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You are here: Home / Foreign Affairs / Wednesday Morning Open Thread: Summit to Talk About

Wednesday Morning Open Thread: Summit to Talk About

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Wednesday Morning Open Thread: Summit to Talk About

(John Deering via GoComics.com)

… In the visual record of Biden’s interactions with his G-7 counterparts in Cornwall and the leaders of the NATO alliance in Brussels, during his official arrival in Geneva in advance of a meeting with Russian president Vladimir Putin, Biden telegraphed ease — even though none of the problems he must contend with are easy. In his public gestures and expressions, Biden painted a portrait of civility, good humor and control as he stood alongside America’s friends.

There’s diplomacy in the details, in the aesthetic grace notes. And in the empty spaces.

For his meeting with Putin on Wednesday, his administration has made it plain that there will be no side-by-side news conference. No mutual answering of questions. During their conversation, there will be no meal. No bread will be broken, but presumably there will, at least, be water.

So much has changed in the vividly fraught relationship between America and its allies and its stubbornly credulous relationship with Russia these past four years. When Macron first met then-President Donald Trump, their long handshake might well have set a record. It was akin to an arm-wrestling match, as each man’s knuckles turned white and their jaws clenched. Their subsequent encounters included handshakes that were tests of endurance and brute strength, with at least one instance of the American yanking on the Frenchman’s hand as if he were prepared to wrestle him to the mat.

But after an administration whose public stance was defined by anger and chest-thumping — and the actual shoving of other world leaders — Biden’s every “hello” is a course correction for the historical record. He and NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg engaged in a shoulder-clasping tête-à-tête in Brussels while visiting the memorial to the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks. The president arrived in Geneva and returned the Swiss gesture of placing one’s hand over one’s heart in a warm and fuzzy welcome. And as some countries begin to see signs of a dissipating pandemic, the diplomatic handshake — so maligned, so germy and yet so deeply ingrained — has made a comeback, but without the palpable animosity of the Trump years…

The visuals don’t tell the full story of policies and negotiations. But they do tell us something about the intent, and the tone — about the way in which one wants to be seen. Biden’s walk across the international stage has been both considered and considerate.

He wrapped his allies in an embrace. And he promised not to give bread and comfort to his adversaries.

Reader Interactions

241Comments

  6. 6.

    SFAW

    There was some op-ed in the WaPo yesterday or Monday; the title was something like “Don’t strengthen NATO, it will just piss off Putin.” [Yes, I’m taking significant liberties with the actual title. No, I did not read the op-ed, so it may actually have been innocuous. So sue me.]

  7. 7.

    Spanky

    I hope Joe’s parting with Vlad is something like “so long, President Putin. Good luck, and stay out of elevators.”

  8. 8.

    NotMax

    It’s a formal meeting, not a summit. Agreement for staffs to arrange a future summit with defined agendas may come from it, but let’s not jump the gun.

    Yalta and Tehran were summits.

  9. 9.

    SFAW

    @Baud:

    Senate unanimously passes a bill making Juneteenth a federal holiday

    Holy shit. That (“unanimously”) is something I never expected to see.

  10. 10.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @raven

    Hope all went well yesterday and that you’re recovering comfortably.

  11. 11.

    Spanky

    @SFAW: Few media spots involving Putin are “inocuous”.

    I’ve always hovered between skeptical and paranoid, but just because I’m paranoid …

  14. 14.

    Dorothy A. Winsor

    In search of coffee, I just passed the cafe downstairs. Mr DAW had earlier changed it from FOX to CNN which was in Geneva. The commenter was saying “What’s different this time” and I expected a comparison to TFG, but no, it was Ronald Reagan. TFG is just sort of erased. So is W and his look into Putin’s eyes. They have to go back to 1985. That’s a long time ago

  15. 15.

    NotMax

    Muddled but non-formulaic enough to stick with it thriller from Korea found on Netflix, Steel Rain. Comes with the genre territory, I suppose, but that doesn’t belie botheration from the guns with infinite ammo syndrome replete in such flicks.

  18. 18.

    SFAW

    @Dorothy A. Winsor:

    TFG is just sort of erased.

    I think Fiona Hill’s “Things were so bad that I was going to fake my own death, on camera” comment is something that an actual journalistic enterprise would investigate more fully.

  19. 19.

    MattF

    The meeting with Putin is paradise for pitchbots. Everyone has an agenda that has nothing to do with the meeting.

  20. 20.

    Betty Cracker

    Autocrat tries to project height:

    What do y’all think this summit is for? The excerpted article above implies it’s about reassuring allies that Biden won’t continue the Trump policy of kowtowing to Putin, but don’t they know that?

    I can’t help but wonder if meeting with Putin is a mistake. It elevates Putin by letting him strut around playing the leader of a great power when in truth he’s a grotesque kleptocrat ruling a failing petrostate. Maybe I’m missing something, but I can’t see what the US will get out of this.

  23. 23.

    Cermet

    Putin is a murderous and utterly low life ass-wipe. That all said, we have only our selves to blame for making Russia such an enemy; still, what’s done is done and can’t be undone. I’d think if putin again attempts to interfere with our 2022 election, we should consider it an act of high level’ cold war’ attack and bring really heavy economic sacatons against them – basically freeze their moneys and banking ability.

  24. 24.

    Baud

    @Betty Cracker: 

    Well, it got all the GOP to go on Fox and talk about how the president is weak. So maybe they’ll look especially dumb when it comes time to vote for legislation that’s tough on Russia, or when they have to defend their colleagues who are found to be in cahoots with Putin.

    Just speculation.

  26. 26.

    Cermet

    @Betty Cracker: because putin controls a nuclear arsenal (thousands of ICBM’s, dozens of Boomers, long range nuclear  capable bombers) that absolutely dwarfs China.

    Also, the issue of a million plus soldiers and vast tank forces facing Europe. That is a super power level military power that we have to start dealing with again.

  27. 27.

    Professor Bigfoot

    @Baud: one only wishes they’d pass a bill making it illegal for police to kill innocent people, but…

  34. 34.

    Anne Laurie

    @Baud: Spousal Unit already gets Juneteenth (Friday, this year) as a company holiday — replacing Columbus Day as a paid day off.

    I’m sure there’s plenty of other companies that have already done something similar, and not *just* in the People’s Republic of Massachusetts.

  36. 36.

    Soprano2

    I think the press obsession with this meeting is funny and pathetic. They keep breathlessly saying that nothing much is going to come of it and not much will change, but they are covering it as if it’s the most important meeting of Biden’s whole trip. They can’t get past the Cold War frame that Russia and the U.S. are the two great world powers.

  37. 37.

    dww44

    @SiubhanDuinne: She’s on now and is truly in her element expounding on Russia and  the world.  She is so very well informed.  How the right so maligned snd smeared her and gave us the Trump presidency is a tragedy.

  40. 40.

    Soprano2

    @SFAW: I think Fiona Hill’s “Things were so bad that I was going to fake my own death, on camera” comment is something that an actual journalistic enterprise would investigate more fully.

    Well, you’d think an actual journalistic enterprise would have more fully investigated why 8 Republican senators spent Fourth of July in Moscow in 2018, but they didn’t. They don’t seem to be that curious about the continual conservative/Republican connections to Russia that keep popping up everywhere.

  41. 41.

    Soprano2

    @Baud: Ugh God, over and over again. They’re so, so excited about this. You’d think they would have looked into Trump’s many Russian connections more if they were that concerned about Russia.

  42. 42.

    rikyrah

    Uh huh ?

     

    Jenn ?️‍?✡️?️ (@JennieTetreault) tweeted at 9:52 PM on Tue, Jun 15, 2021:
    We don’t talk enough about the racist ways people use the term “working class.” Some mean it to refer to only white people. The assumption being all white people should be middle class, whereas POC aren’t “working class,” they’re occupying their rightful economic position.
    (https://twitter.com/JennieTetreault/status/1404995212649267200?s=03)

  45. 45.

    Chief Oshkosh

    @Soprano2: Will we ever know? I have to admit that it really gets under my skin. WTF were those turds doing over there? And why doesn’t anyone in the press or in power seem to care at all?

  46. 46.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @dww44:

    Yes, they gave her nearly 30 minutes, and boy howdy, she is every bit as sharp and well-informed as she ever was. That was a very good half hour.

  48. 48.

    Baud

    While I appreciate Anne Laurie for her consistency with these morning threads, if DougJ were in charge of them, the title would have been “Let’s Give Them Summit to Talk About.”

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    No surprise.  I’m sorry I missed it.

  53. 53.

    Cheryl Rofer

    @SFAW: That op-ed is taking a lot of lumps from the political science and national security crowd.

    It was from Stephen Wertheim of the Quincy Institute for Responsible Statecraft. The Quincy Institute is an attempt at bipartisan statecraft, funded by Koch and Soros. Early on, I thought they might be compatible with my views, but the include in their lineup some people I find utterly irresponsible. Wertheim was not one of those; I’ve even agreed with him on some things. The Quincy Institute, more lately, has been drifting in some odd directions.

    That op-ed was very poorly done. I won’t go into the specifics, but very few agree with him.

  54. 54.

    Baud

    @Spanky:

    I hope Joe’s parting with Vlad is something like “so long, President Putin. Good luck, and stay out of elevators away from windows.”

    Fixed to be culturally appropriate.

  55. 55.

    Patricia Kayden

    @dww44: It’s ironic that she’s on MJ this morning because Joe was part of the Rightwing media who regularly maligned Secretary Clinton.

  56. 56.

    dww44

    @SiubhanDuinne: it really was a great  interview.   Mostly it was just her holding forth. I plan on sharing clips with some twice voting Trump relatives.

  57. 57.

    Baud

    @dww44:

    How the right so maligned snd smeared her and gave us the Trump presidency is a tragedy.

    The tragedy is that it wasn’t just the right.

  58. 58.

    Cameron

    @Betty Cracker: I’d be very happy if they could set up future working groups on arms control/reduction (including cyber warfare, interference in other countries’ governments) and climate change.  And I think I’m being overly optimistic.

  60. 60.

    Ken

    @Baud: I’m expecting an attack on the grounds that Juneteenth is “too close” to either Memorial Day or Fourth of July.  This would of course be ignoring Christmas/New Years, and Columbus/Thanksgiving.

  61. 61.

    Old Dan and Little Ann

    @Baud: My school has off Friday for Juneteenth.  I am excited everyone will as well soon enough.

  63. 63.

    MomSense

    @Soprano2:

    I know.  The press are pathetic.  It’s like the coverage of MVP’s trip. Here’s the problem.  The press think that asking tough questions means asking them questions based on the opposing arguments (GQP spin).  Those of us with functioning critical thinking skills realize that GQP spin is total bullshit.  When we criticize the press for lack of context or both siderism, etc, they always answer with some version of asking the tough questions.  They totally miss the point.

  64. 64.

    dww44

    @Patricia Kayden: Hyper partisanship is the biggest threat we face and what was done to her accelerated it.  I don’t know how we climb down from it.  Win the next few election cycles if there is a level playing field.

  65. 65.

    Cheryl Rofer

    @Betty Cracker: Biden set this up by meeting with the G7, NATO, and the EU. He met with Prime Ministers of the Baltic States on their solemn anniversary day of deportations by the Soviet Union after it invaded in 1941. America has allies.

    Putin has put a man in a prison camp for wanting to run against him in a fair election. That was his run-up.

    Part of the payoff for America is already collected right there.

    I know Adam and others disagree with me on this, but you can’t isolate a country that has as many nuclear weapons as we do, even if its economy is the size of Portugal’s. Or whatever the latest comparison is with a small country. Or maybe Texas before it gave up on electricity. He also has borders or is near some of our allies, who have issues with him.

    This has little to do with Putin personally. He is the representative of his country, so he is the one we must deal with. We are safer talking to him and trying to get some cooperation than in a futile attempt to isolate him. Don’t talk to him, and things will only get worse.

    If we say we are building him up, we play into his desire for that. If we say we must talk because he is another world leader, that deflates some of what he wants.

    It’s like with the Republicans. Meet with him, and he’ll say it’s because he’s important. Don’t meet with him, and he’ll say it’s because he’s important. Whatever.

  67. 67.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Dorothy A. Winsor:

    Putin looks tense. And he’s sending conflicting signals. He’s manspreading, which is classically a way to look bigger, but at the same time he’s slouching his head and neck into his torso, which means he’s trying to diminish his physical presence. It’s very interesting, and a huge change from Helsinki.

  68. 68.

    Ken

    @Baud: My creeping senility is creeping faster, I meant Veteran’s Day is close to Thanksgiving, not Columbus Day.

    We also need to find some national historical events in March, April, and August.

  69. 69.

    Cheryl Rofer

    Admission of failure back at home, as the third wave of the pandemic mounts.

  71. 71.

    Barry

    In terms of certainty, Biden and the US should provide some to Putin – assured massive retaliation for his attacks.

  74. 74.

    Morzer

    Finland are about to play Russia at soccer as part of the Euro 2020/2021 group stages, which ought to be interesting. No idea how to wish the Finns all the best in Suomi, but I hope they thrash the Muscovite bandits!

  75. 75.

    H.E.Wolf

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: ​
      At Biden’s meeting with Putin, there are apparently translators (aka witnesses) in the room as well. Another healthy difference from TFG’s interactions with ol’ Vladimir.

  76. 76.

    Cheryl Rofer

    @SiubhanDuinne: Biden’s posture is straight and very neutral, something one learns to do in serious negotiations. He’s a pro. Putin’s sprawl looks like that kid in the back of the classroom that Obama referenced. But Biden won’t say that.

  80. 80.

    Ken

    @Morzer: No idea how to wish the Finns all the best in Suomi

    Google translate says “onnea onnellesi”.

    It also says that “ilmatyynyalukseni on täynnä ankeriaita” is Finnish for “my hovercraft is full of eels”. I wonder how many languages that phrase has been translated into.

  81. 81.

    Cheryl Rofer

    @MattF: Not only consulted, but showed that a large part of the world is with him and glad America Is Back!

    Democrats in disarray!

    [For those of you not on Twitter, that is how DougJ starts the day when he comes on Twitter. It’s like Rickyrah’s and Baud’s exchange here.]

  82. 82.

    Morzer

    @Ken: Now I shall have to see what Google Translate offers for “Smite the Muscovite caitiffs!

     

    The answer is apparently “Lyö moskovilaisten caitiffeja” which looks to me as if the translator decided to have an early night

    However, Finland have just scored, so perhaps the translator got it right after all

    Goal disallowed for offside. Yes, the translator betrayed us. Oh well.

  83. 83.

    What Have the Romans Ever Done for Us?

    @Ken: Actually it’s Veteran’s Day that is closest to Thanksgiving (Nov. 11). Columbus Day is in mid-October. Oops I see above you corrected yourself.

    What the holiday calendar really needs is an excuse to put a holiday that actually provides an extra day off in March or April. Presidents’ Day to Memorial Day is the longest stretch without a single holiday. I mean, Easter is in there but nobody much gets Good Friday off anymore.

  85. 85.

    Soprano2

    @MomSense:The press think that asking tough questions means asking them questions based on the opposing arguments (GQP spin).

    I wish the answer would be something along the lines of “why are you buying into GQP talking points?” or “Why do you always give GQP talking points so much credibility?” It’s as if they have no imagination of their own to figure out good questions, and instead just lazily mine the opposition (only when it’s Republican opposition, mind you, notice how they never ask Republicans questions based on Democratic talking points?) for questions.

  87. 87.

    Soprano2

    @Ken: I’m expecting the MO legislature to try to pass a law saying that in MO we don’t have to observe federal holidays unless the employer/entity want to. The governor just signed a law saying that local government can be fined by the state for enforcing federal gun laws. They seem to think they can actually do that.

  89. 89.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @Soprano2: that in MO we don’t have to observe federal holidays unless the employer/entity want to.

    It’s already that way here.

    eta I never got off Columbus day, Veterans Day, Presidents Day, or MLK.

  90. 90.

    Geminid

    @H.E.Wolf: There is at least one American diplomat present too, if I remember a preview correctly. A good message: Washington will talk to Moscow, but Washigton has a new Sheriff in town and he won’t deal like the the old sheriff did.

  91. 91.

    Soprano2

    @Cheryl Rofer: Putin’s sprawl looks like that kid in the back of the classroom that Obama referenced. But Biden won’t say that.

    He got too used to dealing with Trump, I think. Putin does look terrible in all those pictures. Is he trying to convey that he just doesn’t care about this meeting?

  93. 93.

    Soprano2

    @OzarkHillbilly: Is it? I know that private employers don’t have to observe them, but I thought governments did. Anyway, they’ll whine about it for sure.

  94. 94.

    Geminid

    @Morzer: Any self-respecting volcano would spit them back, like that humpback whale spat back that New England lobster fisherman.

  96. 96.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @Soprano2: I spent a lot of years working at Fort Lost in the Woods and iirc the Corps of Engineers were there every day we were.

  97. 97.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    I always got Columbus Day off, but that’s because I worked for the Canadian Government and CD coincides, always, with Canadian Thanksgiving.

  98. 98.

    germy

    I remember reading a story about how Putin tried to intimidate Merkel.  He knows she’s afraid of dogs, so he had one of his big bull mastiffs sit in on the meeting.  It aggressively sniffed her all over, and she was terrified.

    Putin can’t try that with Biden.  It would take about twenty seconds for Putin’s mastiff to roll over and let Biden pet its belly.

  99. 99.

    germy

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    It’s a “I’m relaxed, I’m not intimidated, I don’t take you seriously” slouch.  But he looks like the insurrectionist who invaded Pelosi’s office with that pose.

    Putin looks like a guy who’s obeying a court order and visiting his parole officer.

  100. 100.

    Barbara

    @Cheryl Rofer: Mostly I agree with this.  We deal with many unsavory leaders.  But just as it is right to acknowledge that Putin is after all Russia’s leader, it is also right to attribute what Putin does to Russia itself, in imposing sanctions and so on.

    Finally, we tend not to include those that actively work against us in meetings with our closest friends.  There is simply no way that Biden should go out of his way to elevate Putin’s status.

  104. 104.

    Ken

    Ah, looking at pictures of Russians and reading their body language.  Takes me back to the halcyon days of the 1950s, and trying to figure out which commissars were gaining and losing power from where they stood on the reviewing stand for May Day parades.

    (Well, not me personally.)

  105. 105.

    MomSense

    @germy:

    She wouldn’t even have to meet with him if Germany weren’t so dependent on Russian natural gas.  All that energy spent bullying Greece and abandoning  them to deal with the refugee crises would have been better used developing energy independence.

  107. 107.

    germy

    More on the chaotic scene ahead of first Biden-Putin meeting, via the US TV pool: “Lots of shoving and grabbing – it was extremely aggressive. The Russian security pulled on our clothes and shoved us.” Meanwhile, Russian journos blaming US press, saying they staged a “stampede.”

    — Natasha Bertrand (@NatashaBertrand) June 16, 2021

  108. 108.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @germy:

    I don’t think he looks relaxed at all. That may well be what he intends to convey, but if so, he’s failing miserably. IMHO.

  109. 109.

    Baud

    @Ceci n est pas mon nym: 

    Gaetz wouldn’t have been there anyway. It’s the Senate. The House will certainly pass it, and I suspect more Republicans will oppose it.

    Unanimous consent means no recorded vote, but I doubt any GOPer was caught by surprise. Someone could have objected if they wanted to.

  111. 111.

    Betty Cracker

    @Cheryl Rofer: Interesting take on the purpose and timing of the meeting from Fiona Hill:

    Sharp lady. I’m so glad she’s involved!

  113. 113.

    gene108

    @rikyrah:

    Working Class = white men in blue collar jobs.

    The media seems to always make this conflation. Never mind that most jobs that pay working class wages are no longer blue collar factory or construction jobs, and a whole bunch of those jobs have a mostly female workforce

  114. 114.

    Barbara

    @Cheryl Rofer: Umm, I think Putin is steering a hostile course on behalf of Russia. This has nothing to do with Putin personally.  He has as much power as any tsar ever did.

  115. 115.

    Ceci n est pas mon nym

    @Ken: One of the things that alarmed me about TFG, among so many many alarming things, was that reporting about our own government sounded so often like that old Cold War kremlinology. Because we were so open and transparent and all,

  116. 116.

    Betty Cracker

    Regarding the above clip of Hill at #111: jump to around the 6:10 mark to hear her account of wanting to pull a fire alarm or fake a medical emergency to stop Trump’s disastrous press conference with Putin in Helsinki. Amazing.

  117. 117.

    Cheryl Rofer

    In terms of the people who will be present, here’s the end of a thread from Michael McFaul, Obama’s ambassador to Russia. He’s in Geneva to consult with Biden, among a star lineup of advisors. In the thread, he mostly talks about the Russians who will be there. But this one will disconcert Putin mightily.

  118. 118.

    Ceci n est pas mon nym

    @Baud: ​

    Right. Got to keep my assholes straight. I understand Ron Johnson was blocking it but lifted his objection, whatever it was.

    I’m still mildly surprised that it was unanimous, because there always seem to be some Republicans willing to go on the record as being against puppies and ice cream. But again, there is no record on this one, so why bother?

  120. 120.

    Cheryl Rofer

    These two tweets include the American side too, although I’m not sure either list is complete. Plus, of course, the interpreters.

  126. 126.

    Barbara

    @rikyrah: I know that he was supposed to have surgery, I think for some ongoing leg or back issues?  I didn’t realize that he was finally able to schedule the procedure.

  127. 127.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Ceci n est pas mon nym: his objection was fiscal conservatism (Belushi “bullshit” cough here)

    Esther Ciammachilli #WeMakeWAMU @EstherCinDC 50m

    This makes Juneteenth the 12th federal holiday. Sen. Ron Johnson (R-Wis.) had initially objected “concerned the new holiday would give federal employees another day off at a cost of about $600 million per year.” Tell me again how many recesses members of Congress receive?

    Interesting that he backed down. One wonders if McConnell told him “Not now”, or if his own political instincts kicked in. Ben Wikler said he’s actually fairly cagey, and he won’t decide on running again until he has a better idea of his chances. He was elected in two Republican waves (2010 and ’16) and doesn’t want to lose (per Wikler, from memory)

  129. 129.

    Ken

    @Omnes Omnibus: Sorry, not placing it.  Who’s BiP?  I’m guessing it’s an acronym for a pseudonym, from the small-i.  One of our former commenters?

  130. 130.

    gene108

    @Cheryl Rofer:

    He also has borders or is near some of our allies, who have issues with him.

    Never forget, Russia is the buffer zone that prevents North Korea from invading Finland.

  131. 131.

    Soprano2

    @OzarkHillbilly: Interesting, my hubby spent his last 3 years in the Army there. He tells interesting stories about reservists who thought they weren’t actually under the power of the Army because they were reservists. They found out differently.

  134. 134.

    MontyTheClipArtMongoose

    @Baud: who shot up tom cotton, haw-haw hawley, hyde-smith, coach tubbs, rick scott, & (let’s be honest) tim scott with tranqs?

  135. 135.

    SFAW

    @Ken:

    Bob in Portland. He was (I think) our resident Russia apologist. I’m not sure if he lived in Portland, or St. Petersburg, or what. I’m sure someone else can clarify/correct.

  139. 139.

    Geeno

    @Ken: At Omniglot.com that was their standard translation phrase for a long time – so it’s been translated into a lot of languages. At some point they switched to Article 1 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights (boring).

  141. 141.

    Ken

    @MontyTheClipArtMongoose: Were they present, or was this another incident where the Republicans left the chamber thinking the session was done, and the Democrats held the vote as soon as the doors shut behind them?

  142. 142.

    trnc

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: ​
     
    The whole damn thing shocked the hell out of me. Unanimous vote in favor, big praise from Cornyn, RonJon not pushing again and previously saying he would consider supporting Juneteenth holiday if Columbus Day were removed (which I thought would have been rightwing dogma).

    What the hell is going on?

  143. 143.

    Ken

    @SFAW: Bob in Portland. He was (I think) our resident Russia apologist.

    Ah, thank you (and the others who answered). I vaguely remember now. Fortunately (?) even though he’s left (?), others have stepped in to fill that role.

  148. 148.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: listening to MSNBC in my car yesterday there was a lot of chatter about the damage trump did to our relationships in Europe, how our allies are wary of the American electorate now. Which I think is true and important, but… no one remembers Bush? the Iraq War? the un-personing of Tony Blair? “old Europe” and “the chocolate-making countries” from that old idiot Rumsfeld? boycott the cheese-eating surrender monkeys from some of our never-trump friends?

  150. 150.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @rikyrah:

    He had his long-planned surgery yesterday. They had waited to schedule a date until after Bohdi crossed the Rainbow Bridge.

  151. 151.

    MomSense

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    OKOK smarty pants.
    We really need a music thread.  I miss them.
    I tried to find that falling down drunk metric video you posted one time to show my metric loving kid but I failed.

  156. 156.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    Nahal Toosi @nahaltoosi 1h
    Wild stuff from the pool reports at the Biden-Putin summit: “Russian security yelled at journalists to get out and began pushing journalists. Journalists and White House officials screamed back that the Russian security should stop touching us.” (h/t @anitakumar01)

    I don’t know where/how the pool report is broadcast. Kumar has this in her twitter feed, but no pictures or description of the “scuffle”. Biden and Blinken look un-concerned. Seems like this has become part of the process with Russia.

    Anita Kumar @anitakumar01
    Biden and Putin watch the media scuffle

  159. 159.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Omnes Omnibus: I think what the talking heads were talking-heading about was more the destabilization/devaluing of NATO and other traditional alliances

  161. 161.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    I think you may be thinking of Portsmouth. (There is an island called Portland in the English Channel, but I wouldn’t call it western England.)

  163. 163.

    Mike in NC

    If I heard it said once yesterday on the idiot box, I must have heard it 50 times: “high stakes summit” blah blah blah…

  164. 164.

    zhena gogolia

    @debbie:

    I don’t see whose heads he would chop off, since the ignoring of Covid and the demonizing of vaccines were his own doing.

  166. 166.

    MomSense

    @Baud:

    He’s had way too much plastic surgery, fillers, and Botox.

    Biden shouldn’t have had the Botox, too.  This is the only time I’ll ever say that Bernie’s was better.

  169. 169.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Baud: the slouch accentuates the belly. I’m sure he’ll repost that shirtless horse picture, with the horse photoshopped reading tomorrow’s Pravda. And the Russian Olympic hockey team is about to get smoked by a one-man scoring machine!

    @MomSense:

    This is the only time I’ll ever say that Bernie’s was better.

    Had I had a mouth full of coffee, I would’ve spit-took.

  172. 172.

    MomSense

    @Baud:

    Putin should’ve upped his game.  It wasn’t hard to look good next to TFG who always  looked like he was sitting on the toilet.

  173. 173.

    schrodingers_cat

    @Baud: Indeed BS and his campaign and their Twitter and blogospheric amen chorus are culpable too. His toxic primary campaign beta tested many of the attacks that were used later in fall by the Orange Clown.

  176. 176.

    debbie

    @zhena gogolia:

    I mistakenly assumed it had been done behind his back since he wasn’t there, but I now see Cheryl’s point about the timing so he wouldn’t be in the country. I guess I lack the nefarious mindset to be able to figure him out.

  178. 178.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    Sorry, edit window closed on me. I screwed up anyhow, as my morning mind confused Portsmouth and Plymouth. Portsmouth is even more easterly than Portland, so I’ll give it to you, with apologies.

  181. 181.

    J R in WV

    @Baud: ​
     

    This is the dawning of the rest of our lives
    On holiday

    Senate unanimously passes a bill making Juneteenth a federal holiday

    I suspect this is going to be used as the primary reason Election Day cannot become a national holiday — lest every day be a federal holiday!!

    “How many holidays do You People want, anyways, we gave you Juntenth (sic) — whatever that is.”!!!

  182. 182.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @J R in WV: personally, I don’t think an Election Day holiday is a good idea. I would happily use it as a bargaining chip in favor of a week-long national voting period, with drop boxes in post offices and maybe other state-approved sites (Wal-Mart, dollar stores, banks….)

  183. 183.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @SiubhanDuinne: I am not a morning person* so nearly all mistakes made in the a.m. are completely understandable to me.

    *Yes, that was a challenge in my army days.  My NCOs knew not to bother me with unnecessarily complicated things until after about 10:00 a.m.  And, yes, I have spent much of my life being pampered and accommodated by others.  Why do you ask?

  184. 184.

    SFAW

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    I can think of a place in western England….

    A “tied island” ain’t the same as a city.

    [Yes, I know you didn’t say the one in Old Blighty was a city.]

  185. 185.

    L85NJGT

    You see this posturing from kids waiting to talk to the school principal, especially if the hot seat is on view to the rest of the school.

  186. 186.

    Betty Cracker

    @prostratedragon: Yes! The people who need to comprehend what a rolling disaster and embarrassment Trump was will probably never hear Hill’s account, which is a pity. (I don’t mean the Fox News, OAN, Newsmax people, who are a lost cause; I mean low-info voters who think there’s not much difference between the parties.)

  189. 189.

    SFAW

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    I would happily use it as a bargaining chip in favor of a week-long national voting period, with drop boxes in post offices and maybe other state-approved sites (Wal-Mart, dollar stores, banks….)

    If it’s not too much to ask, can you (during negotiations) include some kind of Reality Test? Similar to a literacy test, but would weed out the Foxbots and ONANNists and NewsMaxholes.

    For example:

    Questioner: “Who won the 2020 Presidential Election?

    Responder: “Donald Trump!! MAGA!!!!!!!”

    Questioner: “Sorry, you failed. Come back in four years, you can try again at that time. NEXT!”

  190. 190.

    Captain C

    @Cermet:

    That all said, we have only our selves to blame for making Russia such an enemy

    This is 100% correct, as Russia and Russians have no agency, whatsoever.  Only America and Americans do (and really, only Democrats do among Americans).

  191. 191.

    SFAW

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    Oregon? Is it even one now?

    But using the “was it a city when it was settled?” criterion is bogus. Or do you want to go back to the Rift Valley, and say nothing since then matters, re: cities and their names?

  192. 192.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @SFAW: works for me

    Was Donald Trump a successful businessman?

    Sure was!

    Thank you. Here are your crayons and your ballot. Color the duckie yellow to vote Republican. You can make the horsie and Mrs Cow any colors you want!

  198. 198.

    trollhattan

    Haven’t even finished coffee #2 and yet am assaulted with this gem.

    A federal judge in Louisiana issued a preliminary injunction blocking the Biden administration from pausing new oil and gas leases on federal land.

    Judge Terry A. Doughty of the U.S. District Court in Monroe said the administration doesn’t have the legal right to stop leasing federal territory for oil-and-gas production without approval from Congress.

    The judge, appointed by former President Donald Trump, also said that states suing the federal government—largely southern and coastal states—will be harmed immediately as the pause prevents them from collecting lease bids and bonuses from oil-and-gas prospectors.

    The suit was filed by the states of Louisiana, Alabama, Alaska, Arkansas, Georgia, Mississippi, Missouri, Montana, Nebraska, Oklahoma, Texas, Utah and West Virginia.

    Mr. Biden, during his first week in office, directed the Interior Department to suspend the program, among several new initiatives aimed at addressing climate change.

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/federal-judge-stops-biden-administration-from-blocking-new-oil-and-gas-leases-11623794412?mod=hp_lead_pos1

    (Rest is paywalled so don’t know all the gruesome details.)

    Damn Trump judges will be the death of us all.

  200. 200.

    SFAW

    @Captain C:

     “My name is Reek” look that TFG had after his Helsinki disaster with Putin.

    Except at the end, didn’t Theon die trying to protect Sansa et al.? [Not a GoT watcher, so I might be worng] And there’s no way in hell that TFG would ever do anything selfless; he’d push Sansa in front of him, to save himself.

  202. 202.

    Fair Economist

    @Cheryl Rofer: Putin looks sick to me, not like he’s sending a message. Facial puffiness and abdominal weight gain on a fitness freak suggest steroids. Combined with the Parkinson’s rumors last year, I think he’s come down with some serious chronic condition.

  203. 203.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @trollhattan:

    The judge, appointed by former President Donald Trump, also said that states suing the federal government—largely southern and coastal states—will be harmed immediately as the pause prevents them from collecting lease bids and bonuses from oil-and-gas prospectors.

    But we stopped TPP so it’s cool.

     

    Remember TPP?

  204. 204.

    J R in WV

    Raven is having surgery on his spinal cord to correct something that causes trouble with his gait. That is always a serious thing. Hope all goes well.

  205. 205.

    SFAW

    @Omnes Omnibus:

     you demented goalpost-mover.

    Me, demented? A fine thing, coming from a Cheesehead.

    Be that as it may: MomSense referred to that place in Oregon as a city, so them’s the baseline/ground rules. That you chose to ignore her extremely wise qualification is on you, kiddo. Q, E, and  checkmate  D, libtard.

  207. 207.

    Another Scott

    Joe and his team are doing well. Looking forward to the readout.

    In other news, ThePointsGuy:

    Royal Caribbean has canceled the first four sailings of its newest cruise ship due to a COVID-19 outbreak among the vessel’s crew.

    The world’s largest cruise line late Tuesday, June 15, said the ship — the 4,198-passenger Odyssey of the Seas — would now debut on July 31, four weeks later than planned.

    In a statement sent to TPG, Royal Caribbean said eight crew members on Odyssey of the Seas had tested positive for COVID-19, all on June 10. That was six days after the ship arrived in the U.S. [at Port Canaveral in FL] from Europe in advance of its first sailing, which was scheduled for July 3.

    At the time the ship arrived in the U.S., none of its 1,400 crew members had been vaccinated for COVID-19. But they were vaccinated soon after the ship’s arrival.

    For more cruise news, reviews and tips, sign up for TPG’s new cruise newsletter

    “All crew that tested positive are in good health and being monitored by our onboard medical team,” Royal Caribbean said in the statement.

    There have been no further cases of COVID-19 discovered among the ship’s crew since June 10, Royal Caribbean said. But the line said that all the crew on Odyssey of the Seas would remain in quarantine on the ship for 14 days in what the line called “an abundance of caution.”

    […]

    (Emphasis added.)

    Hmmm….

    More here.

    (via Google News)

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  213. 213.

    SFAW

    @Miss Bianca:

    No, he meant “Isle of Portland.” Which is not a city.

    And don’t call him “Shirley.”

    ETA: Besides: Portsmouth is in New Hamster, not in the great state of Maine

  214. 214.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @SFAW: Look, mate, what if I want her to call me Shirley?  Ever think of that?  No.  That’s because you are a selfish bastard.  So there.  Put that in your pipe and smoke it.​

  215. 215.

    RaflW

    @Soprano2: It continues to be deeply frustrating that the putative leader of the Russiaphiles, RonJon of Wiscon, hasn’t been investigated with any thoroughness.

    Hello, Vanity Fair? Rolling Stone? Somebody? There’s a reek coming off that man, and it seems like it could be Rubles turned into bitcoin to me.

  217. 217.

    trollhattan

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    TPP. Was that the accord that would give the US a place at the table in developing rules for trade among Pacific nations? That TPP?

    Boy, was that a close one. Think of the meetings we avoid!

  218. 218.

    SFAW

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    I humbly apologize. That option had not occurred to me. And as for being a “selfish bastard”: my parents were married, thank you very much. Well, not to each other, but still … And re: the “selfish” part: yep.

    That said, I do not have a pipe, so I am at a loss. Or something.

  225. 225.

    L85NJGT

    Lina Khan in as FTC chair, so hopefully that’s a good thing. The shrug the other four commissioners gave the 7-11  acquisition of Speedway wasn’t acceptable. Divestitures needed to happen in unbalanced markets.

    Stopping your screwy cousin from shitposting on Facebook is probably outside of scope.

  226. 226.

    Barbara

    @SiubhanDuinne: Many of the original settlers in Maine, including some of my husband’s forebears, came from Dartmouth, England (hence the name of the town in New Hampshire).  I think Portland was named as it was simply because they were so grateful to have found a port on land.  Looking at replicas of the boats they used to traverse the Atlantic Ocean in the 17th century makes is clear just how much they really, really wanted to leave England.

  227. 227.

    catclub

    @Omnes Omnibus: And, yes, I have spent much of my life being pampered and accommodated by others. Why do you ask?

     

    There is a risk that if you do an assigned job well, you will get an even bigger assignment next time. But if you do it badly you won’t be asked again.   This may not be optimal.

     

    Did that accommodation have to do with how well you did a job in the early morning?

  228. 228.

    catclub

    @Baud: quote from that article:  Trump, who is facing a mounting crisis of legal problems and political criticism, still wields huge power among Republicans, and has hinted recently at a return run for the White House.

     

    There is very little evidence of said crisis mounting. Maybe all underground.

  229. 229.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @catclub: I think trump just has to go one Hannity once to announce a big new fundraiser to “fight for you” to end his money problems, but OTOH, I keep coming back to the reporting that his three largest individual assets are one-third shares in high-rise office buildings (two in NYC, one in SF) that probably took a big hit in the last year-plus, and that Doral and most of his golf courses have always been losers. And there was an article a couple of weeks ago, I think the NYT, that his brand has been badly damaged in Vegas and Chicago condo markets, which were already pretty shaky IIRC before he came down the escalator.

  231. 231.

    rikyrah

    @Another Scott:

     

    At the time the ship arrived in the U.S., none of its 1,400 crew members had been vaccinated for COVID-19. But they were vaccinated soon after the ship’s arrival.

     

    NONE?

    DA PHUQ?

  236. 236.

    Soprano2

    @rikyrah: They probably took advantage of the easy availability of vaccines in the U.S. to get the crew vaccinated. OTOH, they should have waited for an actual cruise until all the crew could be fully vaccinated. I think we forget that as easy as it is for us to get the shots now, in most other countries they’re not readily available.

  237. 237.

    VOR

    @Anne Laurie: Company I work for made Juneteenth a work holiday in the US on very short notice last year. Notice came out on Wednesday for a holiday on Friday, too late to plan anything. They didn’t have a plan for handling the non-US employees, just an “Um, we’ll figure something out”. This year Juneteenth was listed as an official company holiday in the standard calendar.

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