Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Do not shrug your shoulders and accept the normalization of untruths.

I have other things to bitch about but those will have to wait.

Every decision we make has lots of baggage with it, known or unknown.

Russian mouthpiece, go fuck yourself.

You cannot shame the shameless.

This blog will pay for itself.

Everything is totally normal and fine!!!

Cancel the cowardly Times and Post and set up an equivalent monthly donation to ProPublica.

Every one of the “Roberts Six” lied to get on the court.

When they say they are pro-life, they do not mean yours.

Disappointing to see gov. newsom with his finger to the wind.

Republican speaker of the house Mike Johnson is the bland and smiling face of evil.

People really shouldn’t expect the government to help after they watched the GOP drown it in a bathtub.

Jack be nimble, jack be quick, hurry up and indict this prick.

This country desperately needs a functioning fourth estate.

Fear and negativity are contagious, but so is courage!

People are complicated. Love is not.

Beware of advice from anyone for whom Democrats are “they” and not “we.”

The lights are all blinking red.

Incompetence, fear, or corruption? why not all three?

Take hopelessness and turn it into resilience.

The poor and middle-class pay taxes, the rich pay accountants, the wealthy pay politicians.

Only Democrats have agency, apparently.

Sitting here in limbo waiting for the dice to roll

You are here: Home / Elections / Biden For President / Wednesday Morning Open Thread: Go Joe!

Wednesday Morning Open Thread: Go Joe!

by | 201 Comments

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And I second this, from Donna Edwards for the Washington Post — “It doesn’t matter which woman Joe Biden picks as his running mate”:

Call me crazy, but I have decided to not be invested in former vice president Joe Biden’s selection of a running mate. The stakes are simply too high to declare bright lines based on whom Biden chooses. And, while it is interesting to listen to the arguments for or against various prospects, I’m far more interested in getting Biden elected to end the reign of incompetence, cruelty and racism of the current occupant of the White House.

I would rather focus on strengthening Biden’s governing agenda — health care, reforming the criminal justice system, economic inclusion, the climate crisis. I trust that Biden will choose someone to advise him on a governing agenda that returns competency and accountability to government, and enables the United States to reclaim its seat at the international table. I am confident he will choose someone who is prepared to be president yesterday…

Each of the prospects who have been identified publicly has strengths and weaknesses — wrong geography, problematic record, untested, unknown — including things we do not know that will be revealed only in a thorough background inquiry. Like any good executive, I would expect Biden’s choice to bolster his weak spots and complement his strengths. Remember when the rap on Barack Obama was that he did not have sufficient experience in foreign policy and was not deeply connected in Washington? Well, he chose Biden as his running mate to counter those weaknesses. I expect Biden will do the same — someone younger and ready on day one to be president; someone to rally the masses; someone who’s prepared to step onto the world stage; someone to allay concerns of a skeptical left; someone to whom he could turn as a peer…

Reader Interactions

201Comments

  4. 4.

    Baud

    Geopolitical  smash and grab.

    Israel might start annexing territory claimed by the Palestinians. Taiwan is pushing for a historic free trade agreement. North Korea is desperate for sanctions relief. And Poland is itching to seal the deal on a “Fort Trump” to bolster its defenses against Russia with thousands more U.S. troops.

    As his poll numbers sink, governments that have allied themselves with Donald Trump’s presidency are racing to clinch favorable deals they see as unlikely under a President Joe Biden.

     

  6. 6.

    Baud

    Progressives had a good night in NYC, and the GOP is looking to out-young AOC.

    Top takeaways from Tuesday’s primaries: The left, the right, the wait

     

    The left is on the rise in New York City, and a Donald Trump-endorsed House candidate suffered a rare primary loss.

  7. 7.

    Baud

    I wonder if there should be a moratorium on statue toppling, which seems to have become a distraction from the main BLM message.

  10. 10.

    PST

    @Baud: 538 shows a 14.6 percent gap for Trump’s approval. It’s been a long time since he was so far down by that measure.

  12. 12.

    Baud

    @Immanentize:

    He’s leading!

    Seriously, I fear that the action is moving from sincere activists to kids that just want to break shit.  And it’s definitely occupying the media’s attention more than police brutality.

  13. 13.

    HinTN

    @Baud: While that presents as sensible and rational it also presents as paternalistic and the same old “there there, wait your turn” response received a thousand times before.

  15. 15.

    Steeplejack (phone)

    Today’s light reading (from Father’s Day).

    Today, I ask you for the most Dad things you’ve done in the last year. (You need not be a dad or have kids.) I’ll go first:

    1. For my birthday, I only asked for a pressure washer.

    2. At the store, I said, out loud to myself, that there are “too many dang potato chip flavors.”

    — Ryan Nanni (@celebrityhottub)
    June 21, 2020

  17. 17.

    Immanentize

    @Baud: The loss of focus is that of the media, not of the sincere activists trying to get to real change in their communities.

    Also, sadly, the police somewhere will do something outrageous and horrific soon enough to refocus even the wandering eye of the media.

    Also, those statues really got to go.

  19. 19.

    PST

    @HinTN:

    While that presents as sensible and rational it also presents as paternalistic and the same old “there there, wait your turn” response received a thousand times before.

    I don’t know about that. In Madison last night the statue of an abolitionist Union officer who died in battle was torn down. It’s getting random.

  22. 22.

    Baud

     In addition to the abridged and tweaked schedule, other potential changes, along with expanded rosters, is that the National League is expected to join the American League in allowing a designated hitter in the regular season, upending a decades-long discrepancy in the leagues’ rules and a significant strategic shift in how the game is played in the National League. Another intriguing or jarring change, again depending on your world view, is how extra innings will be played: Each team will start with an automatic runner on second base to start each extra inning. 

  24. 24.

    debbie

    @Immanentize:

    Confederate generals, certainly. But Grant was who defeated them. That’s not the media; that’s forgetting what the fight is about.

  28. 28.

    SFAW

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    I didn’t even notice my birthday and neither did anyone else.

    It’s not that they didn’t notice, it’s that they couldn’t (easily) count that high.

    Happy Birthday, youngster! (Whenever it was)

  32. 32.

    NotMax

    Watching Frost/Nixon on Netflix. Hadn’t seen it before. Solid production, jibes fairly closely with memories of the time. Frank Langella’s portrayal of Tricky Dick is masterful.

  36. 36.

    debbie

    Did anyone watch American Experience’s program on Toni Morrison? What a treasure!

  40. 40.

    Baud

    According to Kristen Weller this morning, the presidential race is “competitive” because the Dems are competitive in Arizona.

  42. 42.

    Immanentize

    @debbie: Personally, I think that Pelosi removing the portrait of the former speaker from the 1880s who only fought for the Confederacy as a teenager was probably an overreaction. Soldiers are not so easily blamed for the sins of their leaders, I think. But, so what if I think that? Is Pelosi ruining everything by not accepting my distinctions?

    I read a great tweet by Ida Bae saying that enthusiasms and even excesses at times like this are likely to happen. 

    Why do people obsess about the mistakes?  It really seems that focussing on misjudgments of people in the streets is just a way of separating oneself from the harder justice issues. It’s like the long history of saying, I’m all for:
    — Ending police violence but do they have to throw water bottles?
    — Removing racist statues but Grant only owned slaves for a short time
    — Equality, but do they have to provoke the police by crossing that bridge?
    — Women’s rights, but do they have to be so strident about it?

    Message to all people fighting for justice —
    Do it right! 
    Don’t make a mistake! 
    Go slow! (Mississippi Goddam)
    I am watching you!

  45. 45.

    Baud

    @Immanentize:

    We’ve seen movements get side tracked in the past, either due to internal or external forces.  We don’t want to see it happen again.  We want trouble spots to be nipped in the bud.  No one is above comment and criticism.

  46. 46.

    Immanentize

    @Baud: Grant didn’t have to go, but some people know he owned slaves and that pissed them off enough to pull down his statue.  I don’t agree with those who did that — they probably didn’t know history as well as we educated white folks.  But I really don’t care that much either. Why do you?

    We would do this so much better if we were in charge of the protests. Amirite?

  50. 50.

    Baud

    Poll: Black Americans outraged by George Floyd’s death, but optimistic about change after nationwide protests

  51. 51.

    Geminid

    Game on in the Virginia 5th Congressional district! U.Va. Medical Center doctor Cameron Webb easily defeated three other good candidates for the Democratic nomination. He’ll face bible thumping Bob Good in November, assuming the state board of elections excuses Good’s late paperwork. Good knocked out incumbent Rep. Denver Riggleman in a “drive through” convention held in a mega-church parking lot, and Riggleman is crying fraud and refuses to endorse Good.              Like 2018 Democratic winners Sharice Davids (KS) and Colin Allred (TX), Webb was an Obama White House Fellow.

  53. 53.

    Baud

    Democrats have opened up a 302,000-voter advantage over Republicans in vote-by-mail enrollment, an edge that could pay big dividends in President Donald Trump’s newly adopted must-win state.

     

    Five months before Election Day, more than 1.46 million Democrats have signed up to vote by mail compared to 1.16 million Republicans, according to state Division of Election data released Friday. By comparison, in 2016, Democrats held an advantage of about 8,800 in vote-by-mail enrollment.

  54. 54.

    Jeffro

    The Ds might do themselves some good on the statue issue by expressing concerns that

    1) Someone could get hurt when these things get yanked down

    2) “While we understand the history of most of these monuments and agree that monuments to the Confederacy should eventually come down, some of our history is a mixed bag – ie Jefferson, Washington – and there really ought to be a community process for potential removals”

    3) Remind protestors publicly that we share their goals but don’t want to give the wingers any extra ammo

    Just spitballin’

  57. 57.

    Sloane Ranger

    @Baud: I understand that his treatment of Native Americans was bad. One Native American writer justified his statue’s removal on that basis alone.

    Don’t know enough about his specific actions to comment.

  59. 59.

    WereBear

    @Sloane Ranger: We have such a checkered history they might ALL have to go.

    But why not be pro-active? Where are the Sojourner Truth and Harriet Tubman statues? While nothing is instant, I think swapping stuff out is more positive than just tearing down.

  60. 60.

    Jeffro

    @Jeffro: then again, we have to keep in mind that when there is no ammo for the wingers, they will invent their own:

    Tucker Carlson: here’s the REAL reason mobs are tearing down statues…

    That’s right, they want to enslave YOU, Real America

    Teddy Roosevelt was a hero to millions of Americans. He still is. That’s precisely why they are tearing down his statue. They know that if they can force you to watch as they topple your heroes, they have won. There’s nothing they can’t do next. They can decide how you raise your children, how you vote, what you’re allowed to believe. Once they’ve humiliated you, they can control you and that’s why across the country, mobs are tearing down America’s monuments.

    This is an ideological movement. The ideas that fuel it have incubated for decades on college campuses. We paid for all of it, by the way. The rest of us were so thrilled that our kids got into Duke that we decided to ignore what Duke was actually teaching them and are continuing to send big checks. That was a mistake. It was one of the greatest mistakes we’ve ever made…We still imagine we can fix it by regulating chokeholds or spending more on de-escalation training. We are too literal. We’re too good-hearted to understand what’s really happening. Our decency is the mob’s main weapon against us. We have no idea who we’re up against.

    Sheer insanity.

  62. 62.

    Immanentize

    @Baud: @Baud:

    No one is above comment and criticism.

    Including you. You can critique protesters’ individual acts carefully curated from thousands of positive acts. And I can criticize such critiques as being classic — even predictable and historic — anti-protest nit-picking which is used, if not designed, to denigrate all the protests by associating the whole movement with a disagreeable act by a few.

  64. 64.

    Immanentize

    @Comrade Scrutinizer: I’m not tracking.  Are you saying that Grant was pulled down by government stooges?  Or are you saying what I am suggesting — that the government and media are amplifying the Grant topple as a way to divide actual in-the-street protesters from their less engaged allies?

  65. 65.

    Baud

    @Immanentize:

    I’m not above criticism. I just ask that you not offer lame criticisms like the one you just did. I did the exact opposite of associating or denigrating the movement with these few disagreeable acts. My worry is that the movement’s message gets sidetracked by these few disagreeable acts, especially if the number of disagreeable acts multiply because no one says anything about them.

  68. 68.

    Zzyzx

    I’d much rather have people who just want to smash stuff be destroying statues that few people care about than going back to looting. It’s an easier defense to talk up most of the horrors inflicted by the honoree than to get all abstract about how the systemic nature of capitalistic racism means that it’s fine for these white Black Bloc members to smash up that Old Navy so other white peoples can grab clothes.

  70. 70.

    Gin & Tonic

    @Baud:

    We’ve seen movements get side tracked in the past, either due to internal or external forces.

    Are we going to re-litigate the People’s Front of Judea *again*?

  75. 75.

    Immanentize

    @Jeffro:

    Teddy Roosevelt was a hero to millions of Americans. He still is.

    Reminds me of these Chuck D lyrics:

    Elvis was a hero to most but he
    Elvis was a hero to most
    Elvis was a hero to most
    But he never meant shit to me you see
    Straight up racist that sucker was
    Simple and plain
    Mother fuck him and John Wayne

  77. 77.

    Mousebumples

    Saw this last night on Twitter, so I thought I’d share. I miss having a President with goodness and humanity in the White House.

    twitter.com/StanleyKrute/status/1275429939597021184?s=19 (unrolled below)

    We need @JoeBiden. We need a mensch.

    From Rabbi Michael Beals of Delaware :

    “The story I’m about to share with you about Joe Biden is special — in fact, I’m fairly certain I’m the only living person left who actually witnessed it firsthand.

    It was about 16 years ago, and I was a young rabbi, brand-new to Delaware, on my way to lead a shiva minyan — a worship service following a death of a Jewish person. I was from California. Back then, I didn’t know Claymont, Delaware from Scranton, Pennsylvania.

    Quick bit of background: When someone passes away in the Jewish faith, we observe seven days of mourning, called shiva. We gather a group of ten Jewish adults together to say the Mourners’ Kaddish. It usually happens in a person’s home — somewhere intimate.

    In this case, the deceased individual — her name was Mrs. Greenhouse, of blessed memory — had not been a person of means. She had lived in rent-controlled senior housing in a tall high-rise building off of Namaans Road.

    Her apartment was too small to fit everyone into, so we conducted our worship service in the building’s communal laundry room, in the basement of the high-rise.

    We assembled the 10 elders together, and it was in this most humble of places that I began to lead kaddish.

    Toward the end of the service, a door at the back of the laundry room opened; who walks in but Sen. Joe Biden, head lowered, all by himself.

    I nearly dropped my prayer book in shock.

    Senator Biden stood quietly in the back of the room for the duration of the service.

    At the close of the kaddish, I walked over to him and asked the same question that must have been on everyone else’s mind: “Sen. Biden — what are you doing here?”

    He said to me: “Back in 1972, when I first ran for Senate, Mrs. Greenhouse gave $18 to my first campaign.

    Because that’s what she could afford. And every six years, when I’d run for reelection, she’d give another $18. She did it her whole life. I’m here to show my respect and gratitude.”

    Now, the number 18 is significant in the Jewish faith — its numbers spell out the Hebrew word chai, as in “to life, to life, l’chayim!” But it’s also a humble amount. Joe Biden knew that. And he respected that.

    There were no news outlets at our service that day — no Jewish reporters or important dignitaries. Just a few elderly mourners in a basement laundry room.

    Joe Biden didn’t come to that service for political gain. He came to that service because he has character.

    He came to that service because he’s a mensch.

    And if we need anything right now when it comes to the leadership of our country — we need a mensch.

    I know this is such a simple, small story. But I tell it to as many people as will listen to me.

    Because I think that, in their heart of hearts, when people are trying to think about the decision they’ll make this year — this is the kind of story that matters.

    Joe Biden is a mensch. We need a mensch.”

    Thank you, Rabbi Beals. You’re a bit of a mensch yourself.

  78. 78.

    Zzyzx

    @Baud: just because I live in Seattle where they always get hijacked, I see that as just one of the stages that show that the protest has probably reached the point where it’s getting too insular and recursive. But that’s just a phase too.

  85. 85.

    OzarkHillbilly

    via the Seattle Times:

    Also exempt from the governor’s order: people who cannot wear a mask for medical reasons, or who are deaf or hard of hearing, specifically when they are communicating with another person.

    Speaking as someone blessed* with considerable hearing loss, I am wondering how removing my mask will help me hear better.

    *I say blessed because not being able hear other people speak makes it easier to ignore them.

  89. 89.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @Steeplejack: Nah, over engineering would be something like using a solid 10×14 beam when a couple 2x6s nailed together would do the job. I never do more or use more than needed to accomplish the task at hand. I’m cheap and lazy.

  90. 90.

    narya

    Kitchen update: The contractor and the electrician (who’s also the contractor’s son) showed up yesterday to discuss the electric; the electrician didn’t see anything that caused alarm, and I may have him add/map circuits around the rest of the place as well if that isn’t a huge extra amount of effort/cost. We all agreed that we got lucky on the floor and it’s in great shape–doesn’t even have a lot of nail holes or anything. And I can finally get rid of the old alarm system box in the closet, I bet. So, nothing was actually “done,” in that nothing changed, but progress occurred. I think the electric may possibly even occur this week, but we’ll see. They have many years of practice weaving together enough jobs to keep everyone working without stacking up so much that delays occur.

  91. 91.

    narya

    @Mousebumples: This is lovely; thank you. I’ve had my issues with Biden (esp. the Thomas hearing), and still would have preferred someone else, but his decency really makes up for a lot.

  93. 93.

    The Thin Black Duke

    If people are going to invalidate the amazing things the BLM movement has done because a few of the “wrong” statues are coming down, those people are unreliable as allies anyway.

  94. 94.

    Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes

    Mitch has been bitching about things like the Grant, Washington and Jackson statues, but had he and his troglodyte caucus acted with empathy and alacrity, things wouldn’t have escalated to this point.

    Sadly, they did.

    Also, perhaps Rome should stop lionizing and canonizing colonizing clerics. Want to do nice things that recognize Latino culture? Canonize people who selflessly contributed without cruelty.

  95. 95.

    Chief Oshkosh

    @Baud: Agreed, but raw action is the price you pay to move an entire society in a new direction. I don’t think anyone has ever solved this problem.

  96. 96.

    Immanentize

    In Boston, we have a very complicated statue problem.  It’s a statue of Abraham Lincoln.  The great emancipator!  It is the emancipation statue in Lincoln Park which is a copy of one in DC.
    The original was gifted to the US through money collected from former slaves.

    But, it shows Lincoln standing over a kneeling black man still with shackles.. Or is the former slaves at Lincoln’s feet just beginning to stand up? Many people don’t like it and want it gone. It shares the same problematic quality as the TR statue in New York.

  97. 97.

    Mousebumples

    @rikyrah:

    @JPL:

    Happy to share. I’m not Jewish (lapsed Catholic), but it just made my heart feel full. ?

    I see enough stuff in the comments here that I wouldn’t see otherwise, so glad to help pay it forward a bit.

  98. 98.

    Geminid

    @Raven: I doubt if Grant would get too strung out over a dozen or so people in San Francisco pulling his statue down, either. Although he might be a little wistful; in his memoirs, he said that but for his promotion as the Union’s sole Lieutenant General he might have had a nice post war career in California, maybe as president of a railroad. He was stationed on the west coast after the war with Mexico, and really liked it out there.

  99. 99.

    Chief Oshkosh

    @HinTN: I guess it IS “paternalistic” to tell people to not randomly break shit. It’s a target rich environment. If shit must be broken, try to avoid the actual good stuff.

  100. 100.

    Baud

    Pro-Biden super PAC launches positive ads amid fundraising dip

    ……

    Positive ads aren’t a common messaging theme for super PACs, which are often charged with savaging the opposition. But Unite the Country is working to carve out a distinct lane for itself among a handful of pro-Biden outside groups because “it doesn’t make sense for everyone to everything,” said Lily Adams, a senior adviser to the group. The positive ads come after two disappointing fundraising months that started when Biden’s campaign signaled that another super PAC, Priorities USA, would be its preferred big-money vehicle.

  102. 102.

    Steeplejack

    I am getting a haircut at 11:00 after 13 weeks and five days. I am unreasonably excited about this.

  106. 106.

    Gin & Tonic

    @narya: I took advantage of a kitchen remodel about 8-9 years ago to add a couple of circuits and a bunch of outlets. Actually, current code requires an outlet every 6 feet, I think. Anyway, makes kitchen life more convenient.

  109. 109.

    NotMax

    @narya

    When it comes to kitchen electrics, there is no such thing as too many outlets. And not just at counter height. If not already there, and the space is available, having one or two strategically placed at baseboard level can be amazingly handy.

  112. 112.

    NotMax

    @Gin & Tonic

    Last time I had a haircut was 1989. We’ve since reached a state of detente. I don’t bother it and it doesn’t bother me.

    ;)

  113. 113.

    Sloane Ranger

    @WereBear: Don’t disagree. The same goes here in the UK. The problem is that people are just so complicated and can’t be reduced to goodies and baddies. Even the slave trader whose statue came down in Bristol, can’t even remember his name now, used his I’ll gotten gains to help the poor and needy. That was why his statue was put up in the first place, not because he was a slave trader.

    I think the issue in the US with Confederate traitors is fairly clear cut and I would be happy to see statues of anyone who made money directly from slave trading and slave owning come down but after that? We really need to look at each person individually, consult widely and then make a decision, accepting that not everyone will be happy with that decision.

    Personally, I’d be happy to see Maggie Thatcher and Oliver Cromwell come down but whatever.

  114. 114.

    Baud

    @Sloane Ranger:

    We really need to look at each person individually

    Also, each statue. Like the ones of Teddy and Lincoln mentioned in this thread. Even if those people are acceptable generally, the particular statues at issue may not be.

    ETA:  Also too, I wish there were more statues of Reagan to tear down.

  115. 115.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @Jack Canuck: But they aren’t reading their own lips. Either the article is really badly worded or the regulation is. That was my point.

  117. 117.

    SFAW

    @Jack Canuck:

    Just a guess, but my assumption was that’s in relation to people who use lip-reading to help with communication.

    Except if you are the one who’s deaf, you’re the one (possibly) reading other persons’ lips, not vice versa.

  118. 118.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @Baud: I’ll settle for tearing his name off an airport, an aircraft carrier, probably hundreds of streets and parks, buildings, etc etc.

  119. 119.

    NotMax

    Guess it couldn’t hurt to repeat this from late night yesterday in case anyone is looking for something innoxious with which to pass some time.

    Felt like vegging out with something preposterous and heavily tinged with humor this afternoon while puttering around the cottage. Little Evil on Netflix filled the bill. Grabs silly firmly by the arm and runs with it through the darkness.

  121. 121.

    SFAW

    Re: statues: apparently there’s a new Rethug talking point that the always-temperate “Democrat activist” Shaun King has said statues of Jesus should be torn down. Or just the ones depicting him looking like a white European. Or something.

  123. 123.

    Dorothy A. Winsor

    I’m a little more on edge than usual because THE WYSMAN comes out on Saturday. Amazon is screwing around with whether they have the paperback or not, but at least they’re selling through third party vendors. Sometimes it seems like every single step is harder than it needs to be

    I remind you that until Saturday, you can get the ebook of WIND READER, the first book in the series, for .99 on Amazon.

    In the meantime, here’s the trailer for THE WYSMAN.

    Now I have to clear out of my unit so someone can come in and work on it. We’re going to drive to a different park and walk. Maybe I’ll burn off some anxiety.

  125. 125.

    O. Felix Culpa

    We’re having a struggle over statues in New Mexico, some of which celebrate particularly bloody conquistadors. That movement has tapped into and resurfaced age old divisions and resentments between Native Americans, the descendants of the Hispanic colonizers, and more recently arrived Anglos (whites). As this morning’s discussion suggests, the removal of some statues seems pretty clear cut; in the case of other statues it’s (potentially) more complicated.

    But in the larger picture, I find it concerning when people get more worked up over broken statuary than over centuries of broken people. I get that the optics of tearing down statues might deflect the message for some, but as the Thin Black Duke says, those folks were unreliable allies anyway. Remember that the oppressor never gives up power voluntarily and the message to those who mobilize for justice is always some variant of “you’re doing it wrong.” My hope is that this resurgent movement for racial justice in our country has real staying and changing power, regardless of a few optical “excesses.”

  126. 126.

    EmbraceYourInnerCrone

    @rikyrah: I  honestly can not understand what the hell the restaurant manager was thinking…how are people this racist AND stupid in 2020??

  127. 127.

    SFAW

    @Dorothy A. Winsor:

    Reagan did a lot of damage. I loathe the man.

    I sometimes have an (internal) “theological” debate re: whether Nixon or Reagan is more responsible for the current Rethuglican Partei. I think the correct answer is “Yes.”

    Although Newtie is also in contention.

  129. 129.

    The Thin Black Duke

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: Trump would not have been possible if not for Reagan. Sometimes even a few of his critics underestimate what a catastrophe that monster was to this country.

  132. 132.

    hueyplong

    Emotional line-drawing on statue removal could be perceived as a godsend by FoxNews.

    Once they’re leading with it every day, we’ll know that our work on statue removal is done and it’s back to the things that got us to 51-38 or 50-41 or wherever we are right now.

    Like people dying due to a pandemic and police riots, and criminals getting off because they’re part of the Trump/Barr RICO ring.  Not hayseeds making their last stand because BLM/ACORN/NewBlackPanthers/soshulists are coming for the Jesus statues I’ve never seen.

  134. 134.

    Barbara

    @SFAW:  I’m pretty sure King isn’t calling for the removal of any statues on private property, but fwiw, I think statues of Jesus have no place on public property and should be removed.

  136. 136.

    artem1s

    @Baud:

    Each team will start with an automatic runner on second base to start each extra inning. 

    WTF, the continued attempt to turn baseball into football goes on. The beauty of baseball is being ruined by the ADHD gambling addicted fantasy league idiots who can’t abide the slow unwind of a well pitched game that leaves control of the ball in the defense’ hands.

    Start your own damn Extreme Baseball league if you want.  Let the players use metal bats. Add an offensive tackle to the center field who gets to bum rush the pitcher between pitches and block the fielders when a fly ball comes their way.  Award 3 points to any player who reaches third base and 7 for a home run (BTW, there is a LOT scores in baseball are much higher than football if you score the games the same way).  Allow the infielders to tackle base runners – make injuries your game plan to keep the opposition from winning the game.

    Leave our game alone FFS.

  137. 137.

    Immanentize

    @O. Felix Culpa: I’ve been trying to follow the New Mexico statue debates.  It is complicated — especially as two groups generally perceived as oppressed battle over their historic imagery.  But, the fact that someone cut off the foot of the statue of Onate gives me no end of pleasure.  It even, as Marie Kondo would say, sparks joy.

  138. 138.

    SFAW

    @Barbara:

    Disclaimer: I haven’t delved enough into it to know what’s what, but I thought I read about King talking about the whole white-Jesus thing. If that’s what he was actually saying, then I think he needs a clue-injection. Re: Jesus on public property: I agree with you.

  139. 139.

    WereBear

    @Geminid: the Union’s sole Lieutenant General he might have had a nice post war career in California

     
    The number of fine Presidents who were also failed businesspeople (Harry S Truman comes to mind) means we should SUPERRETHINK that whole model.

  140. 140.

    Heidi Mom

    @rikyrah: I humbly offer two more reasons:  1)  Before the war, while Grant’s fortunes were at a low ebb, his father-in-law, a Missouri slave owner who fancied himself an old-school Southern gentleman, gave a slave to Grant’s wife, Julia.  It  may be technically correct to say that Grant then owned the slave, given marital property laws at the time.  When Julia’s father died, Grant immediately freed the man, then hired him as a farm hand at a decent wage.  2)  As President, Grant tried hard to “win” Reconstruction, sending in federal troops when the rights (and lives) of freed slaves were threatened.

  141. 141.

    Jinchi

    @OzarkHillbilly: But they aren’t reading their own lips.

    They also communicate by expression themselves. Think putting mittens on someone who relies on sign language. It doesn’t matter if the other person is deaf.

  143. 143.

    Eunicecycle

    @Jinchi: I saw an interpreter today with a mask that had a clear covering over her lips! At first I thought WTF? then went Ohhhhh.

  144. 144.

    Marcopolo

    @Baud:   This 1000%.  I read this yesterday and it really does crystalize/explain a lot of what has happened with the left over the last century or so.

    The best way to make sense of Rorty’s argument is to follow it chronologically. He sees the American left as split into two camps: the reformist left and the cultural left. The reformist left dominates from 1900 until it is supplanted by the cultural left in the mid-1960s. The division has more to do with tactics than it does principles, but those tactical differences, for Rorty at least, carried enormous consequences…

    Before the 1960s, the American left was largely reformist in its orientation to politics. Think of the people who engineered the New Deal or the Ivy-educated technocrats that joined Kennedy in the White House. John Kenneth Galbraith, the liberal economist and public official who served in the administrations of FDR, Truman, Kennedy, and Johnson, is a favorite of Rorty’s. These were the liberals who weren’t socialist radicals but nevertheless worked to promote the same causes within and through the system. They were liberal reformers, not revolutionary leftists, and they got things done…

    The focus of leftist politics changed in the 1960s. For Rorty, the left ceased to be political and instead became a cultural movement. The prevailing view was that it was no longer possible to promote equality and social justice within the system.

    It’s a long, thought-provoking read.

  145. 145.

    CarolDuhart2

    I’m not too worried about the statues.  Statues can be replaced, after all, and since nobody seems to make aesthetic judgments about them, I assume none of them have much artistic value, which is harder to replace.  Yes, it can be overkill, but when things quiet down a bit, there can be new ones for the good folks whose statues have been torn down-maybe even better ones.

    For the rest, maybe they can be replaced by trees and shrubs.  No more checkered history or disreputable honorees, and everyone likes trees.  And they are more beautiful, unlike so many of the statues they replaced

  146. 146.

    Betty Cracker

    @NotMax: We watched Frost/Nixon on Netflix this weekend and thought it was pretty good.

    @Jeffro: It might make sense for individual elected Democrats to respond that way when asked about specific incidents. But IMO, the party should be very careful about doing/saying anything that could be interpreted as co-opting the protests or assuming the protesters are on “our side.” AFAIK, they have been thus far, and that’s wise.

  147. 147.

    hueyplong

    @Heidi Mom: With Andrew Johnson before him and the Compromise of 1877 after him, Grant can fairly be called the only president who took a stab at winning Reconstruction.

  148. 148.

    Mousebumples

    @narya:

    This is lovely; thank you. I’ve had my issues with Biden (esp. the Thomas hearing), and still would have preferred someone else, but his decency really makes up for a lot.

    I understand the concerns. (though I had read something in the last week or two – don’t have a link handy – that indicated Biden realized afterwards that he needed female voices in the room and worked to get newly elected Carol Mosesly Braun and Feinstein (I think?) onto the next term’s Judiciary Committee for that reason)

    I intentionally didn’t pick out a favorite (Wisconsin primary is late anyway) so it may be easier for me to support him without reservations.

  149. 149.

    narya

    @NotMax: @Gin & Tonic:

    Current code requires more outlets than the previous kitchen incarnation had, so I have to get more, by default. No real baseboard showing, though that’s an excellent suggestion; it’s a small kitchen, and the only place I can think to add one would be next to the stove (which is just far enough away from the door so the door can swing in). There are a couple of tweaks that i’m excited to incorporate: (1) a pull-out with the trash & recycling bins, so they will no longer take up floor space or prevent the door from opening all the way; (2) not replacing the cabinets next to the window, which will (a) let in more light and (b) enable me to put up shelves with hooks on the bottom, to hang some pans that I use a lot; and (3) under-cabinet lighting, so I can see what I’m doing. I believe that these will make a disproportionate amount of difference in terms of functionality, as will additional sockets and overall better wiring

  152. 152.

    artem1s

    @The Thin Black Duke:

    If people are going to invalidate the amazing things the BLM movement has done because a few of the “wrong” statues are coming down, those people are unreliable as allies anyway.

    I’m a lot more troubled by the (white) folks that are thinking they get to choose when to validate a legitimate movement by turning it into a (violent) ‘revolution’.  I’ve been nothing but impressed by BLM leaders and the majority of the protesters.  Their efforts to ID those who are instigating violence needs to continue.  I hope they continue to out those who are only interested in mayhem if only to demonstrate to elected officials that they are working towards real, lasting change.  Tearing down statues is all fine and good but in the end is only symbolic if there is no change connected to the removal.  Those who worshiped those statues and used them to intimidate won’t stop just because Mars Lee isn’t standing up there tacitly approving of them.  BLM knows and understands this, but I’m not sure those hopped up on their ‘revolution’ adrenaline do.

  153. 153.

    Immanentize

    @Heidi Mom: And/or:

    In 1848 Grant married into the slaveholding family of Julia Dent. Her father, Frederick Dent, owned 30 enslaved people and had “given” Julia four enslaved people when she was a child: Eliza, Dan, Julia, and John. There is no evidence he legally transferred ownership to Julia but from her writings it is clear she considered them hers.

    In 1854 Grant left the military and tried to make a go of it as a farmer on land adjacent to his father-in-law’s in St. Louis, Missouri. He worked alongside Frederick Dent’s enslaved laborers to build a house for his family that they dubbed “Hardscrabble.”

    Finding farming less lucrative than he’d hoped, Grant asked his father for a loan. Jesse Grant reportedly replied, “Ulysses, when you are ready to come North I will give you a start, but so long as you make your home among a tribe of slave-owners I will do nothing.”

    After the death of Julia’s mother, the Grant family left “Hardscrabble” and moved to her father’s farm, “White Haven,” which Grant managed from 1854-1859.

    Outright “ownership” and “profiting from the labor” of slaves is different, but….

    I am a big Grant fan. But I like my history straight.

    PS. By Grant’s own letter of manumission of his slave, William Jones, in 1859, Grant says he bought him from his father in law.

  154. 154.

    O. Felix Culpa

    @Immanentize: Hehe. Same here.

    That said, feelings are running high right now and it’s perilous (and perhaps presumptuous) for an Anglo to weigh in on the debates. I think it’s important for the more directly involved parties to have their say and be heard. Then continue bending the arc towards justice.

  156. 156.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @narya: No real baseboard showing,

    I think they meant backsplash, with is the vertical part at the back of the countertop.

  157. 157.

    Eunicecycle

    @narya: we did a kitchen remodel where my favorite thing was under cabinet lighting. It really helps aging eyes, so you’ll be glad in the future!

  158. 158.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Immanentize: I am not the one who said that the statues had to go.  My guess is that the people involved were not closely aligned with BLM and were more in tune with Black Bloc.  Those particular statues did not have any association with oppression (except, I guess) with Heig who was associated with oppression in that he was an anti-slavery activist who became a Union officer and was killed at Chickamauga).  But, again, I am not the one who said that they had to go.  Since you did, I was asking you to explain.

  160. 160.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @narya: And if you are looking for recommendations I will pass along my wife’s whole hearted gushing approval of the pull out shelves I put in our base cabinets. It gets a little embarrassing every time she brings it up to folks but It is nice not having to get down on one’s knees to dig around in the back of the cabinet.

  161. 161.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @Steeplejack: Well, it’s illegal to have an outlet at baseboard height. Last I knew minimum ht was 14″ above the floor. I do know all the outlets at the countertop have to be GFI’d.

    ETA Correction: It is illegal to install an outlet at baseboard ht yadda yadda yadda. It’s OK if they are grandfathered. Which if I recall correctly any kitchen rehab would end any grandfathering.

    Of course, this all assumes that Narya lives in a place that enforces code, which I don’t live in one, and can lead to all kinds of unpleasant discoveries, like the lack of properly vented plumbing, or a septic tank that dumps directly on the ground.

  162. 162.

    NotMax

    @Steeplejack

    Yup, in addition (as I said). There are times (for example, while vacuuming, or using/charging a laptop on a kitchen table) when having a cord snaking across the counter and stretched out hanging in midair can be a detriment.

  163. 163.

    opiejeanne

    @OzarkHillbilly: I said the same thing when I read that deaf or hard of hearing are exempt from wearing a mask. That article about the exceptions to masking in Washington State doesn’t specify just what those medical conditions are that would be excepted.

  165. 165.

    NotMax

    @OzarkHillbilly

    Didn’t mean inset in the baseboard, rather the bottom of the outlet plate just about flush with the top of the baseboard. Commonly see that here, anyway, even in new construction.

  168. 168.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @NotMax: The national code, which is what most jurisdictions follow, said 14″. Some locations change parts of the code to suit their local…. Tastes?  But most just go with the whole book as it’s easier. I always assumed it was a matter of mopping, but it could be a floodwater thing as in a sewer backing up. I am certainly not fully cognizant of all the electrical codes, knowing just enough to get myself in more trouble than I can get out of.

  169. 169.

    Gin & Tonic

    @OzarkHillbilly: Every time I’ve had work done by a contractor, one of the first questions is “do you want me to pull a permit?” Like it’s optional. Which, maybe it is in my town.

    I always say “yes.” Because if the stove explodes or the walls catch fire, the insurance company will likely be interested in that sort of thing.

  171. 171.

    Barbara

    @CarolDuhart2: Virtually none of these statues has artistic merit.  Many were stamped out by the same factories, with the same molds of horse and rider, with the  head customized to represent the image of whoever it was that was supposed to be depicted.  Not all, of course, but I assume that only a very small percentage of these statues will find permanent display anywhere else after they have been taken down.  They are not necessary to tell the story of the Civil War, although in some cases they might help to tell the story of its aftermath, which is really what their placement was about — the rise of Jim Crow white supremacy in the South.

  172. 172.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @Gin & Tonic: It’s either required by law or it’s not. I tell people that not getting a permit is granting permission for substandard construction. The permit doesn’t *usually* cost that much and yes, insurance companies and banks want everything up to code. In addition to the safety factor is the resale value. Houses 2 miles away from me in Franklin Co always sell for more than they do here in Washington Co, simply because people can be more sure that they were built right.

    ** cost of permit varies by location. I couldn’t believe how much they cost in some areas of California.

  173. 173.

    WaterGirl

    @rikyrah: I started crying at the part where the 9-year-old describes the cop who recognized him (i think it was a cop) and then the newscaster was so sweet saying the kid was welcome to dinner at his house any time.  Then the mom says they will definitely take him up on that offer, and at the end the newscaster reiterates that the dinner invite is for real.  Good people, all around.

  176. 176.

    SFAW

    According to TPM, the Court of Appeals has ordered Judge Sullivan to dismiss the Flynn case

    ETA: I tried reading the decision, but then remembered that I’m not an attorney, and punted.

  177. 177.

    narya

    I did not have him pull permits (because Chicago can take a loooooooong time for that), because they’re not moving plumbing or gas, and everyone is licensed and he’s insured and comes with great recommendations from someone I know/trust. I live in an old (>100 years) condo building, but it has been very well managed over time, and some current owners have been here >25 years. I have found that the previous owners of my unit were pretty good–they didn’t paint the (amazing!!) woodwork, they didn’t pull out the built-ins, picture rails, etc., and they didn’t walk out with the dining room door that has a gorgeous stained glass window. I will have outlets in the backsplash, but I could also add one to the wall next to the stove (technically above the baseboard, as folks noted).

  178. 178.

    Geminid

    @WereBear: Grant was a good administrator and knew how to delegate responsibility to the right people. He also got a good basic civil engineering education at West Point. He probably would have done fine out on the west coast.

  181. 181.

    WaterGirl

    @rikyrah: The worst part was watching that little nazi pretending to be on the mom’s side – oh, do you live close so you can take your little boy home to change so he’ll meet our dress code – knowing the whole time that there was no problem at all, just so he could humiliate the woman and her son.

    Fucking nazi I hope he can’t find a job anywhere.  What a fucking pig, shown to be exactly what he is.

  182. 182.

    Jeffro

    @Geminid:

     

    @Booger:

    Me, the Mrs, and Fro-ette all voted for one of the other Ds yesterday.  This morning, we could care less that she lost: we’re all in for Webb and rooting for R injuries.

    It’s great living in a blue state; the prospect of having a blue Rep (finally) just makes my morning!

  185. 185.

    Geminid

    @Jeffro: I voted for Hufstetler myself. But one of the advantages of a primary is that we get to see who has the right stuff. It looks like Webb has it. In 2018 we came within 7 points with a candidate that I, at least, thought was mediocre, chosen by caucuses. This seat is winnable, and I don’t think 5th district Democrats have ever been this motivated.

  186. 186.

    low-tech cyclist

    As much as I respect Donna Edwards (and did my bit to help her kick Al Wynn to the curb), she’s dead wrong on this – for precisely the reason she gives: “while it is interesting to listen to the arguments for or against various prospects, I’m far more interested in getting Biden elected to end the reign of incompetence, cruelty and racism of the current occupant of the White House.”

    The essential argument concerning the various prospects is about their effect on turnout – mainly, their effect on turnout of groups that lean strongly Democratic, but aren’t reliable voters.  Getting blacks, young people, Hispanics and other minorities to the polls in higher-than-usual numbers would have reversed the outcome in 2016, and would increase the likelihood of a Biden win in November.  Rachel Bitecofer’s been talking about this for months, and she’s dead right.

  187. 187.

    Another Scott

    @Marcopolo: Thanks for the pointer.  My gut tells me that it’s more complicated than two flavors of liberalism, but my gut is often wrong.

    And simple models are necessary for understanding (see Krugman’s IS-LM graphs) even when real life is much more complex.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  191. 191.

    debbie

    @Baud:

    I cannot imagine how anyone would construe anything Abraham Lincoln did to be detrimental to racial injustice. This instance is ridiculous, frankly.

    There is no reason not to leave TR up if the Native American and African American statues can be removed. TR led the way in conservation and he deserves to be memorialized for that, esp. in front of the Museum of Natural History.

  192. 192.

    J R in WV

    @Baud:

    Another intriguing or jarring change, again depending on your world view, is how extra innings will be played: Each team will start with an automatic runner on second base to start each extra inning. 

    I saw that, some time back, but couldn’t believe it was real !!! Por Que??? what possible reason>??

    Just random poking at the rule book now? Hire a designated runner from the Olympic track team? So strange, maybe Zika on the committee?

  193. 193.

    Geminid

    @debbie: TR also stood up for African American civil servants, as did his successor, Taft. What Woodrow Wilson did to to these civil servants was just shameful.

  194. 194.

    J R in WV

    @Mousebumples:

    June 24, 2020 at 8:05 am

    Saw this last night on Twitter, so I thought I’d share. I miss having a President with goodness and humanity in the White House.

    What a fabulous story, brings tears to my eyes. I hope Joe Biden pulls it off for us. What a guy!!

     

    ETA… thanks so much for sharing this with us!!!

  195. 195.

    J R in WV

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    I am wondering how removing my mask will help me hear better.

    Some people learn lip reading… would be my guess. I Hate loopholes anyone can use to thwart a needed rule!

  196. 196.

    Richard Guhl

    Can we please call a halt to the whining about Democrats getting smug or complacent about the election. I, for one, want to pull my hair out when I hear that nonsense.

    For one, none of us have any control over what other people may be thinking or even how they act. There’s really something weird about believing we can hector people into behaving the way we want. In the long run, it’s self-defeating. Ask any woman accused of nagging.

    For another, it’s insulting to all those who have ever volunteered for a campaign. I know from personal experience that those of us who worked on behalf of the Clinton campaign in the Lehigh Valley in Pennsylvania worked our tails off, making phone calls, knocking on doors, connecting with unions and student groups. We were not smug or complacent. In the end, our efforts came up short. Misogyny, Russian interference, James Comey, MSM Clinton rules and its unwillingness to take Trump seriously had far greater impact. But it wasn’t for lack of trying on our part.

    Instead of wringing our hands, just do what you can. Volunteer, throw cash at the campaign, put up a yard sign. The least productive thing we can do is go woe is us with ZOMG, the sky is falling and we’re going to blow it.

  197. 197.

    J R in WV

    @EmbraceYourInnerCrone:

    I honestly can not understand what the hell the restaurant manager was thinking…

    I don’t suppose he was thinking “How can I get fired today?” Because that’s what happened… what a dumbass! Pick on the little black kid, let the white kid wearing the same stuff walk right in? Shithead racist!

    ETA: As if he was managing a deep south lunch counter in 1957!

  198. 198.

    Origuy

    ASL includes mouth movements as part of the language. If you can’t see the mouth, part of the meaning is lost.

  199. 199.

    PJ

    @Immanentize: Who are the “many people” who don’t like it?  The statue of Lincoln in DC, in Lincoln Square, was the first public statue of Lincoln in the US and was financed by donations from ex-slaves.  When I lived in the neighborhood, this was common knowledge (I think it’s on a plaque at the monument).  It seems like the people who want to tear it down do not care what it meant to the people who paid to erect it.

  201. 201.

    AxelFoley

    @Sloane Ranger:

    Even the slave trader whose statue came down in Bristol, can’t even remember his name now, used his I’ll gotten gains to help the poor and needy.

    Yeah, off the backs of black Africans. He helped poor, white people off the pain of black folks. That nullifies any good he may have done for his fellow white people.

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