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You are here: Home / Politics / Biden Administration in Action / Merrick Garland + Biden Administration LIVE Events Today (Open Thread)

Merrick Garland + Biden Administration LIVE Events Today (Open Thread)

by WaterGirl|  December 21, 202112:43 pm| 302 Comments

This post is in: Biden Administration in Action, Open Threads, Politics, Talk About Whatever You Want

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There are a couple of live Biden Administration events today that might be of interest.

Jen Psaki is up first and I’m betting that she will be asked about Manchin as well as the latest of Omicron, and then President Biden will talk about Covid.  I don’t often make a post for the LIVE Covid events, but things are moving quickly with Omicron so we might get some good information.

Also, there’s an interesting article up on Lawfare today: Merrick Garland Needs to Speak Up

They posit that Merrick Garland needs to speak up, but probably not in the way that you think!

Attorney General Merrick Garland is taking a great deal of criticism these days.

He’s being attacked for not having indicted former President Trump, for not having brought cases faster against witnesses who have defied the Jan. 6 committee, and for not having moved more aggressively against political figures for their supposed involvement in the Jan. 6 insurrection.

These criticisms speak to genuine frustrations with the slow pace of department action. They are also based on two flawed assumptions.

The first is the assumption that the evidence and equities would support prosecutions and, consequently, that the absence of criminal cases reveals weakness or hypercaution on the Justice Department’s part. This may be the case—but it may not. The absence of prosecutions could also reflect inadequacies in the evidence needed to bring cases.

The second problem is the confusion of what has not happened with what has not happened yet. The Justice Department can be very busy without making a lot of noise. The fact that indictments have not materialized so far does not mean they won’t appear tomorrow—or the day after.

But nearly a year into his tenure as attorney general, though much of the criticism of Garland has been unfair or at least premature, the attorney general does have something to answer for: his relative silence.

The article goes on to talk in detail about their issue with Merrick Garland:  his relative silence.

You don’t establish norms, or reestablish them, merely by modeling them. You establish them by articulating them, by talking about them, and by convincing people that they are the right way to behave.

Levi understood this. His speeches and congressional testimonies as attorney general were numerous, highly substantive, and made arguments on behalf of the direction he wished to see the department go. They are a unique body of work among attorneys general, considered intellectually significant enough to have been collected and published as a volume by the University of Chicago Press.

Read the whole thing.  It’s a thoughtful article, not just the blah-blah-blah criticism we hear from people who want the Justice Department to move more quickly than it really can.

Their concern is that Garland doesn’t talk enough about the norms and the changes to return the DOJ to an institution with honor, an institution that is dedicated to justice for all, not dedicated to protecting your cronies or your power.

⭐️

Jen Psaki at 1 pm Eastern this afternoon:

⭐️

President Biden at 2:30 Eastern this afternoon:

Open thread.

 

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Reader Interactions

302Comments

  1. 1.

    Quencher

    December 21, 2021 at 12:53 pm

    These criticisms speak to genuine frustrations with the slow pace of department action. They are also based on two flawed assumptions.

    Remember when people patiently explained how we all just need to wait on Mueller because he was a consummate professional doing his job?

    I seem to recall reading, oh I don’t know, a few dozen right here on Balloon Juice.

    You people have learned nothing.

  2. 2.

    SiubhanDuinne

    December 21, 2021 at 12:57 pm

    Fastest I’ve ever pied anybody in my life.

  3. 3.

    Kay

    December 21, 2021 at 1:01 pm

    @Quencher:

    I just don’t think it’s coherent. If you don’t want people to be disappointed if/when there are no prosecutions, don’t tell people there will be prosecutions.

    Say “I don’t know if there will be prosecutions”, not “prosecutions take a long time”. “Prosecutions take a long time” can be true and there can also be no prosecutions.

  4. 4.

    James E Powell

    December 21, 2021 at 1:02 pm

    Agree with the authors of that article, but would add that I am confident AG Garland is doing & not doing exactly what the president wants him to do & not do.

    It may be better for the AG, for the DOJ, and for the cause of justice that he is not out in front talking a lot. It’s hard to accept silence when we want someone to articulate our positions, but we need the AG and DOJ to be free of the right-wing propaganda machine.

    Look what they’ve done to a respected doctor who is only trying to keep people healthy & alive in the face of a pandemic. Death threats and a constant attack on his credibility. It is now considered acceptable for a FOX host to urge his audience to go for a kill shot on him.

    We don’t want Garland and the DOJ to be working under those tirades. This isn’t cowardice, it’s good judgment. Let the DOJ develop the cases and let facts speak for themselves.

  5. 5.

    Gin & Tonic

    December 21, 2021 at 1:03 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne: Tell me, was “you people” the trigger?

  6. 6.

    Kay

    December 21, 2021 at 1:09 pm

    @James E Powell:

    I just think they’re wrapped around the axel on this “credibility” thing and it’s incoherent so they’re never going to resolve it. It’s bad thinking.

    If you start with the assumption that the DOJ is following the facts and the law then it matters not at all what anyone “believes” about their work. The work is the work. The thing has to speak for itself.

    What harmed their credibility? Their work. What might restore their credibility? Their work. “Credibility” is not the goal. Good work is. The credibility will follow.

  7. 7.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 1:10 pm

    @Quencher:

    Dear WaterGirl:  Did You Know That...

  8. 8.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 1:11 pm

    @Kay: I’m not sure what you’re saying.

    Do you think Garland should come out with a list of people he is attempting to prosecute?

  9. 9.

    SiubhanDuinne

    December 21, 2021 at 1:11 pm

    @Gin & Tonic:

    You know me too well.

  10. 10.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 1:13 pm

    @Gin & Tonic: One of many!

    Someone suggested the other day that he may be Amarynthe RGB, who was banned long ago.  My spelling may be off, but you will surely know which commenter I am referring to.

  11. 11.

    Jinchi

    December 21, 2021 at 1:15 pm

    @James E Powell:  It is now considered acceptable for a FOX host to urge his audience to go for a kill shot on him.

    This is not the first time Fox personalities have pushed (barely disguised) violent rhetoric against political rivals and even private citizens. And while I’d love for Fox to enforce some basic standards, the White House should establish a few of their own.

    It doesn’t seem beyond the pale to ban all members of any organization that peddles in death threats against their employees. Accepting their credentials as a news organization also normalizes this conduct.

  12. 12.

    Bard the Grim

    December 21, 2021 at 1:16 pm

    On a related note (legal proceedings that would do good, if they ever happen and anything ever comes of them), does anybody know what the status is of the various cases brought by the voting machine manufacturers against the Big Lie Liars?

  13. 13.

    SiubhanDuinne

    December 21, 2021 at 1:18 pm

    @WaterGirl:

    I think that was Goku’s suggestion. Very plausible.

  14. 14.

    Kay

    December 21, 2021 at 1:21 pm

    @WaterGirl:

    I think making assurances that there will be prosecutions is just the flip side of complaining that there have been no high level prosecutions. They’re both wrong.

    The answer to “will there be prosecutions?” is not “prosecutions take a long time” – if we don’t want people to be disappointed if there are no prosecutions then we should stop assuring them that we know. We don’t know. That’s the answer to the question.

    I think there’s an eagerness to get ahead of criticism that is counterproductive, because all it does is raise expectations. The people at Lawfare, all “elite” lawyers really and legal commentators, have to stop worrying about how things “appear” and worry more about how things ARE.

    A Supreme Court and a DOJ that run around defending their own credibility are not confident and solid institutions. They don’t have faith in their own work. The work has to speak for itself. If it doesn’t, that’s not a credibility problem, it’s a quality problem.

  15. 15.

    Caphilldcne

    December 21, 2021 at 1:25 pm

    @Quencher: you, person, are a fucking idiot. I rarely comment or block someone but your firehose of bullshit is causing me to do both in your case

  16. 16.

    Kay

    December 21, 2021 at 1:26 pm

    @WaterGirl:

    Bad work = diminished credibility. That’s the sequence. To turn that around you need good work FIRST and then credibility will follow.

    You don’t demand or wheedle or persuade on credibility- you either earn it or you don’t get it.

    I don’t know if there should be prosecutions. No one has even identified the crime to me. But I do know that continuing to tell people “prosecutions take a long time” with the implied promise that there will be some will diminish credibility. People don’t like uncertainty. The cure for that is not offering them false certainty. It won’t work.

  17. 17.

    smintheus

    December 21, 2021 at 1:27 pm

    There is no need for further evidence to prosecute Trump for some of his crimes, such as his attempt to persuade officials in Georgia to falsify the vote. Public evidence is sufficient to show he committed a crime.

    If (as Kay says) you make credibility the goal, or similarly you make it your purpose to be virtually certain of winning a conviction in court before indicting someone like Trump, then you’ve stopped doing your job. There can be an airtight case against Trump that might well fail in court with a jury having the wrong political make up. And no, that is not a reason to give Trump a pass for attempting a coup.

  18. 18.

    Ksmiami

    December 21, 2021 at 1:29 pm

    @Kay: I think Garland is just the wrong personality type for Attorney General. And we need to move quickly or look at insurrection 2 or worse.

  19. 19.

    Caphilldcne

    December 21, 2021 at 1:33 pm

    That’s kind of weird. It’s also now showing pie on my own comment response to the comment I blocked. Oh well.

    to return to the substance of this post, I completely agree with lawfare’s premise but I would say I agree with it because the utter lack of information is doing two things. It is absolutely undermining the response of people who are trying to prevent an insurrection and coup in this country (including legislative responses) and secondly because it is setting up the department for a complete lack of accountability no matter what the outcome is.

  20. 20.

    Kay

    December 21, 2021 at 1:34 pm

    @Ksmiami:

    Oh, I don’t know. I don’t even know what people want Trump charged with.

    We’ve been here before, after the financial crash. People expected prosecutions partly because people kept telling them they were getting the small fish first or cases take time to build or whatever. Then they were REALLY disappointed when it never happened.

    So I don’t know if there will be prosecutions and either do the Lawfare writers. They could just say that. That’s where credibility comes from. They say what they know and they admit when they don’t know. That’s what builds trust.

  21. 21.

    West of the Rockies

    December 21, 2021 at 1:36 pm

    The waiting, waiting, waiting gets frustrating.   Sometimes it seems something BIG has happened but nothing appears to come from it (e.g., Allen Weisselberg).  I keep thinking/hoping though that dragging the real fireworks out until closer to midterms would be very advantageous.  I suppose we’ll see…

  22. 22.

    Spanky

    December 21, 2021 at 1:36 pm

    @Ksmiami:

    And we need to move quickly

    What you mean “we”, fellow White Man?

  23. 23.

    scav

    December 21, 2021 at 1:43 pm

    I wonder! how difficult would it be to have holiday or seasonal menus of pie?  I suddenly thought how cheery it would be to have a selection of, well, candy canes, sugar plums and mince pies or King’s cakes for a bit.  Glasses of Champagne! Spritz Cookies would work too.  Butter Lambs for Easter. Just blue skying.

  24. 24.

    The Dangerman

    December 21, 2021 at 1:44 pm

    New rule: Nym starts with Q? Insta-pie. QuietPacifist? Pied. QuiescentKittens? Pied.

  25. 25.

    Chief Oshkosh

    December 21, 2021 at 1:46 pm

    @Kay: Big and bad things happened, things that should be punished. Nobody got punished. Rinse. Repeat. For decades.

    I think that this Groundhog Day aspect of our modern lives is part of what drives the frustration.

  26. 26.

    zhena gogolia

    December 21, 2021 at 1:46 pm

    MUELLER DID HIS JOB AND THE AG BARR QUASHED IT SHUT THE FUCK UP ABOUT MUELLER I READ HIS REPORT HAVE YOU

  27. 27.

    Baud

    December 21, 2021 at 1:46 pm

    @The Dangerman:

    I guess QBaud is off the table then.

  28. 28.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    December 21, 2021 at 1:48 pm

    @West of the Rockies: the news that trump is suing Letitia James to try to stop her investigation has gotten less attention from Former-US-Prosecutors than I thought it would. The timing makes me wonder if trump and his legal team got some news that hasn’t been made public.

    But in general I remain skeptical of criminal prosecutions of trump. One of the few things he’s genuinely good at is using lawyers to buy time. I think actuarial tables and McDonalds will catch up with him before any legal consequences.

    The solution to trumpism has to be political, and too many people just don’t care.

  29. 29.

    hueyplong

    December 21, 2021 at 1:48 pm

    I know someone who’s a lot more anxious during this drip drip drip delay than are posters here.

    Barr isn’t around to fire USAs, narrow inquiries or smother findings, and we can agree that Biden isn’t likely to be seriously considering a pardon.

    Any incarceration would kill Trump fairly quickly.  His daily life would be comprised of frantic attempts to obtain Adderall in any amount, and literally every conceivable charge being considered by every prosecutor implicates actual jail time.

  30. 30.

    Baud

    December 21, 2021 at 1:50 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    The solution to trumpism has to be political, and too many people just don’t care.

    Je concur.

  31. 31.

    Kelly

    December 21, 2021 at 1:50 pm

    10 day weather forecast for the Oregon Cascades starting tomorrow, Snow could be heavy heavy at times. Several FEET of new snow on my Santiam Pass. Possible Willamette Valley snow Boxing Day. Ho, Ho, Ho Merry Christmas!

  32. 32.

    hueyplong

    December 21, 2021 at 1:51 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Seems logical that Trump has received one or more target letters.

  33. 33.

    Spanky

    December 21, 2021 at 1:52 pm

    @hueyplong: It’s gonna be lit when DeSantis refuses to extradite tfg to NY for the state charges. It’ll be interesting to see how it plays out if/when Federal charges drop. What are the Secret Service responsibilities here, anyhow?

  34. 34.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    December 21, 2021 at 1:53 pm

    @Kay: I’ve often thought if I were a billionaire I would ask Preet Bharara how much I had to donate to which charities to get him to debate some Matt Stoller type who swears “the banksters” would all be in jail if PB wasn’t such a lapdog to Wall St.

  35. 35.

    Starfish

    December 21, 2021 at 1:55 pm

    @Quencher: This is *not* telling you to patiently wait. Garland is the head of the DoJ and not just running one Special Council Investigation.

    As the head of the DoJ, Garland sets the tone for how everyone below him is to behave. Would having a highly politicized DOJ serve us, or would it make people feel the way they feel about the Supreme Court?

    This “investigate faster” business is silly because the timeline for these things are often long. Garland’s job is not to save us, and we need to quit acting like it is.

  36. 36.

    Gin & Tonic

    December 21, 2021 at 1:56 pm

    I know not that many “car people” on here, but back in the spring, after I’d retired, I bought the car I’d been lusting after for some time. Yes, it’s quite late for the mid-life crisis cliche of a red sports car, but whatever – and dear wife joined in my desire for a while now. So it’s particularly gratifying to see yesterday a paean to said vehicle in the pages of venerable Road & Track.

  37. 37.

    Starfish

    December 21, 2021 at 1:57 pm

    @James E Powell:

    Agree with the authors of that article, but would add that I am confident AG Garland is doing & not doing exactly what the president wants him to do & not do.

    DoJ is supposed to be operating independently within the executive branch of government. This is not aligned to doing exactly what the President wants them to do.

  38. 38.

    Gin & Tonic

    December 21, 2021 at 1:58 pm

    @hueyplong: Trump will never see the inside of a prison cell. I’ve said that for years and I maintain that position.

  39. 39.

    Formerly disgruntled in Oregon

    December 21, 2021 at 1:58 pm

    @Kelly: Snow in Oregon? Stay off the roads!

    (Unfortunately my family will be driving from Newport to Corvallis on Boxing Day – time to get some chains for the tires…)

  40. 40.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    December 21, 2021 at 1:58 pm

    Genuine question for any lawyers or people who know: Why would a DoJ investigation have more teeth than the 1/6 Committee?

    as I recall, someone who reviewed Andrew Weisman’s book said he came as close as he legally could to publicly stating that Don Jr had taken the fifth while testifying. Couldn’t all the targets do the same with a grand jury?

  41. 41.

    hueyplong

    December 21, 2021 at 1:59 pm

    @Spanky: Fair to say that precise fact pattern hasn’t been litigated before.

    Disappointing to think of his Secret Service guard failing to play ball.  Otherwise I’d say catch him in a hotel on a tour and film his arrest.  I like to think it would look a bit like Jerry Lundegaard getting the collar at the end of Fargo.

  42. 42.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 2:00 pm

    @Kay:

    I do know that continuing to tell people “prosecutions take a long time” with the implied promise that there will be some will diminish credibility. People don’t like uncertainty. The cure for that is not offering them false certainty. It won’t work.

    The thing is, we just can’t know so by definition it is uncertain.  You can’t make something not be uncertain.  Uncertainty sucks, but there is no way to promise people that prosecutions WILL NOT happen, and there is no way to know yet that they WILL happen.

    It takes time to know whether you have a case or not.

  43. 43.

    hueyplong

    December 21, 2021 at 2:01 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: No one who’s been pardoned can take the Fifth before a grand jury.  For the rubes involved in J6 who are whining about the lack of pardons, that’s probably why.

  44. 44.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 2:01 pm

    @Caphilldcne:

    That’s kind of weird. It’s also now showing pie on my own comment response to the comment I blocked. Oh well.

    If you pie someone, all replies to that pied person are also pied.  So if you replied to a pied person, your comment will also show up as pied.  But you can toggle to see the comments, even if they are pied.

  45. 45.

    Lyrebird

    December 21, 2021 at 2:03 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    Announcer says, “and next up… it’s Subaru Diane, the southeast’s fastest pie-throwing hand!”

     

    And the crowd goes wild!

     

    Just being goofy because it’s better than giving up.

  46. 46.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 2:04 pm

    @scav:

    I wonder! how difficult would it be to have holiday or seasonal menus of pie?

    I suddenly thought how cheery it would be to have a selection of, well, candy canes, sugar plums and mince pies or King’s cakes for a bit.

    Glasses of Champagne! Spritz Cookies would work too.  Butter Lambs for Easter. Just blue skying.

    I can add images to the pie filter.  I can also remove them.  So we could indeed have some seasonal pie images!

  47. 47.

    UncleEbeneezer

    December 21, 2021 at 2:05 pm

    #SistersInLaw podcast had a discussion about this (towards the beginning) and then a specific question about it at 1:06:00.

    TLDL- This is how it’s supposed to work.

    Jill Wines Bank also noted that during Watergate they (DoJ) worked in concert with Congress to make sure that Select Committee Investigation didn’t jeopardize potential charges etc. and might be doing so now (something they obviously aren’t going to announce).

    Also I just saw this yesterday:

    BREAKING: The January 6 committee is weighing whether to pursue referral to the DOJ for criminal charges against Donald Trump, per NYtimes.

  48. 48.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 2:05 pm

    Wow, Jen Psaki’s press briefing hasn’t started and it’s now over an hour late.  I wonder if we might have some breaking news they are waiting for?

    Total speculation.

  49. 49.

    gvg

    December 21, 2021 at 2:05 pm

    @Kay: I think the work is not enough.

    There are at least 2 audiences. 1 lawyers like you. You can look at the work and say good work, the DOJ has credibility or not. Ordinary people can’t. We look and see…….well it appears this rich guy with political power tried to overthrow the government and invalidate my vote. Violently. That isn’t right or fair. The purpose of all these laws is to try to be right and fair. The country I love is supposed to be a place where the law applies to everyone. That doesn’t appear to be happening. Appearances actually matter too. If it often appears that the law isn’t working, then I would say the work actually doesn’t matter. Sometimes the law and the processes need changing. There are a lot more ordinary people like me, than lawyers.

    I don’t need to be told their might not be prosecutions. Justice that follows the facts always has built in the possibility that their might not be evidence of charges or even public perceptions might be wrong. However we saw a LOT January 6th. We have heard a lot of lies and public bullying of officials trying to follow the law. I don’t believe a DOJ where their aren’t charges. Mueller and Fitzmas are also part of perception.

    Real cases do take a long time. Saying so, isn’t wrong, but that can’t be what is said forever. It’s almost a year. They haven’t charged any big shots, only chumps.

    I am also tired of crooks blowing off Congress. I want them in jail, every time right away. That has been my opinion for more than 10 years on multiple people.

  50. 50.

    Starfish

    December 21, 2021 at 2:05 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: DoJ sends people to prison for their lawbreaking. The 1/6 Committee is finding evidence and when they have enough referring things to DoJ to actually charge the crimes.

  51. 51.

    Omnes Omnibus

    December 21, 2021 at 2:07 pm

    @Gin & Tonic:  Which did you get?

  52. 52.

    hueyplong

    December 21, 2021 at 2:07 pm

    @WaterGirl: But it’s awfully interesting speculation.

  53. 53.

    UncleEbeneezer

    December 21, 2021 at 2:08 pm

    @WaterGirl: STOP PROMISING CHARGES!! /sarcasm

  54. 54.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 2:10 pm

    @WaterGirl: Sounds like Jen is about to start.

  55. 55.

    Omnes Omnibus

    December 21, 2021 at 2:11 pm

    @Starfish: As it turns out, Biden has said that the DOJ should be independent.  As he should have.

  56. 56.

    Cameron

    December 21, 2021 at 2:14 pm

    @Lyrebird: “Great hand-pie coordination!”

  57. 57.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 2:14 pm

    @Gin & Tonic: Love that car!  Definitely has to be red.

  58. 58.

    Salty Sam

    December 21, 2021 at 2:14 pm

    @WaterGirl: I can add images to the pie filter.  I can also remove them.  So we could indeed have some seasonal pie images!

    You should load the “breathing pecan pie” from previous thread…

  59. 59.

    Starfish

    December 21, 2021 at 2:15 pm

    @gvg: The ordinary assholes involved are starting to get longer sentences. We still do not know if there is accountability for powerful people, and that makes me sad.

  60. 60.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 2:17 pm

    Holy shit, did I just hear the first question stating that Biden has Covid but he is asymptomatic?

    NO, I DID NOT. A CLOSE STAFFER HAS TESTED POSITIVE. BIDEN HAS HAD HIS TEST 3 DAYS AFTER EXPOSURE AND TOMORROW HE WILL HAVE A DAY 5 TEST AFTER EXPOSURE.

    Biden is testing NEGATIVE and he has NO SYMPTOMS.

  61. 61.

    West of the Rockies

    December 21, 2021 at 2:19 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    I don’t expect Trump to be seen in a gigantic orange jumpsuit either, but I want his younger enablers to take a fall:  Bannon, Flynn, Pompeo, Clark, etc.

    Trump himself is probably miserable.  He has no (maybe has never had–think how sad that is) truly loving relationships; he is aging and crumbling and has to know and feel it; his days are crowded by fear and humiliation and resentment (poisons all).

    He is wretched and probably knows it.

  62. 62.

    Salty Sam

    December 21, 2021 at 2:20 pm

    @gvg: The country I love is supposed to be a place where the law applies to everyone. That doesn’t appear to be happening.

    Excellent point-  during the Mueller investigation I kept repeating a mantra: “Please just make AT LEAST ONE FUCKING WEALTHY WHITE MAN face the consequences of his wrongdoing!”

    Still waiting…

  63. 63.

    Old School

    December 21, 2021 at 2:21 pm

    How do you pie someone? Not sure what the process even is.

  64. 64.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 2:23 pm

    @Old School:

    Look for this before the comments start.

    Merrick Garland + Biden Administration LIVE Events Today (Open Thread)

    Click on the little cherry pie to begin the process.  You can choose a name from a list or search for a name.  When you’re done, click X to close the box.

  65. 65.

    Kelly

    December 21, 2021 at 2:23 pm

    @Formerly disgruntled in Oregon: Oh Yeah there will be unskilled Oregon drivers crossways everywhere. However after New Years this retiree will enjoy deep snow and open roads on mid-week ski trips.

  66. 66.

    WhatsMyNym

    December 21, 2021 at 2:23 pm

    @Gin & Tonic:  Mazda, Mazda, Mazda. Miata – if you’re not to tall though. Tons of aftermarket goodies for them.

  67. 67.

    Jerzy Russian

    December 21, 2021 at 2:24 pm

    @Old School:   You should see a pie icon at the bottom of the post, just above the blue circle with the number of comments currently in the thread.  Click on that and select the names of those whom you wish to pie.

  68. 68.

    Old School

    December 21, 2021 at 2:24 pm

    @WaterGirl: Ahhh!  Seemed like it should be self-explanatory, but darn if I could figure it out.

  69. 69.

    Jerzy Russian

    December 21, 2021 at 2:26 pm

    @WaterGirl:

     

    Holy shit, did I just hear the first question stating that Biden has Covid but he is asymptomatic?

    Did you in fact hear this? I am not watching the event at the moment.

  70. 70.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 2:27 pm

    @Jerzy Russian: It certainly appears so!

    NO!

    Apparently a close staffer tested positive and Biden had been in close contact.

    The sound on the question was garbled, but Jen’s answer is that Biden is feeling well.  SO, no, Biden has not tested positive.

  71. 71.

    Gin & Tonic

    December 21, 2021 at 2:27 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus: The one I could afford.

  72. 72.

    Geminid

    December 21, 2021 at 2:28 pm

    @West of the Rockies: The Manhattan County District Attorney’s case against Trump is still active. On January 14 the Washington Post reported that accountant Donald Bender of the Mazars firm spent several hours testifying before a grand jury. Reporter David Farenthold and three other authors also wrote that former Deutche Bank official Rosemary Vrablic was interviewed by Manhattan prosecutors. “Bender and Vrablic were never Trump employees,” the authors wrote, “but they knew more about his company’s inner workings than many employees did.”

    A new District Attorney for Manhattan will be sworn in next month, but that should not alter the trajectory of this investigation.

  73. 73.

    SiubhanDuinne

    December 21, 2021 at 2:32 pm

    I’m not deaf* but I so appreciate that this White House has ASL translators for pressers, major speeches, etc.

    *Yet

  74. 74.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    December 21, 2021 at 2:32 pm

    @WaterGirl:

    The sound on the question was garbled, but Jen’s answer is that Biden is feeling well.  SO, no, Biden has not tested positive.

    Woof! that’s a relief.

  75. 75.

    NeenerNeener

    December 21, 2021 at 2:32 pm

    @Gin & Tonic: My brother-in-law had a ’96 Miata with both a hard top and soft top. He sold it this summer because he wasn’t driving  it often enough anymore to justify the space it took up in the garage. It was some special blue color that came out for just that year.

  76. 76.

    Bill Arnold

    December 21, 2021 at 2:32 pm

    @Spanky:

    It’s gonna be lit when DeSantis refuses to extradite tfg to NY for the state charges.

    That could escalate quickly.

  77. 77.

    Starfish

    December 21, 2021 at 2:32 pm

    @WaterGirl: A lot of people in various branches of government seem to have COVID in DC right now.

  78. 78.

    burnspbesq

    December 21, 2021 at 2:32 pm

    @Kay:

    The answer to “will there be prosecutions?”

    … is “sorry, but we’re prohibited by law from talking about matters that may or not be pending before a grand jury.”

  79. 79.

    zhena gogolia

    December 21, 2021 at 2:33 pm

    @WaterGirl: close contact

  80. 80.

    no comment

    December 21, 2021 at 2:34 pm

    @Jerzy Russian:

    The reporter seems to imply that POTUS had close contact with someone who tested positive. Psaki doesn’t deny this, just notes that he is asymptomatic.

  81. 81.

    mrmoshpotato

    December 21, 2021 at 2:35 pm

    @Salty Sam:

    You should load the “breathing pecan pie” from previous thread…

    Stop trying to creep me out! :)

    ETA – and you say it’s a pecan pie?  Doubly won’t look at that tweet.

  82. 82.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    December 21, 2021 at 2:35 pm

    @Starfish: I get why they don’t do it, but I’d really like to know which vaccine these prominent cases are breaking through. Whenever I hear about cases in Europe my first thought is “Shit”, my second is, “Yeah, but didn’t they all get AstraZeneca (sp?)?”

  83. 83.

    zhena gogolia

    December 21, 2021 at 2:36 pm

    @Jerzy Russian: they said close contact, not covid

  84. 84.

    Omnes Omnibus

    December 21, 2021 at 2:36 pm

    @Gin & Tonic:  All the fun of a classic British sports car but none of the electrical problems or oil leaks.

  85. 85.

    raven

    December 21, 2021 at 2:36 pm

    @Gin & Tonic: There’s a few gear heads here!

  86. 86.

    Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony

    December 21, 2021 at 2:36 pm

    @Gin & Tonic: I would settle for having the civil courts sieze his assets due to probable fraud / financial crimes.

  87. 87.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    December 21, 2021 at 2:36 pm

    Weekly World News headline for today

    “Joe Manchin sees HIS SHADOW!

    Delays Build Back Better vote for six more weeks!”

    https://www.facebook.com/weeklyworldnews/photos/a.164051496982/10160014673441983/

  88. 88.

    raven

    December 21, 2021 at 2:37 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus: I had an MGBGT for a while, what a pain in the ass.

  89. 89.

    lowtechcyclist

    December 21, 2021 at 2:37 pm

    @West of the Rockies:

    I don’t expect Trump to be seen in a gigantic orange jumpsuit either, but I want his younger enablers to take a fall:  Bannon, Flynn, Pompeo, Clark, etc.

    I want Stephen Miller to be charged with 4500 cases of child abuse on account of the child separations, and spend the rest of his life in prison.

    @Starfish:

    DoJ sends people to prison for their lawbreaking. The 1/6 Committee is finding evidence and when they have enough referring things to DoJ to actually charge the crimes.

    Shouldn’t the DoJ be doing its own investigation?

  90. 90.

    Starfish

    December 21, 2021 at 2:37 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: It’s not just which vaccine. It is also how long ago. It is also age of the recipient. It is also underlying medical conditions. There are a lot of things at play.

  91. 91.

    Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes

    December 21, 2021 at 2:37 pm

    A very real issue that I am going to articulate is this:

    Glacial Pace

    Our system is horribly non-responsive to slow rolling crises.  Adjourning hearings for weeks or months makes our system look illegitimate.  Federal judges who move with no alacrity on things of import to real people (unless it is for something near and dear to conservatives) make our system look illegitimate.  The failure of our system of justice to hold white men of stature to account for civil misdeed and criminal act make our system look illegitimate.  The fact that our media is busy looking at the plays and scoreboard as opposed to those affected by policy calls makes our system look illegitimate.

    See the pattern?

    Perhaps if our vaunted 24/7 free press were capable of asking a question that goes beyond the scoreboard and the plays that cause the score to be what it is, we could start seeing some differences.

    Better questions that go beyond platitudes and conclusory statements, such as:

    “Senator Manchin, what specific negative effects to you believe that Build Back Better threatens, and how do you think those could be mitigated?  How do you address pent up needs that those sections of BBB were designed to meet?”

    “Senator McConnell, you’ve long had as your goal the notion of Republican control of this chamber.  What priorities do you deem most important, and why?  What efforts would you make to address the needs that would be shelved by your wish list, and do you have empirical evidence to show why your method does a better job at meeting those needs? Why should your list take priority?”

  92. 92.

    Jerzy Russian

    December 21, 2021 at 2:38 pm

    @zhena gogolia:   That is good to hear.  I checked Google, but did not see any mention of this.  I would assume the President and those around him are tested frequently in order that they can head things like this off at the pass.

  93. 93.

    zhena gogolia

    December 21, 2021 at 2:38 pm

    These jerks do not remember tfg at all, do they?

  94. 94.

    Geminid

    December 21, 2021 at 2:40 pm

    @raven: I drive a Raguar.

  95. 95.

    zhena gogolia

    December 21, 2021 at 2:41 pm

    DID YOU REFLECT ON YOUR TONE/? F YOU A HOLE

  96. 96.

    Jerzy Russian

    December 21, 2021 at 2:41 pm

    @Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes:

     

    Perhaps if our vaunted 24/7 free press were capable of asking a question that goes beyond the scoreboard and the plays that cause the score to be what it is, we could start seeing some differences.

    I think my idea of having a roving band of robots that kick people who say stupid shit in the nuts is more practical and has a better chance of succeeding than having members of our press corpse ask intelligent questions.

  97. 97.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 2:41 pm

    @burnspbesq: I fixed you.  You went into moderation because your nym was only “bu”.

  98. 98.

    Quinerly

    December 21, 2021 at 2:42 pm

    @The Dangerman:

    Oh…….

  99. 99.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 2:42 pm

    @no comment: Psaki clarified at the end, so I wasn’t the only one with the question.

    Close contact.

    Still testing negative at Day 3.

    Not testing today. (apparently)

    Testing again tomorrow on Day 5.

    No Symptoms in addition to the negative test.

  100. 100.

    Starfish

    December 21, 2021 at 2:43 pm

    @zhena gogolia: There is a reason that we are not White House Press Secretary. ?

  101. 101.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 2:43 pm

    Biden up right now.

  102. 102.

    Spanky

    December 21, 2021 at 2:44 pm

    @raven: The only car I’ve ever felt claustrophobic in. Ended up buying one of my Subes that time, iirc.

  103. 103.

    Jerzy Russian

    December 21, 2021 at 2:46 pm

    @zhena gogolia:

     

    DID YOU REFLECT ON YOUR TONE

    As noted earlier, I am not watching. If this was an actual question, please tell me the President dropped his drawers and said “I have got your tone right here.”

  104. 104.

    zhena gogolia

    December 21, 2021 at 2:46 pm

    @Jerzy Russian: It was to Psaki. But yes, really he said that.

  105. 105.

    Mike in NC

    December 21, 2021 at 2:47 pm

    The Fat Orange Clown is running scared. Good. That he never pays his lawyers is the reason the RNC is paying for them.

  106. 106.

    Spanky

    December 21, 2021 at 2:48 pm

    @zhena gogolia: WTF? The literal tone police?

  107. 107.

    zhena gogolia

    December 21, 2021 at 2:48 pm

    lol TFG got his booster shot, one of the few things we agree on

  108. 108.

    zhena gogolia

    December 21, 2021 at 2:49 pm

    @Spanky: YES FUCK THEM. TYPING WITH LEFT HAND HENCE ALL CAPS

  109. 109.

    Jerzy Russian

    December 21, 2021 at 2:49 pm

    @zhena gogolia:   I take it that Psaki did not drop her drawers and respond in the  manner I suggested above?

  110. 110.

    zhena gogolia

    December 21, 2021 at 2:50 pm

    @Jerzy Russian: I regret to tell you she did not.

  111. 111.

    O. Felix Culpa

    December 21, 2021 at 2:51 pm

    It looks like raven made it into LGM (photo, not title). //

  112. 112.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 2:51 pm

    @zhena gogolia: Maybe that will ding TFG in supporter’s eyes.

  113. 113.

    The Dangerman

    December 21, 2021 at 2:53 pm

    @WhatsMyNym: One of the downsides of being 6-7. The Miata is a FUN car to drive. It corners magnificently.

    All I want for Christmas is my two front teeth, peace on Earth, and the test drive of a Nevera (I’ve never learned how to do the linky thing on my phone so happy Googling if that inspires an interest).

  114. 114.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 2:56 pm

    Biden:  “You fucking bastards who won’t get vaccinated, it doesn’t affect you alone, you are putting people at risk.  You are causing hospitals to be overrun.  Every Covid hospitalization takes a bed away from someone with a heart attack. Lies and misinformation are wrong, immoral.  Stop it now.”

    * This is a paraphrase, but except for “you fucking bastards” it’s pretty much what Biden said.

  115. 115.

    Starfish

    December 21, 2021 at 2:56 pm

    @zhena gogolia: He said that he had the booster, and he was proud of the vaccines in a talk with Bill O’Reilly. The crowd booed him. Trump was not peak wingnut. They want someone even crazier.

  116. 116.

    Chief Oshkosh

    December 21, 2021 at 2:56 pm

    @raven: I are one!

    FWIW, my 60s era American iron overall had many more electrical problems than my 60s era Little British Cars. IMO, the secret to living with and loving your LBC is to always keep in mind that it was essentially engineered and built to pre-WWII standards for farm machinery. There’s good and bad there. It’s mostly over-built and will always perform to spec if maintained to spec (and it was designed to be relatively easy to maintain). It will fail if you attempt to use it beyond spec or if you fail to maintain to spec. I cannot say this about my American cars.

    All bets are off once anti-smog devices were added, especially by the mid-70s. Some worked, some didn’t. All very necessary (or the goal was, anyway).

    As for post-midlife crises…I am holding out for changes to EV-friendly legislation (another reason to hate on Manchin), and then I’m buying…something with a battery. Who knows what will be on offer in a few years.

  117. 117.

    debbie

    December 21, 2021 at 2:56 pm

    “My God, how can you people be so stupid?”

  118. 118.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 2:57 pm

    Free at home tests starting in January.  The government will reimburse.

    More free testing sites will be set up.

    Announcing:

    1/2 billion additional at home rapid tests that can be ordered online with home delivery, starting in January.  For home delivery.

  119. 119.

    Jerzy Russian

    December 21, 2021 at 2:57 pm

    @The Dangerman:

     

    I ’ve never learned how to do the kinky thing on my phone

    I am told (I have no first-name knowledge of this) that you can use the same apps on the phone that you use on your desktop for kinky things.

  120. 120.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    December 21, 2021 at 3:01 pm

    @Starfish: Trump was not peak wingnut. They want someone even crazier.

    As people been saying for a while now; they’re addicts.

    Incidentally, someone at Daily Kos did a deep dive on Qanoon and the latest is they are claiming the Kennedy’s are the descents of Jesus Christ, so full DaVinci Code now.

  121. 121.

    Cermet

    December 21, 2021 at 3:05 pm

    Unlike the DOJ, covid has moved fast and furious – and in a sinister parallel, more often against thug voters and lower level politicians.

  122. 122.

    David ? ☘The Establishment☘? Koch

    December 21, 2021 at 3:06 pm

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques: ​
      Jesus was from Ireland?

  123. 123.

    mrmoshpotato

    December 21, 2021 at 3:07 pm

    @The Dangerman:

    (I’ve never learned how to do the linky thing on my phone so happy Googling if that inspires an interest). 

    Just couldn’t wait for Balloon Juice After Dark to let us know, eh?

  124. 124.

    Zeecube

    December 21, 2021 at 3:08 pm

    @Baud: BaudQ acceptable.

  125. 125.

    Cermet

    December 21, 2021 at 3:08 pm

    @Gin & Tonic: Which vehicle? One Japanese not outrageous to buy and one just outrageous to buy and repair

  126. 126.

    mrmoshpotato

    December 21, 2021 at 3:08 pm

    @David ? ☘The Establishment☘? Koch: Jesus O’Nazareth!

  127. 127.

    Spanky

    December 21, 2021 at 3:10 pm

    @mrmoshpotato: The Fitzjesus clan.

  128. 128.

    Brachiator

    December 21, 2021 at 3:10 pm

    @Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes:

    The failure of our system of justice to hold white men of stature to account for civil misdeed and criminal act make our system look illegitimate. The fact that our media is busy looking at the plays and scoreboard as opposed to those affected by policy calls makes our system look illegitimate.

    The system is often illegitimate. White men of stature do everything they can to cling to power.

    White men of no stature support the system because they dream of one day being white men of stature.

    The media is often the handmaiden to those in power. This is not new.

    And it is not just white men of stature. The UK and India are drifting further into authoritarianism. The Chinese leaders don’t have to pretend to care. Putin is in a class all his own.

    “Senator Manchin, what specific negative effects to you believe that Build Back Better threatens, and how do you think those could be mitigated? How do you address pent up needs that those sections of BBB were designed to meet?”

    Manchin has offered up concerns about inflation and excessive spending as his reasons for rejecting BBB. He has never offered any support for his beliefs because he knows that he doesn’t have to. He is a Senator, therefore he has power.

    Note that from the beginning Treasury Secretary Yellen and Fed Chair Powell specifically addressed these issues and rejected them as concerns. Leading economists agree. The financial markets have not reacted with alarm to the prospect of BBB being approved.

    But the stupid conventional wisdom is that we must fear inflation and spending by Democrats is inherently bad.

    Manchin appears to insulate himself from any real challenge to his assertions. There are business and finance specific news programs that clearly note that he is full of shit. But this gets lost in the noise.

    “Senator McConnell, you’ve long had as your goal the notion of Republican control of this chamber. What priorities do you deem most important, and why? What efforts would you make to address the needs that would be shelved by your wish list, and do you have empirical evidence to show why your method does a better job at meeting those needs? Why should your list take priority?”

    GOP obstructionism has been going on for so long that it is considered to be a natural phenomenon, like rain.

  129. 129.

    zhena gogolia

    December 21, 2021 at 3:11 pm

    They want him to say it’s a failure.

  130. 130.

    debbie

    December 21, 2021 at 3:11 pm

    Jesus, these questions.

  131. 131.

    zhena gogolia

    December 21, 2021 at 3:12 pm

    @debbie: I can’t deal with them.

  132. 132.

    JWR

    December 21, 2021 at 3:13 pm

    Biden: “Senator Manchin and I are gonna get something done. Thank you very much.”

  133. 133.

    Jinchi

    December 21, 2021 at 3:14 pm

    @Mike in NC: ​
      That he never pays his lawyers is the reason the RNC is paying for them.

    I never understood why anyone believed TFG was a billionaire. If he was, it wouldn’t even be worth his time to shake down the Republican party for this.

  134. 134.

    zhena gogolia

    December 21, 2021 at 3:15 pm

    @debbie: People around here have been acting as if Covid was over, no masks, going out to restaurants, now they’re panicking and it’s his fault?

  135. 135.

    mrmoshpotato

    December 21, 2021 at 3:17 pm

    @Brachiator:

    GOP obstructionism has been a goddamn, fucking pile of shit who hate most of the people of this country going on for so long that it is considered to be a natural phenomenon, like rain.

    Fixed.

  136. 136.

    debbie

    December 21, 2021 at 3:18 pm

    @WaterGirl:

    They gave out 16,000 kits in my county yesterday and ran out in less than an hour.

  137. 137.

    debbie

    December 21, 2021 at 3:18 pm

    @zhena gogolia:

    I want to cross the country and throttle each and every one of these idiots.

  138. 138.

    Jinchi

    December 21, 2021 at 3:19 pm

    @JWR: Senator Manchin and I are gonna get something done.

    Biden’s best leverage is that Manchin really wants to be seen as the great mediator. He gets his back up as soon as anyone challenges him on this. Being rebranded as a backstabber who goes back on his word is probably our best chance of him coming around on his nonsense.

  139. 139.

    cain

    December 21, 2021 at 3:19 pm

    @Kelly:

    10 day weather forecast for the Oregon Cascades starting tomorrow, Snow could be heavy heavy at times. Several FEET of new snow on my Santiam Pass. Possible Willamette Valley snow Boxing Day. Ho, Ho, Ho Merry Christmas!

    Exciting!!

    We put an offer on a house yesterday, competing against 6 other bidders. We went over 100k of the asking price and I think someone went up to 150k or something – the competition for homes here is pretty crazy.

  140. 140.

    mrmoshpotato

    December 21, 2021 at 3:19 pm

    @zhena gogolia:

    People around here have been acting as if Covid was over, no masks, going out to restaurants, now they’re panicking and it’s his fault? 

    Well, yes.  Is Biden a member of the Democratic party or the Rethuglican party? ?

  141. 141.

    cassandra

    December 21, 2021 at 3:20 pm

    These people won’t be happy until Joe announces the he and Kamala are resigning because they have failed so hard, and that his last act will be an executive order reinstating Trump as the rightful President because only he can fix it.

    Joe probably also probably needs to apologize for his tone and apologize on behalf of all liberals for their tone, and explain that liberals need to learn how to respect real Americans and have good manners before they ever are allowed to hold power again.

    At least that’s what I’m getting from the press.

  142. 142.

    debbie

    December 21, 2021 at 3:20 pm

    @zhena gogolia:

    I’ve got three different arguments going on with co-workers, but listening to those questions put me right over the edge.

  143. 143.

    Baud

    December 21, 2021 at 3:20 pm

    @Cermet:

    Unlike the DOJ, covid has moved fast and furious – and in a sinister parallel, more often against thug voters and lower level politicians.

    Attorney General Omicron has a nice ring to it.

  144. 144.

    cain

    December 21, 2021 at 3:21 pm

    @Formerly disgruntled in Oregon:

    I need to buy some chains – I actually have no idea where the chains are for my car. I used to have some.

  145. 145.

    mrmoshpotato

    December 21, 2021 at 3:21 pm

    @debbie: Aren’t you in Ohio?  Why do you have to cross the country?

  146. 146.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 3:22 pm

    @scav: Okay, I added a few seasonal images to the pie filter; I’ll see if I can make them prettier, but at least they are there.

  147. 147.

    Dorothy A. Winsor

    December 21, 2021 at 3:23 pm

    Is there any way to know if a bunch of people have pied me?

  148. 148.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 3:24 pm

    @JWR: Yeah, when I heard that I thought:

     Biden publicly called him out with the statement put out by Jen Psaki and didn’t walk it back on Sunday or Monday.

    Now the press is pushing him to call Machin a liar and more, and it looks to me like Biden is now being gracious and giving Manchin the space to walk it back.

    What was your take?

  149. 149.

    JWR

    December 21, 2021 at 3:24 pm

    I heard a news snippet yesterday that Beer Bong Brett’s got Biden’s mask mandate appeal, (for private companies w/ 100 or more employees), on his desk. Oh wait, here ’tis:

    Supreme Court receives appeals asking Kavanaugh to block large employer vaccine mandate

    (CNN) – The Supreme Court Monday said it has received several appeals asking Justice Brett Kavanaugh to consider the Biden administration’s requirement that large employers mandate their employees obtain a Covid-19 vaccine or submit to weekly testing.

  150. 150.

    Omnes Omnibus

    December 21, 2021 at 3:24 pm

    @cain: But everyone should be looking for refuge there?  Right.

  151. 151.

    Dorothy A. Winsor

    December 21, 2021 at 3:25 pm

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques: How can the Q people have TIME for all this conspiracy spinning? It must be their full time job.

  152. 152.

    p.a.

    December 21, 2021 at 3:28 pm

    @David ? ☘The Establishment☘? Koch:

    We know Jesus was Italian because his mom thought he was god.

  153. 153.

    Mallard Filmore

    December 21, 2021 at 3:28 pm

    @WaterGirl: 

    Do you think Garland should come out with a list of people he is attempting to prosecute?

    I think Garland should make a statement that NOBODY is off the list for prosecutions.

    But then, I am nobody, Zero The Hero.

  154. 154.

    Spanky

    December 21, 2021 at 3:28 pm

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: Why not? Balloon Juice is (some of) our full time job.

  155. 155.

    JWR

    December 21, 2021 at 3:29 pm

    @WaterGirl: I like your take: “Biden is now being gracious and giving Manchin the space to walk it back.” I’m keeping my fingers crossed for a series of smaller bills that add up to more than what was in the BBBA.

  156. 156.

    Cacti

    December 21, 2021 at 3:29 pm

    Here is the reality:

    It’s been 11 months since a group of Republican officials set a mob on the Capitol to try and overthrow a Presidential election.

    Thus far, zero of the principals have even been charged with a crime.

    Garland has done nothing to date to make me think he is the right man at the right moment for holding anyone accountable for the above.

  157. 157.

    Omnes Omnibus

    December 21, 2021 at 3:29 pm

    @WaterGirl: Yes, he let Psaki say the harsh things.  Manchin blamed staff.  Now Joe offers him a chance to live up to his word.  It’s frustrating to watch but it’s all stages in a long, slow process.

  158. 158.

    Baud

    December 21, 2021 at 3:29 pm

    @Spanky: And John Cole is a direct heir to Jesus Christ.

  159. 159.

    Spanky

    December 21, 2021 at 3:31 pm

    @Cacti:

    It’s been 11 months since a group of Republican officials set a mob on the Capitol

    Prove it.

  160. 160.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 3:31 pm

    @JWR: Except that a series of smaller bills will each have to get 60 votes.  Not likely to happen.

  161. 161.

    Geminid

    December 21, 2021 at 3:31 pm

    @Jinchi: I expect people will also tell Manchin, “You wouldn’t want to prove AOC right, would you?”

  162. 162.

    OldDave

    December 21, 2021 at 3:32 pm

    @Gin & Tonic: It appears you have picked up a Miata.  Excellent choice (I’ve owned three over an 18 year span – a red 1991 NA, a blue 2001 NB, and a silver 2009 NC).  I’ve since moved onto a more (fill in the blank) Porsche Cayman, but the Mazda roadsters are excellent.  Enjoy!

  163. 163.

    Baud

    December 21, 2021 at 3:32 pm

    @WaterGirl:

    Now the press is pushing him to call Machin a liar and more,

    Joe shouldn’t take the bait.  He should call Manchin a goatfucker.

  164. 164.

    Brachiator

    December 21, 2021 at 3:33 pm

    @zhena gogolia:

    People around here have been acting as if Covid was over, no masks, going out to restaurants, now they’re panicking and it’s his fault?

    The news reporter on a morning talk radio show mentioned recently going to a restaurant in San Bernardino, California.The sign on the door mentioned wearing masks, and she complied, but saw that no one inside, not even the serving staff, wore masks.

    But there will be some idiots who complain that Biden did not snap his fingers and immediately end the pandemic.

  165. 165.

    Alce_e_ardillo

    December 21, 2021 at 3:33 pm

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: Why would we pie you?

  166. 166.

    hueyplong

    December 21, 2021 at 3:33 pm

    I really hated how Nixon got away with Watergate because nothing had happened to any big wigs 11 months after the break-in crew got caught.

  167. 167.

    sab

    December 21, 2021 at 3:33 pm

    @Gin & Tonic: It helps when they are first, because the pie filter is so close.

  168. 168.

    Omnes Omnibus

    December 21, 2021 at 3:33 pm

    @Cacti: Would anyone short of Vyshinsky be acceptable to you?

  169. 169.

    dopey-o

    December 21, 2021 at 3:34 pm

    @cassandra:

    Joe probably also probably needs to apologize for his tone and apologize on behalf of all liberals for their tone, and explain that liberals need to learn how to respect real Legacy Americans

  170. 170.

    Cacti

    December 21, 2021 at 3:35 pm

    @Spanky: That would be the DOJs job.

    So far:

    Zero arrests, zero indictments, zero charges, zero convictions, other than the mob peons.

  171. 171.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 3:35 pm

    Random question.

    Does the new category Talk About Whatever You Want help make it more clear that you are not limited to whatever topic is in the OP?

  172. 172.

    Starfish

    December 21, 2021 at 3:35 pm

    @Baud: Half the Senate probably had relations with goats as part of a fraternity pledge.

  173. 173.

    Baud

    December 21, 2021 at 3:36 pm

    @WaterGirl: As opposed to “Open Thread” in the title?

  174. 174.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    December 21, 2021 at 3:36 pm

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: I cannot imagine a less likely pie candidate

  175. 175.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 3:37 pm

    @sab: laughing.

    How lazy does a person have to be to be unwilling to slide the cursor up to where the pie filter is, because they are too far down the thread?

  176. 176.

    David ? ☘The Establishment☘? Koch

    December 21, 2021 at 3:37 pm

    Does anyone know when Biden’s puppy will be holding his first press conference?

  177. 177.

    Omnes Omnibus

    December 21, 2021 at 3:37 pm

    @Starfish: They can’t all be Phi Delts.

  178. 178.

    Baud

    December 21, 2021 at 3:37 pm

    @WaterGirl:

    Baud-level lazy!

  179. 179.

    Cacti

    December 21, 2021 at 3:38 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus: AG Garland has definitely made the little people pay for what happened.

    People in his own class, not so much.

  180. 180.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 3:38 pm

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: The only way to know if you have been pied is to be working at the PIE-ing person’s device and seeing if you are on their list.

    Or they could share their screen with you, but I would personally be very unlikely to share my screen with someone I had pied.

    Repeat for every commenter on Balloon Juice.

    No, make that every reader, because lurkers can pie people also.

  181. 181.

    M31

    December 21, 2021 at 3:39 pm

    Waiting for the statement from Biden’s puppy that yes, he bit Joe Manchin in the balls and by god he’d do it again.

  182. 182.

    Omnes Omnibus

    December 21, 2021 at 3:39 pm

    @Baud: There was sturm und drang about this a little while ago.

  183. 183.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 3:40 pm

    @M31: That was good for a hearty (literal) laugh out loud.

  184. 184.

    lowtechcyclist

    December 21, 2021 at 3:40 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus:  All the fun of a classic British sports car but none of the electrical problems or oil leaks.

    When I was a kid ~60 years ago, my dad had a thing for British small cars. (Very atypical of him – other than that, he didn’t have an Anglophile bone in his body.)  For awhile, he had a Morris Minor, then he got a Triumph TR4.  I remember both had their share of problems.  Eventually my older sister, who later became a civil engineer, took over the TR4 and learned all about auto mechanics by trying to keep it running.

    Me, I just want a car to be dependable transportation, so my wife and I are Honda people.  Accords and Civics.

  185. 185.

    germy

    December 21, 2021 at 3:41 pm

    When we getting that White House cat?

    pic.twitter.com/t7YyGNEz4E

    — No Contexts Cats (@nocontextscats) December 7, 2021

  186. 186.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 3:42 pm

    @Baud: I do it in addition to Open Thread now because even with Open threads people still seem to only talk about whatever starter thing the front pager puts up in the OP.

  187. 187.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 3:43 pm

    @Baud: Wow, that bad? :-)

  188. 188.

    Kay

    December 21, 2021 at 3:43 pm

    @gvg:

    I think that’s completely valid and understandable. But the writers at Lawfare are lawyers and if they really believe that making statements about credibility restored credibility after Watergate, I think they’re wrong- way off track.

    What restored credibility after Watergate is people were held accountable and some of them went to prison. It was the work, not talking about the work, that did it.

    More than that happened after Watergate, actually. I took a course on “sunshine laws” once and Watergate inspired a whole slew of them. There was a recognition that public trust had been breached and one of the responses to that was increased transparency- “good government”, not speeches about how revered our instutions are. They did the work.

    You can’t cajole or bully or scold people into trust. You have to earn it and when you get it and piss it away you have to earn it back.

  189. 189.

    lowtechcyclist

    December 21, 2021 at 3:43 pm

    @JWR:

    I heard a news snippet yesterday that Beer Bong Brett’s got Biden’s mask mandate appeal, (for private companies w/ 100 or more employees), on his desk. Oh wait, here ’tis:

    We’ll get to check out the big brain on Brett.

  190. 190.

    WhatsMyNym

    December 21, 2021 at 3:44 pm

    I’m still tired from my booster shot on Saturday and the arm is sore (though I was sleeping on it most of night).

  191. 191.

    Baud

    December 21, 2021 at 3:44 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    We need more sturm und drang threads.

     

    @WaterGirl: Do people read the tags?  I almost never do.

  192. 192.

    JWR

    December 21, 2021 at 3:48 pm

    @Cacti:

    Garland has done nothing to date to make me think he is the right man at the right moment for holding anyone accountable for the above.

    I’ve been wondering a lot about this, that either Garland was chosen for his ability to get big things done, or was just a great big F.U. to McConnell for refusing him a hearing. Not very “Biden”, I know, but I’ll wait for what comes out of next years televised January 6 hearings to get a better idea of where this is all going.

  193. 193.

    scav

    December 21, 2021 at 3:48 pm

    @WaterGirl: Yoikes!  An entirely unexpected — entirely undeserved — Solstice treat!  I may need to pie random oeople justmto see them.  I really was just blue skying . . . Thanks!

     

    ETA The snowman cookie!  The Joy one really makes me fall over laughing though.

  194. 194.

    WhatsMyNym

    December 21, 2021 at 3:48 pm

    @WaterGirl: How lazy does a person have to be to be unwilling to slide the cursor up to where the pie filter is, because they are too far down the thread?

    Is that a trick question?

  195. 195.

    zhena gogolia

    December 21, 2021 at 3:48 pm

    @Spanky: inorite?

  196. 196.

    Spanky

    December 21, 2021 at 3:49 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: She knows what she did.

  197. 197.

    Cacti

    December 21, 2021 at 3:49 pm

    @Kay: I don’t think credibility was ever fully restored after Watergate.

    Rather, Ford set the precedent that if you’re at the top, criminal law should not apply to you, even if you’re factually guilty.

  198. 198.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 3:49 pm

    @Baud: I’m not sure.  Probably some do and some don’t.

    But I found that even if Open Thread was in the title, and even if I wrote “Open thread” or “Totally open thread” as the last thing in the post itself, people would still mostly just talk about whatever starter thing was in the OP.  And some people were still complaining that there aren’t enough threads that aren’t “siloed”.

    So rather than throw up my hands, I added the Talk About Whatever You Want category.

    Ever hopeful, WG  (or possibly foolish, or stupid, or foolishly stupid)

  199. 199.

    Spanky

    December 21, 2021 at 3:50 pm

    @WaterGirl: Except from Steep, who winced and scrolled on.

  200. 200.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 3:50 pm

    @scav: I like the JOY cookie, myself.

  201. 201.

    Omnes Omnibus

    December 21, 2021 at 3:50 pm

    @Spanky: He doesn’t have to.   Garland does.

    ETA:  Cacti’s gig is easy.  Garland’s isn’t.

  202. 202.

    zhena gogolia

    December 21, 2021 at 3:50 pm

    @Brachiator: Fine as long as those idiots aren’t national news reporters

  203. 203.

    Alce_e_ardillo

    December 21, 2021 at 3:51 pm

    @David ? ☘The Establishment☘? Koch: More to the point, when will the media demand he be put down because he looked sideways at them?

  204. 204.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 3:51 pm

    @Spanky:  Dear Steep, sorry I laughed at that.  WG

  205. 205.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    December 21, 2021 at 3:51 pm

    @zhena gogolia: I’ve been biting virtual tongue a couple of times in this thread to not point out that the DoJ doesn’t “send people to jail”, they bring people to trial. And IANAL but I think there are a couple of judicial hurdles to clear before “Oyez! Oyez!”

    and thanks in no small part to certain… reasons…   some of those judges are distinctly trumpy

  206. 206.

    scav

    December 21, 2021 at 3:52 pm

    @WaterGirl: Were on the same page.  Or is it wavelength?

  207. 207.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 3:52 pm

    @Baud: And make him deny it!

  208. 208.

    Baud

    December 21, 2021 at 3:53 pm

    @WaterGirl: Maybe you should ban people from talking about the topic in the OP.

  209. 209.

    mrmoshpotato

    December 21, 2021 at 3:53 pm

    @WaterGirl: Completely on topic, here’s an unstuffed shells recipe that makes me go mmmmmm. :)

    Instant Pot Unstuffed Shells

  210. 210.

    lowtechcyclist

    December 21, 2021 at 3:54 pm

    @Kay:

    What restored credibility after Watergate is people were held accountable and some of them went to prison. It was the work, not talking about the work, that did it.

    But it helped at the time that you could see progress being made.  The Special Prosecutor’s office was formed in, what, April 1973? And by October, Nixon (well, technically Robert Bork) fired Archie Cox* for going to court to get that first batch of nine Watergate tapes.  By the end of February 1974, they’d indicted Haldeman, Ehrlichman, Mitchell, and four others, and named Nixon as an unindicted co-conspirator, and handed off a package of evidence to the House Judiciary Committee which was working on impeachment.

    And this was done with an operation pulled together from scratch, bureaucratically outside the regular DoJ, a disadvantage that no investigation happening under Garland has to deal with.

    * Was “Impeach the Cox Sacker” the best political bumper sticker ever, or what?

  211. 211.

    zhena gogolia

    December 21, 2021 at 3:54 pm

    @JWR: Have you heard of a little thing that happened in OK City? At the federal building?

  212. 212.

    Kay

    December 21, 2021 at 3:56 pm

    @Cacti:

    Oh, I don’t know. I’m kind of a sucker for rehabilitation.

    If you ask me Bush v Gore started the current credibility slide and it’s been tanking since. But, some mistakes can’t be corrected so you move on, but it takes a toll.

    If you think about it in your own life credibility is cumulative- you’ll trust a person and ignore a lot and then there’ll be one straw too many and you flip on a dime. It wasn’t “on a dime”. It accrued.

    What kills me is the kind of cavalier and entitled approach to it. The public handed them this absolute gift that someone prior to them earned! It wasn’t even theirs to piss away! To not recognize the value of that? Mindblowing. The whole thing basically runs on trust and consent and norms. You just burn thru them, well, reap the whirlwind. It will be hard as nails to get them back.

  213. 213.

    zhena gogolia

    December 21, 2021 at 3:56 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: As OO points out, they want the Cheka.

  214. 214.

    Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony

    December 21, 2021 at 3:56 pm

    @WaterGirl: So a wide open thread vs a semi-open vs a barely cracked open thread?

  215. 215.

    Cacti

    December 21, 2021 at 3:56 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus: If he hasn’t charged anyone a year from now, will you still be here making the same excuses?

    Magic 8 ball:  “Signs point to Yes”

  216. 216.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    December 21, 2021 at 3:59 pm

    @zhena gogolia: ah, that went over my head. I was thinking of Star Chambers and lettres de cachet, or just that short fat king from teh old cartoons whose brandishes his scepter and bellows “Seize him!”

  217. 217.

    Chris T.

    December 21, 2021 at 4:00 pm

    @Baud: BaQud perhaps?

  218. 218.

    Subsole

    December 21, 2021 at 4:01 pm

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques:

    “Wait. Let me get this straight. Silent Bob is an Instrument of God, and Kennedy…is… part black???”

  219. 219.

    Omnes Omnibus

    December 21, 2021 at 4:01 pm

    @Cacti: That’s like your opinion, man.

  220. 220.

    Subsole

    December 21, 2021 at 4:03 pm

    @Starfish:

    “Bonesmen. All in.”

  221. 221.

    Kay

    December 21, 2021 at 4:03 pm

    @Cacti:

    What I object to, and I won’t put this on the “public”, I have no idea if they object to it, is the disparity.

    You cannot have a functioning, credible justice system that sends the rioters to prison for 4 years and does nothing to the powerful people who either planned it or assisted in it. That’s not a tenable situation.

    My loss of trust is directly related to watching pathetic meth addicts shuffling through the courthouse in their plastic sandals, off to years in prison, and looking at the outrageously corrupt sweetheart deal that Epstein got in the federal prosecution. Or the Sacklers. And on and on, over and over. I want powerful people to face the same brutal US justice system that people who aren’t powerful get. That would be credible.

  222. 222.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    December 21, 2021 at 4:05 pm

    Brandy Zadrozny @BrandyZadrozny

    Some kid just asked Seb Gorka at what point they should use the 2nd Amendment as it was intended—to overthrow a tyrannical government. This is the second time in a week I’ve seen someone ask about shooting at a TPUSA mic

    The Dragon of Budapest says, “not yet”

  223. 223.

    Subsole

    December 21, 2021 at 4:06 pm

     

     

    @scav: Pagelength.

    Nono don’t get up, I was just on the way out.

  224. 224.

    Chris T.

    December 21, 2021 at 4:06 pm

    @Gin & Tonic: Mmph, but did you get the Miata, or the Boxster?

    (I’d rather have the Porsche but I’d rather pay for the Miata…)

  225. 225.

    Dorothy A. Winsor

    December 21, 2021 at 4:06 pm

    @Alce_e_ardillo: I think I won’t point out why you would pie me. :-)

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Thank you. That’s reassuring

    @WaterGirl: That’s a good point. People need to be able to pie someone without anticipating any payback. It’s a quiet action, which is what it should be.

  226. 226.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 4:06 pm

    @Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony: something like that, hard-boiled, soft-boiled, over easy.

  227. 227.

    mrmoshpotato

    December 21, 2021 at 4:07 pm

    Kellogg’s Strike Ends: BCTGM Members Ratify New Contract

  228. 228.

    Dorothy A. Winsor

    December 21, 2021 at 4:07 pm

    @Kay: Amen

  229. 229.

    Subsole

    December 21, 2021 at 4:08 pm

    @zhena gogolia: Only if it’s a Chubby Cheka.

    Okay, okay, I really am going this time.

  230. 230.

    Kristine

    December 21, 2021 at 4:09 pm

    @Spanky:

    It’s gonna be lit when DeSantis refuses to extradite tfg to NY for the state charges.

    Wasn’t it discussed here that this was the reason tfg left NY for Florida?

  231. 231.

    debbie

    December 21, 2021 at 4:09 pm

    @mrmoshpotato:

    Because the idiots are in every state in the country.

  232. 232.

    Kay

    December 21, 2021 at 4:10 pm

    Michael Stratford
    @mstratford
    · 2h
    NEWS: Biden admin is considering extension of student loan relief amid omicron surge & pressure from Dems.
    @usedgov says it may postpone plan to restart monthly payments Feb 1:
    “Later this week, we will be announcing whether to extend the pause further”

    Told ya :)

    Biden’s biggest drop in polling is not with middle aged or older people or the much-discussed anti-CRT suburbanites. It’s with people under 30. He’s dropped 50 in net favorability with that group. They have to worry about that.

  233. 233.

    mrmoshpotato

    December 21, 2021 at 4:11 pm

    @debbie: Oh.  Not limiting yourself to the DC Press Corpse.  I admire your ambition.

    ETA – will you call it Throttlepalooza?

  234. 234.

    debbie

    December 21, 2021 at 4:11 pm

    @WaterGirl:

    LOL, if people don’t notice “Open Thread,” why would they notice anything that’s in that “This post is in” line up top?

  235. 235.

    A Good Woman

    December 21, 2021 at 4:12 pm

    @Gin & Tonic: yeah baby! My RF may not have the soft top, but oh boy is it fun. Temps @50F and no precip — top down weather for moi!

  236. 236.

    germy

    December 21, 2021 at 4:12 pm

    @Kay:  That’s not a tenable situation.

    I agree. What gives me hope is that phone records are being examined.  People like Jim Jordan and Gozar and Boebert seem nervous.

    I’m hopeful punishments will continue up the food chain.

  237. 237.

    Baud

    December 21, 2021 at 4:13 pm

    @Kay: I expected some action too.

  238. 238.

    James E Powell

    December 21, 2021 at 4:14 pm

    @Starfish:

    DoJ is supposed to be operating independently within the executive branch of government. This is not aligned to doing exactly what the President wants them to do.

    You are correct and I agree. My wording was bad. What I mean is that when President Biden chose Merrick Garland he did so because he knew he would run DOJ in this manner and that is why he chose him.

    I realize that he hasn’t been in office for a full year and I don’t want to jinx it, but apart from Neera Tanden, two asshole senators, and a couple of insignificant “conservative” house members, President Biden really looks like he knows what he is doing and he has a handle on things.

  239. 239.

    opiejeanne

    December 21, 2021 at 4:14 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Yes, can’t believe anyone would pie Dorothy Winsor. Me, on the other hand, probably half of the jackals are admiring a pretty dessert where this post is.

  240. 240.

    Kay

    December 21, 2021 at 4:16 pm

    @Dorothy A. Winsor:

    It’s really fundamental to me. It’s not fair. I don’t expect markets to be fair or relationships to be fair or abilities to be fair but I do expect the US justice system to at least attempt to be fair, because if not that and them, then who and what?

    I don’t want to read about justice department lawyers meeting with Epstein’s 600 dollar an hour lawyers  in hotel conference rooms and kissing Ken Starr’s ass any more. I want that to stop. Do the job or leave it and go to the private sector. Those are prestigious jobs. We’ll find a replacement.

  241. 241.

    James E Powell

    December 21, 2021 at 4:17 pm

    @p.a.:

    I’ve heard several similar jokes with various ethnicities attached.

  242. 242.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    December 21, 2021 at 4:23 pm

    @opiejeanne: Pie is in your nym.

  243. 243.

    SiubhanDuinne

    December 21, 2021 at 4:24 pm

    @WaterGirl:

    The “JOY” cookie has shown up on one or two decidedly joyless commenters.

  244. 244.

    cain

    December 21, 2021 at 4:24 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    I hope not – we got enough people here in the metro area. I’d move to another county but the wife is a school teacher and needs to be within 20 minutes to any school in her school district. :/

  245. 245.

    Baud

    December 21, 2021 at 4:24 pm

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: Haha.

  246. 246.

    Omnes Omnibus

    December 21, 2021 at 4:25 pm

    Sorry that this is long, but just got this as an email.  We helped pay for this.

    I don’t think I have formally introduced myself. My name is Alejandra and I am the Development Director of Voces de la Frontera. I am reaching out because I want to tell you a little about myself and why I am also a proud Voces de la Frontera Sustaining Member. 

     

    I immigrated to the United States with my family at the age of 5 and lived most of my life as an undocumented immigrant. In the time my family and I have lived in Wisconsin, Voces de la Frontera was a vital resource for us. They taught us our rights, helped my little brother register to vote when he turned 18, and when the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA) was signed into action, they referred me to trusted attorneys so that I could benefit and be protected. While DACA does not provide a pathway to citizenship, it has opened so many doors for me. I was able to get a drivers license, go back to school to obtain my bachelors degree, and start my professional career.

     

    DACA would have never happened if it wasn’t for organizations like Voces de la Frontera, which is why I committed to becoming a part of the movement to ensure that a pathway to citizenship to all is available. I promised myself that I would do what I can to make sure other children don’t have to live with the fear and anxiety I did growing up.

     

    By becoming a sustaining member, my recurring contribution is providing Voces de la Frontera with unrestricted funds so that they can continue to not just provide services to the immigrant community but to also organize for our rights.

     

    When you give at least $21 a month or $250 a year, your name or the name of a loved one will be featured on a tile in a mosaic mural that will be featured on the inside of our new building. I will be honoring my abuelita, whose sacrifices made it possible for my family and I to come to the United States.

     

    I hope that you can join me and you become a sustaining member today. 

     

    In solidarity,

    Alejandra Gonzalez
    Development Director

     

    No creo que me haya presentado formalmente. Mi nombre es Alejandra y soy la Directora de Desarrollo de Voces de la Frontera. Me acerco porque quiero contarles un poco sobre mí y por qué también soy un orgulloso Miembro Sustentador de Voces de la Frontera.

     

    Emigré a los Estados Unidos con mi familia a la edad de 5 años y viví la mayor parte de mi vida como un inmigrante indocumentado. En el tiempo que mi familia y yo vivimos en Wisconsin, Voces de la Frontera fue un recurso vital para nosotros. Nos enseñaron nuestros derechos, ayudaron a mi hermano pequeño a registrarse para votar cuando cumplió 18 años, y cuando se firmó la Acción Diferida para los Llegados en la Infancia (DACA), me remitieron a abogados de confianza para que pudiera beneficiarme y estar protegida. Si bien DACA no proporciona un camino hacia la ciudadanía, me ha abierto muchas puertas. Pude obtener una licencia de conducir, volver a la escuela para obtener mi licenciatura y comenzar mi carrera profesional.

     

    DACA nunca hubiera existido si no hubiera sido por organizaciones como Voces de la Frontera, por eso me comprometí a formar parte del movimiento para asegurar que un camino hacia la ciudadanía para todos esté disponible. Me prometí a mí mismo que haría todo lo que pudiera para asegurarme de que otros niños no tuvieran que vivir con el miedo y la ansiedad que yo tenía cuando era niño.

     

    By becoming a sustaining member, my recurring contribution is providing Voces de la Frontera with unrestricted funds so that they can continue to not just provide services to the immigrant community but to also organize for our rights.

     

    Cuando donas al menos $ 21 al mes o $ 250 al año, tu nombre o el nombre de un ser querido aparecerá en un mosaico en un mural de mosaico que se exhibirá en el interior de nuestro nuevo edificio. Honraré a mi abuelita, cuyos sacrificios hicieron posible que mi familia y yo fuéramos a los Estados Unidos.

     

    Espero que pueda unirse a mí y convertirse hoy en un miembro sustentador.

  247. 247.

    cain

    December 21, 2021 at 4:26 pm

    @OldDave: ​
     
    My brother got an excellent deal on a Audi TT convertible. I was kind of jealous as at one time I wanted to get one. I think he got it like less than 10k.

  248. 248.

    cain

    December 21, 2021 at 4:26 pm

    @Baud:
    You know it’s a lie, he fucks more than goats.

  249. 249.

    Geminid

    December 21, 2021 at 4:28 pm

    @Kay: I was interested to see Cheryl Rofer suggest a list of actions for President Biden to announce in this speech, and one was cancelling student debt. I don’t think I would neccesarily go that far, but I have to say that Ms. Rofer is a very levelheaded, practical woman.

    There sure has been a war on Twitter over this issue! Some of the vehemence of the opposition may be due to a more general animus towards the most vocal proponents of debt cancellation.

  250. 250.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 4:29 pm

    @debbie: You make an excellent point.

  251. 251.

    There go two miscreants

    December 21, 2021 at 4:30 pm

    @Gin & Tonic: I had two Miatas in succession; enjoyed them for 20 years between the two. Unfortunately I totaled the second one a couple of years ago (walked away without a scratch though). By then I had mostly stopped driving around for the heck of it, even in warm weather, but they were fun! Before those I drove FIAT 124 Spyders — the difference in reliability was pretty striking!

  252. 252.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 4:30 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne: Does that make it bad, or perfect?

  253. 253.

    What Have The Romans Ever Done for Us?

    December 21, 2021 at 4:32 pm

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques: This could work to our advantage – maybe one of the Kennedys should declare himself (it has to be a him, right? because the Q folks aren’t going to buy a femme Jesus) to be God-Emperor of QAnon and then he can command them to leave crazypantstown for something resembling sanityville.

  254. 254.

    Baud

    December 21, 2021 at 4:33 pm

    @Geminid:

    and one was cancelling student debt. I don’t think I would neccesarily go that far,

    I don’t think Biden will cancel all student debt, and I’m concerned that, as a result, he won’t get credit for canceling any student debt.  It’s a problem for another day, however.

  255. 255.

    SiubhanDuinne

    December 21, 2021 at 4:34 pm

    @WaterGirl:

    Perfectly ironic.

  256. 256.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 4:34 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus: Thanks for that.

    Never mind, that was a totally different position!

    FYI: Earlier this week I asked Voces to come and talk with us in 3 or 4 weeks so they can fill us in on what they are able to do with this position, and what they are up to.

  257. 257.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 4:36 pm

    @cain: Maybe some of those junkies that he thinks would buy drugs instead of using their childcare money for childcare?

  258. 258.

    Brachiator

    December 21, 2021 at 4:36 pm

    @Kay:

    Why have the young turned on him? Many told YouGov that their biggest concerns were climate change and health care. Here the president has promised much but so far delivered little. Younger Americans also care more about civil rights and abortion​​—and may be energised by recent Supreme Court rulings on the latter. Others are angry about student-loan debt and Mr Biden’s unfulfilled promise to cancel at least $10,000 owed by every borrower.

    I don’t see younger voters jumping to the GOP if these are their issues. They might also consider sending a few angry letters to Manchin.

  259. 259.

    mrmoshpotato

    December 21, 2021 at 4:36 pm

    @cain: Removing the comma splice, and nominating this.

  260. 260.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    December 21, 2021 at 4:38 pm

    @Baud: I don’t know the counter-argument, but if Biden has the latitude the Cancellers say he does, interest rates would, I think, be a better place to start than cancellation. I heard a story on NPR this morning about a guy paying 8%. That’s ridiculous these days.

  261. 261.

    Baud

    December 21, 2021 at 4:41 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: That makes sense.  Current federal student loan interest rates are much lower.

    Federal Interest Rates and Fees | Federal Student Aid

  262. 262.

    Chief Oshkosh

    December 21, 2021 at 4:41 pm

    @M31:

    Waiting for the statement from Biden’s puppy that yes, he bit Joe Manchin in the balls and by god he’d do it again.

    That’s objectively a lie. Everyone knows that Manchin’s balls are in a jar on the desk of Exxon’s CEO. And Commander is not allowed into that office.

  263. 263.

    JWR

    December 21, 2021 at 4:41 pm

    @zhena gogolia:

    Have you heard of a little thing that happened in OK City?

    Oh yeah, I’m very aware of his past good works, but to be clear, I’m not at the point of bagging on Garland because TFG isn’t in jail yet. Not at all. But I’m also hoping he starts hauling perps before grand juries, and there’s still time for that.

  264. 264.

    Geminid

    December 21, 2021 at 4:44 pm

    @Baud: I distrust some of the people on the left who are most vociferous about cancelling debt. I think they are cynical, and care about this question mainly as a wedge issue to peel away support from the Democratic party. If Joe Biden cancelled all student debt tomorrow, these people would shift to another wedge issue the day after. I try not to let my animus towards these folks determine my views on the matter, but I have to say it conditions them.

  265. 265.

    Baud

    December 21, 2021 at 4:49 pm

    @Geminid:

    There are bad faith actors. I just think they’ll have some influence with young voters if any cancelation isn’t close to 100%, which limits or eliminates the political upside. We keep seeing the same pattern over and over again which all sorts of actions which are considered “half measures.”

  266. 266.

    debbie

    December 21, 2021 at 4:50 pm

    @Baud:

    And also figure out a way to forgive the excess interest already paid.

  267. 267.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    December 21, 2021 at 4:55 pm

    @Baud: yup, that kind of sloganeering is dangerous, especially since so many people, on a gut level, can’t, or won’t, understand how politics and policy actually work in this country

    I like to listen to Molly Jong-Fast’s podcast because she gets good guests, especially on Covid, but it is astounding to me how much of a Green Lanternist she is. Today she and her new partner– a recovering Fox News Libertarian whose name escapes me– were arguing that Pelosi needs to go because reasons, and Senate Democrats should just fire the parliamentarian, which will somehow obviate the need to count to 50 (or 60). She was recently hired away from the Daily Beast to The Atlantic, which I think in Village terms you have to consider a significant promotion.

  268. 268.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    December 21, 2021 at 4:57 pm

    @Geminid: yep, people should remember that most of the leading sloganeers thought Bernie Sanders should have been our nominee in 2020, and the one who didn’t thought Bernie was a great role model as a candidate

  269. 269.

    montanareddog

    December 21, 2021 at 4:58 pm

    @David ? ☘The Establishment☘? Koch:

    @p.a.:

    Jesus was from Ireland?

    We know Jesus was Italian because his mom thought he was god.

    If he was Irish, or Italian, (or even Jewish as some tinfoil hat types maintain), how come his parents gave him a Spanish name?

  270. 270.

    StringOnAStick

    December 21, 2021 at 5:00 pm

    @Kelly: Potato Hill was good last Friday but a little thin to be safe for downhill.  We skinned up Hoodoo from Monday through Thursday since they weren’t open yet; Tuesday was a fabulous powder day, one of the top 3 I’ve had here.  My husband says our new job is to ski every day that the conditions say to, so that’s the plan, starting first thing tomorrow!

  271. 271.

    Old School

    December 21, 2021 at 5:05 pm

    @WaterGirl:

    I would say that we did more than help pay for this.  That position was not in the plans until I asked what their biggest need was that they were currently unable to meet.

    Although to be picky, we helped fund a field organizer position.  Not a development director.

  272. 272.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 5:13 pm

    @Old School: You are so right!  I got that totally wrong.  !!!

    That was from Alejandra who was here to talk with us earlier this year.

    We didn’t fund that position at all.  I have fixed that.

  273. 273.

    frosty

    December 21, 2021 at 5:14 pm

    @Gin & Tonic: I’m a roadster fan from way back. My dad bought us a ’61 Bugeye Sprite my senior year in high school (for $100). We spent two months getting it in shape to pass inspection.

    After college I got a ’67 Alfa Duetto, which was a maintenance nightmare and swapped it with my mechanic for his ’61 TR-3 which I subsequently sold.

    In 1989 my wife saw an article about the Miata and I said “My car! A Japanese front-engine, rea- wheel drive ragtop!” We bought one from the dealer’s first shipment and I drove it 23 years until it got totaled in a low-speed wreck.

    Loved it while I had it!

  274. 274.

    Omnes Omnibus

    December 21, 2021 at 5:18 pm

    @WaterGirl: I did not want to overclaim on our behalf.

  275. 275.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2021 at 5:27 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus: Well I completely claimed but I was talking about the totally wrong position!!!  (oh well, i fixed it, sigh)

  276. 276.

    Omnes Omnibus

    December 21, 2021 at 5:27 pm

    @frosty: Oooh, a Duetto.  I know it won’t get you anywhere reliably, but so pretty.

  277. 277.

    Jager

    December 21, 2021 at 5:31 pm

    @Gin & Tonic:

    I saw an old buck in the grocery store parking lot a few weeks ago, he was driving an old Miata decked out in Showroom Stock racing colors. I asked him if he still raced it? He laughed and said, “No, I can’t keep up with it anymore.”

    As for me, I still walk around with an outdated SCCA license in my wallet.

  278. 278.

    O. Felix Culpa

    December 21, 2021 at 5:31 pm

    @WaterGirl: No. Open Thread is sufficient.

  279. 279.

    Another Scott

    December 21, 2021 at 5:43 pm

    @Gin & Tonic: I knew a guy online who had an S2000. The envy knob was turned up quite a bit…

    Enjoy!

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  280. 280.

    burnspbesq

    December 21, 2021 at 5:54 pm

    @Spanky:

    What are the Secret Service responsibilities here, anyhow?

    Once presented with a facially valid warrant, their responsibility is to step aside and let the FBI and/or the Marshal’s Service do their job.

  281. 281.

    burnspbesq

    December 21, 2021 at 6:00 pm

    @Gin & Tonic:

    I know not that many “car people” on here, but back in the spring, after I’d retired, I bought the car I’d been lusting after for some time.

    I’ve had both, and I have a pretty good idea how much fun you’re having—although living in Texas, I would worry about a Miata getting squashed by some asshole in a F-350 Super Dity.

    Once you go electric, you’ll never go back, so I’m getting a Taycan.

  282. 282.

    Another Scott

    December 21, 2021 at 6:01 pm

    @Jinchi:

    30 years ago, Spy magazine sent “refund” checks for $1.11 to 58 rich people. The 26 who cashed those got a another check, for $.64. The 13 who cashed those each got a check for $.13. Two people cashed the $.13 checks—Donald Trump and Jamal Khashoggi’s arms-dealer uncle Annan.

    — Kurt Andersen (@KBAndersen) October 19, 2018

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  283. 283.

    OldDave

    December 21, 2021 at 6:07 pm

    @burnspbesq: I would worry about a Miata getting squashed by some asshole in a F-350

    Yes, one has to drive a Miata (or Cayman, for that matter) like everyone is inattentive or just plain out to kill.  Same rules as when riding a motorbike.

  284. 284.

    Captain C

    December 21, 2021 at 6:09 pm

    @Starfish:

    Trump was not peak wingnut. They want someone even crazier.

    The rush isn’t enough anymore, like it was in 2015.  They need something even stronger now, like fentanyl is to oxy, [new wingnut] will be to Trump.  Immersive VR can’t get here soon enough to deal with these people.

  285. 285.

    debbie

    December 21, 2021 at 6:11 pm

    @Mike in NC:

    Boy, he didn’t let the ink dry on that deal before filing a lawsuit. //

  286. 286.

    debbie

    December 21, 2021 at 6:13 pm

    @Another Scott:

    Ah, thanks. I’d forgotten about that episode! I will say that he took mocking better back then.

  287. 287.

    lowtechcyclist

    December 21, 2021 at 6:17 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus: ​
     

    Thanks for sharing this.

  288. 288.

    trollhattan

    December 21, 2021 at 6:21 pm

    @Gin & Tonic: Fun, congrats!

    Because it’s possible to travel and also be entertained by the act of driving, why not be entertained instead of transport via driving appliance?

    My theory, which is mine.

  289. 289.

    burnspbesq

    December 21, 2021 at 6:24 pm

    @Kristine:

    Wasn’t it discussed here that this was the reason tfg left NY for Florida?

    It’s more likely that he moved because FL has an unlimited homestead exemption, and he’s somehow convinced himself that he can hold onto Mar-a-Lago if he ends up in BK. I know just enough bankruptcy law to be extremely dangerous, but I sure as shit wouldn’t give him that advice.

  290. 290.

    lowtechcyclist

    December 21, 2021 at 6:29 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    Today she and her new partner– a recovering Fox News Libertarian whose name escapes me– were arguing that Pelosi needs to go because reasons, and Senate Democrats should just fire the parliamentarian, which will somehow obviate the need to count to 50 (or 60).

    Damned if I know what Pelosi should have done differently this year.

    But firing or simply ignoring the parliamentarian, whose role is advisory, would enable Schumer to count to 50 rather than 60 in a bunch of situations.  Because it’s the parliamentarian that’s been ruling that assorted programs can’t be part of a reconciliation bill, which means 60 rather than 50 votes are needed for them.

    Now chances are that, given Manchin and Sinema, getting to 50 on most of them probably wouldn’t have happened.  But 60 certainly wouldn’t have.

  291. 291.

    Chief Oshkosh

    December 21, 2021 at 6:47 pm

    @montanareddog:

    If he was Irish, or Italian, (or even Jewish as some tinfoil hat types maintain), how come his parents gave him a Spanish name?

    To fool the IRS, of course.

    SATSQ

  292. 292.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    December 21, 2021 at 7:10 pm

    @lowtechcyclist: my point was: A different parliamentarian would make absolutely no difference to Manchin or Sinema. He’s not opposed to the CTC, and she’s not opposed to tax increases, because of the parliamentarian. It’s just one example of the kind of “one weird trick” politics so many people fantasize can get around the simplest math of votes in either chamber, especially the Senate.

  293. 293.

    Geminid

    December 21, 2021 at 7:23 pm

    @lowtechcyclist: I think the particular rule that allows the 50 vote reconciliation process has specific criteria for what qualifies for such a bill. The intent is to enable a simple majority to pass a budget if nothing else. That rule would break down without a neutral parliamentarian to rule if a given item qualifies.

    Now, a simple majority can pass a set of rules that blows up the filibuster and makes limiting debate a matter of a simple majority vote. But such a rule set would never get Manchin and Sinema’s votes, and I think Senators like Warner and King would be very reluctant, and they might not be the only ones. So I’d say we are stuck with the reconciliation process with a parliamentarian as referee, in this Congress and probably the next one also. The most I expect would be a rule making a carveout for voting rights legislation, to go with the carveouts for reconciliation and judicial nominations.

    There are also rules Republicans have been abusing all year that allow holds on nominations. Tim Kaine says that he and other Senators are working on some changes there that they hope to put through this coming January, but he’s not saying exactly what because they are still negotiating.

  294. 294.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    December 21, 2021 at 7:38 pm

    @Geminid: King is against eliminating the filibuster, but he’s open to reforming it. I think Hickenlooper said much the same just the other day.

    “I’m not really ready to say ‘Let’s get rid of it altogether’ because I think there are circumstances where it makes sense. So I prefer some alternatives to what the present rule is. I’d like to restore the Senate to what it was, where we actually had debates and people had to hold the floor,” King (I-Maine) said

    “And so I think some kind of a talking filibuster, perhaps a rule that instead of having to have 60 votes to pass something, you’d have to have 41 votes to stop it. So that way, the minority would at least have to show up. One of the problems now is they don’t even have to show up, they don’t have to speak, they don’t have to do anything, it just sort of becomes an automatic supermajority requirement, which isn’t in the Constitution,” he continued.He said the filibuster rule is preventing the Senate from acting on legislation.

    “So we’ve got to do something about this, at least when it comes to something as crucial as democracy itself, as voting rights,” King said.

  295. 295.

    dc

    December 21, 2021 at 7:55 pm

    I just watched the press conference. The White House press corps is uniformly awful. Is awfulness a requirement for the job?

  296. 296.

    lowtechcyclist

    December 21, 2021 at 8:27 pm

    @Geminid: So I’d say we are stuck with the reconciliation process with a parliamentarian as referee, in this Congress and probably the next one also.

    As always, if the GOP retakes the Senate, it’ll all depend on whether Mitch considers it worthwhile to get rid of the parliamentarian.  He’ll get rid of the parliamentarian if he wants to, pure and simple.

    I can say this with assurance because it’s already happened, though not with Mitch. Whoever was Senate Majority Leader in early 2001 axed the parliamentarian over Bush’s tax cut bill.

    Why the Dems insist on being bound by procedural norms that mean nothing in terms of any larger principle, and that the other party has ignored in the past when it wants to, is beyond me.

    There are norms that are important to observe to keep us from being a banana republic, like the independence of the Attorney General.  But this isn’t one of those, not even close.

  297. 297.

    Geminid

    December 21, 2021 at 8:32 pm

    @lowtechcyclist: Well, you could break the norm and “axe” the Parliamentarian, but you still need 50 votes to do it and to pass anything afterwards. Schumer doesn’t have those 50 votes.

  298. 298.

    Another Scott

    December 21, 2021 at 9:07 pm

    @Geminid: Wikipedia says that the Parliamentarian “serves at the pleasure of the Majority Leader”.  So, that part is easy.

    The part about getting to 50 votes to pass anything that can avoid a filibuster still remains, as you say.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  299. 299.

    Professor Bigfoot

    December 22, 2021 at 2:03 am

    @Gin & Tonic: I picked up a “barn find” ’97 Boxster right before the Plague drove everything crazy.

    That plague driven craziness has turned into retirement… and the car that I paid 5K for in 2019 now seems to be worth about three times that.

    Not that I plan to sell anytime soon, of course…

  300. 300.

    J R in WV

    December 22, 2021 at 10:49 am

    @WaterGirl: 

    Thanks for all you do for Balloon Juice and its Jackals!!

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: 

    Pieing only happens on local computers, so you can’t tell how many people have pied you… but if you are a nice person who strives not to deliberately piss everyone else off, and are not a person who expresses hateful beliefs repeatedly, you have probably never been pied by anyone you would care about.

    I mean who cares if Bob in Portland has you pied? He’s banned anyways!

    And I frequently toggle people I have pied, and always toggle people who are pied temporarily because they have replied to someone who is pied to see what they said to the pied person.

  301. 301.

    Linus bern

    December 22, 2021 at 11:43 am

    @Kay:

    This is the problem with the left, they think that if they quietly do good work, the results will speak for themselves.

    Well the right has a huge media infrastructure dedicated to making democracy and justice look like tyranny and corruption at every possible opportunity.  They are going to paint any outcome that holds Republicans responsible for crimes they committed as illegitimate, and they don’t wait for those outcomes to occur before they start their campaign.  Unless there is a forceful counter campaign making the case that it is essential for democracy to hold those responsible to account then you are allowing Republicans to write the narrative that interprets the facts, and their narrative will be that an out of control partisan attorney general is pursuing illegitimate prosecutions of Republicans out of a desire for personal vengeance following his failure to be appointed to the Supreme Court.

    The AG may be reluctant to make public statements that could appear partisan, but he is going to be painted as a rank partisan regardless, he should blunt that by speaking of the importance to the country of pursuing convictions now, rather than hoping people will notice how good and quiet he is while waiting for the Republican narrative to cement itself in the media.

  302. 302.

    J R in WV

    December 22, 2021 at 11:52 am

    I am kinda a gear head, as in I like nice cars. My dad liked nice cars, he was a huge rag top guy, always had at least one car with a soft top he could put down in the spring, and I inherited his last rag top, a Chrysler TC by Maserati.

    It isn’t cherry, tho it is low miles, a 1990 with under 30K. But it is fun to drive, the cockpit is all leather and walnut. Hard to get work done on it, and I’m far from handy around a car. Also have a M-B C300 sports sedan, which I prefer as it’s much faster and easy to get worked on.

    We mostly drive a Mazda CX-5 SUV, which is fast and comfortable, and roomy for dogs and or cargo. I would probably enjoy a Miata hard top, I’m not a sun worshiper like Dad was, and so days when I enjoy having the top down and driving around are slim and few and far between.

    But if you love a rag top sports car, you go you! We had a 1991 Saab 900 which was a fascinating car. Wife drove it mostly, we put nearly 250,000 trouble free miles on it, same clutch, a couple of sets of brake pads, then the frame broke, and we sold it to the shop where we had work done on it for $100 for a parts car… miss that car so much.

    Not so crazy about German cars now. When my folks went for Mercedes vehicles, they were reliable workhorses, strong and comfortable. Now they seem kinda fru-fru and fussy, hard to keep running compared to back in the ’80s and ’90s. Like VWs in that regard, once famous for reliability, that’s all gone now. We sold our last VW when we had to invest nearly $8K to keep it on the road with only 30,000 miles on it, why we have a Mazda now, far better reliability ratings.

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