Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

My years-long effort to drive family and friends away has really paid off this year.

Somebody needs to explain to DeSantis that nobody needs to do anything to make him look bad.

Never entrust democracy to any process that requires republicans to act in good faith.

Can we lighten up on the doomsday scenarios?

You are so fucked. Still, I wish you the best of luck.

Happy indictment week to all who celebrate!

It’s easier to kill a dangerous animal than a man who just happens to have different thoughts/values than one’s own.

Donald Trump, welcome to your everything, everywhere, all at once.

The party of Reagan has become the party of Putin.

Trump makes a mockery of the legal system and cowardly judges just sit back and let him.

I’d try pessimism, but it probably wouldn’t work.

Relentless negativity is not a sign that you are more realistic.

rich, arrogant assholes who equate luck with genius

I conferred with the team and they all agree – still not tired of winning!

They fucked up the fucking up of the fuckup!

Wow, you are pre-disappointed. How surprising.

The new republican ‘Pastor’ of the House is an odious authoritarian little creep.

A sufficient plurality of insane, greedy people can tank any democratic system ever devised, apparently.

He imagines himself as The Big Bad, Who Is Universally Feared… instead of The Big Jagoff, Who Is Universally Mocked.

Reality always lies in wait for … Democrats.

Following reporting rules is only for the little people, apparently.

“Loving your country does not mean lying about it’s history.”

Michigan is a great lesson for Dems everywhere: when you have power…use it!

if you can’t see it, then you are useless in the fight to stop it.

You are here: Home / Open Threads / Sunday Morning Open Thread: Readership Capture

Sunday Morning Open Thread: Readership Capture

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  1. 1.

    NotMax

    Not that there’s a chance in Hades she’ll see it but a shout out to aunt in Brazil who turned 100 last week.

  2. 2.

    matt

    What they really want is a time machine so we can go back in time, train Ukrainians on various weapons systems we sell, and then supply those weapons systems and have them actually be useful today.

    Why won’t Joe fire up the time machine?

  3. 3.

    zhena gogolia

    @matt: I AM SO SICK OF ALL THESE PEOPLE WHO ACTED AS THOUGH THE ISSUES IN THE FIRST IMPEACHMENT WEREN’T REALLY VERY IMPORTANT

  4. 4.

    Walker

    The DST thing is never going to happen. Do you keep DST or Standard time?  We tried permanent DST in 1974. The psychological effects of dark winter mornings caused a major pushback from everyone. And too much of our current summer culture revolves around light summer evenings to go to Standard time.

    Yes, they do it in Arizona. But this is a lower latitude with less variability between seasons AND they actually want it to be dark in the summer.

  7. 7.

    germy

    ICYMI: “Frustration” inside the Democratic Party as Biden faces increased pressure to send more equipment to Ukraine, but calls such actions “World War III.” #MTPDaily

    @Yamiche: “The president has a red line and the red line is that he does not want to get into a war.” pic.twitter.com/nAwu2AMaME

    — Meet the Press (@MeetThePress) March 12, 2022

    This is a bizarre segment that treats the 60y+ US policy orientation toward avoiding potential nuclear wars as some outre view. https://t.co/FBtpUHa93J

    — southpaw (@nycsouthpaw) March 12, 2022

  8. 8.

    OzarkHillbilly

    Doctors want daylight saving time abolished. Here’s why, and what you can do about it

    Doctors don’t have to work out of doors.

  11. 11.

    NotMax

    Couple of items which recently caught the eye.

    1) High time to revisit the Jones Act of 1921. The ebb and flow of a global economy isn’t what it was a hundred years ago. Biden is on the wrong side of the fence on this.

    The ban on importation of Russian crude has led to a renewed call for Jones Act waivers – this time, in order to allow foreign-flagged tankers in U.S. coastwise trade. Congressman Ed Case (D-HI) has called on the White House to allow the shipment of petroleum to the Hawaiian market “from other domestic locations on non-Jones Act vessels.”

    Rep. Case supported the ban on Russian petroleum, but he noted that Hawaiian consumers will bear a greater share of the consequences of the prohibition than citizens in other states. Hawai’i’s sole refinery gets almost all of its oil from foreign nations, and about one third comes from Russia. Domestic oil from the mainland would be the best replacement for Russian imports, Case argued, but he asserted that it is too expensive because of domestic shipping requirements.

    “The costs of such shipping, even if it were available domestically to start with, would be higher by a number of multiples than transport on the plethora of non-U.S. flagged specialty vessels,” Case claimed. “By some accounts, shipping oil from the mainland U.S. to Hawai?i, a far shorter distance than from foreign sources, costs nearly three times as much as shipping from Asia . . . These costs would be passed on in price increases that are already among the highest in our country and would directly affect our national defense headquartered in Hawai’i.”
    [snip]
    The White House has not yet announced a position on tanker waivers, but President Joe Biden is a prominent supporter of the Jones Act. He invoked the Act’s requirements in a “Buy American” executive order within his first week in office, writing that he will “continue to be a strong advocate for the Jones Act and its mandate that only U.S.-flag vessels carry cargo between U.S. ports.”

    Aside from political considerations, the White House’s ability to grant waivers is narrower than it used to be, notes Winston & Strawn partner Charlie Papavisas. In early 2021, Congress put language into the annual defense appropriations bill to make the Pentagon’s authority to issue a Jones Act waiver much more tailored. The Pentagon can now issue a waiver only in order “to address an immediate adverse effect on military operations.” Previously, the DoD could grant a waiver for any “national defense” contingency – for example, responding to a hurricane.Source

    2) Harbinger or statistical blip?

    When it comes to losing enrolled Republicans over the last six years, almost no New York county tops Nassau.

    New state voter enrollment statistics show Nassau shed nearly 25,720 Republicans since April 2016, around the time Donald Trump had seized control of the race to win the GOP presidential nomination.

    Only Manhattan (New York County) lost more — and just barely, 25,903.

    Over the same period, the number of Nassau voters affiliated with no political party grew by nearly 29,000 and Democrats surged by 15,000. The Democratic growth in the county somewhat matches the rate of Democratic enrollment growth statewide.

    While the increase of Democrats in the county has been a long-term trend over several decades, the loss in GOP ranks is still notable in part because it was often called the vaunted Nassau Republican machine — the county Ronald Reagan once likened to heaven on earth for Republicans.
    [snip]
    Statewide, Republicans now are down to 22% of New York’s electorate and are now outnumbered by nonaffiliated voters: 2.6 million Republicans; 2.7 million independents. Democrats number 5.9 million. Source

  15. 15.

    RaflW

    The Jones Act is an economic strangle hold on Puerto Rico (as well as Hawaii, but PR household incomes are stunningly different). There is no legit reason a foreign flag vessel can’t bring South American produce directly to San Juan.

  16. 16.

    germy

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    I thought they wanted to keep daylight saving time year round and abolish standard time.  I can’t keep up with all the proposals.

    Any plan where I don’t have to change my clocks… I’m in favor of.

  17. 17.

    Mike E

    Bad even for MTP? They are dutifully fcuking that chicken of a narrative. Don’t fool yourselves into thinking our 4th estate are doing anything but what they’ve always done: serve their moneyed masters.

  18. 18.

    RaflW

    @NotMax: If they change their registration from Republican to none, but still vote “R” 95% of the time, did a tree fall in the woods?

    I think most right-leaning voters want the stink of being an R to go away, but want to keep the tax cuts, jingoism, and white privilege. As if how they vote, by being secret, doesn’t impugn them. They can loudly proclaim “I quit the party” in a most meaningless little gesture.

  19. 19.

    RaflW

    @germy: My wildly impractical solution: Split the baby. The US goes on a half-hour advance from the median solar noon of the time zones, and stays there year round.

    We’d line up better with India (UTC +5:30)!

  20. 20.

    Frankensteinbeck

    Is it any wonder that a career that teaches Savvy contrarianism and complete detachment from the effects of policies leads to pundits whose only attitude towards war is waving around toy planes and excitedly going, “Wooooosh, BOOM!”

  21. 21.

    Betty Cracker

    Mother Jones obtained a leaked memo from a Kremlin security agency that tells Russian media outlets that it’s “essential” to feature Tucker Carlson. Lord Haw Haw’s essential pro-Putin programming might offer yet another opportunity for the White House to reconsider issuing press credentials to his network.

  22. 22.

    mrmoshpotato

    @Baud: ​
     

    We’ll see if the country is willing to stand behind an anti war president.

    You can bet your ass that the Rethuglicans won’t.

  23. 23.

    Nelle

    I’ll try to be brief here and maybe I’m just venting. But I will welcome comments and advice. First, and I’m hesitant to confess this here, but I’m not really a dog person. I grew up with cats, my children had a cat, but after my daughter left home and took the cat, we’ve been extremely mobile (lived in KS, NZ, KS, Montana, NZ, KS, and now Iowa). Before Covid, we intended to travel a lot. So animals need more stability and care than we were going to be offering.
    My daughter is a dog and cat person and couldn’t say no to abandoned dogs so ended up with four rescued dogs and one rescued cat. One of the dogs is highly anxious and barks intimidatingly in new situations with people. But she has had them for about seven years and we’ve been around him a lot. We’re cautious and even so, he’s nipped me three times over the years if I end up between him and my daughter who he needs and who he protects. He seems stuck in that behavior – looks like a big German Shepherd, though is a mix, and he scares people.
    So, they are in the process of moving from Arizona to Minnesota, but due to complications on the place that they are purchasing (the couple is divorcing and the guy is being a dick), they are stranded, maybe until the end of April. Her in-laws have a place in the country (we’re in suburbia with a small yard) and invited them there. They say they are dog people. They are also Q-Anon and push that at every moment. Toxic to my daughter but, for the sake of the dogs, she was going to put up with it.
    Last week, one of their dogs growled at one of hers and her dog lashed out at them. Their solution was to suggest hanging her dog until he passed out and stand over him when he came to so he would understand who was the boss.
    Despite that we didn’t want dogs in our house (I lose balance – working on that – and didn’t want to be knocked over by a dog), we were horrified and said, get up here (about six hours away), so she is here with the two big dogs. Her husband will be coming up with the cat and two little dogs this week.
    These are mean people and the MAGA part is just part of it.
    How did my SIL come from them? Well, he ran from them as a teenager, but now that he is making money (and has a college degree, with our encouragement and support, now that he sold a house he bought for 350,000 for 600,000 three years later, now that he has a decent job), he is worth knowing to them. The sad rejected kid in him is soaking up their approval, something he hasn’t really felt since his mother died when he was eight (he has a stepmom and four younger half brothers ).
    What a cluster-fuck some people are.
    Meanwhile, my daughter is hiring a trainer to come work with the dogs as she thinks that they are both traumatized by the four weeks that they were at the inlaws.
    So we are trying to be supportive and she’s keeping the dogs in the basement. But they whine and bark if she isn’t with them most of the waking time. When they come up to be taken out to do their business, they bark at us wildly. It’s been very cold (single digits at night) but is warming up today. I’m suggesting that we do walks with dogs, separately) today, so that they can be reminded that we are safe people. But other suggestions welcome.

  24. 24.

    Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes

    @MomSense:

    Saw your Twitter exchange with Doug about Greenwald.

    My god, that 2010 thread he linked. Greenwald was ratfucking vulnerable red state Democrats with Democratic funds for personal profit along with that idiot Hamsher. What I wouldn’t do to have Blanche Lincoln back in the Senate.

    I was around here some then, but completely missed that special appearance.

    I wonder how many people are ruined or dead from his efforts over the years?

  27. 27.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @germy: I have no idea what anyone wants these days. But I well remember starting my *October work days* in the dark. It’s great to start one’s day by mashing fingers and thumb with a framing hammer. Just lovely.

    ** before the switch from DST to Standard time.

  28. 28.

    Frank Wilhoit

    @germy: Local time is bad magic.  The only rationale for it is to put the Sun overhead at noon; but where I live the Sun is overhead at 1330 during “Standard” time and at 1430 during…the other thing.  The real problem — which, like all real problems, is intractable — is the the length of daylight varies from 9 to 15 hours.  No one is ever going to be happy with that, but it is the necessary starting point.  Everything else has to adapt to it.  (DST is not an adaptation, it is a piece of make-believe.)

  30. 30.

    eclare

    @Nelle:   Wow.  I don’t have any advice, I hope the trainer works out.  I will tell you what a trainer told me “Some dogs just don’t like each other.”  My response, “Really?”

    Her response, “Do you like everyone you meet?”

    Anyone advocating punishment, leave immediately.

    Best of luck.  I will say Trazadone dramatically reduced one of my dog’s anxiety issues where she did not even chew, might be something to look at in the short term.

    ETA>  very cheap and at any vet

  31. 31.

    Soprano2

    Doctors who want to do away with DST can bite me. I want sunshine in the evening in the summer. Why people want the sun to rise at 5 A.M. and set at 7:00 P.M. in June is a mystery to me.

  32. 32.

    zhena gogolia

    @Betty Cracker: Great that we aren’t inviting Gergiev and Netrebko any more — BUT WE’RE TOLERATING KREMLIN PROPAGANDA ON A U.S. NETWORK. Sorry for the all caps, I am just seething about this.

    ETA: Russian filmmakers who oppose Putin are being disinvited from film festivals, but Tucker Carlson gets to just roll along. Blech.

  33. 33.

    Mike R

    @Nelle: Being a bit unsocial would have suggested doing a test run by hanging in-laws to see how it worked out.  But good luck with the dogs, patience and calm are all that I can think to try.

  34. 34.

    Soprano2

    @Nelle: Wish I had suggestions. Sounds like walking the dogs so they can get to know you and get some exercise is a good idea. I hope those people don’t have their own dogs because their idea of “discipline is horrific.

  35. 35.

    Yarrow

    @Mike E:  The question to ask is who is paying them to do this? Who are the moneyed masters?

    This thread has some interesting details about how The Telegraph in the UK was paid by Russia to run reports on Russia.

    +UPDATE+

    The Telegraph Newspaper is estimated “to have recieved many millions” from the Russian State News Agency – RIA Novosti – to run Russia reports from 2007 onwards.

    During this time Telegraph’s reporting on Putin softened – while the paper became increasingly anti Europe.
    — Nick?????? (@nicktolhurst) March 12, 2022

  37. 37.

    Mike E

    @eclare: 2nd’d. Miss E’s pup has different issues but she has responded well to doggie prozac and currently has some kitty buddies to keep her social behavior in good practice. And treats, lots of treats, might also help those anxious dogs have a positive association with their new humans. Of course, ymmv but best of luck to those in this situation.

  39. 39.

    germy

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    I see those forehead flashlights for sale at Aldi.  A headband with an LED light.  I wish I’d had one back in the 70s.  It might have saved me from some mishaps.

  40. 40.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @Nelle: Sorry you are in that situation, there are no no easy answers.

    Billy Jean suffers from anxiousness due to her early months/year of abuse and is an aggressive barker when approached by strangers. She probably always will be, thankfully she is not a biter. I just warn people ahead of time.

  41. 41.

    germy

    @debbie:

    All of reality and human suffering is just something for them to express their opinions on…  for a handsome salary.

  42. 42.

    eclare

    @Mike E:   Doggie Prozac was a miracle to my Sophie.  She had a horrific puphood, and no amount of my attention would fix that.  But the drug dramatically reduced her anxiety.

  45. 45.

    Soprano2

    @eclare: I know it varies by region and occupation. As it is here our repair crews start work at 6 A.M. once we get to the heart of the summer because it’s so hot by 2 P.M. I selfishly want some of that sunshine and warmth to occur when I’m not at work and can enjoy it! In the end climate change may change the argument anyway.

  49. 49.

    MomSense

    @Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes:

    I seem to remember there was also a former MSNBC blowhard who was part of that stupid primary Blanche Lincoln because a real progressive woulda won nonsense who ended up at RT.

    I was on the losing side of the balloon juice battles about Greenwald, Assange/wikileaks, Snowden, DRONEZ but I think most everyone has come around at this point.

  50. 50.

    germy

    @Soprano2:

    What a time to be alive

     

    I’m still amazed I can push a tiny button on my car key and lock my car from inside my house.  I would have laughed at the idea in 1975.

  51. 51.

    Mike E

    @Yarrow: I reflexively don’t trust Russians (Yugo kid here) but our Free Press history is pretty much played out in the pocket of whoever holds the cards (oil / mining / industry / defense / finance / pharma et al) at that given moment. Money is speech, doncha know, and corporations are people my friend! As much as it would gratify me to see the Dems pull back that curtain the news media will use Putin tactics to maintain their position in any scenario, even wartimes.

  52. 52.

    eclare

    @Soprano2:   Oh I understand…I just want people in northern states advocating for sunshine at night to understand why some of us may be against that.

    And I know I am in a minority on this.

  53. 53.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @germy: Caving helmets are designed to hold headlamps. Hardhats, aren’t. I used a portable halogen lamp but that unidirectional light source has it’s own problems casting shadows etc. I always felt for highway workers working overnight repaving highways. I’d get a headache just thinking about working under those blast lights. (my personal word for them)

    There’s just nothing like the sun.

  54. 54.

    West of the Rockies

    @Betty Cracker:

    Carlson is such a vile moron.  Am I reading it right that 80% of Republicans view Russia more as an enemy?  Pinhead Carlson has an ever-shrinking audience.   I hope he and Hannity get crushed (figuratively or literally but preferably the latter).

  57. 57.

    germy

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    Speaking of highway workers, I’m always amazed at how people want to speed through work zones.

    Whenever I see the “work zone ahead” signs I slow down and I’m often tailgated.

  58. 58.

    Starfish

    @Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes: I went back to read the Twitter thread.

    I wonder what made it easier for MomSense to see Greenwald was garbage earlier.

    The inability to acknowledge mistakes that you have made and continue to be over-confident is a flaw that a number of men carry around and are less likely to be punished for.

    Women like Elizabeth Holmes and Anna Sorokin are more unusual because women are less likely to get away with arrogant bullshitting.

  59. 59.

    Calouste

    @OzarkHillbilly: There are some doctors who want daylight savings time so they can get a round of golf in after work, and there are some who want it abolished so they can get a round in before work.

  60. 60.

    Yarrow

    I hate the time changes whichever way they go, although getting an extra hour of sleep is nice. Takes me forever to adjust.

    However, my pet peeve about the whole thing now that Daylight Savings Time is eight months of the year and Standard Time is four months of the year is that the names are wrong. The one in place the longer time should get the title of “Standard Time.” The four months that are now Standard Time should have a different name. “Bleak Months Time.” “US Winter Time.” Or my dad’s favorite, “Daylight Wasting Time” (dad joke).

  63. 63.

    Betty Cracker

    @Nelle: No advice except check out the doggie Xanax — it’s been a gamechanger for my sister’s anxious rescue dog. Also wanted to note what a good and supportive mom and MIL you are. At great personal inconvenience!

  66. 66.

    MagdaInBlack

    @Betty Cracker: I’ve watched Tucker lately and noticed he’s become a wee bit more panicked. He has more than the usual amount of the guinea pig squeal to his voice. I’m beginning to wonder just what kind of secrets his minders have on him.

  68. 68.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @eclare: And when camping. I’ve been using headlamps… For a long time. They are great, especially at night in the summertime woods. I knew some British cavers who came over to see how we Yanks do it. Did an Ozarkistan cave trip with some friends of mine. They got out of the cave after dark (of course) and he was tra-la-la-ing his way down the trail when a buddy of mine reminded him that we have venomous snakes. Not 2 mins later he had an up close and personal encounter with a copperhead. He was a lot more careful after that.

  73. 73.

    eclare

    @OzarkHillbilly:   Hahaha…we don’t have many venomous snakes, but we do have them!

    Almost stepped on a huge cottonmouth once crossing a stream.  Almost.  Whew.

  75. 75.

    Calouste

    @Yarrow: How did they notice the Torygraph became more anti-Europe? They kind of have to call for nuking Brussels for that to become noticeable.

  80. 80.

    MagdaInBlack

    I’ve decided to try out watching the tfg rally thru my usual filter of Hal Sparks, but gd that old man is boring. Even Hal can’t save this.

  83. 83.

    Kirk Spencer

    @RaflW: The Jones act wouldn’t affect oil from South America to Puerto Rico.

    The Jones act only deals with shipments moving from US port to US port.

  84. 84.

    RaflW

    @MagdaInBlack: I maintain that these people are just deeply, horribly empty and awful people. They don’t do it because of leverage over them. They do it because they are morally deficient, all on their own (well, their parenting, social circles, and maybe their genes contribute).

  85. 85.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @eclare: We were skinny dipping on a small Shannon County creek. I was sitting spread legged on the edge of the gravel bar with my feet in the water looking for fossils. I looked up just in time to see a 2+’ water moccasin swim to with one foot of my family jewels. I grabbed a handful of gravel but wasn’t about to throw it unless I had no choice. S/He and I engaged in a staredown contest for what felt like an eternity but couldn’t have been but a minute or so.

    It finally backed off, deciding I guess that I’d gotten the message: “Way back heah, this is our home… Don’t nobody fuck with us.”

  87. 87.

    MagdaInBlack

    @RaflW: I agree they’re morally deficient, but in tuckers case I see a morally deficient simpleton who may have gotten himself in a bit deeper than he expected. Thus the panic I’m noticing.

    But agreed, they’re all scum.

  88. 88.

    Geminid

    @MagdaInBlack: That was a chilly evening outside of Florence. One item in the reporting that struck me was how after Lindell, Governor McMaster and others spoke, nearly two hours passed before Trump’s motorcade drove up. He then got up on stage and commented about how cold it was.

  89. 89.

    RaflW

    @Kirk Spencer: I favor wiping out all the US Flag requirements for vessels. It should be coupled with drastically changing how we register, operate and insure US Flag vessels so that Bahamian and Panamanian flags aren’t the primary registries.

    I have no hope that will happen. But the Jones act is crap.

  90. 90.

    RaflW

    @OzarkHillbilly: One rarely-discussed impact of climate change that I think Minnesotans aren’t prepared for: We are, except for a few Mississippi bluff counties in far SE Minnesota, venomous snake free.

    We’ll see how far in-state they wriggle as winters (generally) warm. We had a good run of sub-zeros this year (including the wee hours of Saturday this weekend!) so one hopes the slither is held off at least another year or two!

  91. 91.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @RaflW: We are, except for a few Mississippi bluff counties in far SE Minnesota, venomous snake free.

    Huh, I did not know that. You’re right tho, it’s gonna change.

  93. 93.

    VOR

    @MagdaInBlack: I suspect Lord Haw Haw has other, possibly related issues to panic about. Remember when Matt Gaetz talked about his dinner with Tucker and a date? Might be a shoe yet to drop.

  94. 94.

    laura

    @Baud: You are so right about the good sense of Momsense. I followed the FDL, and found the turn to WTF when this event hit me like a glass of ice water to the face: https: //youtube/dQw4w9WgXcQ

    At least Tbogg and Emptywheel are among the survivors and decent people.

  99. 99.

    Soprano2

    @germy: I’m amazed I have an app on my phone that lets me start my car! In 2000 who thought we’d be able to carry a computer in our pocket?

  100. 100.

    lowtechcyclist

    @Soprano2: ​
     

    Doctors who want to do away with DST can bite me. I want sunshine in the evening in the summer. Why people want the sun to rise at 5 A.M. and set at 7:00 P.M. in June is a mystery to me.

    A lot of the anti-switching people want year-round DST, in which case the sun wouldn’t rise until about 8:30am in mid-winter. Not fun either.

    I’m very much in favor of springing forward and falling back. My only objections are:

    1) DST starts a few weeks too soon in the spring, and ends a week or two too late in the fall. I dread how dark it’s gonna be tomorrow morning.

    2) a) Springing forward should happen on a Friday night rather than Saturday, to give all us five-day-a-week types an extra day to get used to the time change before staggering into work on Monday morning.
    b) And on the flip side, the time change in the fall should take place on a Sunday night, so we’d get an extra hour of sleep that Monday morning, when it really matters. Who cares if you get an extra hour on Sunday morning? You can take your time waking up then anyway.

  101. 101.

    lowtechcyclist

    @Soprano2: @germy: I’m amazed I have an app on my phone that lets me start my car! In 2000 who thought we’d be able to carry a computer in our pocket?

    Hell, less than a decade before that, most people would have been boggled by the idea of a computer in their home.

    Everyday life in 1992 had way more in common with everyday life in 1962 than it does with everyday life now.

  102. 102.

    Miss Bianca

    @zhena gogolia: Meanwhile, I continue to be astounded as to how many people don’t even seem to realize that the first impeachment was ALL ABOUT what Trump was doing to fuck over Zelenskyy and Ukraine. Like, WTF, folks, were you not paying any attention AT ALL?

  104. 104.

    RaflW

    Oh, speaking of paid Russian assets, Tulsa Gabardine is tweeting out utter disinfo Ukraine ‘biolab leak’ bullshit.

    I don’t know what our country can legally do to shut her the heck up, but see certainly needs to be marginalized as much as possible.

  105. 105.

    Yarrow

    @Miss Bianca:  No. They weren’t. People didn’t understand it because that meant learning things and paying attention over several days. It was all happening in some country they didn’t know where it was or anything about. It didn’t seem to affect people’s daily lives so they tuned out.

  107. 107.

    Carlo Graziani

    On the topic of Biden’s “red lines”:

    Suppose, for the sake of argument, that at this moment there were in fact US servicemen in Ukraine, in the capacity of military advisors — presumably in some informal, deniable arrangement, for example seconded to CIA and in UKR Army uniforms, and well out of combat area, for Intelligence liaison, training, other purposes that people with actual military experience (unlike me) might speak to. Does anyone here believe that Biden would be saying anything in any way different in public statements concerning the unwisdom of sending NATO forces to Ukraine?

    Yeah, me neither.

    I don’t know whether US advisors are in fact in Ukraine, although I would offer long odds that there are at least intelligence liaison folks there, were there some way to settle such a bet. Public pronouncements by government figures in war should be assumed to have instrumental purposes, and that includes our own government. “Truth is the first casualty of war” may be a cliche, but it is wisdom nonetheless — if you prefer the more inspiring Churchillian epigram, “In wartime, truth is so precious that she should always be attended by a bodyguard of lies.“

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