Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

This has so much WTF written all over it that it is hard to comprehend.

Republicans don’t want a speaker to lead them; they want a hostage.

Polls are now a reliable indicator of what corporate Republicans want us to think.

The worst democrat is better than the best republican.

Israel, don’t be dumb like we were in the US after 9/11!

Anyone who bans teaching American history has no right to shape America’s future.

A consequence of cucumbers

Let there be snark.

He seems like a smart guy, but JFC, what a dick!

Wow, you are pre-disappointed. How surprising.

It’s a doggy dog world.

This year has been the longest three days of putin’s life.

He really is that stupid.

I wonder if trump will be tried as an adult.

No one could have predicted…

Speaking of republicans, is there a way for a political party to declare intellectual bankruptcy?

We’re not going back!

Many life forms that would benefit from greater intelligence, sadly, do not have it.

I’d hate to be the candidate who lost to this guy.

Bogus polls are all they’ve got left. Let’s bury these fuckers at the polls a year from now.

Usually wrong but never in doubt

Impressively dumb. Congratulations.

They think we are photo bombing their nice little lives.

Ron DeSantis, the grand wizard, oops, governor of FL

You are here: Home / Past Elections / 2020 Elections / And Now a Brief Public Service Announcement From the Director of the FBI, and His Colleagues at the NSA, National Counterintelligence and Security Center, and the Cybersecurity Infrastructure Agency

And Now a Brief Public Service Announcement From the Director of the FBI, and His Colleagues at the NSA, National Counterintelligence and Security Center, and the Cybersecurity Infrastructure Agency

by | 241 Comments

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This will most likely be the final nail in Director Wray’s professional coffin running the FBI if the President is reelection, but this is a very good video that he released earlier today on election security.

Open thread!

Reader Interactions

241Comments

  1. 1.

    jl

    What kind of subtweeting is that? Is there a word for that? (In English, i don’t care about the German mishmash, whatever it is)

    Edit: whatever, good for them. Wray is a top person, we’ve been assured of that from on high.

  4. 4.

    Jeffro

    Translation: “it’s over, trumpov”.  But good job, Deep State, for making a stand here.

    On a side note, the debate commission or whatever has put in the plexiglass shields at all podiums for tomorrow night – Harris’, Pence’s, and the moderator’s.  So I guess the ball is in Pence’s court…will he boldly try to toss his shield aside?  Talk around it?  Also: who cares, these clowns are toast.

  5. 5.

    jl

    Has the production values of a 1970s community college information video. Probably had to write it, shoot it and get it out quick, on the down low. But that is nitpicking.

  6. 6.

    Adam L Silverman

    @Jeffro: Pence is not exactly what you’d call physically robust. He’s not Jared, but he’s soft. I expect if he tried to remove the plexiglass shield the shield would win.

  10. 10.

    sanjeevs

    Are you sure Wray is not doing a Rosenstein or Comey? Say the right things so you can ratfuck better.

  11. 11.

    jl

    I think all debates should be remote from now on.

    @sanjeevs:  Anything that encourages confidence and increases turnout is good, especially this early. So if that is the plan, I don’t think it’s a good one. If they are planning that, it would work better if they kept quiet. Or do one warning against the dangers of rampant, infinite, uncountable, voting fraud

  12. 12.

    Adam L Silverman

    @jl: I wish I could tell you just how bad the production values for the SCI indoctrination video are because it appears to have been filmed while Reagan was still president. But I’m pretty sure I can’t, so I won’t.

  13. 13.

    Scout211

    @Jeffro:

    This from one hour ago:

    https://www.cnn.com/2020/10/06/politics/plexiglass-vp-debate/index.html

    (CNN)The commission organizing general election debates will allow Mike Pence to participate without plexiglass barriers around him at Wednesday’s contest after the vice president’s team objected to their planned use, a member of the debate commission tells CNN. But Kamala Harris and the debate moderator will be allowed to erect barriers separating them from the vice president.

  14. 14.

    HumboldtBlue

    @jl:

    Has the production values of a 1970s community college information video. Probably had to write it, shoot it and get it out quick, on the down low. But that is nitpicking.

    Yes, because the message, no matter how clumsily presented is damn important. I watched these thinking to myself about how far the GOP has dragged us into peril.

  15. 15.

    mali muso

    The past few days have felt like weeks (months?) in terms of breaking news. I’m exhausted. Going to bed and hoping that when I wake up, the country is still standing.

  16. 16.

    Ken

    @jl: Treason is defined in the Constitution, and this doesn’t qualify.  There might be an issue of insubordination, if Trump ever ordered them not to do this.

  17. 17.

    Marcopolo

    Good for Wray, but as Danielx commented, what stops Trump from firing Wray either before or after the election & putting in an acting Director through Jan 20? He won’t give an F about propriety or tradition, he will just want to burn it all down.

  18. 18.

    Emma from FL

    One bedtime snack. I go make my father’s bedtime snack and boom! Another bomb detonated. Is there such a thing as a whole society with PTSD? We’re going to need changes to insurance coverage!

  19. 19.

    jl

    i did not mean to imply that the production values of a 1970s community college information video was a bad thing, said to no one in particular. Spotlights the content.

  20. 20.

    Steeplejack (phone)

    Trump is tripping! Thirty-odd tweets and retweets in the last hour.

    Most are retweets of somebody’s long thread, but still.

  22. 22.

    Rjm

    I can’t understand why Pence wants to sit at the debate rather than stand. Seems very low energy.  Clues?

  23. 23.

    Splitting Image

    @Jeffro:

    Also: who cares, these clowns are toast.

    Trump may be toast, but he can still serve as an anchor to take down a few Senators with him. As far as I can tell, the Democrats can end up with 55 seats if they sweep all of the states which are currently toss-ups, including Kansas, Georgia and South Carolina. If Trump manages to cost his team a few percentage points across the board, people like John Cornyn could go down too.

    Every Senate seat is important from here on out, even if a race looked hopeless a week ago. If Trump keeps up his current pace, he could even save Alabama for the Democrats. Trickster-god willing, he might even cost McConnell his job.

  25. 25.

    Adam L Silverman

    @sanjeevs: I have no specific knowledge other than what has been reported, which is that he has consistently kept his head down, done his job, and when necessary accurately informed Congress  about what is going on. Which is why the President has already let it leak out that he will fire Wray and replace him if he’s reelected.

  27. 27.

    TS (the original)

    Is this new – I’m still reading posts from way back. Doubt I’ll ever catch up with the news today

    The ousted director of the office involved in developing a coronavirus vaccine has now resigned from his post at the National Institutes of Health, charging that the Trump administration “ignores scientific expertise, overrules public health guidance and disrespects career scientists.”
    Rick Bright, who filed an extensive whistleblower complaint this spring alleging that his early warnings about the coronavirus were ignored and that his caution at hydroxychloroquine led to his removal, is exiting the federal government altogether after being “sidelined” at NIH, his attorneys said in a pointed statement released Tuesday.
    “Although not allowed at NIH to utilize his expertise in vaccines or therapeutics, Dr. Bright developed a plan to implement a robust national testing infrastructure, which emphasized the critical need to provide screening tests for asymptomatic individuals and to provide services to underserved populations disproportionately impacted by COVID-19,” Bright’s attorneys, Debra Katz and Lisa Banks, said in a statement.
    “NIH leadership declined to support Dr. Bright’s recommendations because of political considerations, plain and simple. After having his work suppressed for political reasons to the detriment of public health and safety, Dr. Bright was sidelined from doing any further work to combat this deadly virus,” they said.
    “This was the proverbial straw that broke the camel’s back. He can no longer countenance working for an administration that puts politics over science to the great detriment of the American people.”

  28. 28.

    Jeffro

    @Scout211: WaPo’s rolling ‘live updates’ seem to be impossible to link to (at least, to link to just one item) but here’s what they said just a bit ago:

    The Commission on Presidential Debates built a stage Tuesday for the vice-presidential debate in Salt Lake City with plexiglass barriers for both candidates, apparently overruling the objections of Vice President Pence, who had requested that no plexiglass dividers be placed on his side of the stage.

  31. 31.

    dmsilev

    @Scout211: Also from about an hour ago, the Post had this:

    The Commission on Presidential Debates built a stage Tuesday for the vice-presidential debate in Salt Lake City with plexiglass barriers for both candidates, apparently overruling the objections of Vice President Pence, who had requested that no plexiglass dividers be placed on his side of the stage.
    The added protections against the spread of the coronavirus had become a heated point of contention this week, as both campaigns jockey over the threat of covid-19 after President Trump and several campaign and White House advisers tested positive for the virus.

    So, I guess we find out tomorrow?

  37. 37.

    Ken

    @Rjm: I can’t understand why Pence wants to sit at the debate rather than stand. Seems very low energy. Clues?

    (clears throat)

    Don’t you think he looks tired?

  38. 38.

    Jeffro

    @Splitting Image: It’s important to push hard, and then keep pushing even harder, that’s for sure.

    A Reagan/Mondale 1984-scale loss, coupled with loss of their majority in the Senate, and Speaker Pelosi crowing about gaining seats in the House…that’s about as good as it gets in my book.

    I have said it a couple of times but if nothing else, trumpov got this country to move off of its nearly 50-50 divide, that’s for sure.

  39. 39.

    jl

    @Adam L Silverman: Somebody in high levels at FDA promised that they would resign, or throw themselves into the gears, if Trumpsters tried to corrupt the approval process. Is that right?

    If so, any news on that front?

  40. 40.

    Sister Golden Bear

    For those of you looking for a creepy thriller movie for the holidays, a bad-ass friend of mine, Rachel, is in “Smiley Face Killers,” which is be available on streaming Dec. 8. Trailer here.

    She appears briefly at the 1:15 mark, in a scene that she choreographed and rehearsed the other actors. Won her major points with the crew, because the shoot was running late and they only had time to do it in one take. As she tells it, she told the other actress, “Now I’m going to hit you in the head with a (prop) ax, and I need you not to move too much, otherwise I may hit you in the face and it’ll really hurt.”

  41. 41.

    sdhays

    If you want to be cynical, these people can read the writing on the wall that neither Dump nor Dense is not going to be President next year and if they don’t want be fired, they had better be seen doing their actual jobs rather than kissing the ring.

  42. 42.

    jl

    @Ken: Standing puts more demand on brain activity than sitting? Can some neurology maven here do the calculations?

  47. 47.

    Mike S

    It seems like a resignation video. It’s a “fuck these fascist fucks and the traitorous fucks they rode in on” video.

  49. 49.

    Jeffro

    Also WaPo

    The White House offered an informal nod to coronavirus best practices Tuesday, with mask-wearing prevalent after months of flouting public health recommendations and new internal guidelines for interacting with President Trump, who tested positive for the virus late last week.  But the biggest source of resistance appeared to be Trump himself, who, despite having just come home from a three-night hospitalization, was defiant — lobbying to return immediately to work in the Oval Office, discussing an address to the nation as early as Tuesday evening and clamoring to get back on the campaign trail in the coming days.

    So…this is going to keep collapsing around his ears, then.  Good!

    I have no doubt he thinks he was doing totes awesome until he got sideswiped by the ‘China virus’, did absolutely everything a human – nay, a SUPERhuman! – could do, and yet still was betrayed by all the people who wanted to um not die for the stock market.

    “I wasn’t golfing for four, sometimes five days a week!!  What the hell do you want from me, you ungrateful bastards!”

  51. 51.

    jl

    If Kelly confronts McSally by saying that he’s seen with his own eyes that the world is round, would that be a gaffe?

  52. 52.

    Jeffro

    Maybe this was discussed earlier (I know trumpov & Co canceling ads in Ohio was) but apparently he’s canceling ads in Iowa too?  wow.

    Just saw General Hayden’s ‘Republican Voters for Biden’ ad – “Joe Biden is a good man.  Donald Trump is not”.  Wow.

    Also just caught the Lincoln Project’s snark ad comparing trumpov’s WH return and balcony nonsense to ‘Evita’…hysterical!  (catch the coughing at the end ;)

    We got this, people.  Just turn out, turn out, turn. out.

  55. 55.

    Salty Sam

    @mali muso: The past few days have felt like weeks (months?) in terms of breaking news.

    Saw a reference to the impeachment hearings earlier this evening, and was gobsmacked by the realization that THAT WAS LESS THAN TEN MONTHS AGO!

    What is that in dog years?

  58. 58.

    Jeffro

    And now the orange moron is tweeting his brains out about various parts of Covid-19 relief that he INSISTS the House and Senate pass so he can sign, TONIGHT!

    Love it.  Stable (genius) leadership, totally.  Winning votes up and down the heartland.

    ETA he just tweeted that it’s “taking too long” for his just-declassified Russia documents to make it into the ‘discourse’ and result in…um…I guess charges of some kind for all his political opponents?

    I think he’s leaving the WH in a straitjacket

  59. 59.

    TS (the original)

    @WaterGirl:

    I started watching. I have such trouble listening to republicans lie about what they have done & what they will do after the election. I had to tune out.

  60. 60.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Jeffro: Bonus: There was a tweet going around last night that Evita is trump’s favorite show, and he saw it like seven times with Patty Lupone, and Patty Lupone promptly, in so many words, told him to go fuck himself.

    Covita!

  61. 61.

    jl

    @Ken: McSally doesn’t need to be. It might be part of a large discussion of science. My comment was more directed at standard issue media coverage of politics.

  63. 63.

    jl

    @Adam L Silverman: “I know nothing more than anyone else does based on the news.”

    This is supposed to be a full service blog, and the front posters are omniscient. Have I been mislead?

  65. 65.

    Ken

    @gene108: IIRC, the VP debate with Sen. Kaine they were also seated. Know idea why Pence cannot stand and debate.

    I was wondering if he might be afraid of… ahem… showing arousal when looking at Harris.  But if he was seated with Kaine that’s not it.

    Um…. Unless…  No, surely not.

  68. 68.

    TS (the original)

    @WaterGirl:

    They make out they are so reasonable, so honest and will do anything for the people, the country & then go vote 100% opposite – and laugh about it.

  69. 69.

    Jeffro

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: that’s excellent!

     

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: noted at #52 and yup, it was awesome.  They do know how to slip the blade in, these LP folks

    I am weirdly optimistic for the first time in some time.  I mean, I know we have all been watching all year how Biden’s ahead, trumpov can’t get ahold of himself, etc etc, but to see it all play out like this is just amazing.

    HOWEVER

    Nothing is certain, so…we all know the drill!  Vote vote vote!

  70. 70.

    Ken

    @dmsilev: Yeah, it’s only a matter of time before he’s asking if we ever really looked at our palms, man.  Or ordering air strikes on Canada. Whatever.

  71. 71.

    Jeffro

    @dmsilev: everyone around him knew; not one of them stood up and said, “It’s time to hand over power to the Veep, Mr. President*”

    It’s so hard for Republicans to do the right thing, you almost want to gift them all a textbook or self-help book, or something.  They just have no moral compass or sense of responsibility to anyone other than themselves.

    Between the religious nuts, the racists, and the Randians, I hate the Randians the most.

  72. 72.

    Ken

    @jl: This is supposed to be a full service blog, and the front posters are omniscient. Have I been mislead?

    They’re omniscient, but only in rigidly defined areas outside of which is doubt and uncertainty.

  74. 74.

    Jeffro

    And as of 6 minutes ago, the Ill Douche is offering $1,200 stimulus checks to every voter in America via Twitter.

    hey don’t look at us, Republicans…you broke it, you bought it!

  75. 75.

    MisterForkbeard

    @Rjm: I think it’s actually something they’ve done in past debates (2016, at least), but it’s also a good strategy. I think he has to avoid looking like he’s threatening Kamala, who is significantly shorter.

    But then, strong parts of Trump’s base would like that, as in when Trump stalked Hillary and gave her the Scary Angry Abuser face the whole time.

  76. 76.

    jl

    @Jeffro: Trump twittering in all caps about all the big econ stimulus bill that Congress should pass right now. Talks back on?

    Edit: docs predicted Trump would start coming down off the ‘roids over next few days. Might be bumpy ride.

  77. 77.

    Adam L Silverman

    @Jeffro: Yep, a partial reversal.

  78. 78.

    Adam L Silverman

    @jl: Most likely. But I don’t really know any more than you do about whether or not you’ve been mislead.

  83. 83.

    piratedan

    @WaterGirl: she’s getting hammered in the polling I’ve been following in the state and her ads with their lies regarding her support of pre-existing conditions are parried by dark money ones where they cite the bills and dates where she voted exactly the opposite.

    She has tried to link Kelly with the Chinese, shifty medical providers, failed businesses and being a money grubbing shyster (no… no projection here) and Kelly runs positive ads from his campaign regarding who he is and how he’s willing to get the work done to solve problems  (you know, the usual inoffensive platitudes) and the dark money on his side are simply crucifying her in plain, easy to understand language.

  84. 84.

    Ken

    @Jeffro: @jl: @Adam L Silverman: Nothing the markets like better than horrifying uncertainty over the president’s economic policies and directions, unless it’s horrifying uncertainty over whether he’s hopped-up on mind-altering drugs.

  86. 86.

    Adam L Silverman

    @Ken: My guess is he’s got a bad back or something, has never disclosed it because it would seem “unmanly”, and prefers to do these things seated.

  88. 88.

    MisterForkbeard

    @Adam L Silverman: “Give me everything I want and I’ll sign right now!” is not a particularly good negotiating tactic.

    Seriously, it does read like someone on meth. Or coke.

  90. 90.

    Princess

    Any ideas/guesses about this press conference briefing on national security Wray etc. have announced for tomorrow?

  92. 92.

    Marcopolo

    @Adam L Silverman: I’m not a doctor [Jim], but it seems to me that Trump is decompensating right now live on Twitter. Dozens of texts in the past couple hours that are all over the damned place.

    I’d be laughing my ass off if he wasn’t POTUS and if the last medical doctor Maddow had on hadn’t talked about how his patients, when on similar drugs that Trump is taking, lost their ability to think rationally about themselves & their environment.

    25th Amendment stat.

  95. 95.

    WaterGirl

    @Jeffro:

    Vote vote vote!

    That knock you are hearing on your front door?  You are about to be arrested for telling people they should vote 3 times.  That is not legal. ” Voter fraud!”

  99. 99.

    jl

    @Marcopolo:

    ” 25th Amendment stat. ”

    Should have been done when Trump went to hospital. I think it, or a similar temporary transfer of power, has been invoked  couple of times for similar situations.

  101. 101.

    Ken

    @MisterForkbeard: Seriously, it does read like someone on meth. Or coke.

    That’s fair, since the list of side effects for dexamethasone makes it sound like a mix of meth and coke.

  108. 108.

    Adam L Silverman

    @dmsilev: It’s supposed to require a tapering off regimen. I think, based on the reporting, that it’s a ten day process.

  109. 109.

    mad citizen

    I have no idea who Michael Hayden is or why his pronouncement matters, and I read 90 % of this blog.  Trump has been toast for a long time.

     

    ETA: ok, refreshed with who he is.  Still think no opinions from new people matter now.

  112. 112.

    Marcopolo

    @jl:   Agreed.  Of course, with Trump you have to remember everything is projection.  If he were VP and had power transferred to himself you know he’d try to never give it back.  He would try to usurp the Presidency.  I’m pretty sure that is why he’d never transfer power to Pence.

  113. 113.

    Gin & Tonic

    @Adam L Silverman: It’s kind of like SCUBA decompression, in that the longer you’re on, the longer it takes to get off, and it’s not clear from any of the reporting how long he is/has been on the steroid treatment.

    The extra bonus is insomnia, so who knows how long he’ll be tweeting.

  116. 116.

    Jeffro

    @Adam L Silverman: that’s putting it politely.  =)

    He’s still a little sly, though, despite the steroids and sub-optimal oxygen levels.  Note the very targeted beneficiaries and (relatively) small amounts here.  BUDGET CONSCIOUS AMERICAN RECOVERY BUDGET MASTER GENIUS!

    (or it’s just whomever is writing his tweets, I dunno/don’t care)

    I SAVED TAXPAYERS $1.5T and F YOU NANCY!

    Whatever, dude.  28 days.

  118. 118.

    Adam L Silverman

    @mad citizen: Hayden is a retired US Air Force four star general. He is an intelligence officer and has served as the Director of the National Security Agency, Director of Central Intelligence, and Director of National Intelligence. The last two as political appointments from George W. Bush after Hayden retired from the Air Force. He had a stroke about a year and a half ago.

  120. 120.

    TS (the original)

    @Marcopolo:

    And I’m not an investment guru – but he sure controls the markets – futures are going up/down based on his tweets. Someone is making money from his erratic behavior.

    Looking forward to a time when slow & steady is the preferred option.

  122. 122.

    Jeffro

    @TS (the original): Did she pull a Hawley, and say she’ll protect the people who she hopes to pull the rug out from under?

    He’s just an amazing scumbag.

    Also, some years back at this point, I predicted (like many of us) that with so little to offer American voters, Republicans would resort to simply saying the same things as Democrats (but in the Republicans’ case, this would involve straight-up lying) and throwing up enough chaff that they might squeak by in elections.  And with enough Koch money, losing candidates could just be replaced by new and better liars next time around.

    Well…yeah, pretty close!

    Here’s hoping the Dems make some serious hay out of this in the next few years: “Why aren’t Republicans even bothering to put forth plans or compete for voters anymore?  Why is voter suppression their first, last, and only strategy?  Aren’t there conservative solutions to America’s problems?  Let’s hear ’em!”

  128. 128.

    dmsilev

    Via the Post, Pence has caved on the whole Big Glass Wall question:

    The Commission on Presidential Debates said Tuesday night that Vice President Pence had dropped his objections to a plexiglass barricade on his side of the stage for Wednesday’s debate after viewing the setup during a walk-through of the debate hall. The disclosure, by commission co-chair Frank Fahrenkopf Jr., came after a long day of posturing between the Trump and Biden campaigns over whether the barriers were needed to protect the participants from the coronavirus. Advisers to Pence maintained that there was no need for a barrier on his side of the stage.

    But at that point the stage was already being built with two clear dividers, one next to each of the tables where the candidates will sit. Fahrenkopf said he had multiple talks with representatives of the Pence campaign after they saw the layout of the stage.

  129. 129.

    Yutsano

    @Jeffro:  SQUAD! DRINK!

    My God she’s just flopping like a fish. It’s almost sad how much she tries to spout right-wing talking points but she seems to have no credibility. She’s almost shouty.

  130. 130.

    r€nato

    @TS (the original): winner winner chicken dinner. I said immediately after Trump’s tweet about ending Covid relief negotiations, “this is more market manipulation, he will be for it again in no time at all.” I gave him til Monday, I guess I was way off.

  132. 132.

    scott (the other one)

    It looks as though the Biden/Palin debate in 2008 is the only V-P debate this century in which the candidates were NOT sitting.

    I suspect it started because Dick Cheney couldn’t handle standing that long. And if it continued with the Caine/Pence debate, then it’s either Pence is also not up to it physically, or Tim Kaine is several inches taller and they didn’t like the optics. (Google indicates they’re the same height but the few images of them standing next to each other, Kaine looks noticeably taller.)

  133. 133.

    Ken

    @dmsilev: Fahrenkopf said he had multiple talks with representatives of the Pence campaign

    FAHRENKOPF. We’re using the barriers.

    CAMPAIGN. We don’t want one around the vice president.

    FAHRENKOPF. We’re using the barriers.

    CAMPAIGN. The president sees them as a sign of weakness.

    FAHRENKOPF. We’re using the barriers.

    CAMPAIGN. We’ll pull out if you keep the VP’s barrier.

    FAHRENKOPF. We’re using the barriers.

    (At least, that’s how I would handle it.)

  134. 134.

    r€nato

    @Yutsano: I am willing to bet almost nobody outside of politics addicts know or cares much who Schumer is. The voters she needs to win have little idea who he is. #flopsweat

  135. 135.

    Jeffro

    @Yutsano: I just saw that!  Good luck bringing in Omar and Talib into an AZ senate race, McSally

    And could she blink any faster?  Jaysus

  136. 136.

    Miss Bianca

    OK, just watched that video up top. I’m finding what they *don’t* appear to be saying out loud to be quite as interesting – maybe more so – than what they *do*.

  138. 138.

    jonas

    @dmsilev: Drum has said that the weird side effects of dex don’t really kick in until you’ve been on it for a while. We have no idea what kind of shit Trump’s being given, quite frankly. His medical team has been completely co-opted into the propaganda machine. The baseline insanity of his own multiple personality disorders is so off-the-charts that it’s hard to tell whether it’s meds or just him more unfiltered than usual because he fears his own mortality.

  140. 140.

    Ken

    @r€nato: Well really, how long does it take to place a bunch of market orders?  He could whipsaw the market every half-hour.  From what I’m hearing, he’s practicing that tonight.

  141. 141.

    Jeffro

    “border wall system” – new GOP talking point, to get away from easily defeatable walls/fences.

  143. 143.

    piratedan

    @Yutsano: McSally is a great paper candidate, one of the first females to fly offensive missions, has battled sexual harassment in her past as she climbed the ladder.

    Then she opens her mouth….. and all that hate spills out, she’s apparently somewhat self-loathing when it comes to her gender and refuses to acknowledge that without the Dems, she would have been denied her opportunities in the service.  She’s willing to sacrifice any credibility, personal or professional, in order further the GOP agenda.

    she’s shameless and reprehensible.  Sorry to say, she was the one who replaced Dems in my Congressional District, once upon a time taking over Giffords old seat… easy to say that I’m not a fan.

  145. 145.

    Miss Bianca

    @Adam L Silverman: lol

    Still, I have to admit that I find DT’s usual Twitter rantings to be so dumb, bizarre, off-the-wall and just plain batshit gonzo *normally*, that I’m finding it hard to tell just how much MORE so they actually are lately.

    I guess another 24 hours should tell. *shudder

  146. 146.

    Jeffro

    Kelly has apparently been a “political operative for a decade”…”captive of the most extreme American elements in um America”…

    Kelly proceeds to explain that he’s a gun owner, but believes in common sense reform

    Moderators now moving on to trumpov’s comments about service members being “losers and suckers”

    WOW she is just all in on the trumpov Kool-Aid

    Best wishes, McSally

  147. 147.

    Aleta

    @dmsilev: Dig this :

    Pence aides argued that the plexiglass was medically unnecessary and said it would do little to prevent coronavirus transmission, according to people familiar with the back and forth. The Pence team ultimately said that if the barriers made Harris feel safer, they would use them.

    Slimy, passive-aggressive, dishonest way to concede.  “The lady is uncomfortable so I will gallantly do it for her sake …  “

  148. 148.

    r€nato

    “we had more troops dying in training accidents than in combat’ YEAH LET’S START SOME WARS THAT WILL FIX THAT

  151. 151.

    jonas

    @Jeffro: I find this “strategy” of trying to tie whatever Democratic candidate your running against to “the Squad” rather bizarre. 1. Do 95% of voters even know who the hell they are? I mean, crazy “marinate all day in Fox and talk radio bashittery” types know, but does your average voter? 2. I can’t recall a similar strategy by Dems of calling out some right wing bete-noir and suggesting their opponent will forge some kind of unholy alliance with said villain and kill ALL the puppies if given the chance. I guess we can do that with Trump now, but people know who he is. If you were at a debate and started going off on how, if elected, your GOP opponent was going bring Louis Gohmert or Martha Blackburn-style evil to your district, everyone would look at each other and go like “WTF are they talking about?”

  152. 152.

    r€nato

    Kelly positioning himself as the rightful heir to McCain and his seat = smart

     

    McSally is speaking to the Fox News base and that’s it

  153. 153.

    TS (the original)

    @Jeffro:

    Here’s hoping the Dems make some serious hay out of this in the next few years: “Why aren’t Republicans even bothering to put forth plans or compete for voters anymore?  Why is voter suppression their first, last, and only strategy?  Aren’t there conservative solutions to America’s problems?  Let’s hear ’em!”

    No idea why this is not at the forefront for every election. The GOP admitted this year – they have nothing other than whatever trump says – and trump wouldn’t know a policy if it hit him in the face.

    Always comes back to the media – they demand policy from the democratic party – so they can attack it.

     

  154. 154.

    Yutsano

    @piratedan:  She’s dodging the questions. She’s doing her damndest to not talk against Dolt45 on the insulting the military question. And now Kelly is hanging Grandpa Walnuts around her neck. She hasn’t bothered to mention him once. He’s doing much better than I thought he would. And she just lied her ass off about supporting McCain.

  156. 156.

    Jeffro

    On a side note with this Kelly/McSally debate: it’s interesting to see how House and Senate races have been just about fully nationalized now (at least on the GOP side, but hey I’m biased).

    McSally is throwing out some seriously weird shit/trumpov talking points, while Kelly is at least trying to bring it home to Arizona occasionally.

    Ok, she just threw a bone to the ghost of St. McCain (against trumpov)…and immediately pivoted to attacking Kelly as a puppet of Chuck Schumer(!)  Oh well.

  157. 157.

    jonas

    @r€nato: “Time was you sent a boy off to war. Shooting a man’d fix ’em right up. But there’s not even any wars no more, [sarcastically] thank you very much, Warren Christopher!” 

  158. 158.

    TS (the original)

    @dmsilev:

    Advisers to Pence maintained that there was no need for a barrier on his side of the stage.

    Noting that barriers are a protection from the OTHER person, this may not be a winning strategy as it implies pence knows he has nothing to fear from Sen Harris re covid-19, but she has much to fear from him.

    I think the “walk through” may have demonstrated this very well.

  159. 159.

    Miss Bianca

    @Adam L Silverman: Do I really have to spell it out for you?//

    It may just be me, but I notice they’re careful to make a distinction between “foreign enemies” and – well, they never say “domestic ones”, but they imply it by referring to election crimes.

    Or something. I’m really just distracting myself from writing a couple articles about amendments to the zoning resolution on short-term rentals.

  161. 161.

    Yutsano

    @Jeffro: r€nato:  “Green Bad Deal”? Does she even listen to herself? She’s babbling about nothing that will help the climate.

    Ooh Kelly using the astronaut perspective to explain his climate ideals. “We can’t wait around to get this done.” I LIKE THAT!

  162. 162.

    Jeffro

    @jonas: it’s the FoxBubble…they think everyone, everywhere is up on the latest Fox spin or attack, and that it will evoke some sort of horror.

    I mean, an AZ Senator is running – at least in this debate – half against Omar and Talib and Schumer as she is against her actual opponent.

    I dunno…maybe talk about the issues that affect your state, for the most part?  Don’t just go to the FoxBubble boogey(wo)men and expect this is going to move the needle for folks in your state, other than the die-hards.

  163. 163.

    Jeffro

    And now she’s trying her hardest to sound like a greenie, but it’s just sad.  “She’s just making stuff up” – Kelly.  Um, yeah.

  164. 164.

    piratedan

    @Jeffro: AZ now has a mostly Dem Congressional group now and there’s a fair to partly cloudy chance we get AZ CD-6 this year with Tiperneni vs Schweikert… the other three seats are less likely as they send folks like Gosar, Biggs and Lesko to serve.. although if this is a tsunami like wave, maybe, they can also pick off Lesko (unlikely imho).  The big prize in the state is not only the Senate but wiping out the GOP gerrymander in the state lege, there’s indications that AZ in 2020 could be a replay of 2018 Virginia, have to see, but the local GOP is in Susan Collins Furrowed Brow mode.

  166. 166.

    MisterForkbeard

    @Jeffro: Oh good, Kelly just flat stated she’s making things up and lying? Good for him.

    We need more of that in debates, to be honest. Because that’s the go-to Republican strategy: Lie about your own votes and history and count on the limited time to keep from getting debunked.

  167. 167.

    Jeffro

    Also – unrelated – NFLTG Dan Rather is absolutely the best Dan Rather (on Twitter).  Funny guy!

  168. 168.

    Another Scott

    @jl: The 3rd Kennedy-Nixon debate in 1960 was remote (Nixon in LA, Kennedy in NYC).

    “We have the technology!!”

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  170. 170.

    r€nato

    people can debate who won this debate but all Kelly has to do is not fuck up and not give up any big plays to her.

    So far this changes nothing for McSally. If I am an AZ voter on the fence on this, I see McSally auditioning for a job on Fox News while Kelly is talking about issues that matter to me.

  171. 171.

    mad citizen

    @the pollyanna from hell: I am Indy local, and used to listen to a Sat. morning radio show with Pence and local Dem John Gregg, former Speaker of Indiana House who twice was the nominee for Gov.  He ran terrible campaigns.  I recall nothing memorable from Pence.  He is a retrograde evangelical.

  172. 172.

    Adam L Silverman

    @jonas: If you get all your news from Fox, Sinclair, Rush Limbaugh and other right wing radio talkers, Breitbart, and Gateway Pundit, which is where McSally gets hers, then this is what you think is going on in DC. Four of the most junior members of the House are actually running everything on behalf of George Soros even though two are Muslim.

  173. 173.

    Gravenstone

    @Adam L Silverman:  Um, how big a nuke we talking here? I’m not that far north of your proposed ground zero.

    Granted, sometimes it might just be best to get it all over with and vaporized before pain can be felt isn’t the worst choice.

  178. 178.

    Yutsano

    @r€nato:  She thinks “Back the Blue” gets her some credibility. Now we’re in mass shooting territory and she’s ranting about the Second Amendment. Incidentally this has nothing to do with the question. And good on these moderators for sticking them both to the question and the time.

    EDIT: GOD I LOVE THIS MODERATOR IN PINK!!!

  179. 179.

    Kattails

    Just going to toss out the notion that Harris should go in tomorrow and say to Pence “It seems that the American people think you all have been playing Russian Roulette with this virus and a whole lot of people have lost. I have family I love, staff I care deeply about, a country that deserves better, I am not going to play that game.”

    So sod off asshole.

  180. 180.

    Jeffro

    @r€nato: Yup.

    I think Rep. Omar has gotten more name-checks tonight…in an AZ Senate Race!…than any out-of-state official I’ve ever seen/heard.

    And if McSally says “I back the blue” one more time, it’s going to turn into a meme wormhole from which none of us can escape.  LOL

    (also “I shot the A-10’s cannon”…etc)

    She’s just a shameful liar and deserves to be swallowed up by the earth, never to be heard from again.

  182. 182.

    r€nato

    @piratedan: I happen to live not only in CD6 but also in LD28 where the Kate Brophy McGee (R-incumbent) vs Christine Marsh (D) race may well decide the AZ Senate majority.

    On the surface you’d think this is a R-leaning area of Phoenix/Scottsdale/Paradise Valley, but it’s surprisingly purple if you’re on the ground here. Schweikert has the stench of being in office far too long all over  him and two of our three state legislators are Team Blue; Marsh would make it three. We also elected a great Democrat, Deb Stark, to the Phoenix City Council. Her last opponent ran a highly partisan race and was crushed. Her current opponent, Nicole Garcia, is a kinder and gentler partisan hack.

    If you have some money to spare for a political donation give it to Marsh. A little goes a long way in one of these races and tipping the AZ Senate to the Dems is huge for Arizona and beyond. Republic*nts control way too many legislatures.

  183. 183.

    sdhays

    @jl: The problem is that Dump isn’t a President; he’s a king with Presidential powers. He doesn’t trust anyone enough to cede his powers away voluntarily for the sake of the country – I don’t care if he could pick and choose whoever was President while he was out, he would still choose no one. And since he’s the king, even talk of the 25th Amendment is essentially calling for coup, at least in court of Donnie John Dump.

    Dense and the Cabinet won’t even consider invoking the 25th Amendment unless it’s basically guaranteed that Dump isn’t waking up. Otherwise, when the king wakes up, everyone’s going to lose their heads.

  184. 184.

    TS (the original)

    @Adam L Silverman:

    then this is what you think is going on in DC

    I was about to discuss how stupid for a sitting Senator to get their information from RW media, rather than from Senate activities and colleagues – but then I remembered about the covid supporter in the White House, who gets all his news and talking points from the same source. She is a good little disciple.

  185. 185.

    Ken

    @Gravenstone: I have a copy of the 1962 The Effects of Nuclear Weapons, and it’s still got the circular blast-effect calculator in the cover pocket. Give me your distance and the bomb yield and detonation height and I can dial up your overpressure, temperature, radiation dose, and a half-dozen other numbers you probably don’t really want.

    Or you can type “nuclear blast calculator” into google and find a half-dozen sites that do the same thing.

  186. 186.

    Jeffro

    @Adam L Silverman: I actually had a co-worker who I like and usually get along with, one who doesn’t like the trumpov maladministration a bit, tell me today that Pence was ‘pretty sharp’

    (record-needle scratch)

    Um, sir, please double check your sources there…

    We got past it but whew – I thought Pence’s minimal IQ was basically a rare bipartisan point of agreement.

  187. 187.

    jl

    @Jeffro: I think Gohmert is scarier than all the squad put together. But a whole debate built by the local Dem candidate on Gohmertism coming to my district would be very odd. I’d call up the local Dems and ask if they could give the  candidate a psych evaluation.

  188. 188.

    Jeffro

    Love it!  The moderators just asked McSally straight-up if she was for background checks, and she skips right to “extreme radical extreme” etc.

    Total nonsense.  Pretty clear choice Arizona!

  189. 189.

    sdhays

    @Kattails: I want her to ask why the head of the nation’s COVID response allowed it get so bad that the President of the United States is possibly dying of COVID right now. He couldn’t even protect his god President, how can the American people trust him to protect them?

  190. 190.

    Yutsano

    @Jeffro:  Why is she challenging him to three other debates? She was terrible here. They have one more debate next week but after that Kelly should be like nah I’m good fam.

  191. 191.

    piratedan

    @r€nato: i hear you, I’m down in Tucson in Grijalva’s district now, so trying to keep my money in local races after what happening in Phoenix at the state offices.  Kicking in money for voter reg drives that hit the barrios and the reservations down here (lots of busy-bee-ness going on out on the Tohono-Oodham reservations) and growing more diverse local candidates (too many old white liberals in the past, need to reach out to other constituencies).  A lot of small money thankless work to help build foundations

  193. 193.

    Ken

    @Jeffro: Any idea what the Arizona poll numbers are on the background checks issue?  If McSally is dodging that much, they can’t be favorable to her position.

    Which reminds me of a surprise bit of trivia someone posted earlier – that even in South Carolina 55% of the population thinks Roe v Wade was correctly decided.

  195. 195.

    jl

    @Jeffro: Pretty confusing towards the end. McSally accused Kelly of belonging to a sinister left wing group, which is the gun control group that Kelly and his wife Giffords started (after she got shot in the head in an assassination attempt)? But Kelly revealed it, or he was guessing what McSally was talking about? What, huh? Or maybe I misunderstood.

    Not a good look for McSally, whatever that was. Will be interesting to see how this mess affects the polls.

  196. 196.

    Jeffro

    @Ken: and this is the thing, right: the GOP doesn’t even represent its own constituents on most issues!  Choice, background checks, higher taxes on higher earners…they are a minority in most every way, kept in power by racists, Randians, and religious nuts (and our own archaic governmental structures and processes)

  197. 197.

    Suzanne

    @Yutsano:  She is terrible. Like, so, so bad.

    Kelly will be OK. Sinema is pretty shit for a Dem. I think she’ll switch parties at some point.

  198. 198.

    Suzanne

    @Ken: AZ is much bluer than you think. It’s just, like everywhere else, concentrated in the cities and inner suburbs, as well as the Navajo Nation.

  199. 199.

    Adam L Silverman

    @Cheryl Rofer: I knew the summoning would work. If you hadn’t shown up within a 1/2 an hour I was going to do a comment of:

    Cheryl Rofer, Cheryl Rofer, Cheryl Rofer

    Because I figure that would work.

  200. 200.

    r€nato

    @Suzanne: no, Sinema will not switch parties. I guarantee it. She will just keep pushing our buttons when she needs us and stabbing us in the back when she doesn’t and when it benefits her career. And frankly she is brilliant at it, her political instincts are second to none. The woman once called herself a Prada Socialist and marched with Code Pink FFS (early on in her career) and still no Republican can lay a glove on her in an election. She did also have the good fortune to run against McSilly. But they also say luck is when preparation meets opportunity

    Frankly (again) I think Sinema is Arizona’s Obama. You just may see her run for President in four to eight years, depending on the outcome in four weeks.

  202. 202.

    piratedan

    @Suzanne: I always thought she was simply being a very calculating pol underneath all of that facade.  If AZ trends bluer and more purple that she would bend like a reed in the wind and go with the flow.

    If she bolts, then I suspect Gallego would take a run at her.

  203. 203.

    Ken

    @Jeffro: Yes, but it’s so unfair of Democrats and moderators (who are all secretly Democrats since they’re in the liberal media) to ask questions about all these issues where the Republican party position, although perfectly defensible by our Pluto-Christian values, is supported by only a minority of voters.

  207. 207.

    piratedan

    @r€nato: Ruben, he dropped out when Kelly’s org showed him to have an uphill battle to the nom, so I suspect he’s keeping his powder dry.

  210. 210.

    r€nato

    @Suzanne: agreed. Arizona has been almost entirely run by Team Red for way too long (complete monopoly at the state level from 2009 to 2019) but I see that as a house built on sand. Phoenix itself (around 50%-60% of the metro area population) is blue, just look at who gets elected to the mayor’s office and city council. Including the incumbent Kate Gallego, the last FOUR Phoenix mayors have been Democrats. Kate is in her first partial term (won a special election to fill the remainder of Greg Stanton’s term); the other three served multiple terms I believe. Kate should cruise to victory in November.

    Left-leaners keep moving here from California and colder climates. It’s going to tip decisively in the next two to four years to a solid purple state including the Legislature. Just wish I knew who the Dems have in mind for the governor’s office when Douchey is term-limited out. The last two candidates (David Garcia and Fred DuVal) SUCKED. Especially Garcia, it was like the Dems weren’t even trying very hard to win. Typical wonky Democrats who are great in office but suck at campaigning. Especially surprising in DuVal’s case, he ran campaigns for Babbitt (admittedly long ago).

  211. 211.

    Kattails

    @sdhays: oh yes, that would be  most enjoyable to watch.

    I does occur to me that sitting might actually help Harris visually, I’ve seen her in person, she is not a tall person.

  212. 212.

    piratedan

    @WaterGirl: McSally, as a Congrescritter, was the one who led the charge to shut down the government during Trump’s first two years when the GOP refused to work on a budget, so she has “skills” when it comes to screwing over her own constituency.

  213. 213.

    Suzanne

    @piratedan: I think it’s more likely that Stanton runs against her than Kate Gallego. I love Ruben, but I can’t see him winning statewide.

  214. 214.

    Suzanne

    @r€nato: Tucson’s mayor is good. She should run for Gov.

    I both miss AZ and am thrilled to be gone.

    Mr. Suzanne and I are discussing snowbirding.

  215. 215.

    piratedan

    @Suzanne: I hear you, but at least it appears that the Dems are finally building a bench thru Congressional seat holders…  I could have seen Grijalva maybe talking a shot, but with COVID and his health issues, I think that opportunity has flown, but at least his kids are now getting involved at the state level and one of them may challenge Kirkpatrick in a couple of cycles or run for Dad’s seat.

  217. 217.

    WaterGirl

    @rikyrah:  That must be a reference to something I know nothing about.  I see a bunch of strong women, dressed in 3 different kinds of outfits.  What am I missing

    edit: is that literally an organization or event, or symbolic?  Sorry to be clueless.

  218. 218.

    Calouste

    @rikyrah:

    Also on that link:

    When Trump walked through the doors, Walter Reed had a stellar reputation. As he walks out 72 hours later, its reputation is in tatters. There's nothing Trump can't ruin.— Maureen Dowd (@maureendowd) October 5, 2020

     

    Is our media learning?

  220. 220.

    Bill Arnold

    @Aleta:

    Slimy, passive-aggressive, dishonest way to concede. “The lady is uncomfortable so I will gallantly do it for her sake … “

    Yeah, and the recent update to the relevant CDC document makes them liars according to the US government:
    Current CDC “How COVID Spreads” document:
    There is evidence that under certain conditions, people with COVID-19 seem to have infected others who were more than 6 feet away. These transmissions occurred within enclosed spaces that had inadequate ventilation. Sometimes the infected person was breathing heavily, for example while singing or exercising.

    New rules, Mr. Pence.

  221. 221.

    piratedan

    @Suzanne: well based on my visits to Blog for Arizona, there’s more content and hope than I’ve seen in quite some time.  So I do think the tide is turning, slowly, but turning…  I kind of think that the Dem party in the State is being renovated while still being lived in, if you take my meaning…

  222. 222.

    r€nato

    @Yutsano: did you catch Yvette Wingett Sanchez practically calling her a liar? This was a GREAT panel. KJZZ’s Steve Goldstein twice refused to let McSally get away with not answering questions. I expect that tomorrow morning KJZZ will be inundated with angry messages of protest from right-wing flying monkeys who have never listened to the station.

    McSally’s challenge to Kelly to three more debates had all the impact of a wet fart. What a way to end the debate.

  223. 223.

    piratedan

    @r€nato: I was thinking while witnessing that, holy shit, that’s what moderation should be like… answer the question, don’t read me a press release, answer the question!

  225. 225.

    Kent

    @Suzanne:

    @r€nato: Tucson’s mayor is good. She should run for Gov.

    I both miss AZ and am thrilled to be gone.

    Mr. Suzanne and I are discussing snowbirding.

    Years ago I visited a Peace Corps friend living and working in Phoenix.  It was February and she was rattling on about how green everything was that time of year and what a good time it was to visit.

    Um…..  green?   I just flew here from Seattle.   Oh….you mean those little specks of green weeds scattered about in the desert?   OKAYYY..

  228. 228.

    sdhays

    @Bill Arnold: Nobody gives a shit about Dense’ childish taunting except for the boss. It definitely isn’t hurting Kamala or her support. Dump’s Nazi followers eat it up, but this is for the boss.

  230. 230.

    Martin

    @Bill Arnold: Um. The CDC just put out information that Covid is airborne. That means that it can linger in the air after/beyond the particulate cloud that one person can put out.

    So while the 6′ rule keeps you from the most direct exposure, simply walking into a poorly ventilated room after someone with Covid was in there can transmit the virus. Less likely, but it’s a transmission vector.

  231. 231.

    jl

    @Calouste:  ‘ When Trump walked through the doors, Walter Reed had a stellar reputation. As he walks out 72 hours later, its reputation is in tatters. ‘

    Trump has so much control over what the doctors can and cannot say, they are in a bind. The negotiations about what the docs would and would not say must have been insane. Probably took an hour to persuade Trump that the docs just couldn’t stand there and hilariously bald face lie about everything.

  232. 232.

    Bill Arnold

    @sdhays:

    Nobody gives a shit about Dense’ childish taunting except for the boss.

    Sure. Just pointing out that the CDC put out new recommendations about reducing the spread of SARS-CoV-2, and they are not the old recommendations. In particular they clearly call for masks, and for the importance of good ventilation in shared indoor spaces. Masks are now before hand washing in the list, which is a major change.
    Republicans need to be called out for violation of these new guidelines.

  233. 233.

    The Moar You Know

    I’m waiting for him to nuke Milwaukee.

    @Adam L Silverman: There’s only one place Trump would nuke and I would frankly be a bit concerned at the moment if I lived there: New York City. He has scores to settle there.

  234. 234.

    jl

    @Martin: I think more accurate to say ‘can be airborne’ under in certain situations, that cannot be precisely defined, except ‘close or loud conversation, crowded and confined’ with poor ventilation implied, I guess.

    I don’t know if they understand exactly when aerosols are formed, except for inside  infectious disease wards, which is a highly controlled environment compared to ordinary life.

  236. 236.

    Ivan X

    It seems as likely as not to me that Pence might want to be seated as a sign of deference to the boss, especially when the boss might be extra worried about appearing weak. And, maybe there’s a kind of institutional deference as well, given the observation others have made that most recent VP debates have been seated.

  238. 238.

    Mai Naem mobile

    Ummm….what happens if the Veep debate gets canceled because something happens to Orange Cokehead? Does it get rescheduled with a new Veep candidate?

  240. 240.

    Uncle Cosmo

    @The Moar You Know: When Adam mentioned nuking Milwaukee, what flashed in my mind was an old, small, low-budget board game my good friend Neil (RIP) found many years ago at an SF convention: The Creature That Ate Sheboygan.** (No word if creature, as homage to The War of the Worlds, dies of indigestion.)

    I recall the blurb went something like, “Stop it here or all Chicago will be at its mercy!” (For Trumpistas, ees feature, not boog!)

    ** Look, it’s still around! The game, I meant. (Sheboygan too, FWIW.)

  241. 241.

    Uncle Cosmo

    @Sister Golden Bear: Which in turn brings to mind the legendary cheers for MIT intercollegiate athletics:

    E to the x, dx, dx! E to the x, dx, dx!

    Secant, tangent, cosine, sine! Three point one four one five nine!

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