Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

We need to vote them all out and restore sane Democratic government.

When I decide to be condescending, you won’t have to dream up a fantasy about it.

Baby steps, because the Republican Party is full of angry babies.

Damn right I heard that as a threat.

Republicans: “Abortion is murder but you can take a bus to get one.” Easy peasy.

You don’t get rid of your umbrella while it’s still raining.

“Perhaps I should have considered other options.” (head-desk)

How any woman could possibly vote for this smug smarmy piece of misogynistic crap is beyond understanding.

Peak wingnut was a lie.

It’s easy to sit in safety and prescribe what other people should be doing.

Dumb motherfuckers cannot understand a consequence that most 4 year olds have fully sorted out.

One of our two political parties is a cult whose leader admires Vladimir Putin.

… gradually, and then suddenly.

Let’s delete this post and never speak of this again.

75% of people clapping liked the show!

They fucked up the fucking up of the fuckup!

Tick tock motherfuckers!

You are either for trump or for democracy. Pick one.

Jack be nimble, jack be quick, hurry up and indict this prick.

Some judge needs to shut this circus down soon.

I’d like to think you all would remain faithful to me if i ever tried to have some of you killed.

Perhaps you mistook them for somebody who gives a damn.

Optimism opens the door to great things.

Let me eat cake. The rest of you could stand to lose some weight, frankly.

You are here: Home / Elections / Election 2020 / Tuesday Morning Open Thread: It *Has* Been Worse. It *Can* Get Better.

Tuesday Morning Open Thread: It *Has* Been Worse. It *Can* Get Better.

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George Takei, American treasure:


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231Comments

  2. 2.

    Baud

    No one dared stand up for us then. Politicians on both sides, from FDR in the White House to Earl Warren in Sacramento, took advantage of the fear and racism for their own political gain.

    True. With the exception of the Civil War, past atrocities were bipartisan. We shouldn’t dismiss the difference.

  3. 3.

    debbie

    We’re up against an awful lot.

    Donald knows nothing and he couldn’t care less about being informed. He shouldn’t be allowed—by anybody—to spew his ignorant, dangerous nonsense unchallenged in real time. The undermining of science, expertise, and sanity is weakening us, and it is getting people killed.#VOTE— Mary L Trump (@MaryLTrump) September 15, 2020

    I’m still trying to wrap my head around the facile dismissal of science, and I just wish someone in the media would ask Trump if he realizes he’s dismissing the same science he’s depending upon to get us to Mars.

  7. 7.

    cmorenc

    Among the most disturbing things is how many of the folks around us in our everyday lives *support* the orange Mussolini, despite the unambiguous revelations about how depraved, irresponsible, untruthful, greedy and narcissistic Trump’s fundamental character is.  And these folks seem to live in an impenetrable bubble oblivious to anything other than that Trump taps into some ugly inner rage they feel about “others” and gives them permission to express it.

  8. 8.

    Percysowner

    @debbie:

    I’m still trying to wrap my head around the facile dismissal of science, and I just wish someone in the media would ask Trump if he realizes he’s dismissing the same science he’s depending upon to get us to Mars.

    He’s a monster, who wants the world to go his way and expects it to conform to whatever he happens to want at the time. He’s a kid who never grew up, throwing a tantrum while holding on to the levers of power and surrounded by MORE kids, or adults who have decided that giving him everything he wants is to their advantage.

  10. 10.

    Kay

    The cancel culture warriors are promoting a “debate” with Joe Rogan as moderator:

    The podcast host Joe Rogan has said he will vote for Donald Trump over Joe Biden in the presidential election, should the former vice-president be the Democratic nominee  The comic was speaking on Friday’s edition of his podcast, The Joe Rogan Experience, which regularly tops the iTunes chart for downloads. Rogan has nearly 6m Twitter followers, regularly appears on television as a commentator on mixed martial arts, and is seen as an influential voice with young and blue-collar male voters.During a conversation with guest Eric Weinstein, managing director of Thiel Capital, talk turned to the election. Weinstein, who works for the Trump-supporting tech mogul Peter Thiel, said he would not vote for Trump or Biden, the probable challenger in November.Rogan, who has endorsed Bernie Sanders, said the party had made “morons” out of voters by appearing to favour Biden.“I’d rather vote for Trump than [Biden],” said Rogan. “I don’t think [Biden] can handle anything. You’re relying entirely on his cabinet. If you want to talk about an individual leader who can communicate, he can’t do that. And we don’t know what the fuck he’ll be like after a year in office.

    This is considered an unbiased, open minded moderator among our self-proclaimed public intellectuals.
    So edgy and cool! He says “fuck” when he’s on Hannity promoting his podcast!

    Joe Rogan, who apparently doesn’t know how “a primary works” proclaims that “the party” chose Biden when what happened was voters chose Biden. Why are the cancelling tens of millions of Biden voters?

  11. 11.

    Baud

    @Kay: White men are inherently unbiased. When they support Trump, it’s because they made a thoughtful considered judgment about the issues.

    Same with the primary. How can voters choose our nominee when so many of them aren’t white?

  12. 12.

    OzarkHillbilly

    In an attempt to engage in some light reading, I’ve been perusing the pages of Timothy Snyder’s Bloodlands. We can always say, “At least we aren’t Belarus in ’42-’43.”

  13. 13.

    ThresherK

    @Kay: Joe Rogan to moderate a debate?

    If Phil Hartmann were still alive, I’d rather he did it than Rogan. Okay, also rather Hartmann than Todd, Stephanopolous, or basically anyone in the last two decades.

  14. 14.

    Soprano2

    @Baud: White men are inherently unbiased. When they support Trump, it’s because they made a thoughtful considered judgment about the issues.

    Ooohhh, this is another one of my pet peeves. Literally no one ever asks white men if they’re voting for another white man just because he’s a white man!  Everyone else’s vote is questioned, are you voting for a woman just because she’s a woman, are you voting for the black candidate just because he/she’s black, and so on. Literally only white males are allowed to vote for another white male and have it assumed that their vote is given because they believe he’s the best candidate for the job. It’s a huge blind spot in the news media’s culture, this assumption once again that “white man” is the normal, default person who is always granted the benefit of the doubt over everything.

  18. 18.

    Soprano2

    @Kay: This “cancel culture” stuff is such bullshit. Every time I see someone on FB saying they aren’t going to watch the NFL or NBA anymore because the owners are “allowing” the players to put logos on their jerseys and kneel without consequence, I ask them “But doesn’t that mean you are trying to cancel the NFL/NBA? I thought cancel culture was bad!” I have not yet had one person answer me or try to defend it. They all know it’s bullshit.

  19. 19.

    Brachiator

    @Kay:

    This is considered an unbiased, open minded moderator among our self-proclaimed public intellectuals.
    So edgy and cool! He says “fuck” when he’s on Hannity promoting his podcast!

    We have a ton of public commentators. We haven’t really had public intellectuals for a while. I don’t know much about Rogan. Whenever I have read him or seen him speak, I realize that there is nothing there and quickly lose interest.

    It was good to read George Takei’s Twitter posts. A great message of hope to start the day with.

  20. 20.

    Soprano2

    @Baud: I saw that. Yet another super-spreader event where Trump is trying to kill his own voters. Who does that?

    And yeah, there are never “Whites for xxx” events, because all the events not labeled with a specific group are just assumed to be for white people. It’s a huge blind spot in our whole culture, how “white” is always assumed to be the default for everything. I’m a white person, and I’m aware of it. I can only imagine how people who aren’t white feel slapped in the face every day by it.

  21. 21.

    rikyrah

    Of course it can get worse. It has been worse. I have written that I looked at the time with Dolt45, through the lens of what my ancestors went through as they watched the hopes and dreams that they had post-Emancipation and Reconstruction evaporate as they saw the onslaught of Jim Crow.

    But, I consider myself in a better fighting position than they were then, and fight, we must.

    I think it’s quite obvious that the right wants to erase all the gains of this country since Brown vs. Board.

     

    It’s up to us to fight them on it.

     

    I believe in the American Experiment. I am willing to fight for it.

  24. 24.

    The Oracle of Solace

    In Takei’s childhood, both major parties collaborated in maintaining white supremacy. It has taken three generations for one of these major parties (the Democrats, for those who aren’t keeping score) to reach the point where a majority of its members and voters are either directly impacted by institutional racism, or ideologically anti-racist. Yet we will still hear claims that the two parties are the same, or at least insufficiently different, as if Takei’s life experiences don’t matter.

  25. 25.

    geg6

    Thank you, Mr. Sulu!  I just love George Takei.  And I agree with him.  I’m taking a day off from all the gloom porn here at this blog and all the others I usually read.  It’s almost as annoying as the crap from the Trumpsters.  I have my own fears but I’m tired of dwelling on them and I’m not going to today.

    In a couple hours, I’m going to pick up my allotment of postcards and starting work on them tonight.  And then, in a few days, I’m going to request another hundred.  Positive action is going to be my focus today.

  26. 26.

    Dorothy A. Winsor

    One of my book clubs met yesterday and discussed Brad Meltzer’s THE LINCOLN CONSPIRACY, about a historical plot to assassinate Lincoln before he was inaugurated. I thought we might wind up talking about how the country was so divided both then and now, but we wound up talking about racism. It was a profoundly depressing experience.

    One woman choked up talking about the inconceivable evil of slavery. A few minutes later she said she also couldn’t understand racism. When she was growing up, they had a black housekeeper and they treated her like one of the family. She said it never would have occurred to her to tell the housekeeper she couldn’t use their toilet.

    A friend of mine gently pointed out that maybe that wasn’t so straightforward. We have diversity in this building, but it’s between residents (all white) and staff, a big portion of whom are latinx. The woman with the housekeeper says she treats the staff just like she treats her friends and thinks of them in the same way.

    And that was typical. No one there was a raving user of the N-word, but they were blind.

  27. 27.

    Immanentize

    @rikyrah:

    Cause they are majority non-White.

    In the end — not in percentages but in numbers — didn’t Hillary get more white person votes than POC votes? I can’t find the vote count analysis, but I’m pretty sure that’s true.

  28. 28.

    A Ghost to Most

    @cmorenc:

    despite the unambiguous revelations about how depraved, irresponsible, untruthful, greedy and narcissistic Trump’s fundamental character is.

    His base is just as depraved, irresponsible, untruthful, greedy and narcissistic as he is.

  32. 32.

    Kay

    @Soprano2:

    Donald Trump tweeted he wanted Rogan to host a debate – after Rogan endorsed Donald Trump and has spent three months saying Biden is senile- and a former NYT journalist and a current Intercept journalist believe Donald Trump said that because Donald Trump is interested in a free exchange of ideas.

    Their efforts to be cool and contrarian have turned them into morons. They can no longer make the simplest evaluations of a series of events or people.

  33. 33.

    Immanentize

    @OzarkHillbilly: it’s sad to think that there really are people who, deep down, think that way.

    Most of the front pagers at LG&M are a bit off, but I smile everytime Loomis describes Arlington National Cemetery as “the confiscated lands of the traitor, Robert E. Lee.” That is what an actual traitor looks like.

  34. 34.

    charlucklesWe

    @Kay:

    JFC.  Is it too much to ask of my fellow white middle-aged males that they stop embarrassing the **** out of me?  We’re given the keys to the kingdom and then not only do we screw it up, we continuously whine about it.

  35. 35.

    Brachiator

    @The Oracle of Solace:

    Today’s google honors Felicitas Mendez, a dark skinned Puerto Rican woman who, along with her husband, won a landmark case to desegregate California schools. A number of groups who understood oppression joined the lawsuit, Mendez v Westminster. Thurgood Marshall filed an amicus brief in the case and then California governor Earl Warren ordered that California public schools and public spaces be desegregated. This was 1947 and the victory here was a precursor to the 1954 Brown decision and to later civil rights battles.

    The fight for justice continues, and we get to be a part of it.

  36. 36.

    Kay

    Bari Weiss Retweeted
    Glenn Greenwald
    @ggreenwald
    ·19h
    Having them sit for a few hours with Rogan or someone like Rogan — instead of the same set of insular TV reporters plugged into all the same people — would be a great test for people who want to be President. Long overdue to have different kinds of moderators.

    Long overdue for Donald Trump to be interviewed by a Donald Trump fan. That never happens.

    I don’t think they listen to the show. They have some vague idea it’s “edgy” and they know it’s popular and hugely profitable so therefore “good”, but they missed the whole part where Joe Rogan announced, based on absolutely nothing, that Biden is senile and he was therefore voting for Trump.

  37. 37.

    hueyplong

    When you translate “cancel culture” into “Stop noticing that our position is unpopular,” it all becomes a lot clearer.

    It’s not “cancel culture” to declare that, based on a string of misrepresentations (often referred to as “lies”), someone has blown his credibility.

  38. 38.

    NotMax

    It may be because I went on a Monday or a boat had not yet been unloaded; unusually glaring difference of inventory at Costco yesterday. Suspect it’s a temporary hiccup in supply. Maybe related to freight flight schedules impacted due to west coast smoke and ash?

    Fresh chicken – none at all. No breasts, no thighs, no drumsticks, no wings, nada.
    Fresh beef – about half the usual selection.
    Fresh lamb – none.
    Fresh pork and fish aplenty. Much of those locally sourced.
    .
    Bare bones selections in the cold cuts and cheeses aisles. I happen to be a big fan of the Kirkland brand sliced seasoned roast beef, which was absent.

    Fresh veggies in the cooler room about one-third the variety normally stocked. Whole lotta special priced, about to reach sell-by date dips and spreads.

    Hit and miss with canned goods. No canned mushrooms. One the other hand a 12-pack of canned black beans (not Goya) was marked down to four bucks and change.

  39. 39.

    Kay

    That was Rogan’s response when his guest, Thiel Capital managing director Eric Weinstein, said that “people, when they are given no choice at all, express themselves moronically. I want a choice of an actual president that’s viable. I don’t have one.”

    Yes, he’s the voice of the cancelled masses- Theil Capital is never heard from. Silenced!

    A multimillionaire (Rogan) interviewing another multimillionaire (Weinstein) where Rogan endorses Trump is a view that is never expressed. God, the bravery of these freedom fighters! I get misty about the First Amendment just thinking about it.
    AA voters should NOT have cancelled these media and corporate moguls. How dare they elect Joe Biden.

  41. 41.

    clay

    @Kay:

    but they missed the whole part where Joe Rogan announced, based on absolutely nothing, that Biden is senile

    Unfortunately, it wasn’t based on nothing.  I mean, no, it wasn’t based on any evidence or reality, but it WAS based on a months-long smear campaign against Biden perpetuated by members of the Online Left and the Trump campaign*.  And now those same groups are the ones promoting Rogan to be a host.  Hmmm, what was Glenn saying about ‘insular’ again?

    *But perhaps I repeat myself?

  43. 43.

    Hazmat

    Long-time lurker here. geg6 or others, if you don’t mind sharing, what postcard campaigns are you finding to work on? I saw that Postcard Patriots are not doing postcards right now, and Postcards to Voters has very limited campaigns. I’ve been doing letters for VoteForward, but I have a bunch of blank postcards left from 2018 and would like to write more if needed!

  44. 44.

    Kay

    @clay:

    But Theil Capital and Joe Rogan don’t have any choice!  How can you deny the millionaire podcaster and financial manager demographic A CHOICE?

    This is America’s journalistic elite. Donald Trump blathered something on Twitter and they’re SO contrarian and open minded they’re willing to ignore the entire context and boldly call for a debate moderated by a Trump endorser. Interesting!  Americans exist to keep them “interested”. We live to serve.

  45. 45.

    rp

    Greenwald has reached Trumpian levels of dishonesty and general awfulness. I guess he collected enough coins/rubles and has leveled up.

  47. 47.

    Kay

    @clay:

    I mean, come on:

    President Trump had some fun Tuesday at the expense of his Democratic opponent, Joe Biden, with the help of comedian, UFC commentator and podcast host Joe RoganThe president tweeted a 13-second clip from a November 2019 episode of “The Joe Rogan Experience” podcast, during which Rogan employed a less-than-flattering simile to describe the former vice president.

    They’re supposed to be journalists. Why don’t they read anything before talking about it? Both of these people are paid half a million dollars a year and their only fucking job is to read and opine and scold the rest of us. They can’t even do that competently.

  48. 48.

    dmsilev

    Speaking of insular media idiots, the Post has an op-ed with the splashy title “I never considered voting for Trump in 2016. I may be forced to vote for him this year.” (no link), with the author “fearing the leftward lurch of the Democratic Party” more than all of Trump’s pathologies. Oh no, the Democrats are losing the heartland voters with their leftist leftisms. Except…

    Danielle Pletka is a senior fellow at the American Enterprise Institute.

    “Right wing media hack twists herself into rhetorical pretzels to justify her inevitable vote for right-wing candidate” makes for a less dramatic headline.

  49. 49.

    Kay

    @mrmoshpotato:

    Now we’ll be treated to two weeks of lectures on how Joe Biden is “afraid” to “debate” Donald Trump on the Trump fan show by the cancel culture crowd.

    They’re fucking insufferable people.

  51. 51.

    catclub

    @dmsilev: Right wing media hack twists herself into rhetorical pretzels to justify her inevitable vote for right-wing candidate”

     

    Danielle Pletka is not Rightwing, she is FAR rightwing Bomb iran Nutty.

  53. 53.

    clay

    @Kay: Gee, I wonder if Trump would agree to debate Biden for four hours on, I dunno, Nicole Wallace’s show*?  He’s a coward if he doesn’t!  Sorry, I don’t make the rules.

    *Now that I would watch.

  55. 55.

    Kay

    I regret to inform you I have become embroiled in yet another yard sign controversy. I swear I am NOT instigating this. I hate yard signs- I hate talking about them, I hate buying them, I hate picking them and up and carting them around but I cannot free myself. Every.Fucking. Day. Democrats with the yard signs.

    A faction wants to give them away. What happens when you give them away is Republicans come get them and throw them away. So now I’m being portrayed as some greedhead sign profiteer for insisting they ask for a donation. Literally every person makes a donation. Happily. Eager to help. But I’m supposed to piously turn this money down, which is just not how I’m built :)

  56. 56.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    @geg6: 

    And I agree with him.  I’m taking a day off from all the gloom porn here at this blog and all the others I usually read.  It’s almost as annoying as the crap from the Trumpsters.  I have my own fears but I’m tired of dwelling on them and I’m not going to today.

    This. This is why some commenters leave and never come back. This place is getting as bad as LGM

  57. 57.

    Baud

    @Kay: They’re insufferable because they know they can’t lose. Joe is “afraid” if he doesn’t go on Rogan’s show.  If Joe goes on Rogan’s show, he was successfully manipulated into doing so.  If Joe appears weak on Rogan’s show, Trump wins the media cycle.  If Joe appears strong on Rogan’s show, Trump tells other emotionally fragile white guys how Joe doesn’t respect them.  If Joe wins the election, they all get the benefits of Democratic governance.

    They are smug because they are operating from a position of strength.  All we can do is get our people out and win the election, and then the next several elections after that.  That’ll wipe the smirks from their faces.

  58. 58.

    Brachiator

    @dmsilev: 

    Speaking of insular media idiots, the Post has an op-ed with the splashy title “I never considered voting for Trump in 2016. I may be forced to vote for him this year.”

    Which does Pletka prefer, Trump’s incompetence or his corruption?

  60. 60.

    VOR

    @rikyrah: I used to think Conservatives wanted to roll the clock back before the New Deal. Now I realize they want to roll back The Enlightenment. Many would be perfectly happy with feudalism under King Donald.

  66. 66.

    Brachiator

    @Baud:

    Rogan is a nobody’s nobody. No reason for Biden to go on his show.

    If Joe wins the election, they all get the benefits of Democratic governance.

    Sounds like a win for everyone.

  68. 68.

    mrmoshpotato

    @Kay:

    I regret to inform you I have become embroiled in yet another yard sign controversy. 

    Careful.  You don’t want to overcook the outside of the signs before the insides are done.  May I suggest getting reverse-seared in another yard sign controversy?

  69. 69.

    Shawn in Showme

    @Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):

    Gotcha.

    Just wanted to point out, however, that Rogan is the most popular media personality among white males.  Of course there will be serious noises made in the corporate media about him being a debate moderator.  We’re fighting a political battle.  The other side is waging a battle for cultural supremacy.

  70. 70.

    clay

    @Baud: Remember how Biden gave an decent-lengthed interview with Charlamagne tha God, and people only quoted three words of it (“You ain’t black”)?

    That’s 100% what these people want from Biden going on Rogan’s show.  Some brief clip that can be taken out of context and plastered on the airways.

    There’s literally no upside for Biden.

  71. 71.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    @Brachiator:

    Your point was that it won’t matter re:election, which I agree with, but Rogan isn’t a nobody, as much as I and others despise him. Lots of famous people have gone on his podcast and as Shawn noted above, he made $30 million last year from his podcast. That’s not what a “nobody’s nobody” would make.

    I’m hoping that this latest move will help kill his show. He’s a toxic fool who never met a conspiracy theory he didn’t believe in or wouldn’t soon. He has disputed and denigrated commonly accepted concepts like toxic masculinity, for example.

  72. 72.

    germy

    It can get better.

    Vote these people out:

    A Washington state representative dialed the phone of a local reporter and called him a "cocksucker" and "lying piece of shit," among other things, after he published a story about her linking to conspiracy theories on Facebook. https://t.co/SRoMoWddgd— Oliver Darcy (@oliverdarcy) September 15, 2020

  73. 73.

    Brachiator

    @Baud:

    I know. There’s zero chance it’ll happen.  I’m just explaining their psychology.

    Fair point. The best way to beat them at their game is not to play it.

  74. 74.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Shawn in Showme: We’re fighting a political battle. The other side is waging a battle for cultural supremacy.

    No, they’ve already lost that battle.  That’s why they are so enraged.  There are mixed race gay couples on TV selling bathroom cleaner.  It’s not edgy; it’s normal.*

    *I am not saying we are post-racism, post-sexism, that trans-people are safe to be who they are everywhere, etc.

  75. 75.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    @Shawn in Showme:

    “Cultural supremacy”? With Joe fucking Rogan of all people? That’s a laugh lol

    I’ll never understand why he’s popular. He’s an idiot and a piece of shit. I mean, I do understand, but I’m not entertained by him

  76. 76.

    Baud

    I don’t listen to Rogan at all, but my understanding is that most of the time he is not political on his show, but when he does talk about politics, he’s got the stereotypical white male world view.

  77. 77.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    @Baud:

    He engages in a lot of conspiracy theory bullshit under the guise he’s “just asking questions”. He even used to believe the moon landing was a hoax

    He’s also a vile transphobe too

  78. 78.

    Brachiator

    @Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):

    Your point was that it won’t matter re:election, which I agree with, but Rogan isn’t a nobody, as much as I and others despise him. Lots of famous people have gone on his podcast and as Shawn noted above, he made $30 million last year from his podcast. That’s not what a “nobody’s nobody” would make.

    Wasn’t he the host of some TV game show?

    I suppose that he has achieved some fame, but I have only seen a couple of YouTube clips of his recent stuff.  There’s nothing there. By comparison, Alex Trebeck earns $10 million a year from Jeopardy, but I am not interested in his opinion either.

    Bottom line. Biden may be interested in reaching out to the people who watch Rogan, but this does not mean that he needs Rogan to do that.

  83. 83.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Kay:

    Joe Rogan, who apparently doesn’t know how “a primary works” proclaims that “the party” chose Biden when what happened was voters chose Biden. Why are the cancelling tens of millions of Biden voters?

    Rogan is suggesting some shadowy party elite actually chose Biden, not the vast majority of primary voters in states that look far more like the national electorate than say, Iowa or New Hampshire primary voters? Wherever might he have picked up those talking points?

    The Intercept crew– hold on to your wigs and keys, folks– is all over this idea that the roid-addled homophobic racist should moderate a debate. And Lee Fang is arguing on twitter this morning that “white natioanlism” is a strawman that those same shadowy elites use to cling to power.

  85. 85.

    germy

    joe rogan is the ideal debate moderator from Trump's perspective, because he's a dumb meathead who nods thoughtfully when Elon Musk tells him he's gonna implant a tiny game boy in everyone's brain to solve climate change

    — The Online-Normie Complex (@canderaid) September 15, 2020

  90. 90.

    NotMax

    @WaterGirl

    As you asked for a report if seen, between 2 and 3 a.m. (-ish) blog time Recent Comments was running as much as 15 minutes behind. As well, a delay in comments showing up on a page ranging from small to as much as five minutes, requiring multiple refreshes. When such a delayed appearing comment did appear it was timestamped at the time it showed up rather than the time Post Comment was clicked.

    Cannot speak to how much longer the funkiness may have lasted as collapsed into napland very shortly after 3 a.m. blog time.

  92. 92.

    Betty Cracker

    @Baud: Couldn’t Biden say something like, “Rogan already says he’s voting for Trump and spreads Trump campaign lies about me to his audience. I won’t agree to let him moderate a debate for the same reason I won’t agree to let Sean Hannity moderate a debate. How about the League of Women Voters instead?”

    That wouldn’t be weak — it would be truthful, at least to anyone who isn’t already on the Trump bandwagon. I get that Rogan’s audience isn’t the same as Hannity’s (they’re younger, for one thing), but Rogan has made biased declarations against Biden. It’s absurd to act like this is a legit offer.

    ETA: On the other hand, since Biden is in the lead, he shouldn’t agree to any more debates anyway, so there’s that…

  97. 97.

    Immanentize

    Accidents will happen
    We only hit and run
    I don’t want to hear it
    ‘Cause I know what I’ve done

    The South Dakota AG “deer strike” story is getting weirder!:

    Ravnsborg said he called 911 and then looked around his vehicle in the dark, using a cell phone flashlight. He said all he could see were pieces of his vehicle.

    After Hyde County Sheriff Mike Volek arrived, the two men surveyed the damage and filled out paperwork for his car to be repaired. “At no time did either of us suspect that I had been in an accident with a person,” Ravnsborg said.

    With his car wrecked, Ravnsborg said he borrowed the sheriff’s personal car to return to his home in Pierre. The next morning, he and chief of staff Tim Bormann drove back to return the sheriff’s car.

    They stopped at the spot of the accident, where Ravnsborg said he discovered Boever’s body in the grass just off the shoulder of the road. He said it was apparent Boever was dead.

    Ravnsborg said he drove to Volek’s house and reported the dead body. They both returned to the accident scene, where Volek said he would handle the investigation and asked Ravnborg to return to Pierre, according to Ravnsborg’s statement.

  98. 98.

    Brachiator

    @germy:

    joe rogan is the ideal debate moderator from Trump’s perspective

    Yes, in a world where an idiot like Trump can become president, a moron like Rogan can be a choice for a debate moderator.

    And instead of a debate, Trump and Biden could arm wrestle, or play a video game.

  99. 99.

    germy

    @NotMax:

    If I’m in an older thread, the recent comments will show only up to that thread.  If I switch the the main balloon-juice page, or the most recent thread, then recent comments will be more accurate.

  102. 102.

    Miss Bianca

    @OzarkHillbilly: Ah, “Bloodlands”. I remember getting that on audiobook and listening to it on my daily commute over the mountains. It was a traumatizing experience.

    Yeah, Belarus and Ukraine both got thoroughly shafted, both prior and post WWII.

  109. 109.

    Citizen Alan

    @Brachiator:

    Wasn’t he the host of some TV game show?

    He was the host of Fear Factor, which I wouldn’t even dignify enough to call it a game show. It featured wretched fame whores who were willing to go on national television and eat pig rectums for the chance to win a piddly $10k. And what’s worse is that in interviews after FF was cancelled, Rogan himself showed nothing but contempt for the contestants on the show that made him famous who he referred to (in a foreshadowing of his Trump support) as “losers.”

  110. 110.

    Immanentize

    @Betty Cracker: But it took them quite a long time….

    Ravnsborg took Volek’s personal car home?  Volek — at a crime scene! — told the deadly driver, Ravnsborg to just go home?

    ETA. Why hasn’t the AG just gone all no-vowel and spell his name Rvnsbrg?  We would all pronounce it the same way, probably.

  112. 112.

    Gin & Tonic

    @rp: Speaking of which – Ukraine has blocked entry to foreigners (due to COVID.) A large number of Haredim have been trying to get to the Ukrainian village of Uman for a Rosh Hashanah pilgrimage. They flew into Kyiv and were not allowed to exit the international zone of the airport, so they left, went to Belarus and tried to enter overland. As they were blocked at the border, they decided to remain there and prevent anyone else from crossing.

  114. 114.

    OGLiberal

    @charlucklesWe: That drives me nut as well – the constant complaining, the grievances. (and, yes, I’m a white guy) And their godhead is the chief whiner. They make posters of him with his head on John Rambo’s body but the dude is just one big whining complaint machine who can’t even do the thing he’s most recently famous for – telling people “you’re fired” in person. This is the white man’s (and many white women’s) ideal man?

  116. 116.

    Brachiator

    @Citizen Alan:

    Wasn’t he the host of some TV game show?

    He was the host of Fear Factor, which I wouldn’t even dignify enough to call it a game show. It featured wretched fame whores who were willing to go on national television and eat pig rectums for the chance to win a piddly $10k.

    I live in Southern California. This was mild compared to some foreign TV games shows I’ve seen on the international channels here.

    But yeah, that’s the Rogan I remember.  Didn’t he have more hair?

    So he had contempt for the contestants. Projection, I suppose.

  117. 117.

    Immanentize

    @Gin & Tonic: The Mad Haredim of the New Year!  What a crazy story!

    “I don’t know who promised to whom the passage of 3,000 citizens,” the head of Ukraine’s border service Serhiy Deineko told the group on the border. “You were deceived.”

  119. 119.

    Brachiator

    @Immanentize:

    Ravnsborg took Volek’s personal car home? Volek — at a crime scene! — told the deadly driver, Ravnsborg to just go home?

    Was it a crime scene at that time?

    This thing is strange and tragic. Don’t they have some supposedly independent agencies investigating it?

  120. 120.

    The Thin Black Duke

    Maybe it’s me, but courting the idiots who listen to Joe Rogan doesn’t sound like a winning strategy for Biden.

  122. 122.

    Keith P.

    @Brachiator: I saw him perform live back when he had hair and did Fear Factor. I only think he’s a so-so comedian…he got into it with a mother-daughter pair who decided to sit *at* the stage and heckle him, and it detracted from the whole show, as he went into Diceman Mode.  If someone ever releases the tape of that one, he’ll have a few unpleasant news cycles.

  123. 123.

    Immanentize

    @Brachiator: The police guy told Ravnsborg to go home after they found the body.  That is a crime scene (an accident investigation is treated like a crime scene even without a dead guy).  And the dead guy’s cousins say there were lots of state police cars and an ambulance there the following morning after? Ravnsborg was told to go home.

    There was a report that the NORTH Dakota State investigators were going to help, but now it looks like Kristi Noem is handling the investigation?  So unclear about independent investigation.

  124. 124.

    Gin & Tonic

    His first own post since poisoning:

    Hello, it’s Navalny. Miss you all. I still can’t do most things, but I spent the previous day breathing on my own. Completely on my own… Really enjoyed it. What a wonderful and under-appreciated process. Recommended. pic.twitter.com/iduw6pJZCn
    — Leonid Ragozin (@leonidragozin) September 15, 2020

  125. 125.

    Matt McIrvin

    @Soprano2:

    Literally no one ever asks white men if they’re voting for another white man just because he’s a white man!

    Because if you try that he’ll flip his shit and start screaming in your face about “the race card”. If you’re lucky and he doesn’t have a loaded gun handy.

  127. 127.

    Ruckus

    @cmorenc:

    That is exactly what George is talking about. Humans will build an opponent to feed their worse fears if one doesn’t exist. Racism is that opponent to many in this country. It will never go away completely but it can be controlled to a large degree or it can be exploited massively, by notion and fear. Conservatives are exploiting  that, building that, and shitforbrains is the villain and the exploited here, history is his helper and his downfall.

  128. 128.

    Elizabelle

    Sorry the formatting is such a mess.  Cut and paste, and the transition from “text” to “visual” did not take.

    Link for the Fallows article: The Media Learned Nothing From 2016
    The press hasn’t broken its most destructive habits when it comes to covering Donald Trump.

    Link for the AP story he takes on in the first example. Dueling versions of reality define 1st week of fall campaign

    Anyway, I think the Fallows article is superb — it’s preaching to the choir, WRT jackals, and probably deserves its own front page post.  He is so clear about the usual practices that allow Trump and other liar/sociopaths to do a complete end run about professional reporting.

  130. 130.

    Matt McIrvin

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    And Lee Fang is arguing on twitter this morning that “white natioanlism” is a strawman that those same shadowy elites use to cling to power.

    There was a move he made there that I thought was really interesting: he referred to the Democratic establishment as “the far left”. The anti-anti-Trump leftists are making a play to define themselves as the new center, rather than as the true left radicals. “Extremism” in that scheme now means you want justice for black people and other marginalized groups, not that you’re a Marxist who wants to destroy capitalism.

    It’s a more explicit alliance with the Trump right, to my mind.

    I’ve been seeing signs of this coming for a long time.

  133. 133.

    John S.

    This is how wingnuts “own” the libs.

    They throw out some ridiculous notion, amplify it through their puke funnel of surrogates and friendlies, and the next thing you know we have half a thread talking about Joe “tripping balls” Rogan moderating a presidential debate.

    This notion is less worthy of discussion than suggesting Insane Clown Posse moderate a debate in full makeup with an audience of Jugaloos attending.

    ETA: Having ICP moderate would actually be FAR better.

  137. 137.

    Elizabelle

    @Immanentize:   Not sure what “breaking the margin” means, but I should have broken the excerpts into 3 or so passages.

    The edit window seems to allow less time in the last 2 or so days.

  138. 138.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    @Matt McIrvin:

    So what, they flip out if somebody suggests that they’re playing the race card except for whites? What’s their justification/counterargument?

  141. 141.

    Immanentize

    @Elizabelle: breaking the margin means you used a string of characters without a space so long that it runs far off the right side of the normal margin — especially difficult for mobile users like me.  It wreaks havoc with commenting, editing, etc.

  142. 142.

    dnfree

    @rikyrah: As a young white person who grew up in a small Midwestern town that had few black people, the Civil Rights movement of the later 1950s and 1960s was the defining event of my youth.  Everything following that (anti war, women’s rights, gay rights, etc) was built on that foundation and that courage, and to me on that foundational peaceful resistance. We can’t let it be taken away.

  144. 144.

    germy

    Fox & Friends co-host Steve Doocy says the show has not actually committed to doing a weekly interview with Trump, like Trump claimed it had twice on air today: “You may want to do it every week, but Fox is not committed to that. We’re going to take it on a case-by-case basis."

    — Daniel Dale (@ddale8) September 15, 2020

  145. 145.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    @Brachiator:

    I suppose that he has achieved some fame, but I have only seen a couple of YouTube clips of his recent stuff.  There’s nothing there.

    Not to his fanbase. I agree that Biden would not benefit from appearing on his show. My point was only that he’s popular. His podcast is the most popular in the world

  147. 147.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    @Kay: Rogan’s a good one, it’s very likely Rogan is stuck being a talking head on You Tube for the crap he’s said. His show dies because You Tube decides he’s too edgy there an’t to many career options open for him because most HR departments are going to think “well there is a harassment lawsuit waiting to happen”. This is why they are so worked up about “cancel culture” because they are terrified of it.

  148. 148.

    germy

    ‘The President and the People’ a ’20/20′ Special Event
    Undecided voters ask President Donald Trump their important questions before voting in November.

    Tonight on ABC

  150. 150.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    @NotMax:

    The moon isn’t actually real! It’s just a projection the Lizard people project in the sky to mind control us all! //

  151. 151.

    Barbara

    @Matt McIrvin: I have no fucking clue what people like Lee Fang want, except to maximize their own power.  Maybe that’s why they are so obsessed with defining and analyzing the power dynamics of the apparatus that they tried but failed to take over.   All I can say is that, like Glenn Greenwald, whatever Fang’s latest theory of power is, women and African Americans are on the outside, and should be grateful for whatever crumbs Fang and his band of superior intellects are willing to throw our way.  No, I am not surprised that they can’t see this.

  152. 152.

    MomSense

    Well fuck. Staff member at my son’s school is presumed positive.  Whole school released.  This is in a county with a .4 positivity rate.

    Several other schools have released students, too.  We are not even a full week in.

  153. 153.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    @germy:

    Will definitely not watch. I’ve heard ABC tends to be the most right-wing among the networks. It’s owned by Disney and I get that it’s a corporation, but I’ve never gotten the impression that Disney is run by wingnuts and find it hard to believe that Disney would run ABC this way

  155. 155.

    EmbraceYourInnerCrone

    @Immanentize: The whole thing is weird. The man who was hit apparently had crashed his vehicle into a field/haybale in that area and gone home, then walked back out toward his vehicle:

    Family of victim seeks answers

    “In an interview with Dakota News Now, Boever’s cousin, Nick Nemec, provided other details about the crash. Nemec said Boever had crashed his pickup into a hay bale prior to Saturday night’s accident. After the crash, Nemec gave Boever a ride back to his home in Highmore, about a mile-and-a-half away. Nemec said he and Boever made plans to fix the pickup on Sunday morning. But Saturday night, Boever decided to go back to the truck. Nemec did not know why Boever returned to the vehicle Saturday night.”

  156. 156.

    Elizabelle

    @Immanentize:   Ah.  Thank you.  Anyway, will break future long comments up.

    ETA:  Oh!  Sorry!  Did not see you’d already put up today’s SD AG developments.  Well, this one has links.

    AND:  the South Dakota AG’s story now becomes even more whack! The Washington Post story today.
    South Dakota’s attorney general said he thought he hit a deer. The next day, he found a dead man’s body in a ditch.
    Yes.  That “he” is Ravnsborg, personally.

    And the link to Ravnsborg’s statement on the “tragic incident.”

    Ravnsborg now saying his car was too badly damaged to drive; he did call law enforcement.  The country sheriff himself responded — Mike Volek. They did not find a deer, or poor Mr. Joe Boever (who was probably already done for).

    Sheriff Volek lent Ravnsborg — with his 8 speeding convictions — his personal vehicle to drive home.

    And then Ravnsborg returns to the scene the following day and — finds the body!  With his trusty chief of staff at his side (was helping to return the loaned vehicle.)  They were looking for the poor wounded deer.

    According to Ravnsborg’s statement, he immediately drove to Volek’s home and reported the body.
    And then the Sheriff told Ravnsborg to go home to Pierre, immediately.  Like, yeah.

    I guess we know why he was not in his office on Monday.

    Finds the body himself, around 11 hours after the incident.  Uh huh.

    Maybe it could have happened that way …

  159. 159.

    trollhattan

    @Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):

    “News” was once network prestige programming and not required to turn a profit. Your Cronkite/Brinkley era.

    Those days are gone.

    e.g., The only reason the McCain spawn is on The View is ratings jumped upon adding her to the lineup; they had waned after the prior token wingnut left. Conflict=viewership=higher ad rates. SAD!

  164. 164.

    patroclus

    It is not entirely accurate that “nobody” stood up for the Japanese Americans in the events surrounding Executive Order 9066 and the internment camps in the immediate aftermath of Pearl Harbor (even while it is completely accurate that Japanese Americans lost their homes, property and were horrendously treated during that time).  Congress did, in fact, activate the Tolan Committee (which had earlier studied migratory patterns of Americans in the wake of the Depression and Dust Bowl) in early 1942 and it held hearings about the proposed internment policy in California.  The problem was that it was set up too late and the military theater had already been defined and the dislocations had already started by the time it got going.  Nonetheless, the hearings were held and the Committee made two salient recommendations: (1) to set up an Alien Property Custodian (as had been done in WWI); and (2) to create what became the WRA (the War Relocation Administration).  They sent their recommendation to Sam Rayburn, who forwarded them on to Secretary Morganthau at Treasury and both entities were created.  Now, the APC was set up too late to actually record much of the Japanese Americans’ property and they really had to be wealthy enough to hire a lawyer to do that for them, but at least some property was registered and later protected after the war.  And, the WRA started out badly (despite the efforts of Milton Eisenhower) and actively repressed the citizens initially, but over time, it improved conditions in the camps, actually relocated many Japanese Americans to the interior of the country and much greater freedom and facilitated the recruitment of many who served honorably in the armed forces.  The U.S. thus distinguished itself from the Nazis and their concentration camps and did not treat the internees nearly as badly.  Small comfort, yes, but there were some good people in the 1940’s who, at least partially, helped ameliorate the situation.

  171. 171.

    WereBear

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    In an attempt to engage in some light reading, I’ve been perusing the pages of Timothy Snyder’s Bloodlands. We can always say, “At least we aren’t Belarus in ’42-’43.”

    I have done the exact same thing.

    Still haven’t finished the book. It’s too much all at once.

  174. 174.

    Elizabelle

    @Brachiator:   We are told that it was not a crime scene at the time.  That they’d not been able to find the “deer.”

    Ravnsborg found it the next morning.  He drove back into Highmore to gas up the borrowed car, drove west again in direction of sheriff’s home (which was close to the accident site), and he and aide stopped to see if any “deer” was visible.

    Surprise!

    Ravnsborg’s car was towed, once he’d borrowed the car and left.  Big, bright lights on tow trucks, but no one found Mr. Boever then, or was looking for him.

    Suspect he was dead after the high speed impact, but how awful if he survived a while, and Ravnsborg wouldn’t ‘fess up about his “deer.”

  176. 176.

    Jay

    It is actually a federal crime for a judge to intentionally violate a person's constitutional rights, like setting a retaliatory $1 million cash bail for a protest medic. But our legal system largely prosecutes only the crimes of powerless people. https://t.co/DGol37C0Pe— Alec Karakatsanis (@equalityAlec) September 15, 2020

  177. 177.

    Chyron HR

    Do Bernie’s bros sincerely believe that he got a majority of votes and/or pledged delegates in 2016 and 2020, but the superdelegates conspired to steal the nomination from him?

    Does Bernie himself believe that?

  178. 178.

    Elizabelle

    @Gin & Tonic:    Not stated.  Guessing he responded in his sheriff’s vehicle (would need the comms equipment); his home is near the incident site.  He drove the AG to his own home, lent “Speedy” the personal vehicle.  Not stated if the sheriff ever returned to the incident site that night.  A tow truck had been called; they were anticipating an hour’s delay in its arriving.

    I guess it’s possible this could have happened as the AG said, but it’s kind of far fetched.

    Also, I guess we’re depending on the sheriff for any reports on whether the AG was impaired.

    Why was the initial story so different from the AG’s statement?  It is highly interesting that HE was the one to find the vic.  That is something that was known when No Mask Governor Noem was putting out her story Sunday.  Or was it??

  180. 180.

    Jay

    What has been happening at ICE detention centers that we know of:- forced sterilizations- spraying of industrial strength disinfectant (HDQ neutral) on bare skin causing bleeding and airway damage during a respiratory pandemic – thousands of cases of child sexual abuse— Your Antifa Wine Aunt ? (@seltbram) September 14, 2020

  181. 181.

    MomSense

    @Immanentize:

    He opted for remote learning and has been emailing and talking with his principal to work out the details.  I think it will end up that he just finishes by the holidays and then he will decide what to do about college.  His before times gap year ideas are not going to happen any time soon.  Ugh.

    There are students from 22 towns in three counties at his school so this is going to ripple out in unpleasant ways.

  182. 182.

    germy

    @Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):  I’ve heard ABC tends to be the most right-wing among the networks.

    On “This Week With George Stephanopoulos”  they always feature both sides of the spectrum:  Chris Christie on the republican side, and on the democratic side… Rahm Emanuel.

    This is what passes for acceptable discourse on corporate news.

  185. 185.

    frosty

    @OzarkHillbilly: Really good book but, um, light reading it’s not. So far there’s no government program to cause a famine and starve millions of us. Is there?

    (Yes my snarkometer is calibrated and I understand your premise.)

  188. 188.

    H.E.Wolf

    @Hazmat: what postcard campaigns are you finding to work on? I saw that Postcard Patriots are not doing postcards right now, and Postcards to Voters has very limited campaigns.

    Good news! Postcards To Voters is limiting their campaigns because they are doing a huge push to write to Democratic voters in KY, to elect Amy McGrath to Mitch McConnell’s Senate seat.

    Here’s the preamble from 2019: https://twitter.com/DemocratWit/status/1158911780250427392

    I’ve written 24 so far. :) Would love to have your help! Time to make inroads on our postcard inventories….

  190. 190.

    Just Chuck

    @Matt McIrvin: They’ve been referring to mainstream Democrats as DFH’s ever since there were H’s.  Hell, they made the word “Liberal” toxic for a few decades.  It’s wearing off for everyone not already in the cult.

  191. 191.

    Elizabelle

    @WaterGirl:   Thanks, WaterGirl.  I have a copy, too.

    Will maybe put it up again tonight, in shorter segments.  Gonna head out for a while now.

    Many apologies for screwing up the blog’s formatting.

    But do read the Fallows article.  He is such a clear writer and thinker.

  192. 192.

    JPL

    For my next reading adventure, I plan on downloading Caste.    It might be time to ask trump whether he thinks whiteness is more important than democracy.   That is where we are headed.

  193. 193.

    MisterForkbeard

    @Chyron HR: I think the idea is that because of the superdelegates who’d publicly pledged the entire contest was essentially invalidated as rigged.

    Basically, if Hillary starts with a 200 vote lead then the contest was never legitimate to begin with – she was always portrayed as the leader before any substantive votes had taken place and that tampers with the entire race.

    It’s really weak tea – Hillary would always have been in the lead anyway, and she was the presumptive favorite for obvious reasons.

  194. 194.

    Barbara

    @Chyron HR: I have been reading a biography of J.J. Rousseau, and the introduction made a point that I found to be really engaging.  Rousseau, of course, is full of contradictions, and these contradictions were noted and debated and used to criticize him even during his lifetime.  But as the author says, he believes that it is ultimately much more constructive to engage and battle and explain the contradictions in a theory of government or civil society than it is to pretend that the evidence of real life cracks in your perfectly coherent theory don’t exist.

    And I just have to ask myself: Why does Glenn Greenwald and company (including Sanders) keep shortchanging analysis of the power of race and gender to distort social and economic outcomes?

  195. 195.

    patroclus

    Moreover, the lawyers who represented Fred Korematsu certainly stood up for Japanese American rights and, even though they famously lost their case, the opinions in that case were excoriated for decades as horrific examples of non-justice and, as more and more people became aware of them, a strong impetus was created that ultimately resulted in the reparations paid to Japanese American survivors in the 1980’s (in an effort led by Jim Wright and the Dems).  In addition, at the time, the original orders applied to not only Japanese Americans but also Italian Americans and German Americans too.  Francis Biddle at Justice was successful at eliminating the targeted sanctions at the German and Italian Americans (the famous case was Joe DiMaggio’s Dad in San Francisco would have been affected).  Rayburn and some at Justice were just unsuccessful when it came to the Japanese Americans.  Takei is certainly right to complain about what happened, but to equate everyone with the demagoguery of Earl Warren is not entirely accurate.

  196. 196.

    JPL

    @Elizabelle: I’m sure the governor will be able to manage the investigation.      cover-up.

    I wonder if they are paying off his relatives for their pain and suffering.

  197. 197.

    Baud

     

    @MisterForkbeard:

    Somehow, it didn’t bother Obama in 2008. It’s more than weak tea. It normalized a conspiracy theory against Democrats that Donald Trump is using right now in his pursuit of fascism.

  198. 198.

    Citizen Alan

    @Jay: This. What happened to George Takei and the other Japanese-America internees was a travesty. But I’m convinced that when the truth finally comes out, the treatment of Latinx refugees in Trump’s camps will be shown to have been worse by orders of magnitude. And if Shitgibbon wins, I truly believe he’ll expand the concept to citizens. He’s already floated the idea of using internment camps to “solve” the problem of homelessness.

  202. 202.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    @JPL:

    There evening news is number one. How’s that make you feel.

    They all claim that. NBC Nightly News claims the same thing

  203. 203.

    PJ

    @Elizabelle: I once hit a deer with the car I was driving – I was probably going no more than 35, it darted across the road right in front of me, bounced off the front of the car, got up and took off.  I stopped to see if there was any damage to the car (there wasn’t), but I was pretty shaken up.

    That incident couldn’t have been more sudden from my standpoint – the deer was not in my field of vision as I approached, and I only had time to slam on the brakes just as it hit the car.  But there is no way in hell – even if I was completely soused – that I could have mistaken that deer for a person, or vice versa.  Ravnsborg is lying through his teeth.

  206. 206.

    Roger Moore

    @Elizabelle:

    Sheriff Volek lent Ravnsborg — with his 8 speeding convictions — his personal vehicle to drive home.

    The most generous interpretation is that he was sufficiently drunk that he genuinely didn’t know what he hit, and the sheriff only thought he was helping to cover up a DUI.  Even in that case, it should cost both men their careers and result in the AJ winding up in prison.

  207. 207.

    Roger Moore

    @dnfree:

    they don’t know the history after slavery—reconstruction, Jim Crow, redlining, and all the rest. And too many don’t want to know it.

    The history has been suppressed, at least in typical American school history.  There’s a brief section on Reconstruction as told by Lost Cause believers, in which blacks just weren’t ready for political power and the carpetbaggers and scalawags who were exploiting them eventually got run out of power.  Then there’s nothing at all about race relations until the Civil Rights era, when blacks reclaimed their equality and everything has been hunky dory since.

  208. 208.

    trnc

    “I’d rather vote for Trump than [Biden],” said Rogan. “I don’t think [Biden] can handle anything. You’re relying entirely on his cabinet. If you want to talk about an individual leader who can communicate, he can’t do that. And we don’t know what the fuck he’ll be like after a year in office.

    Seems like that explicitly stated bias would be immediately disqualifying.

    ETA: This was meant as a reply to Kay’s comment #10

  209. 209.

    trnc

    @Baud:

    Trump was at a “Latinos for Trump” event yesterday.

    I asked myself, where are the White Guys for Biden events?

    If you became a journalist, you could get paid to ask the Biden campaign that question.

  211. 211.

    Roger Moore

    @patroclus:

    There were also a handful of politicians who actively stood up for Japanese Americans, like Gov. Carr of Colorado.  But the sad truth is that internment was broadly popular.

    The story of Gov. Carr is instructive.  He opposed internment and said the internees were citizens whose rights deserved to be respected, and a substantial fraction of the internees there decided to stay in Colorado after the war.  But that was a very unpopular position, and standing up for it cost Carr his political career.

  212. 212.

    laura

    @Citizen Alan: When the truth comes out about how this Administration treated asylum seekers and immigrants and their stolen children FOR PROFIT there will be a stain that wont scrub out for the foreseeable future. And there damn well be a Nuremberg Trial for each and every depraved participant as an initial step to right the many wrongs.

  214. 214.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Roger Moore:

    The most generous interpretation is that he was sufficiently drunk that he genuinely didn’t know what he hit, and the sheriff only thought he was helping to cover up a DUI.

    “Of course I’ll help cover up the fact that you were driving drunk, and quite probably speeding. Here, take my personal car and drive yourself home.”

  217. 217.

    Matt McIrvin

    @clay: Furthermore, it’s a smear campaign capitalizing on Biden’s visible disability–his stutter, which through decades of practice he works around with extraordinary grace, but you can tell he’s doing it.

    I consider that aspect particularly despicable.

  219. 219.

    Elizabelle

    @Roger Moore:   You know what else strikes me?

    Sheriff Volek got the AG off the site before the tow truck driver showed.  The sheriff took care of the call himself (OK; could say it’s because he — conveniently — lives very close).

    But no other witnesses to whatever state the AG found himself in.  Out of here, AG.  I’ve got this.

  220. 220.

    J R in WV

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    September 15, 2020 at 9:48 am

    @Shawn in Showme: We’re fighting a political battle. The other side is waging a battle for cultural supremacy.

    No, they’ve already lost that battle.  That’s why they are so enraged.  There are mixed race gay couples on TV selling bathroom cleaner.  It’s not edgy; it’s normal.*

    *I am not saying we are post-racism, post-sexism, that trans-people are safe to be who they are everywhere, etc.

    This is so true! We don’t watch much TV at all, wife is a news-aholic and so we do try to watch some CNN and MSNBC in the evenings, often while I cook dinner and then while we eat and drink, from 7ish to 9:30ish. Lots of ads, and depending upon our linkage speeds, some nights we can only manage the audio feed.

    But seeing the gay and/or mixed race couples with happy kids in the commonplace commercials really hits my sweet spot. I started watching TV before Black stars were welcome on most TV shows, in the 1950s and ’60s! I know, to someone born in the late 1990s or the current century it seems hard to believe, but when liberal hosts like the Smothers Brothers, or Laugh-In had Black superstars on, it was really hugely controversial.

    So seeing those blended families of all types in commercials means the bigots have already completely lost the cultural wars. Now we just need to keep the pressure on them.

  222. 222.

    Roger Moore

    @Elizabelle:

    I agree.  The whole thing has the feel of Sheriff Volek wanting to take care of the event quietly only to have his work undone when it turned out the AG hit a person rather than a deer.  That’s why I think the AG may actually not have known he hit a person and why I’m pretty sure that if he did know he didn’t tell the sheriff.

  224. 224.

    Bill Arnold

    @Kay:

    Now we’ll be treated to two weeks of lectures on how Joe Biden is “afraid” to “debate” Donald Trump on the Trump fan show by the cancel culture crowd.

    Somebody should half-seriously propose a debate moderated by Daniel Dale, or somebody else with no tolerance for bullshit and with a quick mind.

  228. 228.

    Mart

    My buddies parents who learned they no longer owned their farm in WA after being released from the concentration camps, had to reinvent their lives. They moved across the country to find work losing contact with their family and community. They were attacked by several neighbors after they received their $20K each in reparations from the Reagan administration. If those neighbors are still alive, they are Trumpers.

  229. 229.

    Captain C

    @OGLiberal: He has the appearance of being a rich asshole who says what’s on his mind, has lots of power, shits on the libs, and gets laid by whatever women he wants, when he wants.  That’s all they care about.

  230. 230.

    J R in WV

    @frosty:

    @OzarkHillbilly: Really good book but, um, light reading it’s not. So far there’s no government program to cause a famine and starve millions of us. Is there?

    (Yes my snarkometer is calibrated and I understand your premise.)

    No famine, so far! This dictatorship intends to use a plague to accomplish the same goals, though… so no big difference so far as I can see.

    Plus, if there is still food on the shelves, but you have ZERO money left from the pandemic, is that a famine or unlucky economic consequences?

  231. 231.

    ballerat

    @Elizabelle: Uh huh, indeed. He needed the 11 hours to sober up.

    He figured his chances were better to show up the next day sober, “find” the guy he hit the night before and then call it in.

    It’s been done before.

    I wonder what the Sheriff will ask the AG for in return? Nothing that will bend the arc of the moral universe toward justice, I’m sure.

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