You lost your freedom because President Trump didn't act. #BidenTownHall pic.twitter.com/wOOeSSNmH6
— Joe Biden (@JoeBiden) September 18, 2020
Watching Biden and CNN and Trump on twitter, I can see why Trump gets confused and thinks Biden is already president.
— Adam Parkhomenko (@AdamParkhomenko) September 18, 2020
Biden: "Guys like me, the first in my family to go to college… we are as good as anybody else, and guys like Trump, who inherited everything and squandered what they inherited, are the people I've always had a problem with"
— Charlotte Alter (@CharlotteAlter) September 18, 2020
I switched over to the Biden town hall and in the first 60 seconds he’s displayed more empathy than Trump could muster in his entire town hall earlier this week.
— Daniel W. Drezner (@dandrezner) September 18, 2020
Great answer here: asked what he expects in the days after election day, Biden smiles and says: if the president were confident in the outcome of any of this he wouldn’t be doing the things he’s doing.
— Tom Nichols (@RadioFreeTom) September 18, 2020
In the first moments, the contrast between what Trump was asked and what Biden is being asked is striking.
— Jeff Greenfield (@greenfield64) September 18, 2020
Asked about whether he’s worried about the breakdown of law and order, Biden pivots away from that to say he’s more worried about the president preaching hate and division. Now tearing into Trump for militarizing domestic unrest.
— Tom Nichols (@RadioFreeTom) September 18, 2020
Biden, in an embarrassing senior moment, recites the divergent biological methods of two possible vaccines (molecular structure versus immune system enhancement) and also details the chemical specifics how they have to be stored and transported.
Awkward!
— Charlotte Alter (@CharlotteAlter) September 18, 2020
Retired police chief asks Biden what he’s gonna do about lack of respect toward the cops. Biden says he condemns violence wherever it comes from. He says he condemns all of it, but it would be nice for the president to condemn the white supremacists and the vigilantes.
— Tom Nichols (@RadioFreeTom) September 18, 2020
I just keep laughing myself into a fit the best idea they had against this guy was paint him as senile and out of touch https://t.co/j2Zo4WHw1j
— kilgore trout, non mini-stroke haver (@KT_So_It_Goes) September 18, 2020
Biden laying into Barr here, and I am here for it.
— Tom Nichols (@RadioFreeTom) September 18, 2020
A notable moment from the CNN town hall tonight: a flash of deeply personal anger from VP Biden as he referred to @TheAtlantic story on the president's alleged comments about deceased U.S. veterans.
— Robert Costa (@costareports) September 18, 2020
Biden is implicitly fact checking Trump by…uttering many consecutive coherent sentences, which Trump has repeatedly said Biden cannot do. https://t.co/LzS2Bx7ioq
— Daniel Dale (@ddale8) September 18, 2020
Joe Biden stood on his feet for well over an hour taking questions from normal human beings and answering them like a normal human being. Unlike the president, whose town hall was a fireworks display of sociopathic behavior.
— Tom Nichols (@RadioFreeTom) September 18, 2020
that he consistently avoids getting mired in the lose-lose trap of “what would you specifically do about this sweeping hypothetical” while everyone lurks around waiting to GOTCHA him is pretty strong evidence he’s very good at this https://t.co/njIIEg2WLV
— kilgore trout, non mini-stroke haver (@KT_So_It_Goes) September 18, 2020
his answers haven't been perfect, but i don't expect perfect, and he's done a pretty good job pivoting back to the ways in which trump is directly and indirectly responsible for so much of it.
— golikehellmachine (@golikehellmachi) September 18, 2020
Elsewhere:
Oh I'm not discouraged at all, just not doing a live-tweet tonight, so assuring you that you're not missing some brand new explanation of how Trump is being dishonest. https://t.co/XhwhgTqDlb
— Daniel Dale (@ddale8) September 18, 2020
No mandate, no problem
frosty
Thanks AL! You read Twitter I don’t have to. I’m grateful you can keep up!
bemused
I’m dreading superspreader, maskless trump aiport rally in Bemidji, MN, population 15,000, later today. I’m imagining all the MN trump idiots will travel there as estimated 5,000 maskless did in Mosinee, WI, pop 4,000.
germy
germy
JPL
— Adam Parkhomenko ? ? ? ???
@bemused: Just be careful the next several weeks.
germy
Jeffro
This is a winning argument!
This too. Just the ‘being coherent’ part is plenty. =)
Cheryl Rofer
Joe Biden has been a politician for 50 years. He was a senator for many of those years, and he took on some of the more intellectually demanding Senate jobs, like chair of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee back when the Senate actually did work.
He knows enough to prepare for something like the townhall or debates.
It’s an indication of how far the media have normalized Trump that they find Biden’s ability to address and answer questions remarkable. And to change the subject when appropriate.
Baud
I expect perfect. I’m voting for Kanye!
Jeffro
@germy: Greenfield might be the original and best David Broder of Chris Cillizzas LOL
(heading over to Twitter to give Holzer some props… =)
Betty Cracker
Smart framing here from Biden:
Maybe this will resonate with undecided voters because Trump crows about the stock market nonstop and insists that “everyone” owns stock when lots of people (about half) do not. It’s also clear to all but the brain dead that Trump downplayed the pandemic so as not to spook Wall Street. But a Venn diagram of the “brain dead” and “undecided voters” would be a circle, so we’ll see.
I usually get annoyed when Biden talks about bipartisanship and insists he’ll be able to work with Republicans. He did that again last night. But the entire Biden candidacy is a bet that Biden-style politics can not only beat Trump but beat him soundly by not frightening off white people who aren’t highly partisan Democrats. Okay then, since that’s the consensus, let’s go with that.
Chief Oshkosh
Greenfield (and most of ’em) are just do goddamned mediocre. Has the guy EVER expressed an original thought?
germy
@Chief Oshkosh:
I’m so old I remember when Jeff Greenfield had shoulder-length hair and wrote for the National Lampoon. I’d see him on TV all the time and wonder “What’s so special about this guy?”
Ambitious, mediocre guys frequently get the most attention.
Baud
@Betty Cracker:
In 2016, we nominated the person the Republicans hate the most in the history of the world and that didn’t work out for us. I’m willing to try anything.
UncleEbeneezer
Oh FFS…this shit drives me absolutely BONKERS! You wanna make an argument that we need to pay police better or give them better benefits packages, fine we can have that debate, but this endless RESPECT MY AUTHORITAH bullshit really shows just how little so many police officers care about the actual ramifications of their actions. They ALWAYS pivot back to their precious feelings. It’s fucking gross and I really wish people would start immediately calling bullshit not it.
Johnnybuck
@Betty Cracker: it’s annoying and as long as Mitch is the Republican leader, it aint gonna happen.
That being said, an awfully lot of them are up for re-election in ’22, if (and it’s a big if) The democrats can pick up 5 or 6 seats this year there might be some pressure on incumbents to look across the aisle. Eh.. who am I kidding.
Betty Cracker
@Baud: This is true. I despise the idea of allowing GOP lunacy to have a veto vote in our primaries, but we have a proof point now that the gap between who a candidate actually is vs. the caricature can be a decisive factor, even if that candidate is running against literally the worst fucking person in the country. Lesson learned!
Alison Rose
Would be a great campaign ad to do a back-and-forth montage of clips from both town halls.
“Which of these men sounds like a president, and which one sounds like an idiotic, sociopathic, whiny-ass little bitch?”
They could tweak the wording a bit if needed.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Johnnybuck:
Yup. And the people who have the potential to take Mitch’s fancy office away are more than likely people who are talking a lot about bipartisanship, and will have to talk about it a lot when they run again. It looks like Mark Kelly doesn’t need Cindy McCain’s endorsement, but (assuming she does it) it won’t hurt. Cal Cunningham, Steve Bullock, even Sara Gideon and John Hickenlooper, they’re all running in states that are varying shades of purple. Progressive icon Stacey Abrams as I recall talked a lot about her ability to reach across the aisle in her campaign for the GA gov’s mansion, where I gather she would still like to live.
bemused
@JPL:
Bemidji is a couple of hours away from our area but we know several people who live there. Worried about them (who have been republican voters but been on board with masks from the beginning of pandemic) and virus spreading throughout state. Our state yahoo Republican legislators have been working diligently to strip Gov Walz of emergency powers but thankfully not succeeded yet.
Good news is that polls showing MN voters going for Biden by about 10 points, iirc.
Hoodie
@Betty Cracker: I imagine some of your annoyance came from when Obama repeatedly tried the same tactic and was rebuffed. Sadly, the difference with Biden is that when he reaches out to Republicans and they try what they did to Obama, the reaction of the great unwashed will more likely be “why are you being such assholes to that nice old (white) man?” In other words, Biden may be able to weaponize bipartisanship in a way that was largely unavailable to Obama. Biden knows exactly what he’s doing. It’s a bit of a risk because it could turn off some of the Dem base, but it’s probably worth the risk when you have such a split electorate and, due to the EC, you need to pull in places like WI, PA, MI and MN that have a lot of non-college educated white voters. The other thing it could eventually do is put some Senate GOP incumbents in purple states in a difficult position in 2022.
Uncle Cosmo
This morning I was on a sports site that often shows ads from a RWNJ site called “ConservativeBuzz”. Usually they feature crap like “Should Russia Hoaxer Adam Schiff Resign?” But today, the question was, “Should The Debates Be Cancelled?” Y’think mebbe Uncle Joe’s performance last night has the Trumpsuckers spooked? :^D
WereBear
Our official Fourth Estate is also an infrastructure problem…
OzarkHillbilly
Good thing it was Biden he asked because if he’d asked me that question on national TV I’d have replied, “You reap what you sow, buddy, you reap what you sow.”
SFAW
@Baud:
Poser. Were you serious, you would be voting for
NaderSteinKislyakBernieAOCBernieDOCTOR Jill Stein!JPL
@bemused: If the virus stayed in the republican lane, I wouldn’t mind, but the folks who attend our going into open establishments to spread their germs.
JPL
@Betty Cracker: trump thinks that the stock market is a winning message for him, and Biden is taking that away. smart move
dmsilev
Apparently some of the fever-swamp folks are claiming that Biden got the questions in advance, because it is unpossible that anyone could, you know, actually prepare for one of these events.
geg6
@UncleEbeneezer:
Every fucking word of this!
No one gets my respect if they haven’t earned it (except kids and animals). Most cops haven’t earned it. When they do, they’ll have it.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Hoodie: also, and this is pretty much gut-feeling stuff on my part so FWIW, but I think the even the more conservative Dems in the potential Dem majority are brighter than the likes of Mary Landrieu and even Dorgan and Conrad, who were pretty much Reagan Democrats. Mark Warner can be annoying, but Tim Kaine probably has his seat (in part) because the even more conservative Jim Webb pulled off a fluke win and then found out he hated the Senate. Claire McCaskill, who’s such a hoot to watch on TV now that she’ll never (I gather) face MO voters again, bragged about shrinking the Stimulus in ’09.
Jeffro
@Alison Rose: I’m dyin’… =)
germy
@dmsilev:
Patricia Kayden
Jeffro
Jen Rubin’s morning post at WaPo is a laundry list of reasons shit ain’t going to get any better for trumpov. It’s great! This part in the middle made me laugh out loud
Jeffro
Bwah-ha-hah!
germy
Ken
Sounds perfect to me, but I’ve never been asked to be in a marketing focus group.
bemused
@JPL:
Exactly.
Betty Cracker
@Hoodie: My annoyance is mostly rooted in my belief that the modern Republican Party is a batshit insane and evil threat to the future of U.S. democracy rather than holdover irritation at how they stymied President Obama at every turn (for the same reason). But I agree with your point about the appeal of “bipartisanship” as a concept among Midwestern white voters.
The idea that politicians need to just roll up their sleeves and work together is a strong delusion among white seniors in Florida too. Now, I suck at political prognostication so much that I should shut up about it forever.
That said, I’m starting to think it’s possible Biden will over-perform with Florida seniors to such an extent that it will end the Trump presidency and preemptively render ridiculous any screeching about FRAUD from the Trump camp. And that probably wouldn’t be possible if any of the primary candidates I preferred over Biden (which was most of them) were the nominee.
bluefoot
@UncleEbeneezer: There’s this interesting disjunction with the word “respect.” When POC say they (we) want to be treated with respect, we mean we want to be treated like human beings. When cops say they need to be treated with respect, they mean everyone needs to be subservient to them.
Hoppie
@germy: The Village Media Idiots are being idiots. Because that’s what they do! Duh!
Baud
Re: the cop, the nice part of that exchange is that Biden remembered meeting the guy before.
JPL
@Patricia Kayden: Will they be allowed to fix them?
Gin & Tonic
@Baud: Unpossible. I’m told he’s senile.
Lacuna-Synecdoche
Republican Anti-Masker Cows Retail Employee Making $11.58/hr (As of 9/11/2020).
Via Stewart Stevens on Twitter:
bemused
@JPL:
MN has a mask mandate but no doubt trumpers will belligerently defy that at rally. Bemidji police and city leaders will have their hands full dealing with them even though Gov Walz said rally must adhere to state distancing, mask guidelines.
Duluth News Tribune reported several progressive protest groups will be there and paper will live stream the rally set to start at 6pm central.
SFAW
@Patricia Kayden:
Well, that’s probably because they’re all ex-felons who didn’t pay the Florida court (and associated) costs.
It would have surprised me not one iota if the FL “let’s re-disenfranchise as many darkies as we can” law included clauses stating something like “and this applies to all them coloreds in other states who have ever (a) lived in Florida, (b) driven through Florida, (c) thought about doing either (a) or (b), (d) seen Florida on a map, or (e) heard or seen the word ‘Florida’ ever in their life.”
I hope we take back the Senate, and pass a Universal Voting Rights Act. [I would also like it if that Act included a section or two devoted to disenfranchising Rethug voters, but that’s because I’m a punitive mofo.]
JPL
@bemused: As much as I believe in the right to protest, progressive groups are playing into trump’s hand. It will only garner more attention for him. It’s best to ignore.
West of the Rockies
@UncleEbeneezer:
I was thinking about law enforcement last night. For some departments, you won’t rise above a certain rank without a college degree (for instance, an MA to become a captain).
But there are a lot of officers and deputies who have just an AA or only went through the academy. Maybe we should make the job require a BA and mandate that classes from psychology and social sciences be part of the credits. Maybe there should be federally-mandated professional development requirements as well (as there are for doctors and therapists), and not just in firearms and chokeholds. Maybe there should also be a second language requirement.
The job pays well in many places. Let’s start requiring more from police than a shaved head and machismo.
chopper
@Betty Cracker:
it should resonate with people, that trump cares more about the dow breaking 30 thousand than the deaths of 300 thousand.
germy
@West of the Rockies: Those requirements might discourage some of the white supremacists who’ve been signing up.
bemused
@JPL:
It’s a worry. It gets dark earlier now and nothing good happens at protests after dark. I prefer Wah Wah Trombone musicians.
Talk from some groups of reserving as many tickets as possible to lessen trumper numbers but doubt that will have much effect.
Jeffro
@germy: zing! LOVE IT
...now I try to be amused
@Betty Cracker:
As I understand it, the delta in the 2018 wave came from white suburbanites. These are voters who are not suppressed. Seniors are another group that is not suppressed. As you note, the great threat to GOP fuckery comes from voters they haven’t written off as hostile to them.
Hoppie
@UncleEbeneezer: Back in the progressive little town my parents had the sense to raise me, (Yellow Springs OH if you’re asking), they used to advertise police openings in the Saturday Review of Literature. Because, how do you get decent police? Duh!
sanjeevs
https://mobile.twitter.com/MarshallCohen/status/1306961499085209602
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@germy: what happens if you take “the blue states” out of the economy?
Betty Cracker
@Lacuna-Synecdoche: What an asshole! I had to go to Walmart last week, and everyone was wearing masks except this one couple that paraded around glaring at employees and fellow patrons. You could tell they were spoiling for a fight, but everyone ignored them, which is probably the best way to deal with assholes like that.
UncleEbeneezer
@geg6: I was part of a congenial meeting that a few activists had with our new police chief to discuss oversight, brutality and other issues. And I swear one of the first things he said was “you don’t understand how hard our job is and we don’t get enough respect.” I couldn’t roll my eyes hard enough. It’s their go-to response for EVERYTHING.
UncleEbeneezer
@bluefoot: Bingo. This is what makes “Blue Lives Matter” such an offensive and racist slogan/symbol/perspective.
Baud
Last I saw more police were victims of right wing terrorists than left wing radicals.
Eunicecycle
@dmsilev: Geez like it would take a rocket scientist to figure out what people are going to ask.
cmorenc
@Betty Cracker:
Within a week, if that long, after it becomes indisputably apparent from the vote count that Biden has clearly won – there will be a GOP meeting similar to the one attended by McConnell, Gingrich, etc. on the eve of Obama’s incoming presidency, where they plot out a tactical plan to attempt to frustrate the incoming Biden Admin at every possible turn and make his presidency a failure. Expect also a faux-grass roots revival of some reincarnated version of the Tea Party.
...now I try to be amused
@UncleEbeneezer:
When I watched Adam-12 as a kid, before I learned that Jack Webb was making propaganda for the LAPD, one thing in it stuck in my memory: cops were supposed to expect disrespect. When authority tells people they can’t do this, people get pissed off. Cops were supposed to keep cool in the face of it.
Barbara
@UncleEbeneezer: This drives me crazy too. I used to wait tables, a long time ago now, so I am aware how ungrateful and dismissive the general public can be. And the thing is, even though MOST people are polite and kind, even when they have complaints, the ones who aren’t really stay with you. You don’t exactly get used to it, but you try very hard to tune it out insofar as it affects the job you are trying to do, and not take it personally. If you can’t, you will either quit or be fired because your employer can’t afford to have surly wait staff insulting the customers.
I stress this because “lack of respect” is part and parcel of every public facing job that requires continuing interaction with individual members of the public. Now imagine what that’s like when the person doing their job has the power of arrest. Seriously, police need to go through training that stresses that their job is not unique in this regard and they cannot, cannot take someone else’s bad day personally.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@UncleEbeneezer: to join two strands of the thread, I haven’t seen it in a while but about month back on twitter there were lots of pictures of NYPD officers going maskless on the subway, in Dunkin Donuts, in a convenience store… several of them had that little “Watcha gonna do about it?” smirk on their mugs. I’d bet that if municipal police aren’t the trumpiest demographic, they’re up there.
Ruckus
@Betty Cracker:
I’m not all that sold on working with rethuglicans either but….
They make up a significant part of the country and of congress, OK, hopefully no more than a significant part of the senate. For now. Rethuglican “ideals” are shit, as are the holders of those “ideals,” but they are citizens. Yes they have pretty much thrown away any right to respect, but. They still live here and even if they fight tooth and nail to fuck themselves in the name of racism and white stupidity they have the same rights as everyone else. Now if we could get them to understand that, we’d all be far better off. My point is that Joe is at least attempting to recognize that they are citizens, even as they try to elevate themselves above the primordial ooze that they live in.
Lacuna-Synecdoche
@Betty Cracker:
I’m not sure it is the best way. Like the asshole I quoted, if they’re not challenged, many of these anti-maskers will just brag about how they courageously cowed low-paid retail employees.
So, I’m thinking that maybe not responding to these anti-masker resent-o-philes is not the best response. Instead, maybe we should be giving them the beat-downs they deserve.
If only we could get cops to treat white antimaskers in Walmart the same way they treat a black man looking at a BB gun.
Ruckus
@Baud:
And said person actually won the popular vote. Just because we have an antiquated electoral system that doesn’t always reflect the will of the majority……..
Gin & Tonic
How do they know the race of the person who submitted a mail-in ballot?
RobertB
@Lacuna-Synecdoche: The Wal-Mart closest to our house has a security guard at the door, and you have to enter at that single entrance. The security guard I saw wasn’t armed and wasn’t the biggest scariest bouncer ever, but I bet he’d have been enough to keep Billy Badass from blowing past the door greeter.
PenAndKey
That second video in the post, at about the 0:40 mark, says it all: “Who the hell makes you think I have to have a Ivy League degree to be president?” And if you pay attention, it’s obvious he wanted to end that statement with, “dammit”. He’s openly, and not entirely politely, dismissive of the idea that someone who was looked down on as a yokel from a dying machinist town could grow up, go to a non-Ivy school, and be president.
This is the guy the GOP is trying to convince is an elitist. Just… uh huh, real elitist there. The guy talks like he’s trying to keep it clean around his grandma, or like every factory grunt I’ve ever worked beside. Hell, much to my wife’s chagrin he talks the way I do. I know it’s a silly thing to be impressed by, but it’s what makes me roll my eyes every time one of the trust fund brats is on Fox claiming to represent the “average American”.
patrick II
@Gin & Tonic:
The people counting the votes would go by name and address. DeShawn would be more likely to be rejected than John. And, of course, they know the neighborhoods. It’s not 100%, but as a rough sreen, it would work.
When Barr says mail-in votes aren’t trustworthy, this is what he is talking about. //
bemused
@Betty Cracker:
What are they, 5 year olds? Our 4 year old grandson is more mature and actually understands why we wear masks, distance and washing hands.
RobertB
@Gin & Tonic: You could do it by zip codes and demographic data.
In fact, I bet some half-smart person at Trump Campaign Central is doing just that. My neighborhood runs about 60-70% Republican Party (I canvassed here for Hillary in 2016) and I get Trump crap in the mail. I’m kind of glad, because if they want to waste their money they can go right ahead, but I wondered why they bother sending anything to registered Democrats.
Ruckus
@dmsilev:
So his supporters are as fucking stupid as the mango menace. Always thought so, but it’s really not all that comforting to know for sure……
Baud
@Ruckus: I know. But we have to deal with the same antiquated system this year.
Betty Cracker
@Ruckus: I get that, and one line Biden often repeats that strikes me as an effective “bipartisan” message is that he’s a Democrat, but if he wins, he’ll serve all Americans as their president. I think that could resonate with squishy Republican leaning center-right people because it’s a stark contrast to Trump’s shocking rhetoric about “Democrat-run” cities and states, which make his contempt for anyone who’s not a supporter clear. Even shitty Republican presidents didn’t used to talk that way, and good for Biden for drawing that contrast.
I’m fine with pretending that a unity scenario is possible to eject the monster from the White House and defeat as many of his minions as humanly possible. But eventually, that rotten party needs to face a reckoning, and maybe pretending that it’s a normal institution and welcoming Trump’s vile enablers back to the table as prodigal sons delays that reckoning.
germy
Ruckus
@Hoppie:
Is the old trope about journalism that it was the easiest subject in college and that’s why a lot of them ended up there still have a smidgen of truth to it?
Baud
StringOnAStick
@UncleEbeneezer: Agreed. My late BIL was cop-adjacent and the longer he was in that position, the more he drifted towards authoritarianism. Even his posture became more macho.
The drum we need to be beating is ‘police reform’, not ‘defund’, and my view of reform includes making the judgements against them come out of their pension funds, along with all the other required reforms that our side has been discussing. The did that left is going to demand Joe say “defund” in order to earn their precious vote, and will once again prove that they care about purity and words more than actual results, especially if they can’t have exactly and completely what they demand.
Ken
@Lacuna-Synecdoche: Maybe if some other customers handled it. You know, tase them, and while they’re out super-glue a mask on their face.
That may seem a little extreme, but I’m inspired by this xkcd.
trollhattan
I want to marry this Tweet.
Sloane Ranger
I love the snark here. Brilliant!
Dorothy A. Winsor
@UncleEbeneezer: That is a really good point. As long as the conversation is about “respect,” you can’t do much. It’s like a report recommending that employees just behave better. I used to tell my students that didn’t count as a recommendation. You needed to be able to measure what you were trying to change.
gene108
@Patricia Kayden:
From the 538 link in the tweet:
States can very simply put up a video of someone filling in a sample ballot, so people know what they are doing.
People learn DIY things from home renovation to car repair from YouTube videos all the time.
This should be a very basic thing to do these days to help people fill in standard forms correctly.
trollhattan
@StringOnAStick:
If they actively weed out the bad actors instead of firewalling the department as a whole from criticism and oversight, they’ll all be safer and will have better community relations.
Ruckus
@West of the Rockies:
I had a friend who became a cop after a pretty decent education and he wasn’t any better than your standard cop. I know, I did a ride along with him. Once. Last time I saw him or talked to him, over 50 yrs ago. Another friend did 30 yrs as a CHP and he’s far more liberal today than he was when he started. I think there may be more at work here than just a college education. Quite possibly a lot of not good on the job mis-training.
debbie
I do like Joe’s responses in these tweets, especially their sharpness and directness, but I wish he’d responded to the retired police chief by pointing out the lack of respect cops have shown toward citizens.
tjmn
@bemused: My go to for any political super spreader event is “lucky bastards.” I was born in Bemidji. It is a wonderful town. If everyone listened to our esteemed governor about masks, we wouldn’t be where we are with COVID-19 right now.
We were downtown Minneapolis the night Der Hairenfurher gave a campaign rally in 2016. People coming out of the rally did not look happy or were in shell shock.
My husband retired from the Navy in 2015 after 30 years. He is so happy that President Obama sent him a congratulatory letter. If it would have been sent from trump, he would have burned it.
hitchhiker
@Betty Cracker:
That reminds me hard of the need for Obama to be the “not at all scary” black guy in order for white people to give him a shot.
What followed (8 straight years of nonstop obstruction) is why we all get the heebie jeebies when we see Biden doing it.
I have to believe he’s learned.
trollhattan
@PenAndKey:
St Ronaldus of Clan Reagan had a BA from Eureka College. His worshipers seem just fine with that humble CV.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@Baud: Biden story: A friend lived in Delaware for years before moving to Montana. When Biden was in Montana for some reason, they went to his event. He talked to one of their neighbors first and the neighbor asked if he’d seen them yet, adding that my friends had met him in Delaware. So when he finally did talk to my friends, he said, “Oh yeah, I met you at…”
The man is a good politician.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@StringOnAStick: the purity left and their “you WILL bend the knee!” rhetoric always remind me of a line from a French movie I saw (and hated) in college, Vagabond, about a young woman determined to live on the margins of society (very much shorthanded). Anyway, another character says of her (roughly, it’s been about thirty years) “By insisting on her own uselessness, she affirms the values of the society she claims to undermine”.
The more the Ryan Knights and Nina Turners shriek that they will never vote for Joe Biden, especially never if he refuses to adopt our maximalist slogans I mean positions which are righteously unpopular, the more he’s going to think, “well, these suburbanites who vote in every election just want me to not be trump, which is a lot easier, so…”
Baud
@hitchhiker:
Why do you think there would have been less obstruction if Obama had adopted a more aggressive stance?
Ruckus
@Eunicecycle:
trump is more like rocket exhaust than rocket scientist. All hot air.
bemused
@tjmn:
The people leaving 2016 rally looking shell shocked is interesting. Can you elaborate, hear any comments from those folks?
debbie
@Betty Cracker:
Biden needs to point out how Trump would roll right over his supporters to keep himself afloat. He should remind everyone of Trump’s multiple bankruptcies and ask how many of his supporters would not get paid for their services in the settlements?
Dorothy A. Winsor
@Lacuna-Synecdoche: I want store managers to get on the PA and warn everyone else that someone has entered the store unmasked and everyone else should stay away. The announcements should follow the creep around the store. I hope it would embarrass them, but if it doesn’t, at least other people have a fighting chance to avoid them.
Ruckus
@Barbara:
Part of my job in professional sports was dealing with – the people. You are absolutely correct, most people are reasonable, within a normal range. There is a segment that is anything but reasonable and it’s not an insignificant percent. And a lot of those interactions stick in your mind, because they are so far from normal.
gene108
@UncleEbeneezer:
My mind compares cops to public school teachers. I think, “what would happen, if a public school teacher screwed up on the job like a cop?”.
They both work for the same or similar local government.
For example, a teacher does something, a student gets hurt, and the municipality (i.e. taxpayers) ends up paying a $12* million dollar settlement, because of it. What would the reaction be for public school teachers over all from the media to the public to politicians?
I think part of the reason cops get away with so much misconduct versus teachers is male privilege.
Teaching is a largely woman dominated field, whereas policing is male dominated. Women saying, they demand respect because they have a critical and yet difficult job gets blown off about them being whiny and ungrateful, because they “only work” nine months out of the year.
There’s an inherent deference shown towards male dominated professions, whether it’s policing to coal mining, in terms of the amount of national attention they get.
* I think this is what Louisville agreed to pay to Breonna Taylor’s family.
tjmn
@bemused: No, it was a very subdued atmosphere in the Skyway coming out of Target Center. it was very quiet. I could see it in the eyes. No doubt all those people still voted for the jackass-in-chief.
West of the Rockies
@germy:
Boo-fucking-hoo.
White supremacists would haz a sad!
Ruckus
@Gin & Tonic:
Their address?
debbie
@Ruckus:
Also, their precincts and other voter information.
Jeffro
@Dorothy A. Winsor: Wow…Delaware to Montana is one heck of a transition!
The Fro family enjoyed many years in DE, but it was good to come back home to VA several years ago.
Lacuna-Synecdoche
@Ken:
In response to someone indiscriminitely threatening the life of every passer-by?
No, I don’t think it’s extreme at all.
StringOnAStick
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Exactly so.
I’ve mentioned before that I used to be friends with a far lefty that I originally had just assumed to be very liberal. Then he told me he’s vowed decades ago to never vote for another D and how excited he was to vote R because Sarah Palin was sure to bring about the downfall of capitalism sooner. I started edging away but not until I’d sent an email in response to his, explaining how every member of my Jewish husband’s family had been lined up and shot on a single day in 1944, except for the teen who’d been in the woods trying to find food for the family. When he later tried to convince me that the Mens Rights movement was about freeing everyone from gender roles, I ended all contact. I guarantee you he’s voting for Cheatolini, because anarchy is his goal.
West of the Rockies
@cmorenc:
Mtea party! Serves both as “empty” and “mentally taxed enough already”.
Ruckus
@bemused:
The maturity of a 5 yr old? You give them far too much credit. They have no maturity whatsoever. They have bluster and bullshit. That’s gotten them through life because most people don’t want to waste the time to put up with them or educate them. They make it to middle age without maturity, they aren’t going to get any, any time soon because that wake up call is a lot different than learning it a bit at a time as a child.
Ruckus
@Baud:
So we have to do what it always takes, overwhelming numbers.
One I really want to win is Amy McGrath. I want that turtle to be kicked down the road, far and hard.
Oklahomo
@Baud: My absentee ballot came in the mail yesterday, and sure enough, Kanye is on it. In Oklahoma. Because Trump surely needs to pull votes from Biden in Oklahoma.
West of the Rockies
@Lacuna-Synecdoche:
“… A black man looking at a BB gun…” Or a bag of Skittles?
Jeffro
Here’s a good one from Max Boot: the longer trumpov stays in office, the crazier the GOP becomes
duh! ;)
bemused
@tjmn:
No surprise to this day, most of them would still eat a shit sandwich and vote for him.
Ruckus
@Betty Cracker:
It’s a fine line for sure. And one an older savvy politician will know quite easily. It’s probably one of Joe’s strong points. I’m like you, I don’t want it to be his only point. We can’t keep going in the direction we’ve been going for the last 40-50 yrs, one step forward, two steps back into the monarchy. Hell, even the monarchy has changed, of course the island is still fucked but at least they may be beginning to understand why. We seem to have. Of course we had to hit rock bottom and not everyone has figured it out. As it always is.
The Moar You Know
@Gin & Tonic: 1st clue: address it was mailed from. Neighborhoods are still extremely segregated in the Carolinas (and most of the South) 2nd: name. I bet I could get 80% right off the bat with just those two data points.
Baud
@Ruckus:
Not looking so great for Amy. If she wins, it’ll mean we’ll have had a historic rout of the GOP.
tjmn
@bemused: Sheeple is very apropos.
A Ghost to Most
@Jeffro: The base was already crazier than shit house rats. t* jumped in front of the parade, and he and the Gang of Pricks are determined to stay there. Too deep in now to stop.
If we get past this, Tom Cotton will lead the rat parade. They aren’t going away.
the pollyanna from hell
@Baud: “less obstruction… Obama… more aggressive stance.”
I would have liked more “Mitch, you said me one term” so I could feel less stupid on Obama’s behalf. Disarming obstruction never seemed possible to me, I looked for leverage found, leverage used. Instead of polite lies about ideal comity I prefer honest praise of ambiguous or savage virtues. Why am not politician, but that’s my vote.
I approve aspirational preaching about ideal comity, but not without realism.
bemused
@Ruckus:
Yup. Kind of reminds me of some alcoholics I knew that drank for decades and then quit drinking for good. Their personalities didn’t change completely for the better. One thought I had was that they lost decades in a drunken stupor and now sober were very behind in maturing and reasoning.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
You’re overthinking it, from the beginning the police were meant to be the Rich people’s street gang.
West of the Rockies
@germy:
Oh, man… I don’t want to cancel Moon Dance and Brown-Eyed Girl, but do shut up, Van.
Ken
@Oklahomo: I’ve seen speculation that Kanye may pull more votes from Trump than Biden, since K&T appeal to the same insane demographic.
evodevo
@Ruckus: It was either that or phys ed lol
frosty
@trollhattan: True. But we can’t even get doctors to weed out the bad ones. It’s all tribal.
hitchhiker
@Baud:
I don’t. I think Obama went out of his way during the campaign to not be seen as scary, and that was followed by years and years of good faith efforts to work with Republicans, all of which were rebuffed — even, for chrissake, when the whole economy had crashed.
I was trying to say that Obama (and now Biden, for different reasons) campaigned with an open posture. I don’t think Biden has illusion that the Rs have changed. They’ll see the whole country burn before they let and Democrat get credit for doing something right.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@the pollyanna from hell:
: blinks :
what?
The Moar You Know
@germy: I go fucking ballistic over the “stick to the singing” bullshit thrown at artists no matter what their politics. If Van Morrison wants to show us his ass, I am all for it. The guy has a reputation in the industry I’d like a lot more people to know about, and this seems like a great introduction to it.
Maybe him and Nuge can do a concept album about how awesome underage girls are. Right in their fucking wheelhouse. And maybe one day people will stop requesting “Brown Eyed Girl”. A musician can dream.
Ruckus
@Baud:
I’m OK with historic rout. I might even have a toast.
Not liquor, actual toast……
Jim, Foolish Literalist
I knew he was an increasingly surly old crank, to put it kindly. I did not know about underage girls.
Oklahomo
@Ken: Good. that was my suspicion, although we have a high ration of the Q-volk here. Down in good old Poteau, OK a few weeks ago there was a “Save the Children” March and a lot of signs were crazy stuff about protecting children from Joe Biden. Idiots.
Ruckus
@Oklahomo:
Just like their “leader” it’s projection all the way.
Baud
@hitchhiker: Well, after 2010, he had no choice but to try to work with Republicans.
hitchhiker
@The Moar You Know:
musician’s wife laughs softly.
bluefoot
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: last summer I got on the T in Boston and two cops were in their summer uniforms (short sleeves). Both had white supremacist and Nazi tattoos on their upper arms – 88 in gothic lettering, SS symbol, etc. also one was carrying a bag w one of those blue line flags. No wonder the train car was so empty…
I didn’t check to see from which city they were as I was trying to stay as far as possible once I noticed the ink.
Kent
I’m a big enough asshole that I would spray mace in the face of someone like that if they got close to me and then say….too bad you didn’t have a mask on
I mean I don’t actually carry mace with me. But I’ve thought about it. You gonna spew covid at me I’m gonna protect myself.
Ken
@Oklahomo: I sometimes worry that some fraction of the Q-volk will pull a Jonestown when Trump loses.
cain
@OzarkHillbilly:
Mine would have been along the lines of respect is earned – it takes giving respect to earn respect and you have shown that poorly. 7 shots in the back to a man walking to his car? Cowards.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Baud: and before, no choice but to work with energy lobbyist Mary Landrieu, young-earthen Mark Pryor, deficit-hawk (feel free to imagine sarcasm font) Byron Dorgan, Reaganite Jim Webb, and Chuck Grassley’s cribbage buddy Max Baucus. And the spite-troll from Hartford.
I think if I sat down and thought about it, I could get this list up to twenty.
cain
@JPL:
We should insist that they wear their Trump regalia. That way we know how to avoid them. They are proud too and we should encourage it as much as possible.
Kathleen
@cmorenc: Not saying they won’t but it may not get the same traction. I believe Tea Party and obstruction were targeting a Black President. That hatred fueled the hysterical response to Obama and Democrats.
Kent
Exactly. Also remember these are local county elections workers doing signature screening who are probably older and have lived there their whole lives. They *KNOW*.
Geminid
The main utility of Kanye West’s candidacy is as a fulcrum to leverage anti-Biden propaganda in social media. He is a clown, but bad actors foreign and domestic can use him dirty Biden, talk people into staying home.
Dopey-o
The onset of drink / drug abuse is often accompanied by a shutdown of personality development. AA literature refers to this as “the wreckage of our past.” Another quote says the problem now is not alcohol, it’s that we don’t know how to live.
i have met some recovering drunks who really could have benefited from a drink.
cain
@West of the Rockies:
This isn’t a good idea – you would close off a lot of non-white applicants and we definitely want to see diversity in the police force. Because of white supremacy – a lot of black and latinx folks dont have the resources to attend college.
We’ll need to find other ways to find better candidates. A tougher entrance exam would be a good thing and a psych eval as well.
cain
@…now I try to be amused:
Both groups are some of the most entitled. They would be pretty angry and it would isolate the republican party further if they tried to fuck with the polls universally because they’ve managed to get everyone angry.
James E Powell
@Kathleen:
And – hateful though he is – McConnell was smart enough to realize that the Republicans in 2009 were at a tipping point. If they went along with Obama and helped him to be successful, they had no chance of a comeback from the disasters of the Bush/Cheney years.
He knew the Republicans’ racist base voters would go along with anything he did, no matter how stupid or counter-productive, as long as they were against that ni-clang! So he had to fan the flames of racist animus. They had nothing else.
cain
They don’t control the party anymore – Trump does. As more Qanon folks get elected into congress – that scenario will be even harder as those assholes will turn on the regular GOP by trying to elect more of their own Qanon people.
the pollyanna from hell
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: If someone says he is my enemy, I would acknowledge it, even if I kept asking, I wonder how we ought to work together?
geg6
@Ken:
Well, although I don’t worry about it at all, I am rather hoping for it.
Kent
What’s wrong with “Brown Eyed Girl”? It is vaguely pedo or something? Or is just too overplayed like Freebird, Sweet Home Alabama, Mustang Sally, etc.
Miss Bianca
@Cheryl Rofer: So, I was riding my horse this morning, and I overheard the roofers working on the house at the property talking about some townhall being “scripted”, and it suddenly occurred to me: Oh, *this* must be the new pivot-to talking point in RW media: that somehow Biden’s entire townhall had been staged and that he had memorized or read off a teleprompter all his answers. Because, of course, you know, he sounded like he knew what he was talking about.
And then I thought: OK, so are they trying to have it both ways now: that somehow Biden is both senile AND “with it” enough to follow a script?
And all this from overhearing a scrap of conversation imperfectly. I hate that conspiracy theories have penetrated the media and popular culture enough that I can make a reasonable *GUESS* as to which the latest ones are going to be.
James E Powell
@Betty Cracker:
I infer from Trump’s aid to Puerto Rico that his internals show him losing Florida. I keep reading that Biden’s campaign in Florida is bad, is rife with dissension, and is not reaching out to Latinos. None of the articles I’ve seen distinguish the various groups of people who are aggregated in “Latinos” and I don’t know how accurate it is. There was a wave of “How Biden can lose” articles over the last week or so.
cain
@Jeffro:
You can thank Facebook for that. At least on Twitter they are banning Qanon – but that assclown at FB apparently still wants his libertarian paradise. But FB algorithms are turning Republicans into crazy town.
catclub
@Patricia Kayden: The key question is: Are the disqualifications for valid reasons? Are they missing the correct signatures, etc?
I have posted before that in our county it seemed like over 50% of mail in ballots were disqualified. because you have to read the instructions and follow them AND you need to get signatures notarized AND the signature has to match. It is HARD. Other states are far more generous.
another question: can you check if your vote is counted or rejected?
can you fix it? If your vote is rejected by mail in, can you then vote in person?
sdhays
He also respects the people watching and cares about communicating what he knows and wants to do effectively. Just on a basic level, he doesn’t want to waste people’s time. Dump doesn’t care about the audience at all, beyond what they can do for him, of course.
ETA: He’s been a politician for 50 years because he has a passion for public policy and making a difference in people’s lives. His political career isn’t a vanity grifting project gone too successful for its own good.
catclub
From that one woman who spoke up, if they do, they will also kill a lot of innocent kids along with themselves.
What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?
@Hoppie: I went to Wittenberg University in nearby Springfield. Visited Yellow Springs fairly regularly back in the day, and my girlfriend at the time had a job waiting tables at Ha Ha Pizza. It was a groovy little place.
MoCA Ace
My mom always said “respect isn’t given, it’s earned”. I’m pretty sure she stole it from every sports coach ever but I’m giving her credit. That should be the standard answer to these winey shits. Clean up your own house and earn back the respect.
geg6
@Kent:
Nothing is wrong with song, per se, but lotsa whispers over the years about Van’s proclivities.
Kent
Remember when the conservative meme was that Obama was not really a good public speaker because he used a teleprompter? The best public speaker we have had since IDK…William Jennings Bryan? There are probably 100 Trump tweets to that effect back in the day.
It’s flop sweat and fodder for the kool aid drinkers.
sdhays
@UncleEbeneezer: Oh, absolutely. If you got into policing in order to be universally loved, you should find another career. If you don’t want to switch careers and also don’t want to be criticized, then maybe take a look at some of the criticism and see what you can do to address it.
MoCA Ace
No, I think you nailed it!
PenAndKey
Mine said it to and now that I’m a dad, so do I. I think it comes with the territory as long as you’re willing to earn your kids respect rather than demand it like they owe it to you by dint of being born.
Pro-tip: based on my single half year of high school football where I told off the head coach for telling my best friend to walk off a severe concussion during practice coaches do not, in fact, like the phrase when they’re not the one saying it.
Kropacetic
Reading from a teleprompter is still a valid skill. You have to be prepared and practiced if you want to deliver well. You need to understand what you’re reading. Trump is proof positive that reading off a teleprompter and coming across well isn’t easy.
MoCA Ace
@UncleEbeneezer:
I think if you graphed respect for police against the prevalence of cell phone cameras in the US it would be… enlightening.
Eunicecycle
@What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?: I went to Wittenberg, too! What year did you graduate? I am old; I graduated in 1978.
Kropacetic
Authoritarians frequently confuse deference for respect, respect being a more mutualistic posture.
Chyron HR
@Ken:
I hope you can see me shrugging, because I am doing it as hard as I can.
Geeno
Never cared much for Van Morrison anyway. No major sacrifice to lose him.
Miss Bianca
@Ken:
I confess I’ve got to the point where I think, “y’know, whatever it takes to thin that particular herd…”
Yeah, I’m a bad person. So sue me, sue me…
bemused
@cain:
Yes, wear their souvenir trump masks so we know to stay far beyond 6 feet away from those spreaders.
debbie
@Miss Bianca:
And also that at the same time, it’s perfectly acceptable that Trump reads a script from a teleprompter.
Ken
@MoCA Ace: The related XKCD.
debbie
@James E Powell:
I’ve heard a rumor that one of the first things Trump would do if reelected would be to deport all Cubans. I don’t know if that’s BS nonsense or something else.
debbie
@Kent:
I had a roommate who played that album as she fell asleep every goddamn night. I have a visceral hatred for that song. His other stuff is fine, but this song…
catclub
@debbie: I think believing two opposite things is almost a requirement now. Obama had to be both an incompetent affirmative action hire AND a time traveling supervillain. Likewise for Biden now.
catclub
@debbie:
makes as much sense as attacking Iraq after the 911 attacks.
James E Powell
@debbie:
It’s definitely on the Playlist from Hell. Back when I was in bar bands we’d laugh about putting together a set of the most overplayed songs in the history of bar bands. Brown-eyed Girl, What I like about you, etc., finishing with a 20 minute Free Bird.
debbie
@James E Powell:
Or a compilation of the band’s favorite Grateful Dead jams. ?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Didn’t Brown-Eyed Girl get re-released as part of a 90s soundtrack, probably a Julia Roberts movie? I seem to recall it got far too popular again in muddled, twenty-plus-year blink of an eye that is my middle-age. I like it again since I’ve all but given up on terrestrial radio. Mustang Sally has never gotten old. It was only a few years ago I realized Freebird was playing on whatever geezer-rock XM station I have on preset, and instead of lunging to change the station I was singing along. Sweet Home Alabama, I still lunge.
Just One More Canuck
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: He was a surly old crank when he was young.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@debbie: my brother loves that shit. I once had to sit through a Los Lobos cover of Bertha that I swear to god last more than half an hour. Everybody around me seemed to think they left us wanting more.
Ruckus
@James E Powell:
They are nothing else. Racism/hate is their life force.
Betty Cracker
@James E Powell: I had the same thought about the aid to Puerto Rico — they’re panicking. Like you, I am also suspicious about the articles alleging that Biden is fucking up Latino outreach. The Latino vote is incredibly diverse, possibly more so in Florida than any other state, so I’d like to see them define “Latino” before I buy the analysis.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Betty Cracker: Armando, erstwhile front-pager at D-Kos and about whom I had forgotten until stumbling across his twitter feed a couple of months ago, is a Floridian of Latin descent (maybe Cuban? he said once but I forget) who thinks Biden is doing much better in Florida and among Latin voters, including FL Cubans, across the country than polls suggest. And while he is a partisan and I think of the K-Hive, he is a self-described Biden-hater.
Ruckus
@MoCA Ace:
The answer could be –
” Respect is earned.
Why was it either never earned or lost?
What have you done to earn that respect? Demand it or else?
The people don’t work for you, you work for the people, all of the people.
They will respect you when you earn that respect.”
That respect for public employees from the cop on the beat to the president is earned. And is lost far easier than it’s gained. Sports fans expect their heroes to earn respect, why is it that employees that we pay, just like sports heroes, think that respect is automatic?
Ruckus
@Kropacetic:
Yes but trump is an extremely bad example of someone with skill at any task that isn’t illegal and even when illegal he’s not good at it.
He has all the skill of a cold piece of toast. And far less charm.
Hoppie
@Lacuna-Synecdoche:
Oh just wow. My Dad got three purple hearts in that war. He always told me he NEVER wanted any of his kids to go through that.
I loved my dad. He was right.
@StringOnAStick:
Ruckus
@debbie:
You’d like the radio where I work. It’s on the oldie scream rock channel. Same damn songs that were crap when they came out, played the same 70 times a week (10 times a day) with people that talk like the DJs did 50 yrs ago. And the guy that likes it? trumper who stopped any growth at 14 yrs old and hadn’t done a lot before that. He’s in his late 50s now. I’ll give him credit, he did pay support for his 2 illegitimate kids. And yes there was alcohol and drugs involved.
Brachiator
@UncleEbeneezer:
Too goddamn easy.
“We should respect good cops, honest cops, decent cops. We should respect cops who respect the citizens they are sworn to serve.”
Ruckus
@debbie:
Well every thing he does or says is BS nonsense – or worse, so I’d say yes it is.
Betty Cracker
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: You’re right — he’s Cuban-American, and he’s is super bullish on Biden carrying Florida. I’m sure he has better insight into how the campaign is playing in S. FL than I do since he lives down that way.
My sense is that red peril scaremongering works to some extent with Cuban and Venezuelan-Americans but less so with Floridians of Puerto Rican descent, which are emerging as more of a force, especially in the I-4 corridor (Central FL metroplexes around Orlando and Tampa).
Boris Rasputin (the evil twin)
@Ruckus: Sarah Palin’s degree was in sports journalism, awarded after five years and a few colleges. This may help answer your question.
Ghost of Joe Liebling*s Dog
@James E Powell:
I killed a man Bojangles cuz he danced for me
In worn out shoes
I couldn’t take the way he’d make for sympathy
And free shots of booze …
Jay
@Betty Cracker:
I still get asked if masks are mandatory, (they arn’t) in the Store.
I answer, “nope, but you are a sociopathic moron if you arn’t wearing one”,
Mgmt get’s complaints , and now that Mgmt is wearing masks, they do the whole polite “fuck off” thing now.
Had a young “high and wide” ( nazi haircut) dude take offence, last week. He waited outside the store for me to get off shift, came in close and grabbed my mask.
I throat punched him, arm barred him, took him to the ground, then with my free hand called 911 and Mgmt. Had lots of witnesses, coworkers and customers. And video.
Guy faces assault with intent charges three weeks from now. 5 to 7 years.
What Have The Romans Ever Done for Us?
@Eunicecycle: I’m old too, but not as old as you. Class of 1992.
Morzer
@Baud: (Don’t) Go West, young person!
Morzer
@Betty Cracker: The Lincoln project people were talking about the Latino vote in Florida yesterday and they seem to think that it’s going to settle down at the usual 25-26% for the GOP mark.
Morzer
@Morzer:
The Lincoln project people’s discussion of Florida/the Latino vote starts at the 34:27 mark:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tFk9R8BHWHY&feature=youtu.be
Morzer
@Morzer: Their discussion of the Latino vote (complex!) overall starts at 24:54.