Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

It’s time for the GOP to dust off that post-2012 autopsy, completely ignore it, and light the party on fire again.

Come on, man.

T R E 4 5 O N

Prediction: the GOP will rethink its strategy of boycotting future committees.

I really should read my own blog.

The poor and middle-class pay taxes, the rich pay accountants, the wealthy pay politicians.

“Everybody’s entitled to be an idiot.”

Accused of treason; bitches about the ratings. I am in awe.

Red lights blinking on democracy’s dashboard

“Can i answer the question? No you can not!”

Battle won, war still ongoing.

Incompetence, fear, or corruption? why not all three?

Good lord, these people are nuts.

Never entrust democracy to any process that requires republicans to act in good faith.

Optimism opens the door to great things.

Let us savor the impending downfall of lawless scoundrels who richly deserve the trouble barreling their way.

Putin must be throwing ketchup at the walls.

Wow, you are pre-disappointed. How surprising.

It’s always darkest before the other shoe drops.

Come on, media. you have one job. start doing it.

You can’t attract Republican voters. You can only out organize them.

Sitting here in limbo waiting for the dice to roll

It may be funny to you motherfucker, but it’s not funny to me.

If you’re pissed about Biden’s speech, he was talking about you.

You are here: Home / Open Threads / Cold to See Clear

Cold to See Clear

by | 233 Comments

This post is in: 

I spent a lot of time overnight reading accounts of Wednesday’s insurrection. Here are some things that struck me:

First, At some point Wednesday afternoon, the only thing standing between complete looting, perhaps even burning of the Capitol was a relatively small group of Metro DC Police.

After rioters were already inside the building, the D.C. police reinforcements, led by a D.C. police officer, Inspector Robert Glover, began to take charge inside the Capitol itself.

To start, he sent a contingent of Capitol Police and D.C. officers to retake the Capitol’s famed Statuary Hall — which one officer said was “like a mosh pit” full of shoving rioters. Then he sent officers to make a floor-by-floor search, corralling rioters and escorting them out.

“If it wasn’t for Inspector Glover, we would have probably lost both chambers to looting and had a complete overtaking of the building,” the officer on the scene said. The officer spoke on the condition of anonymity because he is not allowed to speak to the news media.

Obviously that’s one officer’s point of view, but it explains a lot of things that have enraged us.  It answers why police didn’t arrest everyone:  They didn’t have enough officers, and there was still a mob outside and the building doors were open — if they started rounding up this mob they might have outraged that mob and had another invasion on their hands.  It explains why there’s some video of officers saying nice things to rioters and assisting them down the stairs:  At that point, you say anything to get them out and re-assert control of the building.  This was de-escalation 101 because these MAGAts had backpacks full of God knows what, and job one with the resources at hand was to get them the fuck out of the building.  I’m not ignoring or downplaying the huge overlay of white privilege, as I wrote yesterday.

Second, fucking Trump conspired to create a situation where an understaffed and unprotected Capitol was overrun by a mob.  First, his minions greatly limited the DC National Guard’s mission and equipment, meaning they had to go to an armory to get equipment before they could be deployed to the Capitol.  The governors of Maryland and Virginia describe a 90 minute delay.  DC is full of federal cops – none of them were deployed by (who is the Attorney General today?) and other federal agencies, probably because Trump and his crowd in the White House subtly or overtly pressured them not to.  To me, this is the most execrable of Trump’s offenses.

Third, I don’t know the right strategy for Pelosi and Schumer.  The resignations of Elaine Chao and Betsy DeVos, and Pence’s refusal to even talk with them, indicates that the Trump cabinet isn’t ready to commit what they perceive to be political suicide.  They were all gutless fucks in the first place, because that’s what Trump surrounds himself with.  He has a connoisseur’s eye for a sycophantic chickenshit.  So, it falls to Pelosi and Schumer.  I think their strategy is to let this cook a little more in hopes that Pence will finally be pushed to invoke the 25th, or enough Republicans will cave to have a conviction in the Senate.  Sadly, neither of those things is probable.  Pence, his wife and his brother were in the Capitol and came within minutes of being killed by a Trump mob, yet he’s hiding out.  And it’s hard to see 17 Republican Senators voting to convict.  Still, I think it’s obvious that another impeachment is necessary.

Finally, fuck Josh Hawley.  He and Cruz need to pay.

On the topic of how close we came, this piece by Paul Campos, and the thread by Luke Russert in the piece, are well worth a read.

Reader Interactions

233Comments

  2. 2.

    cmorenc

    DC is full of federal cops – none of them were deployed by (who is the Attorney General today?) and other federal agencies, probably because Trump and his crowd in the White House subtly or overtly pressured them not to.  To me, this is the most execrable of Trump’s offenses.

    In particular, no one within Trump’s Administration with actual authority to call in reinforcement from the DC National Guard, or to request assistance from the Md or Va National Guards, seemed to be in any hurry to do so – leaving Capitol police to deal with the invading mob with what tactics were feasible with the inadequate manpower already on the scene for the an uncomfortably long time (couple of hours).  Neither Trump nor anyone plausibly in the necessary chain of command (eg acting Secretary of Defense) showed any urgency in calling out the DC national guard to the scene, nor requesting other outside assistance.

  3. 3.

    Wapiti

    Pass the Impeachment Articles. Then you get Republican Senators calling Pence to get off his dead ass (while they stall on conviction.) It gives a sliver of hope that the Constitution is intact, and risks some damage to Republican leadership.

  4. 4.

    germy

    When countless citizens lost voting rights to criminal offenses over marijuana possession, a White man trespasses onto the lawmaking chambers of the supposed free nation and lights a joint to parade his privilege. Read that as many times as you need to. https://t.co/RgfcJMcHDn

    — Havana Hübbie (@BlackTiePenguin) January 7, 2021

  7. 7.

    Nicole

    They should still impeach.  They can continue the trial to convict even after he’s out of office, and if he’s convicted, he can’t ever run for Federal office again (which means no more fundraising).  There are a bushel basketful of GOPers who have their eyes on 2024, it seems to me the possibility of eliminating him from running for anything ever again might be enough to lure some of them over to do what’s right.

  8. 8.

    gvg

    It’s not up to Pence alone. He has to get more than half the agency heads to support him and stick with it against a large number of deranged Trump supporters, for weeks of pressure. In addition, while I think the Secret Service will protect him, they don’t protect the other senior staff that have to support him. Those people are on their own against terrorists.  Another angle is Biden asked for specific trusted Secret Service people he knew could be trusted. What if Pence doesn’t know who to trust?  He has been part of Trumps supporters and now he isn’t. He may doubt his own protection detail now.  I don’t think he can get the support to invoke it, and he dares not say he is trying unless he has already got the support lined up. It is not really doable it looks to me.

    Impeach him now.

  9. 9.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Cheryl Rofer: It’s going to take some time, but we will find threads of organization through the rioters.

    I can’t imagine there isn’t a significant electronic trail: Facebook, Twitter, Parler, Reddit…

  10. 10.

    Frankensteinbeck

    I watched video of the crowd at the front gate.  They weren’t determined to get in until they had a door to beat on and feel brave.  They were harassing half a dozen unarmed-looking guards until somebody got the guts to push through, and even then it wasn’t a stampede.  Never forget how much talking tough about violent rebellion and then doing nothing is a religion for conservatives.  With actual security, this would not have happened.

  11. 11.

    Matt McIrvin

    Congress should act ASAP. I’m seeing a lot of blame of Democrats going around for Trump not being re-impeached already.

  12. 12.

    jonas

    So I’ve read some contradicting reporting about what happened with the DC national guard. It looks now like Trump’s Pentagon appointees were purposefully slow-walking any deployment. But other observers are saying that top Pentagon brass were hesitant to hit the deploy button because they didn’t want Trump and his stooges in charge of a large armed force in the capital. And then it was reported that *Pence* had taken charge of the operation was giving the orders, which was just insane.

    Is it the case that the DC guard would have been at Trump’s personal command had it been deployed Wednesday? And do we know what the hell Pence was doing in all this?

  15. 15.

    KNay

    I think any mention of Cruz or Hawley should be as “The Insurrectionist from Texas or the Insurrectionist from Missouri”  No one should refer to them by their elected titles, they should no be given the courtesy of a dignified title. I’d also find “Fucking Insurrectionist” acceptable.

  18. 18.

    Another Scott

    Agreed that we’re still in the “fog of war” aspects of the invasion of the Capitol.  We, and they, don’t know the full story of what happened and who did (and didn’t) do what when.  I’m reminded of early NPR reporting from inside the Pentagon on 9/11 that was confused and the reporter didn’t know what was happening for tens of minutes or an hour or more… We shouldn’t jump to blame the officers who were on the scene. The investigation will take time.

    Relatedly, GovExec (from yesterday):

    The Trump administration on Thursday instructed all political appointees to submit their resignation letters by Jan. 20, ensuring they exit federal agencies upon President-elect Biden’s swearing in.

    The memorandum, first reported by Politico, comes far later than the equivalent one by President Obama, who issued a similar memo in November 2016 and asked to have the letters in hand by Dec. 7 that year. President Trump has refused to concede the election, however, delaying a number of transition steps.

    The news of resignation letters may have little or nothing to do with the 25th Amendment. It’s yet another example of Donnie and his minions trying to break the Transition.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  19. 19.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @Cheryl Rofer:

    Finding organization will be tough for the reasons I mentioned above.  For every white supremacist actually plotting violence online, you have at least a hundred shouting about how they’ll rise up and shoot the traitors, then going to sleep in their easy chairs.  Having photos to backtrack the few who looked serious will probably be the key to separating wheat from chaff.

  20. 20.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    I know it’s Hugh Hewitt and Ben Sasse, and a weaselly phrase, “refuses to rule out”, but…

    Hugh Hewitt @hughhewitt 3h
    Just now @bensasse declined to rule out impeachment and removal of President Trump, instead reserving judgment as to what would be in the best interests of the Constitution long term. He also believes the Republican National Committee to be deeply broken.

  22. 22.

    Elizabelle

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:   A funny tweet I saw yesterday:

    Marcus Strong:  Half of Parler right now is saying this is a false flag by antifa, and the the other half is posting pictures from the capitol saying this is me! i’m doing this!

  23. 23.

    Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix

  25. 25.

    OzarkHillbilly

    DC is full of federal cops – none of them were deployed by (who is the Attorney General today?) and other federal agencies, probably because Trump and his crowd in the White House subtly or overtly pressured them not to.

    Capitol Police rejected offers of federal help to quell mob

    WASHINGTON (AP) — Three days before supporters of President Donald Trump rioted at the Capitol, the Pentagon asked the U.S Capitol Police if it needed National Guard manpower. And as the mob descended on the building Wednesday, Justice Department leaders reached out to offer up FBI agents. The police turned them down both times, according to senior defense officials and two people familiar with the matter.

    Despite plenty of warnings of a possible insurrection and ample resources and time to prepare, the Capitol Police planned only for a free speech demonstration.

    Still stinging from the uproar over the violent response by law enforcement to protests last June near the White House, officials also were intent on avoiding any appearance that the federal government was deploying active duty or National Guard troops against Americans.

    The result is the U.S. Capitol was overrun Wednesday and officers in a law enforcement agency with a large operating budget and experience in high-security events protecting lawmakers were overwhelmed for the world to see. Four protesters died, including one shot inside the building.

  27. 27.

    gene108

    @Nicole:

    They should still impeach.

    The House will impeach. Articles of impeachment are drawn up. They just need to make sure they clear the proper procedural hurdles.

    I expect no later than Monday for the impeachment vote to take place.

  29. 29.

    Jeffro

    I don’t care if they have enough GOP Senators willing to convict – just. do. it.  Impeach him and leave the rest up to them and their conscience.  Do. It.

  30. 30.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    And it’s hard to see 17 Republican Senators voting to convict.  Still, I think it’s obvious that another impeachment is necessary.

    My understanding is an impeached president’s powers are limited until the Senate decides.  If so, two weeks of the Senate dragging their feet will get Dumb Ass Donny, Daughter Bothering backside out of office.

  31. 31.

    bluefoot

    @Frankensteinbeck: If the FBI was able to interview every employer and contact of visa holders from Muslim countries after Sept 11th, they can certainly figure this out.  But god forbid we investigate white people who are looking to overthrow the US government violently.

  33. 33.

    Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix

    @OzarkHillbilly:  I am doubting that story because I don’t understand the sourcing, but I’m sure it might be right, and obviously the Capitol Police leadership and the Sergeants at Arms are responsible (and they’re all gone now).

  34. 34.

    The Moar You Know

    Still stinging from the uproar over the violent response by law enforcement to protests last June near the White House, officials also were intent on avoiding any appearance that the federal government was deploying active duty or National Guard troops against Americans

    @OzarkHillbilly: I don’t know about the rest of it but this is absolute horseshit.  Since when do cops care about “avoiding the appearance” of ANYTHING in this country?

    Just another attempt to dump the blame on “antifa” and BLM.  I’m not having it.

  35. 35.

    gene108

    @Matt McIrvin:

    Congress should act ASAP. I’m seeing a lot of blame of Democrats going around for Trump not being re-impeached already.

    I just want to note that in America, you don’t get to have one free coup attempt. That’s why we are readying Articles of Impeachment for introduction this Monday. https://t.co/qiGzHsHl1m— Ted Lieu (@tedlieu) January 8, 2021

  36. 36.

    different-church-lady

    The asymmetry built into the situation is depressing at best and terrifying at worst: law enforcement in Trump’s thrall escalate on peacefull protestors to show irrefutable authority, while his citizen goons need to be treated with de-escalation in order to mitigate the additional catostophic harm they might do.

    There’s nothing fair, right, equitable, or safe about the situation. The remedies are long and difficult, but they start with getting Justice out of Trump’s hands, and proactive investigation and procecution at the level we took against organized crime.

  39. 39.

    Barbara

    @OzarkHillbilly: This is bullshit.  Not that they rejected help, but that they rejected help because they were “still stinging” from what happened last summer.   I don’t know why they rejected help, but, for instance, Maxine Waters personally asked the chief of the Capitol Police if they were prepared for the threat of potentially violent Proud Boy members and he said that they were, which appears to have been a complete lie.  As others have noted, if you don’t want to give off the appearance of an armed state but are worried about threats of violence, you get officers with appropriate training and tactical gear to sit in vans parked nearby so that they can be deployed quickly if needed but are not highly visible if in fact nothing happens.  The answer to the grotesque use of force last summer was not to lie down and not prepare to use force at all if necessary.  There is going to be a lot of misinformation coming out of law enforcement sources in the next few days trying to cover their asses for some monumental failures.  Some are already blaming Muriel Bowser for asking them not to go overboard.  As if she is responsible for the safety of the Capitol and is if they have not been ignoring every District official’s ideas and offers of help for the last four years.  Oh right, they decided to listen to Bowser JUST THIS ONE TIME when she made a law enforcement related request.  No, they didn’t.

  42. 42.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    @jonas: Do notice that the DC Guard was deployed until after the Virginia and Maryland Guard was sent. One could read that as the Pentagon didn’t act until they were sure Trump and his cronies couldn’t user the DC Guard as their private army.

  45. 45.

    japa21

    Obviously that’s one officer’s point of view, but it explains a lot of things that have enraged us. It answers why police didn’t arrest everyone: They didn’t have enough officers, and there was still a mob outside and the building doors were open — if they started rounding up this mob they might have outraged that mob and had another invasion on their hands. It explains why there’s some video of officers saying nice things to rioters and assisting them down the stairs: At that point, you say anything to get them out and re-assert control of the building. This was de-escalation 101 because these MAGAts had backpacks full of God knows what, and job one with the resources at hand was to get them the fuck out of the building.

    Thank you for saying this. As one tweet pointed out, we are not asking for these people to be treated badly and shot (well, some are) but instead we are asking that the peaceful protestors on our side not be shot.

    @Elizabelle: I have trumpista relatives, and they are doing both. Supprting the invaders and claiming it was antifa. Actually laugh at their efforts.

  46. 46.

    MCA1

    Good assortment of topics here.

    Re: Hawley, it’s been a distinct pleasure seeing his career go splat so quickly. Both in-state major newspapers in Missouri have called on him to resign, and I saw this morning that Senator Coons has, as well. That’s following Danforth’s very public expressions of regret at having nursed him in his political infancy. He’s done. Buh bye. Cruz’s ambitions for the future have evaporated, too.

    On impeachment, have no fear, it’s happening. Ass’t Speaker announced this morning that it’s in the works and House could vote as early as Tuesday/Wednesday. I wanted it to happen yesterday, 10 minutes after they finished the Biden vote confirmation, but I’ll take it. This will be the first president to be impeached twice. I’m curious how broad or specific the Articles will be. Would like the dereliction of duty necessary to not immediately deploy all available federal resources to the Capitol when the next THREE people in the presidential line of succession are all there to be included.

    As for the 25th, I heard Myles Taylor yesterday, asked by Nicolle Wallace, whether it would go anywhere. He couldn’t name any specific cabinet members he thought would actually have the stones to get on board, though seemed to suspect there were some who privately acknowledged the danger Drumpf posed who might. His more important point, however, was that no matter how humiliated, no matter how insulted, Mike Pence was a f’ing coward who never once contradicted his boss no matter how inappropriate he was being, and so while he might want to stab Dotard in the back, there was no chance Pence would be willing to be the primary mover here. With Chao and now DeVos also both exiting stage left, it’s pretty unlikely. Whether they left out of their own cowardice about doing the right thing (including to avoid collateral damage to a spouse’s political fortunes – side note, this is why it should have been a major fucking scandal to have Chao named to a cabinet position and she never should have been confirmed), or because the cabinet members already determined there weren’t enough 25th Amendment votes so there’s no point in staying, doesn’t really matter at this point. They’re two relatively rational voices gone.

  48. 48.

    Immanentize

    @Barbara: Bowser asked for “a light footprint” which is exactly what your agents in vans thing means.  Available defensive force, but not a showy provocative display.

  50. 50.

    PPCLI

    @OzarkHillbilly: Maybe this happened. But before believing it, I’ll wait until there is a story sourced to someone besides anonymous “senior defense officials” for this story shifting blame from the Administration.

  51. 51.

    mapaghimagsik

    Stories are going to come out, I guess. But Iaw enforcement has always been good about setting up narratives that justify their actions. The fog of war is going to get replaced with propaganda. For me, the narrative that DC police had no intelligence about what was coming is… bullshit.

    No one should be murdered for doing their job, and I get the idea that the cops who participated as protesters have some real soul searching to do. They, of all people, should know that cosplay can get brutal real fast.

  52. 52.

    Another Scott

    @The Moar You Know: I don’t know the date, but AFAIK, the Senate does not have to be in session for new members to be sworn in.  Lots of things happen (hearings, etc.) without the Senate being in session.

    Corrections welcome.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  54. 54.

    raven

    @Dorothy A. Winsor:

    Georgia’s top elections official will certify the results of runoffs that will tip the power balance of the Senate to Democrats as soon as possible, he told CNN, but he would not commit to completing the task before Joe Biden is inaugurated as President on January 20.

    “We will get that done as soon as we can,” Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger said Thursday, noting he intends to wrap up by Inauguration Day.

  55. 55.

    bluefoot

    @different-church-lady: Not only that, the BLM protests were PEACEFUL protests against racist violence. This was planned, publicized armed insurrection with the intent of committing violence and disruption of the federal government.  So them saying they “learned” from the summer is complete and utter excuse-making bullshit.

  57. 57.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @MCA1:

    As for the 25th, I heard Myles Taylor yesterday, asked by Nicolle Wallace, whether it would go anywhere.

    Something utterly cowed Trump.  For a malignant narcissist to publicly concede requires gigantic pressure.

  58. 58.

    scav

    There’s undoubtedly multiple, largely uncoordinated, lines of organization (defined broadly) and the cheap and easy and photogenic was at least in part live-streamed. I do hope these confetti-&-cosplay-conspirators aren’t successfully used as cover by the more disciplined subversives. While I’d vastly enjoy rolling up the former clowns, the real task is of course the duller machinations of the latter, especially as they apparently involve ex-military and police elements.

  59. 59.

    Immanentize

    @MCA1: Assistant Speaker — Katherine Clark!  My Rep.  So proud.  She keeps her head down but gets shit done.  If she says it’s happening — it’s happening.

  60. 60.

    hueyplong

    These fuckers live on social media.  They’ll be incredibly easy to identify and track.  It’s not like they have the desire or the ability to flee the country.

    Less sure about the professionals hiding their faces and carrying zip ties.  They probably didn’t spend a lot of time conversing with the rubes.  A knee-jerk suspicion is that they’d be connected to Flynn.

    As for delay, I’m fine with having aspects of this investigation occur after Biden is sworn in.

  62. 62.

    Roger Moore

    @Frankensteinbeck:

    For every white supremacist actually plotting violence online, you have at least a hundred shouting about how they’ll rise up and shoot the traitors, then going to sleep in their easy chairs.

    Finding organization prospectively may be tough, but we know a bunch of the people involved.  Good detective work will identify a lot more.  Once you know who actually did something, you can figure out where they organized and how/if it was different from the people who only talked about it.  That obviously didn’t help to stop the violence this time, but being smart about it might be useful for the next time.

  64. 64.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    Eamon Javers @EamonJavers

    A former Sr. Administration Official tells me sentiment is shifting in the GOP Senate:”In talking with Members of the House and Senate, I get the very real impression that impeachment would succeed right now. Everyone is just tired of Trump, and afraid of what he might do next.”

    CNBC DC reporter, I’m guessing his sources lean right

  65. 65.

    Spanky

    Section 4. Whenever the Vice President and a majority of either the principal officers of the executive departments or of such other body as Congress may by law provide, transmit to the President pro tempore of the Senate and the Speaker of the House of Representatives their written declaration that the President is unable to discharge the powers and duties of his office, the Vice President shall immediately assume the powers and duties of the office as Acting President.

    Having the Cabinet Secretaries resign to avoid invocation of the 25th only lets those individuals off the hook. Every Federal agency has Continuity of Operations plans and chains of succession. There is never not a “principal officer”. Pence could be in contact with each executive department head in short order.

    The better question is, has Pence already polled all the Principal Officers and not found enough to go with the 25th?

  66. 66.

    japa21

    Just a couple other quick observations.

     

    Trump is incapable of not lying. In his “concession” speech, where he condemned the folks who just the day before he said he loved, he said he immediately sent in the National Guard. Obviously, there was nothing immediate involved and he refused to approve the deployment.

    Secondly, anybody in the incoming administration who might have been thinking look forward, not backward has probably changed their tune by now. This invasion virtually guaranteed the administration will be doing both.

  67. 67.

    PPCLI

    @MCA1: In re Hawley:

    i) not just Danforth and the two Missouri papers, but also a megadonor who has a huge influence in Missouri politics. The guy has given millions to support Hawley and now he is openly condemning him. That hurts more than newspaper editorials.

    ii) Sorry if this photoshop has already been posted, but I hope it gets the wide circulation it deserves. Forever associated with that cynical insurrectionist weasel Hawley.

    https://twitter.com/Rob184rob/status/1347425266864414723

  68. 68.

    Fair Economist

    A common feature of coups and revolutions is that their success or failure often boils down to a relatively small group in a critical place.

  69. 69.

    Immanentize

    @Another Scott: I think that Warnock could be sworn in immediately by anyone (LBJ was sworn in by a Judge in Dallas) as his was a special election.  Ossoff probably has to wait as there is no seat to take except the one he will take when the Senate resumes on the 19th.

  71. 71.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @MCA1: Re: Hawley, it’s been a distinct pleasure seeing his career go splat so quickly. Both in-state major newspapers in Missouri have called on him to resign, and I saw this morning that Senator Coons has, as well. That’s following Danforth’s very public expressions of regret at having nursed him in his political infancy. He’s done.

    He’s not dead yet. The people who voted for him couldn’t give a rat’s ass what the Post or the Star had to say, in fact Cleek’s Law applies. As far as Danforth goes, he’s an old politically dead RINO that nobody in today’s GOP listens to.

  72. 72.

    gene108

    @raven:

    From what I read about the typical timeline required to certify races like the Senate run-offs, 2-3 weeks for the counties to verity their vote totals, transmit to the state officials to verify, and have them sign off on it before it gets officially certified.

    EDIT: 2-3 weeks total time for the entire process to be completed and results certified is a normal time frame.

  73. 73.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    Oh another point, since it looks like Congressional staffers, if not outright members of Congress were actively involved in the Beer Belly Coup attempt, I can see why the Senate and House aren’t in a rush to get back into session until they know the meetings can be secure.

  76. 76.

    patrick II

    Two things.

    1.  When Trump replaced all of those people at DOD people were worried that he was going to put the army in action and we would have a military coup under the leadership of his minions. The army leadership swore they would not act in that manner. Instead, the plan was to take advantage of military’s determined inaction and stage a right-wing coup.  No one was looking for that.  They assumed D.C. was safe (hence the failure in intelligence — they underestimated our own response) because of all of the National Guard and National police, but what they had was a bunch of guys standing around because of orders from the new Secretary of Defense and their own inclination to avoid participation in what had been, up until that time, feared to be a military coup. You can say Trump is dumb, but this was a close call in an unexpected manner.
    2. If there is a clear and extreme national emergency that you are actually watching on tv, and the man above you in the chain of command is unavailable (for whatever reason), have the courage to make a decision Gov. Larry Hogan. Your inability was part of the plan.
  78. 78.

    hueyplong

    It’s a waste of time to consider scenarios that involve Mike Fucking Pence taking aggressive action of any kind.  The closest he’ll ever do was the orchestrated walk-out after the national anthem at a Colts game after a football player kneel-down.

    The EC thing only worked because it requred Pence NOT to do something.

    The only useful purpose of the 25th Am demand is to have him demonstrate his unwillingness to do it.

  80. 80.

    Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    He’s not dead yet. The people who voted for him couldn’t give a rat’s ass what the Post or the Star had to say, in fact Cleek’s Law applies. As far as Danforth goes, he’s an old politically dead RINO that nobody in today’s GOP listens to.

    This.  Big chance that Hawley will be on the stage for the first R debate in whenever, probably March, 2021.  (that’s intended as a joke date but who knows).

  81. 81.

    Jinchi

    I think their strategy is to let this cook a little more in hopes that Pence will finally be pushed to invoke the 25th

    There’s no need to wait for Pence. Pelosi and Schumer should just act. If Pence wants to jump in and invoke the 25th while they’re having hearings, all the better.

    Trump sent a mob to declare war on Congress. Everyone with any power should be acting simultaneously to remove the traitor before he decides to pull a few more stunts then pardon himself and his minions.

  83. 83.

    Searcher

    So ignoring the question of whether there are enough Republican defectors in the Senate to remove Trump before the 20th, how much control does Mitch McConnell have on slow-walking this process?

  84. 84.

    Ceci n est pas mon nym

    I was watching the press conference where Biden was announcing the DOJ appointees. There were of course angry words in reaction to the riot, and in reaction to the deferential treatment given the rioters by police. Both Kamala and Joe has plenty to say about equal justice being a priority.

    But much of it was utterly normal and “boring”. I was listening to the impressive resumes, watching each appointee give an impressive speech, and thinking that this was going to happen hundreds of times. And that in the past it’s been utterly routine, of course decent people were going to be nominated and who’s going to watch the boring mechanics of the process?

    Same feeling about the ceremonial certification of the EC. Other than the objections and that little kerfuffle, the ceremony itself is pretty dull.

    I’ve learned to take none of this for granted. Getting back to routine is a radical change from the past four years. I can’t wait for the boring confirmation hearings nd the boring policy work.

  87. 87.

    Gin & Tonic

    Somebody who is actively researching these events has identified one of the people in photos carrying the zip-tie restraints as a retired senior military officer, graduate of one of the service academies, with multiple security clearances.

    I’m sorry I can’t share more right now.

  88. 88.

    Fair Economist

    @Searcher:

    So ignoring the question of whether there are enough Republican defectors in the Senate to remove Trump before the 20th, how much control does Mitch McConnell have on slow-walking this process?

    Absolute, unless the Republican caucus is willing to have a new leader and revolts.

  90. 90.

    Danielx

    Note: When local health department notifies that you have tested positive for Covid-19 in one communication and in another communication indicates you have tested negative, it makes one a little testy. Downright irritable, in point of fact.

  92. 92.

    Jinchi

    @Searcher: how much control does Mitch McConnell have on slow-walking this process?

    Plenty, but Pelosi moving in the House puts pressure on McConnell to act.

    As soon as Trump’s impeached in the House, it’s in the hands of  the Senate. If McConnell sits on it and Trump pulls another stunt Mitch is left standing as the guy who could’ve stopped him but didn’t. As long as Pelosi waits, McConnell can claim that his hands were tied.

    Trump likewise will pull his punches if he thinks he could be removed an hour after acting. (He stayed on relatively good behavior while being impeached last year).

  94. 94.

    Spanky

    @Searcher:

    So ignoring the question of whether there are enough Republican defectors in the Senate to remove Trump before the 20th, how much control does Mitch McConnell have on slow-walking this process?

    All of it. The Constitution only lays out the roles of the House and Senate. It does not provide a timeline for when the Senate trial must begin after the House passes the articles of impeachment

    ETA @Jinchi:  I assure you that Lame Duck McConnell will feel no pressure to do a damn thing before the return from the current recess the day before the inauguration.

  96. 96.

    Immanentize

    I mentioned this yesterday — I want Trump impeached in the House ASAP to shut down his pardon powers.

  97. 97.

    Ken

    @MCA1: I’m curious how broad or specific the Articles will be.

    Can the House recommend the penalties, or is that entirely up to the Senate?  Either way, I hope the House underlines the part about “disqualification to hold and enjoy any Office”.

    I’m also suddenly curious about how the limitation of the Presidential power to pardon “except in Cases of Impeachment” interacts with the clause “the Party convicted shall nevertheless be liable and subject to Indictment, Trial, Judgment and Punishment, according to Law.”  Would that mean that Trump can’t pardon himself for any crimes associated with the impeachable offense, like, say, murder of a police officer?

  98. 98.

    Danielx

    @Jinchi:

    Chorus of sad trombones playing for all those who believed Donald Trump had their backs. He did exactly what anyone observing him could have expected, which is to do whatever he believes benefits him at a given point in time.

    To paraphrase a line I’ve heard before: guys, you fucked up – you trusted him.

  99. 99.

    Mike in NC

    Trump isn’t done with his treason. I guarantee you he will be working the phones this weekend to arrange for a “Red Dawn” style foreign invasion of this country by one of his allies — Putin, Kim, Xi — so that he can just declare martial law. Republicans will fall in line 100% to back him up, and Fat Bastard will appear dressed as Rambo to shout “Wolverines!”.

  100. 100.

    MCA1

    @Gin & Tonic:  Was he publicly disowned by his mentor, and called on by the LA Times and SF Examiner to resign from office, though?  Or just left for dead after losing the 1960 election?  Asking sincerely, as I don’t recall anything like the former befalling him.  He did grasp onto the outsider, the establishment hates me and I hate them back on your behalf thing at some point, which it’s possible Hawley could do, too, but he’s repulsed enough people and he’ll forever have an “S” on his forehead for his role in Wednesday’s events.  Nixon was never involved with anything like that before running for President.

  101. 101.

    Cheryl from Maryland

    Impeach.  Even if it doesn’t result in a conviction, I want those seditious GOP fuckers on record.

  102. 102.

    different-church-lady

    @OzarkHillbilly: We’re at the point where any institution at all, but especially a newspaper, calling for accountability or resignation, or condemning any action of a sociopathic GOP politician just raises his/her street cred with the base. Dead to the mainstream just makes them stronger with the fringe.

  103. 103.

    Booger

    @M31: Worth getting a little worked up over, but I can’t imagine it’s not encrypted, remotely wiped or otherwise rendered into a worthless souvenir by now. Adam could weigh in on how serious it really is.

  104. 104.

    cope

    @Eural Joiner: The “fair use” component of copyright law allows the use of copyrighted material for certain purposes including teaching.

    I was a public school teacher for 28 years and made good use of a variety of articles, videos, clips and music in the my classroom.

  107. 107.

    Taken4Granite

    @mapaghimagsik:

    I get the idea that the cops who participated as protesters have some real soul searching to do should be arrested and charged just like the other protestors.

    FTFY.

  109. 109.

    Spanky

    @Mike in NC: Trump has no allies. No head of state is going to waste any of their resources trying to prop this clown up. Everyone knows he’s a master at fucking things up, and they’d only end up covered in shit if they tried something so late in the game.

  110. 110.

    Gin & Tonic

    @MCA1: The situations are not comparable, of course, but I’m just not comfortable ever writing a political obituary of a smart, ambitious, amoral pol.

  111. 111.

    artem1s

    This was de-escalation 101 because these MAGAts had backpacks full of God knows what, and job one with the resources at hand was to get them the fuck out of the building. I’m not ignoring or downplaying the huge overlay of white privilege, as I wrote yesterday.

    I appreciate your attention to this detail. I have a hard time trying to explain to white privileged denial-ists that no one is asking for cops to not police black people or black neighborhoods. We’d all just very much wish that they were willing to de-escalate in those situations in the same way they do, say, campus football game riots full of white people.

  112. 112.

    Ken

    @Danielx: I keep thinking of the third X-Men movie, where Magneto’s gang of mutants is making their assault. He restrains one of the top-tier mutants, saying “In chess, the pawns go first.”

  116. 116.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    I’d like to very sincerely propose a moment of dignified silence

    Imani Gandy @AngryBlackLady
    some trump numpty tased himself in the nutsack to death. god bless us every one.
    [thread]

  119. 119.

    different-church-lady

    @Gin & Tonic: I’m hoping the subordinates are taking over now, and that the current guy is just telling them whatever they need to know. You don’t want him just disappearing. You don’t just sit down at someone else’s desk and everything goes smooth — you can’t even find the fuckin’ stapler, never mind beat back a mob.

  122. 122.

    Jinchi

    @patrick II: You can say Trump is dumb, but this was a close call in an unexpected manner.

    Trump is dumb.

    It’s pretty clear he hoped to bring the military in. He literally did it, semi-successfully, in DC this summer.  We saw immediate pushback after that, and the public statements and editorials by all the living defense secretaries was a warning to the military to stand down. Trump’s mob was a desperation move. It’s not like he gets control of Congress by burning the building to the ground. What was supposed to happen on day 2?

  126. 126.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @germy: I read last night he wants to go back to Florida on AF1, and if he waits, he’ll have to ask Biden, and someone told him it’s only “Air Force 1” if the sitting president is on it, which suggests one last rant with our plane used as a backdrop.

    Also, in spite of what he said a few times in 2017, his own jet is not actually more comfortable than AF1

  131. 131.

    VOR

    @M31: The author Cory Doctorow tweeted:

    “Resecuring the Capitol’s IT infrastructure should probably involve shredding every device, cable and thumb-drive, tearing open every light-socket and power-outlet, and even then, it will be hard to fully trust the building and its systems. “

    The mob had largely unfettered access to offices. Computers were left out as they reportedly reading emails. Could a foreign entity like Putin have agents in the mob?

  132. 132.

    germy

    I heard at least 3 different rioters at the Capitol say that they hoped to find Vice President Mike Pence and execute him by hanging him from a Capitol Hill tree as a traitor. It was a common line being repeated. Many more were just talking about how the VP should be executed. https://t.co/fxHREouEWF

    — Jim Bourg (@jimbourg) January 8, 2021

  134. 134.

    topclimber

    @MCA1: Yes if Pence had the stones and McConnell played along, Congress can avoid relying on a cabinet vote and instead appoint a special body of its own devising that could begin the 25th process. Pelosi explained this at her presser yesterday.

  135. 135.

    Kattails

    Losing track of where I’ve seen things but somewhere it was mentioned that while Congress members were hustled into a shared space for their safety, many Republican members refused to wear masks even while begged to do so. These people’s souls are utterly broken. We need an exorcism.

    I don’t trust Trump as far as I can throw a Steinway. He needs to be impeached yesterday. It will severely limit his powers. Doesn’t matter what the Senate does.  Impeached is still impeached.

  136. 136.

    clay

    Second, fucking Trump conspired to create a situation where an understaffed and unprotected Capitol was overrun by a mob.  First, his minions greatly limited the DC National Guard’s mission and equipment, meaning they had to go to an armory to get equipment before they could be deployed to the Capitol.  The governors of Maryland and Virginia describe a 90 minute delay.

    Wasn’t one of the big things with Benghazi that there was a (supposed) delay in support being deployed?  The parallels are staggering, except this was on our soil, in our capital (instead of in a semi-hostile nation in a remote embassy).

    Let’s see if Republicans care about this one-hundredth of the amount that they pretended to care about Benghazi!

  137. 137.

    Ken

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: I read that Pence will go to the inauguration

    Secret signalling that he thinks he’ll be President, or at least Acting President, by then?

    And if we were living in the kind of country Trump wants, he would be at the inauguration, in a cage for the crowd to jeer and throw rotten vegetables at.

  141. 141.

    MCA1

    @MCA1: Forgot to add, I’m not saying he’s done as a Missouri Senator, though it’s entirely possible someone with the center tacking skills McCaskill always seemed to have could potentially whip up enough support and get whatever may be left of “establishment” R voters to defeat him whenever he’s up again.  I meant his national aspirations are dead.  He may get up there on the debate stage for the ’24 nomination but unless the party’s truly been taken over by the rabble he’s going nowhere.  Republican power mongers can’t possibly think that guy could win Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, or even Georgia or Arizona after this.  Anything’s possible, yes, and we’ve moved several rungs downward on the “rational, functioning electorate” ladder, but I’m still fairly confident that being intimately tied to a bloody and failed coup attempt disqualifies you in the minds of enough people to effectively run for president.

  144. 144.

    Kattails

    @VOR: “could a foreign entity like Putin have agents in the mob?”

    Ya think? Could he have agents inciting, aiding, and abetting the mob? Almost assuredly. Next question, was he in touch with Donny about this in one of their private off the record conversations or through some mole in the WH?

  147. 147.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Baud: apparently even a worm will turn, or at least leak to another worm

    The vice president, who for four years had remained loyal to Mr. Trump to the point of obsequiousness, was angry in return at the president’s public lashing. Senator James M. Inhofe, Republican of Oklahoma, told The Tulsa World that Mr. Pence privately expressed a sense of betrayal by Mr. Trump “after all the things I’ve done for him.”

  148. 148.

    patrick II

    @Jinchi:

    They missed getting Pence and Pelosi — the next two in succession, and stopping the count. That would have been a different story.  And, yeah, Trump is dumb and this had no where to go.  But with the limited moves he has on the board, this was his best chance.

    And what was supposed to happen next? — not go to jail.  He is desperate and cannot leave the presidency because when his term is over he will be going to jail.

    He had so few moves left on the board. Now, I hope he has none.

  150. 150.

    Kattails

    @topclimber: that special body could include, for example, psychiatrists and psychologists who could speak in professional terms about Trump’s mental state.

  154. 154.

    Elizabelle

    Good to hear Trump will not attend Biden’s inauguration.

    Better all around.  Just make sure the state troopers or whoever from New York know where to find him as the oath is taken

    FWIW, I’d be happier with a very small inauguration, since COVID.  President Biden and VP Harris can host a national celebration once the pandemic is beaten back and Americans are vaccinated and traveling safely again.

  155. 155.

    different-church-lady

    @artem1s: I’ve no doubt that racist perceptions played into this in a big way. But yeah, a big part of problem here is that this was a genuine violent mob, and they HAD to de-escalate, because it was better than the alternative. Whereas cracking down on on peaceful protestors, or treating everyone in a minority neighborhood like they’re the enemy is a CHOICE.

  156. 156.

    different-church-lady

    @gene108: Yes, but the asymmetry of extremism is deadly. Hawley can do a hell of a lot of damage even if his base is isolated to just one state.

  157. 157.

    WaterGirl

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: I thought it was the SECOND friday after the special election.  If I’m right about that, each county has to certify by NEXT Friday, Jan 15, and then it goes on to the next stage, where they are certified for the state.

  159. 159.

    Immanentize

    @Baud: Can you imagine spending all that time, all that effort, every day in and out, nights too, sucking up to the guy only to figure out (duh!) that he didn’t give one toot about you?

    Jesus wept.

  160. 160.

    Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes

    @Jinchi:

    If you waste the lawful chain of potential successors (together with the VP elect) and burn the certificates, you create uncertainty, declare martial law, and remain in control via a “state of emergency”. It would have a fair chance of success, maybe about 45%.

    The “tells” that this was planned are in zip ties, ropes, pipe bombs and a gallows.

  162. 162.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Baud: I’m sure Pence heard this before it made twitter, and that would knock the scales off they eyes of even a pretty dumb fella

    Jim Bourg @jimbourg1h
    I heard at least 3 different rioters at the Capitol say that they hoped to find Vice President Mike Pence and execute him by hanging him from a Capitol Hill tree as a traitor. It was a common line being repeated. Many more were just talking about how the VP should be executed.

    Schumer and Pelosi were also targeted. It’s the Michigan case all over again. These people were planning “trials” and executions.

  163. 163.

    Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes

    @p.a.:

    Recall his ass, court-martial, demotion, burn his uniforms, ribbons and awards. Forfeit all pay and allowances.

  166. 166.

    MCA1

    @Gin & Tonic:  Was it the one carrying around a flag of the country of Georgia, rather than the state of Georgia?  That was pretty funny.

    Beyond the foreign agents spurring on the crowd issue, and the concerns about what listening devices were secretly planted in the U.S. Capitol Wednesday, one of the terrifying things to me is how easily there could have been heavily armed little green men planted in that mob who went on to slaughter dozens of sitting congresspeople on the floor of the House.  We’re incredibly lucky there were only play-acting terrorists there, and that of those a small enough percentage of them were carrying that they never felt emboldened to start shooting at the cops and Secret Service.

  168. 168.

    Kattails

    @Gin & Tonic: Ah, missed that. Excuse me while I find my shocked face, it had to be laundered and ironed after all the use it’s gotten the last couple of days. =)

  169. 169.

    Ken

    @Baud: Maybe Pence is too afraid for his life to invoke the 25th amendment?

    Some of the treasonous mob were planning to kill him, so I’m not seeing how he could make things worse for himself.  I wonder if it’s sunk in that he’ll be at risk from the lunatic fringe for the rest of his life? Almost makes me sympathetic for him, but I’ll reserve that for his Secret Service agents.

  170. 170.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @germy:

    heard at least 3 different rioters at the Capitol say that they hoped to find Vice President Mike Pence and execute him by hanging him from a Capitol Hill tree as a traitor.

    Again, I follow the mythologies of how they expected to overturn the election.  They totally convinced themselves that Pence could overturn the election by choosing the ‘alternate electors’ for Trump.  When he did not, that made Pence the biggest of all traitors.  Trump was convinced of the same idiot theory, and spouted it right back to his followers, which confirmed it for them.  It’s most likely why Trump turned on Pence so hard.  He publicly said he would.

  171. 171.

    Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes

    Depending on the level of culpability that Flynn and Giuliani may have had in the planning (his Tuberville “10 states” call is damning), we ARE looking at. LEO death in the commission of a crime of insurrection/sedition.

    Is a needle on the table? It’s been over 15 years since I last planted a foot in a Federal criminal court.

  172. 172.

    different-church-lady

    And another cheery thought: there are going to be bombings. January 6 is going to become a domestic terrorist red-letter day. They will kill in the name of their “fallen brothers and sisters”. Waco-to-Oklahoma City will look like a school play.

  173. 173.

    lee

    @Gin & Tonic:

    Glad to hear. I knew the green helmet guy with the longhorn sticker had been ID’d (prior service).

    I figured finding the all-black zip-tie guy was going to be more difficult until they started going through cellphone data.

  175. 175.

    Chief Oshkosh

    @Nicole: A case can be made that it would great to have Trump always trying to run. It will continue to fracture the GOP and will definitely syphon money from more intelligent would-be dictators.

  176. 176.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    @VOR: Could a foreign entity like Putin have agents in the mob?

    Do you really thing the Russians have to work that hard with these Republican idiots? They likely have it already threw some dumb ass staffer who wanted to impress that hot Russian woman he meet at a bar.

  177. 177.

    catclub

    @OzarkHillbilly: also were intent on avoiding any appearance that the federal government was deploying active duty or National Guard troops against WHITE Americans.

    FTFY

  178. 178.

    Spanky

    @gene108: That means Trump will have to rush through a last batch of pardons over the weekend. Probably one for himself in there, too.

  179. 179.

    Baud

    @gene108:

    This isn’t just Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez and liberals asking for impeachment. There were notable comments Thursday from Rep. Elissa Slotkin, a moderate from Michigan who didn’t vote for Pelosi for speaker less than a week ago, who pushed for invoking the 25th Amendment. Rep. Abigail Spanberger of Virginia also released a statement pushing for the 25th Amendment, but then saying, “if the Vice President fails to act, it will become necessary for every member of Congress bound by our Constitutional oaths to take further action. If we refuse to respond to a U.S. President inciting an uprising against our democracy, we risk losing it forever

     

    Nice.

  182. 182.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    @Ken: And at this point what does Pence have to lose not calling for the 25th? At lest if he gets murdered, he will be murdered trying to defend the Constitution.

  185. 185.

    rp

    I don’t think Hawley can pull off the raw emotional appeal to the MAGA types. Sure, they’ll vote for him, but I have hard time seeing him inspire people the way that Trump has. (Same with Cruz and Cotton) IOW, without the support of mainstream republicans like Danforth, Hawley’s career prospects don’t look good.

  188. 188.

    Doc Sardonic

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: His own jet is currently not airworthy as the maintenance is not current and it seems to be missing an engine. We’ve paid for his travel the last four years why should he spend money he doesn’t have maintaining a plane.

    Edit: What Moar said.

  189. 189.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    Olivia Nuzzi @Olivianuzzi 15h
    Donald Trump was annoyed by the violent siege on the Capitol Wednesday — which left several dead — because it looked “low class,” according to his adviser. “He doesn’t like low class things.”

    The adviser confirmed that he was watching television coverage of the siege enthusiastically, but noted that the sight of his own supporters forming a violent mob and destroying property and lives offended him on aesthetic grounds.

    Under less strained circumstances, there are like fifty jokes to be made here, starting with him taking such a cheap shot at his own wives.

  190. 190.

    catclub

    @MCA1: He may get up there on the debate stage for the ’24 nomination but unless the party’s truly been taken over by the rabble he’s going nowhere.

     

    It has. he is fine in the GOP

  192. 192.

    Jinchi

    @Gin & Tonic: Somebody who is actively researching these events has identified one of the people in photos

    I remember after Charlottesville, there were people online identifying members of the march. Is any group doing this now?

  196. 196.

    catclub

    @VOR: Computers were left out as they reportedly reading emails.

     

    So did staffer leave CAC cards in the computers when they fled? Or do those computers not require CAC cards?

  198. 198.

    Mike in NC

    @VOR: Could a foreign entity like Putin have agents in the mob?

    Absolutely. Donald Trump traveled to Moscow in 1987 to beg for a handout. He’s been a Russian asset ever since. He met with Putin multiple times over four years and no written records exist of what transpired (on our side).

  206. 206.

    germy

    One joke going around South America today is that the US coup failed because there was no US Embassy in Washington DC providing logistical support.

    — BrianMier (@BrianMteleSUR) January 7, 2021

  209. 209.

    Mike in NC

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:  Schumer and Pelosi were also targeted. It’s the Michigan case all over again. These people were planning “trials” and executions.

    Attorney General Garland will have to appoint a special prosecutor to investigate all of the white supremacist groups that sprung up and thrived like kudzu under the treasonous reign of Donald Trump.

  212. 212.

    Jinchi

    BREAKING: Judiciary Chairman @RepJerryNadler  calls for impeachment articles to bypass his committee and be brought directly to the floor, for an immediate vote.

    Another advantage of impeaching rapidly is that it forces Trump’s hand on pardons. Either he pardons himself and his kids immediately (and looks extremely guilty) or he waits and risks losing his chance at all.

  213. 213.

    Matt McIrvin

    @germy: They had a gallows set up outside the Capitol. I don’t think that was just intended as ornamental–they were planning to hang people.

  214. 214.

    Mike in NC

    @The Moar You Know: his own jet is missing an engine and has had no maintenance done since 2016.  It probably is no longer flyable.

    Another tax write-off for Trump. Perfect! He will pay under $750 in federal income tax in 2021.

  217. 217.

    Mike in NC

    @catclub:  I bet every laptop and PC inside Congressional offices require a CAC to access data. A huge amount of sensitive and possibly even classified material was stolen by the rioters, which I’m sure will soon be revealed to have included agents of foreign governments.

  218. 218.

    Immanentize

    @Jinchi: I was sort of hoping that the “Tuesday or Wednesday” was a ruse.  He needs to be surprised by the articles asap.

  219. 219.

    BaffleGab

    @Steeplejack (phone): I see what you see. I also see other capitol police officers running by, so it’s possible he was encouraging other officer(s) out of frame on the left who were also running. Not enough context…

  220. 220.

    IsraelTopshelf

    Calm them down and get them the fuck out. That makes perfect sense, Although anger tells you they deserve more, reason/hope says they’ll get theirs. Still, how hard would it have been to lock down the grounds and take names/ID/photos before anyone left? OK, they blew the numbers they would need for that. But alone, this slow push from the inside with MPD seemingly chatting with the treasonous mob on the front porch for hours, makes no sense. They had plenty of time to create a perimeter and tag at least a bunch of the rats as they left.

  221. 221.

    Bill in Section 147

    @The Moar You Know:  Wasn’t until you highlighted it but reading that bit alone made me focus on it..

    “Still stinging from the uproar over the violent response by law enforcement to protests… officials also were intent on avoiding any appearance that the federal government was deploying active duty or National Guard troops against Americans

    Maybe they could have written this a bit more clearly but there is a level of media consistency that keeps equating one group as Americans as protestors and one group of protestors as Americans.

  222. 222.

    Feathers

    @Immanentize: This. I pushed back against the “useless Pelosi” crowd, pointing out that the impeachment needed to be announced and the vote taken very quickly, due to the danger of the situation. She also needs to gauge the chance of having enough Republican support for removal. If that exists, then the procedure has to be completely choreographed in order to pull it off.

    All of this happening with the knowledge that it will mean getting the House and Senate to meet while not knowing what police forces can be trusted to keep them safe. Knowing that some federal security forces want them dead and actively conspired to pull it off.

    But yeah, pop off and shout from the rooftops that you are going to impeach. Bozos.

  223. 223.

    BaffleGab

    @IsraelTopshelf: Agree. You want to get them out of the Capitol building with as little additional damage as possible. There are enough photos, videos and selfies of the people involved to track them down later. And persuade them to name others in their group.  “Kettling” hundreds of violent deranged people in our center of government wouldn’t have gone well. Loss of life was minimal compared to what it would have been. Damage was minimal over all.

  228. 228.

    ThresherK

    (Trump) has a connoisseur’s eye for a sycophantic chickenshit.

    I’m sooooo stealing this.

  229. 229.

    Denali

    On my twitter feed there was news of the FBI searching the Cordell Hull building offices in Nashville, Tennessee. Anyone know what is going on there?

  230. 230.

    PST

    @Mike in NC:

    Attorney General Garland will have to appoint a special prosecutor to investigate all of the white supremacist groups that sprung up and thrived like kudzu under the treasonous reign of Donald Trump.

    I don’t think so. Special prosecutors are needed if there is some conflict of interest that prevents DOJ from proceeding in house. That might be the case if Trump were still president, but the AG in the Biden administration will have no conflict.

  232. 232.

    Uncle Cosmo

    @OzarkHillbilly: IIUC the Capitol Policeman who died was struck in the head with a fire extinguisher. The photoshop essentially implies Hawley is complicit in his death.

  233. 233.

    J R in WV

    @Gin & Tonic: 

    a retired senior military officer, graduate of one of the service academies, with multiple security clearances.

    Some of those guys looked quite professional to me, esp. compared to the clowns wearing Cos-play costumes, tight clothes, fully masked, carrying only what they needed to execute their part of the plan.

    I wouldn’t be a bit surprised if senior military officers who have become real fascists (like Gen (ret) Flynn) were organizers of this insurrection. The organizers should be tried for treason, they made war upon their own country.

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