Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

The republican caucus is already covering themselves with something, and it’s not glory.

You can’t attract Republican voters. You can only out organize them.

Whoever he was, that guy was nuts.

Within six months Twitter will be fully self-driving.

Why is it so hard for them to condemn hate?

I’d hate to be the candidate who lost to this guy.

Let there be snark.

JFC, are there no editors left at that goddamn rag?

Republicans in disarray!

Something needs to be done about our bogus SCOTUS.

The next time the wall street journal editorial board speaks the truth will be the first.

Republicans do not pay their debts.

A sufficient plurality of insane, greedy people can tank any democratic system ever devised, apparently.

No offense, but this thread hasn’t been about you for quite a while.

Our job is not to persuade republicans but to defeat them.

Damn right I heard that as a threat.

They traffic in fear. it is their only currency. if we are fearful, they are winning.

Roe isn’t about choice, it’s about freedom.

Republicans: slavery is when you own me. freedom is when I own you.

“I never thought they’d lock HIM up,” sobbed a distraught member of the Lock Her Up Party.

Following reporting rules is only for the little people, apparently.

Republicans are radicals, not conservatives.

🎶 Those boots were made for mockin’ 🎵

Joe Lieberman disappointingly reemerged to remind us that he’s still alive.

You are here: Home / Open Threads / Tuesday Morning Open Thread: You Go, Joe!

Tuesday Morning Open Thread: You Go, Joe!

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Tuesday Morning Open Thread: You Go, Joe!

(John Deering via GoComics.com)

Nice to have S&P among his cheerleaders…


Reader Interactions

181Comments

  3. 3.

    Nicole

    So true about the press masquerading right wing talking points as “tough questions.”  Probably because, as the Biden Administration is revealing itself to be overwhelmingly competent, that’s all they have.

  4. 4.

    Betty Cracker

    “If you have the best ideas, you have nothing to hide. Let the people vote.”

    Amen to that, and I hope Dems at all levels continue to pound that message. Sometimes you gotta connect the dots for people.

  6. 6.

    debbie

    Last night, Jimmy Kimmel highlighted TFG’s “press release” slamming Fauci and Birx. The main takeaways is that long-form Twitter would be a disaster.

  7. 7.

    OzarkHillbilly

    Some guy’s toast to the newlyweds:

    “Y’know, I just got, I turned off the news, I get all these flash reports, and they’re telling me about the border, they’re telling me about China, they’re telling me about Iran – how’re we doing with Iran, how do you like that? Boy, they were ready to make a deal, they would have done anything, they would have done anything, and this guy goes and drops the sanctions and then he says, ‘We’d love to negotiate now,’ [and Iran replies], ‘We’re not dealing with the United States at all,’ Oh, well, they don’t want to deal with us. And China, the same thing, they never treated us that way, right?
    …………………….
    “You saw what happened a few days ago, was terrible, and uh, the border is not good, the border is the worst anybody’s ever seen it, and what you see now, multiply it times 10, Jim – he’s the only one I know who would handle the border tougher than me. What’s happening to the kids, they’re living in squalor, they are living like nobody has ever seen anybody, there’s never been anything like what’s, and you’re gonna have hundreds, and you have it now, they have the airplane photos, the shots, and they call ’em shots, and these things are showing thousands and thousands of people coming up from South America and it’s gonna be, it’s just uh, look, it’s a disaster. It’s a humanitarian disaster from their standpoint, and it’s gonna destroy the country, and frankly, the country can’t afford it because you’re talking about massive, just incredibly massive amounts. Our school systems, our hospital systems, everything.

    “So it’s a rough thing, and I just say, ‘Do you miss me yet?’”
    …………………………
    “We did get 75m votes, Nobody’s ever gotten that, They said, ‘Get 66m votes, sir and the election’s over.’ We got 75m and they said … but you know, you saw what happened, 10.30 in the evening, all of a sudden I said, ‘That’s a strange thing, why are they closing up certain places, right?’ Now, a lot of things happening right now. I just wanted to say, it’s an honor to be here, it’s an honor to have you at Mar-a-Lago, you are a great and beautiful couple … have fun.”

    No complaints, you dumbfucks invited the asshole.

  8. 8.

    debbie

    @Nicole:

    Which is why the response should begin with, “Steve Doocey will appreciate your asking his question for him,” or something similar. Shame them into not doing it anymore.

  9. 9.

    debbie

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    you saw what happened, 10.30 in the evening,

    Yes, jackass. I saw that California voting polls would still be open for another 30 minutes.”
    Why has no one called him on that obvious piece of bullshit???

  10. 10.

    John S.

    @Baud: Which is why all Republicans have right now are Dr. Seuss, theater at the Mexican border, voter suppression, gerrymandering, guns, bigotry and conspiracy theories.

    All fueled by Faux News, which clowns like Jake Tapper should never again consider a “sister” news organization (but probably still will anyway):

    “Welcome to the family, Lara.”

    That’s how a Fox News host greeted Lara Trump upon the announcement Monday that she would be joining the network as a paid contributor.

    “I sort of feel like I’ve been an unofficial member of the team for so long, you guys know, it was kind of a joke, over the past five years I would come there so often that the security guards were like, ‘Maybe we should just give you a key’. So to be part of the team I’m so, so excited.”

  12. 12.

    geg6

    @Betsy:

    As someone in a place where it’s going to be decades before cars are non-existent, where there is not a single charging station and where people in my suburb (outside a city with more bridges than Venice) have to cross cross a bridge to get anywhere, I say fuck you.  We have more bridges that are substandard than any other state in the US.  Oh, and no public transportation to get from my home to work.  No money for cars to travel pretty much leaves us fucked.

  13. 13.

    NotMax

    @Betsy

    Bridge, tunnel and overpass/underpass repair and maintenance. Regrading/repaving dangerous sections of roadways. Erosion control on adjacent landscapes/geography. Roadway flooding mitigation/diversion. Accelerating installation of roadside solar-powered emergency services phones.

    All in need of attention.

  14. 14.

    Amir Khalid

    Biden wants to help Americans. He’s good at it, he’s effective, he has the people’s support, and the Republican party sees all this as an existential threat.

  15. 15.

    SFAW

    @Baud:

    When

    1. Dems are in control and
    2. Dems are united

    Good things happen.

    How do you figure? Those people are getting vaccinated, instead of making them all wait until ALL real ‘Muricans get vaccinated. And what’s this BS with trying to let any of those people vote? My vote is cheapened when one of them is allowed to vote. Pretty soon those damn elitists will start thinking they’re better than us REEL ‘Muricans.

    As an aside: Scott Lemieux at LGM had a post on the song stylings (or as Lemieux put it, “authoritarian stylings”) of one Glenn Ellmers of The Claremont Institute. [Not linking directly to the article, because fuck that guy.] His thesis appears to be not very different from my scrawlings above. I guess that is what passes for “conservative intellectual” writing these days.

    ETA: Twenty-thrid!!!

  16. 16.

    debbie

    @geg6:

    Seconded. It’s not realistic to leave highways out when they’re fucking crumbling while commuters are driving on them.

  21. 21.

    Immanentize

    @Betsy: That is a rather silly take.  Bridges need repair.  Roads need repair.  To get to see my mother, I have to drive, or take three planes then rent a car.  Driving direct is way more environmentally sound even if I had a 1967 gas guzzler.  People, especially lower middle class folks, have been pushed by gentrification to the suburbs — they need cars to get to work.

    Infrastructure for cars can include ubiquitous fast charging stations. Etc.

  22. 22.

    germy

    Democrats have often not prioritized the judiciary, but Biden is signaling a shift by acting faster than his predecessors: By this point, Obama had made only one nomination. Trump had picked two; Clinton and Reagan none. Biden has now announced 11. https://t.co/Z5jkuhWu8j pic.twitter.com/LShOVvxDrj

    — Matt Viser (@mviser) March 30, 2021

    Biden’s first slate — 11 nominations — include three Black women for appeals court vacancies and the first Muslim American to serve on a District Court, in part meant to signal an early departure from Trump nominees who were overwhelmingly White and male. https://t.co/Z5jkuhWu8j

    — Matt Viser (@mviser) March 30, 2021

  24. 24.

    SFAW

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    Some guy’s toast to the newlyweds:

    Two comments:

    1. Not “some guy”; I believe the Biden-approved designation is  That Fucking Guy  The Former Guy
    2. I’m a little disappointed that you go from letting us know about Lyriel’s birth, to that mofos disgusting word salad, all within 24 hours. [Love her name, by the way, forgot to mention that yesterday, Grampy.]
  25. 25.

    billcoop4

    She did say, “No New Highways”. I don’t read that as saying “no money for highways” — especially for needed repairs, maintenance, and such — bridge repairs being vital.

     

    BC

  26. 26.

    NotMax

    Wouldn’t rate a recently watched movie as top tier but it’s worth a gamble on Prime: 50/50.

    On the plus side Joseph Gordon-Levitt, as usual, brings depth and nuance to the table. On the minus side Seth Rogen, as usual, is barely tolerable.

  28. 28.

    OzarkHillbilly

    Over the past 6 months my new granddaughter’s name changed at least 3 times, hence I I stopped trying to remember what it was until she was actually born. Her full name is Lyriel Persephone.

    Doesn’t exactly roll off the tongue but seeing as Persephone is the goddess of spring, and Lyriel is a “Variant of Lyrical, meaning song.”, I think a lyrical spring is just about perfect.

     

    eta, which of course I am listening to Vivaldi’s right now.

  29. 29.

    SFAW

    @Baud:  @MagdaInBlack:

    Somewhere in the space-time continuum, Grunthos the Flatulent — after reading Ellmers — is thinking, “There’s no effing justice in this universe.”

  42. 42.

    Baud

    The Republican Party Is Driving the Nation’s Democratic Decline

    This is what it looks like when a political party turns against democracy itself.

    By Jamelle Bouie

    NYT

  43. 43.

    SFAW

    @Baud:

    Today show says ships with animals get priority through the Suez.

    Even ahead of the ones the child-traffickers are sending? Oh, wait, that was the one that caused the problem in the first place.

    Never mind.

    [On a more serious note: Let’s hope no animals are suffering.]

  49. 49.

    debbie

    @rikyrah:

    Absolutely. In fact, his inaction was specifically due to his belief that only people in blue states were suffering and dying.

  52. 52.

    Chief Oshkosh

    @Betsy: If you’ve read several other posts in response to yours, you see that this hits a nerve. People are fairly dependent on cars and the infrastructure to support them is crumbling. However, I took it that your statement is not about rebuilding existing infrastructure; you’re saying that we shouldn’t spend on NEW highways.

    I don’t know that I agree or not, but it seems like something worth discussing.

  56. 56.

    SFAW

    @debbie:

    Absolutely. In fact, his inaction was specifically due to his belief that only people in blue states were suffering and dying.

    And of course, he did his best to harm — as in, taking action to harm — blue state attempts to minimize the spread/deaths. Which was why I referred to him as the Murderer-in-Chief fairly often.

  57. 57.

    Elizabelle

    @rikyrah:   Absolutely.

    Trump, Kushner, Scott Atlas.  All of the malefactors.  Should all be up on negligent homicide charges.

    400,000.  Those were real people.  With loved ones. Who did not deserve to die because of malicious indifference.

  58. 58.

    germy

    Appalling footage of the carjacking near Nationals Park in Washington D.C. on Tuesday that resulted in the death of Pakistani immigrant & Uber Eats driver Mohammad Anwar. The teenage girls who police say used a Taser to steal the car face murder charges. pic.twitter.com/mOPnrLBf0t
    — Jerry Dunleavy (@JerryDunleavy) March 27, 2021

    warning: graphic footage

    More information about the victim:

    https://meaww.com/mohammad-anwar-uber-eats-driver-murdered-by-teen-girls-13-and-15-carjacking-stun-guns-accident-in-dc

  59. 59.

    Betty Cracker

    @rikyrah: We really need an official accounting for it. I’m not sure what organization/group would be best suited to lead it, but for the sake of future public health, we need a report that outlines the missteps and recommends ways to prevent such a catastrophe from happening again.

  63. 63.

    SFAW

    @Elizabelle:

    Who did not deserve to die because of malicious indifference.

    It went beyond “malicious indifference.” I’m so old, I can remember when he had the Fed route ventilators, etc., away from the hardest hit Blue states. I remember Bob Kraft sending a private jet to pick up PPE supplies, because the Fed was actively preventing MA from getting stuff. The Murderer-in-Chief (or Princeling Jared) pulled that shit on other Blue States. In a just USA, he’d be tried for murder.

  64. 64.

    Dorothy A. Winsor

    A young author (just turned 18) who’s self publishing her book asked me to participate in her launch day online live event. I’m happy to do that but it turns out it’s on Instagram Live, which I’ve never used. I asked her if we could practice today because I am old. The only device that will work with that is my phone.

  65. 65.

    trnc

    @OzarkHillbilly: No complaints, you dumbfucks invited the asshole.

    I have no doubt they got exactly the wedding speech they hoped for. No one asks DT to speak and actually expects him to be on topic.

  67. 67.

    Elizabelle

    @SFAW:   There will be a trail.  Even if documents have been disappeared.

    I am pretty sure it’s being investigated.  Accountability.  Is required.

  68. 68.

    NotMax

    Repeating from late yesterday, because (1) I find it slightly amusing in a schadenfreude sense and (2) the real estate agent knows which side his/her croissant is buttered on. Happened upon it while idly surfing hither and yon (mostly yon).

    Noticed the listing for the house the Kushner couple were renting in D.C. avoids mention by name of them at all as a selling point, only the vaguely worded “recent tenants.” It does, however, include a direct mention that Obama lives nearby (around the corner, actually).

  69. 69.

    SFAW

    @Betty Cracker:

    recommends ways to prevent such a catastrophe from happening again.

    Put That Fucking Guy, his entire maladministration, and the entire elected Rethug party on trial for Crimes Against Humanity.

    It ain’t much, but it would be a good start.

  70. 70.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @SFAW: The first 3 letters of my last name are pan. In grade school my class had a thing we did called “pile up”. We’d grab a kid and everybody would jump on him in one big pile on. Everybody got a turn at the bottom. Some kids actually objected, not that it did them any good tho it did get them banned by the school. We did them anyway. One day, I had my turn at the bottom.

    The sound of my collar bone breaking was like a shotgun in my ear.

    After that my name was “Pancake.”

  71. 71.

    SFAW

    @Elizabelle:

    I am pretty sure it’s being investigated.

    I hope you are right. On the plus side, with a patriot, instead of the Traitor Shill Barr, in charge at the DoJ, there’s at least a possibility.

  73. 73.

    raven

    I posted this earlier on the dead late night thread so I thought I’d do it again.

    I picked up a copy of “You Don’t Belong Here: How Three Women Rewrote the Story of War,” which celebrates the work of FitzGerald, Kate Webb and Catherine Leroy. It’ very interesting but I almost threw it across the room reading, in the preface, how LBJ had “won” the Silver Star in ww2. That fucking asshole was on a plane that went NEAR some action and turned away. He was in no danger and did nothing. No other person on the plane got any decoration. Fuck LBJ

  74. 74.

    Dorothy A. Winsor

    Re vaccine distribution, a friend who lives in PA tells me they’re still on age 70+ for eligibility. How can that be?

    Also I read that employers can’t require the vaccine now because they’re all authorized for emergency use. My google foo is failing me when I try to find out how long it will take for regular authorization to kick in. Does anyone know? I gather even enlisted personnel are refusing the shot, which shocked a veteran friend of mine. In her experience, when they say “take this shot,” you stick out your arm.

  76. 76.

    Geminid

    Infrastructure investment has wider social benefits than smoother roads, well maintained bridges, and more commuter rail track. For instance, if bringing several hundred thousand unnessarily imprisoned people into the workforce is to work, there have to be jobs for them. Some of these people will become coders, some will become lawyers and accountants. But many will become equipment operators, form carpenters, flaggers, sandblasters and bridge painters, if  good paying jobs are there.

    More generally, infrastructure investment can help relieve income inequality. I am all for taxing the rich more. But I think a surer way to tackle income inequality is to encourage a thriving working class. I think the Democrat’s infrastructure initiatives will ensure that good wages are paid. That would help everybody, including small business owners, service workers whose employers must compete with higher wage infrastructure employers, and teachers and other public employees, whose salaries will be funded by a broader tax base.

    So as long as these infrastructure investments are wisely targeted, I say, bring it on!

  77. 77.

    NotMax

    @SFAW

    Start with Crimes Against the Universe and let them plea bargain down to Crimes Against Humanity.

    //

  78. 78.

    Chief Oshkosh

    @rikyrah: But none of these studies, as far as I’ve seen, take into account fairly likely scenarios of how things would have been if the malacious shitbird had continued the trajectory of our national and international pandemic response initiatives. That is, if he had been a more normal human who strove to do even better than the last guy. Most of the estimates just game out mere indifference, letting the existing structure just chug along.

    My estimation approach is based on President Obama’s responses to H1N1 and Ebola, which themselves were based on approaches developed by his Republican and Democratic predecessors. Using this as a very rough guide, the malicious, murdering shitbird is responsible for at least 90% of all current and future Covid-19 deaths in the US and well more than 50% worldwide.

  79. 79.

    gkoutnik

    @Chief Oshkosh:  I’ve been involved with some anti-gas pipeline activism, and the issues are similar:  we need gas today and tomorrow, and also cars.  We also need to reduce both drastically in the longer run.  Every piece of new-built infrastructure (new pipeline, new highway) makes it way more difficult to reduce our dependence on hydrocarbons and private cars.  We can’t say “I need that highway/pipeline to live my life tomorrow” without saying, “…and I understand that we all need to find ways to wean ourselves from these wasteful technologies, as soon as reasonably possible.”

  82. 82.

    SFAW

    @NotMax:

    Start with Crimes Against the Universe and let them plea bargain down to Crimes Against Humanity.

    I like the way you think.

  85. 85.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @trnc: The way the article first read to me is he hijacked the mic. On 2nd reading it’s a little more ambiguous. I am choosing to believe he snatched the mic out of the Best Man’s hand and everybody was afraid to object because it fits perfectly with my expectations of the asshole.

  87. 87.

    WereBear

    @NotMax: I’m on board!

    Sadly, I’m sure this will fall into the history bin, like the way deliberate corporate malfeasance with lots of death results in a tax-deductible expense…

  89. 89.

    Cermet

    @rikyrah: A Judge that practices Islam? Oh no, Shaira law …hold on – that would be protestant and catholic judges that do that. Never mind.

  92. 92.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: Also I read that employers can’t require the vaccine now because they’re all authorized for emergency use.

    Most states are work-at-will, so I am skeptical.

  94. 94.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    @debbie: Why has no one called him on that obvious piece of bullshit???

    It’s Trump, so what is the point? He will just spew up more bullshit. The bigger question is everyone knows Trump is a lying sack of shit so why does anyone listen to him?

  95. 95.

    MJS

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: I live in PA, and in my opinion, the rollout of the vaccine has been atrocious. I think Governor Wolf has done a relatively good job on Covid, but getting people vaccinated has been an abject failure.

  96. 96.

    Soprano2

    @Betsy: Do you think cars are just going to go away? You should live in my city (medium-sized city in the MO Ozarks). All we have for public transport is a shitty bus system that takes forever to get you anywhere. Roads need major improvements. What do you think all those electric cars are going to drive on, anyway? What exactly are you saying here?

  97. 97.

    mrmoshpotato

    “The problem isn’t being tough on Biden, the problem is mistaking coming at Biden with right-wing talking points, often which are based on lies or misinformation, as if that was being tough on Biden being an assclown who’s full of shit.”

    Less wordy, more honest.

  98. 98.

    cmorenc

    @Betsy:

    Got to make sure the infrastructure is not for cars.  No new highways.

    For mass transit’s future, one of the perverse effects of COVID forcing social distancing and vastly increase in % of people working remotely is how that’s inducing and forcing the dispersion of the population instead of concentration along feasible mass-transit routes.  OTOH, this phenomena also means fewer workers taking to the highway to commute to work.

  99. 99.

    Soprano2

    @debbie: Absolutely. In fact, his inaction was specifically due to his belief that only people in blue states were suffering and dying.

    I will always believe Republicans quit caring about Covid the minute they realized that it was mostly black and brown people in liberal states who were dying, at least initially. The minute the stock market started going up and was stabilized, they figured the only thing they actually cared about was fixed so go ahead and open everything up, herd immunity for all! Assholes.

  100. 100.

    Immanentize

    @OzarkHillbilly:
    @NotMax:
    I don’t know where her first name (Holdi) came from, but the two middle names are lesser goddesses. The second (Hosti) being associated with corn. They were farmers all. Literate farmers.

  101. 101.

    Soprano2

    @Baud: The cost to fix America’s crumbling infrastructure? Nearly $2.6 trillion, engineers say

    I totally believe this. Since I’ve been with sewer we’ve spent almost $67 million, and we could easily spend $200 million more just on the sewer, never mind the $75 million of unmet stormwater drainage needs. That’s in one Midwestern city that serves about 300,000 people.

  102. 102.

    Geminid

    @gkoutnik: Some new natural gas pipelines are needed, others are not. Examples of the latter are two 42″ pipelines running from West Virginia to the North Carolina coastal plain. They cross existing 20″ pipelines that adequately service the existing population already. These large capacity pipelines run from the gas fields more or less straight towards the Atlantic before they each do a southward head fake. They were planned with export in mind, although the companies do not admit this.

    Both 42″ pipelines were begun, but have been held up by court challenges. Investors gave up on one, the “Atlantic Coast” pipeline, last summer, citing economic factors. One factor might have been the end of Republican dominance of North Carolina state government. Whereas permitting a liquified natural gas terminal at, say, Morehead City would have been a slam dunk under a Republican government, pipeline investors can no longer count on friendly state regulators.

    The other “Mountain Valley” pipeline is still in the works. Hopefully state and federal regulators can kill it.

  104. 104.

    germy

    This was a great print advertisement from British Rail, back in the 1970:

    it’s time for ads like this to make a comeback pic.twitter.com/AjG63gf2Xp

    — Liam O’Connell (@liameoconnell) March 28, 202

    It’s sad that planners in the U.S. saw that and thought “Looks great to me!”

  105. 105.

    Cheryl from Maryland

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: THIS.  Even if the bulk of the work is repairing roads, bridges, etc., the repair work needs to fold in the beginnings of the infrastructure of the future, like electric lines for car charging stations at rest stops and such.  My townhouse community is starting plans to repave the parking area.  As the homes have no garages, another owner and I pleaded for consideration of infrastructure for charging stations as 1) there’s free money from government and electric companies to pay for it; 2) no one should want to dig up pavement in a few years to do this work.  We were laughed at until we pointed out chargers will affect resale home resale value.

  106. 106.

    Soprano2

    @rikyrah: I think once the vaccines become officially FDA approved, rather than being emergency use, employers will be able to require them if they want to, and definitely I’m sure the armed forces will require them.

  107. 107.

    Ken

    @OzarkHillbilly: TFG did once — at least once — crash a charity event and take a seat on the stage, in a section reserved for people who had actually given money. I wonder if the timeline would have differed had the organizers had him dragged out of there, but they were too polite.

  108. 108.

    WereBear

    Share my joy! 10 AM tomorrow, pharmacy downtown, SHOT #1 with the second one scheduled.

    Thank you, President Biden! Guarded appreciation for Governor Cuomo, who is an abusive ratcake, but does know how to manage a pandemic.

  111. 111.

    Ken

    @Soprano2: Wait, you’re telling me the 19th-century iron sewer pipes and brick tunnels need some repairs?

    (I assume it’s brick tunnels, since pretty much every TV show with a sewer scene has them.  I guess the electric lighting in the tunnels was put in during the 20th century?)

  113. 113.

    Mousebumples

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: the EUA was approved without the typical long-term safety follow up that’s typically required.

    From what I’ve heard, the mrna companies (and probably J&J too) are planning on applying for a full approval when enough time has passed.

  114. 114.

    Ken

    @Mousebumples: Sounds a bit like the software companies that don’t bother with beta testing — just ship it and let the customers find the bugs.  Special circumstances with the vaccines, of course, which is why there’s a process for emergency use authorization.

  115. 115.

    Mousebumples

    @Ken: yeah, and if you have a new flu shot or whatever, there’s not the same emergent need. Initial safety studies during the trials were evaluated with the EUA, but similar to fast track approvals for new cancer treatments, the policy allows for earlier reviews for more wide spread use, versus more certainty on long term safety given the short term mortality risks without the treatment/vaccine.

  116. 116.

    Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes

    The economy does better under Democrats. For some reason, Volcker’s experiment in credit throttling in the last half of Carter’s term became dogmatic “Democrats suck on economies” once they let up on the brakes in Reagan’s first term.

    The only thing I fault Carter for is not figuring out how to fire Volcker early on.

  119. 119.

    Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes

    @Ken:

    I’m told that Louisville’s sewer system has some stunning brick architecture, from the former MSD head, no less. Says that it is amazing, and sad that people can’t tour it.

  121. 121.

    MomSense

    @SFAW:

    Maybe the lawyers can weigh in about who has standing to sue those motherfucking murderers.  I’d also like to know if it is possible to sue the media outlets who spread misinformation.  Can the families of people who died sue?

  125. 125.

    Fair Economist

    @geg6: It’s needed and reasonable to repair the road infrastructure we already have. But we need not to add *more* roads because they will just add to the infrastructure deficit in the distressingly near future. We have plenty of auto-related infrastructure; we are far past the point where the marginal cost exceeds marginal benefit.

  127. 127.

    catclub

    @SFAW: ​
    I only see the downside of opening up vaccines to everybody, which is that all the preferred groups did not bother to fully come forward and get vaccinated in sufficient numbers. Therefore, plenty of doses available. The order of states that have opened up to everybody suggests this.

  128. 128.

    Barbara

    @geg6: The pattern in U.S. transportation policy has been for the feds to construct new highways and then leave the maintenance to the state.  I am sure there are some federal dollars on the table for maintenance, but too often Congress is like the guy who wants a new car every three years, focusing unduly on bright shiny new things and disregarding maintenance.

    Not sure what Betsy was trying to say, but I think focusing on repairs and maintenance and fine tuning for highway infrastructure rather than new construction would be a welcome development.

    It is kind of amazing how many bridges there are in Pittsburgh.  Some places are literally transportation islands and are completely cut off if the bridge needs substantial repairs.  When I was in high school they needed to make major repairs to the Bloomfield Bridge and I remember the near hysteria about what would happen to people who lived in Bloomfield without access to the bridge.

  129. 129.

    Geminid

    @Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes: I sometimes wonder how much of the economic expansion under Reagan was helped by Carter’s deregulation of industries like transport.

    Economists can show the efficacy of such deregulation. But because of Reagan’s and other Republicans’ hostility towards labor, deregulation hurt many workers. Before deregulation, my late friend Chris was making a good living as a skilled furniture mover, not an easy thing for a Black man in 1970s Virginia. But then the industry made a race to the bottom in pay, and he could never make a very good income after. While Chris was an ardent Democrat, he never liked Carter because of this.

  130. 130.

    Edmund Dantes

    @catclub: you would think some of these people were Federalsit Judges readings the second amendment the way they tore apart the first part of what she said, while completely ignoring the whole other part.

    It’s not like she wrote a 15 page diatribe either. Literally two phrases together.

  131. 131.

    Barbara

    @SFAW: ​Has anybody said this? I mean, seriously, the stratification has been almost solely by age and health condition. Considering how many people are resorting to subterfuge to skirt the line (I am nearly certain that a friend lied about her teenage son having a health condition in order to get him vaccinated) I think opening up vaccines to everyone is much fairer at this point, especially if they are not going to verify the factors that make one eligible, as they did not in the case of my friend’s son.

  132. 132.

    Kathleen

    @Elizabelle:  In addition we can add the physical and emotional trauma suffered by over stressed hospital personnel who also had to worry about PPE and family members plus CoVid patients who “recovered” but still deal with effects from the disease.

  133. 133.

    NotMax

    @Fair Economist

    With the glaring exception that there are constantly new developments, even entire new towns, coming into being. People need adequate ways of trafficking to and from them. Two-lane blacktop serves when the land it traverses is primarily agricultural or empty. Once population of sufficient density settles the existing roads are insufficient and obsolete.

  134. 134.

    Ken

    @Kathleen: I wonder if TFG has any long-haul COVID mental effects?  See the “wedding toast” above.  I suppose we’ll never find out because (1) he and his doctors would never admit it and (2) how could you tell anyway?

  137. 137.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Edmund Dantes: Betsy said, “Got to make sure the infrastructure is not for cars.  No new highways.”  It is not unreasonable for someone to interpret that as not wanting infrastructure money to be spent on cars.

  138. 138.

    Jeffro

    @Baud: and this is in addition to having demonstrably worse Covid outcomes, all while lying their asses off, constantly.

    What a combo platter these people are…

  139. 139.

    Ken

    @germy: How mRNA Technology Could Change the World

    Am I the only one who hears that in Maurice LaMarche’s “Brain” voice?

  140. 140.

    WereBear

    @Auntie Anne:

    What about Mr. WayofCats?

     
    I made him an account at the pharmacy, but now trying to use it to get him a vaccine appointment has revealed a fustercluck of giant proportions, such as can only be managed by a rushed and underfunded corporate database application.

    I will be there in person tomorrow, and will try to see what options he has…

  141. 141.

    Elizabelle

    @Kathleen: In addition we can add the physical and emotional trauma suffered by over stressed hospital personnel who also had to worry about PPE and family members plus [Covid long-termers]?

    Absolutely.

    I met a man up in NoVA this weekend who told me that a certain agency investigating healthcare fraud was considered a second career for Secret Service types.  Which makes some sense; it’s not just executive protection; it’s counterfeiting and fraud too.

    Am sure there are many agencies with trained investigators who can do forensic analysis of the FFG’s mishandling (possibly criminal) of the pandemic.

    The CNN report this weekend shows there are many TFG administration officials who are eager to step up and clear their names.  (I winced at some of the rightwing talking points of several of them, used to try to shift blame.)  Let ’em talk, and follow the facts where they lead.

  143. 143.

    mrmoshpotato

    @Ken:

    (2) how could you tell anyway? 

    Dump starts yelling that he’s sucked Kremlin ass since 1987 as we all knew?

  144. 144.

    Fair Economist

    @NotMax:

    With the glaring exception that there are constantly new developments, even entire new towns, coming into being.

    Sometimes, but such new developments being built are overwhelmingly low-density auto-addicted places which will be a drag on our economy and our ecology. At the very least the developers should pay for additional infrastructure, not the country as a whole. We need a lot less of it.

    Keep in mind that our under-65 population has already reached its peak. We don’t need net new housing (except to make up for deficits) unless it’s retirement housing, and that’s not what’s going up in the exurbs. The deficit in housing is entirely in higher-density more walkable communities, so that’s what we should be building.

  145. 145.

    Kathleen

    @Ken: Point #2 for sure! But our media are jonesing for him again so we won’t hear any truth from them

  147. 147.

    NotMax

    @Omnes Omnibus

    “You know what we’re going to do with mRNA, Pinky?”

    “Open a boutique, Brain?”

    “Yes, Pinky. We’ll open a boutique, selling women’s clothing … and vaccine.”

  148. 148.

    germy

    @WereBear:  …a fustercluck of giant proportions, such as can only be managed by a rushed and underfunded corporate database application.

    That was my experience dealing with a pharmacy.  The experience at the actual location was fine, but dealing with the website and the Texas call center was a nightmare.  The website is useless and the call center operator was apparently never trained on the appointment-setting computer system.

  149. 149.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @WereBear: and will try to see what options he has…

    Maybe if you brought him with, just doing it might be an option. Maybe.

  151. 151.

    Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes

    @Geminid:

    Weird part about the Reagan “expansion” was that the expansion seemed confined to C Suites and gimmicked equity values on Wall Street. Anything accruing to the rest of the country was related to the reopening of consumer credit markets and the accrual of a lot more debt.

  152. 152.

    Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes

    @WereBear: I got shot number 2 last night at my local Walgreens. It was mostly fine, but a couple of things stuck in my head:

    1. An elderly black gent showed up without an appointment in the hopes of getting one. The pharmacist told him that the only ways to get one were to schedule via the website (which the man clearly couldn’t figure out to do) OR to navigate the phone appointment process. I don’t know why they couldn’t just pull up a calendar and give him a date.

    2. There was a squeaking woman of a certain age in the pharmacy line going on and on about how she wouldn’t get the vaccine, she heard it was dangerous, she didn’t know why people were getting it, etc. I was seated because of my leg brace  and couldn’t see her face, bet she was unmasked, too.

    As for the shot, it was Moderna. Pretty sore, unlike the first round, and I have a ton of fatigue plus a little confusion on waking. Hope this passes shortly.

  158. 158.

    different-church-lady

    If you’re worried about the condition of the pipes that take the dirty water out, wait ’til you hear about the condition of the pipes that bring the clean water in.

  160. 160.

    Mel

    @OzarkHillbilly: It’s a beautiful name!

    It took a while for my niece’s name to find her, as well. It was worth the wait – named after two great-grandmas, and also, accidentally, after her Auntie’s favorite antique Peony.

  161. 161.

    Matt McIrvin

    @Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes: Every sufficiently public Twitter thread about the vaccine gets people going “I won’t get this vaccine until it’s been in use for years, and we know the long-term effects–I won’t be a lab rat and inject some untested vaccine into my body.” But they’re weirdly OK with risking the unknown long-term effects of an untested virus.

  162. 162.

    Soprano2

    @Ken:  Wait, you’re telling me the 19th-century iron sewer pipes and brick tunnels need some repairs?

    (I assume it’s brick tunnels, since pretty much every TV show with a sewer scene has them.  I guess the electric lighting in the tunnels was put in during the 20th century?)

    Yes, and the clay tile pipes too, and a lot of the manholes that were built with bricks and blocks. We don’t have any more brick sewers here, although the abandoned lines used to show on our maps. What they almost always show on TV are combined sewers that transport both sewage and stormwater. No one builds like that anymore, but many large cities are stuck with them. And no, I doubt that the real ones have electricity in them; all it would take would be one big storm to short all that out. I’ve only seen a couple of times on TV where the sewers are shown the way they really are (mostly); once on “CSI: Las Vegas” when they were looking for bones that had been flushed down the toilet, and they actually showed what looked like real CCTV footage from a TV truck, and one other time but I can’t remember the TV show.

  163. 163.

    sdhays

    @Soprano2: Seems low to me. I’ve seen estimates up to $10-$20T, and when you compare the state of infrastructure in this country to other countries and the lack of investment over decades, that seems more realistic to me. But I’m no expert.

    Either way, it’s well past time to start ponying up and Build Back Better™!

  165. 165.

    Geoduck

    Re: wind power. Important to remember the only reason that  the previous administration opposed the idea was because the Shiatgibbon personally hated windmills for “ruining the view” at his Scottish golf club.

  166. 166.

    NotMax

    @different-church-lady

    Until a parallel water tunnel is finished to bring potable water from upstate watersheds to NYC the engineers are universally in fear of ever having to shut the giant valves at the city end of the original, for fear that it had never been done since Tunnel #1 was put into service in 1917 and they wouldn’t be able to open the valves again afterwards.

    At least up through the 1970s there were occasional stories popping up of service or street maintenance uncovering still in use hollowed out log pipes for water transport buried in downtown Manhattan and parts of Brooklyn.

    Here on Maui, there are now maps (though incomplete or involving guesswork) in the county planning office of water, sewer and storm drain pipes. When first I arrived and for some time after that, all that info was stored in the head of one superannuated employee. If anyone had any questions about what was where, the response was always “Ask Kimo.”

  167. 167.

    L85NJGT

    Janes Jacobs had some important ideas, but taking it to the illogical extreme seems more like GOP ratfuckers in search of a talking point. Personal transport isn’t going away. The no build option sounds good in theory, but the practical reality is politicians and DOTs build parkways instead of freeways. They have their place, but when they get stressed with freeway traffic loads and speeds, with no shoulders or barriers, and lower speed geometry, they are a dangerous mess.

  169. 169.

    Soprano2

    @NotMax: Used to be like that here, GIS on the computer was a HUGE improvement in mapping. We’ve made leaps and bounds in getting things mapped since I started here in 1993.

  170. 170.

    Soprano2

    @NotMax: *shudder* No thanks, I’ve heard stories. Plumbers used to discover that in a house connection every now and then and call us to ask what the hell they were looking at.

  171. 171.

    piratedan

    afaik, the only new Interstate planned (in roughly the last 25years) is Interstate 11, linking Las Vegas and Phoenix.  Although there has been some speculation of additional linkage/construction going northward thru eastern Nevada and then up thru the Idaho panhandle or Eastern Washington/Oregon to the Canadian border.

    Trucking is still an industry, while we may be seeing advancements to it in attempted automation.  I also second the idea that travel by car is a uniquely American thang brought on by the Interstate System and allows a great many of us to experience our country (and its beauty)  in ways that few others can.

  172. 172.

    frosty

    @raven: I saw your comment. Have you read “The Face Of War” by Martha Gelhorn? She covered Normandy against orders by stowing away on a hospital ship.

    Her Vietnam dispatches were much like the others mentioned.

  173. 173.

    frosty

    @NotMax: In the 90s, working for Arlington VA DPW, I had a crew of summer interns going through all the development drawings to put together the first storm drain map the County ever had. It took five summers and then we digitized it into GIS.

  176. 176.

    The Moar You Know

    Also I read that employers can’t require the vaccine now because they’re all authorized for emergency use. My google foo is failing me when I try to find out how long it will take for regular authorization to kick in. Does anyone know? 

    @Dorothy A. Winsor:  This is true.  I don’t know the answer.  Hope it’s soon.  We’ve got one refuser in the office – who thinks it’s a fucking hoax – and they are going to be a huge problem.

    I gather even enlisted personnel are refusing the shot, which shocked a veteran friend of mine. In her experience, when they say “take this shot,” you stick out your arm.

    This is also the case and the number is about 40%.  I don’t know why the military is not making this a straight-out direct order, like they did with troops in Iraq and the anthrax vaccine.   Which was a bit more than “experimental”.   Doesn’t matter if you’re toting an M-4 or a spreadsheet, this affect readiness directly.

  177. 177.

    J R in WV

    @NotMax:

    ask me offline about installing Orangeburg pipe for effluent.

    I had never heard the term “Orangeburg pipe” and so looked it up — Google is your friend.

    OMG who invented that cheap crummy product? What code writer accepted it for installation? The photos of failed installations, the description of the composition of the product:

    Orangeburg pipe (also known as “fiber conduit”, “bituminous fiber pipe” or “Bermico”) is bituminized fiber pipe made from layers of ground wood pulp fibers compressed with and bound by a water resistant adhesive then impregnated with liquefied coal tar pitch.

    AKA toilet paper tube with glue and tar. Who coulda knowed that was a bad terrible stupid idea?

  178. 178.

    The Moar You Know

    If you’re worried about the condition of the pipes that take the dirty water out, wait ’til you hear about the condition of the pipes that bring the clean water in.

    @different-church-lady: Probably dead thread now but this will blow someone’s mind; after the Loma Prieta quake in 1989, when I was living in Santa Cruz, most of the downtown water pipes got trashed.  It was then that we found out that the vast majority of them had been installed in the late 1800s/early 1900s and had been made with the best available local material:  hollowed out redwood logs.  Most of them were over a hundred years old.

  180. 180.

    catclub

    @The Moar You Know: We’ve got one refuser in the office – who thinks it’s a fucking hoax – and they are going to be a huge problem.

     

    Fire their ass for not being a team player.

  181. 181.

    dnfree

    @OzarkHillbilly: it is important to consider initials.  We once knew someone who gave their baby the lovely name of Tammy Irene Taylor. First thing I said to my husband was “Well, no monogrammed sweaters for her.”

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