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You are here: Home / Open Threads / Tuesday Evening Open Thread: Moving Joe Manchin (However Slowly)

Tuesday Evening Open Thread: Moving Joe Manchin (However Slowly)

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Manchin’s gonna be standing alone on that redoubt, if he doesn’t get into gear:

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81Comments

  1. 1.

    guachi

    In election news, polls close in VA at 7 pm. So either follow closely or avoid to keep your sanity.

  2. 2.

    Fair Economist

    The House should pass the BIF as a “deem pass”, considered passed when the Senate passes the BBB. Put the weight on Manchin and head home for the holidays.

  4. 4.

    David ? ☘The Establishment☘? Koch

    Exit polls show the Houston Astros winning the crucial 1st inning demo.

  5. 5.

    JPL

    It’s time for democrats to run on providing Social Security and Medicare.   Republicans didn’t do that.  Republicans gave the top one percent tax breaks along with corporations.   We are paying for Musk and Bezos to the moon.

  6. 6.

    MisterForkbeard

    @guachi: Option 2. Definitely going to be avoiding until much later tonight

    @Fair Economist: Interesting idea. Though I think I can channel Adam and tell you this won’t work because the bill has to come from the Senate, and you can’t refer to a nonexistent bill in a deem/pass situation. Or something.

  9. 9.

    Hildebrand

    Seems that Manchin is just squeezing the last bit of juice he can out of his moment in the sun.  He knows that once this is over he will be forgotten.

  11. 11.

    Wapiti

    As Romney’s Op-Ed said, the Senate is there to ensure the minority gets a say. The important minority to Romney and Manchin: the oligarchs.

  12. 12.

    Jeffro

    Not turning on the tv tonight, no way, how how.  Checking WaPo website at 9pm and then calling it a night.  The punditariat can tell me on Thurs or Fri that McAuliffe won a close one ?

  14. 14.

    debbie

    Someone needs to list out with specific dollar amounts how  each of the provisions of the BBB will help West Virginians. Then present it to Manchin and ask why he isn’t supporting the legislation.

  16. 16.

    Baud

    @UncleEbeneezer:

    Manchin has already signed on to the voting rights bill though.  The only question there is whether he’ll agree to end the filibuster. Less room to play around.

  18. 18.

    Elizabelle

    @Jeffro:   I am nervous as a kitten, but thinking we will pull this one out.

    In the meantime:  have some cubs.  Cheetah Cam.  They’re napping now after dinner.  They were rambunctious earlier.

  19. 19.

    UncleEbeneezer

    @Baud: That’s what I mean though.  Once BBB/BIFF is done, that issue (filibuster reform) is gonna get even more attention and pressure.

  21. 21.

    Elizabelle

    Has Musk been into space?  I am not sure.  I know Bezos has, twice perhaps  (and made sure to load the capsule with Wally the 1960s woman astronaut trainee first, and William Shatner second, cuz otherwise people would be routing for a spectacular fail).

    Richard Branson has been on his spacecraft.  Of the billionaires, he seems like the best guy.

  22. 22.

    Jeffro

    @UncleEbeneezer: smart

    @Baud: also smart

    I am going to do some sort of write-up/op-ed/whatever for the papers about my ‘poll observer’ experience today but for you BJers, a quick advance preview of the best part: the 71-year-old lady who was there as an observer for the former guy’s party, at the end of our shifts around 1pm today.  She goes, “well…I don’t know if my replacement is coming or not, but even so, there’s clearly nothing going on here”.

    (meaning: there aren’t hordes of browns being bused in to vote, nor ballot boxes being stuffed, etc etc)

    Nope!  Just helpful elections officials, always following the rules (even when dealing with several college kids who can’t remember their own address).

    I doubt my new friend will spread the word too far, so I think it’s important that I write it up and help her out, you know? ?

  23. 23.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @guachi:

    I’ll probably just have it on as background until 8:09 pm, at which point I’ll be watching beisból.

    I do like the energy and chemistry that Joy Reid, Nicolle Wallace, and Rachel Maddow collectively bring to election coverage. Wish MSNBC could figure out how to ditch BriWi and Kornacki, but I fear it’s a package deal.

  24. 24.

    Sure Lurkalot

    Deficit spending for tax cuts and physical infrastructure for my paymasters, a thousand times YES! Sorry if that leaves nothing for my constituents. Someone’s gotta be fiscally responsible here.

  25. 25.

    Elizabelle

    @Jeffro:  We run clean and professional elections in Virginia.  We really do.

    It will be fun to hear what TFFG’s “observers” have to say, after the fact.

    Here in Richmond area, it rained lightly from maybe 9:30 am all day.

  26. 26.

    Kropacetic

    I’ve already called my Congressman to support the passage of both bills, but only together.

    I’m considering a new call about my change of heart. I’ve been hearing about some provisions in the BIF I don’t like. I’m hoping if the BIF starts getting more scrutiny from constituents, that might create some pressure to pass the pair of bills before it becomes a real problem for the BIF.

  28. 28.

    guachi

    Biden won VA by 10.1%.  The most D parts of the state are in the north and generally give results later in the evening, though with so many early votes maybe not this year. I suspect most of the good vote watchers will be comparing the places that do get their results in early to 2017/2020 results to make their predictions. So we’ll likely get an idea on the general trend early.

  29. 29.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Elizabelle:

    I’ve been loving the Cheetah Cam! A week or so ago, quite late at night, the cubs were all taking advantage of the milk bar, and Mama was purring up a storm! She was so loud, she pretty much drowned out the tree frogs (or whatever nocturnal critters are responsible for the soothing background noise). That must be a lovely thing for the kittens, to get maternal purring along with the meal.

  30. 30.

    Sure Lurkalot

    @Elizabelle: Nick Hanauer seems like a decent billionaire too, even if he’s playing some hardball about stopping donating to Dems if they don’t pass the BBB and the BIF.

  31. 31.

    JoyceH

    Call me a masochist, but I’m following the election coverage. Ordered a pizza to fortify myself.

    Checked Twitter and realized I had to follow Mack Brown, who tweeted:

    “My son set me up on here for my 76th birthday & this is my first tweet. Not sure ya’ll will care what I have to say as a retired religion professor from Texas, who is pro-vaccine & pro-Biden. He said to ask ya’ll to retweet this & follow me if you care what I have to say.”

    Bless him, he posted this around seven or eight hours ago and is closing on 17K followers.

    twitter.com/CMackBrown/status/1455577060387196928

  32. 32.

    Elizabelle

    @SiubhanDuinne:   Glad to hear.  I love the purring too.  And chirping.  It’s soothing background noise.

    One of the cubs was on his/her back, acting like a little otter for a bit.  In the play hour before dinner.  And the puddle of cubs.  Never tire of that.

  34. 34.

    ThresherK

    ABC News (don’t @ me, it’s the thing before Jeopardy!) has a long piece about Cokie and Steve Roberts. I don’t know the real gist of it because will not listen to that newscast, but I was wondering if she died.

    Turns out she died two years ago.

    I can celebrate all over again, though, can’t I? I mean, live by Cokie’s Law, die by Cokie’s Law, and “It’s out there!”

  36. 36.

    Elizabelle

    @Baud:   I want Terry Mac (and all the Dem candidates) to win by a big enough margin to make a recount futile.

    I am secretly hoping McAuliffe pulls ahead by a lot, though.  The majority of Virginians support vaccines, and masks, and getting past this pandemic.  I cannot believe they would turn the state over to people who support riots at school board meetings.  There may be a lot of “voter excitement” on the GOP side, but we could also call that hysteria. (The national media never does.  Always with the euphemisms.)

    Polls closed.

  38. 38.

    schrodingers_cat

    Its Diwali time guys. I brought so much food from the Indian grocery store that I ran out of room in my fridge.  Today is Dhanteras. 13th day in the month of Kartik. Think of it as Diwali eve. An auspicious time for new beginnings and to make purchases.

    Happy Dhanteras! 

    Tomorrow I will be making karanjis (empanadas with a coconut filling) and savory, chivda (trail mix with beaten rice cereal). I have also bought some traditional snacks that I don’t have the ingredients for.

    The main day of celebration this year is Thursday.

  39. 39.

    sab

    OT: I bought Fiona Hill’s book out of solidarity with an immigrant patriot, and I have found that I cannot put it down. Not what I expected at all. Fascinating. A very intelligent woman sensibly discussing things. Not a reporter holding back to surprise us. Just honest thoughtful discusion by a very bright person who cares a lot about our country.

    Also, I had no idea how hard it was for working class kids to keep their heads above water much less get ahead in the UK. I did a junior year abroad in her county when I was twenty and she was ten. There were working class kids  at the university. I was friends with some of them.  I had no idea what obstacles they had overcome to get there. Of course they wouldn’t talk about that.

  44. 44.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @sab:

    I’m very glad to see your review. I haven’t yet started Fiona Hill’s book, but it’s definitely in the “soon” layer of the TBR stack!

  52. 52.

    Elizabelle

    Dan Rather just turned 90.  Happy birthday.  He’s doing some terrific aggregating/reporting with News and Guts.  Wish him continued health and energetic journalism.

    ===

    I refuse to watch cable or TV stations.  Is there a good, nonhysterical online source of news on Virginia election results??

  53. 53.

    patrick II

    @Hildebrand: ​
     
    We have voting rights legislation coming. If Manchin was serious about his main disagreements about the current bill were economic issues he would be all-in on voting rights. My guess is that he won’t be.

  61. 61.

    gene108

    @guachi:

    In election news, polls close in VA at 7 pm. So either follow closely or avoid to keep your sanity.

    NJ polls close at 8 pm EDT. But no one’s paying attention to the NJ governor’s race.

  62. 62.

    Steeplejack

    “I’m not for any expansion that has a trust fund that is insolvent,” [Manchin] says of Medicare expansion.

    Manchin is just squirting squid ink around to block, obfuscate and delay without admitting that that is what he’s doing. Every “issue” he brings up has been on the table for months, and he’s dragging out clichés that have been around for years. “Medicare insolvent—eek!” What a maroon.

  70. 70.

    gene108

    @Baud:

    Wasn’t Fox pushing some “polls tightening” propaganda in NJ?

    Polls have been tightening.

    To what extent? IDK.

    I couldn’t find much recent polling.

  72. 72.

    zhena gogolia

    Now I have another news organization to say fuck you to. The Atlantic. Why am I giving them money?

    So where exactly does this put us in our fight against the virus? Up to now, President Joe Biden has used a throw-spaghetti-at-the-wall approach to getting the pandemic under control. The whole project has gotten a little messy. We need clearer goals as a country, my colleague Sarah Zhang argues.

    America has lost the pandemic plot. We defaulted to talking about kid vaccines because they were next on the agenda. Now “the path ahead is not just unclear; it’s nonexistent,” Sarah explains. “We are meandering around the woods because we don’t know where to go.”

    They really, truly preferred TFG. They all did.

  74. 74.

    sab

    @Steeplejack: Well maybe we could do somethimg to make it more solvent. I have never understood what is the point of depriving working age (not senior) people of adequate health care so that they can work more productively. Sure a few of them will cost us a lot, but most of them will stop limping around on that painfully bad knee and get seriously back to work.

  78. 78.

    Brachiator

    Asked Manchin about timing: “I just think it’s going to take quite a while. You’re talking about overhauling the entire tax code. That is tremendous. And there needs to be input…And we’re not in a rush right now. The rush was trying to get everything” before Biden went overseas.

    I am so tired of this fool Manchin and his false arguments. He pretends as though the Democrats are trying something that has never been done before. He ignores the goddam fact that the Republicans ripped through the tax code in secret and without consulting with moderate Republicans or any Democrat in devising the Trump tax cuts.

    Manchin has had plenty of time to provide input. But instead he simply babbles objections while throwing up obstacles.

    I don’t know. Is there any way the Democrats can get Manchin to back down?

  79. 79.

    Brachiator

    @zhena gogolia:

    So where exactly does this put us in our fight against the virus? Up to now, President Joe Biden has used a throw-spaghetti-at-the-wall approach to getting the pandemic under control. The whole project has gotten a little messy. We need clearer goals as a country, my colleague Sarah Zhang argues.

    This is truly some of the dumbest crap I have read in a long time. Who is the author? Who the hell is Sarah Zhang?

    Do they get any medical experts to give advice or is this all pundit gas?

  80. 80.

    sab

    Voted today wearing my tie-dyed purple and grey “women voter” shirt from the Post Office. I bet you didn’t know there was such a thing. It had a copy of a commemorative stamp on the front.

    The votimg was reassuringly dull. 5 names on the ballot, one muniacipal judge and four board of education candidates for four places. Everyone unopposed. The poll workers said it was surprisingly more busy than they expected, simce everyom was unopppsed. That cheers me up.

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