CBS News Poll: 57% of Americans believe that the Supreme Court will now go after same sex marriage while 55% believe they will limit access to birth control.
Hard to argue with them given that Thomas called for it, but not as clear that a case could get 5 votes. We'll find out. pic.twitter.com/4FhO0G04O7
— The Wokest Numbersmuncher (@NumbersMuncher) June 26, 2022
Seven states are hosting primary elections on Tuesday, and voters may offer the first clues for how the Supreme Court’s abortion decision will impact midterm elections. https://t.co/95nlyCTrdc
— AP Politics (@AP_Politics) June 27, 2022
A CBS News/YouGov poll conducted immediately after the court decision overturning Roe showed that Americans saw it as a “step backward” for the nation by more than a 20% margin.
~60% of Americans and 2/3 of women disapproved of the ruling, the poll said. https://t.co/HwuSL5UXwa
— Amy Qin (@amyyqin) June 27, 2022
Also… Lest we forget, a recap from last Thursday:
COVID-19 Coronavirus Updates: Sunday / Monday, June 26-27
rikyrah
Good Morning Everyone
Lapassionara
Tap, tap. Is this thing on? Where is everybody? Good morning.
Lapassionara
@rikyrah: good morning to you, rikyrah
Deputinize Eurasia from the Kuriles to St Petersburg
To be fair, once those “restrict it all over” dudes get elected, gas prices will miraculously decrease.
And they’ll be lavishly funded by those who are profiting so handsomely.
O. Felix Culpa
@rikyrah:
Good morning!
randy khan
On the birth control point, I have little doubt that some red state legislature will adopt a law banning hormonal birth control and IUDs because they are supposedly abortifacients, and the odds that the Furious Five go along with that seem pretty high. They won’t have to overrule Griswold to do that because they can base the decision in Dobbs.
But anyone who thinks they’d never go after Griswold is not paying attention.
Lapassionara
@randy khan: Yes. They have laid the foundation for rolling back a lot of rights people thought they had, including a right to privacy.
I wake each morning dreading the news of the day. I doubt I will see anything improve in my lifetime. Democratic voters punish the party when it doesn’t do enough. Republican voters keep voting Republican no matter what.
debbie
What country did I wake up in. It feels very different.
O. Felix Culpa
Seems to me that primary elections are more about internal party politics. On the R side, do voters go for the Trumpiest of Trumpies, or for the person who is only extremely Trumpy? On the D side, there appear to be some conservadem-liberal-progressive matches (e.g. New York’s gubernatorial candidates), but I’m not sure how much those outcomes will tell us regarding reactions to the late Roe.
A commenter referred earlier to an upcoming statewide referendum in Kansas which would remove the right to abortion from the state constitution. That’s a vote to follow.
From January, Kansas lawmakers put anti-abortion measure on 2022 ballot. It will be interesting to see if the timing backfires on them. Hope so.
David ☘The Establishment☘ Koch
Polls are a lagging indicator.
It takes time for the public to price in new conditions. These numbers will only get worse as reality takes hold.
narya
I’ve been watching them eyeing Griswold for 15+ years (and, of course, was told I was eye-rollingly wrong for most of that time), so I’m very glad to see that I’m no longer in the minority on that. I admit I am pleasantly surprised to see so many people aware of these efforts, and opposed to them. I can only hope it has staying power through November.
Baud
@rikyrah:
Good morning.
Tony Jay
Good Morning, world.
Not to belabour the point, but if any ‘good’ at all comes out of this massive overreach, it’s that the Sinful Sextet might have finally ripped the blinders off for a very important percentage of American voters who are now looking around them at all of the other civilised norms they rely on and realising how under threat they are with a Trumpian Court wielding the banhammer.
I’m not surprised that there’s a tremor of loose-bowelled panic disturbing the placid waters of Lake Republican. Even with the Media deliberately downplaying the issue, the smarter ones suspect they’ve just steam-clamped their underdangies to the track and no amount of ducking and weaving is going to stop the 11.08 train from Backlash Central from mashing them into fertiliser.
Baud
@David ☘The Establishment☘ Koch:
Betty Cracker
Saw those CBS survey numbers last night and was surprised and pleased by how strong the opposition to the SCOTUS radical clerics’ ruling is. I hope they come to rue the fucking day.
@debbie: The day the radical clerics struck down Roe, someone on Twitter said, “Be sure to set your clocks back 50 years before you go to bed tonight.” That’s how it feels.
Soprano2
@randy khan: Last year in MO a rep filed a bill to keep Medicaid from paying for Plan B and IUD’s. It failed, but I expect them to try again, and to make it more onerous. Those nice Republican women are going to be shocked when, one day in the future, their doctor tells them “Sorry, you can’t get an IUD anymore, it’s against the law now”.
I heard an interview on NPR this morning with people who were happy with the ruling; the first was an older woman who said, acerbically, “Maybe now those young women will have to be more careful who they have sex with”. This is their position in a nutshell, let’s make sure the “sluts” are reined in. That’s why they want to go after birth control.
Baud
@Soprano2:
I agree. Women should stick with having sex with women.
Soprano2
@narya: Yep, we’re hysterical when we point out what they are clearly saying they want to do by claiming that most hormonal birth control methods cause abortions. *rolleyes* I’ve heard that, too. “But Republican women use birth control too”. Yes, and they want those Republican women to have more babies, haven’t you been paying attention?!! There was an anti-birth control fanatic in HHS when TFG was president! I hate it when people dismiss your real concerns with “that could never happen”. Maybe they’ll listen more now.
Betty Cracker
@Soprano2: Here’s a grotesque example of that mindset:
Even in Utah she got some backlash for that, most especially for — oops! — forgetting that rape is a thing that happens.
MomSense
The gaslighting from progressives is infuriating. Those motherfuckers with their voting didn’t work BS are just trying to suppress the vote.
Baud
@MomSense:
When people show you who they are, believe them.
O. Felix Culpa
@MomSense:
Ayup.
@Baud:
Ditto.
Deputinize Eurasia from the Kuriles to St Petersburg
@Baud:
Thing that bugs me is this-most of the folks who sneer about people having sex with consenting partners that they’re attracted to (which is all about the sensory and emotional pleasure those interactions generate, and which should be absolutely protected First Amendment activities which don’t affect the objectors at all) are just fine with gluttony and greed.
O. Felix Culpa
@Betty Cracker:
I think Kay mentioned that “intake of semen” line last night. As you say, grotesque.
Baud
@Deputinize Eurasia from the Kuriles to St Petersburg:
They are more than fine with it.
Baud
@MomSense:
If voting didn’t work, ask them why the GOP has not enacted a nationwide abortion ban yet.
O. Felix Culpa
@Baud:
They’re also fine with nonconsensual sex as long as the “right” person is wielding power.
Betty Cracker
Rudy Giuliani is still meeping about the backslap. In the linked clip, he says it was like getting hit with a “boulder” and that it knocked him forward a couple of steps and “hurt tremendously.” We knew he was a shameless, constant liar who lies even when there’s video evidence that plainly contradicts the lie, but the Trump experience is a proof point for generating revenue via telling laughably obvious lies, so…
O. Felix Culpa
I recommend Democracy Docket–Mark Elias’s organization–to keep track of voting rights issues and litigation, and to donate to if you have discretionary funds. They do good work.
Anyway
@Soprano2:
The amount of money that every Rethug administration shovels towards “Abstinence-Only” education programs that are anti-science, anti-biology, anti-women … grrr that’s one of my pet peeves.
Skepticat
I’ve always wondered why these intensely personal issues—abortion, birth control, same-sex and interracial marriage, and the like—haven’t been addressed within the concept of right to privacy. However, given the wackaloons in this country, I also can see it being warped to allow some egregious behavior.
superdestroyer
@randy khan:
A better question is when will some state pass a law saying that government employees do not have to issue same sex marriage certificates if it violates the employees religious beliefs just so the conservatives can get a case in front of the Supreme Court to overturn Obergefell. Remember, Dobbs was not originally about banning abortion.
debbie
@O. Felix Culpa:
If that’s her problem with it, no wonder she has a problem with sex.
OGLiberal
That last tweet is exactly right…
Republican voters: Satan is the GOP candidate? That’s bad. Wait, he’s going to ban gay marriage? I will walk over shards of broken glass to vote for Mephistopheles. Heck, I’ll give him my first born…she’s gay, anyway, so fuck it.
Some Dem voters: Wait, no free college for everybody? And Hillary spoke at a Goldman Sachs conference? I’m staying home. No, wait, I’ll vote for Jill Stein.
Undecided voters: This overturning Roe is some backass 17th century shit. But that GOP dude running for Congress in my district seems reasonable and the fucking loaf of bread I just bought was way too expensive so throw the bums out! Besides, I’m 52, my kids are married so why the fuck do I care about Roe anyway?
This is the electorate we have and it sucks.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@debbie: Right. It’s not a coincidence that most of the issues the Rs obsess over are connected to sex: abortion, birth control, sex ed, LGBTQ, inter-racial marriage. These people are no what you’d call sex-positive
Steve in the ATL
STOP SAYING “PRO-LIFE” FFS!
Kathleen
@Betty Cracker: A noun, a verb, ShopRite.
Betty Cracker
A question for our lawyers: if I understand the point correctly, some are saying it would be pointless for Democrats to codify Roe because the SCOTUS radical clerics would gut the new law as they did VRA. That seems to imply that lawmaking is pointless in general, so I’m trying to figure out if being dismissive of the codify option is a political or legal argument. Could Dems in Congress use Article III powers to shield the law from judicial review as outlined here? Just trying to wrap my mind around what remedies are available. Thanks in advance!
Soprano2
@Anyway: We used to have a law in MO that mandated sex ed in schools be medically accurate. Once R’s got control of the state legislature, they repealed it so their favored organizations could teach that “abstinence-only” crap in the schools.
debbie
@Betty Cracker:
Rudy got a hearty hand clap from a friendly source in that video. Trying to turn it into and attack or a “shot” only shows him to be a frail, old, useless has-been.
PST
I woke up to the realization that I have a primary election to vote in here in Chicago. This is my last day to vote early, which I like to do. I doubt that my Democratic primary votes here are particularly critical, but if anyone has a strong suggestion to make I’m open to it. I would like to see Danny Davis retire, but he’s a solid vote for the party’s principles and anyone who replaces him will be as well.
OzarkHillbilly
@Steve in the ATL: Heh, somewhere around 100,000 covid deaths, I put “ProLife My Ass” on the back of my truck. Every time I’ve thought of replacing that, the GOP does something else so egregious I just can’t do it.
Soprano2
@Steve in the ATL: I keep telling people that too, they’re anti-abortion. If they were really pro life they would also be against the death penalty and for common sense gun reform laws. ETA – and like Ozark says, they would have cared about people dying from Covid. In no way are they “pro-life”.
Kropacetic
I am very happy with the state of Massachusetts’s D primary where the more establishment, better supported candidate and her leftier challenger actually seem to be on the same page regarding the need for ambitious solutions to constituent needs. Everything I checked on their platforms show nearly identical priorities.
The main difference seems to be records of accomplishment. Neither is utterly lacking here, though the one who attained higher office predictably has more significant things to show.
So unless your the type to find institutional support to be inherently suspect, this seems like a pretty clear choice. I’d be delighted for either candidate in any case.
sdhays
@Betty Cracker: I missed this. So Rudy was stumbling out of a bar and hurt his back
ETA: I see debbie at #40 has the context.
superdestroyer
@Betty Cracker: All the Democrats needed to do for the Voting Rights Act is require preclearance for everyone. But the Democrats knew that requiring preclearance in traditionally blue states would cause a massive number of problems. The Supreme Court gave Congress an out of the VRA and Congress would not use it.
O. Felix Culpa
@Steve in the ATL:
THANK YOU!
Betty Cracker
@superdestroyer: Why would preclearance for all cause problems in blue states?
Fleeting Expletive
How many missed periods will there be in the next four months until the November elections? How many more pissed off and panicked women, couples, and parents of teens? There will be fallout.
Four months, just for starters, to try to calculate and live with the rhythm method? Oh, that’s going to be fun.
O. Felix Culpa
@Kropacetic:
I’m not that type. :)
Thanks for the info on the MA gubernatorial primary and good luck! It sounds like you have decent choices. And may MA stop its infernal pattern of choosing R governors.
Baud
@Betty Cracker:
No, we can codify Roe. We just shouldn’t get into a debate about why we haven’t. Assume people who want to have that debate are our adversaries.
@superdestroyer:
Exactly wrong. The Dems fell two Semate votes short of fixing the VRA.
p.a.
Was it during the shrub admin when a lot of the backdoor “watch a video about your fetus” and vaginal probe stuff was proposed or passed? The rethug pol outrage as women began emailing them with their gynecological issues and questions was memorable. Political action is of course the prime need, but just as a way to gum up their machinery, doing the same with the new tech, twitter, instagram etc and including catholic bishops and bible thumpers and the supremes would paint them as the uninformed freaks they are.
RAM
Hey, everyone, is Adam okay? I knew he wasn’t well and his daily Ukraine updates have been missing for the past couple days. If he’s still under the weather, I’m hoping he shakes whatever it is that’s plaguing him and he gets on the mend. We are SO lucky to have someone with his experience and knowledge on this here site to keep us accurately informed.
schrodingers_cat
@MomSense: They want Republican rule. That’s what their actions tell me. They are quite comfortable with misogyny, xenophobia and racism. Like their idol in Vt.
O. Felix Culpa
@Baud:
Yet another attempt to blame the Dems foiled again! Damn those pesky facts.
schrodingers_cat
@Kropacetic: I voted for Maura Healey in the D convention in early June. I am going to phonebank for her. She has been on fire lately.
Kropacetic
@O. Felix Culpa: The only R candidate I’m aware of comes with full Trump backing, so I like our chances.
OGLiberal
How different would this world be if people could have just gotten past their misogony and adherence to media told bullshit and just voted for Clinton instead of staying home, voting for some asshole third-party, or rolling the dice with some shitbag TV-guy? Were things really so bad in 2020 that folks were just willing to roll the dice and let an idiot run this country? And why the fuck, after watching the shitshow that was the Trump administration, did we not know by 10pm on the day of the election that he had definitively lost? Why the fuck was it that close?
Three fucking SCOTUS seats. And fuck Trump taking credit – Jeb Bush would have nominated the same three lunatics. Three SCOTUS seats…because I just don’t trust that Clinton lady
O. Felix Culpa
@Kropacetic:
Omnes Omnibus
@superdestroyer: Golly, you’re back, and you are lying. Your paymasters must be surprised at the backlash if they are pulling anti-Dem trolls like you out of mothballs.
Baud
@OGLiberal:
Alito and Thomas are the two worst and that’s the fault of the two Bushes.
schrodingers_cat
It is not surprising what the so called progressives are doing right now. They have been at it since 2016 if not earlier. Vt senator’s campaign was mainly about white grievance just like the Republican nominee’s. Dressing it up in socialist clothes with a few slightly less pale spokespeople doesn’t change that.
JPL
The court refused to take up the Sullivan vs NYT case again. This was
Ginni’sThomas’ dissentThomas writes that he would grant review to revisit the Sullivan “actual malice” standard for defamation. “This case,” he writes, “is one of many showing how NYT and its progeny have allowed media organizations and interest groups ‘to cast false aspersions on public figures with near impunity.”
omg He has no clue about real abuse. what a whiner
Kropacetic
I read “Semate” as Sinema. That tracks.
As long as Manchin and Sinema rule as unelected king and queen of the US, I will now be referring to our most deliberative most inactivate government body as the “Sinemate.”
Baud
@JPL:
Surprised to see him defend Hillary Clinton!
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: Heh back in the day on this very blog the villain during the Alito hearings was Ted Kennedy.
germy shoemangler
As someone said, there’s a reason God made him infertile.
JPL
@Baud: They are going to hear another case regarding religious liberty. from Scotusblog
This was a case in which a Christian non-profit group sued the Southern Poverty Law Center for designating it as an anti-LGBT hate group, and AmazonSmile excluded C
rikyrah
TRUTH
nerd nonsense (@nerdnonsense19) tweeted at 11:12 PM on Sun, Jun 26, 2022:![]()
It’s offensive to tell any Black person in this country, when we have ancestors who actually died trying, that voting doesn’t matter. It does. It always has. Or those with corrupt power wouldn’t try so hard to suppress it.
(https://twitter.com/nerdnonsense19/status/1541273201547911169?t=c-jXulnQQ12Yc-DzlMXuew&s=03)
evap
Okay, possibly dumb question: Why would SCOTUS/GOP want to outlaw birth control? I can’t believe that more than a small minority of voters want this, much much smaller than the group who wanted to overturn Roe.
OGLiberal
@Baud: Yes, they are. But if this country hadn’t been as stupid as it is, if Clinton wins in 2016 they don’t matter.
I’d put Coney in the same world as Alito and Thomas…she’s cult level shit.
germy shoemangler
Brachiator
@Soprano2:
The Connecticut Comstock Act of 1873 made it illegal to use “any drug, medicinal article, or instrument for the purpose of preventing conception…” The theory behind this was that the state had an interest in making sure that men and women got married and had children. And so, acts of intercourse should result in pregnancy.
The crazy thing is that by the 1950s only Massachusetts and Connecticut still had these laws on the books.
The law that Griswold overturned wasn’t just aimed at potential sluts, it assumed that the state had the right to indirectly monitor and directly control the behavior of all men and women in the state.
I ain’t no lawyer, but I have never understood why conservatives keep thumping that there is no right to privacy because the Constitution does not say so. It seems plain to my ignorant eyes that the Constitution establishes the federal government and defines its powers, and that the Bill of Rights lists some specific restraints on government power.
But conservatives and this Taliban Supreme Court seems to believe that the states are mini dictatorships with total and complete sovereignty over the lives of the people who live there.
I am glad that I live in a blue state, California. But I see myself as a citizen of the United States who lives in California. And it is absurd to think that my rights should ever wax and wane if I visit or even move to another state, or that I should have to double check each state’s constitution to see what rights I might have.
I suppose that a general rule might be that a state constitutional provision might be more expansive than the federal Constitution, but never more restrictive. And I totally reject the theory of the Taliban Justices of the Supreme Court that they have held some legalistic seance with the Ghosts of the Founders and have determined how the country should work.
Baud
@schrodingers_cat:
Really? I wasn’t here then.
Kropacetic
@evap: Control! Control! They must have control!
raven
Video of the “attack” on Guliani. Fucking wimp.
Kropacetic
@Baud: I wisely decided to watch those hearings from my buddy’s house with half an ounce of the finest herb we could find.
germy shoemangler
sad:
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: Really! I wasn’t here either. But JGC was a staunch Republican back then. He was not Alito fan but thought that Kennedy had overreached.
Soprano2
@evap: Because they claim to believe that it causes abortions, but the real reason is to punish the “sluts” even more by making it harder for them to prevent pregnancy. They really want us to go back to the sexual mores and situation of the 1950’s.
evap
@Kropacetic: Okay, maybe, but that’s the folks who want to outlaw it. I would think that the politicians would stay clear because it would piss off a lot of voters, and would definitely not help the GOP gain voters.
O. Felix Culpa
@Brachiator:
It would be better and more accurate to refer to the Six and their supporters as Christofascists, instead of Taliban, for that is what they are. Especially since Islam has more liberal allowance for abortion than they do.
Betty Cracker
@Baud: I choose to interpret my ignorance on the dynamics of that intramural feud as a sign that I’m making progress on the road to Normieville! :)
OzarkHillbilly
@germy shoemangler: He’s got a point, just not the point he wants.
schrodingers_cat
@O. Felix Culpa: Agreed. No reason to invoke Taliban when the Spanish Inquisition will do. This court is imposing Catholicism as the state religion by judicial fiat.
raven
Haven’t had enough? SCOTUS has more.
Baud
@Betty Cracker:
Welcome!
It’s a standard trope. Because Dems held power at limited times in the last 50 years, anything that hasn’t been fixed is the Dems fault and so they shouldn’t be trusted.
germy shoemangler
Betty Cracker
@O. Felix Culpa: I’ve been going with “radical clerics” since it’s nonspecific enough to apply to all religious fanatics who are a menace to secular governments.
raven
The Court holds that both the free exercise and free speech clauses protect Kennedy’s right to pray at midfield following high school football games.
O. Felix Culpa
@schrodingers_cat:
Obligatory: Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition! https://youtu.be/Cj8n4MfhjUc
There’s little excuse for not expecting it in the case of Roe, though. The klaxons have been blaring for a long time.
germy shoemangler
@Betty Cracker:
I’m so old I remember when “radical clerics” were nuns and priests working for human rights in South America.
Betty Cracker
@RAM: He and I are frequently in touch via text (mostly to point and laugh/cry at stupid things happening in Florida, of which there are many), so I can report he’s okay. My guess is he needed a break; I know he puts a ton of time and heart into those posts, which I imagine is draining.
schrodingers_cat
@Betty Cracker: In India the RWNJs are not clerics necessarily but have fused toxic nationalism with toxic religiosity.
And my cohort (the equivalent of ww here) has been largely supportive.
Soprano2
@Brachiator: During the time this law was passed it was assumed that only prostitutes wanted to control pregnancy, so that was the basis of this law. That was wrong, but it was what the old men of that age believed.
JPL
All religious nuts can now take a knee, but not Colin Kaepernick. Free speech
They continue to weaken the separation of church and state, but only for Christians..
Citizen Alan
@OGLiberal:
I’m assuming you meant 2016. And it was exactly the opposite. Things were going quite well in 2016 which is why the vote went the way it did. When the economy is in freefall and everything’s going to hell, no one gives a shit about culture issues. It’s only when the democrats have gotten everything back on track that the chuds have the luxury of voting for their hatreds over their pocket books.
O. Felix Culpa
@raven:
Fuck those fucking fuckers.
That is all.
geg6
@evap:
What makes you think they give a shit at this point? Isn’t it pretty obvious that screaming the quiet parts into a bullhorn while wearing clown makeup and shoes is SOP for them at this point? The entire party exists for nothing more than trolling the libs in every way possible and then giggling with their fat white Klan buddies about it.
The Moar You Know
59/41 is appalling. Should be 73/27. Or even less. 41%…this country is fucked up.
raven
@O. Felix Culpa:
The fear of offending the Constitution’s establishment clause does not, Gorsuch writes, require the government “to single out private religious speech for special disfavor. The Constitution and the best of our traditions counsel mutual respect and tolerance, not censorship and suppression, for religious and nonreligious views alike.”
Baud
@geg6:
Exactly right. The GOP message for the last 40 years is “We dare you to vote for Democrats to stop us.” And a lot of people are unable to rise up to the challenge.
schrodingers_cat
@The Moar You Know: Polls are a lagging indicator we should check in a month.
Baud
@Citizen Alan:
I agree.
O. Felix Culpa
@Betty Cracker:
That works too.
My other concern is the presumably unintended whiff of Islamophobia when we invoke the Taliban. We have our own homegrown fanatics and should acknowledge them as such.
Soprano2
@raven: The Radical 5 won’t be happy until the U.S. government and all the states can endorse Christianity as the official religion of the U.S.
Baud
@raven:
By nonreligious, I’m pretty sure he means Christian denominations other than his own.
Soprano2
@raven: Can’t wait until a Muslim coach unrolls a prayer rug at the 50 yard line and starts encouraging the whole team to pray with him.
Brachiator
@Soprano2:
The original law dates from 1873. If they thought that only prostitutes wanted to control pregnancy, they would have left married couples alone. Associated laws made it illegal to send information about birth control through the mail.
Also, in the deep days of the patriarchy, men had a vested interest in making sure that the prostitutes they visited did not become pregnant. But lack of birth control would scare their daughters into remaining pure. And they were expected to perform their duties as husband by fathering children with their fecund wives.
prostratedragon
@PST: (If you’re still around) Were you in Danny Davis’s district before? I was, over here in Bronzeville/Grand Boulevard, but now I’m back in the 1st, as for many years before. That’s some major redistricting.
sdhays
@Brachiator: Just to add, they’ve pretty much given up on even “Ghosts of the Founders” when they’re reaching back to 17th century witch trail judges. I guess even the Founders in their heads can’t be trusted.
Geminid
@germy shoemangler: The Washington Post had a good article Saturday about a new Uvalde organization titled “Fierce Madres.” They are very determined to hold their city’s political leadership accountable for its failures on May 24 and since. Among other efforts, they are holding voter registration drives.
O. Felix Culpa
@raven:
Sigh. And they’re not done yet. As I said, fuck those fucking fuckers.
Soprano2
@Brachiator: I’m not saying it made sense, but that was the logic of the law. It was assumed that a good married woman wouldn’t even want birth control, which was extremely wrong. Like I said, this was white men writing the laws. They probably thought it was easier to just ban it universally rather than make an exception for a group they thought wouldn’t be trying to get the products anyway. Plus, it was probably assumed that if a married woman wanted contraception, it meant she was cheating on her husband. Again completely wrong, but that was the cultural belief at the time.
O. Felix Culpa
I remember the days when Rs complained about activist courts and “legislating from the bench.” I’m beginning to think that wasn’t really the issue.
//
raven
They are not going to gut the EPA today.
Baud
@raven: Save some for next year!
Soprano2
@O. Felix Culpa: Ya think! LOL Of course they don’t mind activism as long as it’s the “right” kind of activism. In a few years they’ll probably be ruling that it’s perfectly OK for teachers to lead Christian prayers in public schools, and that not letting them do so violates their free speech rights to indoctrinate children into their religion.
Brachiator
@O. Felix Culpa:
That works, too. Also, I have problems with all religious extremism and religious fundamentalism. I certainly don’t have any problem with Islam.
And I explicitly associated these Supreme Clown Justices with the Taliban because they are exactly alike, even though these fools think that their own religious principles are wonderful. But their extremism blindly hurts people and is socially destructive.
raven
@Baud: No, they will decide this term.
JPL
@O. Felix Culpa: They’re going to gut the ability of the federal government to regulate smog. They will say this only applies to this one case. In the fall they will gut the clean water act.
I hope I’m wrong, but I fear not.
Baud
@raven: Ah, I see. There are more opinions coming later this week. Thanks.
JPL
@raven: I don’t think today. They’ll wait until the last day. imo
raven
Hey, now it will be easier to get your fix!
Anyway
@Soprano2:
Ha! I would watch that football game
O. Felix Culpa
@Brachiator:
“But their extremism blindly hurts people and is socially destructive.”
Truth. Rather understated, even.
raven
@JPL: They are done for today.
JPL
If the supremes gut the ability of the federal government to regulate, Biden should consider adding a few justices for those stolen from us.
Thor Heyerdahl
I haven’t checked any libertarian accounts since the decision- but you’d think this would be a slam dunk for them with state overreach into personal autonomy…. hahahahahahaha who am I kidding. Non cis, white guys need not apply.
germy shoemangler
Jim, Foolish Literalist
/rubs temples/
germy shoemangler
@JPL:
I thought he announced he wasn’t going to consider that.
lowtechcyclist
We have to win enough votes with the electorate we have, not the one we’d like to have.
Baud
@germy shoemangler:
schrodingers_cat
Why are people acting so surprised at the Roe verdict. Am I the only one who remembers the air quotes by McCain around the health of the mother when an abortion question came up during a Presidential debate with Obama?
schrodingers_cat
WTF is MSNBC up to giving this organization a platform?
Baud
@schrodingers_cat:
MSNBC’s ratings went up during the Trump years too.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@schrodingers_cat: that specific and very strange organization aside, the whole “HOW DARE YOU!” thing on fund-raising strikes me as odd.
schrodingers_cat
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: A certain NY Congresswoman was retweeting and otherwise amplifying them as well.
Baud
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
I just hope no one blackmails me into voting to restore Roe.
Brachiator
@Soprano2:
My reading of history is that these laws were not only directed at women, nor did they assume that good middle class white women would not even worry their pretty little heads about birth control. It was more that husbands were expected to be fertile and that women could not object or refuse.
People forget that often it was illegal to sell condoms, and that later people got around the obvious contraceptive value of condoms by labeling them as being “only for the prevention of disease.”
Women had no say in matters of birth control. One of actress Katherine Hepburn’s aunts became a doctor because she observed that in their upper class society, male family doctors would not inform their women patients that their husbands had contracted a venereal disease. And even on the rare occasions when a wife did find out, husbands could refuse to protect their wives. Hepburn’s aunt wanted to make sure that women could make informed choices about matters that affected their health and sex lives.
funlady75
@Betty Cracker:
thanks for update on Adam..
OGLiberal
@Citizen Alan: Yes, did mean 2016. And how do we fix that? Polls say majority of folks don’t agree with the white guys rule/ make the sluts and browns pay party. I get gerrymandering is an issue at the state level but why do Dems lose national elections? Yeah, electoral college and all that but I find it insane that states like WI, MI and PA are toss-ups these days.
Of course, I know the answer….fucking white people.
Eolirin
@germy shoemangler: Biden doesn’t get to consider shit when it comes to the court. Congress does. If there’s a will and numbers in the house and senate a court expansion bill will end up on his desk and he’s not going to veto it.
It’s not clear that there’s enough support for that yet, and we need to expand our senate majority and hold the house for it to even be an option. But if they keep making extremely bad rulings that affect the ability of society to function and keep striping essential rights the support will get there as long as we can win elections.
Eolirin
@OGLiberal: If white women start voting for Democrats with the same margins that white men vote for Republicans, the Republicans will cease to exist overnight. We may be heading toward that.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Or, you know not much, as far as this person knows, in her town, in her personal work experience
I don’t know why that formatting is so wiggy, it’s copied from Axios– and for those who don’t want to click, that Abigail Spanberger’s opponent in VA
Geminid
@schrodingers_cat: I attribute that to bad staff work, but this is no excuse. And the way the Congresswoman and MSNBC were so quick to amplify these these dubious complainers says something about their priorities.
Kayla Rudbek
@evap: because 1) they’re true believers 2) that’s what their Rethuglican paymasters want. I was educated by these people, I went to school with these people, and the only thing that has so far saved us from a religious dictatorship was the denominational splits between Catholic and all the flavors of Protestant. But now I see that the real split coming up is authoritarian/fundamentalist versus democracy, across all denominations and religions. It doesn’t matter what the label on the box is, if the contents are the same rotten patriarchal and oligarchic crud.
Steeplejack
@debbie:
Refresher for those who haven’t seen it—the brutal attack on Rudy Giuliani. Supposedly it wasn’t friendly; the guy allegedly called Rudy a “scumbag,” although possibly in a “New York friendly” kind of way. Or that could be another fiction of the Rudy side of the story.
Baud
@Geminid:
I don’t quite understand all the details, but bad staff work would entail a retraction at some point, no?
Brachiator
I see the Supreme Clowns are at it again
This does not seem like a personal religious observance.
If he prayed at home, at church, even privately in a school office, no problem. But the field is part of the school property. And there is no reason for him to involve his players in his supposedly personal religious observance.
Next up. Specific endorsement of school prayer.
Soprano2
@JPL: If they do that it’s insane, because air pollution doesn’t stay within one state’s borders. You’ll have a crazy situation where states are suing each other all over the place over pollution. That’s why it needs to be a federal issue!
Soprano2
@Anyway: I read an editorial a long time ago in “Church and State” magazine written by a fundamentalist Christian about how he thought prayer at things like football games was OK until he moved to Hawaii and there was a native religious ritual before the football game at his son’s high school. Suddenly he understood what everyone was upset about!
Geminid
@Baud: Not neccesarily in this case. MSNBC may not account for giving credence to these cult members (and the “independent journalist” who interviewed them) either.
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: I also found this.
SFAW
@Betty Cracker:
But haven’t we been told that wimmins have a “way to shut that down”?
Baud
@schrodingers_cat:
What am I looking at? What’s the significance of the chanting?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@schrodingers_cat: is she still saying Biden should open abortion clinics on federal lands because as a sitting Member of Congress doesn’t know about, just for starters, the Hyde Amendment?
Steeplejack
@OGLiberal:
But her emails!
Soprano2
@Brachiator: Yep, within a few years your Catholic child’s Baptist teacher will be able to try to indoctrinate him/her with a religious belief different from yours in the classroom if these people have their way.
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: AOC is chanting with the leader of the RiseUp4Abortion group which calls itself communist.
The account tweeting the video is also a bit cray cray. So many crazies hard to keep them straight.
Baud
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
The main problem isn’t the Hyde Amendment, it’s the Assimilative Crimes Act.
Baud
@schrodingers_cat:
Is that the same group discussed in the MSNBC tweet?
Also
Is that their actual name, because it’s backwards, no?
schrodingers_cat
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: She put out a video urging Ds to purge their pro-life members. RNC research immediately tweeted that video.
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: I made a mistake. I have corrected it.
It is RiseUp4Abortion. Yes same as the MSNBC group.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@schrodingers_cat: @Baud: Sunsara Taylor is, I believe, the woman with the microphone
More on that group:
and of course……
Steeplejack
@germy shoemangler:
Couple holding sign: “Please don’t abort . . . we will adopt your baby!”
@vagabondvivant: “I’ll be honest—if my spouse and I looked like that, we’d adopt too.”
@IsThisThingOn31: “Please don’t make me snort laugh in these troubled times.”
Baud
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Thanks for the information. We get mad when centrists associate with places like No Labels, I think fairness requires similar treatment here. (I actually don’t care that much that she’s a communist, but I don’t care to be preached to about abortion by someone who opposed Hillary).
Matt McIrvin
This isn’t the way, you’re supposed to hide the naughty word behind some kind of coy phrase about Brandon!
Matt McIrvin
@Baud: Not just any communist, one of Bob Avakian’s clowns. Maoists who hang around college campuses telling people not to vote. They’ve been worse than useless since forever.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Eolirin:
Thank you. I don’t have the energy anymore. I had to quit listening to Molly Jong-Fast’s podcast because of this and other Green Lanternist horseshit. How does someone who doesn’t understand the whole checks-and-balances/co-equal branches of government thing get paid to write (and podcast) for so many high-end outlets
Geminid
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: I really appreciate Dr. Susan Prendergast’s Twitter feed. Her day job is professor of literature at the University of Illinois, but Ms. Prendergast has a lot of good political insights too.
Baud
@Matt McIrvin: Ok, thanks. That sounds … not good.
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: Red Roses are not our friends.
Matt McIrvin
@Baud: They fit right into the stupider fringes of political Internet trolldom but they’ve actually been at this at least since I was a teenager, handing out pamphlets and newspapers on campus. I do admire their persistence.
(They are not to be confused with the British group also called the Revolutionary Communist Party, who sometime back in the 1990s or so suddenly decided they were anarcho-capitalist libertarians, changed their name and started mostly attacking environmentalists. Stupid comes in many enticing forms.)
rikyrah
@germy shoemangler:
SUE SUE SUE
TheTruffle
@David ☘The Establishment☘ Koch:
You believe this to be the case? Because today’s article on Dems switching to GOP was scary. See below.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/more-than-1-million-voters-switch-to-gop-in-warning-for-dems/ar-AAYTKxY?rc=1&ocid=winp1taskbar&cvid=898223c1217e43fae91d5226098e8208
Is this a real shift or would these be Dems ratfucking primaries?
germy shoemangler
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
I was simply replying to JPL’s comment that Biden should consider adding a few justices for those stolen from us.
Baud
@Matt McIrvin:
I hadn’t heard of them before.
Baud
@Matt McIrvin:
There’s something for everyone.
Skepticat
Might this be a good time to start repeating and showing all the times tRump said he was in favor of abortion?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@germy shoemangler: I suppose I was too. But I am enormously frustrated by people judging Biden and Democrats by a standard of executive power that is based in fantasy. “Biden just needs to….”
germy shoemangler
@Skepticat:
Can they lock him up for paying for one?
germy shoemangler
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
I suppose it’s because the people making those “just do something” requests often see something being done. “Billions for Ukraine? Done!” “Pass a special law to give additional protection to supreme court justices? Done!” “Increase funding for police depts? No problem, done!”
And then they look at their own lives and problems with health insurance, or rising rents, or unaffordable houses, and they see “Well, we’re going on recess, see ya in a few weeks” or “Well, we’re forming a commission to take a closer look at that” etc.
stinger
@Soprano2:
FTFY
Geminid
@Matt McIrvin: These people remind me of Lyndon Larouche’s outfit, but I don’t think they are connected, just similar in their culty nature.
I have a theory that Larouche’s people took over the Green Party when the old man died, but much of it is supposition. They went somewhere, though.
germy shoemangler
@Geminid:
maybe Qanon?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@germy shoemangler: yes, politics is hard and often frustrating. Pretending that the executive branch has power and authority it doesn’t won’t make that any better. It very often makes it worse.
sab
@Betty Cracker: “Radical clerics” doesn’t really work, since they aren’t clerics. They’re just a bunch of lawyers.
Baud
@germy shoemangler:
It’s frustrating, but until they recognize who’s standing in their way, there’s nothing we can do.
Soprano2
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: *sigh* I’m almost there between all the stuff you mention (“Why isn’t Merrick Garland doing anything!!!!!“, she whines on almost every podcast) and her awful voice and laugh…I’m not one to dislike women’s voices, but she needs a voice coach IMHO if she’s going to be on a podcast, because that laugh is grating.
Soprano2
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: People get confused about what they think happened vs. what can actually be proven. You can’t arrest people based on what you think happened, you have to have actual evidence that will stand up in court. I explain this to people a lot, and I’m not a lawyer!
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Soprano2: I’ve actually come to like her voice! she has some medical condition that I believe led to the removal of a vocal cord.
She gets great guests, especially on Covid, but yeah, her rhetoric on Garland is another thing that makes me want to bang my head against the desk.
superdestroyer
@Betty Cracker: Because there is no way that state like New Hampshire could be allowed to keep voting rules that would have never cleared Justice Department review in Alabama or Mississippi.
Matt McIrvin
@Geminid: Very similar, though, yes, not the same bunch. LaRouche also started out claiming to be a Marxist and then flipped to a strange conspiracy-fueled version of the extreme right, while also trying to take over the Democratic Party from the inside by running fringe candidates in local elections.
Soprano2
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: The voice isn’t that bad, but her nasally laugh makes me crazy every time I hear it! I know there is vocal coaching for people who are on the radio or TV, because I had a friend who had to take classes to learn how to say “s” when she was on a microphone. People can learn to modulate their voice to make it more pleasing. Most people don’t need that, but when you’re on the radio/TV/podcast/YouTube you should at least think about it. I would probably at least go to someone if I were considering that to make sure I didn’t have any problems I needed to fix to make it easier for people to listen to me.
superdestroyer
@Baud: The Freedom to Vote act was filibustered and did not even seem to mention preclearance. If the Democrats were really serious about preclearance after Holder, they should have proposed it for all 50 states and taken away one of the major arguments of the Republicans.
Matt McIrvin
(Speaking more generally: Self-described Marxist radicals suddenly turning into fascists or right-wingers of some sort is actually a really common process. Sometimes, there’s an intermediate period when they espouse a bunch of far-right ideas but claim they’re still the true left, you’re the fascist. It happens much more often than the other way around–apostates from the right are more likely to slide gradually toward a conventional liberalism.)
livewyre
@Matt McIrvin: Right? Rule of force is a hell of a drug.
Baud
@superdestroyer:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Lewis_Voting_Rights_Act
OGLiberal
@Eolirin: I would strongly advise that nobody hold their breath waiting for that to happen. I know too many white women who are as big or bigger assholes than their husbands. 50+ percent of white women voted for Trump in 2020 knowing full well that he was a sexist asshole and that Roe was likely dead. They ain’t changing their minds because of this decision…in fact, they probably love it. Our only hope is getting more of our side out to vote and prevent folks from our side from voting for Jill Stein because Dem candidate A didn’t pledge to turn the entire Midwest into a wind farm.
UncleEbeneezer
@germy shoemangler: Speaking of Get Out, yesterday at the Jazz Festival at The Bowl, there was this Big Phat Band that played that was nothing but white people. It was really strange considering it was a SUPER-BLACK crowd (probably 60-75%). Then they brought out this white lady with platinum blonde hair who sang the chorus of “Through The Wire” off Kanye West’s iconic album The College Dropout. It was SO BIZARRE. I seriously thought we might be in an episode of Atlanta.
UncleEbeneezer
One of the friends I went to the Bowl with yesterday is a FreeAssange/Dem Socialists bozo. Nice guy and he does good work locally on police reform, but never, ever, ever talk US politics with him. His opening salvo on Dobbs/Roe was “You know who I blame?”
To which almost like a drinking game we all new the answer would be The Democrats/Pelosi etc. So goddamn irritating…I just changed the subject.
divF
@evap: Remember, the Six are all right-wing Catholics, and the Catholic Church has as doctrine (1) sex without the possibility of procreation is sinful, and (2) life begins at conception.
OGLiberal
@divF: Right wing Catholics are basically Evangelicals but with a big international and powerful infrastructure. That said, the Catholic wingers hate Francis and think the Vatican is controlled by a gang of gay bishops.