line BS.
Matt McIrvin
Biden’s statements are actually pretty amazing to me–this is not the Joe Biden of 30 years ago, I’ll say that.
Villago Delenda Est
@germy: I’m shocked, shocked.
Kathleen
@Mary G: l strongly believe the biggest factor that triggered the virulent hatred of and opposition to Hillary Clinton in 2016. was her embrace of the mothers of the murdered African American men. It’s never been mentioned by our insightful nuanced Mainslime Media propatainment purveyors in their 2016 coverage. But it triggered a a lot of hate.
And needless to say she was right about everything.
Bruuuuce
@MomSense: That’s the one. Apparently the ID included using the gloves etc. as evidence that it was him. As I said, definitely not conclusive.
@Elizabelle: It’s not so much that it’s a leap to assume it’s a cop because of his behavior; rather, the ID that’s circulating is of a named cop from St Paul. Still not proved, though
Elizabelle
@Bruuuuce: Keep us posted. Had not heard that, and it’s a disservice for the tweets to not mention any background.
That would be a gamechanger, and could be severely prosecuted. Should be, if they apprehend whoever this is. And I hope that they do.
VeniceRiley
We saw yet another black man get tortured and murdered on TV and people are looking for ways to make it bad for Amy and Hillary. Van Jones just said on TV that it’s Hillary voters that we have to watch out for.
I think we are at some kind of breaking point. I saw several CNN anchors and guests choke up on air today.
ET
What is worse of an already worse situation, is that they did it while the the crew was live and didn’t arrest the white reporters.
Police are so used to doing this stuff in the dark and counting on it, that they really do forget that in situations that are public someone(s) are always willing and able to pull out a camera and film. Sadly, they also seem to not care if they do remember and they aren’t totally wrong to fell that film doesn’t matter.
And lest we forget, there is always still what happened in Georgia and Louisville hanging out there.
Elizabelle
@Kathleen:
Excellent point.
Kathleen
@Villago Delenda Est: 1968 called and it wants to lend its undercover LEO’s out again.
The Moar You Know
@terraformer: Same shit has been going down in the SF Bay Area for decades. Every single last “violence during civil disturbance” incident since the 1980s has been shown to be the work of the local cops. They finally got caught last decade. Not that it has stopped them from continuing to do it.
This happens a lot more often than anyone realizes.
Bruuuuce
@VeniceRiley:
The question is whether the breaking point is going to be a Reichstag Fire or a Selma March. It’s up to us to ensure it’s the latter despite the almost certain attempts by Miller, Barr, and the rest of the Nazis at the top to try to make it the former
Elizabelle
WaPost item, in full. Whooooa.
MomSense
@Bruuuuce:
Apparently the gas mask belongs to the ex.
mrmoshpotato
@VeniceRiley:
What?
I know Van Jones is an idiot. (Is Dump “President” yet, Van?) But this is a whole new level of stupid!
germy
It happens every time.
Protests, and then arrests.
Rightwingers then say “If people didn’t LOOT and BE VIOLENT, then they wouldn’t be arrested!”
And then we see journalists arrested.
I never see rightwingers comment on that.
It happens every time.
Elizabelle
@Bruuuuce: You are right. We have to make this a Selma March.
I hope we can all do some (socially distanced!) candlelight peaceful protests, in support of the murdered black men and their communities. Which are OUR communities.
Kathleen
@VeniceRiley: WTF? Why do I have to be watched out for? Not directed at you of course LOL.
Bruuuuce
@MomSense: True. Still circumstantial, though indicative, I would think. (It could have been loaned out, for example)
SiubhanDuinne
@Dorothy A. Winsor:
That video trailer is gorgeous to see and tantalising to contemplate. Your publisher did a great job. I preordered the book a few weeks ago; now I’m more eager than ever to read it. Congratulations!
Kathleen
@Elizabelle: Thank you.
Fair Economist
I think the only option is to “repeal and replace” the Minneapolis police department. Disband it, and form a new police department, with a citizen’s group doing the hiring. Future hirings and promotions all need to be done by citizen’s groups as well. The police must be subordinate to the people.
Bruuuuce
@Elizabelle: I’m just not sure we haven’t passed that point, at least until this part of the cycle plays out. Which will last at least until the charges the MN AG says he’s going to bring against the cop(s) are laid, and he (they, by preference) are in custody. The CNN incident is not going to help.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@mrmoshpotato:
You know what you did.
TaMara (HFG)
Alright. I’m going to go about my day and try not to hate everything…
Sebastian
@Elizabelle:
Why has the chief of police not stepped down already?
MomSense
@Kathleen:
Exit polling says racial resentment was major factor. We felt it at the time. The economic anxiety argument was always crap.
Elizabelle
@Bruuuuce: This was a fascinating bit of footage, of a young black man in a pink shirt confronting the masked provocateur who was breaking store windows (at the Advance Auto store)??
I am wondering if anyone followed this guy back to his car, or wherever he went. You can see two men kind of monitoring him.
Also, at one point, the gas-masked guy turns to the camera. Face recognition might be of some use there, even though it’s incomplete. It’s a good image.
Jackals, please let us know if you see any follow up on this.
Source: (from a jackal!) The Grio:
Masked white man smashing Minneapolis AutoZone windows in viral video raises suspicion
narya
I’m also overwhelmed today. I don’t have to go anywhere or talk to anyone, and i have work to do to distract me, but that is only a distraction. Terrorists invade the Michigan legislature, and . . . nothing. People protest yet another murder, on camera, of a black person, and it’s time to pull out the tear gas and rubber bullets.
Leto
@Kathleen: it’s us, the Hitlary voters, who are marching on state captials decked out in full combat gear (ill fitting, poorly serviced, even more poorly trained), DEMANDING our precious hair salons be opened immediately; that wearing a mask, trying to protect ourselves and others (because the “good book” is full of helpful advice about caring for each other in times of need), is an infringement on our dog given rights to spread plague! Yes, it’s these voters that the nation needs to be afraid of…
rikyrah
Arrested the Black reporter.
Heard him ask, at least 3 times
‘ where do you want me to move?’
But, somehow, let the WHITE reporter alone.
UH HUH
UH HUH
Bruuuuce
@Elizabelle: I really do hope a positive ID turns out to be possible, especially if they guy was pushing chaos and violence for the purpose of vilifying and discrediting the protestors. If I read anything more certain, I’ll surely bring it here.
Elizabelle
@narya: I think we are hitting a tipping point, and that we will win, in the long run.
Those thug white protesters at the Michigan capitol? That stuff has got to stop. Don’t you personally feel “hey, it really is time to junk the Second Amendment.” Footage like that belongs in some failed third or fourth world country. Which those white thug protesters want to turn this county into.
And: too much, too much, and more than enough of black men, people of color, and all kinds of community members being killed by the police or by (particularly white) people taking the law into their own hands.
I think we have reached a tipping point, and that Trump and the people who support him are the outliers.
There are more of us. And Joe Biden and our Democratic politicians and community leaders can say a lot, intelligently, to step into the vacuum left by Trump’s deplorable leadership (on behalf of his base, the deplorables).
Doesn’t it feel it is going to be a long summer? This truly is the kickoff this weekend, not last.
Elizabelle
@rikyrah: And on film. And CNN is shocked, shocked.
This is going to help in being a gamechanger.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@SiubhanDuinne:
Thank you. I’m obviously excited and in the process of sharing it everywhere. I hope people aren’t too horrified by the world to see it.
Feathers
It is now officially a put salt in the coffee morning for me. Time to put a nail polish strip around the top of the sugar jar. I have them labeled, but apparently put the salt away where the sugar usually is last night.
Plus I seem to have gotten a nasty infestation of pantry moths. Am going back to reread the overnights, but I had to share.
Kay
I’m worried too. Every time you think it can’t get worse, it does get worse.
I heard a stimulus joke today though:
“how much does it take to turn a Republican into a socialist?”
1200 dollars :)
lamh36
JPL
@Elizabelle: John Berman left no doubt that he felt the incident was racial in nature. He was livid. He didn’t act shocked as much as he was angry.
Krope, the Formerly Dope
Funny. But the truth is too many of them already see this as too much to invest in the well-being of the public despite the fact that it is, in fact, too little and FAR too late.
narya
@Elizabelle: I hope so. I remember 1968, somewhat; not the full impact, because I was 10. And I get a teeny tiny bit of . . . respite from seeing that many protesters in Mpls are white. And I’m ashamed at myself, too: I have the privilege of saying, oh, i’m overwhelmed, I’m just gonna sit here and do my work. My (female-presenting) body may be in danger sometimes in other ways, but not like the bodies of the brown and black folks, every single damn day.
Bruuuuce
On a totally different note:
Gov Beshear of Kentucky responds — and responds well — to the putzim who hung an effigy of him last week:
It’s nice that the guy who hung the effigy (a Three Percenter, natch) has lost his job, but IMNSHO, he should be sitting in a Kentucky cell awaiting trial on a charge or more of terrorism.
Kay
@Krope, the Formerly Dope:
Yeah, I sort of disagree about “too little”. The stimulus and the PPP were the focus, but the UI bump is the single most important thing Democrats got accomplished, and it will pay huge dividends in avoiding further damage to the economy and to people. 1200 doesn’t matter- it’s a gimmick which Trump recognized and tried to capitalize on. 600 a week matters. Trump paid no attention to the UI bump because he’s an idiot.
If we had done a 600 a week UI payment after the financial crash we could have avoided so much misery, mitigated so many cascading effects. But- we got it right this time.
Elizabelle
@JPL: Haven’t seen it, and will watch.
Was speaking more of CNN management. Who enabled Trump’s rise. Wake up call for them.
AnnaN
Shit. I grew up in one of the neighborhoods where this is happening. Actually, in two of them, if it’s true that the riots spread to West St. Paul last night. This is killing me. I’m outraged at the cops, sympathetic to the non-looting protesters and worried for my mother who is 81 and lives six block from Lake St. in between the Hiawatha and Uptown hot spots. All those small businesses being torched. Fucking cops who started this and that asshole County Atty who won’t even push for an arrest.
Patricia Kayden
Krope, the Formerly Dope
I agree. That is a far more significant help to people. And it was designed to reach people that UI hadn’t reached before.
Nevertheless, a century of failure to properly invest in healthcare and decades of promoting a culture where everyone was one paycheck away from ruin has caught up to us.
MisterForkbeard
@VeniceRiley:
The fuck does that even mean? That Hillary voters are the dangerous ones?
Kay
@Krope, the Formerly Dope:
I feel strongly about this. I want Democrats to not just defend the UI bump, but crow about it. Make the argument. Tell people the continuing payment may avoid what I think of as “the cascade”, when they lose 1 or 2 or 3 or 4 paychecks and shit starts to snowball, and they lose everything, including their homes. That was 2009 -10. That’s what happened.
They need enough money, every week. It’s really that simple. Give it to them. We will ALL benefit. It will be the best money we ever spent and end up being cheaper than allowing them to drown.
Barbara
@MisterForkbeard: “Do you mean all 65 million of us or a specific subset, what do you mean Van?”
Sometimes the response to this kind of idiocy a request for further explanation.
Croaker
Definitely a deeper story into Dereck Chauvin’s killing his coworker George Floyd. Motivation color sure but what else. These guys knew each other…
George 2 traffic violations /. Dereck 18 occurrences one police force
https://amp.kstp.com/articles/george-floyd-fired-officer-overlapped-security-shifts-at-south-minneapolis-club-may-28-2020-5743990.html?__twitter_impression=
Krope, the Formerly Dope
@Kay: I agree, wholeheartedly. I likewise feel strongly about it. But I also feel strongly that it shouldn’t require a world historical catastrophe to make sure our citizens are having their needs met.
TaMara (HFG)
Because 2020, that’s why. Fuck it, I’m just going to eat ice cream all day.
Kay
@Krope, the Formerly Dope:
I want people to think about this in a different way. An example: cuts to public schools. I read a good rebuttal on Twitter to the “borrowing from our grandchildren” idea. Cutting schools IS borrowing from our grandchildren, much more directly than deficit spending is. We are literally taking their money when we cut schools.
I think we have to make the argument. We have a good one! There’s more than one way to “borrow”. Borrow and pay it now or pay for not funding it later. It’s all borrowing.
Matt McIrvin
@Kay: I agree. I have already been seeing Republicans complaining about the paltry payouts that have already happened because they’re keeping unemployment up by making lazy people not want to work. I can’t believe this could possibly be a majority position, but it’s one they will espouse openly and proudly in the misery to come, and if we support the unemployment extensions they will walk right into it.
JPL
@TaMara (HFG): Just no!
Elizabelle
@TaMara (HFG): They retrieved the samples from the monkeys. Seemed undamaged and not released.
They have retested the three individuals whose vials the monkeys seized.
We don’t have to worry about crowds of ravaging monkeys through our streets. Yet.
Felanius Kootea
@Elizabelle: I saw that too and was like “they knew each other?”
Did some googling and the restaurant/club owner says Chauvin worked there 17 years as an off-duty cop on the outside while Floyd worked as a bouncer for the last year on the inside. They may not have known each other.
Chauvin still needs to be arrested. God knows what else that man has done that hasn’t yet come to light.
Baud
@Elizabelle:
Fixed.
Elizabelle
@Matt McIrvin: Just like they’re walking into the masks as cultural signifier “controversy.”
They’re going to lose on that, too. Selfish and childish is selfish and childish. And it is way more apparent now, too.
Kay
@Matt McIrvin:
I don’t know but it may not matter, because the 600 dollar payments are going to “work”- they are succeeding at their function, which was “mitigate the cascading disaster that mass unemployment causes”.
Unlike their economic stimulus, tax cuts, ours actually WORKS. Because of course it does. They get it, and they pay their bills with it. Then they don’t lose their home or their car and they can get back up easier. And that’s good for all of us.
Sloane Ranger
For what it’s worth, in a previous thread someone mentioned the fact that UK police are generally unarmed and points out that this is easier with a generally unarmed population.
I think there is also a cultural difference between British and US attitudes to policing. In the UK policing was based on what were known as Peel’s Principles of Law Enforcement (Peel was the Home Secretary who set up the Metropolitan Police in 1829).
There are 9 principles and the 2nd one is as follows “The ability of the police to perform their duties is dependent upon public approval of police existence, actions, behavior and the ability of the police to secure and maintain public respect.”
The others expand on those. See https://www.durham.police.uk/About-Us/Documents/Peels_Principles_Of_Law_Enforcement.pdf
These Principles have been updated a couple of times, but remain substantially unchanged. Have they been followed by all police officers (or even all Forces) on all occasions? Certainly not, but they continue to set the cultural norms for both police and citizens. I get the feeling that, in the US, police forces were created in all too many jurisdictions solely as agents to control feared groups and this continues to be the case. Hence the problem today.
VeniceRiley
I think what Van was going for was trying to channel MLK by restating his warning to beware moderate voters … by throwing in some extra misogyny. Also, Van? Hillary was not a moderate. Bill was. So F U, mister.
Boris Rasputin (the evil twin)
@Villago Delenda Est: Tell me about it! And somewhere a basement troll is working on his manifesto modeled on the “Protocols” for MAGAt consumption.
Baud
@VeniceRiley:
If moderate voters are Hillary voters, then I’m happy to shun liberals.
Krope, the Formerly Dope
Thanks, I’m gonna…borrow that. I also feel compelled to point out that smart public investments can promote growth and advancement in ways that tax cuts have never been shown to do.
I would never make such a lofty claim that such investments would pay for themselves, but the benefits are clear enough that I would say it’s clearly worthwhile.
Frankly, I find all the fussing over money distasteful. We CAN feed everyone and house everyone and care for the sick and continue education for those who want to do more with their careers. We don’t because money.
Then when the money shufflers fuck up their casino games, suddenly people aren’t working and can’t pay for the basics and we refuse to fix that state of affairs without making the financial sector, which caused the whole problem, whole.
Then we’re subject to a GD plague and suddenly all the lowest paid and most at-risk people are deemed essential. But they were always essential. We never paid them like they were. We likely still won’t.
Elizabelle
@Kay: A lot of rightwing shit is slogans. Just slogans.
Examine them more closely — stealing from the grandchildren to fund education and — there is nothing there.
It seems the people most likely to watch and spout Fox News/rightwing shit are the people least likely to do any original thinking on their own. Albeit, plenty of original thinking on conspiracy-mongering. They excel at that.
Hoping there are more of us. I suspect there are, and that it’s only that the loudmouth rightwingers get an outsize megaphone.
(Those comments and article links last night about how developing an AI algorithm to screen for white supremacist/extremist comments was catching too many Republicans’ comments — that was priceless.)
We could stop this backsliding. We have to.
Kay
@Matt McIrvin:
And, then, as always with the GOP base we have “the lying” problem. Because I have heard the same complaint- that people “won’t” come back to work because they’re getting 600 dollars. But that isn’t how unemployment works. If the employer notifies unemployment the laid off employees are off furlough and can go back to work the UI recipient is no longer “unemployed” and cannot receive unemployment.
UI had two sides. The employer verifies. In Ohio, the employer verifies weekly. So they have to walk me thru this- how is it that the employer calls the employee back and the employee refuses and remains on unemployment? None of them can answer these questions because it’s just Right wing bullshit they heard and are parroting at me.
Sloane Ranger
@MisterForkbeard: I watched this. What he said was that the woman involved in the Central Park incident with the dog and the birdwatcher was probably a liberal, Hilary donor/supporter, but she couldn’t escape the racism that is a baked in part of American culture.
CaseyL
@NotMax: That’s Loulou the miniature doxie and one of her family’s ducklings! I subscribe to her human’s channel on YouTube. A delightful Netherlands family, with an ever-growing menagerie. Watching Eveline’s videos is a real tonic in these par’lous times.
I don’t know which way the country will break. The truism of history is that prolonged abuse of a populace doesn’t ennoble it, but turns it meaner and more punitive. Charity, mercy, and generosity of spirit are luxuries of a prosperous, safe community – that’s why the Right prefers a divided, fearful, poverty-stricken country. It’s easier to turn people against one another when everyone is on a knife’s edge.
different-church-lady
@Elizabelle:
They can’t even do police brutality in the correct order.
Elizabelle
@VeniceRiley: Can you or anyone point us to what show, what date, what time the Van Jones comments appeared?
I would like to see the segment for myself, and can prepare a transcript if you will guide me there.
Sometimes the speaker did not say what it seemed. Sometimes he/she did. Have to check the original source.
trollhattan
@TaMara (HFG):
Monkey in pic lucky she’s not completing a circuit. Bad monkey!
lamh36
PBO statement on George Floyd
https://twitter.com/BarackObama/status/1266400635429310466
Elizabelle
@different-church-lady: That was actually the hilarious part. Leaving the cameraman to record the whole thing.
Sadly, it might be an educational moment for bad police departments.
Elizabelle
@Sloane Ranger: Where exactly did that appear? What program? Can you provide a link?? re Van Jones comments.
Kay
@Matt McIrvin:
I have already seen this situation. Employee at assisted living. She’s high risk for COVID so her employer laid her off and she was receiving unemployment. Employer then called her back to work. She doesn’t want to go because if she gets the COVID she probably dies, but she is now ineligible for unemployment. The employer (cleverly!) then put her on FMLA (unpaid, of course). That’s how that will work, from the employer side.
Ruckus
@Elizabelle:
I’ll ask.
If the police confirm that he isn’t a cop, then they must know who he is. If they know who he is and what he’s done they should arrest him, for destruction of property and starting a riot. Otherwise I’d assume that the cops are lying which means he is a cop or they don’t know who he is. None of which helps at all.
This is always how it starts.
schrodingers_cat
Any good local MN reporters I can follow on Twitter
Elizabelle
@Sloane Ranger: Great comment re difference in policing philosophies.
Slavery on our own soil comes back to bite the United States. Again.
VeniceRiley
@Elizabelle: You can watch it- I RT’d with a comment on my twitter @veniceriley about an hour ago
Ruckus
@Matt McIrvin:
Something that could make him a good president. He’s still learning, at his age. He’s willing to visit and revise his world views. He’s willing to grow. It is encouraging. I’d vote for him regardless because he’s a million miles ahead of shitforbrains as a human, maybe farther. But it’s also nice to see that he’s worthy of that vote.
Patricia Kayden
Yep.
Elizabelle
@Ruckus: From this link, the St. Paul Police put out a comment on Facebook.
Made me wonder if they were referring to a named individual whom they could prove was otherwise engaged at the time. Do not know if the police know who the masked white man was yet.
I, Elizabelle, have not verified this item yet. But checking on the St Paul PD Facebook page now. Will report back.
Source: Minnesota website called Bring Me the News.
Who is the umbrella man who started damage at AutoZone?
The damage and subsequent fire at AutoZone sparked a major escalation of the protests.
trollhattan
@Ruckus:
Recalling the Seattle WTO mess (21 years ago?!?) there were folks who traveled there committed to performing violence amidst the great majority of peaceful protesters. Could similar folks be drawn to Minneapolis? We’ve occasionally had them show up here for protests at the State Capitol.
Not ruling out inside job by cops but there are myriad possibilities and as we know from the goober gun-humper events, uniforms, body armor, helmets and the like can be bought by cosplayers.
Elizabelle
@VeniceRiley: Thank you. Will check that out.
I am rather Twitter illiterate, but I do love checking their linked material.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Krope, the Formerly Dope:
See, that’s why tax cuts(especially capital gain tax cuts) are better, they pay for themselves and they cure the clap.
Kathleen
@MomSense: Right. I always related that to why people voted for Trump. I think the unexamined piece is how that played out related to Hillary.
Elizabelle
@trollhattan: That’s what I think too.
And they show up at all the DC meetings for World Bank Week (September, if memory serves. Publicized months in advance.)
They show up at a lot of protests to cause trouble and instigate.
ETA: You can definitely see that the organized white thugs with rifles types are organized. Same signs and slogans in Michigan and Virginia at the Reopen protests, along with the charming local made signs that misspell tyranny.
We’ve learned that there are Trump groupies who travel to his hate rallies.
We had assholes from all over the country flood into Richmond, VA for the Martin Luther King holiday gun “rights” protests.
Bruuuuce
@Elizabelle: Thanks for the link. The problem is that there’s no good way other than eyewitnesses to verify what the St Paul PD is saying about his activities. Any records the PD can produce other than video or eyewitnesses placing him elsewhere are suspect because of the protective culture of police for their own.
Ruckus
@Kathleen:
I’m going to me too here. Why am I a problem because I voted for Hillary Clinton? Because I was trying to hire a far, far better person, an actual human being to be president rather than shitforbrains? That makes us bad how?
Kay
Oh, well, if he SAID it. How naive are these people? Facebook and Zuckerberg promoted Sandy Hook conspiracy theories for 6 years, to the extent where the grieving parents of those children had to MOVE and go into hiding. Facebook promoted those posts. They made money off it.
It’s a horrible company and Zuckerberg is a horrible, garbage person. The Trump thing isn’t even their worst offense. We already know how bad they are : very bad.
AndoChronic
Checking in with Edith. My favorite gas station got blowed-up this morning on the northside of Mpls. and I could still see the smoke from the 3rd. Police Prec. this morning from my office window on the west bank of the U of M campus. We’re safe and doing good though, so far. The damage in Mpls./ St. Paul is a lot more extensive and widespread than what’s being reported in the national and even local media.
trollhattan
@Ruckus:
Hillary is perhaps, probably even, the most-prepared candidate for president of my lifetime. I’m the “problem” because I happily voted for her twice–primary and general?
Elizabelle
Minnesota Governor Waltz holding a press conference now. Can access it through WaPost front page.
Baud
@Ruckus:
I listened to it. He was talking about people like the Central Park woman who see themselves as liberal but can be triggered by race. It was inartful, but all he was saying is even supposedly “good” white people can end up being dangerous.
lamh36
Uh huh…I see Amy K on Andrea Mitchell trying to clean up her past as Minnesota AG. (btw, the Kamala is Cop slam can finally die a painful death)
nope…not gonna work Amy…sorry…
https://twitter.com/ira/status/1266409100063039489
Kathleen
@TaMara (HFG): Corona Monkeys would be a great name for a beachy Jimmy Buffet tribute band.
manfrommadras
I genuinely dont understand how the protests are going to help. I know its a cry of anger and rage, but once the dust settles, what is the outcome? Is it going to move the needle of justice forward or not? Or is that a pointless question? Everyone needs to stop reacting emotionally to these events, otherwise they will only snowball….
different-church-lady
@Kay: But… but but… STAYING IN TOUCH WITH MY GRAND-NEPHEW!!!
lamh36
Lordt help us all… chump giing a pressers at 2pm ET
Jinchi
A man died.
Baud
@Jinchi: Do you recognize the nym? I don’t.
rikyrah
@Kay:
tell the truth, Kay.
Break it down.
different-church-lady
@VeniceRiley:
The only hard and fast rule about media is that everything just dispassionately fascinating until it’s one of them.
MisterForkbeard
@manfrommadras: There was an interesting article on this kind of thing a few days ago – there are instances where this kind of damage actually does work, because there are real consequences to elites and moneyed classes that would ordinary just shrug off the complaints, protesting.
This whole situation is really bad, but maybe we’ll get a silver lining out of it.
different-church-lady
@Kay:
I’m not even sure he’s a person. He might be a shark that gained the ability to walk on land.
MisterForkbeard
@Baud: Pretty sure I’ve seen them around before.
Jinchi
They are responding to the accusation that umbrella man is a named officer from the St. Paul police force. His name and picture have lit up on twitter.
Carol
David Frum in an Atlantic essay says there’s evidence the riots were started by “outsiders”. I’ve always thought that many of the liberal riots were started by republican operatives, perhaps not officially, but by alt right underground nuts.
Kathleen
@Ruckus: Exactly . So sick of My Pure Betters.
Steeplejack
@Elizabelle:
It’s on MSNBC, too, or was a few minutes ago. I had to switch off because I was about to blow a gasket.
Jinchi
Is Roger Stone still in jail, or has he been released to ‘house arrest’?
lamh36
Lordt…let me go take a nappy nap so I can miss Chump’s presser. My money says it’s gonna be a shit show!
AnnaN
@AndoChronic: Yep – my mom said that the Best Buy in Roseville was hit. I mean…Roseville? She had done some volunteering at the Native Am. Inst. back in the 90s which is in the Powderhorn Park area – she said it was set on fire too.
Makes me wonder if this hands-off approach by the police in protecting POC small business owners would be happening if this riot was taking place in Edina.
And, West Bank Shout Out! I lived three years of my life in Wilson Library and Wiley Hall.
Steeplejack
@Kathleen:
That thread has some great shots of black humor.
Sometimes you just have to laugh.
lamh36
@lamh36:
Biden will speak at 1:30EST before Trump!!!
Come through JOe!!!!
Steeplejack
@Baud:
Infrequent but genuine commenter, going back to at least 2009.
Baud
@Steeplejack: Ok, thanks. Can’t be too careful these days.
Spanky
Pepper spray? I hear it’s in the air everywhere in MSP.
BTW, what ever happened to debit?
Baud
When you’ve lost The Turtle.
mali muso
@AnnaN: Roseville! I lived there for many years in the late 90s/early 00s while going to college. Been to that Best Buy many a time. Wow.
Spanky
It does have all the makings of a long, hot summer once again, doesn’t it? I’m not the praying type, but we really don’t need a Reichstag Fire moment any time before the election. Well, any time, really.
The whole world’s watching.
Elie
@Carol:
I was discussing this with my husband. I could see white nationalists in the mixed crowd of protesters would be able to commit arson or also participate in looting and other crimes. It has happened before and how better to deligitimize the reason for the protests — the murder of a black man, than to turn the public’s eyes onto the “violence” and lawlessness of black protesters and “rioters”. I am very very suspicious of the riots — not for the protest of this horrible act, but because the violence spawned is truly unrelated to the just cause for the protest. Also notice how quick the orange monster in the white house took up the call for violence.
Elizabelle
@lamh36: Thanks for the head’s up. Will watch that.
Do you have a link for it? Does not appear C-Span has one up.
Gin & Tonic
@Spanky: I thought I saw her posting in one of the late threads that I was reading in the middle of the night when I couldn’t sleep.
AndoChronic
@AnnaN: Shit is crazy. Being a 4th gen. Minneapolitan it’s been my experience that virtually anything that happens in Mpls. would never fly in the surrounding burbs or even in St. Paul. We’re apparently that special!
sdhays
@Matt McIrvin: NPR had an article making this point just this week. That the overly generous unemployment benefits were making it “difficult” for people to go back to work. That was the headline!
Elizabelle
LA Times, publishing article from the Minneapolis Star Tribune from yesterday. Since both publications are behind a paywall, putting this up in full for you.
What we know about two of the officers caught on tape in the death of George Floyd
By MINNEAPOLIS STAR TRIBUNE
MAY 28, 2020
The Minneapolis police officer shown on video kneeling on George Floyd’s neck as Floyd pleaded for help, along with another officer who stood by and watched, have both been involved in use-of-force incidents over their careers.
Officer Derek Chauvin has been identified as the officer pinning down Floyd in the now-viral video, which shows Floyd saying he can’t breathe repeatedly before losing consciousness. Floyd later died. Four officers on scene have been fired. They have not yet been officially identified by department officials.
Chauvin, 44, is a 19-year department veteran. Department records and news accounts show that he has been involved in several police-involved shootings over his career.
In 2008, Chauvin shot and wounded a man named Ira Latrelle Toles during a domestic assault call. According to a 2011 article from the St. Paul Pioneer Press, Chauvin and other officers showed up to an apartment in south Minneapolis just before 2 a.m. Toles grabbed for an officer’s gun and Chauvin shot him in the abdomen.
In 2006, Chauvin and five others responded to a stabbing. After a man named Wayne Reyes, 42, allegedly pulled a shotgun on the officers, one of the officers shot and killed Reyes, according to a report titled “Stolen Lives” from Communities United Against Police Brutality, a police watchdog nonprofit based in Minneapolis.
The other officer identified in the video is Tou Thao. According to a deposition he gave in a 2017 lawsuit, Thao started with the department as a community service officer. He went through the academy in 2009. He was laid off for two years and returned to the department in 2012.
In 2017, a man named Lamar Ferguson sued Thao and another officer, Robert Thunder, for excessive use of force. According to the lawsuit, Ferguson and an eight-month-pregnant woman were walking home when Thao and Thunder stopped and searched them without cause. The officers handcuffed Ferguson, and Thao threw him to the ground and began punching him, while Thunder kicked him, according to the allegations.
The officers took Ferguson to the hospital for medical treatment. Afterward, they escorted Ferguson to jail wearing only his underwear and T-shirt, rejecting hospital staff’s requests that he be allowed to fully dress, according to the complaint.
In a deposition, Thao said they arrested Ferguson due to an outstanding warrant for his arrest. He said he only punched Ferguson after one of Ferguson’s hands slipped out of the handcuffs.
“He tries to pull away,” Thao said in the deposition. “And he puts his hands on me and tries to give me a stiff arm in a way to try to get me off of him. … At this point he’s actively resisting arrest. … So I had no choice but to punch him. I punched him in the face. It causes him to pause a bit, which gives Officer Thunder the time to come around and help.”
The case settled out of court for $25,000, according to Seth Leventhal, one of Ferguson’s attorneys.
Amir Khalid
Donald Trump has been on the phone today with another of the world’s less useful national leaders, discussing international cooperation against Covid-19. (Oh, the irony… ) CNN’s liveblog cites a statement from 10 Downing Street:
Tazj
@MisterForkbeard: I wasn’t listening to Van Jones on CNN when he said that, but from what I gather he made some reference to Amy Cooper and how she was probably a white liberal who voted for Hillary Clinton. Does he know that? I’ve seen no evidence of her party affiliation and I don’t know Cooper could very well be a Democrat. Regardless, he forged ahead trying to make a larger point about white liberals, Democrats and Hillary Clinton being covertly horrible on racial issues, by tying them to Amy Cooper.
Cheryl Rofer
Seeing this in several tweets.
Mary G
A bit late.
James E Powell
@MisterForkbeard:
Sometimes I think every news organization in America pays a bonus to every one of their reporters who says something stupid about Hillary Clinton.
Spanky
@Gin & Tonic: Thanks. I don’t think I’ve seen her around for months.
trollhattan
@Baud:
Did not see that coming. Truly.
Sloane Ranger
@Elizabelle: Sorry didn’t catch the name of the programme but it was on CNN at about 1.30pm UK time (8.30am in US?).
Does that help?
trollhattan
@James E Powell:
It’s a merit badge that goes on their awards sash.
Elizabelle
Here’s the WaPost link for the Biden remarks on Minneapolis/St. Paul. Coming soon.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/video/national/live-soon-biden-speaks-on-george-floyd-minneapolis-protests/2020/05/29/8c5ae80f-9897-490e-ae61-ac0e52e8cce6_live.html?itid=hp_hp-top-table-high_live-biden%3Ahomepage%2Fstory-ans
Elizabelle
@Sloane Ranger: Very well might. Venice Riley said he/she had tweeted with a link, but have not found that yet.
Thank you.
The Thin Black Duke
@Baud: Oh wow. I wonder what polling numbers Mitch is looking at. They must be pretty damned bad.
Mary G
Elizabelle
@trollhattan: Protests have come home to roost for the Turtle. Louisville KY had its own protests against the death of an unarmed black woman at the hands of police. Eight shots, and they found no drugs.
WaPost this morning, a roundup:
Seven shot in Louisville as protests turn violent nationwide overnight
The unrest multiplied from Phoenix to Columbus, Ohio, as hundreds of people converged in city centers and descended on state capitol buildings in the face of tear gas and rubber bullets from police.
Gunfire broke out in multiple cities, including Louisville, where police say seven people were injured in a shooting that sent dozens scattering. Several hundred people there were protesting the March fatal police shooting of Breonna Taylor in her apartment, which police entered while she was asleep.
Six or seven shots were also fired near a crowd in Denver on Thursday evening, but a police spokesman said no one was injured.
….
Thursday marked the third night of protests after Minneapolis officer Derek Chauvin was captured on video digging his knee into the back of Floyd’s neck as Floyd cried, “I can’t breathe!” before he died.
In Louisville, multiple protests had also broken out since Taylor, a 26-year-old emergency medical technician, was shot and killed by police. When narcotics detectives broke down her door after midnight, her boyfriend fired a gun, thinking armed intruders had entered the home. Police shot Taylor eight times when they returned fire. They found no drugs.
The Louisville protests appeared to reach a fever pitch Thursday night.
Protesters blocked buses, broke an arm off a statue of King Louis XVI outside City Hall and threw fireworks at police officers, WFPL reported. Then, around 11:30 p.m., gunfire erupted from within the crowd, police said.
Of the seven people shot, at least two were in surgery and five were in good condition as of early Friday morning, said Louisville Mayor Greg Fischer (D), adding that no police officers fired their weapons. Police spokeswoman Alicia Smiley said officers made multiple arrests but said she was unable to elaborate on how many or whether the arrests were connected to the shooting.
Fischer said, “I feel the community’s frustration, but tonight’s violence and destruction is not the way to solve it.” He shared a video message from Taylor’s sister, Juniyah Palmer, urging everyone to be peaceful.
“Louisville, thank you so much for saying Breonna’s name tonight,” she said. “We are not going to stop until we get justice, but we should stop tonight before people get hurt. Please go home, be safe and be ready to keep fighting.”
Spanky
@James E Powell:
Quite possibly, but Van Jones is nothing near a reporter. If anything, “Democratic Operative” is – or was – his career.
Elizabelle
Biden up. Sounds very sad and restrained.
Shawn in Showme
@Ruckus:
The point that Van was making is that even some of the “good guys” who voted for Hillary are capable of practicing white supremacy because its part of the DNA of American society. It’s a cultural problem, not a Republican problem. They just have a higher concentration of white supremacists them over there.
He even made this point clear if you listen to his entire commentary:
https://dailycaller.com/2020/05/29/van-jones-hillary-clinton-supporters-threat-ku-klux-klan/
“Even the most liberal, well-intentioned white person has a virus in his or her brain that can be activated at an instant, and so what you’re seeing now is a curtain falling away,
Elizabelle
Biden just went there. Spoke of Original Sin.
MLK. The appalling silence of good people.
The Pale Scot
@Cheryl Rofer:
Looks Like him to me
The large upper sinus area, the recessed eyes under thin eyebrows. Where’s Abby Sciuto when you need her
Elizabelle
Sitting in Starbucks. Air BnB. Watching birds.
Yup.
This is no time for incendiary tweets. This is no time for violence.
We will have to put this transcript up after. It’s concise and effective and too fucking true.
Hold bad cops accountable.
We need to stand up as a nation. With the black community. With all communities …
[For those of us in a position of power] Finally deal with abuse of power.
Speaks of the pain, and the wound, and “without treating the underlying injury.”
The very soul of America is at stake.
Barbara
@The Thin Black Duke: I try not to be an optimist so I can better manage my disappointment but I think the footage of Floyd being slowly asphyxiated is too shocking to defend. The DA who blathered about “other evidence” fomented despair that could have been avoided. The criminal culpability of the other three police officers is less obvious.
Shawn in Showme
Here is the original Martin Luther King comment that was the inspiration for Van Jones’ modern take. MLK was just more careful about naming names when it came to white moderates:
In his 1963 “Letter from a Birmingham Jail,” Rev. Martin Luther King Jr. wrote, “I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro’s great stumbling block in the stride toward freedom is not the White Citizens Councilor or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate who is more devoted to order than to justice.”
James E Powell
Biden talking like he’s done with this shit and will make these issues a central part of his campaign. Pretty bold move for an old guy, no? Not exactly the ossified Democratic nominee that many people – including me at times – thought he’d be.
Elizabelle
And that was it.
PLEASE: FRONT PAGERS: please put Biden’s remarks up in its own post.
It was very short, very true, very eloquent, very heartfelt.
No grandstanding.
Spanky
From a WaPo piece titled When American conservatism becomes un-American, by …
… George Will ??
SFBayAreaGal
@Shawn in Showme: Exactly this. I a white woman knows I have the potential to do harm. That is why I am working at being a better ancestor and becoming an ally.
It is a work that I must be do every single day.
Elizabelle
@Shawn in Showme: I would like to see a thread on Biden’s remarks just now, and we can put in a link to that letter.
I read that for the first time in college freshman comp, and had never read anything so eloquent in my life.
This was the professor who told us to look at a blank page and think “the only thing you have to do is improve upon that.”
Villago Delenda Est
@Mary G: Won’t work, Amy. The crusts are burning on your VP aspirations.
Ruckus
@Elizabelle:
@trollhattan:
Oh I realize but it seems a lot of cops are not all that honest. The people we should trust most, a lot of us do not. And I’m not a minority, I’m an old white fart. But I’ve seen more than enough times that the cops will lie to protect their own and even when they don’t, how can you tell? Remember Rodney King? I lived nearby. They moved the trial, fearing the cops would get a fair trial. Ever watch the entire tape? I have. The other person in the car was arrested by one female cop, went peacefully. Know his name? The LAPD testified at his trial that the LAPD cops on trial went way past the vast limits of LAPD rules when they beat the crap out of him, they still got off. The Watts riots? I worked a few blocks from the riots at the time. Years later I watched from the same location as the LAPD would cruse around in unmarked cars, 5 men all over 6 ft tall packed in and would stop anyone of color walking down the street, surround them and harass them, men, women, anyone of color. The people of color were not the problem. The white people with power and their enablers were and are the problem. We knew some of those people of color, we employed some of them, they were fine, normal people, far better than many white people I’ve known.
I don’t know if it’s the power, the whiteness or both that cause people to be hateful and resentful above all else but it’s there. People will lie if it benefits them. People will be violent if they think it benefits them or if the people they are violent against scare them for whatever fucking stupid reason they can imagine. We have a massively bad history of racism in this country and it affects all of us in one way or another. We blame a lot of normal human problems on race, when it is never justified. We’ve tried for over 200 yrs to make it justified and it never has been nor ever will be. Racism has been raised as a rational to act inhuman by the majority in this country since it’s inception. It needs to stop, but I’m not sure that’s even possible. But we must try or it will destroy us all.
Villago Delenda Est
@Shawn in Showme: Yet Van fucking Jones remarked about Donald “becoming President” after his first SoU address.
Van Jones has been dead to me since that night. Fuck ’em, in the immortal words.
JPL
@Elizabelle: I second that
Villago Delenda Est
@Spanky: American “conservatives” have always cast longing eyes towards authoritarianism. Whatever it takes to protect the parasite overclass from justice for their crimes.
Baud
@Elizabelle: No one does plain spoken empathy like Joe. It’s his superpower.
lamh36
COME THROUGH JOE!!!
Compare and contrast from the shit show about to happen!
Ruckus
@trollhattan:
Exactly.
Matt McIrvin
@Elizabelle: I hope so.
The one that worries me is the same one indycat32 was worrying about in the other thread: we know white backlash stoked by unrest over police brutality helped Trump in 2016, and the place where it worked was the upper Midwest. Trump’s trying to use this to win Minnesota, and retain Wisconsin and Michigan. Does it work again? Or are the times different enough?
Villago Delenda Est
@Matt McIrvin: The times are different enough. Coronavirus is the albatross around Donald’s turkeywattle neck.
Elizabelle
@Villago Delenda Est: I have never thought there was any way Amy Klobuchar would be the VP. She just brings nothing, nothing to the ticket.
Although it is courteous to interview her, since she was one of his opponents for the nomination.
Period.
germy
Cheryl Rofer
Anybody got a link to Biden’s remarks? I’ve looked and don’t see them yet.
Also, Obama has issued a statement. And the shitshow is about to begin.
I’m gonna feed and water the birds. Be back in about ten minutes. If any other FP’ers get here with the goods before then, go for it!
cain
My girlfriend and I were talking today and she said her facebook people who normally do not want violence or even encourage it are now hit the threshold of they are sick of it and that violence may be the only way to make black people safe. My gf who is black also is near the end of her rope. She was interested to know what the non-white folks who cannot pass for white are going to do when it goes down though.
I’m going to have to figure out that myself.. I’m not really a violent person – but I can do satyagraha.
germy
Ruckus
@Baud:
Figured as much.
Elizabelle
@Matt McIrvin: Oh yeah.
We are going to see “Blue Lives Matter” and “All Lives Matter” and they’re coming for your (assault weapon) guns dialed up to eleven.
But: there is a limit to the deplorables. And even the deplorables have wives and spouses who do not share their views.
Think of how evangelical religions are seeing a real lack of enthusiasm in the younger generation. Because they have seen all the hypocrisy up close.
Gonna be the fight of our lives, but I really do think there are more of us, and if we can have a full and fair vote, we can win.
Got to get everyone who can vote registered, and with photo ID, if they need it. Just do it. And keep them inspired and connected.
MisterForkbeard
@Baud: No one ‘lost’ McConnell.
What he’s doing here is really simple: Acknowledge the plain truth about what happened (the officers murdered a black guy for no reaons) and ignore that it took massive protest and rioting to get ANY action on it. Instead he’s just blaming the rioters and protestors for being terrible people and this whole thing is their fault.
Elizabelle
@Baud: Decency.
Tazj
@Shawn in Showme: Thank you for clarifying the remarks of Van Jones. I agree with some of what he says. Racism is the original sin in this country. You can be from the northern US, a white liberal and/ or a white Democrat and still be a racist or blind to the problems of other races. The Democrats and Hillary Clinton are far from perfect. I’m far from perfect. However, at this time the Republican party is the greater problem because they yield the most power in this country and at this time their policies are actively hurting people.
Spanky
@Villago Delenda Est: My point is that it’s George Fucking Will calling these people out as un-American.
Ruckus
@manfrommadras:
At this point asking anyone to not be emotional seems to be a waste. People’s lives are at stake, people are being killed for no reason, people are being injured, marked for life for things that are pure bullshit. It’s been going on since the inception of this country, and it won’t change till that hate and stupidity are not encouraged, especially by our president. I wonder if Hillary Clinton partially was vilified because she’s the opposite of many of the men who have been president, by those who do not want to change the hate and bigotry that they have been raised in, steeped in, rewarded for their entire lives.
germy
Matt McIrvin
@Shawn in Showme: Reminds me of, I think, Michael Harriot talking after Biden’s last gaffe about, in his view, the need for Biden to have a black running mate. White people in the US have to work constantly and consciously to NOT be casually racist–it’s the air we breathe. It’s difficult to manage without another set of eyes.
Kathleen
@Baud: The more I think about his jab the more pissed off I get.
germy
The national guard is fighting for George Floyd.
Elizabelle
@Ruckus: If we are angry, we should be.
Channel that energy into productive action.
Kathleen
@Ruckus: This.
germy
Chilling.
Elizabelle
I guess Trump is delaying his press conference because Minnesota police are doing theirs on the arrest of George Floyd’s killer.
Matt McIrvin
@Kay: And if they just quit, they can’t receive unemployment either.
It’s hard for me to argue with these people because even my saying “no, that’s not true” accepts the implicit assumption that we SHOULDN’T be paying people to just stay at home idle! Which, right now, we should definitely be doing!!
SiubhanDuinne
@lamh36:
I caught a few minutes of that. Amy was defensive. She sounded angry and immature, which isn’t a good combination for anyone.
Barbara
@Spanky: The Atlantic got a lot of flack for publishing Vermeule, although I think of it as a kind of public service. In addition to showing the zeal of the converted, really, Vermeule and his ilk show the despair of people who desperately want Christianity not just to be mainstream, but to define the mainstream. At its root, this seems to be Bill Barr’s animating spirit. Barr and Vermeule see their own ethics and proclivities being marginalized. They never stop to wonder how their ethics and proclivities have marginalized others, for decades if not centuries.
Matt McIrvin
…the position on COVID-19 that makes me the most furious the people who respond to stories of people catching it at work with “and did anyone FORCE them at gunpoint to come to work?!” These are generally the same people who are upset about their tax money going to pay lazybones to stay home.
MisterForkbeard
@germy: So I guess they’re going to… respect Floyd’s memory by attacking the people who are protesting his murder?
This is going to end well.
schrodingers_cat
@Gin & Tonic: There is no special status but while your application is being decided on, you can get Employment authorization and travel permission. But you have to apply for it and there is a fee for it.
Also you cannot be outside the US for more than 6 months when your application is being processed.
gwangung
@Villago Delenda Est:
That’s nice.
But what he said was correct, nonetheless.
Aleta
General question about police violence, not this specific case. I’ve never seen an answer in stories about police shootings or other violence against civilians.
When an officer shoots someone (to simplify, in those cases when shooting must be reported to their department right away) are they required to be drug tested? IMO it should be immediate for an officer whenever someone dies in an interaction or custody. Does it happen? (Because of this epidemic of police violence, I’d also like to see it done whenever a suspect is transported to the hospital or arrives at the station injured along with reports of police violence by suspect or witness.)
Though privacy laws would apply to results, there must be public info at least as to how often police are tested routinely, and under what circumstances testing is mandatory.
They test the victim and report the findings in the press or if there’s an officer trial. But I’ve never seen an officer’s drug test reported, even in a trial of one being prosecuted for killing.
And why not, since officers are supposed to be ‘law-abiding.’ Urine collection is not complicated, and drugs and medications affect behavior and judgement and perceptions. And since police often report to the press that a suspect was under the influence after a report of police violence.
As well, routine drug testing might help make changes we need to get rid of at least a few officers who should be fired before they kill again. And to identify those who’re self-medicating their mood disorders or stress reactions, which may be understandable but isn’t OK mixed with absolute power, authority issues and a job where perceptions affect whether someone is treated fairly or is abused or murdered.
germy
The Moar You Know
@germy: You just wouldn’t think a guy in Trump’s piss-poor physical condition could beat a dead horse for that long.
MazeDancer .
Third degree murder. And manslaughter.
When are the other 3 cops being charged?
Steeplejack
@Spanky:
Debit commented in one of the overnight threads or early this morning.
Mary G
Shawn in ShowMe
@Tazj:
Agreed that we need to get Joe Biden into office. But that still doesn’t stop the white terrorism being carried out against black people. Having a Democrat as president would not have saved the lives of Breyanna Taylor, Ahmaud Arbery or George Floyd.
The black communities around the country can’t be asked to wait another 400 years until white supremacy is bred out of American society. At the very least, they’re owed reparations to be made whole economically. That way they have at least have the economic power to hold white supremacists accountable.
Ruckus
@The Thin Black Duke:
A side note about the hopeful Amy McGrath kicking of moscow mitch’s career.
I’ve donated to Amy because she seems like a normal person and she’s trying to beat a very abnormal/amoral one. I’ve also donated to an organization that claims to be for her but whose emails are now in direct opposition to Amy’s current emails about the race in KY. The polls and Amy’s emails are positive if cautious. This other organization is saying she’s losing badly and that I need to contribute a lot more to help her win. Something is mighty fishy.
The organization is called Stop Republicans. As I said something smells about this. Looked it up and the responses I got from my search of the name comes back with filing information and several hits on fake orgs to raise money. Don’t see any calling this out directly but I’m wondering if my sense of fishy isn’t justified.
This is their address.
Stop Republicans
P.O. Box 618293
Chicago, IL 60661
They are registered as Stop Republicans.org
laura
@manfrommadras: We the People have a Fundamental Right to Assemble, to Free Speach, to Petition our Government for a redress of grievances. The daily lynchings of American Men and Women of color under color of authority is certainly worthy of Direct Action. Sitting idly by is not going to restore life or advance justice.
I hope that helps. And if you just wandered by to concern troll, please to be running and jumping up your own ass.
Kay
@Matt McIrvin:
I don’t even get that far. We have a big catastrophe. We can do some transfer payments and avoid a bigger one, or not. Do they want the bigger one? It’s optional and if there is a bigger one 95% of them will be harmed too, whether they like it or not. It’s win/win.
I am currently NOT unemployed but I would prefer not to have another Great Depression because that’s a bad thing. For me.
They have to start making a connection between “the economy” and “the money people have or don’t have”. They must.
Barbara
@MazeDancer .: I am not defending them, but I would want to know what their legal duty was before I knew what to charge them with. Firing them is a necessary step, even if they are ultimately not charged criminally.
Ruckus
@Shawn in Showme:
Thank you.
I’m not saying he’s totally off base but he is wrong. Yes most white people can be racist, as can most humans in the world. And yes a lot of white people in the US are in fact racist as hell. But this is not in any way every white person. I know too many white people who are not, nor would they ever entertain that someones race makes them a bad person. There are bad people of every race. In this country there are a lot of white people who think everyone that doesn’t look like them are criminals and filthy, nasty people. They are wrong. I served with some of them in the military, I’ve seen them my entire 70 yrs, my grandmother lived in south central LA, my mom grew up there. And people I know are as black as I am white. And I’ve described myself as white as headlights. Not every person who looks like me acts or thinks in any way like a member of the KKK. Racism is a learned trait, not a virus. You don’t just catch racism, you are steeped in it, raised in it, it is reenforced in your life and you have to be amenable to that to be racist. It’s a white people issue in this country because we are a majority white country with a huge and ongoing history of racism. Not because it is some kind of virus that only infects white people.
H.E.Wolf
Amy Cooper is reportedly a Canadian, so it’s unlikely that she voted for HRC in any election.
Steeplejack
@Barbara:
Well said.
Stacib
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: “I’d rather die on my feet than live on my knees.” James Brown in Say It Loud, I’m Black and I’m Proud
The Pale Scot
…There was a fantastic universal sense that whatever we were doing was right, that we were winning. . . .
And that, I think, was the handle—that sense of inevitable victory over the forces of Old and Evil. Not in any mean or military sense; we didn’t need that. Our energy would simply prevail. There was no point in fighting—on our side or theirs. We had all the momentum; we were riding the crest of a high and beautiful wave. . . .
So now, less than five years later, you can go up on a steep hill in Las Vegas and look West, and with the right kind of eyes you can almost see the high-water mark—that place where the wave finally broke and rolled back.”
Hunter S Thompson
Bobby Kennedy anounces MLK’s Death
Growing up hanging out with my older cousins listening to Hendrix, The Beatles, Love, you thought things were always get better, that assholes were being shoved into their holes. Then Reagan rode the wave of think tank manufactured reactionaries and weight of the shame of being an asshole slowly lifted. Evaporated now totally by the Internet echo chamber. RFK would have been an awesome president. His death is when the tide starts to draw out.
Ruckus
@Kay:
THIS.
The great recession of this century would have bankrupted me, had I had the money to declare bankruptcy. Cost me my second business.
There was a recession in 80/81 during which I owned a company with 6 employees. Went almost 4 months with no work. If two men hadn’t left when I cut back to 40 hrs because I couldn’t pay OT and then to 32 hrs because I couldn’t find any work and all we did was make personal tools for when the work came back I wouldn’t have been able to pay the others. Work did come back, we rebounded and recovered.
All these republican recessions have been killing me (and many other) slowly for my entire life. The continued racism has killed many fine human beings and once again is trying to destroy our country. I’ve long ago lost count of the racist battles that have killed huge numbers of people that just wanted to be…. human. And we are doing it again. WTF is wrong with people that they can’t see this, that selfishness is key here. The conservative policies that create the recessions and the type of money grubbing that makes shitforbrains salivate, the racism that creates the blame that no one deserves, to hide the selfishness of conservative policies is a curse that needs to be at the very least brought to the front of all issues in this country or we will never recover.
Duane
@Kay: A lot of people getting that extra unemployment money see that the economy has money, it’s them that “don’t have.” Republicans don’t like that at all. When people realize how much a few hundred dollars means to their life, they might start demanding it.
The Pale Scot
@different-church-lady:
Reptilian, almost definitely a Reptilian
How to Spot the Reptilians Running the U.S. Government
Old, but still germane
Feathers
@Aleta: Short answer. Police unions. Police have the right to unionize and their unions are notoriously corrupt. Many, if not most, jurisdictions have negotiated in their contracts the terms under which police accused of wrongdoing can be questioned and charged. It is not uncommon for police not to have to answer questions for 24 or 48 hours, which of course would negate any alcohol or drug testing, as well as give them time to meet with a union provided lawyer who would coordinate the statements of all the officers involved (who have the same 24-48 hour window of silence) before they are interviewed.
Breaking police unions is the key to police reforms. There was behavior within the NYPD union so egregious that the DOJ had drawn up RICO charges against them. They ended up being to chickenshit to file them and went for the individual officers instead. But that is what it will take.
The Massachusetts police and fire unions are notoriously awful. A more than frequent bargaining tactic is to put up a union picket line at Democratic Party meetings and functions (knowing the Dems have a don’t cross picket lines policy). Back during the Dukakis administration, the police even shut down the annual Democratic Party state convention. Not coincidentally that was about the same time that their was a gang of bank robbers who were all from the same local police department. Forget which North Shore town it was.
The Pale Scot
@Spanky:
Almost nothing worse than a prod who converts to Cath, holier than all zoos up the wazoo
EthylEster
@Elizabelle: try googling Van Jones Hillary voters.
Tazj
@H.E.Wolf: Interesting, I didn’t know.
J R in WV
deleted
Drdavechemist
@Spanky: George Will also recently wrote about my Democratic governor, Gina Raimondo, in favorable terms as a potential VP pick for Biden, based on her management of the COVID pandemic here. Scary, huh?
J R in WV
@germy:
Oh, come on germy, you know it’s illegal for the Army to be called upon to intervene in Americ… — oh, wait. AG Barr, laws!!
Never mind!
Anya
@Raoul Paste: I don’t really think she was a serious VP contender.
J R in WV
@Ruckus:
I only donate to individual candidates for the most part, and always via ActBlue, which I find to be totally honest and above-board. I do support Four-Corners, a political action committee connected to Native Americans. I got a really nice phone call from them thanking me for supporting their work the other day, a good conversation, no begging whatsoever.
Committees, like the DCCC, DLCC, DSCC, absorb a lot of your donation in overhead and payroll. Candidates don’t do that so much. Particularly Democratic candidates, as opposed to RWNJ grifters.
Amy McGrath, while not a perfect person, is so far ahead of McConnell so far as being a human being, I contribute to her regularly. Also contribute to many candidates in AZ, some of whom actually win election. I think Mark Kelly will be in the next Senate instead of Martha McSally, who is a waste of space.
Procopius
@Kay: <blockquote>I want Democrats to not just defend the UI bump, but crow about it.</blockquote>I felt the same way back in 2010 about the ACA. I thought every Democrat incumbent should be back in her district selling the program to her constituents. They ran away from it, instead.
Procopius
@Elie: Old leftist proverb: “The first person to call for violence is the police spy.”
cain
Rapper Killer Mike – https://www.cbsnews.com/news/rapper-killer-mike-pleads-with-atlanta-demonstrators-to-burn-systemic-racism-not-specific-targets/
Amazing talk from the heart by this man. I would love to see this man in political office.