Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Balloon Juice has never been a refuge for the linguistically delicate.

Motto for the House: Flip 5 and lose none.

The jury literally has a bell they can ring to force Trump to show up on command. Greatest thing ever!

“The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits.”

Dead end MAGA boomers crying about Talyor Swift being a Dem is my kind of music. Turn it up.

I desperately hope that, yet again, I am wrong.

Anyone who bans teaching American history has no right to shape America’s future.

Everyone is in a bubble, but some bubbles model reality far better than others!

This fight is for everything.

Maybe you would prefer that we take Joelle’s side in ALL CAPS?

Nothing worth doing is easy.

There’s always a light at the end of the frog.

You’re just a puppy masquerading as an old coot.

Let’s show the world that autocracy can be defeated.

Wow, you are pre-disappointed. How surprising.

Somebody needs to explain to DeSantis that nobody needs to do anything to make him look bad.

You can’t love your country only when you win.

Reality always lies in wait for … Democrats.

If you tweet it in all caps, that makes it true!

Impressively dumb. Congratulations.

Proof that we need a blogger ethics panel.

The gop couldn’t organize an orgy in a whorehouse with a fist full of 50s.

Red lights blinking on democracy’s dashboard

It’s a good piece. click on over. but then come back!!

You are here: Home / Politics / GOP Death Cult / Thursday Morning Open Thread: Today’s GOP, Shameless & Shiftless

Thursday Morning Open Thread: Today’s GOP, Shameless & Shiftless

by | 141 Comments

This post is in: , , , , ,

Thursday Morning Open Thread: Shameless & Shiftless

(Lalo Alcaraz via GoComics.com)
.

When Bill Kristol is the voice of sanity…

Reader Interactions

141Comments

  1. 1.

    debbie

    I’m looking forward to whatever this statement  from 100 disgruntled Republicans about a third party turns out to be.

  5. 5.

    Cermet

    A third party via a spilt from the thugs ain’t gonna happen; first, lost of money, second, lost of more money and third, did I mention they’d lose access to large amounts of money? Access to a donor org like the thug party is everything for state wide elections. This is more an attempt at myth creation via some talking heads. Cheney will continue but she will not gain any real supporters.

  6. 6.

    Dorothy A. Winsor

    I saw a headline that some anti-vaxxers are now threatening to wear masks to protect themselves from vaccinated people who “shed.” So…I need to be sad that they’ll be masked? Hm. It’s not as good as vaccinated but I’ll take it.

  8. 8.

    mrmoshpotato

    @Gin & Tonic:

    It will be bullshit. Saved you some time.

    “We wish our racist, fascist, orange god wouldn’t be so loud with the racism and the fascism.

    ETA – and why did the Dumbocrats make us so racist and fascist?”

  11. 11.

    David ? ☘The Establishment☘? Koch

    You need to show fealty to Trump to survive in today’s Republican Party, but that fealty need not be genuine or heartfelt.

    In Max Brooks’s novel World War Z, “quisling” refers to a human that had broken down psychologically due to the presence of zombies and thus begun acting like a zombie.

  12. 12.

    Jake Gibson

    The worst and most bizarre thing about this time line is finding myself agreeing with Cheney and Kristol. Not that my opinion of either has changed.

  13. 13.

    mrmoshpotato

    @Ben Cisco: John: So this guy throws himself on the cart, but then decides he’s fine seconds later and wants to go for a walk?  How’s that make any sense?  Oh, and then he decides he’s dead again?  Are you guys nuts?

  15. 15.

    satby

    @Baud: I hope it’s true.  We get to walk free and they have to cover their ugly faces.

     

    Or as I put it in last night’s thread:

    Actually getting little shivers of joy at the thought of all the asshole redneck Dumpers at the farmers market FINALLY putting masks on their slack-jawed, dumbshit faces.  Yeah,I may have some resentment after 18 months of their bullshit.

  16. 16.

    Betty Cracker

    I’ve been collecting “only Democrats have agency” takes for ages, but the lugubrious observation by Heer captured in the tweet above and histrionic scolding by the other usual suspects (including Greenwald, of course) just really take the fucking cake

    ETA: I mean, Greenwald is a regular guest on the Tucker Carlson White Power Hour. And he’s going to lecture people for praising Cheney for a single thing she did, which was telling the goddamn truth? Fuck all those people.

  17. 17.

    Ben Cisco

    @Jake Gibson: Nor should it. We should not forget that Ms. Cheney’s preference is to go back to saying the quiet things quietly, NOT to stop saying them. In other words:

    (Romanoff) We have an ally?

    (Fury) Ultron’s Trumpists got an enemy. That’s NOT the same thing.

  19. 19.

    lowtechcyclist

    @Betty Cracker: I’m normally a fan of Heer, but the real blindness in that tweet is the notion that there is a wing of the GOP that’s worth a damn in terms of what they stand for.

    Their last Presidential candidate before TFG famously called 47% of Americans ‘moochers and takers’ – and he’s considered one of the party’s ‘moderates.’  And there’s a reason the ACA got zero Senate GQP votes in 2009/2010, and why Biden’s Covid relief bill got zero this year.

    If the GQP were magically de-Trumpified and de-Qanonified tomorrow, they’d still be awful, and they’d still stand foursquare against any meaningful solutions to our nation’s and our world’s problems

    ETA: And like you say, the media would still strongly imply that it was up to the Dems to somehow persuade them to see the light.  Only Dems have agency.

  20. 20.

    Dorothy A. Winsor

    (As you can tell, I’m catching up on news)

    I see Marjorie Taylor Greene yelled at AOC who’s been studiously ignoring her. Florida, either MTG doesn’t represent you, in which case, aren’t you embarrassed? Or she does, in which case, aren’t you embarrassed?

  21. 21.

    Geminid

    @Betty Cracker: I don’t like Liz Cheney or her politics. Not that she cares. But I’m glad Lynn and Darth Cheney did not raise their daughter up to be another Lindsey Graham.

    I still think she looks like one of those Whos from Whoville, though.

  22. 22.

    hueyplong

    It’s possible that we need to stop trying to create hopeful narratives that can’t stand sunlight and just default to an indiscriminate Root For Injuries posture that cares not who gets injured but focuses instead on how many injuries are incurred.  More is better.  Fewer is much less helpful.

    And, of course, the injuries have to be career-ending.

    Style points don’t matter.  It is the otherworldly accumulation of injuries that will completely turn off the persuadables and lead to the 73-27 world that ought to exist.

  24. 24.

    Kay

    I’m not responsible for people refusing to get vaccinated. Nothing I do or don’t do matters at all as to whether they decide to get vaccinated.

    I supported getting competent, accessible distribution of a free vaccine and that was accomplished so I really feel I’ve done my part. The idea that people who wear a mask are somehow responsible for people not getting vaccinated is ludicrous – can they possibly treat Trump people any MORE like giant babies?

  33. 33.

    danielx

    @Ben Cisco: ​
     
    The enemy of my enemy is not necessarily my friend. Temporary ally, perhaps, but not friend. Cheney is motivated by the pursuit of power, just like her plutonium-hearted daddy.

  38. 38.

    PST

    @Betty Cracker:

    I’ve been collecting “only Democrats have agency” takes for ages, but the lugubrious observation by Heer captured in the tweet above and histrionic scolding by the other usual suspects (including Greenwald, of course) just really take the fucking cake

    I think the problem lies entirely in Hazanov’s characterization of Heer’s observation. Taken by itself, I don’t think that Heer is implying anything like “only Democrats have agency.” I think he’s saying we’d better get used to a fully Trumpified Republican party because Cheney-wing opposition won’t be enough to stop the process.

  39. 39.

    Dorothy A. Winsor

    @What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?: I just looked her up and by god, you’re right. She’s from Georgia. So same question to them.

    But isn’t there one like that from Florida? The gun lady maybe? Isn’t she from Colorado?

    There was a time when I wasn’t absolutely sure who my own House member was, much less the loons from another state. I try to remember that. First because it was a good time since ignorance is bliss. But also to remind myself that normies don’t care about this stuff.

  40. 40.

    Soprano2

    @Kay: Unfortunately, they are giant babies. If everything in the world isn’t exactly to their liking, they throw giant temper tantrums. To them being made uncomfortable is the worst thing in the world! Trump made that a lot worse, because he was the biggest tantrum-thrower ever, and told them he’d make sure the world never changed in a way that made them uncomfortable again. I’ve never understood it myself – I’m not trying to make them live the way I live or believe the way I believe, I just want to be left alone to live my life the way I want to live it (within the law), and I’ll do the same for them. Instead, they insist on trying to make everyone live the way they want them to live, because they take people living “differently” as some kind of personal insult. Like the Mr. Potatohead thing – instead of saying “A company is changing the way they market a child’s toy, I wonder why they’re doing that, they probably think they can make more money” they curled up their fists and began pounding them on the table and yelling “How dare you change something that I really never noticed until now! It’s a personal insult to my way of life that you made this change (I was actually told by a fellow employee that I should see how this was an insult to traditional marriage!!). They think this is all directed at them personally.

    I saw that your governor is going to give away $1 million in a lottery to those who are vaccinated and enter. He has watched how they behave and knows what motivates them!

  42. 42.

    rp

    Liz Cheney’s motives don’t matter. And she doesn’t have to be our friend or future ally. Praising her stance costs nothing and hurts the GOP.

  44. 44.

    rp

    @PST: I would agree if Heer made it clear that his comments were directed at a specific group within the GOP. But since those better GOP advocates for anti-trumpism don’t exist, it sure sounds like he’s talking to Democrats.

  46. 46.

    Ohio Mom

    Off topic a bit:
    I just came from reading about my Governor’s brainstorm to use the voter registration rolls to pick five people who have been vaccinated to win a million dollars each. Using the Biden/Federal rescue money.

    Putting aside the logistic and moral questions about using the voter registration rolls — I suppose HIPPA prevents using a list of people who actually have been vaccinated — the whole idea strikes me as peculiarly Republican.

    First, we have evidence that people can be motivated to get a shot by a mere beer. I don’t begrudge the cost of a beer — I think most people could afford to buy one beer for themselves — but I am going to begrudge some Johnny-come-lately who couldn’t be bothered earlier to get vaccinated on behalf on furthering public health winning a million bucks that could have better gone to some public use.

    It seems to me to be celebrating selfishness, while the beer idea conjures images of people gathered in happy groups, enjoying the camaraderie of being part of a historical moment. It’s story they can tell their grandchildren.

    The lottery winners on the other hand are likely to face all the hassles lottery winners do — being hounded by broke relatives and finding themselves worse off after an unwise spending spree.

    It’s like Republicans can’t help but spread misery whatever they do.

    On another level, picking out five big winners — rather than spread the reward money more widely — and here I am not sure I have the right words.

    It smacks of the mythology of god gracing a few specific individuals, and we don’t know why but they must have deserved it while obviously the rest of us are worthless.

    It reinforces the idea that hierarchies of privilege are the way the world is meant to organized.

    Anyway, back to the discussion at hand.

  47. 47.

    catclub

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: I saw a headline that some anti-vaxxers are now threatening to wear masks to protect themselves from vaccinated people who “shed.”

     

    _I_ saw a headline that Mike deWine is offering a $1M lottery prize to people who are vaccinated. That is my idea.

  50. 50.

    Betty Cracker

    @PST: Maybe, but the way Heer puts it: “those who oppose” Trumpification “need to realize that it’s a problem” that the Cheney wing is leading the opposition? As if we don’t fucking know that already? Good Christ. Also, I’m pretty sure that’s not the only example of Heer joining the scolding chorus that’s piously informing Dems that Cheney is a vicious wingnut. Well, duh. It’s condescending bullshit.

  53. 53.

    catclub

    @Ohio Mom: and I  disagree. if it works to get more people vaccinated. It works.  Lots of people buy lottery tickets when the prize is large.

  54. 54.

    natem

    @PST: I read the original tweet as a condescending jab at the kind of squishy, unprincipled liberal very online lefties typically imagine in their heads predominates Democratic politics. It’s something I’ve seen that person do before.

  56. 56.

    hueyplong

    @Ohio Mom: “It reinforces the idea that hierarchies of privilege are the way the world is meant to organized.”

    You could make a list.  It would be really long.

  58. 58.

    Kay

    @Soprano2:

    Someone who works at the local hospital told me yesterday that 50% of employees are refusing to get vaccinated. This is not may fault and it is not the fault of liberals who wear masks outdoors.

    There is vaccine available on nearly every corner in this town and that’s just the private sector- there’s also a public sector effort and availability. I’m not walking them in there.

  60. 60.

    MomSense

    @Ohio Mom:

    It seems like your Governor is really thirsty because there are better ways to incent people to get vaccinated.  Here in Maine you can get hunting and fishing licenses, gift cards to LL Bean, and free tickets to the Sea Dogs and Oxford Speedway. Seems like a much better and cheaper way to go about it.

  61. 61.

    Soprano2

    Did anyone else hear this mind-boggingly untrue interview with Rep. John Curtis from Utah about his vote to remove Liz Cheney from leadership? To hear him tell it, it’s totally not about her unwillingness to tell the Big Lie, but instead is because she won’t talk about the other issues Republicans really do care about!!!!!! I mean, good Lord does he think there’s even one person who believes that load of bullshit?  After hearing it, my husband & I looked at each other and just laughed!  https://www.npr.org/2021/05/12/996370738/rep-curtis-r-utah-explains-his-vote-to-remove-liz-cheney-from-house-leadership Here’s a taste:

    CHANG: But why did she get voted out today?

    CURTIS: Because since that time, it’s not the statements she’s making. It’s that she is not leading this party in a way that will help us accomplish our goals and objectives. There’s nothing to do with her statements. It’s that we need somebody who, as I mentioned, is not looking in the rearview mirror, but is looking forward. But we’re seriously – we got major issues with a pandemic, with unemployment and in some cases overemployment. We have gas prices that are shooting through the roof because of a cyberattack. We’ve got inflation knocking on our doors. We’ve got what’s happening in Israel. We’ve got the cost of health care. I mean, I could go on for, like, a half-hour with these issues.

    CHANG: I hear you, but to be talking about those issues – you mentioned spending, Israel, health care – I mean, ideologically, Liz Cheney is a staunch conservative on all her policy positions. So why is that insufficient for her to continue as a leader?

    CURTIS: Because she’s not talking about those things. She’s not advancing that agenda. She’s stuck on this one issue. And that’s OK. Listen. I don’t disagree with what she’s saying. I totally agree with them. And I think Republicans in general should talk about it more. But when you are the team leader, that’s not enough. You need to be leading us forward.

  62. 62.

    catclub

    @Kay: ​
     

    . I’m not walking them in there.

    How about an injection drone that targets people and just stabs them?
    Good idea? or GREAT idea?

  63. 63.

    Kay

    Are these people going to refuse to vaccinate their kids and then whine when school have mitigation efforts?

    How much are we supposed to bend over backward for them?

    Since the beginning it’s been one long, screeching WHINE.

  66. 66.

    Soprano2

    @Kay: Oh, ITA that this is not our fault. It’s why I agree with Amanda Marcotte that we can’t let them keep things shut down just because they won’t get vaccinated. I’ve said all along that once it’s as easy as walking into a WalMart to get vaccinated, and a significant percentage of the local population has been vaccinated (my community is using 50%), things have to open back up. They can take their chances of getting a deadly disease if they want – I’ve protected myself, which is what I can be expected to do. I ask everyone I know if they’ve gotten their shots yet, to see if there are any questions they have I can answer.

  69. 69.

    Booger

    @Geminid: I have found Good’s emails to be just the most succinct distillation of MAGA bullshit I have ever read; just amazing little nuggets of utter dogwhistle bullshit compressed into diamonds of feckless stupidity. I can’t wait to see him gone.

  70. 70.

    catclub

    @Geminid: ​
     

    Since then, no Democrat has won more than 30% of the vote there.

    This suggests the opposite of GOP gerrymandering. IN gerrymandered states the lone democratic dominated district is 90% Democrats, while all the rest of the districts are 58% GOP.

  71. 71.

    Soprano2

    @Kay: Are these people going to refuse to vaccinate their kids and then whine when school have mitigation efforts?

    Yes, they are. I told a co-worker the other day that if people don’t want to get the shot it’s their personal right, but then I don’t want to hear one word of complaint from them about the mask mandate, since they aren’t willing to do what it takes to get the mandate lifted. He disagreed, saying it’s ok for them to complain about it anyway because “freedum”. I swear, these people are nothing but big whiny babies.

  73. 73.

    Booger

    @catclub: How about one of those flamethrower drones, with fire on one end and vaccine on the other?

     

    “CHOOSE, HUMAN…YOU HAVE FIVE SECONDS”

  75. 75.

    Dorothy A. Winsor

    @Soprano2: Talking to people about your experience strikes me as a good idea. I think people who are on the fence hear a lot of horror stories about side effects. It helps to hear calmer talk about someone’s experience

  76. 76.

    different-church-lady

    Half the country is being lead and influenced by sociopaths and there’s hardly a thing we can do about it.

  77. 77.

    NorthLeft12

    A couple of things that are bothering me about the reporting on this.

    1. Liz Cheney being demoted is not an attack on democracy in the US. That attack on democracy has been ongoing for decades, and all by the Republicans and their enablers and masters. Just say that.

    2. Where are the interviews with all the reasonable Republicans? Is the media waiting for them to show up at the local MAGA diner to express their disappointment in the general direction of the right wing fascist party?

  78. 78.

    Betty Cracker

    @Soprano2: All I can say is thank merciful Christ these whiny bastards weren’t our fellow citizens during WWII. “The Man in the High Castle” would be a reality TV show if they were.

  79. 79.

    different-church-lady

    @Betty Cracker: He’s not talking about us. He’s talking about the never-Trump wing of the GOP. Poorly written tweet, but we’re not the subject.

  80. 80.

    Ohio Mom

    MomSense:
    I agree. Maine’s method spreads a lot of happiness.

    People are going to enjoy themselves fishing and hunting,
    watching a game, or picking out something flattering at L.L. Bean. In a small way, they will be reminded that government can care about them and make their lives better in concrete ways.

    Meanwhile, in Ohio, we are reminded that Columbus has a bad habit of distributing favors unfairly (we are in the midst of yet another big corruption case unwinding).

  81. 81.

    Geminid

    @catclub: When they last drew the Georgia congressional map, Republicans were complacent about their hold on the northern Atlanta suburbs, so the 14th is fairly compact. That will change this time around, and Republicans will try to parcel out the suburban districts now held by Democrats Lucy McBath and Carolyn Bordeaux. Greene’s GA14th will likely be extended into the Atlanta suburbs, to be closer to 58% Republican, as you describe.

  83. 83.

    Betty Cracker

    @different-church-lady: A Venn diagram of the Never-Trump wing of the Republican Party and the Cheney wing is a perfect circle, so I disagree. Besides, it’s pretty common for Heer to wander into “only Dems have agency” territory. I find Heer insightful sometimes, but that’s one of his well-established quirks.

  84. 84.

    Barbara

    @Kay: I expect hospitals are going to head in the direction they have for flu shots.  Nope, you don’t have to get one, but if you don’t you have to wear a mask 24/7 during your shift, including in the cafeteria.  If that doesn’t work for you, then you can eat off premises.  Any lapse is a firing offense. Maybe this sounds harsh, but I think they have gotten to where many of us are: most of these people don’t hold deep beliefs about the hazards of vaccinations, they just don’t want to be told what to do.  Making their stated “convictions” inconvenient is generally all it takes to change behavior.​

  87. 87.

    Ben Cisco

    @Soprano2:

    Unfortunately, they are giant babies. If everything in the world isn’t exactly to their liking, they throw giant temper tantrums. To them being made uncomfortable is the worst thing in the world! Trump made that a lot worse, because he was the biggest tantrum-thrower ever, and told them he’d make sure the world never changed in a way that made them uncomfortable again. I’ve never understood it myself – I’m not trying to make them live the way I live or believe the way I believe, I just want to be left alone to live my life the way I want to live it (within the law), and I’ll do the same for them. Instead, they insist on trying to make everyone live the way they want them to live, because they take people living “differently” as some kind of personal insult. Like the Mr. Potatohead thing – instead of saying “A company is changing the way they market a child’s toy, I wonder why they’re doing that, they probably think they can make more money” they curled up their fists and began pounding them on the table and yelling “How dare you change something that I really never noticed until now! It’s a personal insult to my way of life that you made this change (I was actually told by a fellow employee that I should see how this was an insult to traditional marriage!!). They think this is all directed at them personally.

    This was PERFECT!! Just had to see it again! Thanks for this!

  89. 89.

    lowtechcyclist

    @natem: I don’t get your problem with the second one.  ISTM that there’s still a great deal of obliviousness to the reality that the GQP reaction to the 2020 election results wasn’t a one-off, and they’ll be more unified the next time.

    That’s what I read Heer to be saying, and it’s absolutely true.

  91. 91.

    Matt McIrvin

    @natem: I think Jeet is right on the first one. I’ve always been bothered by the “red states as moochers” notion because those funds are being spent on people who are being abused by their own governments, and, in the South particularly, are disproportionately minorities who don’t even vote Republican.

    Meanwhile, that blue states have a lot of very rich people in them is not particularly a badge of honor.

  92. 92.

    Soprano2

    I just had a co-worker tell me that he “knows” that it normally takes 10 years for a vaccine to get approved, so he wouldn’t let his kid get vaccinated if he had one under 17 until it’s been that long. He also tried to tell me that these vaccines “mess with” your DNA. (I think the RNA thing confuses a lot of people, they think it’s related to DNA somehow.) I told him no, that’s absolutely not true, that it’s a lie that’s been spreading on the internet. Of course, he got vaccinated because he has poor health and is over 50.

  93. 93.

    cmorenc

    @Geminid:

    @What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?: M.T. Greene represents the Georgia 14th, in the northwest corner of the state. The GA 14th was created after reapportionment gave Georgia another seat in 2012. Since then, no Democrat has won more than 30% of the vote there.

    The demographics of Ga-14 are similar to the portions of NC-11 that elected the excretable Madison Cawthorn, except worse because the 11th includes blue-leaning Asheville and there are no significant blue-leaning islands in Ga-14.

  95. 95.

    Jeffro

    the anti-trumpov Republicans just posted their opening shot in the Post

    “[we are] hastening the creation of an alternative: a political movement dedicated to our founding principles and divorced from the GOP’s obsessive cult of personality around a deeply flawed (and twice-impeached) man, whose favorability ratings are reportedly tanking in key swing districts around the country.”

    So there’s that

  96. 96.

    Jeffro

    @lowtechcyclist: that’s excellent

    Hey GQP candidates and officials: you’re all going to have to either fully embrace trumpov or disavow him, there’s no middle ground to be had here.

    Right, DeSantis?

    Right, Youngkin?

    Right, McCarthy?

    No more having it both ways, GQP.  trumpov or not.  Which will it be?

  97. 97.

    Geminid

    @Matt McIrvin: I agree with you here, generally. But I think the latest iteration of this trope is specific to the fight about bringing back the state and local tax (SALT) deduction, which McConnell and McCarthy insist they won’t allow. The “red moocher state” argument is being applied to the red state politicians who want to have it both ways on taxes, and pretend that the SALT deduction is for blue state moochers.

  98. 98.

    germy

    A commenter over at LGM compared the GOP’s Liz Cheney decision to Snowball being chased off the farm in Animal Farm.

  99. 99.

    Woodrow/asim

    @Matt McIrvin: those funds are being spent on people who are being abused by their own governments, and, in the South particularly, are disproportionately minorities who don’t even vote Republican.

    The reason the Black women-led Georgia coalitions won Georgia for Democrats was simply that they didn’t try to dunk, or talk down to, the people in this state. Instead, they worked damn hard to connect with, and support, the people whose voices aren’t well-heard, building on Abrams’ Governor run — and the bad taste Kemp’s tactics left with many.

    That built up enough of a margin of goodwill and energy to overcome the voter suppression and other issues that plague marginalized voting in this region. Harrison worked for similar in SC, and sadly we got some real work in my home state to overcome these issues, on many levels.

    That said — every time some wanked tosses the many BIPOC and allies who have, in a lot of cases, worked for change here in the American South for all their damn lives under the bus to make a “joke” about dumping the South from the union? I want to just scream.

    Racism isn’t isolated to the South — hell, Oregon was started as a White Supremacist enclave! Jim Crow — you know, American Apartheid, the one that gave the Nazis a baseline for their horrors? — only existed because the Federal Government just turned a blind eye to the brutal treatment of Black folx for close to a Century, counting from the “compromise” of 1877.

    By letting White Supremacists run nearly unchecked in the South, our Political Grandparents and Great-Grandparents set us up for what we’re seeing today.

    We need to be 100% on board with not letting that shit, happen again, y’all. And the way to start that, is to boost those who are working to buttress Democracy in the South — not to tear down the region because of it’s screwed-up “leadership”.

    [And I know no one here is doing it, this time. I’m talkin’ in general, not specific to this thread/blog commentariat :) ]

  101. 101.

    Ruckus

    @Kay:

    Well they can’t act more like giant babies.

    Because they are giant babies.

    The closest one to an actual adult now is Liz Cheney and she isn’t all that close. And is for all intents, alone. Their policies are not good for each other, only for the rich who would as soon see everyone but them dead. And it’s difficult to have all that money when there is no one to steal from. The world they seem to want is untenable. I’d imagine that it is difficult to see that with their heads located where they continue to hide them, a place that is dark and smelly, and not all that healthy or I imagine easy to stick one’s head. But they manage.

  103. 103.

    evodevo

    @Soprano2: ​
      It’s their fundie religious background that makes them want to foist their beliefs on everyone else, by law or coercion, whichever works. This is the way the fundie mind works, and it bleeds over into everyday life for them. If they do ever regain power, you will be finding out just how true this is…I live and work among them…

  106. 106.

    Ruckus

    @Ben Cisco:

    Monty Python tried (and succeeded) in showing that stupid and privilege can go hand in hand. And often does. And they made it funny.

    This level of stupid is not funny, and it’s not an act.

  107. 107.

    rp

    @Matt McIrvin: One of the right’s go-to arguments (and lately one of their only arguments) is that people on the left are hypocrites. You say you’re anti-racist, but you’re the real racists. You say you want to fight climate change, but you fly around the world. You say you don’t like the police, and yet you’d call the police if you were mugged. etc. The “red states are moochers” argument is a very effective way of throwing that back in their faces. “You hate the federal government and the safety net, but you use it more than the blue states you complain about.

    ETA Of course, the argument that “you want us to follow rules that you refuse to follow yourself” is pure projection. It goes back to the idea that the law should protect but not bind us, and bind but not protect people we don’t like.

  108. 108.

    Soprano2

    @evodevo: I live and work among them…

    I live in Springfield, MO, in the middle of the Bible belt, at the international headquarters of Assemblies of God, where there is pretty much a church every 3 or 4 blocks. I’ve got some experience with this. One of them actually told someone I knew that grapes didn’t ferment in Biblical times, which is why they could drink wine then but we can’t drink it now! I know that’s part of it, but that’s not all of it. I think they just don’t want anything that makes them uncomfortable to be out in the world. People can be gay, just do it in private and please don’t show it on TV or in the movies. People can be transgender “somewhere else” where they don’t have to see, talk to, or do business with them. Black people make them “uncomfortable”, so they need to just go somewhere else. And so on.

  109. 109.

    clay

    @Soprano2:

    I’ve said all along that once it’s as easy as walking into a WalMart to get vaccinated

    It is, at least in many parts of the country.  An hour after they fully approved Pfizer for 12+ yesterday, I was able to walk into CVS and get my 13-year-old her first shot.  Took maybe 20 minutes, total.

  110. 110.

    Betty Cracker

    @Betty Cracker: PS: It’ll be hilarious if fear of being turned over to the cops by the NJ governor makes TFG endure a Florida summer to maintain the possibly illusory protection of his lackey DeSantis. Not that the shithead would wander out of his hideous gold leaf Disgraceland suite and breathe in the humid air and bake in the relentless sun anyway…

  111. 111.

    Matt McIrvin

    @rp:

    The “red states are moochers” argument is a very effective way of throwing that back in their faces. “You hate the federal government and the safety net, but you use it more than the blue states you complain about.

    Yeah, but in practice it’s not the “you” that’s using it, it’s their victims. I’m not fond of anything that gets even close to blaming victims.

  112. 112.

    Betty Cracker

    @Soprano2: My maternal grandfather was a Southern Baptist preacher, and sometimes I’d help my grandma pour Welch’s grape juice into the mini-shot glasses the church used for communion. She had a story about how the wine referred to in the Bible wasn’t really wine too. I don’t remember exactly what the story was; it may have been something to do with fermentation.

  113. 113.

    Betty Cracker

    @Matt McIrvin: One way to get around that is to point out that the states are so poorly run and the citizens so abominably treated by local businesses that the feds have to subsidize the people who live there so they can survive. That way, you’re putting the moocher label where it properly belongs — on the state’s civic and business leaders.

    As an aside, I am related to several red state-dwelling moochers who fully deserve the label. But your broader point is a good one.

  114. 114.

    jnfr

    @Kay:

    What Kay said there. I don’t take any responsibility for the deniers. We’ve done what we said we would.

    I am happy knowing that me and Mr J are vaxxed and therefore pretty safe from their shenanigans.

  115. 115.

    zhena gogolia

    @Betty Cracker:

    Fun fact: Mr. Welch was a Methodist deacon who developed the process for grape juice so they wouldn’t have to drink wine in church. There’s a great book, Whitebread Protestants, on this whole subject. I read it when our minister and I were trying to re-introduce wine into the communion service. We failed. People with alcoholism would be upset, even if we had grape juice available alongside the wine.

  117. 117.

    Soprano2

    @clay: It’s like that here now. There are signs on the doors of WalMart and CVS and WalGreens and Target and HyVee, and those signs that look like campaign signs along the front of the businesses advertising “Covid-19 vaccinations Walk-ins Welcome”.

  119. 119.

    Matt McIrvin

    @Soprano2: I think they’re supposed to teach the “central dogma of molecular biology” in high school, but I don’t suppose many people remember it even if they were paying attention.

    (It’s actually a little more complicated than that–I think somebody here recently linked to a paper about the possibility that leftover retroviral sequences already hanging around in our genome like ragged malware remnants could cause us to express reverse transcriptase, which could in turn result in our occasionally incorporating bits of the genome of RNA viruses like SARS-CoV-2, even though it is not a retrovirus. But it turns out this is unlikely to work with the vaccine’s mRNA. So the risk of having your DNA messed with is from getting the virus, not from getting the vaccine!)

  120. 120.

    john b

    Did anyone else hear the mention of Balloon Juice on the newest episode of the podcast Slow Burn yesterday? This season is about the buildup to the Iraq War, so BJ was mentioned as one of the upstart blogs pushing the pro-invasion message (along with Yglesias, Ezra Klein, etc. — opposed by Atrios and a few others). Glad that Cole has come around since then.

    Makes me wonder if someone in that production is a lurker / poster here. . . .

  121. 121.

    Matt McIrvin

    @Betty Cracker: On an individual basis, there are definitely a lot of people out there who live entirely on government largesse or government pay while calling for the destruction of the government and complaining about the welfare state. I’ve never understood it.

  122. 122.

    lowtechcyclist

    @rp:

    @lowtechcyclist: It’s the “from across the spectrum” parenthetical. Who on the left is denying this?

    It’s more, who’s talking about it and who isn’t? This is an issue where a relative handful of people aren’t enough to raise the alarm.  Obliviousness is functionally denial here.

    @Betty Cracker:

    @lowtechcyclist: Looks like it was Josh Marshall who called DeSantis a lackey rather than Politico. Figures.

    Yeah, I shoulda looked more closely. My bad.

  124. 124.

    Betty Cracker

    @zhena gogolia: That sounds like a fascinating book — thanks! I was just wondering whatever happened to that communion set. It was a fancy round silver tray with high sides that the mini-shot glasses fit into, plus there was another tray in the set where Grandma would place cubes of Wonder Bread she’d sliced for the communion service (crusts off — LOL!).

    The set may have belonged to my grandparents, but I never saw it in their home, which I explored extensively. So maybe it was the property of the backwoods church, which is closed but still standing and not too far from where I live now. I visited it a few months back with my husband to explore the old (by Florida standards) graveyard. (I’ve got a thing for old graveyards.)

  125. 125.

    sdhays

    @Soprano2: If that were true, wouldn’t they have just called it…grape juice? When did the Lord decide that grapes should start fermenting?

  126. 126.

    zhena gogolia

    @Betty Cracker:

    Washing those damn little glasses after service is a bitch. We did succeed in changing to intinction (one cup, everyone dips the little piece of bread into the cup). Maybe post-Covid we’ll have to dust off the little glasses, sigh.

  127. 127.

    Miss Bianca

    @Betty Cracker: A lot of these bastards *were* our fellow citizens during WWII. They were the people who refused to consider entering the war until we were literally attacked, they were the people who cheated on rationing, they were there whining and obstructing and objecting, all right – it’s just that they didn’t have quite so many avenues for amplification of their shitty views.

    Also, something in our culture appears to have changed – validating selfishness as the prime operative virtue of society. And a society can’t last when anti-social behavior becomes the norm.

  128. 128.

    Another Scott

    @Soprano2: (sigh).

    Genesis Chapter 9:

    20 Noah, a man of the soil, proceeded to plant a vineyard. 21 When he drank some of its wine, he became drunk and lay uncovered inside his tent. 22 Ham, the father of Canaan, saw his father naked and told his two brothers outside. 23 But Shem and Japheth took a garment and laid it across their shoulders; then they walked in backward and covered their father’s naked body. Their faces were turned the other way so that they would not see their father naked.
    24 When Noah awoke from his wine and found out what his youngest son had done to him,
    25 he said, ‘Cursed be Canaan! The lowest of slaves will he be to his brothers.’
    26 He also said, ‘Praise be to the LORD, the God of Shem! May Canaan be the slave of Shem. 27 May God extend Japheth’s territory; may Japheth live in the tents of Shem, and may Canaan be the slave of Japheth.’
    28 After the flood Noah lived 350 years. 29 Noah lived a total of 950 years, and then he died.

    (Emphasis added.)

    Don’t get your passed-out drunk father angry or you’ll be sorry!!1

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  129. 129.

    J R in WV

    @NorthLeft12:

    Where are the interviews with all the reasonable Republicans? Is the media waiting for them to show up at the local MAGA diner to express their disappointment in the general direction of the right wing fascist party?

    Your big error is in expecting there are reasonable Republicans — there are not. There haven’t been since Reagan was their Sainted Man.

    They become less reasonable every election cycle, and now as so many have said above, all we are left with are fat whining babies, crying about (for dawg’s sake!) The Potato Head Family, masks and vaccines, restrictions on spreading the plague, and how dare you Demoncrats win an election, we Republicans never said you could do that.

  130. 130.

    Soprano2

    @Another Scott: I know, the idea that fruit didn’t ferment in Biblical times is crazy, but I guess that’s what they’ve got to tell themselves to support their prohibition against drinking alcohol.

  132. 132.

    Chief Oshkosh

    @rp: She doesn’t even have to be praised. All we need to do in referencing this is to say: “The Republicans kicked Cheney out because she won’t lie for Trump!”

  133. 133.

    J R in WV

    @Ruckus:

    [Republican] policies are not good for each other, only for the rich who would as soon see everyone but them dead.

    I almost always agree with you, because you are so smart, but here I think you make a small error.

    The rich don’t want to see everyone else dead, for then who would wait on them, bringing the martinis and caviar?

    They just want feudalism, where they are in charge and everyone else has to work for them for swill and a dry place to sleep. I’m not willing to put up with that, not at all. Nor are most folks here.

  134. 134.

    Soprano2

    @Chief Oshkosh: We especially need to repeat this because all the Republicans are now pivoting to “We kicked her out because she’s not talking about our issues, it’s not because she won’t lie for Trump”.

  135. 135.

    Soprano2

    @J R in WV: They just want feudalism, where they are in charge and everyone else has to work for them for swill and a dry place to sleep. I’m not willing to put up with that, not at all. Nor are most folks here.

    Yep, ITA with this. Not just the wealthy, either – many people who have worked for peanuts and under hard conditions want others to have to do the same because “I survived it, why shouldn’t they have to also”? These people resent that anyone gets any help that they didn’t get.

  137. 137.

    J R in WV

    @Betty Cracker:

    I’d help my grandma pour Welch’s grape juice into the mini-shot glasses the church used for communion. She had a story about how the wine referred to in the Bible wasn’t really wine too.

    In Biblical times, with no way to cool things down whatsoever, no fruit juice was ever not going to ferment. All fruit juice was going to ferment, and pretty darn quickly, also too!

    And a good thing too, the alcohol helped prevent diseases like cholera from spreading in the drinking water. They would pour the water into their glass of wine, which would at least in part disinfect that water.

    Same for beer. Which I think was invented by Sumerians somewhat east of Israel. Millet beer, mostly

  138. 138.

    wenchacha

    @HinTN:

     

    @Betty Cracker: Wow. I had no idea of this particular belief. Growing up Lutheran, we had real wine for Communion. I was a little surprised that some churches used grape juice instead.

  140. 140.

    catclub

    @Soprano2: These people resent that anyone gets any help that they didn’t get.

     

    I think they actually resent people getting the help they DID get. The guy complaining about depending on government handouts… is a federal employee.

Comments are closed.