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You are here: Home / Politics / domestic terrorists / Insurrection Open Thread: Disgraceful

Insurrection Open Thread: Disgraceful

by Anne Laurie|  January 6, 20216:22 pm| 125 Comments

This post is in: domestic terrorists, Goddamned Traitors, GOP Death Cult, Open Threads, Trump Crime Cartel, Lock Him Up...Lock Them All Up

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Trump repeats claims about the election being stolen from him but says, "We can't play into the hands of these people…So go home. We love you. You're very special…I know how you feel, but go home & go in peace." His former chief of staff said many are "domestic terrorists."

— Kaitlan Collins (@kaitlancollins) January 6, 2021

It would be shameful, but these people — and particularly their Dear Leader — are incapable of shame.

Trump is in the private dining room off the Oval Office watching news on the protesters on television, sources tell @SalehaMohsin and me.

— Jennifer Jacobs (@JenniferJJacobs) January 6, 2021

White House adviser tells @Acosta some aides around Trump are furious the president won't do more… but "he doesn't want to”

— Ana Cabrera (@AnaCabrera) January 6, 2021

Dan Lamothe is on the ‘military beat’ for the Washington Post:

BREAKING: The entire D.C. National Guard will be activated today, putting about 1,100 guardsmen on duty tonight, defense official tells me. Comes after breach of Capitol by pro-Trump protesters.

— Dan Lamothe (@DanLamothe) January 6, 2021

So, unarmed protesters in the streets last summer get the military and tear gas and men in unmarked outfits armed to the teeth, but an invasion of the Capitol gets "sorry, we're not home, please leave a message." https://t.co/a123O0U2Zj

— Tom Nichols (@RadioFreeTom) January 6, 2021

The D.C. National Guard is not controlled by the Mayor; it’s controlled by the President.

The lack of a military response right now is a failure by the *federal* government to respond to an assault on one of its most important institutions engaging in its most important duty.

— Steve Vladeck (@steve_vladeck) January 6, 2021

This tracks with previous reporting: Request was made and did not get an immediate response. https://t.co/kX75XyaPNH

— Dan Lamothe (@DanLamothe) January 6, 2021

This is nuts. The Acting Secretary of Defense acknowledging that he and the Joint Chiefs Chairman did not discuss deploying the National Guard with President Trump – but rather with VP Pence and Congressional leaders. pic.twitter.com/b8gAT9bnSC

— Jamie Dupree (@jamiedupree) January 6, 2021

Cops are taking selfies with the terrorists. pic.twitter.com/EjkQ83h1p2

— Timothy Burke (@bubbaprog) January 6, 2021

still can’t wrap my head around how the MAGA terrorists broke through this wall of heavily armed national guardsm- *taps earpiece* -ah I’m being informed this treatment was for racial injustice protesters pic.twitter.com/c1voc9cv7G

— kilgore trout, brad r’s brother (@KT_So_It_Goes) January 6, 2021

Never forget. Never forgive.

They evacuated Pence out of an "abundance of caution" or to put it in plain English, he's been removed in reaction to a coordinated attack at the direction of the president. https://t.co/RpFBrgruFH

— Natasha Rothwell (@natasharothwell) January 6, 2021

News with @karoun @mikedebonis —> effort underway to persuade Cruz, Hawley and the objectors to stand down from their objections after the pro-Trump mob breached the Capitol today https://t.co/SDPa3yir05

— Seung Min Kim (@seungminkim) January 6, 2021

Sedition. https://t.co/kYEiMIr7Fr

— Tom Nichols (@RadioFreeTom) January 6, 2021

From our Francis Chung, Sen. Josh Hawley greeting protesters in the east side of the Capitol before riots began. pic.twitter.com/I8DjBCDuoP

— Manuel Quinones (@ManuelQ) January 6, 2021

Huh. Weird. Almost like he thought this was all for show and was too dumb to realize he was coddling fascists. https://t.co/33FXKXAWmx

— Chuck Enderlin (@Vote_Chuck) January 6, 2021

"Violence is always unacceptable. But it's also really fun to think about and kind of tacitly encourage, it gets people fired up. But also it's unacceptable. So that's a complicated thing. Anyway I'm in a bunker right now for unrelated reasons." https://t.co/gJrmlkdb5l

— David Roth (@david_j_roth) January 6, 2021

THIS MORNING at the rally Giuliani called for "trial by combat."

Don Jr. told Congressmen who weren't going to vote to overturn the election: "We're coming for you."

— Jake Tapper (@jaketapper) January 6, 2021

A law enforcement source has confirmed to CNN that pipe bombs were found at the headquarters for the DNC, RNC and grounds of the United States Capitol. All of the devices were safely detonated by the police, the source tells @evanperez.

— Ana Cabrera (@AnaCabrera) January 6, 2021

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Reader Interactions

125Comments

  1. 1.

    patrick II

    January 6, 2021 at 6:26 pm

    Joy Reid was just on fire on MSNBC.

  2. 2.

    Nora Lenderbee

    January 6, 2021 at 6:29 pm

    THIS MORNING at the rally Giuliani called for “trial by combat.”

    This 58-year-old woman is ready to meet you one on one, Rudy.

  3. 3.

    jl

    January 6, 2021 at 6:30 pm

    Repeating my comment from previous  thread:

    Omar should be able to  get the bill of impeachment written up in time for the Senate to get the trial over by tonight and kick Trump out. McConnell should be talking with House to get that done, or his name goes down in even more infamy than it does already.

    I’ve heard talk that some in Congress are asking for a quick 25th amendment procedure. OK with me, need to two track this and get the criminal president out asap.

  4. 4.

    Cataphract

    January 6, 2021 at 6:30 pm

    Imagine having an (R) next to your name right now. Traitors. Pigs.

  5. 5.

    patrick II

    January 6, 2021 at 6:31 pm

    I suppose there is some logic to Trump’s motivation to what is happening today, but for the last few weeks he has been trying to get back at Georgia and today the country. Vindictiveness, regardless of outcome, is the motivator for Trump.

  6. 6.

    Chyron HR

    January 6, 2021 at 6:32 pm

    This Tweet can’t be replied to, Retweeted, or liked due to a risk of violence.

    The tweets are what’s causing the violence, you fuckers!

  7. 7.

    banditqueen

    January 6, 2021 at 6:32 pm

    The fascist orange brute told his brownshirts to stand down and stand by, then he told them to come–and neither he nor they are finished with their attempted coup.

  8. 8.

    jl

    January 6, 2021 at 6:34 pm

    I surmised to someone, or maybe commented on this blog, that Trump may have come back to DC to agitate and pep talk and cajole and threaten his Congressional flunkies to do whatever necessary for what he envisioned as his last stand on Jan 6. Wonder if he did anything else. That should be investigated. Let his lawyer flunkies run to court and try to argue again that the president, as a tin pot dictator, can never even be investigated.

  9. 9.

    zhena gogolia

    January 6, 2021 at 6:35 pm

    Hey, maybe he should write something in the NYT that's a little stronger. I hear he's willing to do that if once the hue of the crowd gets darker than "eggshell" https://t.co/aqR09XODst— Tom Nichols (@RadioFreeTom) January 6, 2021

  10. 10.

    Martin

    January 6, 2021 at 6:35 pm

    I’m seeing members of Congress calling for the expulsion of their fellow members for their support of this. I’m sure there will be motions, I hope to hell they succeed.

  11. 11.

    trollhattan

    January 6, 2021 at 6:35 pm

    @Nora Lenderbee:

    Careful, Rudy has a combat ribbon from the Battle of the Tavern on the Green.

  12. 12.

    Jerzy Russian

    January 6, 2021 at 6:35 pm

    If we can’t have arrests and convictions of various offenders, I would settle for Ted Cruz getting his face punched repeatedly on national TV.

  13. 13.

    Josie

    January 6, 2021 at 6:35 pm

    Interestingly enough, I received an email from Beto O’Rourke this morning asking me to join his organization, Powered by People, in their mission to register voters and stay in touch with them in preparation for the next election.  I am determined to do so and do everything in my power to see that Ted Cruz no longer represents the state of Texas.  I have always disliked him intensely, but now I feel a white hot hatred that is hard to describe.

  14. 14.

    Wapiti

    January 6, 2021 at 6:36 pm

    @jl: 25th is Pence’s job. Impeachment is Congress’. They need to do what’s in their lane.

  15. 15.

    Leto

    January 6, 2021 at 6:36 pm

    Never forget. Never forgive.

    My people are correct.

  16. 16.

    lamh36

    January 6, 2021 at 6:36 pm

    Mitt Romney’s balls finally dropped I guess.

    Mitt Romney: “What happened here today was an insurrection, incited by the President of the United States.”
    https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1346961131051515904?s=20

  17. 17.

    Subsole

    January 6, 2021 at 6:37 pm

    @Josie: Cool.

    Fuck the GOP. I am seething.

  18. 18.

    lamh36

    January 6, 2021 at 6:37 pm

    That bish Ivanka tweeted this AM calling these terrorists “patriots”.  The bish deleted it once the violence started

    Screencaps exist bish!

    https://twitter.com/dopeboijrr/status/1346944773769359366/photo/1

  19. 19.

    MattF

    January 6, 2021 at 6:38 pm

    Apparently, Congress is staying in session this evening– at an undisclosed location–  so who knows what might happen… No point in speculating, but nothing would surprise me at this point.

  20. 20.

    jl

    January 6, 2021 at 6:38 pm

    @Wapiti: What I heard on the news is just that the talk about doing the 25th is currently coming from Congress. But you are correct, it is Pence’s and the cabinet’s job. Why aren’t they doing their clear duty?

  21. 21.

    John S.

    January 6, 2021 at 6:39 pm

    The national disgrace continues. With a curfew in effect, these scumbag traitors are still on the streets and the police are not doing a fucking thing about it.

  22. 22.

    L85NJGT

    January 6, 2021 at 6:41 pm

    Hawley and Cruz should have a slap fight at the top of the Capitol steps to determine who is “the successor”. Neither has the C list Q rating, or reality show chops to pull it off, but they seem to believe it’s there for the taking.

  23. 23.

    Subsole

    January 6, 2021 at 6:41 pm

    @John S.:

    Work forces, burn crosses…

  24. 24.

    banditqueen

    January 6, 2021 at 6:41 pm

    @lamh36:  Ms Ivanky-vank will never be Senator Barbie–she can keep on keeping on with her hair flipping and rictus smiles for her twitter selfies–that’s as much limelight as she’ll get.

  25. 25.

    Benw

    January 6, 2021 at 6:42 pm

    Breaking that apparently Pence deployed the DC NG – not Trump! Holy shit

    Pelosi says the House will reconvene tonight

  26. 26.

    jl

    January 6, 2021 at 6:42 pm

    Pence apparently knows whether Trump refused to do his duty, and he almost certainly  refused. He should start 25th amendment process. Congress should impeach, convict and remove from office asap.

    @nytimes

    ” Vice President Mike Pence, not President Trump, approved the order to deploy the D.C. National Guard on Wednesday, defense and administration officials said. It was unclear why the president, who is still the commander in chief, did not give the order. ”

    https://twitter.com/nytimes/status/1346951431195144200

  27. 27.

    lamh36

    January 6, 2021 at 6:42 pm

    Here’s the clip of Joy Ann righteous rant!

    “White Americans aren’t afraid of the cops. White Americans are never afraid of the cops, even when they’re committing an insurrection,” @JoyAnnReid says about the Trump supporters rioting the US Capitol

    https://twitter.com/MSNBC/status/1346961872428421122?s=20

  28. 28.

    Eunicecycle

    January 6, 2021 at 6:43 pm

    @patrick II: She was. Righteously angry.

  29. 29.

    Geminid

    January 6, 2021 at 6:43 pm

    @jl: I want to see Congress finish counting the Electoral votes and certify Biden’s win before they do anything else. But it sounds like that is happening now.

  30. 30.

    MattF

    January 6, 2021 at 6:45 pm

    @MattF: Joint session will resume at the Capitol, per Pelosi.

  31. 31.

    zhena gogolia

    January 6, 2021 at 6:46 pm

    @lamh36:

    Very powerful.

  32. 32.

    jl

    January 6, 2021 at 6:46 pm

    Just heard a reporter, on a national news broadcast, say that Trump’s behavior has ‘certainly raised eyebrows’.

    Edit: some of the media commentary has provided me grim black comedy relief today.

  33. 33.

    Just Some Fuckhead

    January 6, 2021 at 6:46 pm

    Hey, how about those conservative judges though??

  34. 34.

    VOR

    January 6, 2021 at 6:46 pm

    I keep thinking about the cleanup. They will have to check everywhere to see if any pipe bombs or IEDs were left behind. The mob breached Congressional offices, I wonder if any classified information was not secured. Were any SCIFs breached? Were any of these useful idiots acting as agents for a foreign country?

  35. 35.

    Leto

    January 6, 2021 at 6:46 pm

    @lamh36: fucking, preach!

     

    ALSO WHY THE FUCK ARE THE INSURRECTIONISTS STILL OUT AND ABOUT? THERE’S A FUCKING CURFEW; ARREST THEM!

  36. 36.

    banditqueen

    January 6, 2021 at 6:47 pm

    @jl: I hope this means that Pence the dominionist is in effect acting prez while the Fascist-with-orange-on-his-face is lost in his tweets–and I hope the Fascist is impeached and removed from office before Biden/Harris are sworn in.

  37. 37.

    Cheryl Rofer

    January 6, 2021 at 6:47 pm

    Twitter just deleted Trump’s video justifying the insurrection. Good. Now do his account.

    — Brian Tyler Cohen (@briantylercohen) January 6, 2021

  38. 38.

    Suzanne

    January 6, 2021 at 6:48 pm

    Idly wondering what’s going to happen to Josh Hawley’s career.

  39. 39.

    Rusty

    January 6, 2021 at 6:48 pm

    The entire leadership of the capitol police should be fired.  Gross incompetence at best, malfeasance or active collusion at worst.  We really are a failing country.

  40. 40.

    Spanky

    January 6, 2021 at 6:48 pm

    @Nora Lenderbee:

    This 58-year-old woman is ready to meet you one on one, Rudy.

    Can I watch?

  41. 41.

    chopper

    January 6, 2021 at 6:49 pm

    @Cheryl Rofer:

    awful nice of twitter to wait like 3 hours to delete it. fuckers

  42. 42.

    debbie

    January 6, 2021 at 6:49 pm

    @lamh36: 

    As did G.W.’s.

  43. 43.

    Patricia Kayden

    January 6, 2021 at 6:49 pm

    Make no mistake, the so-called leader of our country, who swore to protect and defend the Constitution, directed a horde of white supremacist domestic terrorists to stage a coup to overturn a legitimately decided election. He isn't just encouraging them, he IS them. #traitor— Mary L Trump (@MaryLTrump) January 6, 2021

  44. 44.

    jl

    January 6, 2021 at 6:49 pm

    @banditqueen: Pence knows what happened, and he should act. He can’t do it all by himself, but he can do his duty and start the process. Even looking at it from a completely selfish point of view, it will look better for him when he gives testimony and has to answer questions.

  45. 45.

    Just Some Fuckhead

    January 6, 2021 at 6:51 pm

    @Suzanne: Ima go out on a limb and say nothing but guaranteed reelection.

  46. 46.

    debbie

    January 6, 2021 at 6:51 pm

    @Just Some Fuckhead:

    But, boy, weren’t the Georgia results and Garland’s nomination great things to see?

  47. 47.

    Just Some Fuckhead

    January 6, 2021 at 6:53 pm

    @chopper: Facebook put me in FB jail for thirty days for telling someone they had an overactive imagination on a public thread INSIDE OF TWO MINUTES. So timely response IS possible.

  48. 48.

    Subsole

    January 6, 2021 at 6:53 pm

    @Leto: This too. That park looks incredibly crowded for a curfew.

    Really just highlights that non-conservatives are second class citizens.

  49. 49.

    NotMax

    January 6, 2021 at 6:53 pm

    “Your call from an undisclosed location is very important to us. Please stay on the line.”

    //

  50. 50.

    Geminid

    January 6, 2021 at 6:54 pm

    @MattF: The CNN report you link to is pretty good. Has some details from the gathering of Senators still at the Capitol. Joe Manchin:”We’re not letting those thugs run us off.”

  51. 51.

    Just Some Fuckhead

    January 6, 2021 at 6:54 pm

    @debbie: Yep. If Georgia can replace its Republican Governor with a Democrat, we can let them in the Blue State club.

  52. 52.

    debbie

    January 6, 2021 at 6:54 pm

    Congressional leaders are in the undisclosed location and focusing on the 25th Amendment to get @realDonaldTrump out of office!— AprilDRyan (@AprilDRyan) January 6, 2021

  53. 53.

    lamh36

    January 6, 2021 at 6:55 pm

    @Cheryl Rofer: I’ll say it again.

    Kamala Harris adovcated for suspending Chumps accout in 2019 on the debate stage.   Folks on the same stage laughed at her.  Chris Hayes tried to make her out to be disingenuously pushing a gimmick.

    Imagine if twitter had done that then and Chump at the very least had some idea that there was a consequence to his tweeting and inciting violence and shit

  54. 54.

    Baud

    January 6, 2021 at 6:55 pm

    8 pm restart of certification.

  55. 55.

    Spanky

    January 6, 2021 at 6:55 pm

    @Cheryl Rofer:

    Twitter just deleted Trump’s video justifying the insurrection.

    Careful! That tweet needs to be preserved in accordance with the Presidential Records Act.

    (Also for evidence at his trial.)

  56. 56.

    counterfactual

    January 6, 2021 at 6:56 pm

    @VOR: Ars Technica has an article about an idiot tweeting that since Pelosi’s staffers were evacuated so suddenly they left their computers on, he was going through the office emails.

  57. 57.

    Mary G

    January 6, 2021 at 6:56 pm

    Name a place with tighter security than the Capitol. RIGHT answers only. ???— R A C H I E (@itsmeRachie) January 6, 2021

    High-walled Troy, even after that damned wooden horse was dragged in https://t.co/f4WgDegsCA— Flint Dibble ??? (@FlintDibble) January 6, 2021

  58. 58.

    Subsole

    January 6, 2021 at 6:57 pm

    @Suzanne: Meet your new minority leader…

  59. 59.

    MisterForkbeard

    January 6, 2021 at 6:57 pm

    The effort underway to get Cruz to back down must have failed miserably. I see that he’s out attacking Beto and others for noting his obvious encouragement of sedition and violence and says that Democrats need to calm down and not be violent.

  60. 60.

    lamh36

    January 6, 2021 at 6:57 pm

    Imagine getting shot to death trying to defend that P.O.S. who’s gonna be gone in 2 weeks anyway.

    Chide me if you want to, but what a stupid reason to die for…

  61. 61.

    MCA1

    January 6, 2021 at 6:57 pm

    @jl:  Whoa. That’s…a problem. I really haven’t given much credence to the 25th Amendment talk today, focusing on the need for Congress to impeach again instead, but damn. If Pence is actually in charge right now, wow.

  62. 62.

    Benw

    January 6, 2021 at 6:57 pm

    Joy Reid already told you why they aren’t being arrested, dumbass

  63. 63.

    NotMax

    January 6, 2021 at 6:57 pm

    @jl

    To which someone must ask of Pence, by what authority? He is not vice commander-in-chief.

  64. 64.

    Suzanne

    January 6, 2021 at 6:58 pm

    @lamh36: I hope Ivanka and Jared bought some property abroad. I hope they never feel safe in this country again. My contempt for them is overflowing.

  65. 65.

    jl

    January 6, 2021 at 6:58 pm

    @Baud: Enough time to 25th the guy and get that part over with before the do the count. Besides all the evil and criminality, Trump has clearly gone insane if he thought this vile stunt would work.

    Same for Giuliani and other Trumpster die-hards, but how to deal with them is another matter.

  66. 66.

    trollhattan

    January 6, 2021 at 6:58 pm

    @jl:

    Oh, so those were eyebrows?

  67. 67.

    Immanentize

    January 6, 2021 at 6:58 pm

    @debbie: Congressional leaders have exactly zero to say about the 25th amendment. Cabinet Officials and Pence only.

  68. 68.

    Just Some Fuckhead

    January 6, 2021 at 6:58 pm

    It’s a real shame the White Nationalist group Proud Boys goes by that name because every time they are referred to on television, their name makes them sound completely unserious. In my mind, I always hear “Proud Boys!” shouted out to the tune of Duran Duran’s Wild Boys.

  69. 69.

    Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant)

    January 6, 2021 at 6:58 pm

    I just got home from work. My God.

  70. 70.

    Subsole

    January 6, 2021 at 6:58 pm

     

     

    @debbie: Dear god, yes.

    Can you imagine if the GOP were looking forward to a senate they control??

  71. 71.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    January 6, 2021 at 6:59 pm

    @jl: Agreed.

  72. 72.

    Spanky

    January 6, 2021 at 7:00 pm

    So, what is going on with the DC police? There’s a curfew that’s not being enforced. Over half the force is non-white. I’d really like someone to ask some of these mooks exactly what orders they were given.

    If only there was some profession where someone could gather information, then organize it and  present their written report to the public …

  73. 73.

    MisterForkbeard

    January 6, 2021 at 7:00 pm

    @Just Some Fuckhead: I told someone on facebook that they were “insane” after they started talking about conspiracy theories and how this was really the left causing all the problems and so on.

    They reported me and facebook gave me a warning for “harassment”. I’m contesting it. That warning happened within 10 minutes and was approved by an actual human being.

  74. 74.

    jl

    January 6, 2021 at 7:00 pm

    @NotMax: ” To which someone must ask of Pence, by what authority? He is not vice commander-in-chief. ”

    Jefferson wrote that in some dire emergencies, an official’s first duty is to save the country, and if not legal, then afterward put himself (or these days, herself) at the mercy of the nation.

  75. 75.

    Leto

    January 6, 2021 at 7:01 pm

    The Rioters Who Took Over The Capitol Have Been Planning Online In The Open For Weeks

  76. 76.

    Danielx

    January 6, 2021 at 7:01 pm

    Remembered this evening –

    From The Coming Fury, Bruce Catton:

    …The War Department had gone to great lengths to build up a thoroughly loyal home guard in the District of Columbia to prevent a seizure of power by secessionist sympathizers, and Winfield Scott had remarked that the general tension was such that “a dogfight might cause the gutters of the capital to run with blood”. Just before Lincoln let Springfield, a citizen visited the old general to ask if precautions had been taken to make sure that Congress could formally count the electoral vote; it was being rumored that a mob would rise and prevent it, thus (presumably) making it impossible for Lincoln to take office.

    “I supposed that I had suppressed that infamy,” said General Scott. “Has it been revived? I have said that any man who attempted by force or unparliamentary disorder to obstruct or interfere with the lawful count of the electoral vote for the President and Vice President of the United States should be lashed to the muzzle of a twelve pounder and fired out a window of the Capitol. I would manure the hills of Arlington with the fragments of his body, were he a Senator or chief magistrate of my native state!” Subsiding a little, the general added” “While I command the army there will be no revolution in the city of Washington.”

  77. 77.

    jl

    January 6, 2021 at 7:02 pm

    @Spanky: Video evidence that the police are split, some trying to do their duty while greatly outnumbered, others don’t care to do anything or are collaborating with the rioters and insurrectionists. That is surely complicating things.

  78. 78.

    Just Some Fuckhead

    January 6, 2021 at 7:02 pm

    @Spanky: The onsite reports I saw were journalists wondering who was going to clean this mess up before the inauguration in two weeks.

  79. 79.

    Mrs. D. Ranged in AZ

    January 6, 2021 at 7:04 pm

    I’m just now seeing what is going on because I’ve been buried in work all day.  I am incandescently angry!  How TF did the Capitol Police allow this to happen?!  There is NO way (as Adam said earlier) that they didn’t know this was a possibility.  No matter what, whether they underestimated the threat or they knew and didn’t act to secure the Capitol, some heads need to roll.  In addition, every mothereffer officer who took selfies with the insurrectionists needs to be fired.  And they better round up the terrorists, hell they have their faces on video ffs, and put them in jail…every damn one of them.  So far as I’m concerned only one dead traitor so far is far too few.

  80. 80.

    Just Some Fuckhead

    January 6, 2021 at 7:05 pm

    @MisterForkbeard: In my experience, you get more time in FB jail if you don’t accept their initial decision. I’m up to 41 days in the last two months. My inquiries to them go unanswered. I report other commenters who are guilty of far worse and they reply back that they don’t violate their community standards and I can block them if I want.

  81. 81.

    lamh36

    January 6, 2021 at 7:05 pm

    @debbie: fuq W.  At least Mittens said the work “brought on by the President of the United States”…W couldn’t even manage to even fuq’n directly mention that fuq’er

  82. 82.

    MisterForkbeard

    January 6, 2021 at 7:05 pm

    @Immanentize: It sounds like some of Trump’s cabinet are pretty aghast that he won’t even pretend to care about this, and is still encouraging the seditionists.

    If congressional leaders from both sides tell Pence to pull the trigger, he might do it. He’d do it as a “more in sorrow than in anger” thing, but maybe.

  83. 83.

    NotMax

    January 6, 2021 at 7:06 pm

    @jl

    Addressed the weaknesses of the 25th downstairs.

    Biggest problem is the initial successful invoking of it is reversed simply by a subsequent letter from the president saying “Nope, I’m okay.”

  84. 84.

    Mary G

    January 6, 2021 at 7:06 pm

    Welp, this has caused a miracle. My housemate’s day client is a wealthy long-term Republican crazy lady who worshipped the ground Twitler walked on when he was elected. The housemate is not someone who keeps her mouth shut, so they agreed not to discuss politics. I just got a text from her saying the client told her she was getting out of the Republican Party based on today’s news they’ve been watching all day. I suspect having her taxes go way up after the “tax cut” bill passed a couple of years ago may have been a factor. I know Mimi Walters, her prior GOP rep had been telling her that they would get that fixed and she’s been souring ever since.

  85. 85.

    Subsole

    January 6, 2021 at 7:07 pm

    @lamh36: Stupid people play stupid games for stupid prizes.

    I am far too angry over this shit to weep for these doorknobs.

  86. 86.

    Leto

    January 6, 2021 at 7:07 pm

    So for people who were alive during the 60s: does this have the same existential feel? One of the things that a former boss condescendingly told me almost 5 years ago was that America now (2015/2016) was nowhere near the same level as the 1960s. Does that still hold true? Trying to get a gauge here.

  87. 87.

    MisterForkbeard

    January 6, 2021 at 7:07 pm

    @Just Some Fuckhead: Yeah. I’m not actually in facebook jail, but they did give me a warning. I’m clicked the “I disagree with this decision and want it reviewed by somebody else” button.

    If they uphold the warning, fuck ’em. Not like I’m going to stop telling insane cultists that they’re insane cultists. Not an insult when it’s true and when they’ve just attacked the capitol building.

  88. 88.

    Subsole

    January 6, 2021 at 7:07 pm

    @Benw: The protection of complexion, I believe Rikyrah calls it…

  89. 89.

    jl

    January 6, 2021 at 7:09 pm

    @NotMax: IANAL, but IIRC,  VP and cabinet can veto president’s ‘I’m OK, FU’ letter and then it goes to Congress. Not sure by what procedure Congress decides the matter though.

  90. 90.

    Suzanne

    January 6, 2021 at 7:09 pm

    When HILLARY called them DEPLORABLE…. I knew she was right, but I didn’t realize it was the truest thing ever said.

  91. 91.

    Subsole

    January 6, 2021 at 7:10 pm

    @Leto: Jesus Hussein Christ.

    Why, precisely, IS the FBI, again???

  92. 92.

    mrmoshpotato

    January 6, 2021 at 7:11 pm

    His former chief of staff said many are “domestic terrorists.”

    Which Dump maladministration scumbag called these fascist shitpiles “domestic terrorists?”

  93. 93.

    FelonyGovt

    January 6, 2021 at 7:12 pm

    @Leto: This is many degrees more insane and shocking and horrifying than anything that happened in the 60’s.

  94. 94.

    Leto

    January 6, 2021 at 7:12 pm

    Per MSNBC, Trumpov’s shitter account (twitter) has been locked, warns it could be suspended because he keeps inciting violence. Fucking suspend it already OMFG

  95. 95.

    Just Some Fuckhead

    January 6, 2021 at 7:12 pm

    Whoa, turns out it was a false flag operation by those crafty antifa bastards.

    https://twitter.com/KenPaxtonTX/status/1346954747996205062?s=20

  96. 96.

    Uncle Cosmo

    January 6, 2021 at 7:13 pm

    @Wapiti: You think mebbe the reason he replaced so many Cabinet members with “acting” flunkies recently is he was afraid the originals would 25th him in response to something he was planning?

  97. 97.

    Just Some Fuckhead

    January 6, 2021 at 7:13 pm

    Twitter has locked Trump’s account for inciting violence. Good christ, that only took four fucking years.

  98. 98.

    MattF

    January 6, 2021 at 7:14 pm

    @Leto: What I’ve read is that if he doesn’t delete the offending tweets, his account will be locked permanently.

  99. 99.

    Leto

    January 6, 2021 at 7:14 pm

    @Suzanne: they had a chance to show us that wasn’t true, but a face eating tiger doesn’t change it’s stripes.

  100. 100.

    Just Some Fuckhead

    January 6, 2021 at 7:15 pm

    @MisterForkbeard: To be fair, I’m on a watchlist. I don’t need to be reported. My public comments go right to the head office for examination.

  101. 101.

    NotMax

    January 6, 2021 at 7:15 pm

    @Leto

    It’s of a different level. Off the cuff,

    The 60s were a protracted expression of protest and unrest seated in the frontal lobes.

    Today (and the protracted simmerings and eruptions leading up to it) are an expression of unrest and protest seated in the limbic lizard brain.

  102. 102.

    Subsole

    January 6, 2021 at 7:17 pm

    @NotMax: It’s not a protest, it’s a temper tantrum.

    They lost and they’re flipping the table.

  103. 103.

    jl

    January 6, 2021 at 7:18 pm

    Trump needs to be removed from power right now. He still can can cause a huge constitutional crisis by trying to order the military to pull some BS, declare martial law, try to do some BS invoking of the insurrection act (on the pretext of controlling his own supporters? Or maybe declaring that the police who actually did their jobs today are traitors?) Who knows what that criminally insane moron will try next?

    Maybe Pence is running things and everyone is pretending that Trump delegated his powers to him? Who knows?

  104. 104.

    catclub

    January 6, 2021 at 7:18 pm

    @MisterForkbeard: It sounds like some of Trump’s cabinet are pretty aghast that he won’t even pretend to care about this

     

    is it to the level of Collins furrowed brows, yet?

  105. 105.

    Just Some Fuckhead

    January 6, 2021 at 7:20 pm

    @NotMax

    What if the letter from the president is written in the Vice President’s blood?

  106. 106.

    persistentillusion

    January 6, 2021 at 7:21 pm

    @Nora Lenderbee: This 64 year old white woman will hold your beer and finish grinding the remnants into fine powder.

  107. 107.

    VOR

    January 6, 2021 at 7:27 pm

    @NotMax: Yes, but the 25th has some delays built in. The President can object immediately, but the VP (acting President) has something like 4 days to respond. Then IIRC Congress has up to 21 days to act (i.e. vote) on the President’s request. So it may be possible to simply run out the clock until Trump’s term expires.

  108. 108.

    NotMax

    January 6, 2021 at 7:28 pm

    @jl

    Yes, the V.P. and cabinet must repeat the exercise within four days following the president’s letter (during which interim the president resumes his office – and during which time he/she presumably could fire cabinet members before they repeat their participation), and then both chambers of Congress must assent within 21 days following that.

    As I mentioned in the link, it’s a clunky vehicle.

  109. 109.

    NotMax

    January 6, 2021 at 7:35 pm

    @VOR

    See #108. The 25th’s aim was mostly to address severe physical (medical) incapacity.

  110. 110.

    KenK

    January 6, 2021 at 7:37 pm

    @Leto: @86 No, this is far worse, IMO.

    This is far more existential because of the number of people willing, if not eager to assume the cape of autocracy.

  111. 111.

    Zelma

    January 6, 2021 at 7:44 pm

    @Leto:

    Actually, this feels much worse than 1968-76.  Except for the assassinations.  I never felt that the Republican supporters of Nixon were as numerous or as nutty as Trumpsters.  And, say what you will about Nixon, he was not interested in destroying the Constitution.  And he never called for an attack on the Congress.  I never thought I’d see something like this.

  112. 112.

    WaterGirl

    January 6, 2021 at 7:45 pm

    @Immanentize: I was thinking that some of them might have influence with cabinet members?

  113. 113.

    VOR

    January 6, 2021 at 7:46 pm

    @NotMax: Yes it was. Nobody thought about a President like Trump.

    IANAL, but the text is fairly clear. Per the amendment, the President can object immediately and the VP & cabinet have 4 days to confirm their initial vote. If they confirm, then Congress has to vote and needs a 2/3rd vote of both Houses to uphold the VP’s determination, which is a pretty high bar. However, Congress has “twenty-one days after receipt of the latter written declaration”, I assume for debate, before taking the vote. So that’s 25 days. If Congress is not in session then they must assemble within 48 hours and then has 21 days before the vote.

    The bar for upholding the 25th is actually higher than impeachment, but it seems like you could simply run out the clock for the remaining 14 days of the Trump administration.

  114. 114.

    WaterGirl

    January 6, 2021 at 7:48 pm

    @Leto: Holy fuck.

  115. 115.

    Skepticat

    January 6, 2021 at 7:54 pm

    @Nora Lenderbee: This 58-year-old woman is ready to meet you one on one, Rudy. Oh, please, let this 74-year-old woman help.

  116. 116.

    Skepticat

    January 6, 2021 at 8:00 pm

    @Just Some Fuckhead: I always hear “Proud Boys!”

    Funny, I always hear “pud boys.”

  117. 117.

    Skepticat

    January 6, 2021 at 8:05 pm

    I want a medal given to the alert Senate staffer who rescued the hard-copy Electoral College ballots, which almost were left behind when they evacuated the chamber. However, it ought not be the Presidential Medal of Freedom, because that’s been utterly devalued.

  118. 118.

    Nora Lenderbee

    January 6, 2021 at 8:07 pm

    @persistentillusion: @Skepticat:   All of us, Katie.

  119. 119.

    Kattails

    January 6, 2021 at 8:08 pm

    Well I just tried to call Traitorous Ted Cruz to tell him that I’ve scraped dog shit off my shoe that was less odious than he is, but oddly enough the mailbox was full.

  120. 120.

    There are those who call me...tim... (Still posh)

    January 6, 2021 at 8:20 pm

    I fucking beg the Repiglicans to proceed with their objections and tomorrow deny they are part and parcel of that whole shit scene today.

  121. 121.

    sab

    January 6, 2021 at 8:31 pm

    @Leto: This feels much worse than the 60s, and I spent all of high school going to protests and working on political campaigns. ( Most of the adults volumteering on those campaigns were returned Vietnam vets.)

    Nixon was awful but he wasn’t batshit insane. His cabinet people were strong-willed and competent.

  122. 122.

    NotMax

    January 6, 2021 at 8:43 pm

    @VOR

    I will repeat that upon receipt of the letter of competency from the president, the status of the v.p. as Acting President ends and all the authority and power of the office is restored to the president, who *could” immediately fire all or any of the cabinet, effectively putting a halt to the subsequent procedure outlined in the rest of the amendment.

  123. 123.

    topclimber

    January 6, 2021 at 9:15 pm

    @NotMax: Get rid of the cabinet and Pence becomes a majority of one. He repeats the finding of incapacity and then lets the 21-day cooling off period run, with Biden taking office along the way. This assumes acting cabinet members can’t vote and that the Senate refuses to ratify any new ones in time for Trump to prevail.

    Another possibility: Those cabinet members who vote him out are unreachable (for security reasons) and do not get the news of their firing before they vote him out again. Naturally, they don’t accept email or tweets as appropriate notification. If they insist Trump delivers the news in person, they can delay for weeks while his lard ass moves around DC. Those letters of resignation they signed upon taking the job–make him prove they are legit.

    Personally I prefer impeachment. Even without conviction, the Loser-in-Chief gets the YUUGE distinction of being the only President impeached twice.

    Congress has no obligation to hold hearings or give him a chance to respond to charges (these are mere norms, which we now know are irrelevant). Impeach him for sedition and incitement to riot –should take no more than 15 minutes to pass that. Then slow walk the trial in the Senate. Adjourn it as moot when Biden takes office.

    Yes, I agree this is all wonderful fantasy. But the endgame is the same. He is done as President. Let us count the ways.

  124. 124.

    Kattails

    January 6, 2021 at 9:18 pm

    @Leto: I just wrote a bunch of shit and deleted it.  Thread’s probably dead now, but WTH. The outward demonstrations during the 60’s were certainly more in number and intensity as the decade wore on and the body count kept rising, with no sense of victory in sight.

    You can’t compare the two.  The 60’s had an external enemy that was Godless Communism and the overrunning of the entirety of Asia. It was a convenient smokescreen for a shit ton of evil goings-on in our own government.  There were three major news networks and newspapers to get your information from, all spouting the same thing.

    The last number of years have not seen anywhere near the level of demonstrations and violence, until this past year, and those for different reasons.  Yet more news, in depth, is available through so many more sources.  which also leaves it all wide open to so much more propaganda. The threat from our own government then and now is something most people don’t see or care to believe. Back then it was more obvious  because the government was actively perpetuating a horror that directly affected a lot of lives. People’s kids were coming home in body bags or with terrible wounds or PTSD and it went on and on and there was a lot of it.  There was a draft, no one could say “Well they knew what they signed up for”. We’re not going to go back to the 60’s. The domestic threats are similar, but the environment is completely different.

    But as I see Sab said, Nixon wasn’t batshit insane either. Remember, he had great support right up until the end.

  125. 125.

    lowtechcyclist

    January 7, 2021 at 6:51 am

    @Kattails:

    Remember, [Nixon] had great support right up until the end.

    Actually, his approval numbers dropped into the 20s right after the Saturday Night Massacree (October 1973), and with only brief exceptions, stayed in the 20s right to the end.

    https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/09/25/how-the-watergate-crisis-eroded-public-support-for-richard-nixon/

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