“It would be a shame if anything were to happen to them…”
Trump’s lawyer, who allegedly used to represent a parking garage (a much smarter client!), says the judge should unseal the DOJ search warrant affidavit over the DOJ’s objections. She says she understands the “witness protection issue” the DOJ outlined in its objection, but “these witnesses are truly not going to be concealed for long” anyway, so what the hell, tell us who they are.
Trump’s attorney, Alina Habba, says Trump wants the Department of Justice to release the names of the witnesses who helped secure the search warrant for Mar-a-Lago. pic.twitter.com/n3MJsD1tBI
— The Recount (@therecount) August 16, 2022
I’m not a lawyer, but that sounds like attempted witness intimidation to me. The DOJ asked the judge to keep the affidavit sealed because it would reveal a “roadmap” of their criminal investigation and could potentially affect the willingness of witnesses to come forward and cooperate.
Didn’t think mob-like behavior on the part of Trump or his crew could still surprise me, but between this and Trump’s alleged back-channel message to Garland about the country being “on fire,” it appears there are still new depths to plumb.
Open thread.
lowtechcyclist
Just like there was no “peak wingnut,” there’s no bottom to the depravity of TFG and his accomplices
ETA: I’m not sure the parking garage owner was a smarter client – you’d think it would have been able to choose a higher class of attorney than Mango Mussolini can currently get. Sounds like this one’s even crazier than Sidney Powell.
germy shoemangler
The National Report? I’ve never heard of them. Are they another OAN?
EDIT:
whoops, I found this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Report
Ken
The DOJ is hampered here, because their lawyers know and understand the law.
Also they are pretty humorless, so they won’t troll TFG by having some anonymous staffer send a message saying it’s Jared. (Especially if it is Jared.)
lowtechcyclist
@germy shoemangler: Looks like it’s on Newsmax, and the National Report is a specific program there. (I just let the video play for a few seconds, and the Newsmax logo popped up.)
Ocotillo
Open thread? I didn’t realize yesterday was a Media holiday; the anniversary of the U.S. withdrawal of troops from Afghanistan. They did not want to miss the opportunity to kick dirt on Biden during his recent spate of positive news.
Barbara
All I can say is, if the informants were Secret Service agents, they should be reassigned before the affidavit is unsealed. Also, it can be redacted even if it is unsealed. The fact that Trump is lionized by so many people leads me to believe that my instinct about mafia fascination is correct, that many people would love to live their lives as mafiosi. They like the idea of hurting people and mostly getting away with it. Of course, when you use the term “gang” instead of mafia they get all sanctimonious — but the mafia is just a gang and gang mentality usually includes hurting anyone who crosses you.
ETA: Ms. Habba is wrong about the concealment of witnesses. Being a witness for purposes of the Affidavit does not necessarily mean that they are witnesses for purposes of the criminal investigation. Lots of informants are never witnesses. Let’s say you have infiltrated a criminal gang as an undercover officer. Your information might lead to a warrant in which drugs or other contraband are uncovered, but the evidence of the drugs, etc. is more than enough to convict. Your identity doesn’t need to be revealed.
JanieM
I completely missed this one. Any links to the story? When did it happen?
JoyceH
It dawned on me the other day that in earlier times when there was a major scandal, the witness or accuser would ‘go into hiding’ to avoid the intrusive media, NOT because they feared for their lives from the powerful perp’s demented followers. I mean, there were a lot of Clinton supporters out there who defended him against the Ken Starr inquisition, but did any of them try to kill Monica Lewinsky?
Barbara
@JanieM: IMHO, this is spurious without further information. He can hold a press conference anytime he wants and tell his lunatic supporters that he supports the rule of law and is happy to let the process take its course.
zhena gogolia
@JanieM:
Old School
@JanieM:
Leto
OT:
For the lawyers, here’s the court’s decision: On appeal from the Circuit Court for Escambia County. Jennifer J. Frydrychowicz, Judge
zhena gogolia
@zhena gogolia: And the first reply to Haberman is “What did AG Garland say when you handed it to him?”
Immanentize
YES, BUT!!
Who am I supposed to real pay in this thread?
Old School
@zhena gogolia:
I enjoyed the reply tweet.
SiubhanDuinne
@zhena gogolia:
LOL! The first response to MAGA Habs in that thread is:
what did AG Garland say when you handed it to him?
ETA: Jeez, I really thought I had scrolled through all the comments before posting. How did I miss Old School @ 15?
ETATA: And ZG @ 13? Sheesh.
JanieM
@Barbara:
@zhena gogolia:
@Old School:
Thank you! I’d rather never hear about Clickbait again, but if the story is ongoing I want to keep up with at least the chapter headings. ;-)
Irishweaver
@Ocotillo: like what you said there. So true!
Betty Cracker
@Barbara: I read the DOJ objection the other day (I think it was at Politico, which linked to the filing), and their argument was that redacting the affidavit sufficiently to protect witnesses, sources and investigation techniques, etc., would render it meaningless.
Ken
@Ocotillo: Speaking of how Biden has failed us this week, are we going to have a thread for the signing of the IRA?
lowtechcyclist
@Leto: Not mature enough to decide to have an abortion, but mature enough to raise a child or make the decision to give it up for adoption.
That makes so much sense. Some people, very definitely including this judge, should not be in a position to make decisions concerning other people’s lives.
Betty Cracker
@Ken: I thought he already signed it.
Edmund Dantes
@Leto: not sure why the guardian doesn’t qualify under the law (they also approve of abortion).
*well I know they don’t qualify cause the law is about forced birth in reality.
Captain C
@Barbara:
I suspect that most of them also figure they would be Vito, or at worst Michael Corleone, when most mobsters are more likely to end up like one of the three main characters from Goodfellas: dead by their associates (Tommy), in jail for life (Jimmy), or living like a schnook in Witness Protection (Henry). Kind of like how everyone was a king or conqueror in their past life and no one was a peasant or spearman.
Ken
@Betty Cracker: It was scheduled for today, has it already happened? I was expecting a Republican-shattering KABOOM. Where is my Republican-shattering KABOOM
EDIT: Google tells me that it will be a relatively low-key signing, since Congress is on holiday this week, and there will be a celebration in September.
lowtechcyclist
@Ocotillo:
Lots of people over the past couple of decades have compared the Beltway media to the Kewl Kids in high school that got to decide whether or not you were kewl too, or whether you were a reject.
Let’s just say they’re doing precious little to invalidate that analogy.
WaterGirl
Trump’s attorney: “You can run, but you can’t hide. Not for long, anyway.”
Why are all of these attorney’s not being disbarred????
WaterGirl
@lowtechcyclist: I took Betty’s comment to mean that an actual parking garage – an inanimate object – was smarter than Trump!
Baud
@Betty Cracker:
Scheduled for 3:30.
A bigger ceremony is scheduled for September.
WaterGirl
@Leto: That makes me want to throw up.
WaterGirl
@SiubhanDuinne: Some people type faster than other people.
Baud
@WaterGirl:
Hopefully, it’ll make enough Floridians want to vote the right way.
WaterGirl
@Ken: Why yes, yes we are. The threads is scheduled for 3:15, the signing is at 3:30.
edit: I can’t believe you would doubt me like that! :-)
trollhattan
Habba duh wut?
“Esq” after a lawyer’s name generally a tell.
PAM Dirac
@JanieM: Most of the news stories just quote the supposed message to the DOJ, but the orange fart cloud is going well beyond that on FOX. A sample quote:
Pretty clear that his “whatever we can do to help” does not include stopping his lies and false accusations.
Baud
@WaterGirl:
That’s a bannable offense in my book.
WaterGirl
@Baud: Thank you Baud, you always have my back!
Mr. Bemused Senior
@WaterGirl: haven’t you noticed that the quality of Trump’s legal team has been on a long downhill slide? It’s hard to get good help when you don’t pay the bills and there’s the risk of losing a license.
Old School
@SiubhanDuinne: I assumed you had zg and I pied.
SiubhanDuinne
@JoyceH:
In 1996, my daily commute to work took me right past the apartment complex where Richard Jewell lived. For weeks following the Centennial Park bombing, the media were camped out along the highway with their satellite trucks slowing traffic almost to a standstill. It must have been just horrible for that poor man. He must have felt utterly besieged.
frosty
@WaterGirl: I took it the same way. The lawyer represented the garage, not its owner. So Trump is therefore dumber than a pile of rocks (ok, concrete).
zhena gogolia
@WaterGirl: NotMax has been trying to arrange a NYC meetup. He was reluctant to bother you with an e-mail, but I think it would be more efficient than him waiting for somebody to notice his comments.
Roger Moore
@Barbara:
I wouldn’t count on redactions keeping anyone’s identity concealed. There are a limited number of people who plausibly could be the informant, so any detail that isn’t redacted might be enough to reveal their identity.
Betty Cracker
@Baud: Thanks! I could have sworn there was already a thread devoted to the signing last week. Anyway, maybe Biden should do a signing ceremony in every state. Couldn’t hurt!
Lapassionara
@lowtechcyclist: This was not just one judge. The case was being reviewed by the Florida Supreme Court, iirc. Got to keep up that “domestic supply of infants.”
WaterGirl
@Old School: hahaha
Mr. Bemused Senior
@frosty: murder in a parking lot, wrong on so many levels.
WaterGirl
@zhena gogolia: That probably would be more efficient!
SiubhanDuinne
@Old School:
I would NEVER!!
zhena gogolia
Did anybody link to this great George Conway column about the cookies?
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2022/08/16/george-conway-mar-a-lago-search-trump/
Cacti
@Ocotillo: They were so angry that he took their war away from them. Like a junkie seeing their fix flushed down the toilet.
Omnes Omnibus
@WaterGirl: If this is a serious question, it’s because disbarment is effectively a death penalty. You are done and cannot practice law again. It is reserved for the absolute worst cases. There are levels of discipline that fall short of disbarment including suspension, fines, reprimands, and warnings. This is often a drawn out process that begins with someone filing a grievance with the regulating authority. Investigation happens. The attorney on question gets to respond. And so on. The bar is unwilling to take a license away permanently for anything less than the most egregious offenses. These are not the most egregious offenses. A lot of this stuff is unlikely to draw more than a reprimand.
Betty
@Ocotillo: Jake Tapper led yesterday at 5 with the Republican report trashing Biden on Afghanistan. Very disappointing when you look at what else is happening. They don’t miss a chance.
NotMax
“Alexa, buy ALL the rakes.”
//
@WaterGirl
Fell free to copy/paste in full or in part from comment #14 this morning if you’re willing to assemble a front page notification.
Anonymous At Work
It’s random but a nice soother: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_jEfgGFJ12Y
UPS drivers’ Facebook group dedicated to pets greeting them, sometimes with presents for the drivers. Readership capture at its finest.
cain
@Leto: Forcing a child to have a baby while also said child does not have any kind of family to help raise the kid.
Maybe we should have laws in place forcing the parents of the boy that got her pregnant to give up some funds. It’s only fair. Imagine how well that is going to go down.
Mike in NC
@Mr. Bemused Senior: They say that Trump’s latest crop of legal eagles got their law degrees from schools that advertise on the back of matchbooks.
Steve in the ATL
@Ken:
I am COMPLETELY unhampered!
Redshift
@Barbara:
If they were Secret Service agents (which I still think is reasonably likely, since it probably wouldn’t have occurred to TFG not to talk in front of them) then I’m amused at the prospect of cheap-ass TFG trying to decide between getting rid of “spies” around him vs. keeping security he doesn’t have to pay for.
rikyrah
She barely could get a drivers license.
Can’t vote.
Can’t get a drink.
But, will be forced to have a child.
Absolutely ENRAGING!
Axios (@axios) tweeted at 0:17 PM on Tue, Aug 16, 2022:
A Florida court blocked a 16-year-old teenager from getting an abortion, saying that she’s not “sufficiently mature” to choose to end her pregnancy.
The teen had told the court that she’s “not ready to have a baby.”
https://t.co/RKt2HG70bU
(https://twitter.com/axios/status/1559590103974137856?t=-xsCXPiAtl_bOikVL2VW8g&s=03)
Gravenstone
@zhena gogolia: My response elsewhere – “how do you feel about seppuku, Don?”
Leto
What happened to the Grand Old Party: How did the GOP get here?
It’s a good 10 min interview, better than what’s usually had on NPR. I think my favorite part, near the end, is when the interviewer tries to blame Dems for Republican actions and Millbank just slaps that stupid shit down. Millbank also talks about how what’s currently happening with Liz Cheney now is a result of her father’s actions 25 years ago.
Captain C
@WaterGirl:
Because state bar associations probably tend to ignore strip mall storefront Lionel Hutz-level operations until they do something so stupid it’s noticeable. Now that they have, hopefully it’s only a matter of time.
Betty Cracker
@Leto: Milbank did a column recently on how Dick Cheney set in motion the lunacy that will almost certainly cost Liz her seat in congress, comparing it to a Greek tragedy. It was a good one. I doubt the Cheneys make the connection, even though they’re no dummies. Hubris.
Skepticat
As did I, though I thought it still was slighting the garage.
trollhattan
@SiubhanDuinne: Donald “I’ve been treated so unfairly” Trump would learn a lot walking in his shoes. Lord, how that thing mushroomed out of control (and all the while it was a proto-Trumpian hillbilly living out of dumpsters).
UncleEbeneezer
Baud
@UncleEbeneezer:
👍
Kent
They should leak that it is DeSantis or whoever the hell we want to defenestrate this month.
Redshift
@Mr. Bemused Senior:
I think it’s also that he’s out of office and back to the kind of lawyers he had in business. The kind that were fine for getting out of non-payment by counter-suing and delaying until it was costing the victim more to fight than they were owed.
Using those kinds of tactics against the infinite resources of the Justice Department is insane, but it’s all they know.
Steve in the ATL
@Captain C: @WaterGirl: @Omnes Omnibus: and also because lawyer discipline is administered by fellow lawyers, not by angry lay people, and they don’t usually stick it to their fellow lawyers unless they’ve done something really bad. Something that embarrassed the fellow lawyers.
My first day of law school, our legal ethics professor said “if you don’t learn anything else from this class, remember these two things: don’t have sex with your clients, and don’t steal their money”. So a vague complaint such as witness intimidation is unlikely to lead to serious discipline.
And FYI for Georgia lawyers—or clients!—you no longer get disbarred here for having sex with your clients!
eclare
@Anonymous At Work: Thank you. I needed that in a thread where a 16 yo is being denied an abortion because she is not mature enough.
rikyrah
@UncleEbeneezer:
clap clap clap clap
RaflW
I know we’ve thrashed Lindsey Graham many times, but the notion that he was ever a National Security Hawk is bitterly laughable. It seems increasingly likely that Trump sold state secrets to try to refinance his mob loans (and to just puff up his very flaccid ego).
Graham defends Trump on the regular, none the less. None of those worm tongue consiglieres should ever be allowed in polite company. But then, the GOP has zero use for such things (not sure where the heck all the ‘comity’ pearl clutchers went).
Betty Cracker
@UncleEbeneezer: Here’s hoping this stops the nonsense Republicans are trying to pull with Medicaid in Florida.
RaflW
@Leto: Ah, this reminds me to cue up Fresh Air’s interview with Millbank.
Leaving this here for this evening as I deal with a sore throat, cough and mild fever. Going to test again this evening. Blergh!
catclub
I just want to say that the Tweet or whatever Trump gave saying his lawyers were cooperating fully , but the FBI invaded anyway, is certainly a lie, and it was allowed to fly by under all the other shit he was throwing about magical de-classifying.
Trump has never in his life had lawyers who cooperated. The same day he said it he and his lawyers were being sanctioned ( the bad kind) for not cooperating in discovery on the NY case.
JWR
@germy shoemangler:
From there, I found this NPR piece about the site from November 23, 2016.
So, he wants to create even more “Fake News” which quickly finds its way into hard-right orthodoxy, whereupon this one guy’s gonna spring from behind the bushes, shocking the knuckle draggers with proof positive that they’d fallen for yet another made up story, and they quickly adjust their policy positions to fit. (Ha ha! Cracks me up, that one.) Never mind the old saying about a lie making it’s way half-way around the world before the truth can get its pants on.
And from your Wikipedia there’s this story about playing with fire:
catclub
@Redshift:
Unfortunately not always true about Justice Dept lawyers. They have a tendency to back down on cases where the other guy’s lawyers are a LOT better paid than they are. The book you are looking for has ‘Chickenshit’ in the title.
Scout211
@UncleEbeneezer: From your link: link
She explains why this is so ruling is so great.
This ruling is just awesome.
catclub
@Steve in the ATL:
… so if you are defending yourself and have an idiot for a client, sex is still ok? Asking for a friend.
Bill Arnold
@Ken:
Pretty sure that you know that this site has a large-ish heterogeneous collection of lurkers, so this is extra spicy. :-)
karen marie
@lowtechcyclist: lol at you thinking she would be allowed to make those decisions either.
WaterGirl
@Omnes Omnibus: Reality is so disappointing sometimes! Thanks for the information.
WaterGirl
@Skepticat: hahaha
Eolirin
@Scout211: Hopefully the SCOTUS doesn’t just reverse the decision. >>
Boris Rasputin (the evil twin)
@WaterGirl: I see no problem with your first take, as it’s quite possibly true.
Bill Arnold
@lowtechcyclist:
Biden took advantage of a Trump-Pompeo-negotiated US surrender to the Taliban (a surrender in exchange for no attacks on US forces in the run-up to the 2020 election), blindsided the neocon warmongering apparatus by moving quickly before it could tool up politically to block the exit, and the US managed a huge withdrawal/evacuation, largely though not completely without incident, ending US involvement in a 20 year forever war.
Or one could go with the dominant right-wing-curated narrative in the largely-lazy US press.
Scout211
@Eolirin:
IANAL, but I guess it depends on whether the jail that is charged with discrimination under the ADA has grounds to appeal the ruling to SCOTUS.
More detail on the case.
satby
Poor Jim Wright gets email, and it reminds me of someone…
Steve in the ATL
@catclub: yes, see State v. Onan
PDXBob
@Ocotillo:
What no one ever seems to ask, especially with the latest news of how TFG didn’t pack up to leave as he thought he was in for another four years, what was TFG’s plan to get us out? It was his admin that “negotiated” the withdrawal. Where was his plan?
MisterForkbeard
@PDXBob: Trump has already stated that he had no intention of following through on the withdrawal plan and “would have done it right with no violence” and that the old Afghan Government would still be standing, or something to that effect. But he was very clear that he wasn’t going to stick to his own agreement.
RandomMonster
@lowtechcyclist: I thought it was that the parking garage itself is smarter than Trump. Which is objectively true.
Chris Johnson
@PAM Dirac: Is that real? If so, it’s more ‘threatening like a mobster’ rather than ‘Maggie Haberman wrote this to make Trump look nice’.
‘if it isn’t, terrible things are going to happen’. for fuck’s sake. To YOU, Donny. Shut up, Donny, you’re out of your element.
SWMBO
@Steve in the ATL:
How do you know this?