There was a piece in the NY Times by Elizabeth Spiers yesterday about how Cuomo got away with it so long, and it was depressing that it needed to be explained again. He got away with it the same way they all do.
He harassed vulnerable women low in the organizational hierarchy.
He did it privately so that meant the onus was on them to come forward.
In public, he did it in ways that people could say “Oh he’s like that with everyone.”
He instilled a culture of fear.
He retaliated.
He surrounded himself with people who would look the other way.
He did it in America, where women are STILL not believed most of the time.
It’s the same shit everywhere. There’s a big scandal rocking Activision/Blizzard where some horrific shit has apparently been going on for some time. It’s basically everywhere in every industry.
And it’s damned sure still happening every hour of every day in stockrooms of diners and restaurants, in the office at small businesses, and so on.
Another Scott
+1
Even after what everyone knew about the Hollywood culture of the “casting couch”, Weinstein was somehow regarded as an aberration by too many.
The battle is far from over.
And Cuomo needs to go.
Cheers,
Scott.
Anya
There is a reason why I always hated Cuomo. I knew someone who dealt with him. I won’t say anything bc she never wanted to make anything public. I am so glad the creep is finally facing some consequences.
namekarB
Sexual harassment is an Old White Man Superpower, doncha know?
Jerzy Russian
Christ, what an asshole! He needs to go, like yesterday.
Nicole
It’s so pervasive. I remember being at a grocery store with my dad, and a guy in his 60s coming up to my father and saying approvingly, “You’re keeping her nice and thin!” I was 13 years old.
Those of us recognized as female by society are told from a very early age we don’t have the right to our own bodies; we spend our lives getting pinched, groped, commented on, judged. Every woman reading this blog knows exactly what I’m talking about and not a single man will ever fully grasp the extent of it. But I’m glad that we’re starting to realize that this is all just the tip of an absolutely enormous iceberg. It was put well a couple years ago: “We should not have to be explaining the gradations between sexual assault, harassment and unwelcome groping. And what message do we send to our sons and daughters when we accept gradations of crossing the line? None of it is ok and none of it should be tolerated.”
sab
So my older sister the art historian gets an offer to go to France this year, to Dijon. She is fully vaxxed, and used to speak excellent french. My husband is furious because this conversation is innterrupting his dinner.
Stupid as hell, but this is the level the conversation is functionning at. Bozos everywhere. Her husband is furious because it will probably be safe, but outaide his aea of expertise.
I would be afraid to go at all.
debbie
When he tried to palm off his behavior as a generational thing, my head
almostexploded. That was never, ever acceptable behavior! Smarmy bastard.Edited for accuracy.
dr. bloor
Cuomo has always been raw ambition in a tailored suit–I used to think of him as Mitt Romney with a “D” after his name, although TFG appears to be a more accurate analogy. I’m not particularly surprised.
Johnnys mom
Gaslighting is a powerful tool. Employed by powerful tools. I hope they all come back as young women. In the 50s.
The Moar You Know
Ask a Capitol cop if you won’t listen to Silverman:
Ruckus
One way was to keep the women out of power. You elect a woman as VP all of a sudden women have more voice and power. You elect one as president and that makes it even harder to get away with sexual harassment because women have power.
The past has been to control their voices, to make those voices small, less significant. Works the same way with minority men, Barrack Obama being president – and doing a pretty good job, made those voices heard just a bit louder. IOW the more breakthrough people there are, the more they get heard. And of course that scares the conservative side because they are mostly hot air, they know what a voice is, even if that voice is full of shit. When all of a sudden you hear from many directions, valid, good voices, of women, people of color, that changes the entire line of conservative bullshit, and they know it. Because their talk is all bullshit, all of it. No masks, masks, oh my god no masks – they can’t spew two words with out 20 pounds of bullshit inbetween. They are their own worst enemies and they have gotten many to not listen to anything else because they have noting positive to say. Because it’s all about them getting the money and nothing more. All of it. Sure you have people who have money, like Rupert, but then you have people with MONEY, who could buy and sell Rupert before noon on a holiday, without thinking of breaking a sweat. They use Rupert, for his bullshit and his controlling ways. All those Non-Thinking tanks, those right wing money farms, they are in it for the serious money. And they hire people like DeStupid in FL to help with the project of control for the money. We beat them by not playing their game, by not being them.
Elizabelle
@sab: I’d go to Dijon in a heartbeat. I hope she is able to make the trip.
Johnnys mom
@Nicole: Well said. You know, I have never accidentally touched/brushed/bumped/groped ANYONE’S ass. It’s not hard to do. You just walk right by and you don’t touch them. I wish more people would try it.
PsiFighter37
He got away with it because people are attracted to power. That means both men and women – I have no doubt there are high-ranking women who worked for Prince Andrew who thought that looking the other way would help their careers.
As for Prince Andrew himself, the most delicious thing is that the fucker isn’t going to outserve his father. That is all these douches who follow their dads into political life care about.
debbie
@The Moar You Know:
It will be like trying to remove a cancer that’s already spread to 90% of the body. ??♀️
Mike in NC
Cuomo always creeped me out. Wasn’t surprised by this story.
debbie
@Johnnys mom:
That photograph of him cradling the assistant’s smiling but frightened face at a party along with an assistant’s description of him running a finger down the length of her spine on an elevator convinces me we should just hang him at dawn and be done with it.
Elizabelle
What do jackals see in terms of Cuomo leaving office? Will he stick out his term; will he resign (and Democratic Lt. Governor Kathy Hochul would replacie him).
Next gubernatorial election is November 2022. Cuomo’s term, should he stick it out, would end in January (?) 2023. No term limits for NYS governors, so he could run again (but come on).
Anyway, January 2023 seems too long to burden Democrats with having him in the spotlight. About 18 months. Ugh. Enough.
PsiFighter37
@Elizabelle: His dream of a fourth term is shot. No way he comes back from this, IMO. I also think that he will eventually be impeached and removed by the legislature. His last quasi-ally, Speaker Carl Heastie, threw him overboard. The fact that Jay Jacobs, the state Democratic chairman who has been Cuomo’s bootlicker for the past decade plus, said he should resign – but also said that Cuomo was refusing to do so – means that this asshole is going to be removed with screeching nails on the doorframe.
Kathy Hochul sucks ass – she was mediocre in her one term in Congress, and she is LG now precisely because Cuomo wanted geographic balance to his ticket, but more importantly, he wanted someone who had zero profile and would never upstage him. She has no power base and will be as vulnerable to a potential primary as David Paterson was when he decided to not face the (erstwhile) Andrew Cuomo juggernaut.
It made electoral politics here in NY more interesting. If we get Governor Letitia James, that would be the ideal outcome, IMO.
debbie
@Elizabelle:
NYS Republicans are out for blood. They know they have no chance for the governorship. I would be surprised if he lasted out his term.
arrieve
@Nicole: This. Times a million.
One of the things I love about becoming an old lady is the anonymity. I walk down the street and no one looks at me! I always knew that constant judgment was exhausting, and having it just disappear is so freeing. I went to Rome with a friend when I was 20 and after three days of being constantly followed, groped, kissed and grabbed we got on a train and got the hell out of there. I went back for the first time a few years ago, and actually got to look at the sights because no one paid the slightest attention to me. But why don’t younger women have that privilege? Why does walking down the street make you public property?
And that doesn’t even begin to address all the crap in the workplace. I was lucky in many ways, but when I complained because a high-level manager put his hand on my thigh, I was told that nothing could be done about it except to sit farther away from him.
Ruckus
@Elizabelle:
I’d bet he’ll have to be run off, I’d be amazed if he decides to resign on his own. The thing with power of that kind is that he’s gotten away with it for a long time, he didn’t start being handsy last week, this is normal behavior for him. I’d bet he thinks it’s his right to do what he does. People in power often have a very twisted view of themselves and what actual level of power they are entitled to. And once they get away with whatever crappy behavior they do, they will continue doing it. At some point they go too far or they get caught or someone takes far more offense than they are used to and does something. Which starts their downfall. Or they get replaced at whatever they were supposed to be doing, or they die.
MobiusKlein
I was at a company 25 years ago where the head of HR was fired for sexual harassment.
Yah, bad news that he was harassing, but at least good news that he was fired.
Scout211
@Nicole:
@arrieve:
Thank you! You both wrote exactly what I was thinking.
How did he get away with it so long? Sadly, don’t they usually?
And until he is actually out of office . . . he still is getting away with it.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@Nicole: Every time I see another report of sexual misbehavior by a prominent man, I wonder how wide spread it is. We all run into it, but each time, I think of it as a freak event
Ruckus
@arrieve:
I think I’ve told this here before but in 7th grade I had a PE “coach” who when we assembled on the field for PE he would walk down the line and if he felt the need to talk to you he would put his hand on your throat and pick you up, showing you how strong he was and yell at you face to face. And no I’m not joking, I saw him do this and he did it to the kid next to me once. I wondered what I’d do but my first thought was to grab his arm for leverage and boot him in the balls. As hard as I could. I never had to do that and don’t know if I would or could have, but I think if I did, I would have enjoyed it, even if only for a moment. I was small for my age, I had two older sisters, and I got picked upon. A lot. Playing defense was all I could ever do, so I was ready for that at all times. Women get crapped upon a lot more than I ever did but people can be shit to anyone, and often are. I am reminded of turning in my cap and gown after HS graduation, standing in line behind a girl I knew, who handed in her paper, cap and was holding her gown in front of herself, picked up her diploma and handed over her gown and this was the first time I noticed that she was very pregnant. The woman handing out diplomas tried to grab hers back because of course she could not be pregnant in school, the absolute horror of that would shock the entire planet. She got away with her diploma and a big smile.
Ruckus
@Dorothy A. Winsor:
It may be a freak event but it’s not just an occasional thing. Take a poll of the women on here how many have never been the victim. You very likely won’t see many raised hands.
People get picked upon by assholes all the time and women get it far, far worse than men ever do. And some men know the routine as well, just not very many and very often it doesn’t go on for decades. It can and does for women.
Geminid
@Ruckus: I would not be surprised if Cuomo resigns. Now it seems certain he will be impeached. He will have to testify at a trial, after 11 women testify against him. His legislative contacts may tell him the votes for conviction are already there. Cuomo’s pride may tell him to go down fighting. But removal through a trial and a conviction will be humiliating for him and those around him.
Johnnys mom
@debbie: 100% agree. I thought he handled NY’s covid outbreak well, until it turned out to be smoke and mirrors. What a disappointing being. Nothing genuine about him.
EmbraceYourInnerCrone
@sab: I went to visit my daughter and niece and daughters soon to be sis-in-law, in Central NY/Finger Lakes(drove, masked and washed and Purrelled hands when having to stop once). Spent most of weekend swimming and floating, went to a winery (masked except when sitting at our outside social distanced table with just us) and out to dinner ( outside, staff masked, tables widely separated ) ALL of us are vaccinated…ALL of us got sniffles, headache, sore throat by Tuesday night Wednesday(we had all headed home Sunday morning). ALL OF US have symptomatic COVID-19. This new variant does NOT play. Learn from my experience…stay home if you can…Going back to bed now. I hope everyone is staying safe. PS-thankfully husband is negative so far and can get tested through his whenever he wants. he is living downstairs and I am living upstairs. fingers crossed. 2nd P.S- Symptoms in case anyone is curious: Sneezing, sore throat, runny nose, dry cough occasionally, wicked sinus pressure, low fever at night sometimes, loss of appetite, Fatigue.
half of us got the Rapid test, half got the PCR test, the two who got the Rapid test tested negative on Tuesday and Wednesday. After some of us popped positive they went back and got the PCR test today. Positive.
Be careful out there.
Cheryl from Maryland
I’ve know way too many women at work who are minions to a male sexual harasser because they think it gives them power.
VeniceRiley
@arrieve: Best thing about being 60! The last time some stranger grabbed my boob was a decade ago.
I think Cuomo suffers from a common delusion that alpha power makes him attractive. He thinks they all want him; so faster just to take command and skip the consent part. It’s the worst. Men, you have friends that do these things, I hope you know. You need to do a better job of stopping it.
Nicole
@Ruckus:
Except that it’s so much more than getting picked on by assholes. It’s relentless when you’re young and female. It’s not just the catcalls, it’s the comments, and I imagine a lot of them are from guys who honestly don’t think they’re being assholes, but there’s no way to explain how it just doesn’t. ever. stop. for women. And it puts a woman on constant edge, because you can’t tell if a guy is going to get mad at you for not acknowledging his “compliment” or not. I watched a young woman get trailed down the block by a guy who kept after her to, “Smile! You so pretty!” and she patiently waited for him to finally go away, and when he finally did, she looked at me and said, “I ALREADY paid him.” (meaning, she smiled the first time) She was just trying to get him from getting mad. God, the constant balancing act. It just sucks. I’m pretty much past the harassment stage of my life, which is great, but the scars stay. I had a really hard time during the Kavanaugh hearings because it brought up soooo many memories, and I haven’t had nearly the abuse that a lot of women have.
Beisbol Houligan
Longtime lurker here. My father worked for the New York City Housing Authority and had dealings with Cuomo in the nineties. Dad absolutely detested him and said he would never vote for that “rat-bastard.” He would be enjoying this tremendously were he alive today. For the record, he admired Mario Cuomo immensely.
Gvg
You know, I know it has been terrible for a lot of women, but I have been lucky. I never got harassed at work, I have had decades of no problems, I rarely noticed cat calls, nobody touched me. Now I have worked for 27 years for a University and most of the time the department chair was a woman, in a majority woman department, I am shy and never liked going out much, my father wasn’t a sexist..I can’t say why I have been lucky. There was one drunk customer once who exposed himself in a previous job, I reported it to work and they blacklisted the address.
On the other side my job is mostly reading petitions from students not doing well about why they should keep their financial aid. Rape is really really common and so is years of panic attacks, depression and other problems as a result. Stalking and domestic violence are not rare. I did get really lucky. However I will try to be encouraging and say it’s not hopeless.
N M
The blogmaster’s comment about stockrooms and the offices of small businesses reminded me of this quote from Sir Arthur Conan Doyle’s Sherlock Holmes story “The Adventure of the Copper Beeches” (bold mine):
satby
@namekarB: Uh, nope. It’s Y-chromosome linked and males of every race can be equal opportunity offenders.
satby
I wish it were true, but not totally my experience. We move from being sexually desirable (maybe) to prey for guys who think we might be easy targets because we “must be lonely”. It may happen to me more because I’m so obviously single. And I am FAR from a looker: fat, grey haired, and I inherited my dear Irish grandmothers resting bitch face.
TriassicSands
I can’t stand Cuomo, but I don’t think he should resign, and I hope he doesn’t resign, but instead rides his massive, toxic ego into an impeachment trial. There, if the evidence is sufficient, the Democrats should lead the way in convicting him and removing him from office. That is holding someone truly accountable and it would give the Democrats an opportunity to show the country that they are willing to hold one of their own accountable for his crimes and abuses.
Forcing him to resign leaves him with the ability to claim he was railroaded and if only he had had a fair hearing, he would have been exonerated. His rhetoric makes it sound like he believes he’ll do just that when everything is known. I suspect, but can’t know, that is his bloated, narcissistic ego talking.
The biggest political mistake in accountability this country had ever made, until Trump, was letting Nixon escape with all the perks of his office. He should have been impeached, convicted, humiliated, and stripped of his pension. Instead, we started down a path where the president is above the law. The most shameful act I can think of ever committed by the Senate was failing to convict Trump in his second impeachment trial. Failing to convict him the first time runs a close second.
I firmly believe that carrying through — all the way — with the impeachment of Cuomo is exactly what this country needs. Forcing him to resign might give people some satisfaction, but it is the easy way out. That’s what the Republicans did with Trump — took the easy way out in a collective act so disgusting and shameful it should have destroyed the party. Obviously, it didn’t, but that is because Republican voters are every bit as corrupt and depraved as are the people they elect.
satby
Here’s an example that went viral on TikTok and Twitter this week, behavior exactly as @Nicole: describes.
Lord Fartdaddy (Formerly, Mumphrey, Smedley Darlington Mingobat, et al.)
It happens everywhere, all the time. My wife and I are amazingly lucky in that she has never really had to deal with any hardcore sexism or harassing in her life. I really don’t understand how she got this far in her life without any of that happening, but I’m thankful, but I’m also angry at the same time that so many other women have had to wade through that filth.
Oklahomo
I used to work at a parimutuel horse track, and oh the shit I saw. One guy, who was not even in management got away with shit for years. Also sexual innuendo, almost in every sentence, but with touching. Lots and lots of touching. When he was called out for his bullshit, only the threat of going to the labor board finally saw him out the door. The number of women who defended him was the most horrifying part. But, he had made sure he was in tight with several women department heads, who all just rolled their eyes and said it was a mountain out of a molehill, because he was that way with everyone, and was just friendly and lonely, he meant no harm, etc. He was the large physical type who delighted in cornering women. And he didn’t even try to hide what he was doing.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
Indeed, the first sexual harassment I encountered was a black sales guy on of, all things, on the company’s female CFO. And Chines men are utter pigs.
According the harassment training we had to go threw because a female manager was going at it on her female subordinate in another department same sex harassment is quite the thing now.
persistentillusion
@satby: Great comment. Come sit six feet away from so we can ruminate on the differences between the Irish resting bitch face and its Dutch counterpoint.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
Do keep in mind Cuomo fucked with NYC COVID response at first just to screw with the Mayor of NYC. It’s not impossible Cuemo sexual harassment was being drowned out by the even more awful dick moves he was pulling.
randy khan
We periodically get pretty good training on sexual harassment at my office (although, as always is true, the training is focused on protecting the business more than anything else, the attitude is that the way to protect the business is to prevent and stop it).
That said, one thing in the training always has struck me as, if not wrong, not entirely right, which is that we’re told that, under the law, being a terrible, abusive person isn’t sexual harassment as long the person does it to everyone. Essentially, it’s not a legal issue if you’re an equal opportunity jerk, no matter how bad a jerk you are.
I’m sure that’s right as an explanation of the law, but I’ve often felt that it’s a sign that you have to watch out for more abuse, and sexual harassment in particular. You see a guy who creates an atmosphere of fear, and exploiting that fear for sexual purposes really isn’t a big step.
Ruckus
@Geminid:
I think you might be right, but.
He’s been a powerful man for a long time, he’s gotten away with crap for a long time and he may think his power protects him. It has in the past. Maybe enough people will get through to him, I don’t think that will make enough difference and he will hang on way farther than he should. He’s going to think that resigning will make him look guilty. And he likely thinks he’s not. Friends/confidants of his have told him to resign and he’s saying no. There might be a bunch of reasons floating about in his head but the biggest one is likely that he has power now, if he resigns he has none, and I’d bet he doesn’t see the error of his hands.
Ruckus
@Nicole:
I understand, I really do. I have been and know other guys who have been picked upon a lot and it’s nothing compared to what I know women have gone through. I obviously didn’t write that strongly enough, I’ve known men who wouldn’t take no for an answer. It’s bad, it shouldn’t be this way. But I also know men that wouldn’t think of doing this shit. Not all of us were raised by hyenas.
Another Scott
@randy khan: I don’t see how that doesn’t qualify as a hostile work environment. DoL.gov:
(Maybe your training is somehow arguing it doesn’t fit under the “protected status” rules. But if it’s happening to everyone, then surely protected groups are being victimized?)
There was a story a few years ago about some government department somewhere where people were basically having orgies at work. Nobody participating apparently was being coerced to do so (though that’s hard to imagine), but it was a hostile environment for those who didn’t partake. In addition to being completely inappropriate and unprofessional and wrong (hard to claim objective supervisor/underling evaluations in such situations) and a waste of government resources and falsifying timecards (how could you be doing work in an orgy??).
IANAL.
Cheers,
Scott.
Geminid
@Ruckus: I am not certain myself. I’m guessing the legislature will go back into session after Labor Day. I would think they will take up impeachment first thing. Then it will be crunch time for Cuomo.
Sister Golden Bear
@Ruckus:
Agreed. But the problem for women we never know for sure who is and who isn’t. Consequently, dealing with men is always Schrodinger’s Sexual Harasser/Sexual’s Assaulter.
And, not aimed at you. As someone who’s lived on both sides of the gender binary, men, no matter how much you think you understand how pervasive it is, how it permeates down to women’s very bones, you don’t. You just don’t. Trust me.
AlaskaReader
tam1MI
I truly hope that everything works out for NY Dems. They are taking an awful chance by doing the right thing and trying to get rid of Andrew Cuomo. Because we all know that the first order of business for any Republican who replaces Cuomo will be to give Donald Trump. his family, and the Trump Organization a full and complete pardon.*
And our last chance to hold that motherfucker accountable for anything will be gone.
Meanwhile, Matthew Gaetz. serial rapist. still squats in Congress, untouched and untouchable.
Why is it that our side always suffers the worst consequences possible for doing what’s right. while Repukes suffer none at all for their evil and depravity?
* ‘ Hell, I wouldn’t put it past Cuomo to issue the pardons himself on his way out, to punish Dems for going after him…