Thanks to the coronavirus, The Onion didn’t have much of an opportunity in 2020 to retweet this classic headline over a photo of a recent mass shooting site:
‘No Way To Prevent This,’ Says Only Nation Where This Regularly Happens https://t.co/c1FEE0smko pic.twitter.com/u0TucOuQ71
— The Onion (@TheOnion) March 23, 2021
As the pandemic recedes, mass shootings will likely tick up in a perverse spin on the “nature is healing” meme. President Biden came out strong for reinstating a ban on assault rifles, and good for him. But it’s hard to image enough lawmakers coming on board to end our country’s gruesome indulgence of gun fanatics, especially since virtually every elected Republican is or at least pretends to be a gun fanatic. Here’s one of them on a Sunday show:
"I own an AR-15. If there's a natural disaster in South Carolina where the cops can't protect my neighborhood, my house will be the last one that the gang will come to, because I can defend myself." — Lindsey Graham pic.twitter.com/PYTkLzvK1J
— Aaron Rupar (@atrupar) March 28, 2021
Could be Graham is telling a politically convenient lie about his plans to protect his collection of John C. Calhoun and Strom Thurmond memorabilia from hordes of South Carolinians who are lying in wait until the next hurricane triggers their insatiable desire to lay unclean hands on those priceless artifacts. But lots of people, mostly older white dudes, share those lurid Rambo fantasies, and until the rest of us say enough with this bullshit, nothing much will change.
I think we will get there eventually, and Republican intransigence in the face of hideous events will make the blowback stronger than it would have been if they’d just accept the simple shit virtually everyone, including gun owners, agrees should be done, such as closing background check loopholes. But that’s how American democracy seems to function. Republicans get away with obstructing stuff most Americans want done until suddenly, they don’t get away with it anymore, and they lose decisively.
Anyway, that’s what I tell myself to keep despair at bay, and sometimes it’s even true. Open thread!
patrick II
Lindsay, the last time I was near a natural disaster (tornado in Indiana) neighbors helped each other. Is there something different about the people you represent in South Carolina?
Betty Cracker
@patrick II: True. I’ve been through a few hurricanes, and the remarkable thing in the immediate aftermath is how people help each other and share what they have, even bugfuck nuts people in Florida.
Patricia Kayden
Mike in NC
Lindsey Graham would only shoot himself if he got within ten feet of an AR-15. Reminds me of the ridiculous cartoons of the Fat Orange Clown that wingnuts drew, with his head grafted onto Rambo’s rippled body.
After dinner tonight I plan to watch a rerun of “Trump’s American Carnage” on Frontline. On April 13th they’ll be running a follow-up documentary on the January 6 riot, entitled “American Insurrection”.
Brachiator
This has been the most insane thing about coming out of the lockdown. Most people are relieved and happy to try to reclaim their lives.
But a certain number of nutburgers are hot to suit up, grab some weapons and wreak havoc.
karen marie
Graham sure does load a lot of “what ifs” into his scenario. Has his fantasy ever occurred?
Dorothy A. Winsor
The kind of crap Graham is spouting just sounds crazy to me. Like if I heard someone saying that on the street, I’d call a cop
WaterGirl
@Betty Cracker: Remember Soonergrunt, after the tornado, grilling all the food that was in his fridge/freezer and sharing it with neighbors?
Once again Lindsay shows his true colors, and it’s not pretty.
Brave senator: “If something terrible happens, i’m gonna make sure that everybody goes after you guys before they get to me”.
Not even “I need to be able to protect my neighbors.”
MattF
I guess Graham believes now that bugfuckery is the only way to victory. The (somewhat) comforting thought is that South Carolina is the political last ditch.
Lige
Unless you have a job in law enforcement, the military or organized crime a gun nothing but a dangerous toy. Sorta of like a dirt bike, jet ski or lawn darts. Anyone blathering about how they are going use them like some sort of action hero or vigilante should be laughed at and/or watched pretty carefully.
Another Scott
Repost – Meanwhile, yesterday in Canada – Reuters:
In contrast, US GunVilolenceArchive:
3/27 – 3 mass shootings
3/26 – 4 mass shootings
3/23 – 2 mass shootings
3/22 – 2 mass shootings
3/20 – 3 mass shootings
…
The Onion headline is correct. And it’s long past time we do something serious about it.
Grrr…
Cheers,
Scott.
trollhattan
Taking a year off from school spree killings is my positive from 2020. We seem to have hit the reset button now.
But one of the many stories from the Boulder slaughter. The writer is a public radio news director and undoubtedly learned more, sooner, about what had happened than the rest of us. I cannot fathom the shock of learning of her father.
smith
Graham’s fantasy seems to be quite common among racist gun nuts. Basically, they’re trying to conjure up a a scenario in which they can shoot as many black people as they long to without suffering any consequences.
trollhattan
@Another Scott:
I recall another Onion story saying the NRA had decided that “A thousand sounds about right” as their answer to “Just how many victims will it take to finally do something about guns?”
Stephen Paddock took a good run at that tally, and crickets.
randy khan
@Mike in NC:
You beat me to it.
trollhattan
@smith:
House as Fortress seems VERY prevalent. When it comes up in conversation (a LOT last summer during the Floyd protests) I remind them that Charles Bronson did not technically make documentaries.
RaflW
@Betty “it’s hard to image enough lawmakers coming on board to end our country’s gruesome indulgence of gun fanatics” and yet Sen. Murphy of CT was on the teevee this weekend saying he’s asking Schumer for time to cobble together a bill that can get 60 votes.
Does CT have legal pot now? Because he seems stoned on his own supply.
matt the somewhat reasonable
The reason Graham says this is because he knows that being totaled out by a mob is exactly the fate he deserves.
matt the somewhat reasonable
@trollhattan: ‘My philosophy of life comes from the movie The Omega Man.’
Sure Lurkalot
When the NWS predicted 2 feet of snow a couple of weeks ago in my city, I wonder how many of my neighbors looked through their pantries and went out for ammo like a common Lindsay Graham?
Baud
So Graham’s neighbors don’t have guns and he just informed the “gang” to go after them first?
RaflW
The reality of course is that normal not sociopathic people go out and help their neighbors after a natural disaster. They clean up downed trees, help people patch roofs or sort through belongings. They bring food and offer warmth.
But not Republicans.
patrick II
The two main reasons that are given for so many mass shootings in America:
Democrats: Too many guns. Solution: Fewer guns, especially among those with records or mental problems.
Republicans: Mental illness, bad guys. Solution: Thoughts and prayers.
Since we have so many more mass shootings than other industrial countries, the implication of the Republicans thesis (if the cause is only bad guys and mentally ill), is that the U.S. has many more bad guys and mentally ill than other culturally similar populations. Which, if I believed in their sincerity, would tell you much about the Republican’s opinion the American people — that many of us are irretrievably bad and/or mentally ill. And furthermore, there is nothing to do about it (since it is evidently a natural, incurable condition) but to pray about it. And to arm yourself with the most powerful weapons available and carry them everywhere to guard against all of those crazy, bad fellow Americans.
trollhattan
@matt the somewhat reasonable:
Heh. Wonder how much it influenced NRA into inviting Heston to be their figurehead?
Hungry Joe
Lindsey will die a hero. His body will be found surrounded by thousands of shell casings as he fought to the end, Gen. Ripper-like, mowing down waves of Commie-proles that stormed and finally overran his mansion.
Or — karma being an underachiever — he’ll die old and in bed.
Ken
I think Graham’s admitting that the South Carolina government’s response to a natural disaster will make Texas’s handling of the deep freeze power outages look competent, and the state will have months to degenerate into a Mad Max style anarchy.
Ken
That’s a very loaded question, and I do not want to know the answer.
trollhattan
@Ken:
I see what you did there.
Another Scott
Like most federal politicians, Graham lives in the DC area. (It makes sense and I don’t begrudge him that.) His home is on South Capitol Street SE, DC.
So, yeah, it’s even more posturing than one expects as DC has strict gun rules (even after Heller v DC). You’re shocked, shocked, I know.
(And whodathunk a RWNJ politician would brag about having an AR in his other, unoccupied, house??)
(sigh)
Cheers,
Scott.
Splitting Image
In Graham’s defense, if civilization collapsed to the point that the police couldn’t protect his home, it’s likely that the internet would be completely off-line, making it impossible for anyone to say anything mean about him on Twitter.
It’s entirely possible that he could recover his spine in such an eventuality.
Nutmeg again
Talking with my (adult) kid who lives in Europe today. One conclusion, kind of bittersweet: ever coming back here to work and live would be a terrible idea, for all kinds of reasons. We shoot each other here! (She keeps asking: “even if they make guns illegal like Australia, how do they find all the guns that people have hidden away?” It’s a good question.) Our working conditions are terrible, awful, and really lousy by comparison. We have no work/life balance. We worship the dollar, or need to live as if we do. We have no sane housing policy, and rents or housing cost is insane. Crap public transit–she lives in a large northern city with tram lines, subway lines, trains, busses, ferries… all subsidized by her work. I won’t even mention health care, except I just did. ach! how did we go so wrong?!? So, yeah, as I age, and her life unfurls, we are joined–or separated–by an ocean.
karen marie
Off topic but funny, I thought:
Another Scott
Relatedly, LeTourneau – Take a bow David Simon, you were right all along:
What?? Attacking societal issues works better than moar guns and no tolerance??! That’s crazy talk!!
A good read. Click on over.
We’re not destined to keep doing the same things forever. We don’t have the systems we do because of the laws of physics. Things can change a lot, quickly, with sensible leadership that isn’t afraid of disingenuous bad-faith criticism.
Cheers,
Scott.
JDM
As I understand it, Graham’s SC “house” is an empty lot he claims as his residence for electoral reasons. Not sure how many looters are gonna fight anyone to try to get some weeds and gravel.
Another Scott
@Nutmeg again: I honestly don’t think that “what will we do about the hundreds of millions of guns that are suddenly illegal”? is a major problem. We outlawed machine guns in the 30s and got them off the street. Not all of them, of course (I knew a guy in Ohio who had a tommy gun). But enough that if they were ever seen in public, very bad things happened to the person with them (unless they were federally licensed).
My dad told a story about going out in the Colorado mountains with his step dad to shoot a Nazi machine gun that he brought back from the war. After doing so, they took it to a dealer to have it disabled.
Most people will obey the law. If buy-backs are part of the package, evidence says they will be well subscribed. If the RWNJs decide they won’t obey, they will keep their guns put away and not risk federal charges. And eventually they will become inoperable, be turned in by spouses / children / survivors, etc.
My $0.02.
Cheers,
Scott.
Parfigliano
@Another Scott: Yup Lindsey only owns property in SC for electoral residency requirements. If shit hit fan and he was somehow in SC his only action would be calling for a govt helicopter evac.
What a tool.
Ken
@JDM: I dunno, come the apocalypse and collapse of civilization, weeds and gravel might be valuable. More likely than bitcoin, anyway.
prostratedragon
@Another Scott: Seasons 2 (docklands) and 3 are both seeming quite relevant now.
Cameron
So…after a natural disaster in the place he represents, he doesn’t call on the power of the body he’s a member of to help? Instead, he gets strapped? What am I missing here?
Jay
@Another Scott: ???
laura
I believe that Senator Shiny Machine Gun is spewing his fantasy Gretna and Danziger Bridge. One of the lasting impressions of hurricane Katrina was the white residents treating their black neighbors as a ravening criminal hoard instead of their friends and neighbors. Nothing more than a racist white supremacist planning for the change to shot a black person or several black people for the crime of being black at or near Lindsey’s house.
mrmoshpotato
@WaterGirl:
Where in South Carolina does Leningrad Lindsay live that he doesn’t think the SC National Guard would be present in the wake of a natural disaster?
Jay
@Another Scott:
when they changed the rules here, my Dad, my Brother and I went through our inventories of guns, swapped what we wanted, kept what we wanted,
and sold the rest off to a Movie/TV Armourer, who decommissioned them for use as prop guns.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Baud: Lindsey’s a good neighbor.
Jay
Villago Delenda Est
Lady G cannot face his heroic end a moment too soon. Except it will not be nearly as heroic as his fantasies are.
cain
I wonder if he realizes that nobody is going to approach a house with a guy who has a military class killing weapon – he might be starving in there – but nobody is gonna come over and check on him. Sucks to be him.
Villago Delenda Est
@Nutmeg again: Your daughter is perceptive. Confiscating as many firearms as we collectively have would be a logistical nightmare, as the ammosexuals would fight tooth and nail to keep their precious precious toys and penis substitutes.
Of course, the ammosexuals haven’t thought through the real world difficulties in Obama coming to grab their guns. Because the also have not thought through anything else regarding their fetish totems.
piratedan
waiting for the day when the GOP is no longer classified as a Political Party and is properly characterized as a Criminal Organization (organized is in the eye of the beholder in this instance…)
NorthLeft12
Are roaming gangs of unarmed scary people a regular thing after natural disasters in the United States?
An interested foreign observer would like to know.
NorthLeft12
@cain: I would hazard a guess that if they know that Sen. Graham lives there, they will not approach it whether they know that he is armed or not.
CaseyL
The dilemma is, are Republican individuals driving the obstruction no one really wants, or are they doing the will of the voters who keep (re-)electing them?
Who should we focus on ridding ourselves of? The individual politicians, or their voters?
My understanding of the situation is that GQP pols have conditioned the people in their districts to expect nothing from the government that would actually make their lives better. The GQP has convinced people that “improving our lives” is an illegitimate aim for government to have in the first place. Apparently the only legitimate use of government is to uplift billionaires and white supremacists. The GQP replaced any semblance of public service with calls for white nationalism.
Is there a way to get through to voters who, for 40-odd years – two generations! – have had this drummed into them? To convince them, or teach them, that government exists to strive toward a more perfect union? Or are they so wedded to racism that even a rising tide lifting all boats is a bad thing, if some of those boats belong to POC?
the pollyanna from hell
@Villago Delenda Est: Instead of gender insults, how about fainting couch commando, sniff-lipped squint-lids, or something more creative?
?BillinGlendaleCA
@CaseyL:
You see, Republicans(and conservatives in general) don’t believe that, life is zero sum. If your lot in life improves, I have to lose.
SFAW
@CaseyL:
Yes. Given the past five* years, I thought this would have been obvious.
* Yes, I realize it’s actually been obvious for somewhat more than five years, but TFG’s campaign and “election” made it that much more obvious.
SFAW
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
Not unlike: if gays are allowed to marry, my het marriage is cheapened.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@SFAW: TFG embodied the “life is zero sum” philosophy, but Republicans have believed in that for at least the last 40 years.
Ruckus
@WaterGirl:
Conservatism.
What does the word mean? To conserve what they have. LG has a fair amount, he lives in SC and makes $174,000/year. I’d bet he could pay for a nice house in SC for that amount. It was a lot cheaper to live there when I was stationed in Charleston for 2 yrs, than it was in the SoCal area. Now that was a few decades ago but I’ve also lived in OH in this century and it was dramatically cheaper than SoCal. I doubt that SC has gotten more expensive than the outskirts of Columbus, OH.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@SFAW: Yup, just another manifestation of the basic philosophy.
Ksmiami
@Mike in NC: I’m just hoping superintelligent robots will eventually go door to door programmed to grab all the guns…
Ksmiami
@Villago Delenda Est: super intelligent ai can find all the guns and grab them… I welcome our robotic overlords
rikyrah
@Nutmeg again:
You do understand that, underneath all these gaps, is RACE, right?
Do I need to explain to you how Housing, Public Transportation, let alone healthcare, how RACE factors into it all?
White Supremacy is why we can’t have nice things.
rikyrah
@CaseyL:
Don’t you already know the answer to this?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
The performative machismo doesn’t really square with the stooped old man I saw shuffling through an airport a few months ago, hounded by mouth-breathers, and escorted by security, into a restricted area where they couldn’t heckle him anymore
ETA: I was quite surprised when I googled at the time and found out he was only 65. He looked a hard ten years older.
debbie
@Dorothy A. Winsor:
Aunt Pittipat all over again.
prostratedragon
@Villago Delenda Est: About a generation of ammo control might help.
Steeplejack (phone)
Cryptic but good to hear.
smith
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
If it weren’t for the fact that his Rambo-esque dreams could encourage some weak-minded stoopits to actually carry them out, he would be an object of pity.
westyny
Sigh, I wish there was a way to prevent Lindsay Graham. . .
MagdaInBlack
@rikyrah: It isn’t taught and we know that’s no accident. It wasn’t until I was a 36 y/o undergrad (yeah i got started late) that I was exposed to that information. These were elective classes in Urban History and Sociology, so one had to choose to learn this. It surely wasn’t taught in any history books during my childhood.
Nutmeg again
@rikyrah: So much truth–absolutely. Agreed, seconded. In our convo we also talked about racism–I was noting how there is such an obvious connection between the violent eruptions of racist hate with guns here, and the rise of the Nazi movement in Germany. (although she is not fond of me talking about historical Nazis, because Germany, I guess) . Racist hate is so powerful, now and then. and absolutely, 100% about social policy: In Germany (a lot of Europe) the infrastructure was so wrecked after WWII that they had a chance to rebuild (but who, now has the most awful places to live? Roma/Sinti–areas with no infrastructure to speak of, and of course refugees in many parts of Europe.) Here we just layer environmental assault upon highway incursion, after poor or absent housing, and biased and unstable financing for the housing that there is. And on. Yeah. Thank you for pulling our eyes and thoughts to that issue, it needs to be foregrounded. So much more to say–
Ruckus
@smith:
They want no consequences for any of their actions.
No matter who or how much they hurt.
The Pale Scot
@Another Scott:
Unfortunately, properly stored weapons can last almost indefinitely, they’re made of very strong alloys. In the travel show Himalaya with Michael Palin made right before the Soviets invaded in 1979, he walked into a gun shop at a bazaar, on the walls hung a century’s worth of weaponry from AK-47s to WW2 Soviet burp guns to Lee Enfields the British left in the 19th century. They all worked, and I doubt they spent any time in a climate controlled environment. More likely a black market in illegal guns arises
Another Scott
@Steeplejack (phone): Thanks.
He’s a smart man.
Cheers,
Scott.
CaseyL
@rikyrah:
Yes, I do already know the answer. That’s why I asked the chicken-or-egg question: Is the problem the politicians, or the voters?
Looks like the problem is indeed the voters.
We need to be rid of their voters, somehow.
RepubAnon
@Lige: Maybe Lindsey lives near Alex Jones:
RepubAnon
@Hungry Joe: More likely, he’ll first shoot some unarmed folks fleeing the disaster. If Lindsey does encounter an actual gang, and threaten them with his gun, the gang will pull their own guns and kill him.
Gangs are rarely unarmed, and being shot at is fairly routine for gang members.
The Pale Scot
Chris Rock probably has the best idea. Taxes so that every bullet cost a thousand dollars. I’d be happy if chemical markers were put in the powder so that the residues from a crime scene could be tracked
Another Scott
Relatedly, …
[ womp, womp ]
(via NotLarrySabato)
Cheers,
Scott.
West of the Cascades
@patrick II:
74,216,154, to be exact (the number of people who voted for TFG in 2020)
J R in WV
@Another Scott:
Ok, that’s really funny!!
What did they think a business was going to do when the subpoena shows up?? Cough up the data, that’s what!!!
MagdaInBlack
@Another Scott: Did they melt down after the huge data breach in January ?
Geminid
@CaseyL: I don’t think we can get rid of the Republican voters. We just have to outvote them. And continue to win majorities of new, younger voters.
Winning majorities of Independents also helps. When Arizona voter rolls closed before last November’s election, party registration stood at 35% Republican, 32% Democrat, and 31.7% non-affiliated. Turnout was high on both sides, and Biden won narrowly, while now-Senator Mark Kelly won by ~150,000 votes.
Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant)
@CaseyL:
The lack of situational awareness required to ask this question after all we’ve suffered at the hands of the GQP since 2008 is STAGGERING. JESUS.
Geminid
@Geminid: Correction: Mark Kelly won last year’s Arizona Senate race by 80,000, not 150,000. out of about 3.3 million votes cast.
Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant)
@CaseyL: In this instance, the voters and the politicians they elect are one and the same. We’ve been fighting against them and their mindset for DECADES. Welcome to the party, pal.
CaseyL
@Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant): No, I don’t think so.
Back in the 1990s, when the Democratic Party embraced corporate donations and began taking more centrist positions, I said at the time that abandoning workers, unions, and economic equity would mean there was no particular reason to support Democratic politicians.
I said at the time that given a choice between politicians who on the one hand offer them nothing meaningful and on the other hand offer them tribal vindication, voters who have very little and few prospects for anything better would embrace the tribalism (the racism, sexism, and all the other bigotries).
My question wasn’t naive. I was asking, now that Democrats are again the party of Big L Liberalism, will a new focus on economic equity break the spell of tribalism? If people who have embraced racism have a chance to make their lives better in meaningful ways, will they go for the latter, or stick with the comfort of grievance and hatred?
It’s a vital question to ask, because it’s the difference between being able to return to some kind of normal country and permanently playing defense against neo-Confederates.
Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant)
@CaseyL: You’re welcome to afford a level of flexibility to a group of people who just tried to burn the federal government to the ground because the electorate said no to Neo-Confederatism. Perhaps you can afford to be wrong. I cannot.
Gvg
Actually I have seen stories that say that statistically 2020 had a pretty typical number of shootings, including some mass shootings, they just didn’t make the news much compared to the pandemic. Surprised me.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@CaseyL: The unions to a large extent abandoned the Democrats, not the other way around.
Baud
@CaseyL:
We need to think of terms of permanently playing offense against the neo-Confederates.
Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant)
@?BillinGlendaleCA: Exactly.
Bonus question: Why did the unions desert the Dems?
Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant)
@Baud:
Much like the Germans have to against Nazism. Be great if more people would face that fact.
CaseyL
@Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant):
Not all 72 million of them showed up. The ones who did, I want in prison for very long sentences. The politicians who encouraged them should also be in prison for a long time. Make no mistake, I Ioathe each and every one of them and wish they were all dead. There’s a whole lot of people whose graves I will happily dance on.
I was just hoping we could reclaim some of the 72 million.
The Moar You Know
In response to Graham’s (and millions of others) gun porn fantasy, all I’ll say is this: walls are not bulletproof, not even a little.
@Another Scott: Actually, we didn’t. They’re 100% legal. Given two conditions, and it’s an approach we might want to think about taking.
Condition 1: possession of an unregistered machine gun is “go to prison for life” territory. It’s what got the Feds after Koresh. And Randy Weaver.
Condition 2: Registration is easy! One-time $200 fee. But here’s where the shit hits the fan; you pay that fee and register your machine gun, and then any US law enforcement agency has the right to come in your house (or wherever it’s registered at, and this is why most of them end up stored at gun ranges or museums) any time they like with no warrant or probable cause. They can do it at 4am on Christmas Eve just because they fucking feel like it. And you have to present it for inspection any time they show up so they can confirm it’s there, and God help you if it’s not.
Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant)
@CaseyL:
We are in agreement on this.
As far as reclamation goes, hope is a valiant thing, and it perhaps doesn’t speak well of me that I don’t have much left in that regard. But they’re going to have to show me.
Geminid
@CaseyL: The next election cycle will tell a some about what the 70 million or so trump voters are up to. Although exit polling has declined in accuracy, so we won’t find out but so much.
In Virginia, the hard right turn the Republicans have made in the last twenty years has turned a lot of moderates, even conservative leaners, into Democratic voters. But a political scientist I follow says that this realignment has passed, and at this point Republican voters are thoroughly polarized. A few will come to their senses on their own, but I think most, especially those over 45, are stuck
But trump, and the Democratic response to him, may have triggered a substantial realignment recently. A November 2019 Wason Center poll of registered Virginia voters showed party self-identification at 31% Repuican, 30% independent, and 34% Democratic. A February 2021 Wason Center poll showed self-identification at 25% Republican, 33% independent, and 37% Democratic. (unlike states such as Arizona, Virginia has no registration by party).
CaseyL
@Geminid: “Independents” are Republicans who are embarrassed to admit it. I have no faith in them at all.
SFAW
@CaseyL:
Asked and answered: they’ve proved they will “stick with the comfort of grievance and hatred.”
SFAW
@CaseyL:
Polling over the last few years shows self-identified Independents as being more in line with Dem/left policy positions. [Especially when TFG is in the mix.] Not always, but fairly often.
Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant)
@CaseyL: This has been my experience by and large. Give them someone at the top of the GOP who isn’t an obvious fascist, they’ll head home.
Geminid
@CaseyL: I think that is a limited view of who independents are. Political scientists put effort into studying this group of voters, and find that 35%-40% vote fairly consistently for Republican candidates, 35-40% vote consistently Democratic, but around 20% are truly swing voters.
I’ve noticed that a lot of partisan Democrats hold Independents in contempt, and do not like the idea of winning elections with the votes of such people. But given that last November’s Arizona election had a very high turnout on both sides, and party registration was 35% Republican, 32% Democratic, and 31.7% non-affiliated, could Joe Biden and Mark Kelly have carried the state without winning a majority of independents? I doubt it.
I believe Colorado has an even larger share of non-affiliated voters. While I wouldn’t say Democrats should neccesarily go out of their way to win these votes, in Colorado at least, Democrats ignore independents at their peril.
In Virginia, on the other hand, Republicans absolutely cannot win a statewide election without carrying independents by a good majority, but the Republicans have moved so far right they have alienated even conservative leaning independents. While dominant at the beginning of this century, Republicans have not won a statewide race since 2009.
SFAW
@Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant):
I would respectfully suggest the above modification. Because Tom Cotton is — to us — an obvious fascist, but the RWMFs can pretend he isn’t, because he’s not quoting Hitler or Goebbels. At least, not in public. That we know of
ETA: I used Cotton, but there is any number of them with presidential aspirations. Cruz, Little Lord Randy, DeathSantis, and so forth.
smith
I agree that placing our hopes on large scale conversion of current Republican voters is a mug’s game. However, what can happen, and is happening, is the hidebound fascists aging out. In 2020, Biden lost the 45 to 64 year old age group by only 1%, doing much better than either Clinton or Obama with this age group. He won younger age groups by a lot. Only among the 65+ did Trump clearly win. There will continue to be a bump at the older end as the baby boomers pass from the scene, but there is no reason to believe that younger voters will start to move towards Republicanism, especially given the Rs depending solely on the culture wars to define themselves.
Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant)
@SFAW: I did a poor job of stating the point in that I presumed the position from the GOP’s point of view – by not obvious, I intended exactly what you said.
SFAW
@Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant):
I should have picked up on it. I blame … something.
Outside of that, and outside of your obvious concerns (i.e., those mentioned or hinted at above), how are you doing? Healthy? [I don’t come here as often as I used to, so just trying to “catch up” a bit.]
quakerinabasement
Rambo fantasies?
I think you mean Grahambo fantasies!
SFAW
@quakerinabasement:
Stealing “Grahambo.”
Jinchi
Lindsay Graham just really wants an excuse to kill people. He was very upset that the Capitol police didn’t use deadly force during the January 6th insurrection (which would have ended in a massacre on both sides.)
And now he dreams of shooting looters during a natural disaster.
Is there really nothing better for a sitting Senator to do during a natural disaster than fending off rioting gangs? I imagine he seriously regrets not living in New Orleans during Hurricane Katrina.
Geminid
@smith: Another demographic trend that appears to favor Democrats is the rise of the college educated as a proportion of the electorate. Fifty years ago, a majority of this group voted Republican, but in recent decades the college educated have increasingly voted Democratic. This may be in part because of, as you suggest, the reliance on social issues by Republicans.
In 2018, Democratic Congressional candidates flipped suburban House districts in Virginia, Georgia, Texas, New Jersey and other states. It is thought that college educated voters, particularly college educated women, were one of the keys to these victories.
Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant)
@SFAW: All is well. Dodging the (not so) odd tornado here and there, but aside from that, no complaints. Family is as of Friday vaccinated, job is going well and not itching to have us back onsite regularly yet. Still maintaining protocols as Governor Meemaw (Ivey) gets ready to open up the state in a few days.
SFAW
@Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant):
Sounds good, glad to hear/read it.
PaulWartenberg
We just got an ACTIVE SHOOTER in the freaking Everglades tonight, people! /fume
https://twitter.com/EvergladesNPS/status/1376327085174702081
mrmoshpotato
Oops! Cry harder Brexit trash.
mrmoshpotato
@PaulWartenberg:
Oops!
All Berries!Eaten by gators!Gin & Tonic
Don’t know how to link from this phone, but now both the head and deputy head of emergency at the hospital in Omsk that saved Alexei Navalny’s life have died. Hell of a coincidence, if you ask me.
Yutsano
@Gin & Tonic: My heart stopped for a second…until I read that the doctors had died. Although I am worried about Navalny. I’m hoping he doesn’t come out so weak or incapacitated he can’t continue his fight.
EDIT: not to make light of the deaths there, which are indeed suspicious as all get out.
Patricia Kayden
Ditto
Patricia Kayden
@mrmoshpotato: Hilarious!! Thanks for the belly laugh. I suppose these idiots thought only people of color and Eastern Europeans were going to be harmed by BREXIT. Oh well. ??♀️
Enhanced Voting Techniques
What the hell is Graham going on about? As Cruz showed, the first reaction in a disaster for a republican senator to leave the country for some resort. The only his precious AR-15 collection is going to do is arm the looters.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@mrmoshpotato: From the article the quote came from
tokyokie
Graham’s histrionics today bring to my mind an exchange between Henry Fonda and Gabriele Ferzetti in Once Upon a Time in the West, which ends with Fonda saying: “Poor cripple talkin’ big so nobody’ll know how scared ya are.”
Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony
@CaseyL: You need to change their voters minds, not ‘be rid’ of them.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Patricia Kayden: during the 1/6 riots, he was hiding under a desk, desperately trying to contact Ivanka trump. I don’t who that makes me sadder for, him or this country.
No, I do know.
Cereal
Yeah, I suppose when the US becomes a violent, cannibalistic hellscape out of a Cormac McCarthy novel, you’ll want your guns. Thing is, people like McConnel are doing their best to make that kind of ultra-pessimistic “state of nature” world a reality, which is the problem.
Jado
@karen marie:
Polk County, AR 1896
Wilmington, NC 1898
Springfield, IL 1908
Slocum, TX 1910
Washington, DC 1919
Chicago, IL 1919
Elaine, AR 1919
Ocoee, FL 1920
Tulsa, OK 1921
Rosewood, FL 1923
Catcher, AR 1923
Greensboro, NC 1979
Oak Creek, WI 2012
There have been plenty of times that a mob has come for law-abiding people, and Lindsey would be wise to be wary…if he were a different color. Or maybe if he were a labor organizer and the local sheriff was on the corporate payroll. But the last time anyone came for politicians, he was in the Capitol building, far from his home in the Carolinas. Far from his guns. Should he have firearms in his office in the Senate wing? I would say so given what occurred in January. Maybe a trained paid security force could keep him safe, so he doesn’t have to constantly train in order to shoot straight.
But honestly, NO ONE is coming to get Lindsey. NO ONE wants to be that close to him.