POTUS gets a standing ovation after paying tribute to the late AFL-CIO President Richard Trumka, whom he said once called him the most pro-union president in the history of the country. Biden says he promised he would be and will continue to do so as long as he has this job. pic.twitter.com/TWVs3ccEwr
— Courtney Subramanian (@cmsub) June 14, 2022
Biden says prices are too high, gas prices are up. "But here's the deal: America still has a choice to make. A choice between a government by the few for the few, or government for all of us." He criticized Ted Cruz, Rick Scott, Ron Johnson; praised John Fetterman, Stacey Abrams.
— Jennifer Jacobs (@JenniferJJacobs) June 14, 2022
“Trump did not leave a very good situation,” says @POTUS to the @AFLCIO audience, which responds with laughter. “You think I’m kidding.” pic.twitter.com/lirzrQfJbz
— Steve Herman (@W7VOA) June 14, 2022
Biden: “Look, I believe in bipartisanship, but I have no illusions about this Republican Party, the MAGA party. I've been able to bring some Republicans along on parts of my plan, but the fact is Republicans in Congress are still in the grip of the ultra MAGA agenda."
— Kate Sullivan (@KateSullivanDC) June 14, 2022
“Are you prepared to fight with me…to build a better America?” concludes @POTUS to cheers and applause from the @AFLCIO audience in Philadelphia. pic.twitter.com/LnvlCfw1KU
— Steve Herman (@W7VOA) June 14, 2022
Test: https://twitter.com/W7VOA/status/1536734937092694021?s=20&t=D62GorAhABuko2SzXXSUnw
Test 2: Potus at AFLCIO
Baud
I’m a little cynical when it comes to labor, but I appreciate Biden putting in the effort.
debbie
Jesus, finally.
debbie
@Baud:
I’ll take labor over Wall St./corporate America anytime.
Baud
@debbie:
I’m not sure what that means. My cynicism relates to labor’s political abilities.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Baud: yeah, whenever I hear “Democrats abandoned labor”, I think somebody’s got subject and object backwards, at least with the (white guys in) hard hats that most pundits are thinking of when they talk about “labor”
also, in inflation fighting news:
Baud
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Biden is probably the best president Labor has had in a long time. I would like to see them build on the momentum.
debbie
@Baud:
Labor may not be the major force it was previously, but there’s still plenty of votes there
ETA: I agree Biden’s their best president.
JPL
OT The NYTimes had an article about Herschel’s secret child, but because they are the NYTimes they did point out that Senator Warnock’s wife wanted to recalculate child support. Both sides you all!!
Baud
@debbie:
Right. Dems and Labir attached at the hip. No question. I’m just saying Labor as a whole hasn’t lived up to its full potential when it comes to political power. Maybe that’ll change, but I haven’t seen much evidence except a few glimmers here and there.
Soprano2
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Good, put their feet to the fire and get it out there more widely that this is a choice they’ve made to drive up the price of gas. People are angry at the wrong target.
Geminid
@Baud: Political power is very fragmented these days. Organized Labor is one of the larger fragments and its numbers can give it substantial grass-roots organizing clout, even if unions can’t neccesarily deliver all their own members.
I recall the November 1, 2020 Politico article, “Inside the machine to turn out Latinos-and turn Arizona Blue.” It described a campaign to register and mobilize Latino voters. Its volunteers had visited hundreds of thousands of homes in Latino neighborhoods. This was a coalition of community groups and labor unions, and it may well have made the difference in Joe Biden and Mark Kelly’s victories in Arizona.
Baud
@Geminid:
Agree. Compared to other parts of the Dem coalition, Labor is one of the stronger forces. When it comes to the U.S. as a whole, I feel like Labor underperforms. I don’t have hard evidence, obviously. It’s just a sense.
zhena gogolia
I love Biden. That is all.
Ken
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Just yesterday I was thinking how we’re continually fed the message that capitalism is good and government shouldn’t interfere with the markets. Until capitalism does what it does, and then the same people are asking why the government doesn’t intervene in the markets.
I was thinking of it in the context of baby food, but gas prices works too.
sdhays
@JPL: Hershel Walker claims he was an FBI agent and police officer, except he hasn’t ever been either of those things, but Warnock misspelled something in a memo (probably) so, you know, both sides.
I’m waiting for Walker to tell us about his trip to Mars before the end of this race.
Baud
@Ken:
Agreed.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@Baud: It’s taking labor a while to let its good intentions outweigh its historically shaped white male beginning. It’s getting there, but we’ll see
JPL
@sdhays: The day is still young.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Some good news
Baud
@Dorothy A. Winsor:
Yes. In some sense, labor is just a microcosm of the racism fueled dysfunction of the U.S. as a whole.
Baud
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Despite the rhetoric of TX GOP, renewables are doing well there.
Betty Cracker
@sdhays: The only good that can come out of the Hershel Walker candidacy is elevated awareness about CTE.
rikyrah
Good Morning Everyone
Baud
@rikyrah:
Good morning.
Baud
@Betty Cracker:
And about the GOP.
rikyrah
to lamh and her family. One of her sisters passed away last night.
Immanentize
@Baud: Regan divided labor (or maybe it was Nixon?) The very fact that the AFL which was a conservative pro-white laborer branch of the UAW is now a partner to the anti-racist, (more) progressive CIO is like a Janus coin.
The power is there to be tapped. But the consensus is not.
Baud
@rikyrah:
MY condolences to her. I miss her here.
Betty Cracker
@rikyrah: That’s awful. Will keep her in my thoughts.
OzarkHillbilly
@Baud: In my experience, Labor goes with whoever brings home the bacon. They endorsed Blunt every time he ran because he was always putting Misery in for big federal projects. It didn’t matter that the GOP was trying time and again to turn Misery into a Right to Work for less state.
Geminid
@Baud: The midterms should be a good test of organized labor’s political capabilities, at least in states and districts where unions are strong.
Dina Titus, for instance, will need labor’s help to be reelected in the redrawn Nevada 1st CD. Marcy Kaptur (OH) is now in a R+3 district, and I think unions will play an important role in her campaign.. Someone in Kaptur’s district could give a more knowledgable opinion on this.
Labor can potentially make substantial contributions in the Senate campaigns of Catherine Cortez-Masto, John Fetterman, and Tim Ryan. We’ll be able to better gauge labor’s impact after the next few months.
Immanentize
@rikyrah: Omg, I am so sorry to hear that.
Jeffro
So…who wants to talk about Lauren Boebert and Ted Cruz?
I said “talk about”, not “think about”.
Immanentize
@Baud: GOP = CTE?
Really not too far off. A few COVID denier-to-the-end brain dissections might tell a story?
debbie
@Immanentize:
Reagan, when he broke PATCO.
debbie
@Jeffro:
Over on Twitter, it’s thought the same group that ended Cawthorne’s career is behind this Boebert/Cruz stuff.
Immanentize
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: My inlaws moved to a house in a subdivision west of Sugarland (which is southwest of Houston). The HOA had lots of stuff, but included was — roofing must be black and no rooftop (or yard) solar allowed. That is insane, but the deal with the oil boys was solid.
OzarkHillbilly
Those Chinese are really going to far with this global climate change hoax.
eversor
@Dorothy A. Winsor:
An issue with labor is that the jobs are very stratified by ethnicity/race/sex. So one sector union can have nothing culturally in common with another. There really isn’t any solidarity between unions. It’s each service sector scrapping for their own slice and many unions are staunchly socially conservative and culture will always decide votes before economics.
One of the strengths of organizing a union for say Amazon warehouse workers is that doesn’t really apply. It’s a fairly diverse group and while they are all doing different things they are all stuck in the same facility together. Ditto for a possible Tesla union or Starbucks.
I get the feeling the reason Bezos, Musk, Schultz are all so massively anti union (outside the normal reasons) is they see the diversity of job work and workers they have and realize if one of them falls the jig is up and things could turn around.
rikyrah
@JPL:
Ridiculous
Kent
@Baud: Some of the industrial unions have been pretty disappointing as of late, and too damn MAGA-curious frankly.
But Labor is larger than that. The teacher’s unions have been pretty damn loyal, for example. Despite being pretty betrayed by the Obama Administration with the selection and regime of Arne Duncan who was a complete horror frankly. With all the promotion of the charter school fraudsters.
Around here it is the teacher’s unions that often get candidates over the bar. In my county there isn’t much else
Kay
@Baud:
Their great strength as an ally is they are pragmatic. They know what they want and they are less likely than other D groups to collapse into infighting, because they have a heirarchy- a structure- within labor unions and they elect their own leaders. It’s a negotiation and you have to be comfortable with that to work with them. You won’t get everything you want- they don’t focus on a lot of our issues and don’t pretend to- but you’ll get a lot. They can be great on imposing discipline on the rest of the groups when there’s something they want and they think D groups are dragging it off track. So like a minimum wage ballot initiative. It isn’t going to be voting rights, womens rights and minimum wage. It’s going to be minimum wage. That makes people mad sometimes.
Baud
@debbie:
That was a long time ago.
Ken
I feel so virtuous. I got my vote-by-mail primary ballot yesterday, and actually sat down and researched the candidates as I voted. Well, for those few races with more than one. Now I just have to remember to mail it sometime in the next week.
Immanentize
@debbie: Nixon when he got labor goons to beat on Hippies and black kids
Immanentize
@debbie: Do they have a go fund me somewhere?
Baud
@Kent: Right. My observation is about labor as a whole, at the 50,000 level where the unevenness gets smoothed out.
debbie
@OzarkHillbilly:
If these 100+ degree days don’t convince them climate change is real, what will for chrissakes? There are neighborhoods here who have had their power cut off which won’t be restored until Friday.
Baud
@Kay:
Sure. I’m not questioning the importance of the alliance.
Immanentize
@OzarkHillbilly: Let the battle for the earth top begin!
Ken
I heard about the videos and such here on BJ, but I missed the part about his career ending. Did he resign? Lose a primary?
(I suppose I could google it, but that might serve up his picture, and I’m working on my blood pressure.)
zhena gogolia
@rikyrah: Oh, I’m so sorry!
debbie
@Baud:
Doesn’t make it any less evil, does it?
debbie
@Immanentize:
I didn’t realize there was a connection. Just the usual anti-hippy crap.
zhena gogolia
@debbie: Oh, what is this? Sounds juicy.
Immanentize
@Kent: The SEIU is big and growing in the Northeast. I think they took some hits in COVID as a lot of their peeps were laid off in the service industry. But it seems they are having a bit of a (quiet) resurgence in this tight back-to-business recovery.
debbie
@Ken:
He lost his primary. I assume that’s the end of his Congressional career.
zhena gogolia
@Ken: He lost his primary.
Immanentize
@Kay: I am hoping Marty Walsh, who totally speaks the language of labor, can find out what issue that is right now and get labor into the 2022 game.
rikyrah
@Jeffro:
If true, explains a lot
rikyrah
@Jeffro:
The question should be is why is this coming out now?
geg6
@Jeffro:
I have no idea what this is about, but I’m pretty sure that whatever it is will gross me completely out.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
one of Obama’s campaign gurus said the UAW kept Ohio and possibly MI in his column in 2012 due to the rescue of the auto industry and “Let Detroit Go Bankrupt”
Ken
On to the Senate! Or perhaps a lifetime appointment as a judge somewhere.
debbie
@zhena gogolia:
I’ve never heard of this PAC, but they apparently were behind Cawthorne’s misfortunes:
zhena gogolia
@geg6: Yeah, I dipped my pinky toe in, and it ain’t pretty.
zhena gogolia
@debbie: Sounds true. Now do Greene.
debbie
@Kay:
I think they’ve realized what really matters. The blackness of Obama threw them for a loop.
debbie
@debbie:
It’s run by some guy named David A. Wheeler.
ETA: They eat their own.
Immanentize
@rikyrah: Here is my take. Although the focus is on Boebert right now, the more interesting story of the “modeling agency,” run by an Israeli it seems, who had a number of now-dialed-in Republican women as clients. Including Candace Owen and the woman who testified with Rudy! in Wisconsin (I think).
The GOP Daddy Caucus (still run, I presume, by Dick Cheney from his basement) is seeing the J6 committee as a critical moment for the party. Some of the House members were neck deep in the actual insurrection, and who those people are is probably known to the GOP elites (both Trumpers and anti-Trump folk).
Boebert is one of them. It would not be a bad time to move her along with information seemingly unrelated to the actual J6 events, while at the same time take a big swipe at the GOP Trump grooming agency that is just a bit too crazy for the old guard. They are trying to get the monster back to the lab.
NotMax
Bostonian byword: Piss off.
:)
dww44
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: At the risk of being labeled a conspiracy theorist, I think there is a good possibility the price of gas has been, in part, deliberately manipulated by our corporate masters to undermine Biden and Democrats. They only want to put the GOP back at the helm so that they can continue to turn the country into one ruled by oligarchs.
They do not believe in true democracy. Like the party they support, there is an obvious sense of entitlement and belief that the country should always be ruled by them.
O. Felix Culpa
Elon is taking us
to the mountaintopover the cliff:WaPo
sab
@rikyrah: Oh no. That’s terrible.
Soprano2
@rikyrah: Oh no, I am so sorry. :-(
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@dww44: not a doubt in my mind that MBS and teh other Gulf state rulers want trump and Jared back in power
germy shoemangler
@debbie:
I didn’t know escorts were licensed in this country.
Betty Cracker
The PAC that took down Cawthorn and is going after Boebert is run by Republicans, I think. Good. Let them tear each other to pieces. I don’t even care about their motives. I hope they do Gaetz next.
germy shoemangler
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Netanyahu certainly did.
NotMax
‘@dww44
A string of Illuminatiesque bridges too far. Oil and gas price spikes are a worldwide phenomenon.
Immanentize
@O. Felix Culpa: The super scary detail in the auto drive issue at Tesla seems to be that the auto drive feature spontaneously disengages about 1 second before each collision allowing Tesla to say that the auto drive software wasn’t being used at the time of the crash.
That sounded too crazy to be possible, but I asked the Immp (who has historically been a Musk fan) and he said, certainly the software could be programmed like that, but it would not always be reliable depending on the sudden or unexpected nature of a crash. So, the investigation continues
Immanentize
@germy shoemangler: That suggests you have been using illegal under the table escorts?
Kay
@Immanentize:
You just have to take them for what they are and don’t expect “liberals” or even particularly ideological.
They approach this as a negotiation. If you appreciate the clear lines of that, and I do, you don’t have to do a whole lot of analysis on what they aren’t.
If it benefits them the issues can intersect, but only if it benefits them. So in Ohio they did a campaign to repeal an anti-labor law and they also took on a voting rights effort at the same time, because there’s a clear connection there. They may or may not be racist but they’ll pick up voting rights if it nets them 7000 more votes in Columbus for the labor initiative. Everyone involved understands this because they’re not hiding it.
Soprano2
Now for something totally different – someone found Richard Spencer, famous white nationalist, on the Bumble dating site listing himself as politically “moderate”. They are a reader of Jezebel, so someone from the site interviewed him. It was strange, to say the least.
Baud
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
The Brotherhood of the Glowing Orb is forever.
Soprano2
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Oh no doubt, they are birds of a feather for sure.
O. Felix Culpa
@Immanentize:
If I understand correctly, that auto-disengage feature means that the crash rate could be even higher than reported. Yikes!
Elon tends to be popular among young engineering males. The son of one of my closest friends recently got an internship at Space-X, and is over the moon about it. I swallowed my tongue about Musk and just congratulated the young man for his not insignificant achievement.
Baud
@Kay:
I think the question is, does being purely transactional help or hurt them in the long run.
germy shoemangler
@Immanentize:
Not me, the Koch family. Muckraker keeps calling her an “unlicensed” escort which makes it sound like most escorts are licensed, like they renew every year after an inspection or something.
It sounds like the Boebert/Koch thing (if it’s true) was a sugardaddy situation. But who knows? The more I try to understand the story, the more nauseated I feel. People can do whatever they want with their personal lives, but it’s disgusting that Boebert won an election.
Soprano2
@O. Felix Culpa: Several years ago I got into an unexpectedly heated exchange with a co-worker when I simply observed that I believe true self-driving cars are a lot further off than some people think. He was quite heated in defending the idea that they’re just around the corner because they’re safer, blah blah blah. No acknowledgment of the huge infrastructure that would have to be built in cities to support them, no thinking that perhaps we’d better make sure they work right before we unleash them on the world. It surprised me, the ferocity of the belief.
NotMax
‘@>a href=”https://install.local/wednesday-morning-open-thread-plugging-away/#comment-16302″>O. Felix Culpa
“You can’t make an omelet without smashing eggs.”
// // // // //
Ken
Nice, but I’ll still have to give the programming award to the clever team at Volkswagen who programmed their vehicles to detect that they were undergoing emissions tests, and only then turn on the emissions controls. And to think that Volkswagen tried to denigrate that accomplishment as a “bug”. Maybe in the sense of “undocumented feature”…
O. Felix Culpa
@Soprano2:
It appears that Musk has a cult following, supported by rabid bots.
germy shoemangler
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
US Retail Sales Unexpectedly Drop in May as Inflation Weighs on Spending
Baud
@O. Felix Culpa:
Musk’s companies do interesting things from an engineering perspective. That can overshadow the broader picture.
Ken
Only in Nevada.
JPL
@rikyrah: How sad and please relay our sympathies.
Betty Cracker
Last night Elon Musk tweeted that he’s leaning toward supporting DeSantis in 2024, in case there’s any remaining doubt that Musk is okay with authoritarianism as long as it benefits himself.
Ken
Paid? Or is that a silly question nowadays?
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@rikyrah:
How awful. My condolences to lamh and her family
O. Felix Culpa
@Baud:
Yes, which is why my friend’s son was so eager to get the Space-X internship and why I’m happy for him. He’s had a longstanding interest in space exploration and there are limited opportunities to work in that field.
Kay
@Betty Cracker:
It’s becoming clearer and clearer though that they are rehabilitating the Republican Party. Obviously that’s part of what Cheney is doing. They hope to keep the good parts of MAGA and discard the parts that harm them with moderates. Right now that works for Democrats but just so everyone is clear that’s what’s going on here. Cheney hopes to isolate Trump and draw a distinction between him and the mainstream party. That won’t work for Democrats politically. It works right now but that won’t last.
I’m really interested to see what she does with the GOP House and Senate pieces of this – I assume she will try to isolate them as unwanted and unrepresentative radicals too, where Democrats won’t want that, right? Democrats want to say “the Party is ultra MAGA”. This marriage of convenience is going to be very short :)
O. Felix Culpa
@Ken:
I don’t know if it’s paid.
Baud
@Kay: She has to win her primary first.
ETA:
They do, but I’m not sure it’ll work. The GOP, being the white person’s party, gets the privilege of not being subject to guilt by association.
JPL
@Betty Cracker: According to twitter, Elon is anti-trans.
JPL
duplicate
Baud
@JPL: What does that mean? Either he said or did something anti-trans or he didn’t. (Besides supporting the GOP).
Immanentize
@Kay: I actually like that approach/attitude.
germy shoemangler
@JPL:
JPL
@Betty Cracker: Why didn’t they take down MTG? Her multiple affairs are public knowledge.
germy shoemangler
@Baud:
He goes out of his way to insult trans people. He told one “You’re a guy.”
Immanentize
@O. Felix Culpa: I don’t think it is affecting crash rates so much, but it is allowing Tesla to deny liability.
eversor
@germy shoemangler:
From it what it seems in Colorado you have to get a license to escort to do it legally. I would assume this is like the system in Europe where prostitution is legal, but they have to get licensed and there is a set way to go about it to keep the sex workers safe (from STDs bad Johns), and also monitor for any sort of illegal activity.
In other words. A licensed sex worker is known by the state, getting STD checks, paying taxes, of legal age, volunatarily doing this, and a known entity. A unlicensed sex worker could be an illegally trafficked minor, with who knows what STDs, the traffickers are taking the money, could be getting raped/recorded, and who knows what else. So dodging the license even if you think you don’t need it is the sort of thing that puts kids at risk and helps give cover to traffickers.
The Boebert thing stinks to high hell and given these people took down Cawthorn is probably true. I wouldn’t be shocked if she was hooking, Republican men were paying, she was having abortions, maimed her family and ran from the scene, and if that’s the case I’d be 100% certain she didn’t bother to do any of it in the above board way you’re supposed to!
We also know MTG was having affairs with a tantric sex guy at her gym, that came out and was proven a while back. I wouldn’t be shocked if she has some roid rage incidents as well.
It also seems that poor Madison Cawthorn was right about those cocaine orgies after all. And I wouldn’t be shocked now if Cruz and Boeberts names came up in them!
Baud
@germy shoemangler: Thanks.
Immanentize
@Soprano2: I want my jetpack!!
eversor
@JPL:
If it’s public information already it’s not really a take down.
JPL
@Baud:emptywheel – Twitter Search / Twitter
Kay
@Baud:
She’s a Republican through and through though. All this bullshit about her great patriotism. She has an objective. She’s also trying to cleave the MAGA voters from Trump. “He lied to you and robbed you” – they’re being presented sympathetically because TO HER they are GOP voters and you don’t attack your voters. I don’t resent it or oppose it. I just think it’s strategic. Even if she loses her primary she can come back as an ordinary far Right Republican in the next iteration of the GOP. She’s got plenty of time. In a long game way of thinking she will have rescued the Republican Party from the radicals.
NotMax
‘@O. Felix Culpa
If Marty McFly had been driving a Tesla it would have been one very, very, very short movie.
;)
Immanentize
@Ken: Both stories tell the same story — programmers are super smart, but not necessarily moral actors.
O. Felix Culpa
@Immanentize:
Ah, that makes sense in its own evil way.
Leto
@Immanentize: NHTSA Upgrades Autopilot Investigation to Engineering Analysis, Finds Disturbing Signs
Very informative article, but this part stood out:
Baud
@Kay:
Nixon notwithstanding, I think it’s hard for Republican losers to come back, especially when they are seen as betraying the party.
eversor
@germy shoemangler:
Elon Musk’s family owns(ed?) an emerald mine in South Africa. That’s how he got his seed money. He’s always been a wingnut but that got overlooked because “electric car good, good for earth, green energy, green future” and totally missed that he’s a psycho.
dww44
@NotMax: Not necessarily that far. Secretary Granholm was on TV this morning pointing out that while oil prices are a global issue, all of the gas price rises are not necessarily so. She noted that the price of crude in March was close to the price now, so why have gas prices gone so much higher?
Are the refineries the issue here? My take is that, like the escalating prices in my grocery store, some of this is deliberate price gouging. Greed is a basic component of unfettered Capitalism, compounded by the desire to enable the greed politically.
O. Felix Culpa
@NotMax:
JPL
@NotMax:
germy shoemangler
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Baud: agreed, she has a weak home-base (Wyoming) and there are too many De Santis and Hawleys and Kemps out there for her to come back. She’s 55 YO and soon to inherit half of a fortune I believe of a couple of hundred million. My bet is she becomes a regular panelist on a Sunday show for a while and her obituary will provoke a lot of “Oh yeah, I remember her
ETA: Maybe the Cheney Institute for Politics and Patriotism will be at her alma mater, Colorado College, a bit more cachet than UW Laramie. With offices in Virginia
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@germy shoemangler:
God, he’s such a disgusting piece of shit
germy shoemangler
@eversor:
Obviously Boebert didn’t want big government putting its hand into her escort activities.
Kay
@Baud:
The Republican Party’s relationship with Donald Trump is purely transactional. Hugely cynical, right, but purely transactional. Trump is also purely transactional. They’re hoping they can keep the judges and the white voter gains and jettison the overtly corrupt and embarrassing MAGA electeds. He wants to stop them from doing that, if for no other reason than he expects to benefit from what he gave them. They’re not getting it free from Donald Trump.
debbie
@Kay:
Cheney can try all she wants, but she’ll never peel MAGATs away from TFG, if only because they’ll refuse to look like they’re admitting they made a mistake in the first place.
Baud
@Kay:
I agree that the GOP would love to move beyond Trump while keeping his supporters. I just don’t see any way for Cheney to benefit from that, even if the GOP is successful.
Kay
@Baud:
I don’t think they will keep the white voter gains without MAGA racism, because without that you get Lindsey Graham cutting Social Security and no MAGA anywhere wants that to happen. Those people will just go back to not coming out.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@debbie:
This. It’s hard for people to admit they were duped. It would mean having to take responsibility for the harm they’ve caused
Kent
@O. Felix Culpa: If you want to get involved in cutting-edge space flight engineering your choices are SpaceX, Boeing, or Jeff Bezos’s company. Of the three I’d go with SpaceX any day.
Scout211
Since this is a Tesla adjacent thread, this was news a few days ago in Sacramento. A Tesla that was in a recent accident caught fire in a wrecking yard and the fire department had a difficult time getting the fire out. It kept re-igniting. They ended up having to dig a trench, fill it with water and move the car into the water to get the fire out. Watch the video posted by the fire department in the tweet embedded in the article. As the fire truck approached the car, you can hear the fire fighter say, “Oh, it’s a Tesla.”
Baud
@Kay:
That’s the hope. What the GOP (and we) don’t know is how much they can lie to their base and get away with it. Can they end SS and successfully blame Dems for ending it? No one knows until they try.
lowtechcyclist
This is the right way to play it. Kudos.
Kay
@debbie:
But it’s more than “Cheney”, right? She’s not actually out there alone. She represents a group in the Republican Party who have ridden this tiger as long as they think it benefits them and are hoping to avoid the downside and get back to “reforming entitlements”. They want to get off. They think they wrung every bit of benefit out of it they can.
Every time I see Trump now I think of that movie line “I will not be IGNORED” – he’s not going anywhere. He’ll fucking attempt to destroy all of them before he’ll “give them” all he’s given them. He wants a HUGE cut.
Nelle
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Where does Liz actually live? Remember, Dick lived in Texas when he chose himself to be W’s VP. He hot around that petty point that the president and vice-president had to be from different states by going back to claim he was from Wyoming. Maybe Liz can claim to be from one of their other homes. It’s all very flexible…Romney, Gov of Mass, Senator from Utah.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@lowtechcyclist:
I agree. I think it’s the best way for him to play it
NotMax
‘@dww44
Certainly refineries (or attrition thereof) a significant factor.
Kent
It is part of a larger anti-public and anti-transit campaign from the right. Every time there is any kind of regional proposal for transit, light rail, etc. etc. there are a whole bunch of rabid folks who show up shouting about how self-driving cars are the future and therefore we shouldn’t invest in old 20th century technology like mass transit. I expect it is part of a larger anti-transit conspiracy funded by the Koch’s or something. But the whole self-driving car fanboy thing is really tied into a larger right-wing campaign to defund public infrastructure in transit. Seriously. So they are probably getting a lot of that sort of propaganda from the usual social media sources where they feed.
Kay
@debbie:
Its weird because I don’t know who to root for. I go back and forth. Is it better for Democrats if Trump destroys the Cheney wing or if the Cheney wing destroys Trump? Dilemma! I don’t want any of them!
But it’s not within the control of Democrats. They couldn’t game this out if they tried. So they should do the next right thing, which is continuing to prosecute Donald Trump.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@NotMax:
If anybody knows, would it be possible to invoke the Defense Production Act to speed up oil processing?
Kent
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): Biden is already talking about it. But it isn’t a magic bullet. Especially if the companies aren’t in a big hurry.
Betty Cracker
@Baud: That sounds about right to me. IMO, the best case scenario for the GOP is try to engineer a transfer of MAGA enthusiasm to someone like DeSantis. (I don’t know if it would work nationally, but it sure has worked in Florida.) The best-case scenario for us is that Trump takes offense at being tossed aside and goes after DeSantis and the GOP, wrecking party unity.
Baud
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):
The DPA is more about allocating resources than producing resources. Channeling oil through the government doesn’t create more oil for the market.
debbie
@Kay:
Agreed, like Sherman marching across Georgia.
JPL
Scotus is going to release opinions soon. I wonder what rights they will take away today. Maybe the right to regulate firearms?
Anyway
@Kent:
Yes, Uber, Lyft etc were funded by VCs and their business plan never showed them running without huge subsidies from VC – but they had the effect of killing transit funding increases in large cities. They also dropped demand for ZipCars and the like. Now VCs are pulling back some of the subsidies and Uber, Lyft rides are no longer as attractive a proposition.
Kent
@Baud: Exactly. If there were some critical component to gasoline production that was in short supply because it was being used for other things like say plastics production then Biden could use the defense production act to re-route that component to refineries instead. But that isn’t the problem. The problem is that refineries just shut down.
And frankly, for the sake of the planet they should just stay shut down despite the short-term political loss for Biden due to high gas prices.
debbie
@Kay:
I’m with Cheney. She’ll never win, but I’m rooting for the injuries to last as long as possible. I want blood. I’m thumbs down in the Coliseum.
Cacti
@Baud: A fair amount of the labor movement also tends to vote their prejudices before their pocketbooks.
Kay
@debbie:
I don’t think they can give him what he wants, which is a second term. It kills him every fucking day that he was a one term President. He will not accept that.
germy shoemangler
@Kay:
Because Obama had two terms. A Black man got more years than him and it’s killing him.
And it’s killing him that he lost an election to that Black man’s former VP. It hurts!
zhena gogolia
I’d never seen Peter STRZOK talk before that tweet AL posted last night. He’s impressive.
eversor
@germy shoemangler:
LOL, if she gets hit for tax fraud while escorting
Soprano2
@O. Felix Culpa: I don’t think this guy was a ferocious Musk supporter; more like a ferocious automation supporter. Musk’s name never came up, although I can see him liking the guy.
Paul in KY
@Kay: I’d rather have the Cheney Wing than the MAGAs. The Cheneyites are (in general) rational actors.
eversor
@Scout211:
That’s because of the batteries. You see that with laptops as well, also cell phones. If the battery goes up in flames you can’t really put it out. Which is why you have metal containers full of sand and you have to chuck the whole thing in there and burry it in sand. You cannot put out a battery fire really, if it goes up you are either burying the whole thing or standing by till it burns itself out, and anything else around it.
Soprano2
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): And this is part of how inflation cools down.
Elizabelle
UPI article on Biden’s speech to labor, with video of the whole thing embedded. Looks like it’s about 54 minutes long.
I am so watching this later. Biden O’Clock.
NotMax
‘@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
It’s not as if they’re operating at 50% capacity. Physical plant and its concomitant output is finite.Too, what you propose would have about zero impact on mitigating the initial contract cost of crude, presuming there’s any reliable excess of supply available in the first pace.
eversor
@Anyway:
They also killed taxi’s and regular food delivery services. Now that they are monopolies they are going to raise rates.
Elizabelle
@Kay: He just about killed us by being a one-term “president.” And that was a sketchy Electoral College win.
No sympathy for TFG. Neither he nor we deserved that presidency.
Ramona Rosario
What amuses me to no end is that Trump has to watch these hearings. He has to watch Barr denigrate him and know that millions are watching this as well. In theory nobody is forcing Trump to watch but of course he can’t resist watching much as it must be driving him into a blind rage.
Soprano2
To me the problem with this is that there aren’t enough of them to have a divided political party like this. IMHO there is no way to separate the cultists from TFG. I agree that’s what she’s trying to do. It’s interesting to see her sharpness on the committee vs. some Democrats’ squishiness, like Thompson pre-emptively saying “oh, we aren’t going to recommend any prosecutions” which Cheney (rightly, I might add) quickly publicly contradicted. Why do Democrats sabotage themselves like that? It makes me crazy!! “This is the worst incident against our government in our nation’s history, but we aren’t going to recommend that anyone be prosecuted for it” is a dumb, dumb message to the American people.
Kay
@Paul in KY:
I guess I would too, because cutting entitlements and abolishing public schools are genuinely unpopular.
We also need the Cheney wing because as political opponents they make Democrats better, not worse so the conflict is beneficial to the country. Trump, true to his completely negative and toxic influence has not made Democrats better, where George W Bush did.
Baud
@Kay:
You don’t think the Dems are a better party in 2022 than they were in 2016?
Elizabelle
@Ramona Rosario: I smile every time the Committee or a witness says “He lost.” Knowing TFG is watching too.
And they say it constantly. It’s the whole point. They cannot say it enough.
germy shoemangler
@Ramona Rosario:
It happened very quickly, but during the second hearing they played a clip of Barr talking about election results. Trump did “weakly” in areas where other republicans did better, in Barr’s words.
That word “weak” must have raised Trump’s blood pressure.
debbie
@Kay:
I’ve been waiting for his downfall since 1978. I’m almost giddy with anticipation!
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Kent:
@Baud:
@NotMax:
I see. That’s disappointing. What about that deal with OPEC that was supposed to increase their production?
Kay
@Soprano2:
I think the “recommend prosecutions” is a red herring that media have stupidly seized on. It’s not a real thing. The DOJ is independent. There’s no “recommending” outside of contempt of Congress, which is specific to Congress. If I were on that committee and asked that question I would not accept the question. It’s bullshit. It always amazes me they think they have to answer every question. I just wouldn’t do it.
Soprano2
He’s Cartman, full stop.
eversor
@Soprano2:
Democrats are happy with the status quo and are conflict adverse. So they will avoid doing anything until they are lined up against the wall and shot. And right before the trigger is pulled when they get their last words they will say “when they go low we go high, non violence always works, don’t get mad vote!”.
Ramona Rosario
@Elizabelle: That’s right! Even better!
debbie
@germy shoemangler:
It bothered him almost as much as the references to an “inebriated Rudy Giuliani” bothered Rudy.
eversor
@Soprano2:
I dunno Cartman was more grounded in reality. Cartman had actual friends as well. This is sort of an insult to Cartman.
Immanentize
@NotMax: price fixing is within the President’s power.
zhena gogolia
@eversor: Идите на хуй.
Baud
@Immanentize:
What good would that do? It’ll just lead to gas station shortages.
Ramona Rosario
@germy shoemangler: I remember that! Barr was citing Trump’s poor showing relative to other Republicans on the ballot as evidence that there had been no tampering with the election.
Geminid
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: The Saudis and the oil companies definitely want a Republican Congress, and they want to see a Republican President elected in 2024. The fossil industry’s future will be conditioned by how hard or softly the U.S. leans into the clean energy transition, and a Republican administration will make a big difference for the industry.
I’m not sure that the Saudis and thr oil companies care about trump. These are cold blooded realists, not enthusiasts, and I think they see trump as a worn out tool.
Kay
@Soprano2:
Members of Congress have no more authority to “recommend” charges outside their purview than anyone else does. They’re not a grand jury. There’s no “sort of a grand jury” that issues, like, advisory opinions. Thank God. That’s a disaster.
Immanentize
@Baud: That doesn’t make sense. How would capping price reduce supply?
Baud
@Immanentize:
Reducing prices increases demand.
Immanentize
@zhena gogolia: I had to look that up. I got a warning before I could proceed to the translation!
I completely support your comment and give it a “10”
NotMax
‘@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
While not a solution, could serve to put a temporary damper on wide swings in the world market.
(Incidentally, KSA is hellbent for leather in investing in and promoting solar-on-the-sands for their own infrastructure.)
Baud
@Geminid:
I am disappointed that, for all the talk of fighting Big Oil, we really lack the capacity to fight.
Betty Cracker
@Kay:
Interesting. I never thought about it like that, though I agree that in general, a healthy democracy requires opposition parties with a commitment to governing who compete on different policies and philosophies. I think you’re right.
Immanentize
@Baud: Not too much. Demand has not really decreased since prices have been rising. People have laid off other consumer goods, but not gas.
That was a weird reactionary spasm from you. I don’t think Biden would ever do it, but he could. There were no gas shortages when Nixon set price limits. And the gas shortages under Ford/Carter were driven by foreign OPEC supply, which we really don’t have to be too bothered by these days
Elizabelle
@eversor: There is a reason you are in my pie filter. And: what zhena said. FU.
zhena gogolia
@Immanentize: Spasibo.
Baud
@Immanentize:
I’m no economist, but I’m not a big believer that setting prices solves more problems than it creates. Besides, if Biden were to do it, he’d also have to figure out how to prevent the oil companies from exporting more gas to foreign markets, and from shutting down even more production. I think there will be a bunch of cascading effects that will just prolong the misery.
debbie
@eversor:
Yep, they’re right. You really are an asshole. Go be a MAGAt. I’m sure you’ll be very happy.
NotMax
‘@Immanentize
Institutional complacency also plays a part, an “It’s always been a license to print money and will always be so” mindset.
More unwieldy to turn that around than for a supertanker to do a one-eighty.
Kay
@Baud:
I guess I don’t. I think Trump set them back on their heels and they have scrambled to counter. I don’t blame them- it’s bewildering. I don’t know that anyone could have done better but I don’t usually go to alternate, fantasy versions of the Democratic Party.
Opponents can make you better. Sharper. More focused. George W Bush made Democrats better and Donald Trump did not.
eversor
@Elizabelle:
It’s not my fault they refuse to fight and then take consequences off the table. I remember when Bush and co get let off. And I’m sure they’ll do this again. And then when Trump gets elected in 2024 they’ll blame their voters.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@eversor: right, the people who impeached trump twice and unanimously voted to remove from office and got a record number of Rs to vote the same way (the second time) are to blame for the lack of consequences
and yes, while it seems to be an idea that confuses more people here than just you: Voters do matter in elections
Elizabelle
@eversor: blah blah blah
Your presence has added NOTHING to the blog. It’s all “I hate religion” and “I despise Democrats.”
Fuck off. You are both delusional and a bore
ETA: on the other hand, the thread is quite colorful, with all the lovely cookies and Avalune’s Eeyore drawing.
Baud
@Kay:
I guess I disagree. Aside from the diabolical duo in the Senate, the 2022 Dem party is the best I’ve ever witnessed.
Geminid
@Baud: We are still beginning the clean energy transition. So far this Congress has delivered only modest legislation in this area. Some of the legislative efforts are significant, though. The Infrastructure bill’s funding of local mass transit, AMTRAK, electric school buses and other clean energy intitiatives will add momentum to the transition. The head of AMTRAK noted that the $60 billion investment in that rail service exceede investment since its founding, and said it would be “transformative,”
Decisions by the Biden administration will have an impact also. I’m not sure if anyone has put out a summary of the executive branch’s initiatives (Ron Klain, are you lurking?). But the different Departments put out their own summaries, and some are quite long.
So I guess I’m saying that we fight the oil companys by electing Democrats. And it’s possible that we make the clean energy transition a good issue for us. As in the cases of gun control and abortion, combating climate change is an issue where Republicans are on the wrong side of majority opinion.
Ksmiami
@Baud: the best thing long term is high oil and gas prices… that is what will foster innovation and alternatives. Unfortunately it’s political cyanide
Kay
@Baud:
The counter of saying over and over “these are all lies” (true) takes them out of the frame where they can get better and win to another frame – a place where the skills they have are not valuable, don’t matter.
Think of the pro-democracy lawyers in the post election litigation. They didn’t “get better” v Sidney Powell. She wasn’t an opponent that made them really work with the skills they have. There’s nothing to work with. It’s just a bunch of lies. So they shot down some Sydney Powell lies and they were lucky enough to be a forum where that matters and they win. But Democrats aren’t in a courtroom.
Paul in KY
@eversor: Does Cartman really have friends? I think of them more as frenemies.
Geminid
@Ksmiami: Yeah, I agree. If it wasn’t for the political ramifications I’d want the current price to be a floor that increased 7% a year, indefinitely. I guess my hope right now is for pump prices to fall a dollar by September, and then increase slowly.
Eolirin
@Ksmiami: If we had a friendly media environment we could be placing the blame squarely on the oil companies and their republican enablers while passing legislation in the house that we know will die in the senate to force more refineries to get built.
People will buy price gouging as a reason. There’s no love of the oil companies in the places we need to win. But we’d need to be able to drive that narrative and it’s not one most media outlets will push. Especially not in the constant sort of way we need.
Eolirin
@Kay: I think we got that in 2018. But it was more in response to the Republican held legislature than Trump specifically.
The party is far more unified in messaging and values than it was before Trump, but I do think a lot of that has to do with push back against attempted congressional action in 2017-2018 rather than anything else. Lessons learned around the success of the health care fight.
Unfortunately those lessons only work when we’re out of power. So they’re not going to be so relevant to anything except maybe abortion rights, where we can credibly make the case that we need more Democratic wins to protect something.
Soprano2
@Kay: I don’t disagree, but it was dumb for Thompson to say that in the first place!
Soprano2
@eversor: Cartman didn’t have friends, he had people he used.
Soprano2
@Immanentize: Oh God No, I don’t want gas stations running out of gas before the end of the month. In 1979 I drove with my BF between MO and Corpus Christi at the end of June. There wasn’t an open gas station in Oklahoma on that day – they were all out of gas.
Formerly disgruntled in Oregon
I guess we can put you down for “going low”, violence, and not voting. Good to know. Will keep in mind…