Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

People identifying as christian while ignoring christ and his teachings is a strange thing indeed.

In my day, never was longer.

rich, arrogant assholes who equate luck with genius

Books are my comfort food!

Within six months Twitter will be fully self-driving.

If you voted for Trump, you don’t get to speak about ethics, morals, or rule of law.

Republicans in disarray!

The gop is a fucking disgrace.

I really should read my own blog.

The real work of an opposition party is to hold the people in power accountable.

Come on, media. you have one job. start doing it.

Impressively dumb. Congratulations.

Tick tock motherfuckers!

The most dangerous place for a black man in America is in a white man’s imagination.

Live so that if you miss a day of work people aren’t hoping you’re dead.

When they say they’re pro-life, they don’t mean yours.

Never entrust democracy to any process that requires Republicans to act in good faith.

The real work of an opposition party is to oppose.

They are lying in pursuit of an agenda.

T R E 4 5 O N

If you tweet it in all caps, that makes it true!

Never entrust democracy to any process that requires republicans to act in good faith.

This fight is for everything.

Elections aren’t won by handwringing, cowering, and/or bashing your own candidates.

You are here: Home / Politics / Impeachment Inquiry / Impeachment Hearings / Impeachment 3 – Procedure Over Content

Reader Interactions

173Comments

  3. 3.

    Martin

    I can at least understand the point this guy is trying to make. It’s complete bullshit, of course, but at least I can follow it.

  5. 5.

    wvng

    Ade hill

    @Adehill28

    they’re not even bothering to make their case bc they know trump won’t be convicted

    Hownotamovie?

    @Hownotamovie1

    “Look, at the end of the day, 50% of you will choose your party over your country, and I’m ok with that. So I’m just gonna kill time here.” – Trump Defense.

  10. 10.

    Old School

    My client has does a lot of impeachable offenses over his time in office.  And you do so after an insurrection?!!?

  11. 11.

    Soprano2

    I watched that 13 minute video that Raskin showed. It was terrifying, and showed the sequence of events better than anything else I’ve seen. I wish all the news networks would show it uncut tonight. Especially revealing were the chants of “Fuck the police”. LOL

  13. 13.

    Almost Retired

    @?BillinGlendaleCA:  No, Mr. Shouty-face is not a Gym Jordan School of Law graduate.  At the Gym Jordan School of Law, you were not taught to out-argue your opponents.  You were taught to wrestle them to the ground and tickle them.

  15. 15.

    dmsilev

    So, you can’t impeach a President near the end of his term, and you can’t impeach him after the end of his term? Is that right?

  17. 17.

    Bobby Thomson

    When you start at 11, you have nowhere to go.

    But again, it’s not like what is said or how it is said will make a bit of difference.  The Republican Party is deeply corrupt.

  18. 18.

    NotMax

    Arguing it’s a partisan scalp hunt kind of falls apart when it wasn’t a straight party line vote that passed the article.

  20. 20.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Martin:

    Pretty sure you gotta wake some people up after Castor.

    They’re very different from each other, but they’re both terrible.

  26. 26.

    Martin

    Does this guy not realize his presence is proof that Trump’s due process rights are being met?

  28. 28.

    zhena gogolia

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    The twitter explanation is that he’s used to wearing a kipa so he’s holding it on. I don’t find that too convincing. Isn’t he aware that he’s not at the moment wearing a kipa?

  30. 30.

    Almost Retired

    To his credit, Schoen effortlessly made the transition from screaming at me to boring me into submission.   I expect he’ll end with a bang – smashing a guitar or lighting himself on fire.

  31. 31.

    SiubhanDuinne

    Now he seems to be arguing that Trump’s due process rights are being violated because … he’s not testifying? He has no witnesses? Huh?

  32. 32.

    NotMax

    @Tata

    That was the impeachment of a judge named Nixon., the case which resulted in the Supreme Court flatly stating they had no jurisdiction over the procedures and rules for impeachment or for conviction as set forth in each chamber of Congress.

  38. 38.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Martin:

    If he’s that observant, I wonder why he’s not wearing it while delivering, arguably, the most consequential speech of his legal life.

  43. 43.

    bjacques

    They’re both counting on the public believing due process during impeachment and trial is the same as in a court. Unfortunately, they’re right

  44. 44.

    Leto

    Also I’m going to start referring to this guy as Barty Crouch, Jr because he won’t stop licking his fucking lips.

  46. 46.

    NotMax

    This entire current argument conveniently ignores that the Chief Justice explicitly demurred from participating, and the rules in place then laid the presiding officer duties to the president pro tem.

    Also he’s arguing that the House moved too fast and yet the Speaker moved too slowly.

  48. 48.

    Martin

    @SiubhanDuinne: I have a faculty member that only takes his off in class. His view is that his instructional role takes priority over his faith in that environment and he wants his students to see ‘professor’ and not ‘jewish professor’.

    The lawyers I’ve known seem to take a similar view when representing a client. They are an agent of their client, and they don’t bring their personal self into that space.

  51. 51.

    Suzanne

    That video is unbelievable.

    Every one of those rioters behaved like a wild, rabid animal that day.

  53. 53.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Martin:

    Thank you. Actually, that makes sense. Though if he grabs his scalp every time he takes a drink, it’s kind of a constant reminder that he’s missing his kippah, which is kind of a constant reminder that he’s Jewish…

  57. 57.

    JWR

    Somewhat O/T question: What kind of rock is the dais behind him made of? (And don’t tell me it’s made of the rocks in this guy’s head!)

  60. 60.

    Almost Retired

    Honest to God, this presentation will be reviewed in law school trial advocacy classes for decades as a cautionary tale.   This is thematically and stylistically incoherent.  I couldn’t even begin to summarize or diagram his arguments.

  61. 61.

    CaseyL

    On Twitter I read that very observant Jews say a little blessing every time they drink (or eat), and maybe that’s what Schoen is doing, and covering his head each time since he isn’t wearing a kipa.

    (I’m Jewish, but areligious, so I can’t definitively say if this is true.  It does seem a bit excessive.)

  66. 66.

    MazeDancer

    Twitter says observant Jews are not supposed to drink or eat in public without a covered head. So he’s covering with his hand.

    So give him a pass.

    Still a terrible lawyer. He will not be missed on the Sabbath.

  67. 67.

    bjacques

    I was gonna go with Counselor Schoen covering his blowhole in case he burps.

     

    Trump was impeached while still President you dolt!!

  70. 70.

    Booger

    @Almost Retired: According to the Originalists, citing Federalist Paper #24-7-365-69-420, it would have to be a lute or perhaps a mandolin. And whale oil, since lighter fluid hadn’t been discovered yet.

  71. 71.

    TomatoQueen

    @JWR: I wouldn’t bet against it being marble, from either Vermont or New Hampshire, or maybe somebody spent some proper money on the stuff from Italy.

  72. 72.

    jl

    What I’ve learned so far is that the crimes of incitement, insurrection and conspiracy are logically impossible and laws against them need to be stricken from the books.

    I mean, in the Rwandan genocide, people were told to go and murder their neighbors over the radio, the people who said it weren’t there, they didn’t hold any knives. Did Jefferson Davis fight in any Civil War battles or fire a gun? Not that I know of. When Bugsy Thug paid Harold Hitman to go cap some rat, a go between delivered some cash in an envelope. Bugsy had nothing really to do with it, when you think about it hard enough.

    The GOP is just a bottomless font of wisdom, and gives me so many ‘ah-ha’ moments. Insights, if you will.

  76. 76.

    Sloane Ranger

    How can you make an argument that you can’t impeach a former official when former officials have been previously impeached successfully?

  77. 77.

    jl

    @Sloane Ranger: ” How can you make an argument that you can’t impeach a former official when former officials have been previously impeached successfully? ”

    Blount and Belknap are fake news. It was all staged by the lizard people replicants, like the moon landings and the Mars rovers, the 9/11 attack and the school shootings, and climate change.

    Edit: Hillary and Bill have been plotting for longer than people realize. They forget that Obama had a time machine. Only a fool and/or a knave can deny things so obvious.

  80. 80.

    Elie

    I believe that the target of the trial (and importantly the video) is the American public and voter.  Its gonna leave a deep wound  — not on Trump, but on the GOP.  THEY are the targets and they behave as though none of this relates to their future. Stupid is as stupid does.

    The other thing I think is that the media and such have been going on and on about the anger of the MAGAts.  They actually misunderstand that many people against Trump and his mob are FURIOUS, and that there will be consequences for that as well.

    This trial was absolutely necessary and whether or not that thing not to be mentioned is convicted, it will have the necessary impact on the true target for this undertaking – the American voting public AND the rotten, putrid GQP.  Trump is gonna be old history sooner than people think.

  84. 84.

    Brachiator

    @Almost Retired:

    Honest to God, this presentation will be reviewed in law school trial advocacy classes for decades as a cautionary tale. This is thematically and stylistically incoherent. I couldn’t even begin to summarize or diagram his arguments.

    These are Trump’s people?

    I thought they would at least be semi-competent.

  85. 85.

    Almost Retired

    @Booger:  This comment made me laugh so hard I spewed gin on my keyboard….Not gin…..I mean water….I’m drinking water.   It’s only the early afternoon in Los Angeles.  So it’s water….water is a clear liquid, too.

  92. 92.

    jl

    The commenters are clearly warning that the defense is about to go shoe-gaze metal. So, I’m turning it off and will read about it later.

  96. 96.

    Brachiator

    @jl: ​
     

    Blount and Belknap are fake news. It was all staged by the lizard people replicants, like the moon landings and the Mars rovers

    A little OT news about Mars:

    The United Arab Emirates is celebrating its first mission at Mars.

    It has put a probe called Hope in orbit around the planet, making it only the fifth spacefaring entity to do so after the US, the Soviet Union, Europe and India.

    And a US probe with a rover is scheduled to land on Mars on February 18.

  98. 98.

    jl

    Final comment, one thing the GOP has established beyond any doubt is that if you read the various notes on the Constitutional debates, and the Federalist Papers, and history of the early republic, the Framers were very wise and practical people who churned out mindless text that stuck solely to nitpicking proper procedure, and didn’t give rat’s ass about what it meant for real stuff, real consequences for real people in the real world.

  99. 99.

    debbie

    All this lawyering has become tiresome. The next manager to speak should point out that the Founders never provided for this situation because they never envisioned the election a president so heinous that he would incite an insurrection. Case closed. Boot the bastard out forever.

  102. 102.

    NotMax

    “Shall means mandatory.”

    Except when the law says the IRS “shall provide” requested tax returns to tax-writing committees of Congress.

    //

  103. 103.

    JWR

    @TomatoQueen: That’s what I guessed, too, but hadn’t thought about the origin. I was wondering about that during last years trial, but never bothered to ask. As for where whatever it is came from, I’d again guess that they most probably used the imported stuff.

  104. 104.

    Almost Retired

    @Brachiator:  It doesn’t really surprise me that he couldn’t get competent lawyers.  I think he had to fish in the scum-filled pond of right wing ideologues.  Defending him is intellectually indefensible, and social and professional death.  Also, they won’t get paid.  And they’ll be condemned to spend eternity hanging out and watching OAN with the other traitors in the Ninth Circle of Hell.

  108. 108.

    Elie

    @Almost Retired:

    Do you think that they made Trump pony up a down payment in cash first before even sitting down the first time?  I sure would have given his notorious history.  Cash on the barrell I would say….And I would check my bank balance to make sure it was there before putting my butt in that chair…

  109. 109.

    Leto

    Oh, we’re going to learn from Lincoln? When are we appointing Sherman to go campaigning again?

  117. 117.

    Almost Retired

    @Elie:  Perhaps, but if Washington works anything like Hollywood, a lot of lawyers don’t worry too much about payment if they can get a high-profile client and garner some press attention.  But career-damaging attention, like these clowns are about to get?  I doubt it’s worth it……

  120. 120.

    Another Scott

    Jamie Raskin deserves the thanks of a grateful nation for yielding back those 33 minutes.

    — Charles P. Pierce (@CharlesPPierce) February 9, 2021

    They’re voting on whether the trial is Constitutional…

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  121. 121.

    Leto

    Michael Beschloss@BeschlossDC
    6h
    Was delighted to hear this morning from Kris Condon, daughter of my beloved first-grade public school teacher, who writes that Americans who have already forgotten the insurrection are like those saying “that Nuremberg was unnecessary since the Third Reich no longer exists.”

  125. 125.

    LuciaMia

    My God. When Schoen just came on, I went down to the laundry room, collected my clean laundry , chatted with a few residents and got my mail. Back upstairs got some turkey thighs and potatoes ready for the oven, rearranged the pantry, made a cup of tea. Just came back in here and THE GUY IS STILL SPEAKING!?!

  126. 126.

    Brachiator

    @Starboard Tack:

    Yeah, Perseverance. I’m looking forward to the 7 Minutes of Terror.

    Hmm. I guess the public can’t go down to JPL and watch the folks there do their thing.

    I think there may also be another probe getting there soon. A number of agencies all taking advantage of the July launch window.

  128. 128.

    debbie

    I just watched that video up top. There aren’t attorneys good enough to get Trump out of this mess.

  129. 129.

    mali muso

    @Leto: YES to this take.  I’ve been saying it for a long time.  Nuremburg trials.  We need them.  And maybe this is the closest we can get (although I’d argue we really need a full scale truth and retribution commission).

  131. 131.

    dmsilev

    @Brachiator: Three probes total heading to Mars this cycle: The one from the UAE that just entered orbit, a Chinese combination orbiter/lander due to arrive tomorrow, and Perseverance next week.

  136. 136.

    Starboard Tack

    @NotMax:

    I saw an interview today with one of the scientists for the Perseverance mission. She stressed how much effort went into making sure the rover isn’t carrying any biologics.

  137. 137.

    catclub

    @NotMax:

    “Shall means mandatory.”

    Except when the law says the IRS “shall provide” requested tax returns to tax-writing committees of Congress.

     

    I just saw that definition in a federal government training manual glossary.  “Should means recommended.”

     

    I hope the tax writing committee has repeated that request to treasury.

  139. 139.

    MJS

    Since actual conviction is a lost cause, I hope the House Managers spend their time 1) showing and describing how horrible January 6 actually was and 2) laying it at the feet of not only Trump, but Hawley and Cruz, too, by name.

  140. 140.

    bjacques

    Wait—(record scratch)—Castor acknowledged that Trump was defeated in a fair election? Maybe Trump should question him more closely about that…

  144. 144.

    Mo MacArbie

    The Nuremberg Trials were the conqueror’s justice for the conquered. Red America doesn’t resemble 1945 Berlin just yet.

  145. 145.

    piratedan

    I think we can all sleep soundly tonight knowing the probabilities are highly likely that these guys didn’t get paid to represent Trump any more than we did.

  148. 148.

    Almost Retired

    I can’t even begin to tell you how brilliant it was of Jamie Raskin to not do a rebuttal and let the day end with that horrific poetry reading.  I’m surprised he didn’t recite that fucking snake poem that Trump considers literature.

  150. 150.

    Mary G

    @Betty Cracker: Good for Corn and J-Rubs. Love the shot about “most papers have a policy. At least we do.” Maggie and the entire crew covering politics at the FTFNYT are due for a tongue-lashing.

    I started to watch it and just couldn’t after Raskin talked about burying his son and hearing his daughter tell him she would never come to the Capitol again.

    Had to try many times to see the video; hopefully that means many are watching it. It’s heartstopping. So vicious, and seeing HWSNBN’s real time incitement really hit home.

  153. 153.

    Nora Lenderbee

    The 6 Rs who voted yes were Bill Cassidy (R-La.), Susan Collins (Maine), Mitt Romney (Utah), Lisa Murkowski (Alaska), Ben Sasse (Neb.) and Patrick J. Toomey (Pa.).

    Collins must have a permanent waffle print on her ass by now.

  154. 154.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    contra Maggie Thin-Skin

    Kaitlan Collins @kaitlancollins 16m
    Multiple people tell me Trump was basically screaming as Castor made a meandering opening argument that struggled to get at the heart of the defense team’s argument.

  158. 158.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    Jim Acosta @Acosta 40m
    Trump team adviser candid on messy opening day for former president’s impeachment team. Adviser said Trump could be in serious jeopardy if he finds himself charged in criminal court: “Trump is f*cked if anyone ever charges him. No one wants to work with him.”

    I imagine Letitia James reading this tweet and indulging in a half smile of anticipation….

  164. 164.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Nora Lenderbee: Rob Portman really is a profile in cowardice. I think it was Lawrence O’Donnell getting giddy with anticipation that Richard Shelby announcing his retirement at the tender age of eighty-six signaled a shift in the Senate. I would hesitate before betting too much on the good conscience of the last Dixiecrat in the Senate.

  169. 169.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Kathleen: Rubin definitely seems to have the zeal of a convert. Maybe she was always pro-choice and pro-environment, but those issues seem to have more prominence in her writing these days, and to turn again to my favorite Nixon line, she knows how to hate, and she hates trump.

  170. 170.

    J R in WV

    And of course our Republican Senator, Shelly Moore Capito didn’t vote for truth, justice and the American way. She voted for insurrection, violence, lies and the Trumpian way!

    You go Shelly Moore, just like your dad the convicted felon!!!

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