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You are here: Home / Open Threads / Oh Christ, not…

Oh Christ, not…

by Betty Cracker|  March 2, 20222:46 pm| 149 Comments

This post is in: Open Threads, Politics, Republican Stupidity

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…this asshole again:

‘This is ridiculous’: @GovRonDeSantis scolds students for wearing face masks during his @USouthFlorida visit https://t.co/v9XLjueCYi pic.twitter.com/TFeC6t6wL9

— WFLA NEWS (@WFLA) March 2, 2022

Florida’s governor is an angry dick who yells at teenagers at a public event for wearing masks. What business of his is it if they want to wear masks? What a jerk!

Anyhoo, on a semi-related note, I thought Biden’s speech was okay last night, but at first, I thought maybe he was missing an opportunity to inject partisanship into it — to play up the vast differences between the parties, one of which is fractiously democratic while the other is increasingly autocratic.

Instead, Biden went out of his way to be gracious, pretending that Republicans are united with Democrats to support Ukraine when in fact prominent Republicans — including their political leader and favorite Fox News propagandist — are rootin’ for Putin.

Biden appealed to Republicans to depoliticize the COVID-19 response, even as he talked about rolling back mandates that most Republicans have demagogued for fun and profit, killing people in the process. Biden rejected “defund the police,” which was never a policy he supported nor a plank in the party platform.

I wondered if it made sense to scold his own party’s activists for something they said two years ago instead of slagging the elected cultists who were making fools of themselves right before his eyes at that moment.

But then I watched the Republican response from Iowa Gov. Reynolds, and I began to think maybe Biden’s tone is part of a larger strategy. Reynolds mouthed the boilerplate anti-woke horse shit — Democrats are anti-cop, pro-crime, mask tyrants blah blah blah. It sounded jarring if you’d just finished listening to Biden.

Maybe that’s the point: to contrast an open-handed president who’s trying to find common ground with the peevish, snarling churls like DeSantis. I don’t know.

Open thread.

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Reader Interactions

149Comments

  1. 1.

    Dorothy A. Winsor

    March 2, 2022 at 2:48 pm

    Punching down: A Republican tradition

  2. 2.

    Roger Moore

    March 2, 2022 at 2:51 pm

    What business of his is it if they want to wear masks?

    He doesn’t want people in the picture with him who undercut his political message.  Republicans absolutely cannot handle dissent, even quiet dissent like continuing to wear a mask after they’ve decided it isn’t necessary.

  3. 3.

    Scout211

    March 2, 2022 at 2:52 pm

    I saw that clip a few minutes ago.  COVID theater? Such brilliance.  ?

  4. 4.

    Baud

    March 2, 2022 at 2:52 pm

    I didn’t see the speech, but I saw clips.  Did Biden scold activists, or simply disagree with their policy?

  5. 5.

    Baud

    March 2, 2022 at 2:53 pm

    As far as the masks go, keep wearing them to own the cons.

  6. 6.

    Alison Rose

    March 2, 2022 at 2:53 pm

    Ron Dicksantis

  7. 7.

    Jerzy Russian

    March 2, 2022 at 2:53 pm

    Christ, what an asshole!  Referring to the current governor of Florida.

  8. 8.

    Scout211

    March 2, 2022 at 2:54 pm

    @Baud:

    Well, I did study at the COVID Theater of Performing Arts so I am well prepared.

  9. 9.

    Wakeshift

    March 2, 2022 at 2:54 pm

    In general, I’m grateful to have a president and an administration that i trust to (try to) do the right thing.
    Building on that idea, I try to temper my bloodlust for the dismemberment of the republican party with the sense that a coherent strategy of “do the right thing, as much as possible” is better in the long run than any set of tactical takedowns engaging with the assholes case by case, no matter how cathartic and gratifying those may be.
    I have further realized that, in addition to voting, that’s *our* job.

  10. 10.

    Ken

    March 2, 2022 at 2:54 pm

    It sounded jarring if you’d just finished listening to Biden.

    Now I’m wondering if any of these has ever been an actual response, with its content based on what the President just said. Probably difficult to pull off — I’ve seen plenty of comedians manage it, but they’re more quick-witted than the majority of politicians.

  11. 11.

    cckids

    March 2, 2022 at 2:58 pm

    What a bullying fuckwad DeSantis is.

  12. 12.

    scav

    March 2, 2022 at 2:58 pm

    Oh! Look! Freedom and doing one’s own research is off the GQP menu again!

  13. 13.

    Calouste

    March 2, 2022 at 2:59 pm

    @Roger Moore: Also, it is about them. Always about them. People couldn’t possibly do a thing they don’t like except to upset them. (My mother in law is like that as well). It’s pretty close to narcissism, other people only exist as a reflection of themselves.

  14. 14.

    Percysowner

    March 2, 2022 at 3:03 pm

    @Calouste: My ex is like this. If his feelings are hurt, it must be because whoever WANTED him hurt. If he is angry someone MADE him angry. His reactions are never his own and he doesn’t examine any viewpoint other than his. It’s exhausting. The only real answers are to cave, which the media has done for a long time, fight, which doesn’t end well, or refuse to engage at all. Biden’s speech was part a way of refusing to engage.

  15. 15.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    March 2, 2022 at 3:04 pm

    Ob open thread, as (I think) Another Scott puts it

    Alex Kokcharov @AlexKokcharov

    In #StPetersburg, #Russia, the police detained a well-known survivor of the Siege of Leningrad Yelena Osipova at an anti-war #protest:

  16. 16.

    Betty Cracker

    March 2, 2022 at 3:05 pm

    @Baud: Here’s what he said:

    “We should all agree: The answer is not to defund the police. It’s to fund the police. Fund them. Fund them. Fund them with resources and training.”

    If he wanted to leave the activists out of it, he could have said something more neutral that conveyed the exact same idea, like “our police need more resources and training.” It was deliberate, the wording.

    And maybe that’s good politics? I honestly don’t know. I agree “defund the police” hasn’t been helpful for the party, though I don’t think it’s been as catastrophic as some people claim.

    The point is, he went there with the lefty activists, and he didn’t go there with the unhinged wingnut cultists, some of whom were showing their whole asses right there in the chamber. Not a word about 1/6. I guess that was by design?

  17. 17.

    mikefromArlington

    March 2, 2022 at 3:06 pm

    this guy needs to die of covid.

  18. 18.

    Jager

    March 2, 2022 at 3:09 pm

    I was enough of a smart ass when I was in college, I probably would have said, “Go fuck yourself Ron.”

  19. 19.

    Baud

    March 2, 2022 at 3:11 pm

    @Betty Cracker:

    I agree that the wording is to make clear that he wants to distance himself from the slogan. I wouldn’t call that scolding, unless a great deal of political rhetoric involves scolding.  (And maybe that’s how people want to view other people’s arguments.).

    ETA: as to the parity argument, there is no reason Biden needs to distance himself from seditionists and trashy people.

  20. 20.

    prostratedragon

    March 2, 2022 at 3:12 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:  They must be so proud! (Actually one cop did register as sheepish even through hi helmet.)

  21. 21.

    Scout211

    March 2, 2022 at 3:13 pm

    When the CDC recently relaxed the indoor mask requirement, they listed every US county and designated each county as green, yellow or red depending in various COVID numbers. I checked all the counties where my various family members live and all were either in green or yellow counties, except for one. My sister and BIL live in Orange County, Florida and that county was the only one listed as red, which should mean that indoor masking is still required. But according to the Governor, that’s just COVID theater. ?

  22. 22.

    matt

    March 2, 2022 at 3:14 pm

    I’d take my mask off and start coughing, and cough the whole time ostentatiously in the direction of Ron Desantis.

  23. 23.

    Jeffro

    March 2, 2022 at 3:15 pm

    Mask wearing = taking Covid seriously and acting collectively

    which trumpov didn’t, and neither does mini-trumpov here.  That’s why they can’t stand them.  Biden won while campaigning from his basement and/or in a mask, right?

    anyway, good on these kids for (unintentionally) reminding Americans that the GQP is only about student/parent ‘choice’ if you make THEIR choice

  24. 24.

    lowtechcyclist

    March 2, 2022 at 3:17 pm

    Don’t know how reliable this guy is, but:

    Chip Franklin.com on Twitter: “BREAKING: Florida Governor Ron DeSantis is refusing to divest $300 million in Russian investments from Florida. Is he complicit?” / Twitter

  25. 25.

    Baud

    March 2, 2022 at 3:18 pm

    @lowtechcyclist:

    Hard to be worse than Shell Oil, but DeSantis is up to the challenge.

  26. 26.

    Boris Rasputin (the evil twin)

    March 2, 2022 at 3:19 pm

    Oh, for a student to tell Death Sentence: “Masks save lives, you don’t!”

  27. 27.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    March 2, 2022 at 3:20 pm

    God damn ROFL, when I was a kid it was Reagan scolding kids for their dangerous drug habits, now it’s DeSantis scolding kids for their proper use of safety equipment.  Talk about full circle. LOL

  28. 28.

    lowtechcyclist

    March 2, 2022 at 3:20 pm

    @Baud: As far as the masks go, keep wearing them to own the cons.

    I’ll keep wearing them to protect myself and my family.  Owning the cons is a nice fringe benefit, though.

  29. 29.

    Lyrebird

    March 2, 2022 at 3:20 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Yeah that’s wild.

     

    She’s amazing!

    Speaking of amazing people who speak Russian, I don’t know if zhena gogolia will read this, but: apparently Anonymous got thousands of files and is asking for people to help translate.

    The link is to a DKos thread where I saw it, you have to search for this comment:

    Didn’t they just get a whole bunch of intel that needs translating?

  30. 30.

    Betty Cracker

    March 2, 2022 at 3:22 pm

    @Baud: I’m not sure I’d describe it as a “parity” argument. Just pointing out that giving pride of place in a SOTU speech to swatting away a lefty slogan that has amounted to a fart in a whirlwind (AFAIK, not one dime of police funding has been removed) while not mentioning the literal elephants in the room who supported a coup attempt is a deliberate choice. Whether it’s wise or not, I guess time will tell.

  31. 31.

    Baud

    March 2, 2022 at 3:25 pm

    @Betty Cracker:

    Substantively, it is a fart in the wind. But with crime up, I can see why Biden would want to try to innoculate Dems from the anti-police line of attack.

  32. 32.

    Old Man Shadow

    March 2, 2022 at 3:25 pm

    @matt: “Oh, man, thank you so much *cough cough*. You know, most people really freak out about my drug resistant tuberculosis, but you’re cool *cough cough*”

  33. 33.

    Brant

    March 2, 2022 at 3:27 pm

    New rotating tag line: Governor Ron De Santis / Greg Abbot is an angry dick, who <<fill in the blank >>.

  34. 34.

    mrmoshpotato

    March 2, 2022 at 3:27 pm

    ‘This is ridiculous’: @GovRonDeSantis scolds students for wearing face masks during his @USouthFlorida visit

    Tell him to fuck off. Tell him loudly.

  35. 35.

    Kay

    March 2, 2022 at 3:28 pm

    I know it doesn’t matter, but no one actually “defunded” the police and in my opinion is it not true that police need “more funding”.

    They’re public servants. We’re permitted to prosecute them when they break the law, look at their clearance rate and general effectiveness at crime fighting and judge their performance. That’s allowed.

    But i get it. It’s political. They demand complete deference and when they don’t it get it they punish the pols who dare to hold them to account.

  36. 36.

    NotMax

    March 2, 2022 at 3:31 pm

    Angry because he’d planned to single out several with “you sure got purty lips?”

    //

  37. 37.

    Baud

    March 2, 2022 at 3:33 pm

    Here is the full text of the speech discussing law enforcement issues.

    I recently visited the New York City Police Department days after the funerals of Officer Wilbert Mora and his partner, Officer Jason Rivera.
    They were responding to a 911 call when a man shot and killed them with a stolen gun.
    Officer Mora was 27 years old.
    Officer Rivera was 22 years old.
    Both Dominican Americans who grew up on the same streets they later chose to patrol as police officers.
    I spoke with their families and I told them that we are forever in debt for their sacrifices, and we’ll carry on their mission to restore the trust and safety of every community deserves.
    Like some of you that have been around for a while, I’ve worked with you for on these issues a long time.
    I know what works: Investigating crime prevention and community policing. Cops who’ll walk the beat, who know the neighborhood and who can restore trust and safety.
    Let’s not abandon our streets, or choose between safety and equal justice.
    Let’s come together and protect our communities, restore trust and hold law enforcement accountable.
    That’s why the Justice Department has required body cameras, banned chokeholds and restricted no-knock warrants for its officers.
    That’s why the American Rescue Plan that you all provided $350 billion that cities, states and counties can use to hire more police, invest in proven strategies. Proven strategies like community violence interruption — trusted messengers breaking the cycle of violence and trauma and giving young people some hope.
    We should all agree: The answer is not to defund the police. It’s to fund the police. Fund them. Fund them. Fund them with resources and training. Resources and training they need to protect their communities.
    I ask Democrats and Republicans alike to pass my budget and keep our neighborhoods safe.
    And we’ll do everything in my power to crack down on gun trafficking, of ghost guns that you can buy online, assemble at home — no serial numbers, can’t be traced.
    I ask Congress to pass proven measures to reduce gun violence. Pass universal background checks. Why should anyone on the terrorist list be able to purchase a weapon? Why? Why?
    And folks, ban assault weapons with high-capacity magazines that hold up to a hundred rounds. You think the deer are wearing Kevlar vests?
    Look, repeal the liability shield that makes gun manufacturers the only industry in America that can’t be sued. The only one.
    Imagine had we done that with the tobacco manufacturers.
    These laws don’t infringe on the Second Amendment. They save lives

  38. 38.

    Nelle

    March 2, 2022 at 3:35 pm

    • @mrmoshpotato: “My body, my choice” would make a decent retort.
  39. 39.

    Kay

    March 2, 2022 at 3:36 pm

    @Baud:

    Why don’t they “know the neighborhood” and “walk a beat” with current funding and training?

  40. 40.

    Baud

    March 2, 2022 at 3:37 pm

    @Kay:

    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

  41. 41.

    Mowgli

    March 2, 2022 at 3:37 pm

    @Kay:

    It’s all about the rhetoric and the weaponization of the phrase.

    As someone said above, this is about Biden innoculating D’s against the “Defund the Police” slogan itself, that has become toxic to so-called “kitchen-table” voters that can’t be bothered to be informed about anything beyond a sound bite.
    To be fair, it was a terrible slogan from the optics perspective.

  42. 42.

    mrmoshpotato

    March 2, 2022 at 3:39 pm

    @Nelle: Ah yes.

  43. 43.

    gvg

    March 2, 2022 at 3:40 pm

    @Scout211: Tampa/USF is not in Orange county.

    Mind you, Its none of his business if student choose to mask, Plenty of people have decided they like not catching colds or avoiding allergens and some people are going to continue to mask for not even Covid reasons.

  44. 44.

    JAFD

    March 2, 2022 at 3:41 pm

    It being almost spring in Gotham today, and yours truly thinking amybe is come-out-of-hibernation time, wondering if anyone else is interested in a BJ NYC gettogether sometime in April or May ?  Assuming no new Covid variant.*  Possibly outdoors, Union Square ? Central Park?

    Thoughts ?  Green balloon stockpiles ?

    *For some reason I remembered the MDs in Trollope’s Barchester Towers, Dr. Lambda Mewnew and Dr. Omicron Pye ….

  45. 45.

    Kay

    March 2, 2022 at 3:45 pm

    @Mowgli:

    Ok, whatever. We’ll pretend someone or other “defunded the police” when police budgets go up every year and go back to complete deference towards police where we aren’t even permitted to ask if they’re doing their jobs.  Walking  a beat (actually, always driving, but we’re pretending here so why not go with it) and “knowing the neighborhood” isn’t a special, extraordinary request. It’s the job. You know all of this alleged “disrespect” of police perfectly coincided with a couple, not a lot, a couple of police officers being prosecuted for breaking the law. That’s when they got really mad at us. How dare we.

  46. 46.

    Yarrow

    March 2, 2022 at 3:45 pm

    @Mowgli:  This is exactly right. The rightwing has weaponized the phrase. It’s easy to do because it sounds like you want to bankrupt the police, which sounds scary. Biden aimed to inoculate the Dems by saying what he said last night. That’s all that was about.

  47. 47.

    Mallard Filmore

    March 2, 2022 at 3:45 pm

    @JAFD: 

    It being almost spring in Gotham today

    I thought Metropolis is NYC and Gotham is Chicago.

  48. 48.

    Skepticat

    March 2, 2022 at 3:47 pm

    The expression on DeInsanity’s aide’s face made me want to punch him through the screen. It did look as though one of the young men kept his mask on. I can’t wait for my nephew and his husband to get jobs far away from Floriduh.

  49. 49.

    Bill Arnold

    March 2, 2022 at 3:49 pm

    @Baud:

    As far as the masks go, keep wearing them to own the cons.

    I will keep wearing a mask until the local rate is less than 2 new cases per day per 100K. (At about 12 now.) If anyone gives me shit (so far, no, whew) I will call them gullible selfish ignorant assholes (or similar), who have not studied the new CDC mask guidance document and probably have not read any scientific papers on COVID-19. If they get belligerent, they will learn fear.

  50. 50.

    eversor

    March 2, 2022 at 3:49 pm

    @Betty Cracker:

    Except it DID matter.   You have people on the right who will never vote for a Democrat because abortion, prayer in schools, lgbtq, traditional gender roles, promiscuity, aka Christians.   Then you have the out and out white nationalists.   Both of these groups know what they want doesn’t sell to the mushy middle.   But they also know that same middle hates lefty social engineering.   So they take quotes like “defund the police” and drive that wedge for all it’s worth.

    And it works.   People stay the fuck home or they do an honest look at their lives and realize that lefty stuff might hit them more than the crazy right wing stuff and punch for the Republican.

    And it works, it’s smart, it’s effective.

  51. 51.

    Kay

    March 2, 2022 at 3:49 pm

    @Mowgli:

    We can throw 350 billion into it but good policy or reforms aren’t going to come out of it because it is built on a fantasy that we had “funded” police and then we had “defunded” police. None of that actually happened.

    I just ask that if you’re going to hire social workers to do police work perhaps we could look at police staffing? If social workers are doing half of it then I don’t know why we need the same number of officers. And pay them like police.

  52. 52.

    UncleEbeneezer

    March 2, 2022 at 3:51 pm

    @Baud: The concept of reducing police budgets in order to invest in communities and move certain duties away from armed officers with the goal of reducing police violence, incarcerations and even make the job of policing more efficient and safe for officers is nothing new.  People have been pushing variations of this overall strategy since at least the 60’s here in Los Angeles.  Of course the other side has always responded in bad faith with Soft-On-Crime , Pro-Crime and Anti-Police accusations, because of course they would.  So we were probably gonna see major white-lash regardless of the terminology but damn…Defund was just like putting everything on a tee for the other side.  Even within police reform spaces that I am a part of (where people are actively FOR major police reforms), we have had to waste SO MUCH time correcting, clarifying, refuting this stuff to talk people down from their gut reaction to the hashtag/phrase that I wonder how much it has actually helped to set back the coalition/work.  It’s frustrating, to say the least, since when you explain some of these concepts in different framings, most reasonable people think they are great ideas.  The fact that Dem politicians still feel the need to distance themselves from it kind of proves the point that there were probably much better slogans worth trying.

  53. 53.

    Scout211

    March 2, 2022 at 3:51 pm

    @gvg:

    I was just trying to point out that counties in Florida are in the category that the CDC designates as high, which means indoor masks are highly recommended. DeSantis calls masks theater.

    Google tells me that USF is in Hillsborough County?

    That county is also list as high.

    High
    In Hillsborough County, Florida, community level is High.

    • Wear a mask indoors in public

    • Stay up to date with COVID-19 vaccines

    • Get tested if you have symptoms

    • Additional precautions may be needed for people at high risk for severe illness

  54. 54.

    Taken4Granite

    March 2, 2022 at 3:54 pm

    @Kay: I don’t know about Ohio, but here in New Hampshire and surrounding states there are lots of vacancies in law enforcement. I just heard today that one of the officers in my town has been poached by the State Police in a neighboring state, leaving our force at 2/3 its authorized numbers.

    It may be the case that we really don’t need that many police officers. If my town’s police force were at full authorized strength we would have one cop for about every 700 residents. Which seems high for a town and state with such a low crime rate.

    But if we do decide we need that many police officers, then those officers need better training than what has been typical in many US police departments, and that costs money. We also need to pay them enough to want to stay with the department.

  55. 55.

    Kay

    March 2, 2022 at 3:57 pm

    DeSantis is mad that the students are ruining his photo op. That’s why he’s yelling at them. They’re just props behind him.

    What a shame that we subject them to this bullshit. They deserve better.

  56. 56.

    Kay

    March 2, 2022 at 4:01 pm

    @Taken4Granite:

    There’s lot of vacancies in everything. It’s a tight labor market. I don’t know about “training”. I’ve interacted with police in my job for 20 years and some of them are good and some of them are bad and if I had to guess I think “temperament” and the workplace culture in their department plays a much larger role than training. They can’t be hotheads, they can’t be biased or bigoted and they can’t hate the job.

  57. 57.

    Geminid

    March 2, 2022 at 4:02 pm

    @Betty Cracker: In the runup to last year’s New York City Mayoral primary, I read of a poll result that struck me. The question asked what was the most important issue voters wanted the new mayor to deal with. 57% said violent crime, higher than any other issue. New Yorkers seem like pretty aware people who aren’t just bamboozled by propaganda, so I believed that this was a real problem for them. It may not be for me, but I recognize that New Yorkers and people like them are a big piece of the Democratic coalition.

    So I think Joe Biden did the right thing by taking the slogan “defund the police” head on. This set off a lively debate on Twitter (and blogs) that spilled into today on the timeline of “Mr. Weeks” (Wonderking82). Mr. Weeks, whose day job is counseling Bronx schoolkids, answered someone’s assertion that addressing root causes of violence, not policing, is more critical by saying:

       Black people want to feel safe from murderers, gangbangers, sexual predators and anyone else who wants to bring harm into their lives. Black people who vote and are active in their community have rejected defund the police on many levels. You can’t combat the root without the police.

    Of course this is just one New York City Democrat’s perspective. But to me it counts as much as that of any “activist,” and I think Joe Biden was speaking to the experience of Democratic base voters like this school counselor.

    @Wonderking82 does not seem to be a particularly conservative Democrat. I remember how, after one of Mayor Eric Adams’ early misteps, he commented that he was frustated because New Yorkers might have had Maya Wiley as Mayor instead of Adams. But, he said, when Wiley picked up on the “defund the police” slogan he knew she would lose.

  58. 58.

    JCJ

    March 2, 2022 at 4:04 pm

    @Betty Cracker:

    The loathsome Ron Johnson has mentioned “Democrat policies” including defunding the police as a reason he is seeking re-election when he had previously stated he would not.  He has an ad with video of the shithead driving into the Waukesha Christmas parade as an example of the results of said “Democrat policies”.  A statement like Biden’s seems an attempt to lessen that attack.

  59. 59.

    Kay

    March 2, 2022 at 4:08 pm

    It’s Bill Clinton’s 100k new cops, except thankfully without Bill Clinton’s embrace of “boot camps” for juveniles, which were an absolute fucking disaster. 

  60. 60.

    Lums Better Half

    March 2, 2022 at 4:09 pm

    Leftism is, always has been, and always will be, illegitimate in American politics.

    If Democrats were smart they would harshly sanction any and all PDLs.

  61. 61.

    Rob

    March 2, 2022 at 4:09 pm

    I have no words for DeSantis’s action.

  62. 62.

    MisterDancer

    March 2, 2022 at 4:09 pm

    Anyone recall The Bill Clinton campaign’s use of Sister Souljah to flag that he wasn’t “one of those kinds of Democrats?”

    I do. That was ugly and divisive, a stain on his rep and a serious part of why the accusations of racial bias in the 2007 Primary season landed so hard, once Obama won Iowa.

    I’ve said a lot, here, about That Slogan, and how people react to it/engage it, and I’m not gonna rehash my still-raw feelings on the matter. I will say that I did see some consternation on Twitter from people I generally respect on Biden’s verbiage…and that Baud’s extended quote points out why it didn’t hit me so hard.

    Part of this is that people rely on media discussions/descriptions of activism, which are at least as suspect as what we get from the media on what politicos are doing and saying — moreso,I think, because most of these folx aren’t “important” from mainstream media’s POV. It’s part of why I try to pay them some mind; not just because it might be my body in the street next, but because their ideas/vision (and variety thereof) can get twisted with a quickness…

    …yet so, too, do too many politicians. We talk about that here all the damn time, that it’s seemingly easier to stand for next-to-nothing save getting a rise outta people, than to actually do the hard work of building coalitions and structuring laws. And we also talk about how a lot of media reporting is more about getting that rise as well, over communicating nuance.

    It’s not great that a lot of activists are reacting, possibly, to that reported one-liner over the nuance I think Biden is trying to bring. Yet I’m also not too invested to throw stones over the situation at this point.

  63. 63.

    trollhattan

    March 2, 2022 at 4:09 pm

    @lowtechcyclist: Compare and contrast.

    Gov. Gavin Newsom called on leaders of California’s public pension systems on Tuesday to re-evaluate their investments in Russia. The state’s Public Employees’ Retirement System and State Teachers’ Retirement System, along with the University of California Retirement Retirement Plan, have investments funds worth a combined $970 billion. They together hold more than $1.5 billion in investments in Russian stocks, private equity holdings, real estate, debt and other investments, Newsom said in a letter to the three chairpersons of the pension systems’ boards of directors.

    https://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-government/the-state-worker/article258928008.html#storylink=cpy

    TBH I don’t know how much direct influence the governor has over the CalPERS portfolio. They, you know, hire people for that and have their own managing board. I assume they’ll act, regardless.

  64. 64.

    raven

    March 2, 2022 at 4:10 pm

    Really, debating “defund the police” again??? Sheesh.

  65. 65.

    Cameron

    March 2, 2022 at 4:11 pm

    Is it true that “Fuck you, DeSantis” flies under the radar as “Let’s go pantsless?”

  66. 66.

    Baud

    March 2, 2022 at 4:13 pm

    @raven:

    Eh, it was brought up in the SOTU.  It’s not so random this time.

  67. 67.

    Kay

    March 2, 2022 at 4:14 pm

    @Geminid:

    Is there anything at all that centrist Democrats have done or could do that would harm Democrats politically?  Or is it entirely the fault of “progressives” that Biden is at 40?

    Do centrists ever do any analysis of how politically popular their positions are? Or is that analysis  restricted to progressives?

    They’re the majority. They run the policy agenda. Why do they never take responsibility for the political fortunes of the Democratic Party?

    I don’t even think this is good for the Party. If all they have to do is point fingers to the Left everytime they lose an election they never do any analysis of their own work.

  68. 68.

    Matt McIrvin

    March 2, 2022 at 4:15 pm

    I’ve been carrying around a spare mask in case something happens to the one I’m wearing.

    It occurs to me that an incident like this would have been a perfect opportunity to make use of it–if some asshole like DeSantis tells me to take my mask off, whip it out and put it on over my existing mask.

  69. 69.

    Baud

    March 2, 2022 at 4:17 pm

    @Kay:

    I disagree that centrists are the majority (maybe you label them differently), but who here has questioned the harm they (at least Manchin and Sinema) have done to the party?

  70. 70.

    Kay

    March 2, 2022 at 4:17 pm

    @Matt McIrvin:

    I’m sorry they had to be part of it. They don’t know any better. The school should decline to provide props for his stupid fucking photo op. He’s horrible and disrespectful and they shouldn’t be subjected to it.

    He’s annoyed that they’re messing up his campaign event.

  71. 71.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    March 2, 2022 at 4:18 pm

    I have this crazy theory that omicron (now fading) and gas prices (probably rising) have more to do with Dem approval ratings than AOC (!) or Joe Manchin.

    Let’s all hope Putin has a massive heart attack in the next few hours.

  72. 72.

    Betty Cracker

    March 2, 2022 at 4:19 pm

    @eversor: Lots of people say that, but I’ve seen zero hard evidence to back it up. Happy to change my mind if you can link to something more substantial than wingnut crowing/centrist whining. I agree it’s a problematic slogan because it doesn’t mean what it sounds like it means. I’m personally sick of hearing about it. But that’s not the same as “it works.”

  73. 73.

    Kay

    March 2, 2022 at 4:22 pm

    @Baud:

    I just cannot believe we are getting ready to blame another loss on “defund the police”. It’s ludicrous. Worse, it lets the Party completely off the hook for any painful, real analysis of why they are in this predicament. They can sideline progressives if they want. It won’t work. They’re not the reason Biden has dropped 40 with young people and is at 70 with Democrats, but the Democratic Party would prefer not to look at anything else, so I guess we won’t.

  74. 74.

    Betty Cracker

    March 2, 2022 at 4:25 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: I agree the pandemic dragging on, plus inflation, etc., is a big drag on Biden. That said, I don’t think the Manchin/Sinema Show was without cost either.

  75. 75.

    zhena gogolia

    March 2, 2022 at 4:26 pm

    But then I watched the Republican response from Iowa Gov. Reynolds, and I began to think maybe Biden’s tone is part of a larger strategy.

    Ya think? The man is a master. I underestimated him.

  76. 76.

    Baud

    March 2, 2022 at 4:27 pm

    @Betty Cracker:

    I don’t know what hard evidence would be.  Here’s Keith Ellison, who’s no centrist.

    “I think allowing this moniker, ‘Defund the police,’ to ever get out there, was not a good thing,” Minnesota Attorney General Keith Ellison (D) told The Washington Post’s Dave Weigel on Thursday

     

    I thought there was a post-election report that surveyed voters, but I can’t locate it now.

  77. 77.

    Kay

    March 2, 2022 at 4:27 pm

    @Betty Cracker:

    At least they stopped allowing him to pretend he’s negotiating, or really working at all. I’m grateful for that.

  78. 78.

    Baud

    March 2, 2022 at 4:28 pm

    @Kay:

    Who’s blaming the next losses on that?  We haven’t even lost yet.

  79. 79.

    Villago Delenda Est

    March 2, 2022 at 4:29 pm

    “This is ridiculous”, sez DeathSantis.  Yes, you moron, you are ridiculous.  At all times.

  80. 80.

    NotMax

    March 2, 2022 at 4:30 pm

    @JAFD

    Contemplating possibly* going to see Mom in NY, maybe August.

    A B-J potluck picnic would be fun!

    *if the stars of circumstances then are aligned

  81. 81.

    Kay

    March 2, 2022 at 4:33 pm

    @Villago Delenda Est:

    He has such a squeaky, whiny voice. I’m suprised the manly men of the Right pegged him as tough guy.

  82. 82.

    Roger Moore

    March 2, 2022 at 4:37 pm

    @Mallard Filmore:

    I thought Metropolis is NYC and Gotham is Chicago.

    Nope; they’re both New York.  Superman and Batman started as standalone comics, and each used a nickname for New York to emphasize that it was a fantasy universe rather than the real city.  They didn’t crossover until they had been in publication for well over a decade, by which time the names for their fictional version of New York were well established.

    Marvel was actually really bold by setting its comics in New York and by planning from the beginning to have their characters live in a shared universe.  To some extent, this is why the MCU works as well as it does.  The characters were always conceived of as being available for crossovers, while the DC characters- at least the really big ones- weren’t.

  83. 83.

    Kay

    March 2, 2022 at 4:37 pm

    @Taken4Granite:

    We have a good police agency here (the city police) and a poor quality police agency (the county police) and it isn’t training. It’s a culture that hires for good/bad. They don’t hire for the attributes and skills that would make one good with the public and it systemic, because the people who do the hiring have the same problem as the people THEY are hiring. You can’t train around that. You have to HIRE around it.

  84. 84.

    Betty Cracker

    March 2, 2022 at 4:38 pm

    @Baud: I keep thinking there must be some conclusive data since the concept that those three words are killing the party is so widespread, but I’ve looked, and I haven’t found anything except lots of opinions.

    I think there was a survey where people said they don’t like the slogan, which again, I agree is a bad slogan. (I’d probably tell a pollster I don’t like if asked.) But I’ve found zero evidence it moved any votes.

  85. 85.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    March 2, 2022 at 4:40 pm

    Hanna Liubakova @HannaLiubakova 19m

    Ukrainian intelligence reported that Russian soldiers were sent to #Ukraine with rations for only three days. Apparently, there is literally not enough food. People post videos showing soldiers in Russian uniforms stealing food from stores. Sometimes they eat it on the spot

    I imagine people around Sergey Shoygu, possibly people named Sergey Shoygu, must be getting very nervous around windows and staircases

  86. 86.

    Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony

    March 2, 2022 at 4:41 pm

    @Kay:

    I just cannot believe we are getting ready to blame another loss on “defund the police”.

    If we lose, I’ll blame it on inflation, the pandemic dragging on, rising crime, and the ongoing culture wars. However, my circle is pretty broad. I know leftist activists who actually believe we don’t need police at all, which I think is crazy, and conservative voters who didn’t like Trump but were completely freaked out by the ‘defund the police’ rhetoric. Its hard not get upset when that slogan does motivate people you know to vote for Republicans who probably would have stayed home.

  87. 87.

    Southern Goth

    March 2, 2022 at 4:44 pm

    @Betty Cracker:

    It actually polled better than “Defund NCIS.”

  88. 88.

    Salty Sam

    March 2, 2022 at 4:44 pm

    “The Democrat party is soft on crime!”

    “The Democrat party wants to de-fund the police!”

    “The Democrat party is weak on national defense- a bunch of Neville Chamberlain appeasement monkeys!”

    “The Democrat party buys votes from minorities with welfare- remember the Obama-watch?!”

    “The Democrat party is the real racists! It was Democrats who founded the KKK!”

    Joe Biden can say “Fund-not-De-fund the police as much as he wants, but the minds that need to be changed are impervious to it.  They have their narrative, planted by the Noize Machine and nurtured by Media, and nothing will change them.

  89. 89.

    JaneE

    March 2, 2022 at 4:44 pm

    @Baud: The first few days after the public health orders were rescinded it seemed like the same or even more people were masking here.  At least they weren’t taking off their masks when they walked outside or on the city streets.  I plan to keep it on when I am inside until I feel safe enough to quit.

  90. 90.

    Geminid

    March 2, 2022 at 4:45 pm

    @Kay: I did not say anything about centrists or progressives, but was talking about Democrats who deserve to have their real needs met. I am not blaming a wing of the party for any failures. I leave that to the partisans of the two wings, who are much more judgemental than the actual members of the House Democratic Caucus.

    But since you are talking about “Progressives,” or liberals, and “Centrists.” or moderates, how do you feel about Tim Ryan as a Senate candidate in Ohio? You know he’s part of the moderate House majority that you dismiss as “Centrists.”

  91. 91.

    Baud

    March 2, 2022 at 4:48 pm

    @Betty Cracker:

    What’s frustrating about the distraction is that the main goal was never to defund the police (however interpreted). The main goal was to deter unnecessary police violence and hold them accountable, particularly when the kill under black people.  Defunding was just one element of how to do that.

  92. 92.

    JaneE

    March 2, 2022 at 4:51 pm

    Assuming you watched both the SOTU and the GOP response, it had to be a jarring contrast.   That is a good metaphor for who lives in reality and who just ignores it.

  93. 93.

    WaterGirl

    March 2, 2022 at 4:56 pm

    @Baud: This is one more example of Biden being a pragmatist.

    He knows we can’t win he argument re: what people were attempting to do with defund the police, so he’s trying to take the conversation off the board.  He’s trying to neutralize that as a weapon because they sure as hell will try to use it against us.

    @Betty Cracker:

    When I used to listen to Pod Save America, they had research that showed that defund the police did hurt us in some races.  But I don’t recall the details.  sorry!

  94. 94.

    Baud

    March 2, 2022 at 5:00 pm

    @JaneE:

    Yeah, assuming cases don’t spike again, I’ll demask slowly.  Am probably never in places like airplanes.

  95. 95.

    Bostondreams

    March 2, 2022 at 5:00 pm

    @Roger Moore:

    Nope; they’re both New York.  Superman and Batman started as standalone comics, and each used a nickname for New York to emphasize that it was a fantasy universe rather than the real city.  They didn’t crossover until they had been in publication for well over a decade, by which time the names for their fictional version of New York were well established.

     

    A few years ago, there was a great Marvel/DC crossover, and Marvel characters crossed into the DC Universe. Good throwaway line: “wow, this Earth is so big it has room for three New Yorks!” or something like that :)

  96. 96.

    Matt

    March 2, 2022 at 5:04 pm

    I began to think maybe Biden’s tone is part of a larger strategy

    It is – Biden’s not on a different team than the fascists, he just knows how to act polite.

    He’s been a cop-fluffer his entire political career, and inconvenient facts like “the cops are a murderous white-supremacist gang” aren’t going to put a crimp in that.

  97. 97.

    Roger Moore

    March 2, 2022 at 5:04 pm

    @Betty Cracker:

    The thing that’s really dangerous about the “defund the police” slogan is that the people who originated it mean it in exactly the sense the Democrats are trying to run from.  They genuinely want to cut police funding to zero, and they’re more than happy to say exactly that.  There aren’t a lot of them, but the people who picked up the slogan to mean police reform were idiots to tie their very reasonable goals to a slogan from people with completely unreasonable goals.

  98. 98.

    Baud

    March 2, 2022 at 5:04 pm

    OT. Judge Jackson’s confirmation hearings will begin on March 21.

  99. 99.

    Betty Cracker

    March 2, 2022 at 5:06 pm

    @Baud: Agreed. Kay alluded to something earlier which probably should get more attention in this debate, i.e., that sheriffs, police chiefs, police unions, etc., are political actors, and they gin up this conflict every time their authority is questioned. Regular as clockwork!

  100. 100.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    March 2, 2022 at 5:06 pm

    “Gotham” has been a nickname for New York City that first became popular in the nineteenth century; Washington Irving had first attached it to New York in the November 11, 1807 edition of his Salmagundi,[22] a periodical which lampooned New York culture and politics. Irving took the name from the village of Gotham, Nottinghamshire, England: a place inhabited, according to folklore, by fools

    always vaguely wondered about the origin of the name, finally remembered to use this “internet” thing to find out

    also

    Gotham City is traditionally depicted as being located in the U.S. state of New Jersey

  101. 101.

    Roger Moore

    March 2, 2022 at 5:08 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    I would be careful about interpreting stories of soldiers grabbing whatever food they can find.  Soldiers have looted food for as long as there have been soldiers, and they tend to do it even when they’re well supplied.  It’s often a sign of bad discipline more than bad supply.

  102. 102.

    O. Felix Culpa

    March 2, 2022 at 5:09 pm

    @Roger Moore:

    The thing that’s really dangerous about the “defund the police” slogan is that the people who originated it mean it in exactly the sense the Democrats are trying to run from.

    This. I know several such activists IRL. They want to abolish all police and the entire prison system, both of which need serious revamping, but total abolition? The RWers are, as ever, taking the slogans of a fringe and smearing all Dems with it, and doing it effectively among low-info voters IMO. Unfortunately I don’t have any stats at hand to back up my experience and impressions.

  103. 103.

    Baud

    March 2, 2022 at 5:13 pm

    @Betty Cracker:

    Absolutely.

  104. 104.

    Kay

    March 2, 2022 at 5:14 pm

    @Geminid:

    Of course they deserve to have their real needs met. But it is the worst kind of oversimplification to say glorifying police or even hiring more of them means they will do ordinary protective policing work in black communities. Ask why they aren’t on that woman’s street. Ask why she can’t get anyone to write a report for a stolen bike or to get loiterers off her corner.

    The Adopted Budget for fiscal year 2022 sets the City-funded NYPD spending, including agency and central expenditures, at $10.4 billion, a spending increase of $465 million (4.7 percent) against fiscal year 2021

    10.4 billion. Not enough? Can we ask why that’s not enough to “walk a beat” or “know the neighborhood”, or should we just give them another 350 billion and hope they start “community policing”, although we have been asking them nicely to do that for 20 years.

    I agree that lower income people and black people and minorities should get public safety services. Absolutely. Is the reason they aren’t getting it because 11 progressives said “defund the police”?

  105. 105.

    Baud

    March 2, 2022 at 5:15 pm

    @Baud:

    particularly when the kill under black people = particularly when they kill under black people

  106. 106.

    Roger Moore

    March 2, 2022 at 5:15 pm

    @O. Felix Culpa:

    The RWers are, as ever, taking the slogans of a fringe and smearing all Dems with it, and doing it effectively among low-info voters IMO.

    We had a discussion about this recently.  The same way that White people are all individuals but minorities have to answer for the wrongs of any member of their group, Republicans are all individuals while Democrats have to answer for the mistakes of anyone in their party.  This makes it really easy for Republicans to smear the Democrats with the worst decisions of anyone with a (D) after their name, or even anyone who looks like they ought to have one [ETA: IYKWIMAITYD].  In the specific case of “defund the police”, it was idiocy to co-opt the slogan, because it makes the smears that much easier.

  107. 107.

    Baud

    March 2, 2022 at 5:16 pm

    @Roger Moore:

    Seconded.

  108. 108.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    March 2, 2022 at 5:17 pm

    WASHINGTON – Rep. Van Taylor apologized Wednesday for an affair with an ex-jihadist dubbed the “ISIS bride” by British tabloids and abruptly dropped his bid for a third term, conceding the GOP runoff to rival Keith Self, a former Collin County judge.
    “About a year ago, I made a horrible mistake that has caused deep hurt and pain among those I love most in this world. I had an affair, it was wrong, and it was the greatest failure of my life,” he said in an email to supporters.

    anybody have this on their bingo card?

  109. 109.

    O. Felix Culpa

    March 2, 2022 at 5:18 pm

    @Roger Moore:

    The same way that White people are all individuals but minorities have to answer for the wrongs of any member of their group, Republicans are all individuals while Democrats have to answer for the mistakes of anyone in their party.  This makes it really easy for Republicans to smear the Democrats with the worst decisions of anyone with a (D) after their name, or even anyone who looks like they ought to have one.

    Well put. And the MSM are actively complicit with this too.

  110. 110.

    prostratedragon

    March 2, 2022 at 5:19 pm

    @O. Felix Culpa:  I’m reminded of Richard Pryor, who said that at one time his own views were like those of the complete defunders. Then he did some comedy shows in prisons, and actually talked to some inmates, concluding that there really are people who need to be somewhere apart.

  111. 111.

    Baud

    March 2, 2022 at 5:20 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    Yes.  Pretty predictable actually.

  112. 112.

    germy

    March 2, 2022 at 5:21 pm

    This photo:

    pic.twitter.com/q2EAgZscW9

    — Pam McRoman (@pam_mcroman) March 2, 2022

  113. 113.

    Quiltingfool

    March 2, 2022 at 5:22 pm

    Need some Liberal Redneck Trae Crowder?  Here ya go

    https://twitter.com/traecrowder/status/1499145957904039939?s=20&t=NNOnv6SOUU05t4qL8URJNw

  114. 114.

    Kay

    March 2, 2022 at 5:22 pm

    @Geminid:

    Here’s some police reforms that people would probably get behind:

    The abuse by cops of parking placards is an unambiguous example of low-level yet blatant corruption that suggests a lack of public sector and police accountability.
    Significant, yet incremental, reforms like transferring the Traffic Enforcement Division from NYPD to NYC’s Department of Transportation could be worth exploring to align those who set the rules of the road with those who enforce the rules of the road — and thereby unbundle from police responsibility a civil enforcement activity that does not inherently require police involvement.
    Placards are a highly corruptible perk that signal a general culture of venality. It is well established in global development literature that widespread, low-level corruption is worse for governance overall as it erodes trust and tears the social contract. It also signals that public servants can get away with more corruption too; for this reason, NY1’s Errol Louis actually calls placard abuse a “gateway drug.”

    They have a workplace culture problem. You can make them sit for all the over-priced “trainings” you want and it won’t dent it. This is entitilement and a lack of accountability. Kissing their ass and flying the thin blue line flag isn’t going to fix it.

  115. 115.

    Citizen Alan

    March 2, 2022 at 5:22 pm

    @JAFD: April, please.  I’m done with classes in mid may and, sadly, will be leaving for … somewhere.

  116. 116.

    Baud

    March 2, 2022 at 5:23 pm

    @germy:

    If Republicans were Democrats, we could successfully smear the whole party with those two.

  117. 117.

    UncleEbeneezer

    March 2, 2022 at 5:27 pm

    @MisterDancer: “Part of this is that people rely on media discussions/descriptions of activism, which are at least as suspect as what we get from the media on what politicos are doing and saying — moreso,I think, because most of these folx aren’t “important” from mainstream media’s POV.”

    Amen.  And may I just add that in my experience in police reform spaces, the slogan really isn’t anywhere near as popular as many people (and Twitter) would lead one to believe.  And it’s not just the media.  Part of the problem is because it feels good and defiant and righteous (I agree!) which appeals to alot of for-lack-of-a-better-term Allies, who then latched onto it and help perpetuate the myth that it is the consensus among activists and organizers.  In reality, many groups with lots of voices and input from the most effected communities looked at it and decided: “yeah, great concept, bad slogan” and moved on.

    Also, I think it’s really important to remember that Activists are not a monolith and that they can be just as petty, attention-seeking, contrarian and unwilling to ever admit they are wrong, as anyone else.  IE- They can be just as loud and wrong as anybody.  We can value their work while also being aware of the fact that they aren’t superheroes, and that the solutions they advocate can be just as right in theory, but not in practice, as any other attempt to solve really complicated and dynamic problems in our society.

  118. 118.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    March 2, 2022 at 5:28 pm

    a fucking six. hundred. million. dollar…. boat

    Russian billionaire Alisher Usmanov was sanctioned by the European Union on Monday. Two days later, Forbes has learned from three sources in the yacht industry that one of his prized possessions—the 512-foot yacht Dilbar, valued at nearly $600 million—has been seized by German authorities in the northern city of Hamburg. […]

    At 15,917 tons, it’s the world’s largest motor yacht by gross tonnage, and is typically manned by a crew of 96 people. Dilbar boasts the largest swimming pool ever installed on a yacht as well as two helicopter pads, a sauna, a beauty salon, and a gym. Its plush interiors have more than 1,000 sofa cushions and it can host up to 24 people in 12 suites.

    two helicopter pads, just in case, you know how it is

  119. 119.

    Hoodie

    March 2, 2022 at 5:28 pm

    @Betty Cracker: seemed like an unnecessary own goal when Black Lives Matter was having positive results in basically the same arena. Generally, negatively phrased slogans like defund the police don’t inspire positive actions. I think some activists may have fallen in love with it as a performative tool with the thought it would result in some sort of consciousness raising, but that’s a vanishingly small group. The bigger problem is that right wing activists look for these types of negative code phrases and distort them into caricatures. CRT is another example.

  120. 120.

    Kay

    March 2, 2022 at 5:28 pm

    Russian billionaire Alisher Usmanov was sanctioned by the European Union on Monday. Two days later, Forbes has learned from three sources in the yacht industry that one of his prized possessions—the 512-foot yacht Dilbar, valued at nearly $600 million—has been seized by German authorities in the northern city of Hamburg.

    Please be true. And Germany wins for getting the first one :)

  121. 121.

    Kay

    March 2, 2022 at 5:30 pm

    Usmanov purchased Dilbar in 2016 for a reported cost of $600 million from German shipbuilder Lürssen, which custom-built it for him over 52 months. The firm calls it “one of the most complex and challenging yachts ever built, in terms of both dimensions and technology.” At 15,917 tons, it’s the world’s largest motor yacht by gross tonnage, and is typically manned by a crew of 96 people. Dilbar boasts the largest swimming pool ever installed on a yacht as well as two helicopter pads, a sauna, a beauty salon, and a gym. Its plush interiors have more than 1,000 sofa cushions and it can host up to 24 people in 12 suites.

    Guffaw. 1000 sofa cushions!

  122. 122.

    Baud

    March 2, 2022 at 5:31 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Is it wrong for me to want Bezos and Musk to invade Ukraine?

  123. 123.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    March 2, 2022 at 5:37 pm

    I don’t follow the game, but I know Chelsea is huge; and I don’t trust this guy, but… maybe a sign that UK-based oligarchs are getting nervous? Abramovich selling the Chelsea football club

    The sale of the Club will not be fast-tracked but will follow due process. I will not be asking for any loans to be repaid. This has never been about business nor money for me, but about pure passion for the game and Club. Moreover, I have instructed my team to set up a charitable foundation where all net proceeds from the sale will be donated. The foundation will be for the benefit of all victims of the war in Ukraine. This includes providing critical funds towards the urgent and immediate needs of victims, as well as supporting the long-term work of recovery.

  124. 124.

    WaterGirl

    March 2, 2022 at 5:38 pm

    @Baud: That’s nearly 4 weeks from when he put her forward. :-(

  125. 125.

    trollhattan

    March 2, 2022 at 5:38 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    For somebody who wants the ability to vanish at the drop of a (very nice) hat and disappear, it must be a little disquieting that your 512-foot floating town is child’s play to track around the globe by civilian satellites. “Is now to be deploying cloaking device, deploy!” [crew places bag over head]

  126. 126.

    Geminid

    March 2, 2022 at 5:39 pm

    @Betty Cracker: There is only the indirect evidence of Republicans trying to move votes with this slogan. But just because they tried doesn’t mean it worked.

    Crime is a concern for voters, though, as much or more among Democrats as among Republicans. Politicians have to address the issue, and you cannot address crime without speaking to the criminal justice system including policing.

    I thought Biden handled this well and said a lot of good things about what he was going to do. It’s true he did not have to say what he wouldn’t do, but I don’t think he was disrespecting the activists who came up with the slogan just because he was disagreeing with them.

    I respect the activists who created this slogan. It was born out of their lived experience as Black people. But were they the ones who tried to make it stand for Democratic party policy? I think that was the white leftists who ostensibly champion the oppressed, but in fact use these injustices to grind their anti-establishment axes. And those are the people who will cry the loudest about Joe Biden and Nancy Pelosi throwing them under the bus.

    As to a positive program for crime and criminal justice, you will get to see at first hand how Val Demings addresses these issues in her Senate campaign, where they will certainly come up. And just over the border, Stacey Abrams will show how a very shrewd and practical politician handles them. She gave a glimpse last month in a really good interview in Atlanta.capitalbnews.org, titled “Stacy Abrams and her Vision of ‘One Georgia’.”

  127. 127.

    Calouste

    March 2, 2022 at 5:39 pm

    @Kay: That crew of 96 is 12-15 people to actually run the ship, and 80 domestic servants.

  128. 128.

    WaterGirl

    March 2, 2022 at 5:40 pm

    @Kay: If hiring more police gets Biden and democrats elected, that’s a trade-off I can live with.  But they have way too much power, and we need to do something about that.

  129. 129.

    trollhattan

    March 2, 2022 at 5:40 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    Chelsea is up there with Man U, Man City, Liverpool, Arsenal as elite Premiere League billionaires’ baubles.

    As sports crazy as we are in the States, they’re on a different level.

  130. 130.

    Calouste

    March 2, 2022 at 5:41 pm

    @trollhattan: It wasn’t particularly hard to track because it had been in a dock in Hamburg for a few months for a refitting.

  131. 131.

    WaterGirl

    March 2, 2022 at 5:41 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    and [getting caught] was the greatest failure of my life

    fixed that for him.

  132. 132.

    WaterGirl

    March 2, 2022 at 5:42 pm

    @germy: Who is the cat and who are the two women in the upper left?

  133. 133.

    Subsole

    March 2, 2022 at 5:44 pm

    @Roger Moore: Yeah. After a month of Russian surplus MREs eaten cold, I’d probably be stripping every gas station I saw of chips, soda and anything else edible.

    Hell, I’d probably do it after a month of American MREs eaten warm.

  134. 134.

    Ken

    March 2, 2022 at 5:45 pm

    @Kay: Guffaw. 1000 sofa cushions!

    Do I want to try to imagine how 24 guests will use 1000 sofa cushions? World’s largest pillow fort? Something more in Rule 34 territory?

  135. 135.

    Kay

    March 2, 2022 at 5:49 pm

    I told you Manchin and Sinema’s top priority was protecting the Trump tax cuts, and it is:

    Though he prefers everything in Congress to be bipartisan, Manchin said he has “come to that conclusion” that changing the tax code to make the rich and corporations pay their fair share can only be done with Democratic votes. To enact Manchin’s vision, Democrats would also have to bargain with Sen. Kyrsten Sinema (D-Ariz.) who last year steered the party toward surtaxes and corporate minimum taxes — and away from raising individual and corporate tax rates.

    They both could have saved a lot of time if they had simply admitted at the outset that they had no intention of repealing the Trump tax cuts. The rest was all bullshit.
    The Manchin and Sinema number was always the amount they could spend while preserving massive tax cuts for billionaires and corporations. These two would throw themselves in front of a train to protect those tax cuts. It’s all they care about.

  136. 136.

    Baud

    March 2, 2022 at 5:52 pm

    @Kay:

    I agree with what you say, but the quote in the block quote says the opposite, at least with respect to Manchin. Not that I trust what he says.

  137. 137.

    Kay

    March 2, 2022 at 5:54 pm

    Next time Democrats are in power they should have only one goal- rejigger the tax code so it’s no longer a billionaires dream. All the rest is details.

    It all starts there. Everything else will be much easier to solve if they do that one thing. They can’t this time- Manchin and Sinema will never allow it- but if they ever have 52 again it is the single most important thing they could do for the country.

  138. 138.

    citizen dave

    March 2, 2022 at 5:58 pm

    desantis is over the top on the loathsome scale.  I really hope that florida man and woman don’t foist him on the rest of us.

    Anyhoo, coming late to this thread, but “this asshole again” seems a particularly apt campaign slogan for the man; and maybe even both sides.  In the republican world, asshole is a positive.  It may have been our blogfather, but anyway I think it was here a long time ago where someone was saying all you to do to figure out the R position is to think of the asshole thing, and they will do or support that one.  It works.

  139. 139.

    debbie

    March 2, 2022 at 5:59 pm

    @Jerzy Russian:

    Can’t he be reported to the principal for bullying???

    Meanwhile, the Ohio GOP is unhappy with Biden because he mentioned the Intel semiconductor manufacturing plant that will be opening here. The assistant governor, John Husted, noted that Biden was very unpopular and it wasn’t surprising he’d try to attach himself to this successful project wholly obtained by himself and other state officials. ? ?

  140. 140.

    Kay

    March 2, 2022 at 6:02 pm

    @Baud:

    It doesn’t. They’re using the phrase that Democrats use and attributing it to Manchin. He didn’t say this- the idiot reporter filled it in:

    that changing the tax code to make the rich and corporations pay their fair share

    “Surtaxes”. Guffaw. Its the same bullshit dodge they used for the infrastructure bill.

    When the Manchin and Sinema bill comes out of production I guarantee there won’t be a single income tax increase in it. Democrats will take it because they have to, but the next time they have 50 Democrats they should rewrite the tax code and take it from our current “corrupt plutocrat code” to a decent countries code. 90% of the problems we’re facing get much easier with that one act. Want to make a dent in inequality? Start taxing them again. Want a less corrupt country? Start taxing them again. It’s the only thing that really matters.

  141. 141.

    Baud

    March 2, 2022 at 6:03 pm

    @Kay:

    Ok, thanks.  I’ll take anything positive, but no more negotiations in front of the media. That’s all I ask.

  142. 142.

    Kay

    March 2, 2022 at 6:14 pm

    I never resented paying income taxes until the Trump tax cuts. Just the absolutely obscene disparity between what ordinary tax payers got and the wealthiest people in the country got- it’s insulting and it makes you feel not like a good citizen, but instead a sucker.

    Democrats should fix it. It isn’t fair. They should stop letting Republicans bleed the public.

  143. 143.

    JAFD

    March 2, 2022 at 6:22 pm

    @Citizen Alan: OK, Assuming no one wants to do this on Easter / Passover weekend, that leaves:
    Sat 4/3, Sun 4/4, Sat 4/9, Sun 4/10, Sat 4/23, Sun 4/24, Sun 4/30, and maybe May Day
    Who has to rule out any of these dates ? (assuming you would be there on some other date.)
    Pass the word !​

  144. 144.

    Noname

    March 2, 2022 at 8:04 pm

    @WaterGirl: https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/woman-yelling-at-a-cat

  145. 145.

    sherparick1

    March 2, 2022 at 9:08 pm

    @Dorothy A. Winsor:

      Partly punching down, but also an example of getting high on one’s own supply. DeathSantis believe the conservative news sources, libertarian fanatics, & Christianist plutocrats that make up the dark network that controls the Republican Party. Because of his affinity for these bullshit artists, he actually now believes the BS. “That COVID is no worse than the flu.” “That masks don’t help.” “That vaccination does not stop infection so useless.” “That Fauci secretly caused the pandemic to sabotage Trump and gain power.” He almost has to believe these things because since he has been sabotaging the public health campaign for two years & probably creating circumstances that kill twice as many people who would have died of COVID-19 anyway, he would have to be a monster. Even monsters don’t like to believe they are monsters. So when he sees the students wearing masks, he just believes, as he said, it is performance BS to taunt him.

  146. 146.

    Paul in KY

    March 3, 2022 at 10:12 am

    @Kay: ‘Defund the Police’ is a horrible slogan.  Right up there with the Social Democrats letting the nutwad minority in their party claim the title ‘Bolsheviks’ (The Majority).

    I understand Pres. Biden wanting to kill it.

  147. 147.

    Paul in KY

    March 3, 2022 at 10:17 am

    @Yarrow: Wouldn’t surprise me if the person who thought it up or pushed it was a Repub plant.  It’s that bad.

  148. 148.

    Paul in KY

    March 3, 2022 at 10:33 am

    @Baud: It was about removing police from enforcing various petty laws that impose fines. Of course, as you know, they use the ‘enforcement’ of those laws to try and fish for probable cause to search & harrass people.

  149. 149.

    Diceros bicornis

    March 3, 2022 at 3:58 pm

    @JAFD: New York? In May? I’ll be back stateside for a long postponed vacation in mid May and would totally show up for this!

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