I have two predictions about a couple of New York politicians.
First, Chuck Schumer. Chuck’s getting a little bit of attention because he’s signaled that he’s completely done with Susan Collins’ shit (warning: Politico link). Good — she’s a fucking useless time waster. I guess Harry Reid once said that you’ll get her vote, but never on anything important, which is a form of performative bipartisanship that media wankers like, but doesn’t get anything done. Collins is also salty about her tough campaign, which if Maine had any sense, she would have lost. Too fucking bad.
Anyway, my prediction about Schumer is that the a primary challenge by someone like AOC is about as likely as Collins doing anything about her many concerns. The New York federal office holders who have lost primaries in the last couple of cycles took their constituents for granted. Schumer shows up. If we have festivals in Rochester this Summer, I can guarantee you that some staffer will be holding up a “Meet Chuck Schumer” sign and Chuck will be there, taking selfies and answering questions. Also, AOC is a smart politician and a Schumer primary challenge would be a dumb move.
Second, Mario’s kid. Another accusation (unwanted touching) came out a couple of days ago, and there are almost certainly more to come. Cuomo has vowed not to resign, and there aren’t enough votes to impeach him. The legislature voted to strip him of emergency powers, but to allow him to extend the 96 emergency executive orders he’s already issued, which is a fair bit less than nothing. Calls for him to resign from the Assembly Speaker and Senate Leader are just words until they have the votes to impeach.
My easy prediction here is that, barring some live boy / dead girl revelation, Cuomo won’t resign. Hell, he might even run for another term. (And, no, AOC won’t challenge him, which is something you hear every so often. A Tish James challenge is more likely.)
This isn’t a prediction, but Gillibrand has been pretty weak sauce on Cuomo, in contrast to her position on Franken. She’s probably a more likely target for AOC in 2024, if that’s in the cards (which I doubt).
Walker
Schumer is WAY into constituent service. I will never forget the time I went to the Lilac Festival in Rochester and there was this incredibly distraught woman talking to Schumer. And he was assuring her that he would personally get her the help she needed.
Chyron HR
I understand the impetus to punish Cuomo for his grabby hands but this seems pretty arbitrary.
WereBear
Cuomo is also being hammered for his COVID handling, which started at the beginning and has never stopped. THAT part I don’t get: at least from my on-the-ground perspective, the lunatics who wanted to defy mask orders got little traction through the whole state: and I’m in a red area.
I think it’s undeniable he saved lives. Not that he’s right on this harassment thing: he is at least someone who bullied women who didn’t play along, and that’s got to have some consequences.
But I’m glad I didn’t vote for Cynthia Nixon, or the Republican. All I’m saying.
Keith
At every graduation ceremony, at each and every minor college or University in NY State, there was a really good chance that Schumer would turn up and deliver the very same speech he likely gave at the first graduation ceremony to which he was invited.
This has become such a routine event in New York that it is rumored you do not even have to invite the Senior Senator to attend and regale us with tales of how he met his wife, and other great life lessons, he will simply turn up, speech at the ready. Put him in Provost – he’s ready to play!
Schumer, in short, gets around and makes his presence known in every town, large or (more importantly) small throughout the Empire State.
Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix
@Chyron HR:
It’s not as big a deal as it sounds. Basically, it’s them saying “no more, we’re back to regular order, but what you did is fine”, since they didn’t invalidate the existing, broad 96 orders related to COVID, and allowed him to extend them. The New York constitution gives the governor extensive emergency powers unless or until the legislature votes to stop him.
Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix
@WereBear:
I agree with this. He wasn’t perfect but my God he was a lot better than red state governors.
Deekaa6
4 kids 4 high school graduations 4 Schumer speeches. The guy’s a mensch.
lowtechcyclist
Thoughts about AOC and Gillibrand:
I could be wrong, but AOC doesn’t strike me as someone who’s particularly defined by ambition. I won’t say she’s the opposite of Buttigieg, who’s spent every last freakin’ minute of his political life trying to grasp for a higher rung, but she seems a lot closer to the other end of the scale. I could see her running for Gillibrand’s seat whenever Gillibrand is ready to retire, but she’s not going to challenge her (or Schumer) in the meantime. And I think she knows herself well enough to realize that, at least for now, the governor’s office would be a bad fit; she won’t be challenging Cuomo either.
I expect that where Gillibrand is coming from is, she took the lead on Franken, it took a toll on her, and cost her a lot of support within the party. And for those reasons, I think she’s decided to let others take the lead on this one. Just because she did this once doesn’t make her the Official Take-On-The-Harasser Functionary of the Democratic Party. This seems to be the expectation in some people’s minds, but I don’t think it’s a reasonable one.
lowtechcyclist
@Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix:
Sure, but that’s a very very low bar in extremely blue New York. Surely Cuomo can’t be the only Dem politician in the state who’s capable of doing a decent job as governor.
WereBear
@lowtechcyclist: I was upset because Franken didn’t get a hearing, so I’m willing to wait while Cuomo gets an investigation. Because everyone should have one; the press is not the place for fact-finding, heaven knows.
Still, that was Franken’s choice, and Gillibrand did not do this by herself. He was so sharp, well-liked, and on target I understand he was missed.
Until I know otherwise, I figure his past, as a comedian who spent years on a show with a frat-boy lean, were marginal for his former profession, but not as a senator in the #MeToo era.
Of course, at the time, the Republicans were pushing Roy Moore, an actual — if unconvicted — rapist, and I would have loved to see a compare and contrast. I think they missed an opportunity there: despite what toxic Christians claim, there are degrees of sin, and I doubt Franken came close to Moore’s level.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
I think the telling moment was Collins showing up for that White House meeting with a group of ten Republicans and a non-starter of a counteroffer on a rescue plan. She was letting everybody know she’s not gonna be part of any Manchin led moderate coalition that Gets Things Done. She’s betting her relevance on the Rs retaking the Senate in ’22 and her having lots of seniority and a key chair (appropriations, if memory serves). Underneath the stammering, wide-eyed affect, she’s a partisan and cynical as McConnell. I hope Dems have the combination of smarts, luck and good candidates to disappoint her in that ambition.
WereBear
@lowtechcyclist: The whole place isn’t blue. I’m in Elise Stefanik’s district. We STILL can’t get rid of her.
Northern and Western NY is rural/farm country, and it could have easily gotten as bad as certain red states, regionally. I’m saying his approach worked… and the rivals for the governor’s position would have been likely disastrous.
Doc Sardonic
@Keith: He spoke at my goddaughter’s graduation from Hofstra a few years back. The original slated speaker had cancelled Chuck came on short notice, gave his speech, glad handed a bit and everybody was happy.
JanieM
@WereBear:
I was driving back from NE Ohio to Maine two years ago in the fall, on my beloved back roads (i.e. I mostly stay off the interstate). It was in far northern/western NY state that I saw a homemade sign in front of a house in the middle of the corn fields: “Trump is love.”
…
CliosFanBoy
that’s a pretty good summary of Buttigieg.
WereBear
@JanieM: We had a similar experience the very end of last year, when we made a six hour round trip drive to farm country to adopt our latest kitten. (Respite post this weekend!)
Giant homemade signs with Bible verses and Trump support, in an eerie juxtaposition straight out of science fiction.
We wouldn’t even have considered it if we weren’t in NY. But I have a contact app, everyone wore masks, and I could check on infection rates everywhere we passed through.
I don’t know about any other states, but I just haven’t seen that kind of handling in my following of the whole American COVID crisis. And it’s statewide.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@WereBear: Vermont, Maryland, Massachusetts… lots of “blue” states have R governors, and there are more examples in the fairly recent past. Maine voted for Obama by double digits while they were not only electing R and I Senators, but the proto-trump LePage as governor. NYC is bigger and bluer than a lot of states, the Giuliani-Bloomberg run wasn’t that long ago. Those blessed Normies don’t see parties the way we do. People are apparently getting nervous about Cortez-Mastro in NV and Hassan in NH in the next cycle (not that New Hampshire was ever deep blue, I suppose).
billcoop4
@WereBear:
We suffer together with Stefanik. Blech.
BC
Anonymous At Work
I hate Collins more than any other member of teh Senate, frankly. She’s a gaslighter whose crocodile tears piss me off royally. In 2009, she explicitly required the bill to be below $1 trillion for optics only, not for policy. Now, she “mis-remembers” her role in setting an arbitrary ceiling. Oh, and decrying how her version, which was laughably inadequate, never got any consideration. Obamacare-reconciliation aside (handwritten portions of that bill), when has she been the decisive vote on rejecting Republican bills or appointments?
Anonymous At Work
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Maine’s elections were marred by a super-progressive, a moderate-to-liberal Democrat, and LePage or Collins or some other down-the-line Republican. It’s why Maine moved to ranked choice voting.
Alce _e_ardillo
@Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix:
1. Cuomo has always been an asshole.
2. Even assholes will have moments which were made for their skill set- and 2020 was his moment.
3. 2021 is not that time anymore, and if I were him it would gracefully retire, and anoint a successor. ( I know, not gonna happen)
4.New York still is stuck in the “ three men in a room” era of governance, which Cuomo exemplifies. The sooner he leaves the stage and allows some real reform, the better off we will be.
Brachiator
The Democrats may need Collins’ vote. And Schumer knows how to count.
Maybe the possible slow self-destruction of the GOP will change things for Collins. If not, life goes on.
As for Cuomo, I don’t know. I don’t see anything yet that requires resignation. But there should be some process to deal with him, and levels of punishment. I do not believe in zero tolerance, or that all levels of offiense are the same. And I don’t believe in summary judgement by outrage.
I also don’t believe that any Democrat can just be replaced by any other Democrat. Otherwise, for example, you would just pick Speaker of the House by pulling names out of a hat, on the idea that anyone could do as good a job as Pelosi.
Betty Cracker
I haven’t known what to make of Schumer as majority leader, but the fact that he just successfully shepherded the massive relief package through Congress and dismissed Collins as the dithering fraud she is are huge points in his favor in my book. Go Chuck!
If I were AOC’s advisor and she told me she didn’t want to stay in the House forever, I’d suggest that she retire from the House after her term expires, move to Vermont and open up a progressive think tank and then wait for Bernie to kick the bucket so she can run for his senate seat. I like AOC, but I’m not sure she’s a great fit for statewide office. Maybe I’m wrong about that, but it’s my impression.
As for Gillibrand, it’s pretty obvious to me why she was more forceful during L’affaire Franken: it concerned a member of her legislative chamber, where she’d built a rep as a champion of women in the military who were harassment victims. Now maybe she’s neck-deep in state-level politics and so is just as familiar with the Cuomo thing, but I don’t make that assumption.
Brachiator
@Brachiator:
Meant to add. I live in California. We got our own problems with the possible recall of Governor Newsom.
Hildebrand
@lowtechcyclist: An ambitious politician? Hmm. I’ve never heard of one of those before.
Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix
@Alce _e_ardillo: Yep, you nailed it.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Betty Cracker: also:
having never been overly impressed with Gillibrand, I never thought the Franken stuff hurt her in the primary cause I never thought she was a strong national/presidential candidate, but I never thought she was trying to take out a rival, either. As you say, she made what national reputation she has going after the Pentagon. That wasn’t an act of cynical calculation. IMHO
WaterGirl
@Hildebrand: I still don’t get the Pete Buttigieg hate.
JanieM
@Hildebrand: Thank you.
Keith P.
or end up on the US Supreme Court if he can nudge his accuser count into the double digits
Uncle Cholmondeley
@Betty Cracker:
AOC will get re-elected to the House as long as she wants to be. With some patience she could get to be pretty powerful, as in the chair of a major committee or, potentially, Speaker.
cain
@JanieM:
The sign could be much improved with some buckshot. Just sayin.
lowtechcyclist
@Hildebrand:
You could talk about ambition as an on-off switch – either you have it or you don’t – or you could talk about it as if different people have different degrees of ambition. Just sayin’.
Hildebrand
@WaterGirl: The knives really come out for Buttigieg – in a way they don’t for just about any other Democrat. I find it…strange.
cain
I would like to see all the states move to rank choice voting. I don’t think it’s fair to have to pick one party over the other. All politics are local and sometimes in the lower levels it would be nice to be more subtle in our politics.
Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix
To those who are suffering under Stefanik, don’t worry — she’s been mentioned as a Republican candidate for governor now that Democrats have been so weakened by Cuomo’s scandal. Fucking LOL at that. Take that shitposter-to-own-the-libs snowflake out of her protective Fox bubble and she would melt.
cain
@Betty Cracker:
I think it hurt her presidential ambitions and I don’t think she has given up on those ambitions.
Betty Cracker
@Uncle Cholmondeley: That sounds about right to me, and maybe she’s fine with staying in the House. But if not, do you think she’d be a good fit for a US senate seat repping NY? Not my state, so I don’t know, but my guess is maybe not.
Hildebrand
@lowtechcyclist: I just found it odd that whilst talking about potential movement in NY politics, Pete Buttigieg made a cameo appearance just to be dragged over the coals for his ambition.
I just don’t understand how he has become the living personification of ‘bad’ political ambition.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
That would require some major changes both in AOC (!) and the country. For starters, she’d have to learn that whole “art of addition” thing, and I’m not just talking about 1,400 + 600 = 2,000
germy
@Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix:
Stefanik is so horrible and dishonest. And when she jumped on the trump train she even started tweeting like him, making up nicknames for her opponent.
She’s a rich girl who cosplays as a “salt of the earth” upstate NYer. I wish she’d go back to the private sector, but she keeps winning elections.
Betty Cracker
@cain: Maybe, but politicians are almost all ambitious by definition. The way Gillibrand gets characterized as a scheming, power-mad woman raises a host of red flags for me.
Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix
@Hildebrand:
He really makes some people’s teeth grate. Look at Klobuchar. She clearly hates his guts.
Personally, at this point, I can take or leave him. I think his ambition ruined his Presidential bid because he appeared to be someone who would change his positions to win. It’s also odd to see someone young try to take the “mature centrist” lane. Transportation is a really important-sounding-yet-useless cabinet seat, which is kind of perfect for him. Elaine Chao had it, and Obama appointed a Republican (Ray LaHood), which shows how much it is valued.
germy
@Hildebrand:
I don’t remember all the details, but during his presidential run, one of Pete’s key advisors was the same woman who’d worked with Cuomo to keep Republicans in office. So Cuomo could point and say “I’d love to do more, but these damn Republicans won’t let me!”
I’m glad Buttigieg is in this administration, because I like his transportation policy ideas.
Benw
@Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix: somewhere I saw my rep Lee Zeldin (R-pasty) was considering coming for Cuomo. I wish a fascist would
kindness
I like Gillibrand. I don’t think she has anything to worry about wrt being challenged by AOC. NY is a big state. There are a whole lotta folks upstate that are happy middle of the roaders. They aren’t smitten by AOC and I have to figure AOC is smart enough to know her path is at the Federal level, not the state level.
I didn’t like that Gillibrand helped push Franken overboard. I don’t really want to re-litigate that here as we have many fine people on both sided of that debate. It’s all been done to death. Cuomo won’t run for re-election and if he does I doubt he wins the primary. Cuomo is dead meat at this point.
Elizabelle
@Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix:
Really? Jesus, mistermix.
germy
(Devil’s Dictionary – Ambrose Bierce)
Elizabelle
@Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix: So Obama doesn’t value the FBI either? Interesting.
PS: I don’t think he should have appointed Comey, because there are plenty of excellent Democrats who could have done a far better job. I am tired of our feeding the “only Republicans are serious about national security/the military/law enforcement” myth.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix:
he was the thirty-seven year-old, gay mayor of a town of 100K people in Indiana. The fact that he did as well as he did among the whiter and leftier parts of the Dem party represented by the Iowa and NH contests is astounding. He was never going to be the nominee. He’s smart and talented and charismatic, and if he came from an even slightly less red state– Ohio or Wisconsin– he might have followed a more conventional career ladder. Nobody but nobody, not the next reincarnation of TR, JFK or BHO, is ever gonna go from South Bend to Pennsylvania Avenue. IMHO.
Though as I type that, and I’m sure this was discussed ad nauseam a year ago: Is/was his local CD out of reach?
cain
I agree, I wasn’t pleased with that whole scenario because it seemed like the whole thing turned on her say-so and there was no investigation or anything else. But the blowback was more over the top than it should have been but I understand that Franken was a very popular politician.
PST
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Before the primary scramble began in earnest I thought Gillibrand was going to be a very strong contender, not just because being a senator from New York is a good launching pad, but because there was something in her affect and presentation that seemed “presidential” to me, whatever that means. That all changed when she started running, and she wasn’t the only one. People who had been good interviews, capable of low-key, conversational back-and-forth, became shouty, tendentious, and guarded. After it was over, they reverted. Gillibrand was bad, Eric Swalwell was maybe the most Jekyll-and-Hyde in his change of affect, and Cory Booker was pretty bad too. I could hardly listen to any of them while they were running, and now they are all pleasant and interesting again. The only one who seemed immune was Pete Buttigieg. Say what you will about him, he could always be calm and conversational. Somehow the qualities that you thank would help make someone a good candidate (not necessarily a good president) can disappear when they have to perform the role.
lowtechcyclist
@Brachiator:
I don’t get this. Can you come up with a plausible example of a situation where Schumer might not get Manchin’s or Sinema’s vote, but would get Collins’ as vote #50?
And in any situation where the Dems need and stand an actual chance of getting 60 votes, Collins won’t be the tipping point.
OK, but is New York so devoid of other competent Dem politicians that it’s either Cuomo or somebody who would totally suck ass as governor? I admit great ignorance of NY politics, but that strikes me as implausible.
And as far as levels of punishment are concerned, he’s governor. What sort of in-between is there between things remaining more or less as they are now, and his ceasing to be governor? Unless someone can come up with a good in-between, ISTM that the choice is: does his pattern of sexual harassment rise to the level where he needs to go, or not?
I’m very much on the side of: powerful men shouldn’t be given room to believe that their power gives them special access to the bodies of the women who work for them or that they come into casual contact with. So you can probably infer where I come down on this, if that’s the choice. But I’m open to being shown that there are other options.
WaterGirl
@Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix:
If that’s what you really think, then you haven’t been reading what Biden and others have been saying about Transportation being one of the pivotal ways Biden plans to address some of the inequities that are suffered by communities of color.
cain
I don’t think so. I think Transportation is going to be important under the Biden administration. I think we are going to see significant investment in transport infrastructure. We’re talking about Biden here, the man who loves trains. No. I think he’s gonna be more important than in previous administration.
gvg
@Hildebrand: He seemed rather light on experience for my taste in President. This just past election seemed life or death to us. Anyone who ran, whom we thought was a likely loser even to Trump goat a lot of panic hate. Especially Bernie, not especially Buttigeig IMO. Bernie seems to have tapered off lately, Wang has almost disappeared. I don’t think Buttigeig got a lot more hate than others. Some of his supporters were very stubborn about not getting why most didn’t think so.
If he does a good job at transportation, people will reevaluate their opinions favorably. Inexperience is very correctable.
germy
@gvg:
Wang wants to be mayor of NYC.
I thought we’d learned our lesson about letting politically inexperienced businessmen take office.
PST
@Uncle Cholmondeley:
That may very well be correct, but I’ll bet people thought the same thing about Joe Crowley. He was even considered to be a potential speaker. Maybe the key is wanting to be. People can get tired and complacent as they age, and they don’t notice the earth shifting under their feet. We can’t all work as hard as Chuck Shumer.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@PST:
She and Tom Perez– whom I supported (FW that was Worth: nothing) for DNC chair– both got into performative swearing early in ’17. As someone who will curse the paint off the walls and thinks this country needs to grow the fuck up about what’s obscene and what isn’t– see the recent treatment of that basketball player’s anti-semitic comment, headlines blanked out the “f word” but printed the slur– that grated on me.
Old School
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Indiana’s 2nd congressional district went about 60/40 for Trump in the past election. It was similar in the congressional election.
The district last went Democratic in 2010. After redistricting, it went more Republican leaning.
Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix
@Elizabelle: Take a look at a list of Secretaries of Transportation and show me one that’s gone somewhere after that job. I’ll wait. Remember Federico Peña? He was supposed to be an up-and-comer. Went nowhere. Norm Mineta – it was a retirement job for him, same for LaHood. The fact that Chao held on to the job for 4 years in the Trump admin, when Trump was firing everyone else left-and-right, shows that she didn’t do anything (and also that Trump was scared of her husband).
That said, if Biden is really going to do something with transportation, maybe Pete will be an exception to the rule. But color me skeptical on that.
UncleEbeneezer
The are a whole lot of differences between the Franken situation and the Cuomo situation, and really anyone paying attention should have no trouble seeing them. It’s a grossly false equivalent to pretend like those differences don’t exist, don’t matter and then proceed to bash Gillibrand. It’s misogynist and feeds into several sexist double standards. Pulling that kind of shit is not what men who want to be allies to women should do. Just stop.
lowtechcyclist
@Hildebrand:
I just don’t understand how he has become the living personification of ‘bad’ political ambition.
Lige
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: I lived in SB when he was mayor and yes even though South Bend is a large (for Indiana) democratic city the CD is totally gerrymandered so that a do nothing Republican who hasn’t even visited South Bend (the largest city in her district) has been unassailable. The only reason we had Joe Donnelly as senator was because he was redistricted out of that seat.
Omnes Omnibus
@Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix: But, if Buttigieg is the kind of person who is always looking for a way up, why would he take the Transportation job? Isn’t he smart enough to see what you see – that Transportation is a graveyard of ambition?
zhena gogolia
@lowtechcyclist:
Ocasio-Cortez is not defined by ambition?
Wow.
Omnes Omnibus
@lowtechcyclist: He really does trigger some people. Next, we will have the usual suspects saying he doesn’t really speak as many languages as we have been told.
Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix
@Omnes Omnibus:
Because his option was to stay Mayor of South Bend Indiana. This stuff isn’t hard.
PJ
@lowtechcyclist: Are you still sore that he denied Bernie a win in Iowa?
schrodingers_cat
@Betty Cracker: Or move to MA and challenge Warren.
wenchacha
@Brachiator: This morning there has been a report of him groping an assistant he had called to the mansion to help with a technical issue. He put his hand under her blouse. That’s enough for me to say he should go.
I do believe that there is an issue of degree, but once he has his hand under her shirt, he can’t pretend it’s part of his culture of friendly hugs and kisses.
Anonymous At Work
@cain: Important to remember that you get 1.67 votes for Federal office in off-year and 2.67 votes in Presidential elections. That’s it, under the current system. So, yes, many votes are wasted and complex issues are boiled down, mashed up and over-simplified. It’s important to remember and recite that information when talking about different voting systems. Reminding people that they don’t get to vote on issues but only on one person to carry forth lots of contradictory issues and positions.
catclub
EXTREMELY low bar. I think he WAS worse than a good many blue state governors. Although, by death rate, NJ is worst.
lowtechcyclist
@PJ:
I will give you the benefit of the doubt, and assume you have accidentally confused me with someone totally different.
Jinchi
@Chyron HR:
The legislature was already talking about rescinding his emergency powers, but he was able to keep them in line with a mixture of favors and threats. This combined with the nursing home scandal pushed it over the edge.
The Pale Scot
@WaterGirl:
McKensey
He’s Trump without other people’s cash
lowtechcyclist
@zhena gogolia:
OK, tell me about it. Other than (correctly, IMHO) believe she could represent her Congressional district better than Joe Crowley could, which hardly shows she’s defined by ambition (as opposed to merely having some), what’s she done that demonstrates she’s consumed by ambition?
Baud
@The Pale Scot:
Calling any Dem Trump is way over the line.
Elizabelle
@Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix: I remember Neil Goldschmidt, Brock Adams and Drew Lewis being considered capable Cabinet members. You’re right about its not being a stepping stone to higher office so far, but that does not make it a fake agency or fake work.
That said, we’re undergoing rapid technological change, our infrastructure is crumbling, and a well run DOT could be an important player. You don’t like him, but Pete Buttigieg strikes me as a skilled communicator and a good advocate. Biden will need a lot of teamwork in building the consensus for actual heavy funding and spending on infrastructure — and what infrastructure, long overdue.
DOT Secretary is 14th in the line of presidential succession, true, but that’s because it’s organized by date each Department commenced. The DOT dates from 1967; Energy, Education, Veterans Affairs and Homeland Security are newer.
randy khan
@lowtechcyclist:
I think this is quite fair. And, honestly, because other people are taking the lead, she doesn’t have to do it.
Also, she may be considering whether to run for Governor some day, and being a big player in taking Cuomo down would hurt her with a lot of Democrats. And it would be worse to be a big player in a failed effort to take Cuomo down.
Omnes Omnibus
@Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix: He was no longer mayor. Seriously, if he is as driven by ambition as people make out and Transportation is a nowhere post, wouldn’t a think tank, NGO, or a university be a better place to bide his time?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
I laughed at Buttigieg when he went from “They’re gonna call us sosh’lists anyway so let’s be legends!” to “I can see cornfields of bipartisanship from my house”, but we’ve got a potentially rough mid-term coming up and I’d prefer candidates who recognize the reality of our political landscape, even belatedly, to performative, jargon-addicted emo-progs who say things like “Joe Biden is the corporate-consensus neoliberal candidate who’s not socially regressive.”
Maybe that’s just me.
Just Some Fuckhead
@randy khan: Maybe Gillibrand doesn’t work with Roger Stone anymore, since his legal troubles. I imagine she has standards.
Brachiator
@lowtechcyclist:
Is the Politico article wrong when they say the following:
Maybe it’s a non-issue and the article is a waste of time. Might there be some political value in at least pretending to want bi-partisan support and not deliberately antagonizing Collins, even if you don’t give a shit about her vote?
I presume that there are other competent politicians. Some might have greater problems. You could end up with a situation like VA a few years ago, where initially there was outraged desire to replace the governor and it turned out the guys next in line had their own, or worse, problems. I’m just suggesting a little caution.
Is all sexual harassment the same? Are you also in favor of mandatory minimums for hungry people who steal 5 slices of pizza?
Doesn’t really address the question of whether there should be levels of offense and levels of punishment.
Also, not strictly a gender thing.
PST
@Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix:
I respectfully disagree on both counts. First, Buttigieg had no chance whatsoever of being the nominee, and surely he knew that, so his objective must have been to become a national figure and get an important post in the coming administration (especially since he had nowhere else to go). He succeeded completely. Second, Transportation doesn’t have to be useless. Buttigieg’s greatest weakness (not his only one) is that he is a complete dud with African-American voters. If President Biden can really get an infrastructure offensive off the ground, then Buttigieg can be in the middle of things if he has Biden’s blessing, which he probably does. I foresee that his new best friends will be people like Muriel Bowser, Keisha Lance Bottoms, and Lori Lightfoot. Much of the worst neglect of infrastructure in the last half century has been in the big cities that have Black mayors and lots of Black voters. Bad transportation is an important component of structural racism because it affects access to jobs, medical care, and a host of other necessities. Attention to this does not have to be merely performative. With the party behind the effort, and for once I believe it truly may be, Buttigieg can be the face (or one of the faces) of genuine change that benefits millions of people in the groups that like him least, with endless opportunities for outreach from coast to coast. He could end up doing well by doing good, because voters care more about action than words.
Jinchi
@catclub:
Cuomo made some disastrous decisions at the start of the pandemic, but he learned pretty quickly from his mistakes and moved to correct them. We all saw coverage of his daily briefings because (1) New York was essentially ground zero for the first few months and (2) DJT continued to pretend that there was no plague at all.
Not the best, not the worst. Like most Democrats, he at least tried. (The best governors were probably in Vermont and Hawaii, but we don’t talk about them, because there’s little to talk about.)
Hildebrand
@lowtechcyclist: So, he is a typical ambitious politician. He served two terms as mayor and decided to take his show on the road, I am not sure how this makes him any different than any other politician who seeks higher office.
I mean, honestly, President Obama was all of, what, three years away from being a State Senator when he ran for the big chair?
I still find it incredibly odd that Buttigieg, amongst all the folks who ran for President, is the one who seriously bugged people.
Though, I definitely agree with BC that Gillibrand was likewise vilified. In both cases, it was all strangely visceral.
germy
Off topic, but
Just Some Fuckhead
@Hildebrand: Klobuchar was the only Democratic candidate that bugged me and only because of her ridiculous mom campaign of “Here’s why we can’t have anything nice.”
The Pale Scot
@Baud:
Yea well Mackenzie is a big red flag for me. That’s the production line where the newbies who have a soul get it removed. “Eyes like a doll” said Quinn. those people fuck over entire countries. I feel he’s just flying a flag of convenience, if he wasn’t gay, he’d be GQP
Jinchi
@Just Some Fuckhead: For me, the only Democratic candidate I really objected to was Bloomberg.
Baud
@The Pale Scot:
I couldn’t care less how you feel about Mackenzie. It diminishes Trump’s awfulness to pretend that Pete or any other Dem is the same or even similar.
.
the Pale Scot
@Baud:
Ok, that’s good point
satby
oh, deleted. Haterz just gonna hate.
zhena gogolia
MCKINSEY
STRZOK
lowtechcyclist
@Omnes Omnibus:
Tru dat. But Cabinet, regardless of which department, is way above mayor of a large-ish town, and even further above ‘no longer mayor.’ Instead of being in (or out of) Class A ball, he’s now a utility player in the bigs.
But what bothers me most about Transportation in particular is that transportation policy will be a very important part of any climate change policy worthy of the name.
There are people who could have done that job who really know their shit about the effect on climate of how we do transportation now and what we might do about that, who’ve been immersed in it for decades. And instead, we have this guy who’s going to spend the next couple of years learning what those people already know, rather than going in with a detailed agenda. Given that the next two years may be our only bite at this particular apple, that’s important.
The bum should have settled for Commerce, which is nearly unfuckupable, since it’s basically a grab-bag of mostly unrelated agencies that can run themselves, and largely do.
Omnes Omnibus
@The Pale Scot: Who is Mackenzie?
kindness
@Brachiator: I don’t understand how a Democrat could idealize anything with the hope of getting Senator Collins vote on any matter of importance. She has time and time again shown us she will vote as Mitch directs her to (other than the one saving the ACA in 2017). Collins ‘legendary’ moderate facade is a fake. She will never be someone we could count on not to twist the knife in Democrat’s hopes. She went out of her way to delay passage of the ACA and when she got almost everything she asked for she still voted against it.
And don’t get me started on taking any sage advice from Politico.
lowtechcyclist
@Hildebrand:
He waited that long, did he?
Just Some Fuckhead
@Jinchi: I’m not talking about objecting to candidates. I’m talking about being seriously bugged by Klobuchar’s terrible campaign that torpedoed her chances. Every debate, here’s why we can’t do all the great things my opponents are suggesting..
OTOH, I will always have a soft spot in my heart for the Bloomberg candidacy that gave us two hours of the most riveting television ever as Warren completely humiliated him.
PST
@Baud:
Agreed, but I cannot think of anyone who is more the opposite of Trump along so many parameters. As far as I know, Buttigieg has no economic interests to advance or protect. He’s notoriously smart. He’s soft spoken and gentle in his criticism. He is so little a sexual predator that he even married someone Chaste(n). And while he obviously has driving political ambitions, it isn’t clear that Trump ever did. His run seems to have started out as a sort of goof intended to improve his brand for business reasons. We can all probably think of more. It doesn’t make him perfect, but Buttigieg is the anti-Trump.
satby
@zhena gogolia: yeah, was going to correct all these learned people, but WTF bother.
Benw
@germy: what a douchecanoe. But if he wants to get punched out by the whole US military, I’m not gonna get in the way
satby
@lowtechcyclist: two terms was 8 years. How long do you wait before you look for a better job? And in your follow-up comment, you clearly demonstrate you have no fucking idea what you’re talking about re: Buttigieg.
Just Some Fuckhead
@satby:
Where’s Omnebaud? This is a teachable moment.
schrodingers_cat
@Omnes Omnibus: Bezos ex-wife
Benw
@Just Some Fuckhead: watching his slow realization that next to professional politicians he is a charisma-less void and that E Warren was ending his candidacy was deeeeeeee-lightful
Enhanced Voting Techniques
What was the despicable Admiral King’s line in WWII; “When they get in trouble they send for the sons-of-bitches.” It’s quite likely Cuomo being a jerk-off who demands his way or else is why he was effective in the face of Trump’s active sabotage. Meanwhile that attitude isn’t acceptable in normal times in a democracy.
Omnes Omnibus
@Just Some Fuckhead: I don’t know whether Baud or I should be more offended.
lowtechcyclist
@Jinchi:
Maybe he did. He also moved to cover up their extent, as we’ve been learning lately.
randy khan
@Brachiator:
In a world with the filibuster, Collins can only be the vote you need on reconciliation (and, honestly, Murkowski will be a lot easier to get than her – Murkowski is pretty transactional for her constituents, in the fine tradition of Ted Stevens). If you need 60, the 51st vote isn’t that important.
lowtechcyclist
@satby:
He waited that long?
ItinerantPedant
Re: AOC. Winning a D +29 District doesn’t set you up for a large state Senate seat.
And being a Dem Socialist running for office in a state where a significant part of its GDP is financial services is a real non-starter.
She could be the political equivalent of David Bowie and she’d still lose the primary let alone the general.
She wants to be the next Pelosi, she can absolutely rock that. She’s gotta work a bit harder about not alienating potential allies, though.
Baud
@Omnes Omnibus:
If I’m being honest with myself, you should be.
Jinchi
I think the real question is the opposite. Buttigieg was an incredibly successful fundraiser for a small town mayor who was relatively unknown at the start of the campaign, and he ended up finishing strongly.
In a field of ~30 candidates, many of whom were quite impressive in their own right, why did he stand out?
Salty Sam
Not so odd for a former McKenzie consultant…
Hildebrand
@lowtechcyclist: Oh my god. Did Pete personally piss in your cornflakes for days, weeks, months on end? Did he kick your dog? Mug your grandmother? Bring a store-bought dish to your pot-luck?
Yeesh.
Omnes Omnibus
@Baud: No, it’s you. I insist.
Jinchi
@ItinerantPedant:
If AOC stays in politics until she’s Nancy Pelosi’s age, it will be 2070 before she retires. She’s got a lot of time to build alliances if she wants to.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Just Some Fuckhead: I don’t know who Chuck Schumer’s recruiting in Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Florida, Ohio and North Carolina, but I hope they sound a lot more like Amy Klobuchar, and Joe Biden, than their opponents who promised nice things.
Omnes Omnibus
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: I don’t recall Biden saying that we can’t have nice things.
Almost Retired
Not that he asked me, but I think Buttigieg boxed himself in by initially portraying himself as an Indiana boy made good, returning to his roots to improve the plight of his home state, etc. etc. When that home state is as red as Indiana, what higher or state-wide offices are available to him locally? He should have asked McKinsey for a transfer to the Minneapolis office, or something and then started his political career. Follow me now for lightly-informed opinions on matters of which I know little….
Baud
@Omnes Omnibus:
Biden was pretty strong against M4A.
PJ
@Jinchi: Initially, in early 2019, Buttigieg got a ton of press because his campaign was novel (at the time, some people here got upset because I used the word “novelty”, but that’s what his campaign was for the press): he was the first openly gay person to run for President, and his highest office held was Mayor of a small town in Indiana, a very red state. There was about a month where he seemed to be featured in every paper or magazine I glanced at.
After that, I think he got a lot of traction, particularly with a certain kind of white voter, because he was “that nice young man.” That helped him win Iowa, and come in second in NH, but being an inoffensive white guy was only going to carry him so far, and it was no help at all once he got to states that a significant number of minority voters.
Baud
@PJ:
Pete is an incredible communicator. It’s a large reason he caught fire.
Omnes Omnibus
@Baud: But not against universal healthcare.
schrodingers_cat
@PJ: And the ridiculous gushing about speaking in 13 languages. OMG he speaks Norwegian.
PJ
@Baud: But campaigned on expanding and improving the ACA (which he has already started doing with the ARP) and for a public option. I wouldn’t call that saying “we can’t have nice things”.
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: Good point. He acquitted himself well during the general campaign as a team player.
PJ
@Baud:
I was initially skeptical, but he was really good at handling the idiots on Fox during the general campaign, when they thought they were going to zing him.
Baud
@PJ:
Well, we’re comparing Biden to Amy. Amy wasn’t against improvements either. Neither one went as far as the progressive-side candidates wanted to go.
Another Scott
ICYMI, …
Naturally.
(via nycsouthpaw)
Cheers,
Scott.
Barry
@Brachiator:
“The Democrats may need Collins’ vote. And Schumer knows how to count.”
I honestly don’t understand this. If they need to override a filibuster, they need 60 votes, which means Collins and 9 other GOP Senators.
Who are those?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Baud: myself, I was comparing Biden and Klobuchar to Bernie! and Warren, who, I’m pretty sure, Fuckhead was referring to as the “nice things” candidates.
Biden also kept his distance from the Green New Deal, and rejects the magic
wandpen approach to student debtJames E Powell
@WaterGirl:
I haven’t seen or heard any in a long time. If I recall, his entry into the national political discourse included uncharitable remarks about Hillary Clinton. Add McKinsey to that and some people will find fault.
I think the overwhelming majority of Democratic types have enjoyed his TV appearances. He is good on TV and is definitely not a “but some” Democrat.
Just Some Fuckhead
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Don’t make assumptions. Consider this a final warning.
Omnes Omnibus
Read this thread.
Peale
@Baud: Also, despite being a soulless technocratic MBA blood sucking flunky lickspittle from Satanenzie or whatever, he seems to have picked up the ability to break down a problem, come up with a plan, and execute it. (Which is often the problem of McKenzie’s ideas. When they are executed, they are disasters, if they can be executed at all, which they often cannot be, but then “that’s your problem, give me my $500,000 fee anyway, thank you very much”). For someone who didn’t stand a chance, he certainly executed a plan to win the Iowa caucus that worked. It didn’t matter in the end, but maybe at Transport he can solve other problems presented to him.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Is McKinsey worse than Goldman Sachs?
WaterGirl
@Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix: Let’s talk in 2 years. I’m willing to put up $100 that says Buttigieg is the exception to your rule.
Hildebrand
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: For some on this thread it seems to be worse than working for Satan.
WaterGirl
@wenchacha: That’s an allegation. It should be investigated, and then we can talk whether that means Cuomo should go.
Geminid
One factor that may condition New York Reps. Zeldin and Stefanik’s plans is redistricting. New York will lose a congressman in reapportionment, and Albany Democrats will try to squeeze out a Republican. Those two Republicans may be targets, as well Claudia Tenney, who won the NY 22nd by less than 200 votes. Just adding Ithaca to the 22nd would turn that district blue.
Baud
@Hildebrand:
Satan actually offers decent benefits.
Peale
@Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix: I would say that Being Secretary of Transportation across several GOP administrations has indeed helped the Chao family fortune.
satby
@Almost Retired: he worked at their office in Chicago.
@lowtechcyclist: ok, be an ass; but how long did you stay in your job before deciding you were ready to move on to a new job? You never answered. You sound jealous of the guy.
@schrodingers_cat: 7. Which is decidedly more than the average non-immigrant American (that would be none) so that was somewhat noteworthy.
WaterGirl
@PST: Well said.
PPCLI
@schrodingers_cat: Though this seems like a universal American reaction to (claims of) speaking another language. We got a similar “OMG Melania speaks 5 whole languages!!!” when what little evidence there was of her speaking anything but English and Slovene revealed her ability to be below rudimentary.
zhena gogolia
@Baud:
For his appearances on Fox during the general election campaign alone we should all bow down and kiss his feet. I’m serious.
zhena gogolia
@Another Scott:
Great!
James E Powell
@cain:
It seemed that way because that’s the way the press/media decided to portray it. As Betty Cracker noted, it was about another senator. Every Democratic senator was being pounded by the press/media for their responses to the latest news about Al Franken. It was turning into the only story they were going to talk about.
And the reason that the press/media made Gillibrand the point senator on Franken was because she had just very vocally made sexual assaults her issue. Not because she was ambitious, not because she was taking out a rival, not because of any of the things people like to say about female politicians.
Hildebrand
@Baud: I imagine those who have worked their way up (down?) the infernal hierarchy, sure, but the junior tempters seem to be pretty mistreated (if C.S. Lewis is at all a reliable source).
lowtechcyclist
@Hildebrand:
Didn’t realize I’d asked such a challenging question!
Edmund Dantes
@Hildebrand: if you worked in a company after McKinsey came in and ducked everything up, you’d understand.
Omnes Omnibus
@Edmund Dantes: I was in the army, am I guilty of what happened at My Lai?
PST
When it comes to Buttigieg I keep in mind that his three years at McKinsey in his twenties came before eight years as mayor (with time out for active military service). It doesn’t seem that relevant to who he is, other than having the kind of degrees that land you a job at a place like that. Maybe he had some student debt to pay off. After all, he’s the son of a Marxist professor, not a real estate multi-millionaire.
Baud
@Omnes Omnibus:
You know what you did.
Hildebrand
@lowtechcyclist: It wasn’t challenging. The visceral distaste you have for one candidate feels…strangely odd and disproportionate, like there is something else going on.
WaterGirl
@Omnes Omnibus: I believe that was an equal opportunity remark. I don’t consider it a slam because you and Baud or two of my favorite commenters. Equal opportunity compliment?
Geminid
@James E Powell: Although not a Franken fan, I respected him as a serious and hardworking Senator. The ruthless decision of other Democratic Senators to cull him from the herd was instigated by the Alabama special election. Another time Franken would have faced a possible reprimand, and then Minnesota’s voters would have decided his fate.
I understand Franken took this hard. I wouldn’t wish deppression on anyone, so I was glad to see recent signs of Franken life.
Peale
@PST: Hillary Clinton Supported GOLDWATER in 1964 when she was 17!!!!!! She Clearly has just been a wolf in sheep’s clothing her entire life!!!!
Hildebrand
@Edmund Dantes: So, do you believe that working a short stint at a consulting firm (even one with a terrible rep) is enough to cast someone into the outer darkness for all time?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Peale: when I think there were people seriously making that argument in ’16, and probably still….
lowtechcyclist
@Brachiator:
The fact that TBOTP said it doesn’t add anything to its value, as far as I’m concerned. Main thing is, they don’t answer the question I asked you: what’s Collins going to be Vote #50 for, that Manchin or Sinema will have voted against?
Well sure, there should be. But my point was that I couldn’t see how there could be, in this context. Either he’s the governor or he isn’t. I ask again: What’s the in-between? What’s the third choice?
lowtechcyclist
@Hildebrand:
We can debate honestly, or you can try to read between the lines, and respond to what you think you see there. Your choice.
WaterGirl
@Omnes Omnibus: @Baud:
I could never understand why everyone (except Bernie) couldn’t just say:
James E Powell
@Brachiator:
While there will surely be times when Collins’s vote might be helpful, it is a huge mistake to tell her and the press/media world that her vote is the most sought after prize. Turning her into the deciding person only makes her a more formidable obstacle because that’s how she plays it. See also, Murkowski.
Collins the moderate is a lie that she and press/media like to tell. She & they needed to hear what Schumer said: we are no longer going begging to Collins.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Four Seasons Total Landscaping mistermix: The cabinet is where political careers go to die. Excluding Sec. Clinton, name one former cabinet secretary that’s had a future career in politics.
WaterGirl
@Omnes Omnibus: Thank you!
I thought for a second that maybe I had lost my mind or was living in an alternate reality.
James E Powell
@Omnes Omnibus:
I see people explaining why they didn’t like him for the Democratic nomination for president, but I don’t see hate.
Baud
@WaterGirl:
They were competing with each other. They were all trying to develop their brand.
WaterGirl
@Baud: They should have competed in areas where there really were significant differences – there were plenty of areas where they could have developed their own brands without contributing to the bullshit narratives that the press wanted to talk about.
Baud
@WaterGirl:
Brands have to play to the consumer. A lot of people were focused on health care policy in early 2016 as the critical issue.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@James E Powell: I’m pretty confident that Collins will never be the 51st vote for anything. Murkowski is pretty damn unlikely, even though I think she’s probably more sincere in her moderation than Collins, if not much more likely to act (independently) on it.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@WaterGirl: @Baud: I thought, and still think, that health care is the most important non-trump issue in the party. I think a lot of Dems misread the results of 2016 (I may have said this before) and thought Bernie and Bernie-ism were way more popular than they actually were. A bunch of ’20 hopefuls in the Senate signed on to his SP/M4A proposal early in 2017. In 2018 the focus on AOC and the telegenic, narrative-friendly “Squad” over people like Lauren Underwood and Conor Lamb reinforced the wrong lesson for a lot of the big name candidates not named Biden or Klobuchar.
In fairness, the stories I read suggested that Warren, wonk that she is, dug into the details of a public option vs SP and concluded that SP was the better way to achieve UHC, but she ignored that “eliminating private insurance” was the politically toxic flipside of “Medicare for All”, even as that fact had already pretty much killed the Harris campaign.
WaterGirl
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: I’m not saying they shouldn’t have talked about healthcare, but they should have acknowledged that their goals were the same, and that every one of them would work to get the best bill through congress.
YMMV
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Baud: So you’re saying Walmart isn’t Satan?
lowtechcyclist
@satby: You said he waited 8 years. I say he didn’t. We have a factual disagreement, easily resolved by checking Wikipedia.
Debates like this work better if both parties are at least working from the same set of facts.
Brachiator
@wenchacha:
A report of groping is a serious charge and should be investigated. Wouldn’t this be a form of criminal assault? This would be very serious.
But an accusation by itself is not proof.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@WaterGirl: I’m definitely not saying they shouldn’t have discussed health care, just that in a primary especially, they have to make distinctions, and in 17-20, a whole lot of people convinced themselves that the future of the party was written on twitter and in the Sanders platform, and once they had staked their campaigns on that, they couldn’t dial it back without harming their own brand, their own campaign.
In the end, after the primary, most of the big name Dems, even Bernie, mostly, came together in pragmatism to support Biden and his more moderate, and successful, stance.
WaterGirl
@lowtechcyclist: It would have taken you less time to google and find out that you were wrong and that satby was right – than it took you to write that comment.
Besides, satby lives in South Bend, so one might have reason to think she knows what she is talking about.
I think satby is very much arguing in good faith. Not sure I could say the same of you when you call Buttigieg a bum.
lowtechcyclist
@WaterGirl:
So Wikipedia is wrong, he didn’t run for DNC chair in 2017?
My bad
Oh noes, I called him a bum!
No, she wasn’t arguing in good faith. Someone who asks twice about your personal career history is not arguing in good faith.
PST
@Peale: 1964. I was 11, and just beginning to extricate myself from the cult. My father had brainwashed me with The Conscience of a Conservative a couple of years before. There was no DCFS in our little town to prevent that kind of thing.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@lowtechcyclist: so did backbench congressman Keith Ellison, a state rep named Jaime Harrison, and an obscure bureaucrat named Tom Perez. Are they also consumed by an unhealthy and unhinged ambition?
Geminid
@WaterGirl: Buttegieg seems to draw a lot of animus, for different reasons. One reason may be that he occupies a space at the moderate end of the Democratic spectrum. Some liberal Democrats, by no means all, have an ax to grind against the moderates in the party. I see this sometimes with regard to Virginia Governor Ralph Northam. Most Democrats in either wing know they can’t win without the other wing, though. That is demonstrated by the way the House Democratic caucus hung together on the ARP.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@lowtechcyclist: as someone who is a more than a bit befuddled by passion PB inspires in some of his fans, I’m a lot more befuddled by the degree of your hostility.
PST
@?BillinGlendaleCA: Herbert Hoover.
Central Planning
@?BillinGlendaleCA: Former cabinet members that had political futures: George HW Bush, Donald Rumsfeld, Daniel Patrick Moynihan, Cy Vance, Andrew Cuomo, Tom Ridge, Joe Biden, Rahm Emanuel.
J R in WV
@satby:
There is no way to convince the homophobes among us that Pete Buttiegieg is bound for greater things, and is worthy of the assignment.
No matter how well spoken, how thoughtful, how successful, they will always have nothing but despite when they think of him. It’s just like racism and President Obama.
A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan)
@Hildebrand: Buttigieg seems great to me, so yeah, I don’t get it either. I love how sharp he is when going on Fox or some such. Actually, I love how sharp he is in general. Perhaps some are bothered by “young gay man in a hurry”? I personally don’t think we can spare any political talent right now, if we ever could.
JAFD
An old man babbles here:
1 – Every politician is ambitious. Campaigns require effort and ego, many other vocations will give you a good living more easily.
2 – You can’t beat somebody with nobody, and every somebody is imperfect, with weaknesses and strengths.
3 – The future wil bring surprises. Does ‘the right person’ today have the skills to deal with what happens in 2023 ? (Nobody in 2016 ‘expects the
Spanish Inquisitionpandemic’)4 – The problem with Gov Cuomo, now, is that he’s made himself unpromotable. Governor of New York is one of those ‘triple-A’ jobs. People in them should be ‘trying out’ for the Presidency. The Democratic Party – and the country – cannot afford to have too many of those positions filled by people who wouldn’t make good Presidential candidates.
Am not trying to get into arguments with anyone this afternoon. Please overlook it if I contradicted you. (My ambition is to outlive my enemies before I make any new ones, and try to make enough friends so someone attends my funeral.)
Martin
I’d be surprised if AOC runs to the senate that quickly. The House is where you can be a rabble-rouser. That doesn’t work nearly as well in the Senate, and I think she enjoys some of the freedoms she’s afforded there. She’s barely old enough to even run for the Senate, so I think she can afford some patience.
Cuomo can DIAF. He may not resign, but we can make it continuously clear that he should. Honestly, NY gov and NYC major need to be elected as a ticket. NYC mayor can sink the gov, and the gov can sink the city. It’s not sustainable. Alternatively, move the capitol to NYC, because right now the Govs job is to represent the half of the state that doesn’t live in NYC, at the expense of NYC. NYC is Paris, and there’s no getting around that. Lean into it and everyone will benefit.
A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan)
@zhena gogolia: I agree!
lowtechcyclist
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Now this is just stupid. I was refuting the false claim that Mayor Pete had waited 8 years before seeking another position. That’s all. I wouldn’t have bothered if multiple posters hadn’t made a big deal about it.
But since you asked: yes, I think that running for four very different offices in less than 9 years (state treasurer of Indiana 2010, mayor of South Bend 2011, DNC chair 2017, and POTUS 2019) with most of them seeming (at least to me; YMMV, and probably does) quite a bit over his head relative to his experience at the time, seems to establish a clear pattern here: he wants to be Somebody Important, and that in and of itself seems to matter way more than the actual Important Job. So now he’s Secretary of Transportation, and the pattern continues.
lowtechcyclist
@A woman from anywhere (formerly Mohagan):
Maybe this is the problem. I don’t watch TV, and only rarely watch clips of people saying stuff; I’ll read the transcript, thanks. And on paper, he seems to me like an unexceptional talent.
@JAFD:
Well sure, but even among politicians, there’s a great degree of variance in terms of degree of ambition, and how it manifests itself. Even in politics, there are a variety of normal career progressions. Buttigieg’s attempted career progressions aren’t like anything I can recall seeing in nearly sixty years of following politics, other than from maybe a few guys who were considered a bit flaky by political standards and didn’t get very far.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@lowtechcyclist:
that’s some straight up bullshit, your first comment about Buttigieg talked his ambition
You let your hate-flag fly a little more blatantly than you intended, and you doubled down again and again… I don’t really care if you’re a liar as well as a crank, but don’t be insulting when you’re called out on the latter