These Jan 6 committee hearings are like social media. There is one main character each time and you don’t want to be the main character.
— Shana Gadarian (@sgadarian) June 23, 2022
And the usual suspects were asking for pardons
Pardon requests:
– Gaetz (for himself “from the beginning of time up until today, for any and all things” and for anyone at 12/21 meeting)
– Brooks (for anyone at the 12/21 meeting)
– Biggs
– Gohmert
– Perry
– Greene— southpaw (@nycsouthpaw) June 23, 2022
lollipopguild
You get a pardon, and you get a pardon and everyone gets a pardon. Here in Kentucky we had a gop gov who was so corrupt he pardoned every person who had worked for him as well as pardoning himself.
Ruckus
There seems to be a common theme here.
The requests for pardons are from exactly the people you would expect to be asking. It isn’t the entire list of expected askers by any means of course but is there anyone on the list who was unexpected?
JoyceH
Interesting that Gaetz was asking for a ‘blanket pardon’, and started lobbying for it in early December – he was trying to make that sex investigation go away.
Steeplejack
Hearing-related, updated from this morning.
I’ve been following the GoFundMe drives for Ruby Freeman and Shaye Moss, the two Georgia poll workers who testified at the January 6 committee hearing on Tuesday. Both drives were started last December but went almost nowhere until Tuesday. I think Ruby Freeman was around $60,000 late Tuesday, and now (this afternoon) she’s up to $266,476. Shaye Moss is at $222,738.
These women are heroes, and they deserve every penny they get after all of the pain and suffering they went through—and still are. They are an inspiration to us all. I donated to both drives, and I urge all jackals to consider doing the same, if they can afford it.
Note: These are the bona fide GoFundMe accounts for these two women. It has come out that several other accounts have been established, of doubtful provenance.
Cameron
@Ruckus: I was initially surprised by Gohmert. I figured he was too stupid for anybody to bring on board. My error – I forgot how stupid ALL of them are.
Jerzy Russian
I wonder if everyone named Jeff Clark can sue for reimbursement of the expenses associated with changing their names.
Leto
@Ruckus: Oh, I’m sure the names who aren’t there still crimed their little hearts out. Just give it time. The commission’s work keeps on keeping on. Honestly, some of the best “must see tv” in a while.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
From studying law on MSNBC a couple hours a week these past few months (okay, years), I believe pleading the fifth cannot be used against a defendant in a criminal trial. What about a request for a pardon? evidence of consciousness of guilt?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Cameron:
Yeah, but when he tried to ask for a pardon, he actually asked for a parsnip
debbie
@JoyceH:
“From the beginning of time.”
JPL
Did Elise Stefanik forget that she said she would be giving a good rebuttal to the hearings and show trump’s side?
TriassicSands
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Acceptance of a pardon is an admission of guilt. That is very different from a constitutionally guaranteed right against self-incrimination.
Deputinize Eurasia from the Kuriles to St Petersburg
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
If bar associations were run by people of integrity (hah), I’d say that invoking the Fifth regarding questions of legal advice you gave to a client would be an admission against interest for the purposes of receiving discipline and potential suspension of your license.
debbie
@JPL:
No, her remarks are right there, beside TFG’s tax returns. //
MisterDancer
@JPL: It appears her rebuttal is via running to Fox News a lot.
Steeplejack
@Jerzy Russian:
Matt Gertz of Media Matters gets a lot of undeserved flak on Twitter. “Definitely not the GOP congressman.”
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@TriassicSands: but if you asked for a pardon that wasn’t granted? as far as we know?
One of my tin-foil hat questions is are there: signed and dated pardons, including a self-pardon, in wall-safes or safety deposit boxes in Florida and some of the nicer DC suburbs.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@Steeplejack: That poor guy. He says when his notifications blow up, he wonders what Gaetz has done now
Tony Jay
“What did you think you needed a Presidential pardon for?”
“……. nuthin. Just thought it’d be cool to have one is all.”
“But you didn’t get one, did you?”
Gulp!
Old Dan and Little Ann
Still dreaming of an end like, “The Shawshank Redemption.”
BigJimSlade
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Naw, he had just burped and farted at the same time.
Raoul Paste
On MSNBC, Claire McCaskill just asked why are we not searching Mark Meadows house today
Ruckus
@Cameron:
They are stupid, no question.
But too stupid to do criming? Nope. A definition of criming is being too stupid not to. See my next line.
Too stupid to not get caught criming? Yep.
Cameron
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: You sound like you’re casting asparagus on him.
Tony Jay
Plus, following that twitter thread on, did Clarence Thomas really ‘justify’ expanding concealed carry with reference to a butchered quote from Chief Justice Taney about the threat of armed Negros?
There’s trolling, and then there’s whatever messed up acting out of deep seated neuroses that is.
What a sad little wanker.
Elizabelle
@Raoul Paste: Oh please oh please oh please.
eclare
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Hahaha….I literally LOL’d.
germy shoemangler
You know he was gritting his teeth while he typed this
citizen dave
I’m dreaming of an end like goodfellas with the stones/clapton soundtrack and the perp walks, etc
Too bad the FBI can’t livestream their searches.
West of the Rockies
@Old Dan and Little Ann:
Works for me. The lot of them (all Trumpies) can fit their pie holes for a Glock.
JPL
@MisterDancer: At this point, I assume that Fox has switched to their daily coverage of DeSantis.
Craig
@Jerzy Russian: The Jeff Clark who was the first person to go out and surf 65′ waves at Mavericks ain’t changing his name.
Geminid
@JoyceH: I read a news story saying that while Gaetz asked for his own pardon, he recommended that his former friend Joel Greenberg’s pardon request be denied. I imagine that story made Greenberg really want to help put Gaetz away.
Prosecutors have been rounding up more witnesses, and Greenberg’s sentencing judge has given them a sort-of deadline of August for Greenberg’s sentencing and by implication, indictments of Gaetz. In the meantime Greenberg is sitting in the Orange County, Florida jail.
Baud
@JPL:
When Trump and company are indicted, I promise you the Internet spin will be that Biden messed up by helping DeSantis.
TriassicSands
One extraordinary hearing after another. Each one compelling. Among the best use of television in history.
Only a brain dead imbecile or a psychotic cult member could watch these hearings and not realize the truth — Donald Trump and the Republican Party have been and are actively involved in behavior that threatens the foundations of this country. Of course, that is why few if any of the people who really need to watch these hearings will watch them. You can continue to insist the Earth is flat as long as you don’t put yourself in a position where you can see the obvious curvature¹. The best defense against the truth is utter, total, complete, overwhelming ignorance.
¹ Even then, the devout cult member can simply deny what is right in front of them.
The Thin Black Duke
@Tony Jay: House Nigg*r.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@germy shoemangler:
sorry Matt (my boldface)
zhena gogolia
@Baud: take it to the bank
Delk
WTF? MTG was in office all of 3 days and needs a pardon.
Baud
@Delk:
She’s more efficient than she lets on.
JPL
Apparently, there is no repercussions if you ask for a pardon.
JPL
@Baud: She was married and still was able to have multiple affairs at the same time. Of course, she’s efficient.
John Revolta
@TriassicSands:
Ah, but we need a majority
TriassicSands
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
I wonder if your questions have ever been adjudicated. One could argue that asking for a pardon implies understanding that acceptance will constitute admission of guilt, which is voluntary self-incrimination. And that should certainly be discussed if a pardon will be offered. But in this case the pardons didn’t materialize. The current intellectual state of the union is so wanting that the person in question could always argue that they didn’t know that and would never have asked for a pardon if they had known that.
Booger
@Raoul Paste: Well who knows where he really lives anyway?
Xavier
@JPL: Something something gas prices.
Martin
@Delk: FOMO runs strong in the GOP.
Burnspbesq
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Can’t find anything definitive on the point with a quick search, but if the mental state for the offense is willfulness, it seems intuitively obvious that it would be highly relevant.
SiubhanDuinne
@West of the Rockies:
Nope. Not even for people we detest.
Pied.
Martin
@JPL: I attribute that to a lack of object permanence on her part. If she wanders too far from her husband she assumes he doesn’t exist any longer.
JoyceH
Hey does anyone else think this hearing being postponed might have been at the request of DOJ, which had the Clark search warrant in the works?
Scout211
Unprecedented coming to Discovery+. The trailer:
Trailer
ETA: link fixed
Burnspbesq
@TriassicSands:
True. But Trump et al have convinced tens of millions of your fellow Americans that the foundations of this country suck.
West of the Rockies
The warden commits suicide at the end of The Shawshank Redemption. If Trumpian criminals make that choice, I do not care.
Cameron
@Baud: “This is all good news for Ron DeSantis!”
Jeffro
@Jerzy Russian: yes, and even those slightly derivative of ‘Jeff Clark’
=P
Delk
I hope whoever searched Clark’s kitchen accidentally knocked over a bottle of cooking oil.
Jeffro
@Xavier: this is 110% the entirety of the GQP’s strategy from here on out…fingers in ears re: J6, keep harping on gas prices, and hope it works.
“They WANT working Americans paying extremely high prices at the pump. They don’t care who it hurts. They have no solutions to bring prices down. And they think you’ll be dumb enough to vote them into power.” – every Dem campaign at every level this year, hopefully.
Ken
Ah yes, the old “I’m in Congress — you can’t expect me to know and understand the law” defense.
Spanky
@TriassicSands:
And a large minority of this country is OK with that.
trollhattan
@germy shoemangler:
Your offer is acceptable.
Captain C
@Tony Jay:
Sounds about right. Thomas will also probably write the opinions for overturning Loving, which could end his marriage (this could be a plus for him) and for declaring the 13th through 15th Amendments invalid, which could end his freedom, and that of his kids. He’ll probably be proud of doing so, until he’s hauled off in chains to work for his ex-wife Ginni’s family.
Citizen Alan
@Tony Jay: Totally unsurprising. Clarence Thomas is basically Uncle Ruckus from The Boondocks if he somehow got an Ivy League law degree. The only reason he got appointed is because he’s a black man who hates all other black men and is totally supportive of white supremacy.
Captain C
@germy shoemangler: Every time Gaetz is in front of a media person, he should be asked something along the lines of, “so how many underage kids have you raped so far?” Every fucking time.
Tony Jay
@The Thin Black Duke:
Can’t argue with that assessment.
Captain C
@Geminid:
While I’m not surprised that the Trumpy criminals are so inept that they leave extensive records of their criming, I am a little amazed that they seem to think they can screw their co-conspirators while said people still have a chance to nark them out.
H.E.Wolf
@JoyceH:
The US House is going on recess for 2 weeks, returning on July 12th. Meanwhile the Jan. 6 Committee staffers will be hard at work. :)
https://www.electoral-vote.com/evp2022/Senate/Maps/Jun23.html#item-1
Lacuna Synecdoche
Yes, yes, it looks curved — but you’re forgetting about the cleverly placed black hole beneath our flat earth that bends light!
(Actual theory I read once from a alleged flat-earther. Could have been someone pretending to be a flat-eather, though, as I’m kind of skeptical that an actual flat-earther would accept the existence of a black hole, but not a round earth.)
Geminid
@Captain C: Yeah, I think Thomas’s end game is to abrogate Loving. He’s a very strict Catholic so divorce is out of the question. In desperation, Thomas has latched on to overturning of Loving as the only way he can rid himself of that horrible harpy!
Tony Jay
@Captain C:
@Citizen Alan:
I’m aware of the concept of a self-hating (fill in the blank), but I never thought I’d ever see such a dialed up to 11 example outside of badly written fiction.
Kind of explains why he married Ginni.
Shana
@JoyceH: Speaking of which, is Greenburg (?) ever going to be sentenced or is he still giving up valuable info? It must be close to a year since I’ve heard anything about him. They just keep delaying his sentencing
And I see it’s been answered at around #34. Thanks.
Omnes Omnibus
@Spanky: Which means that a majority is not.
JoyceH
@Lacuna Synecdoche: The apparent curvature of the earth is an optical illusion created by God to test our faith. Same way they explain those dinosaur bones.
Tony Jay
@TriassicSands:
Well yeah, but as was discussed last week, their country and your country might share a geographical location, but they are very different places, and to their minds they can’t commit treason against a country they don’t belong to.
The White Settler-State of Traditional America is a hard mistress.
David ☘The Establishment☘ Koch
Looks like I picked the wrong week to sublet Jeff Clark’s abode
Geminid
@Captain C: Greenberg was up to his eyeballs in provable charges by then, so he already had reason to be a cooperating witness. But this Gaetz pardon story must have made him that much more eager to hang his former friend.
I just hope that the prosecutors have other good witnesses against Gaetz. I think we’ll know in two months, maybe sooner.
CaseyL
Every time I think I know how loathsome Trumpists are, I’m proven wrong: they’re even worse than I thought.
How does a creature like Trump with such a complete lack of redeeming qualities – to call him a spirochete is an insult to syphilis – find and keep people willing to abase themselves for him?
JPL
@Captain C: Makes sense in a twisted way, since if Greenberg is pardoned, his charges are real. That would only implicate Gaetz more.
James E Powell
@Omnes Omnibus:
And that majority is who we need to be talking to every day.
It’s anecdotal, but I use my barely engaged sister who votes Democratic as a rough gauge of the low information voter.
Until I mentioned it to her this morning, she was not aware of the hearings at all and did not know any of the things being established on the air..
Voters like her aren’t going to get information from the news because they don’t watch the news. They have to get it from us, their friends & associates, or it will not register as something they should pay attention to or care about.
MazeDancer
Looking forward to the DeSantis Showdown. Ron gotta be liking these hearings.
Hoping Don kneecaps Ron while he still can. And encourages a revenge write-in candidate for Gov.
Baud
@James E Powell:
Spot on.
Lacuna Synecdoche
Of course we think Ginni Thomas is awful (because we’re part of the reality-based community), but I can’t think of any reason why Clarence would would want to divorce her.
I mean, they seem perfect for each other.
Frank Wilhoit
@Martin: Isn’t he supposed to keep her on a leash or something? I hear that the radical left is trying to ban pinch collars.
JPL
@Frank Wilhoit: ha He married into a wealthy family, so he’s fine with whatever. One of the affairs was highlighted in the New Yorker and it was a COX family heir, she couldn’t dispute, because she’s not that wealthy.
mrmoshpotato
FUCK BLAGO! (and Kari Lake too!)
sab
@Tony Jay: UK Law and Order said that in England you have the opposite of the 5th amendment. Failing to answer questions can be used against you as an indication that you have something to hide.
Geminid
@Lacuna Synecdoche: I’m just having fun. Or what passes for fun in my humdrum life
But maybe you are too.
Spanky
“Spanky”, I keep telling myself, “half the American electorate is below average intelligence.”
Largely invisible in the circle I move in, I have to keep reminding myself that they’re out there.
lowtechcyclist
“In the beginning the Universe was created.
“This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move.”
sab
@CaseyL: If you have ever worked near a narcissist you’d have seen it. The minions are so busy clawing each others eyes out to impress the boss that they don’t think things though. They are all badly damaged people themselves.
Tony Jay
@sab:
The actual wording is –
“You do not have to say anything. But, it may harm your defence if you do not mention when questioned something which you later rely on in court. Anything you do say may be given in evidence.”
As always, what that turns out to mean depends a lot on how expensive your lawyer is.
Gin & Tonic
Tens of thousands dead, millions displaced for this. Contrast that with the stupid motherfuckers in England who were too good for the EU.
Steve in the ATL
@Tony Jay: the more expensive the better! Lawyers are woefully underpaid.
sab
@Tony Jay: Well that sounds a little bit better.
sab
OT Why isn’t the right to bear arms limited to muskets and primitive rifles? Were our rich ancestors allowed to own cannons?
Steeplejack
@Tony Jay:
This was not a big deal when I was at Midsomer Law School, because the guilty party is always apprehended. There might be an occasional
plot twisthiccup, but it all gets sorted in the end.Baud
@sab:
Especially when said with a British accent.
raven
@Steve in the ATL: Where you bean frijole? Manning to Texas but we’re fine.
sab
@Baud: While wearing a curly shoulder length white wig.
Steeplejack
@Steve in the ATL:
Well, they’re woeful, that’s for sure. Zing!
MomSense
@Steeplejack:
As horrible as his mentions must be, he definitely doesn’t want to change his Twitter handle. He has made the absolute best of this unfortunate situation.
lowtechcyclist
@H.E.Wolf:
Oh, thank goodness! Due to various things coming up at work and at home, I’ve only been able to watch the first hearing and half of the third. Now I can catch up!
I would never have doubted it. They know they’ve got the bad guys on the run, and don’t want to let up.
Baud
@sab:
Who wouldn’t want to confess?
Steeplejack
@sab:
A peruke! (Crossword lore.)
Wyatt Salamanca
@West of the Rockies:
I used to think that was how Trump would leave office after losing to Biden. The only appropriate ending for this bastard is to die in prison along with Giuliani, Eastman, Ellis, and Powell.
MomSense
@Tony Jay:
What an asshole – plus there’s the states rights for forced birth (abortion) but states can’t make any laws about guns. Fucking pubic coke Justice is an abomination.
Steeplejack
@MomSense:
He has done a great job of joking about it and getting the word out, to the point that random people will correct nitwit commenters.
sab
@Steeplejack: I learn new things every day on this full service blog.
Steve in the ATL
@raven: our QB room is well stocked and we don’t need the circus that will come with Arch!
Been too busy with life and work. And Europe!
debbie
Pass.
Dan B
@sab: Boiling oil and flaming arrows should be in the concealed weapons file. Spears? Must stick past battlements, sadly.
CaseyL
Those 6 or 10 or however many MOC who were part of the scheme should be barred from being seated in the next session. Hell, Pelosi should have refused to seat them for this session.
And I want some Senators barred, too. The J6 Committee isn’t talking much about them. But the final electoral slate count took place, I believe, in a joint Session, where insurrectionist Senators were able to object to electoral votes being accepted. Those are the ones I want to see barred from their seats.
raven
@Steve in the ATL: Cool good to see ya.
Steve in the ATL
@Steeplejack: [sad face emoji] I’ll never post here again!
NotMax
Follow the money. (WaPo link.)
hilts
Don Lemon, the king of cool among cable news hosts, interviews Alex Holder tonight at 10:00
Steve in the ATL
@raven: you and well. Hope the pain gets better!
kalakal
@sab: The UK wording on being arrested is
“You do not have to say anything. But, it may harm your defence if you do not mention when questioned something which you later rely on in court. Anything you do say may be given in evidence.”
phdesmond
WaPo:
Geminid
@Lacuna Synecdoche: They say, “there’s a lid for every pot.”
@Geminid:
raven
@Steve in the ATL: So far so good. Great weather for Athfest!
JaySinWA
@David ☘The Establishment☘ Koch:
Caught with your pants down
debbie
Unsurprising.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
She can’t do that. Expulsion requires a two-thirds vote of the whole House.
Steeplejack
@sab:
Not necessarily useful, but new.
Omnes Omnibus
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Don’t bother people with details.
Baud
@debbie:
Interesting. Barely dipped in 2000.
JPL
@debbie: Who still supports them, is what I want to know.
Baud
@JPL:
The 27% (actually 25%).
Kathleen
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Harrumph. I got my law degree from the Law And Order School of We TV Reruns. I can prosecute or defend, depending on my whim.
JPL
@Baud: Barrett the let us not focus on the 14th amendment timeline is a real winner
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Baud: a long graph and I don’t have it broken down into years, but it looks like the Thomas nomination was a big hit
that was after Poppy’s big boost from the first Gulf War, no?’
ETA: Gulf War ended in Feb. 91, Thomas nominated in July
Baud
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Good eye.
Elizabelle
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
There is precedent, in the great state of South Dakota, ridding itself of state attorney general Jason Ravnsborg earlier this week. First successful impeachment there ever.
Clear evidence of lying, criminal behavior, possibly dragging the rest of them down? (Ravnsborg hit and killed a man walking along a highway, and then lied about it.)
It could happen in Congress, if the conditions are right.
Obvious Russian Troll
@phdesmond:
This is one of the extremely rare occasions I’m gonna agree with the former guy. Kevin McCarthy absolutely fucked up the J6 committee for the Republicans.
Thankfully.
Captain C
@Wyatt Salamanca:
If we arrange that he could share a cell, Seinfeld ending-like, with Beavis, Butthead, and Lucrezia (his 3 kids by Ivana), that would be very acceptable, especially if there was a continuous live feed complete with audio. Money generated thusly could be used to compensate his many victimsl.
Steve in the ATL
@Baud: I forgot that you were a little league baseball coach!
Scout211
@Obvious Russian Troll:
Sure, but do you really think pulling that power play by yanking all of his nominees when Speaker Pelosi rejected three of them was all Kevin McCarthy? It was likely either plotted by Trump and his advisors or at the very least approved by them. Throwing McCarthy under the bus (as if Trump himself had nothing to do with it) is just icing on the cake. (schadenfreude cake). The Trump bus has a big crowd of former allies underneath it now.
Bill Arnold
@TriassicSands:
I once spent close to 24 hours in a big tube high enough that the ground often could not be seen, and arrived in a place “they” claimed was called “Australia”.[1]
At night, what looked like the constellation Orion was upside down. The little “sword” was above the belt.
Also, I had never before seen the stars in much of the sky. (I know the name of every bright star visible from the northern hemisphere.)
[1]“Someone on Quora recently posted a flat-earth craziness I was previously unaware of – which is that Australia doesn’t exist and all Australians are actors!! You really can’t make this stuff up!”
Steve in the ATL
@Bill Arnold: if your sample is the Hemsworth family, then the theory checks out
Steeplejack
@Obvious Russian Troll:
I think at the time all of the Republicans—and Trump, too, probably—were braying about no coöperation with the fake witch-hunt committee. Now they’re underbussing McCarthy, not that he doesn’t deserve it on general principles.
Ken
I’m wondering, is this the first time we’ve seen a circular firing squad but with busses?
Dopey-o
He’s not a strict Catholic, he’s an Old Testament Catholic. All the fire and brimstone, all the vengeance and punishment. All that hippy stuff like love your enemy, give your stuff to the poor?
He’s a Cafeteria Catholic, he’s anti birth control, anti abortion, but the death penalty and heartless immigration policies are fine. Kids in cages? A-OK. Union busting? Also fine.
Ken
Worst of all, he got caught.
Jim Appleton
@Bill Arnold:
Whoa, you were that high?
Props!
I usually just forget I have legs …
prostratedragon
@Ruckus: I agree with this. The idea of the “criminal genius” is a misapplication.
schrodingers_cat
Wrong thread deleted.
catclub
@Ruckus:
But it is pure Trump that none of them got pardons.
catclub
he was almost certainly speeding, and also likely distracted by reading his phone. so no jail time.
a thousand flouncing lurkers (was fidelio)
@Delk: Honey or molasses.
TriassicSands
I agree with the responses to my original comment.
It all reinforces the sad fact that tens of millions of Americans are lost — untethered from reality, devoid of the ability to see beyond their own bigotries, and capable of fashioning bizarre explanations for why the nonsense they believe is true and the reality they deny doesn’t exist. In the end, their defense is simply to refuse to look, watch, hear, read, or accept anything that is in disagreement with their fantasy world.
I don’t see any way to put Humpty Dumpty back together again.