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Donald Trump found guilty as fuck – May 30, 2024!

They were going to turn on one another at some point. It was inevitable.

They are not red states to be hated; they are voter suppression states to be fixed.

A democracy can’t function when people can’t distinguish facts from lies.

if you can’t see it, then you are useless in the fight to stop it.

The republican ‘Pastor’ of the House is an odious authoritarian little creep.

Quote tweet friends, screenshot enemies.

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Disappointing to see gov. newsom with his finger to the wind.

Balloon Juice, where there is always someone who will say you’re doing it wrong.

Celebrate the fucking wins.

Speaker Mike Johnson is a vile traitor to the House and the Constitution.

Not so fun when the rabbit gets the gun, is it?

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Petty moves from a petty man.

Seems like a complicated subject, have you tried yelling at it?

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Welcome to day five of every-bit-as-bad-as-you-thought-it-would-be.

You are here: Home / Domestic Terrorism / Tuesday’s Jan6 Committee Hearing Open Thread: Early Notes

Tuesday’s Jan6 Committee Hearing Open Thread: Early Notes

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Excellent summary, IMO. Rep. Cheney is not gonna settle for less than a Red Wedding reenactment:

If there’s one member of the Jan. 6 committee most focused on guiding the Justice Department to charge former president Donald Trump, it’s Rep. Liz Cheney (R-Wyo.). Cheney was the first, back in December, to preview the crime that the committee would ultimately focus on: obstruction of an official proceeding of Congress. Cheney later objected when Jan. 6 committee Chairman Bennie G. Thompson (D-Miss.) said the committee wouldn’t be making a criminal referral to the Justice Department. Cheney said last week that, in fact, multiple criminal referrals could be on the way…

“Now, the argument seems to be that President Trump was manipulated by others outside the administration, that he was persuaded to ignore his closest advisers and that he was incapable of telling right from wrong,” Cheney said.

She added: “The strategy is to blame people his advisers called, quote, ‘the crazies’ for what Donald Trump did. This, of course, is nonsense. President Trump is a 76-year-old man. He is not an impressionable child.”

She said the record, in fact, showed quite the opposite — that he was told over and over again that he had in fact lost his reelection. The committee has shared lots of evidence that he had been told this, and it would play new evidence to that effect Tuesday.

Then came the key line from Cheney: “No rational or sane man in his position could disregard that information and reach the opposite conclusion. And Donald Trump cannot escape responsibility by being willfully blind.”…

But some close to the situation continue to push the idea that ne’er-do-wells were whispering in Trump’s ear and manipulating him — a view that’s consistent with how aides have long talked anonymously about how Trump’s worst impulses came to be. Cheney laid down a marker, asserting that the committee won’t settle for that, even if it could conceivably be used to prove Trump broke the law.




=====

Sidebar: Mehdi Hasan and his DO SOMETHING!! besties can now shut up, forever:

Reader Interactions

116Comments

  2. 2.

    sab

    Small thing in the scheme of thimgs, but Mehdi Hassan certainly is clueless most of the time. Why does he have a show in the USA?

  4. 4.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    Medhi Hassan is a fucking tool, a bellowing blowhard. I don’t know why this has to be pointed out over and over again, but apparently it does.

    ETA: @sab: I can’t remember if I’ve read this or it’s just my notion based on their similar sympathies and worldviews, but I hold to the theory that Chris Hayes is his big booster at MSNBC

  6. 6.

    zhena gogolia

    @sab: Wow, those tweets are bad, aren’t they? I sometimes get sucked into the Mehdi thing because his accent is so cute. But that’s bad.

  8. 8.

    cain

    Mehdi’s tweet was certainly rage inducing. All these clowns were screaming “do something” and now the story is all changed.

    That said, kudos to Cheney for going for the jugular – her father has taught her well.

  15. 15.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    Speaking of Do-Somethingists, blowhards and Chris Hayes

    Will Bredderman @WillBredderman
    NEW, from me: @CorbinTrent @AOC‘s former comms head and a co-founder of @JusticeDems and @BrandNew535, launched @NoExcuses_PAC in 2021 to end the filibuster and pressure Manchin and Sinema. But for more than a year, it’s done little but pay Trent himself.’

    article’s paywalled, but it looks like a not uncommon story, he pays himself and hired a friend’s company to help him pay himself. I’m sure it’s a huge relief to Manchin and Sinema that this political jeenyus is distracted from “pressuring” them by his grift.

    Centrism Fan Acct @Wilson__Valdez

    I turned on MSNBC primetime a few days after the Roe ruling to see what they were saying and for some inexplicable reason @chrislhayes had this Justice Dems grifter on as a guest to discuss it. Turned that garbage off quickly.

    “He’s deeply unpopular. He’s old as shit. He’s largely been ineffective, unless we’re counting judges or whatever the hell inside-baseball scorecard we’re using. said Corbin Trent, co-founder of the progressive No Excuses PAC and former communications director for Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (D-N.Y.)

    Hayes turns to this little “unless we’re counting judges or whatever the hell” nitwit to discuss the trump-Bush (because I’m feeling nice) Court

  16. 16.

    sab

    An important part of management is hiring good people. Anyone noticing how good Biden’s hires are?

  17. 17.

    piratedan

    out of the names named at Coup Club, anyone there that was a surprise for anyone?

    I speculated in a prior thread about what Nona Pelosi might do, is hoping that expulsion and barring from holding future and current office is on the table.  Might as well put down a marker and make them choose, the big lie or the country.

  19. 19.

    Splitting Image

    I’ll give Hasan credit for this: in two tweets he has perfectly captured how the news media depicts the Democratic party and why the professional left is so consistently disappointed in it.

    When faced with an important decision and more than one course of action which can be taken, the wise course is to draw up a list of advantages and disadvantages for each. The news media does this, waits until the Democrats commit to an action, then lists the disadvantages of what they did and the advantages of the other option. Presto: Democrats in disarray! Again.

  21. 21.

    UncleEbeneezer

    Hassan is trying to give Elie Mystal a run for his money as most annoying member of MSM Do Something Twitter

  24. 24.

    Shalimar

    @piratedan: I had never heard of Brian Babin before.  Other than that, it was all the worst House members except Mo Brooks. And I guess Boebert, who would have been included if it had been a few months of her trolling-for-attention later.

  25. 25.

    Jim Appleton

    So witness Ayers is shown on video entering the Capitol in a helmet and what looks like body armor.

    None of which is relevant to his testimony?

  28. 28.

    sab

    @Jay: I had an internship at a big manufacturing /chemical corporation in 1978, and upper management was absolutely giddy about PACs.

  29. 29.

    sab

    Where’s Goku? Probably working. I want to know if he knows Stephen Ayres. Same county. They must know each other.

  31. 31.

    sab

    @pat: We do need two parties. I just wish the other one still was Lincoln’s. I am not sure Cheney is on board with that.

    She believes Antifa is an equal menace. The Antifa kids I know are just tolerant punkers who get in fights with racist punkers. What am I missing?

  32. 32.

    SiubhanDuinne

    Whether this is Autocorrect Gone Wild or merely journalistic ignorance, I do not know, but it’s one of the finest entries in the “Are There No Editors?”sweepstakes I’ve seen in a long time. Take it away, Washington Post:

    When he arrived on the Ellipsis, Ayres said, he didn’t plan to march to the Capitol.

  34. 34.

    HumboldtBlue

    I am rarely gobsmacked (well, that shit changed 2015 or so) and yet Oklahoma is always a gold mine for gobsmackingly absurd stories. Like, Florida’s younger, much stupider cousin. And to be honest, if I’m gonna kill somebody, they better call me the “mad butcher” or “slasher McGee” and not the fucking “noodler.”

    A noodler has been arrested on a murder complaint after he confessed to killing another fisherman for trying to feed him to Bigfoot along a river in southeast Oklahoma, an OSBI agent reported.

  36. 36.

    sab

    Normies shouldn’t go to marches.

    I am an Ohioan but I have been to a lot of marches to DC and I am not particularly radical or active. And I always knew, from age 15, that if people start bashing other people or knocking down barriers  or attacking cops you get the hell out of there.

    This isn’t rocket science.

    Trump politicized non-voters. The results weren’t pretty.

  38. 38.

    ian

    @sab: Well, that sent me googling.  He is a British born naturalized US citizen.  He has been a fairly prolific writer working for several US based magazines and websites before TV.  He has a show in the USA because NBC hired him.

    Here is an interesting guardian article about why Brits get so many media jobs in US. Link

  39. 39.

    Ken

    @HumboldtBlue: I recently read Nellie Bly’s “10 Days in a Madhouse”, and was shocked by how bad the treatment of the mentally ill was back then. But I can’t say that it’s better to let them wander around, dodging imaginary Bigfoots and voting, until they kill someone.

  41. 41.

    Fake Irishman

    @HumboldtBlue:

    a noodler is some one who fishes for large catfish by sticking out a finger and wiggling it in muddy water. Think 20lbs plus. A very Oklahoma thing to do. Perhaps Ozark can fill us in on the finer points as it’s also pretty popular in his neck of the woods.

  42. 42.

    Jay

    @HumboldtBlue:

    “noodler’s” hand fish catfish by sticking their arms into hollow logs, undercut banks, rockpiles, log jams and caves. When the catfish bites onto you, you grab him back, ( because your hand is deep in it’s mouth), and try to haul it out.

    They are a little bit territorial about good noodling spots.

  43. 43.

    sab

    @ian: Well I didn’t know that he is a US citizen. He needs to restudy his civics class.

    Since he is one of us now I’ll cut him some slack, but maybe he should get another job until he learns the ropes. Our government structure is insanely complicated and nothing like the UK, but nevertheless it is what it is. That’s the parameters within which responsible, knowledgeable reporters report, because that is the parameters within which politicians must try to govern.

  44. 44.

    HumboldtBlue

    @Fake Irishman: @Jay:

    Oh, I am aware of noodling, the term just doesn’t give off an air of danger and menace.

    Although, now that I think about it, it does give off a whiff of “wicked uncle Ernie” and that’s disturbing.

    Then again, we are discussing the preferred name one would like if they were a serial killer.

  50. 50.

    James E Powell

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    When he arrived on the Ellipsis (sic), Ayres said, he didn’t plan to march to the Capitol.

    Instead of “he said” insert “he now claims” –

    Note to reporters & editors:  pretend it’s Hillary Clinton then do what you always do.

  54. 54.

    RaflW

    I get the sense that Liz is still serious about running for president in ’24. Wyoming is too much of a cipher for me to get a sense if ‘crossover Dems’ will show up enough for her to keep her seat, but she’s sure raising her profile.

    None of that is to say her J6 work isn’t solid and important. But I think it helps that she’s ambitious (and maybe a little too full of herself like her daddy).

  55. 55.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @RaflW: I hadn’t heard that she’s planning a presidential run. As we’ve learned, a candidate focused on running against one other person as opposed to for the presidency can do a lot of damage to that person. I don’t know if there’s room in the GOP for that kind of campaign, but it might be fun to watch. I can’t deny she has a presence.

    Of course, Ron DeSantis might be the actual beneficiary if it worked.

  56. 56.

    Jay

    @SFAW:

    big Catfish hide out during the day. Most people who fish for catfish in coloured water, use trotlines at night.

    I have guddy tickled trout, char and salmon.

    There is something about catching a fish with nothing but your bare hands that is unique.

  57. 57.

    debbie

    @RaflW:

    I think she’s realistic enough she knows she has no chance there in ’22 and will bide her time, watching how her successor and DeSantis’s GOP fare. God help them all if they don’t meet her rigorous standards, because she will be back if needed,

  59. 59.

    Layer8Problem

    @SFAW:    Nah, that was Steven Wright, but coincidentally I did take a database administration course in Burlington MA quite a few years ago.

  60. 60.

    RaflW

    @Jay: I get widdgy if a bluegill takes a tiny, toothless nibble on me when I swim in a lake. I get that the catfish don’t have (what we think of as) teeth, but jiminy. Not my thing. At all.

  61. 61.

    RaflW

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: I would not say she’s planning a run just yet. But there have certainly been rumblings that she’s interested. And I believe she appraises herself as capable (she probably is. And I’d vote against her for so, so many reasons!).

  62. 62.

    Jay

    @RaflW:

    they can tear up your skin pretty bad, but there is a big difference between a bluegill hunting you while enjoying a peaceful float, ( stay away from their spawning beds),

    and you deliberately hunting a fish.

    I would avoid it because snapping turtles often hide in similar spots.

  63. 63.

    NotMax

    ‘@RaflW

    Wyoming is too much of a cipher for me to get a sense if ‘crossover Dems’ will show up enough

    All eight of them?

    //

  65. 65.

    ian

    @RaflW: There are not enough of us ‘crossover dems’ here in Wyo to carry the load alone.  Wyoming is about 4:1 Republican to Dem, and if Cheney has a good day, she may get 1/2 of the Dems to do so (I filled out my absentee ballot for her the other day).

    Her ads here on radio (I assume TV as well, I don’t watch, and most the local TV is Colorado based) heavily use on her conservative record and second amendment fetish.  I don’t think I have heard the J6 committee mentioned in an ad.  Some ads do mention loyalty to the constitution, which is about as veiled a reference to Trump as she can go here.  Her best bet is elderly Wyomingites (state skews heavily older) who have been voting for Cheneys for years continue to do so.  I hope she pulls it out, her main opponent Hageman is full into the Big Lie

     

    Edit: @ Notmax

    All eight of them?

    Basically.  Give us time.  The only two parts of the state growing in population voted for Biden.  The other 21 counties are deep red, but shrinking.

  66. 66.

    Kent

    @RaflW:

    I get the sense that Liz is still serious about running for president in ’24. Wyoming is too much of a cipher for me to get a sense if ‘crossover Dems’ will show up enough for her to keep her seat, but she’s sure raising her profile.

    None of that is to say her J6 work isn’t solid and important. But I think it helps that she’s ambitious (and maybe a little too full of herself like her daddy).

    I expect she is, at a minimum, angling for a major cabinet position in the next Democratic administration.

  67. 67.

    Kent

    @NotMax: My daughter spent the past winter working at the Jackson Hole ski resort in the NW corner of Wyoming next to Yellowstone.  There are a lot of lefty types in that little town.  It actually went solidly for Biden in 2020.

    There is also the Wind River reservation (Shoshone and Arapaho) which is solidly blue.

    Of course eastern Wyoming ranch and coal country solidly outvote those places.

  69. 69.

    sab

    Stepson had a traffic issue six months ago. He deserved it. Not drunk, but high on zantax. Driving very erratic, could have killed people.  Threw the book at him.

    Our book is slow and convoluted. Eventually they pulled his license. He lives on other side of town. Retired dad has bee++n driving him to work and elsewhere for the last at least six months.

    Meanwhile dad desperately needs back surgery. Finally got a slot. July.

    Stepson finally got through all the court stuff and got his mandatory five day jail time. Husband drove him to there and home.

    Stepson of course tested Covid positive. Dad has been driving him everywhere. Masked but in his car always.

    I have cut these kids a lot of slack over the last twenty years, but I am done with them. If husband misses his back surgery slot because he cleaned up after them then he can move in with them. I am done with the whole lot of idiots

    ETA To remind everyone, this kid also has a mother and a stepfather. But my husband has had to pick up the slack all year, even with impending back surgery.

  70. 70.

    HumboldtBlue

    @Ken:

    But I can’t say that it’s better to let them wander around, dodging imaginary Bigfoots and voting, until they kill someone.

    Indeed.

  73. 73.

    JoyceH

    @SFAW: How do you feel about “chicken necking”? Sounds really hinky, but it’s basically tying a string to a raw chicken neck and dropping it into the bay or river, crab latches onto it and you pull it out and collect the crab.

  75. 75.

    JoyceH

    Open thread topic – have you folks seen the “I’m Dave” commercial? Am I imagining things or have they created an app for payday loans?

  80. 80.

    sab

    II whine a lot, and I get annoyed a lot. But I try avoid vivid anger (not helpful.) But husband, after twenty or forty years ( dependending on how you count) is missing or postponing much needed back surgery because his people were completely selfish idiots (of course they were. Aren’t they always?)

    Next time step son wants to borrow money he can go elsewhere. This whole mess wouldn’t have happened woth a litle more control on his part.

    Probably not fair, but I am incandescently angry.

  81. 81.

    Bruce K in ATH-GR

    Whether to support or condemn Liz Cheney is a bit complicated, but as far as I can see, it boils down to this: the Neocons, the Dominionists, and the Trumpists are all enemies of the America we were taught to believe in. But they’re not all on the same side. The Trumpists are the most immediate threat; if we can’t take them out then we’re all doomed anyway. There still needs to be a reckoning with the Dominionists and the Neocons, but for now, we have to deal with Cheney like FDR and Churchill dealt with Stalin: as an ally in the current war but not a friend in the long term.

    As Lord Vetinari said, “there aren’t good people and bad people; there are only the bad people, but sometimes they’re on different sides.”

    And to quote Saving Private Ryan: “You’ve got to take Caen so you take St. Lo. Got to take St. Lo to take Valognes. Valognes you get Cherbourg, Cherbourg you get Paris, Paris you get Berlin, and then that big boat home.”

    Take down the Trumpists, deal with the Dominionists. Once the Dominionists are out, deal with the Neocons.

  84. 84.

    frosty

    @JoyceH: Nothing wrong with chicken necking. You toss bait into the Chesapeake that you’re not going to eat and you come back with some tasty crabs. Can’t argue with that!

  85. 85.

    Ruckus

    @Ken:

    47 yrs ago I was a mental health counselor at a city clinic and no the treatment for the mentally ill wasn’t all that good. It might have been, believe it or not, better than today. Because there are more people, there are more people that need help, but there is, as a percentage of the population, fewer low or no cost places to get help and fewer places to check people into. Yes we have more meds to treat some of the issues, but that is very often not enough. The overwhelming need of the wealthy to get far wealthier for no reasons other than ego and greed is killing people.

  87. 87.

    SFAW

    @Jay:

    There is something about catching a fish with nothing but your bare hands that is unique.

    Well, I guess “unique” is one way of looking at it.

  88. 88.

    Geminid

    @ian: Pew Research has interesting data on Wyoming party affiliation among various demographic groups. They were using “self-identification” which is very different from party registration which shows a lopsided advantage for Republicans. Evidently most Wyomingians register as Republican because Republicans are so dominant that many people pragmatically register for the party whose primary determines the general election winner.

    By self-identification, Republicans constitute 47% of the electorate, followed by Independents at 36% and Democrats at 17%. Cheney must get votes from like minded Republicans, Independents, and Democrats to win. Those in the latter groups can reregister the day of the primary, but many are already registered Republican.

    One GOP Impeacher has already fought a Republican primary. That was Tom Rice (SC 7th CD. He was beaten fairly soundly by a Trump-endorsed challenger last month. I thought this was a bad sign fo Cheney.

    She may benefit from multiple challengers splitting the vote, although Harriet Hageman has gotten separation from the others on the strength of Trump’s endoresment. Also, I expect that Dick Cheney is working hard for Liz behind the scenes, and I do not underestimate him.

  89. 89.

    Geminid

    @Geminid: Another data  point will be  Peter Meijar’s performance in his western Michigan primary. He’s another Impeacher challenged by a Trump-endorsed candidate. I thought his primary was yesterday, but I guess it’s next week.

    Unlike in  Wyoming, the winner of Meijar’s primary will face a viable Democratic opponent. Hilary Scholten came within 4 points of Meijar in 2020 and will be the Democratic nominee this year.

  90. 90.

    Baud

    The one thing I can say about people like Hasan is that a decade ago, they would have received almost no pushback on social media. So in that sense, things have gotten better.

  91. 91.

    brantl

    @HumboldtBlue: Noodlers are the idjits that lean down in bodies of watet, stick their hands under logs, etc, and wiggle their fingers, to catch behemoth catfish ON THEIR FINGERS. Not unheard of that the catfish wrench back on the hand, concuss the idjit, and he drowns.

  92. 92.

    Quinerly

    Good Morning from Santa Fe!

    Wouldn’t it be cool if Hannity is the witness Trump called? Great for the big reveal in prime time next week.

  99. 99.

    Geminid

    @Quinerly: Good morning from Virginia! I hope those terrible wildfires in May did not threaten your house. How is life in your new home?

  101. 101.

    David ☘The Establishment☘ Koch

    @Quinerly: ​
      It’s probably Patrick Byrne the ex-Overstock.com CEO who had an affair/worked with russian spy Maria Butina. He’s part of Dump’s inner-circle.

    What a surprise, someone with access to the oval office under Dump was connected to russian intelligence. (link)

    Who could have known.

  102. 102.

    Quinerly

    @Geminid: love it here. Love my house. Wildfires were as close as 20 miles at one point since l am on that side of Santa Fe. I’m off the 285 corridor. Thanks for asking. 2PODS and my van full, JoJo and l are pretty much settled. The smoke plumes were very upsetting for weeks. Then the monsoons came. Everything is so green! Cactus are blooming. I have been working hard in the yard clearing all the dead stuff from the drought. We have several yard snakes… Beneficial Bullys. Very cool. (JoJo is not amused) Family of Scaled Quail too. JoJo is thrilled to be back in his Native Lands.

  108. 108.

    catclub

    @James E Powell: The joke is that MSNBC is considered to be the Democratic equivalent of FOX.

     

    Who is the equivalent of Joe Scar at Fox?  Joe Scar is a florida republican.

  111. 111.

    The Lodger

    @Quinerly: Great to see your nym again! I didn’t wait till the end of the thread because I’m already late enough to welcome you back. Cheers to you and Jojo!

  112. 112.

    Paul in KY

    @sab: We (and Antifaites themselves) should mention whenever they are mentioned that ‘Antifa’ means ‘Anti Fascist’. My dad was pretty Antifa back in WWII…

    I don’t think they do that enough.

  113. 113.

    Paul in KY

    @HumboldtBlue: I think paint thinner being drunk as alcohol might have been involved there.

    My dad was a great noodler.  He didn’t call it that. He just called it ‘fishing’ :-)

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