For many of us, we’re approaching the time of year where we read Terry Pratchett’s Hogfather; a lucky few may even read it for the first time. In this solstice classic, Death takes over for a thinly-veiled Santa Claus figure. I’ve only read it once, but I seem to recall that hijinks ensue.
I remembered this during the Pratchett thread the other day, and thought I’d ask the jackaltariat if you’d be interested in doing a little light-reading-for-the-holidays book club. We can meet here (maybe even with an embedded chat?) to talk about them. Obviously this would be the Christmas entry–but it would be cool to read a fun romp about a different seasonal holiday, too.
(Update: important note: you do not need to have read a single other Discworld book to read this one, or most other Discworld books)
Now, I know that asking you to read two books is a little silly, but I thought I’d gauge interest. Any takers? Just as importantly, any suggestions?
At the very least, let’s do Hogfather! Here’s a wonderful excerpt to wet your whistle. (For those who don’t know, Death speaks in ALL CAPS, which is how you can tell he’s a frequent correspondent of John Cole’s.)
“All right,” said Susan. “I’m not stupid. You’re saying humans need… fantasies to make life bearable.”
REALLY? AS IF IT WAS SOME KIND OF PINK PILL? NO. HUMANS NEED FANTASY TO BE HUMAN. TO BE THE PLACE WHERE THE FALLING ANGEL MEETS THE RISING APE.
“Tooth fairies? Hogfathers? Little—”
YES. AS PRACTICE. YOU HAVE TO START OUT LEARNING TO BELIEVE THE LITTLE LIES.
“So we can believe the big ones?”
YES. JUSTICE. MERCY. DUTY. THAT SORT OF THING.
“They’re not the same at all!”
YOU THINK SO? THEN TAKE THE UNIVERSE AND GRIND IT DOWN TO THE FINEST POWDER AND SIEVE IT THROUGH THE FINEST SIEVE AND THEN SHOW ME ONE ATOM OF JUSTICE, ONE MOLECULE OF MERCY. AND YET—Death waved a hand. AND YET YOU ACT AS IF THERE IS SOME IDEAL ORDER IN THE WORLD, AS IF THERE IS SOME… SOME RIGHTNESS IN THE UNIVERSE BY WHICH IT MAY BE JUDGED.
“Yes, but people have got to believe that, or what’s the point—”
MY POINT EXACTLY.
(Picture is from a comic version of same; the novel is of course done only with words. Click to embiggen.)
ellie
Sounds good! I’m in. I have not read any Pratchett but have been meaning to.
Major Major Major Major
@ellie: woohoo!
narya
I”m in! I was working my way through Pratchett (in order, of course . . .) but don’t remember how far I got. Yes, I’m interested.
MattF
1) Specifically, Death speaks in small caps. Fonts matter.
2) Susan is Death’s adoptive grand-daughter. Probably my favorite Pratchett character, see Thief of Time.
(((CassandraLeo)))
Pratchett is one of my favourites and I was absolutely devastated when he died. I don’t know where my copy of Hogfather is. I’ll have to acquire another one.
It’s not really necessary to work through Discworld in strict chronological order, by the way. It encompasses a number of different… sub-series, for lack of a better term, that each have their own chronology. You can read Guards! Guards! without having read The Colour of Magic and not really miss out on much. On the other hand, if you read Night Watch without having first read Guards! Guards!, you will miss out on a lot of the characterisation.
The first two novels aren’t really very indicative of Pratchett’s true skills as a satirist, either; they’re more along the lines of straight parodies of fantasy literature, although by Equal Rites he was already infusing that with some trenchant commentary on gender inequality (a couple of reviewers early on apparently assumed he was a woman because Equal Rites is so sharply feminist).
Anyhow, I frequently recommend that newcomers to the series start with one of the following:
I haven’t read Hogfather in years. The above excerpt makes me realise I need to fix that.
Cēterum cēnseō factiōnem Rēpublicānam dēlendam esse īgnī ferrōque.
Alison Rose
I’ve been working my way through the City Watch arc, so I’m certainly up for more Pratchett and have never read Hogfather. I’m into it!
But what is the second book you’re referring to? Or do you mean, maybe we could find a second book about another holiday to also read? I feel like a terrible Jew for not having any good Hanukkah book recs at the ready, but I mean………..there’s not a lot of Hanukkah-themed books out there. It’s not “Jewish Christmas” despite what a lot of goyim want to believe, LOL
Comrade Colette
I’m in! And I still love and get a bit teary about these tweets:
KnittyGal
Big-time lurker, but I will come out for a read of Pratchett. Count me in!
No One of Consequence
You’ve given out the crown jewel excerpt from the whole book, perhaps the entirety of Pratchett’s work!
FFS.
To be the place where the fallen angel meet the rising ape. Had I the mind to have conceived of that line alone. To have written it, and published it. Ah…
I ain’t made at ya, you made a great choice. I am fond of Pratchett. This bit most of all. Entire means of existence, ways of life, paths of philosophy are contained herein. One man’s path, anyway.
If you’re unfamiliar, Pratchett is rewarding in ways both immediate and profound. At times the simplicity belies the great wisdom offered. And always with a healthy dose of not-taking-oneself-too-seriously and chuckles too innumerable to count. YMMV, but it’s likely you’ll have an experience like this if you’re human.
Peace,
NOoC
Major Major Major Major
@Alison Rose: yeah I don’t know any either!
Major Major Major Major
@MattF: you are technically correct! (The best kind of correct.)
Comrade Colette
@Alison Rose: @Major Major Major Major: Hanukkah is mostly for little kids, anyway. It’s the wrong time of year, but reading the Book of Esther and getting hella drunk seems more appropriate.
Emma from FL
Can’t find my paper copy so got one for my kindle. Ready to go.
I haven’t read much Pratchett, but I was given Hogfather as a Christmas gift years ago and enjoyed it tremendously. It might become a Christmas tradition.
Major Major Major Major
@Comrade Colette: I would even accept a Saturnalia book lol. But yeah, I know Hanukkah is not a big deal in Judaism…
Obvious Russian Troll
Confession: I read the first Discworld book when it came out back in the eighties and wasn’t that impressed, so I have not read any other Pratchett (except for Good Omens, which he wrote with Neil Gaiman).
I understand that may have been a mistake and I have been meaning to rectify that. Now is probably a good time.
jackmac
I loved “Hogfather” and — actually — anything by Terry Pratchett. His Death character combined wisdom of the ages and empathy with doses of innocence and naivete. Pratchett’s DIscworld series output was prodigious yet I always wanted to read yet another new book. The cruelty of Alzheimer’s robbed us all of a great storyteller. I believe Pratchett wanted all his papers and unfinished works destroyed upon his death, thankfully sparing us collections of partial, unfinished and unpolished stories that would only diminish his stature. (My introduction to Pratchett was Night Watch, so I’m always been partial to Sam Vimes).
CaseyL
Excellent idea – I’m in!
I reread Hogfather not very long ago, during a Covid-inspired binge read – it’ll be fun and interesting to read it in company.
OldDave
I’ve read Hogfather multiple times, but I don’t think SWMBO has. Perhaps she will join the group Read-A-Thon.
Feathers
The Kindle is only $6.99. I’ve never really gotten into Pratchett, but I think some of that is the hype and the anxiety over having to pick one to read which means I’ve invariably passed over what I’ve read several times. Both of which affect my enjoyment, even though I know it’s silly.
But I’ve never really heard of this one and I can put it in the Christmas category, for which my expectations are generally very low, so I should be all set!
I did enjoy Good Omens very much when I finally got around to reading it.
Mary G
I haven’t read much Pratchett, except Good Omens and Going Postal, which for some reason are the only ones my two libraries have for the Kindle, and for some reason just didn’t really connect. I did read a short story about Grammy Weatherwax that I loved, so I’ve wanted to read more with her in it, but I am afraid that once I start buying Pratchett books, I’ll end up loving and buying all of them. My earlier life of penny pinching puts up that “You’ll end up in a refrigerator box under the freeway without even a sparrow for a curtain rod” nonsense. But I will join the bookclub and even read a second book, because I am tired of what I’ve been picking and need a new direction.
dkinPa
Another lurker, but I may have to come out for this. I try to read a new Terry Pratchett two or three times a year. Spacing them out, because I know I’ll be sad when there aren’t any more. I don’t read them in date order, and found that it doesn’t matter. Hogfather is a new Christmas tradition for me, too!
Sloane Ranger
I’m in. My favourite Pratchett books are the City Watch series (Feet of Clay) followed by anything involving Unseen University, especially The Librarian. Ook ook!
Haven’t re-read Hogfather in a while. It’ll be fun.
Benw
Yeah I’m in. Gonna order a dead-tree copy, so give me a couple days!
Even though I’ve been a lifelong sci-fi/fantasy reader I’ve never pulled the trigger on Pratchett, so this is fun!
CaseyL
@Mary G: If you belong to a public library, many of them may be available as eBooks.
Pratchett is one of the few writers whose books I would snap up as soon as they appeared at the book store – and I’m very glad to have bought most of them before I decided to use the library instead, and just rent books from now on.
Bruuuuce
I’m in. I’ve been rereading several fantasy series of which Discworld is one (Lawrence Watt-Evans’ Ethshar is the other), and was just starting a reread of Reaper Man, but Hogfather works, too.
narya
There are some stories in the Dresden-verse that have . . . relevance. The most relevant one, unfortunately, is a coda to the last one he published in September. But I’ll keep thinking.
Chacal Charles Calthrop
I’m in!
Although as I’ve never been part of a book club, let alone a virtual book club, you’re going to have to tell me what to do.
(I’ve always been a solitary reader of books I found in the library via other books. The required college intro-to-literature class felt like being introduced to my secret mistress at a formal gathering, with me thinking, if only this teacher knew how well I already know these books.…)
Cookie Monster
As a huge Pratchett fan, yes!
As an aside, there’s a pretty decent dramatization of Hogfather (and Going Postal) on Amazon Prime video. It was done some years ago for UK’s Sky TV. I’d read the book first, of course, but it’s worth watching, IMO.
Steeplejack (phone)
Maybe Truman Capote’s “A Christmas Memory”? It’s a (long) short story, available in several Kindle and paperback editions. There’s even a link in the Wikipedia article to an on-line posting of it.
Ken
Also, as others have noted, meditations on the human condition which in their own ways as deep (if not moreso) than anything you’ll get from the philosophers and theologians.
Major Major Major Major
@jackmac: his remaining works were publicly crushed under a steamroller, per his will.
grandmaBear
I’m in. I’ve read a couple after high recs here, so I’m looking forward to it.
Elma
I started reading the Discworld books earlier this year as pandemic relief on the strength of B Jackals recommendations. I will now go get Hogfather and join the group.
NotMax
Any fans of Robert Asprin’s MythAdventures series?
Ken
For other Christmas-themed stories, I can recommend John Scalzi’s collection A Very Scalzi Christmas. “Christmas in July” is especially affecting in these uncertain times.
(“In these uncertain times” seems to be what most advertisers have settled on in preference to “pandemic”.)
Clember
Would love to tag along.
My sleepy-time audio for the last several weeks has been Making Money, which I believe is a follow-on to Going Postal? I’ve only seen the Hogfather on YouTube so I’ll look forward to reading the real words.
Major Major Major Major
@Chacal Charles Calthrop: it’s very simple: first you read the book, then you get together to talk about it. Most are monthly I think so this was the right time for the post. I imagine a chat room would be nice but we’ll see.
dm
@Comrade Colette: Gosh. All I had to do was read the first four words of the first tweet, and my eyes runneth over.
My favorites of the Discworld books are the Tiffany Aching books (plus the others involving the witches). There’s a solstice-related book in that series, too: Wintersmith, which has a description of the spookiest Morris Dance ever.
Unfortunately, I think you do have to read the preceding novels to get the most out of that one.
opiejeanne
There are TV movies for both “The Hogfather” and “Going Postal” and both are pretty good, especially “Going Postal”, but I love Death playing the Hogfather, and Susan being exasperated with him and Quoth, the Raven and Death of Rats (a leftover character from “The Color/Colour of Magic”.
When someone asks where to start reading Pratchett, I always push for “Guards! Guards!” because it’s short, it has dragons, and it is a tale with degradation and redemption, plus C.M.O.T Dibbler and Sausage Inna Bun. It’s fun, and it draws you in.
I have a library discard paperback of “Equal Rites” that I asked PTerry to sign, and he wrote: Burn this book! (Because he wanted people to buy his books.)
Bruuuuce
@NotMax: Yep. I rather like a couple of Perverts — I mean, Pervects
Major Major Major Major
@dm: I read Wyrd Sisters for the first time this month, absolutely fantastic.
opiejeanne
@Cookie Monster: The townspeople in Hogfather and Going Postal were all British Pratchett fans, many of them involved in putting on the Discworld conventions. The director said he was amazed because they knew exactly what to do and how to be residents of Ankh Morpork.
Major Major Major Major
@opiejeanne: oh that’s cool.
And it can’t be that hard for a Londoner to act like an Ankh-Morporkian, they’re the same thing!
Kristine
I’m in. I do like Susan.
My favorite dialogue duels are those between Lord Vetinari and Sam Vimes. Always loved this one from Feet of Clay:
“Commander, I always used to consider that you had a definite anti-authoritarian streak in you.”
“Sir?”
“It seems that you have managed to retain this even though you are authority.”
“Sir?”
“That’s practically zen.”
opiejeanne
@Major Major Major Major: Not only that, but the conventions are approximately 3 days of cosplay and people take a great deal of trouble with costumes and getting into character (and staying in character). One young guy always showed up at the American ones dressed as a milkman from the 1950s, right down to the well-shined black shoes. It took me a while to figure out who he was supposed to be
We went to one in England and it was even more-so. It was fascinating.
Kristine
@Obvious Russian Troll: If I’d started with the first DW book, I wouldn’t have continued. Things pick up, imo, with the books featuring Death, the Witches or the Night Watch. Not a Rincewind fan, me.
Bruce K
I think it was Neil Gaiman (Pratchett’s collaborator on Good Omens) who said that there was an element of rage under Pratchett’s good cheer – rage at injustice, at cruelty, et cetera, and yeah, that does come through clear as a bell at times, especially when Sam Vimes is on the warpath.
My introduction was Guards! Guards!, which led naturally to Men at Arms and the rest of the Watch books – I found Thud! to be particularly poignant for some reason.
CaseyL
For those interested, there is a third book in the Moist Lipwig series: Raising Steam.
I think it was Pratchett’s last Discworld novel, unless the last Tiffany Aching book was. It is, by Pratchett standards, a bit rushed – the plot moves along more quickly than usual – but still excellent.
NotMax
@opiejeanne
A cherished snippet of movie dialogue (paraphrased from memory but the gist is intact).
“You know what they say. Early to bed and early to rise makes a man healthy, wealthy and wise.”
“Is that so? Have you ever seen a milkman?”
Gaffa
Pratchett was one of the Top 10 best writers of the 20th Century regardless of language. As his lifelong friend Niel Gaiman once remarked on him: “He seems to be the only writer I know who actually enjoys the act of writing.”
I’ve read all the Discworld books one zillion times, but I’m always up for a group re-read of what might be his best novel (although Lord knows there’s lots that could compete with it). Hogfather certainly has my vote for my favorite first paragraph in a Pratchett novel (or, really, any novel).
But as much as I love Hogfather and Death, it’s still not the book that has my all time personal heartbreaker line from our beloved Death in it…
WHAT CAN THE HARVEST HOPE FOR, IF NOT FOR THE CARE OF THE REAPER MAN?
Erin in Flagstaff
Great timing! I already had Hogfather on my to-read list for December. It will be a first-time read for me.
I’ve been reading some Discworld books the last two years and enjoying them. I had read the first three or four books in the series when they were first published, but didn’t keep up with them, so it’s been fun picking them up again.
opiejeanne
@Major Major Major Major:
https://flic.kr/p/cYLgB5
Kristine
What’s the start date for the Hogfather reading?
Spanish Moss
I’m in. A couple of my children are big Pratchett fans, and I have seen the movie. Been meaning to read one of his books for a long time.
cckids
I’m also in. Pratchett is my favorite writer, I could re-read his books forever.
ETA: as a coda to the tweets at the time of his death, my favorite was
“PERHAPS YOU WOULD TELL ME A STORY AS WE WALK.”
Major Major Major Major
@opiejeanne: fun!
Major Major Major Major
@Kristine: I was thinking I’d just give a date for the discussion in a subsequent post? December 19 or 20. Were you imagining a readalong where we talk about it in chunks?
JeanneT
I’m in to reread Hogfather. It’s a good year for it!
Ukai
Hogfather was my introduction to Pratchett and Discworld. Highly recommended. The Sky One adaptation with Michelle Dockery (Downton Abbey) as Susan Sto-Helit is pretty good too.
WereBear
What a great idea! Long time Pratchett fan. Ready to lap myself.
Avalie
Yes! I’m in. Will have to “borrow” my copy back from my kid or maybe just buy another
J R in WV
I enjoyed all the Pratchett books, have a lot of them, but don’t recall this one at all. Will order one for my tablet, looking forward to sharing it with everyone. One of my best friends (clear out in Colorado! Retired ER Doc…) loves the Discworld series, reads it from beginning to end over and over from time to time.
Merry Thanks Giving All ~!!!~ and Happy holidays! I kinda insist on that, as everyone is not Christian, and many who claim to be are not.
rivers
I would love to be part of this!
Nancy
I’m going to read Hogfather. Nice to have like-minded persons to discuss the finer points with. Also have the video–always worth watching.
My heart belongs to Sam Vimes but I also have a fondness for DEATH.
RSA
This is me. Thanks for the recommendation! My library happens to have an online copy that I just checked out.
Anne Laurie
The book is better — and I’ve read it every year around this time since about the time it came out in paperback, so I should know — but the TV adaptation of Hogfather is actually pretty good. Especially the casting of Mr. Teatime… and the scene with Nobby Nobbs and Constable Visit (short for ‘Visit the Infidel with Enlightening Tracts’) in the Hogfather’s department-store grotto!
Comrade Colette
@RSA: Same! I’ve only read a handful of Discworld books, and never Hogfather – just checked out the ebook from my library. New (to me) books! Yay!
O. Felix Culpa
I’m in. I read Guards, Guards at opiejeanne’s recommendation earlier this year and loved it. I also like the Tiffany Aching books. Was not able to finish Good Omens, but might try again at some point. Looking forward to a new good book!
aliasofwestgate
I haven’t reread Hogfather in a few years, So i am definitely up for this.
My intro to Pratchett in the late 90s was Lords and Ladies, i think i followed it up with Small Gods(which in particular remains a fast favorite).
The Watch books, Granny Weatherwax, and i think Tiffany Aching remain my absolute favorites of the whole shebang. But i’d reread any of them in a heartbeat. Rincewind even has his place in things, because you get the whole Faculty of the Unseen University along for the ride and that alone makes for tons of time laughing.
DEATH and his books are poignant but also incredibly wise. I don’t think i’ve ever stopped laughing when reading the Discworld, and i’m glad for it. It shaped a lot of my POV in my 20s, when i started reading them. I even did a version of Susan Sto-Helit costume for Halloween one year back in the 00s. I think Pratchett and Douglas Adams are the few authors that will make me burst out laughing while reading a book, and they remain so.
Bruce K
@CaseyL: I got the sense that Pratchett was rushing in his last few books, too – it felt like he was trying to get them out while he still had the capability to do so, racing against time – perhaps literally trying to finish before Death overtook him. Like a man who had a lot to say still, and not much time left in which to say it.
brantl
@NotMax: I read them a long time ago.
There go two miscreants
Have never read Hogfather, but I will get a copy and join in! I read a couple of the Discworld books and enjoyed them, but I can’t remember which ones — I left them at my grandchildren’s house in the hope of inspiring some reading.
Obvious Russian Troll
@Kristine: I’ve found a lot of series take a few books to get their feet under them. I wouldn’t be surprised if Discworld was like that.
sralloway
Read Hogfather years ago and obtained the video a couple or five years back. The same with my reading of Good Omens. Also obtained the videos Going Postal, The Color of Magic and Johnny and the Bomb. Would love to get Johnny and the Dead, as well. Watched Good Omens on Amazon Prime and really enjoyed the way they interpreted the book. Have always Pratchett’s writing. So sad we lost him.
Death, in Hogfather, was played perfectly, in my estimation.
Kristine
@Major Major Major Major: Yeah. I’ve never bookclubbed, so I didn’t know what to expect. I’m good with whatever the plan is.
Origuy
It’s been a while since I’ve read much Pratchett and I haven’t read all of them, by any means. But I’d like to suggest Pyramids as a standalone to start with. It doesn’t tie in much with the rest of Discworld, taking place in a faraway kingdom.
Suusan
Connie Willis has a couple of collections of short stories centered around Christmas. They are funny and they are happy, which is pretty nice, I think.
Dupe1970
Count me in. I was just thinking about re-reading Discworld series anyways.
Annamal
I remember being a teenager and dragging my parents along to Terry Pratchett doing a reading (I think of Carpe Jungulum). He turned them into lifelong Pratchett fans in a single reading.
Small Gods, Night Watch and Monsterous Regiment are my continuous rereads (I walked a religious pilgrimage with a copy of Small Gods which felt appropriate).
Hogfather not only has the amazing paragraph above but also the magnificent
“But Albert threw snowballs at them until they went away” (it’s only magnificent in context but trust me).
RobertS
@(((CassandraLeo))): I would also add Making Money to this list. Its a fun story that contains some important insights about currency and the banking system.