Interested in hearing a discussion of the Executive Summary of the final report of the Select Committee to Investigate the January 6th Attack on the United States Capitol?
On Tuesday, Dec. 20 at 10 a.m. ET, Lawfare senior editors will discuss the newly released executive summary.
I think we’re going to learn a lot more in the next few days as the floodgates open.
WaterGirl
Anybody going to be watching with me?
Shalimar
I had no intention of even knowing this existed, but sure, I’ll watch it with you.
Narya
@WaterGirl: I’m on the road but am not enjoying the driver’s selections so I’ll try to listen w headphones. :)
SiubhanDuinne
Will try to catch most of it, in between showering, doing a couple of loads of laundry, and finishing up my Xmas cards.
BruceFromOhio
“This video has been removed by the uploader.”
This link appears to be working for me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZRvK-uGvX-g
Starfish
This says “Video has been removed by the uploader” for me. There was an interesting LawFare article about the summary report painting over the intelligence failure.
Betty Cracker
@Starfish: I just read that a while ago and agree it’s interesting. We’ll need to wait for the full report to draw any firm conclusions, but if the goal is to avoid a repeat, intelligence failures need to be addressed.
Geminid
It will indeed be a flood. I’m glad the Committee put out this executive summary to help get reporters and the rest of us ready.
This is actually a good week for the Committee Report to drop. It’s a slow time for other political news and I think there will be a lot of interest in the material and several days to report the many highlights. Journalists will still be digging through this report for several more weeks.
Starfish
@BruceFromOhio: Thanks for a working link!
Omnes Omnibus
@WaterGirl: Some of us need to work.
WaterGirl
@Omnes Omnibus: So that’s a yes? :-)
WaterGirl
@BruceFromOhio: No idea why the link they sent out yesterday didn’t work, thanks for the working link.
The link up top has been replaced with the one that works!
Emma from Miami
@Starfish: I think the problem is not that they didn’t plan but that so many people in so many agencies can’t wrap their heads around the fact that violence on behalf of a particular group is coming from the right. The myth of the violent left is too entrenched in intelligence and policing. Until a truly apocalyptic event happens they will continue looking in the wrong direction.
Especially since there seem to be too many conflicts of interest to pursuing the alternative.
Dangerman
Thinking about Ferndale, CA, this morning; a lovely little community. If you saw Outbreak (think that was the name of the Dustin Hoffman film), well, that was Ferndale. I lived in Eureka for a couple years, earthquakes were regular events, but having no bridge at Fernbridge is gonna suck on steroids. The other way in is gonna be a problem.
Cmorenc
Is there anything the incoming narrow R majority can do to bottle up or suppress public access to the work product and info produced by the 1/6 committee? How much interference can they run?
WaterGirl
@Cmorenc: The House can share all their work on the committee with the Senate.
WaterGirl
Okay, now i’m going to catch up on the video.
Starfish
@Emma from Miami: There were random people in the agency who “detected” the threat.
However, no one bothered to pull all the threads together, and the report is not critical of this.
This is beyond just cultural tendencies of certain groups. It was a true failure to investigate a real threat.
LawFare is critical of the discussion in the summary report because it misrepresented the failures of law enforcement and paints them as successful.
Ceci n est pas mon nym
Just came online. Was going to do something else but, sure, I’ll tune in.
I’m picking up live rather than rewinding.
Geminid
@Cmorenc: The J6 Committee will publish this report and there will be no way to suppress it.
They’re not releasing everything, but I think they’ll release just about anything they think was germane to their investigation. I expect unreleased materials will be archived but not made available to the public.
Ceci n est pas mon nym
As long as they go to a place where the new Republican Congress can’t tamper with them.
Is my understanding correct that every scrap is going to DOJ?
Emma from Miami
@Starfish: Which, to me, seems only an extension of the problem. But what do I know?
Another Scott
@Ceci n est pas mon nym: That’s my take on what I heard at the hearing – all the evidence is being thrown over the wall to the DoJ. The GQPers cannot stop that.
Cheers,
Scott.
Starfish
The distinction that Roger made in the video about the insurrection issue was interesting.
He said that the way that the committee focused on Trump supporting the insurrectionists after the insurrection started dodges the first amendment issues presented by focusing on Trump calling the insurrectionists to the capitol, and this could be powerful.
WaterGirl
@Starfish:
I agree on the failures of law enforcement – in advance – but the rank and file law enforcement people who were present on Jan 6 were everything we could have asked for.
Citizen Alan
@Starfish: IIRC, the DHS early under Obama issued a report on the rising danger of right wing militias, and they were forced to pull it because it hurt the feelings of Congressional Republicans.
BruceFromOhio
These cats are engaging. And it’s fun to see and hear how similar this event is to the online collaborations at work – “Ben is attempting to get himself off mute”.
Also interesting to hear the critique of the J6 committee itself, it’s results and perceived shortcomings. I also like the attention given to what law enforcement (FBI, DHS) was and was not doing between the election and January 6.
Thanks for posting about this, would never have seen or heard otherwise.
laura
It was hard to ignore Ben Wittes sartorial splendour- that big old labradog shirt while he swung around in his hanging chair. Thanks for linking to this panel, it was well focused and leaves me wanting more.
BruceFromOhio
@Citizen Alan: This has to change. These fuckers want to burn everything down, the last thing that should happen is to handcuff the fire department(s).
Starfish
@WaterGirl: Lawfare is not looking to disparage individual police officers. This was a systemic failure at the top levels of DHS, FBI, and the Secret Service, and the summary is not touching how or why that happened. These organizations are actually being painted in a good light.
Did the warnings from individual offices get passed up? Why were they not put into any higher level reports? Why didn’t the people in DC take any of it seriously?
None of these questions were addressed in a meaningful way, and the choice not to address any of this and actually paint a rosy picture of these organizations was seen as a political choice.
Starfish
@Citizen Alan: Yes. It is that type of stuff that is going on behind the scenes. The lack of meaningful accountability for our law enforcement bodies is a deliberate choice — a bad one.
laura
The Department of Homeland Security has been an abomination since it’s inception post 9/11. I am not aware of any value this agency provides. I’m not aware of any real time information that thwarted any of the hundreds/thousands of domestic terror actions across the country, but instead just a constant refusal to address what we can plainly see with our own eyes- an overestimate of threats posed by the left and routine downplaying of threats posed by the right. The panel’s discussion around the Committee’s walling off of the failings of the investigative community did not disabuse me of my opinion. Pretending their is no domestic threat isn’t making that threat go away.
WaterGirl
@Starfish:
I am totally aware of that and I didn’t mean to give the impression that I am not.
In sharing my agreement on the failures of law enforcement, I just wanted to be entirely clear that I did not think the law enforcement people on the ground were any part of that failure.
I can image that the police, etc on the ground have a ton of anger toward the higher ups who completely screwed the pooch in advance of Jan 6.
Aurona
Thanks for giving a photo of the folks on the panel. I’m sure this is very interesting, but when I look at the photo, I see only white people, with maybe one as a person of color, but definitely no black participants. I won’t watch a bunch of white people like me discuss our country’s future without full representation of our country. Probably why I’m sticking with Spoutible.com with Christopher Bouzy (@cbouzy) the black guy who also runs #BotSentinel for the next twitter replacement. Post is too white.
WaterGirl
@laura: I think that IF, as is likely, not much legislation can happen because the Rs control the House, that Biden will be able to focus more on things like – hopefully – reorganizing the parts of government the are not working properly.
WaterGirl
Possibly inside the Secret Service?
There are certainly issues inside the Secret Service.
The Moar You Know
@laura: It’s the second largest federal agency save for DoD and unlike DoD, very much politically involved and very much an arm of the GOP.
So, if you’re a Republican, it has quite a bit of value.
Ceci n est pas mon nym
A dive into the ridiculous Trump NFTs showing all the red flags indicating that it’s a money laundering scheme to bypass the financial monitor that NY state put in the Trump Org.
I imagine the monitor is well aware of this kind of game, and is not going to be fooled by a bunch of transactions that are just under the $10K reporting threshold (100 x $99 = $9900).
Sorry, I bailed on the Lawfare discussion.
Mike in NC
Yes, this from the dumbass motherfucker whose entire life was all about getting the highest ratings, the biggest numbers, so much winning you’ll get sick of it. Nothing else mattered. At all. Die in a fire, please.
laura
@The Moar You if you’re a Republican, it has quite a bit of value.
The Department of Domestic Fuckery.
Another Scott
@Starfish: I’m reminded of a comment in one of the World Cup threads – a goalie having a good game is a sign that the team is playing poorly. That is, if everything is working as it should, then the last line of defense should not need to be called upon.
I haven’t seen the Lawfare discussion nor skimmed the committee summary yet, but in figuring out what happened and the preparations, we need to remember the context.
TFG and his minions were screaming for months about calling out the army to “fight crime” in the large cities. There were violent protests in DC in the weeks and months before January 6 and the Mayor was fighting to keep local control so that TFG couldn’t call out the National Guard or the Army. There were lots of people trying to balance lots of things on January 6 so that TFG couldn’t invoke the Insurrection Act and overtly take over.
Maybe they didn’t communicate enough; maybe they didn’t do enough worst-case wargames; maybe there was too much silo-ing of information; maybe there are far too many law enforcement agencies in DC that are too protective of their turf and don’t see the big picture. Dunno. But it was a very complex situation with lots of moving parts and lots of questions about who was with TFG and who was going to follow their oaths…
My $0.02.
Cheers,
Scott.
gvg
@Starfish: The actual capitol police protected Congress, a few with their lives, so maybe the committee does not feel safe critiquing too much. Even though it may be their superiors or a different part of the agencies or even different forces, in the past, the police/intelligence types have taken criticism badly and personally. This is tricky. They needed more cops to show up sooner, not say some blue flu sulk fest.
That is pretty bad that I have to think this. It means things are already out of hand (duh) and we need to inch away from a cliff slowly.
Ferd of the Nort
Please stop chasing symptoms.
Root Cause Analysis: What was the PRIMARY issue?
An attempt to overthrow the government of the USA.
All else is side issues. The committee did not chase everything because a 160 page INTRODUCTION means the primary issue was so big that it must be very focussed. Did you expect another all encompassing Meuller report delivered to late, too big and incomprehensible enough to be corrupted by a five paragraph fraudulent summary?
What is the primary issue? What is the most important message? What NEEDS to go into history?
Intelligence failure or OVERTHROWING THE GOVERNMENT OF THE US?
pick one ‘cause you get only one root cause
Ceci n est pas mon nym
Anyone following the George Santos story? Republican congressman who apparently lied about everything on his bio.
Including his name.
I’m holding out a slim hope that there may be enough damaging info about Republican traitors and criminals that McCarthy (or whoever) loses the majority before ever seriously exercising it.
We know what the new Congress is going to do with the ethics committee referrals. But not what DOJ will do with the same damning evidence against virtually every Republican currently “serving” or whatever they do with their days.
Footnote: When I google “George Santos” one of the top links is an NBC story titled “Why the George Santos fiasco points to Democrats’ political malpractice”. I’m not going to click on that.
Starfish
@WaterGirl: You are right. I feel so bad for the people on the ground and just the human loss and the PTSD that they experienced from this.
Qrop Non Sequitur
If four Congressional Republicans of good conscience can be found to switch sides…
gvg
@Another Scott: That is right, I remember. The problem with calling up more cops and troops before hand was that they would be under the control of Trump. some of the smarter ethical people were actually making it harder for Trump to call out the guard or more police…..which didn’t address the problem of Congress not being able too. The problem is, calling in troops/police is an executive not legislative function. I recall the DC mayor and one of the governors and I think either the Sec of Def or the Joint Chief giving orders ahead of time that they had to approve any order that Trump gave.
And Trump didn’t try. It was Pence and Pelosi who called.
Mai Naem mobile
@laura: lots of people have made lots of money off it. IIRC Chertoff Dubbya’s head went off into consulting after his gig at the DHS and got several lucrative contracts from the DHS. I wouldn’t be surprised if Tom Ridge did the same. Also, i have hated the term Homeland in DHS from the beginning. Sounds very wwII era Germany.
zhena gogolia
@Ferd of the Nort: Correct.
Hangö Kex
https://yle.fi/a/74-20009705
Seems Prigozhin’s thugs have paid a visit to the Finnish embassy in Moscow; it is encouraging to see rule of law still being a thing in the US.
Ceci n est pas mon nym
@Qrop Non Sequitur: I’m not holding out any hope for “good conscience”. I’ll take “indictment on federal felony charges”.
Narya
As folks pick apart the summary etc. I think it’s important to remember most folks will only pay attention to the hearings; yesterday’s presentation was spectacular. Focused and tight.
Matt McIrvin
@Ceci n est pas mon nym: Almost all of the discussion I’ve seen around the Santos story is “how did the Democrats let this happen?” It’s the purest Murc’s Law instance ever.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Matt McIrvin: it’s making me crazy
Qrop Non Sequitur
@Ceci n est pas mon nym: I don’t know if that will even cut it. You are allowed to hold your seat from jail and Republicans, having resisted remote voting for years during COVID, will likely allow it for their incarcerated measures.
If we can make it to the next election without the House triggering a catastrophe, I’ll consider it a win.
Lacuna Synecdoche
Suggestion to anyone who finds the presentation a little slow: turn the playback speed to 1.25x or 1.5x. I personally found my attention kept wandering until I sped it up a bit.
Captain C
@Matt McIrvin:
Questioner: So how did your newspaper miss this?
Clueless Richerthanyou III, FTFNYT editor: Well, none of it was apparent. Besides, it’s the Democrats’ fault for not telling us.
Q: They sent you boxes of evidence via Registered Mail! They hired a speaker truck to orbit the Times‘ offices yelling it out!
CR3: You can’t expect us to read anything from such a partisan source! [Or do any actual reporting or journalism for that matter…]
CaseyL
I started to watch, but checked out when Ben Wittes opined.
I don’t trust WIttes at all: he’s the one who wrote op-eds talking about what a great guy Kavanaugh was, and did yeoman work to minimize the crazy emanating from the GOP.
I think that’s Lawfare’s general MO: they like the GOP, they like GOP policies, they supported GOP framing until the seditionist crazy spilled out all over the TV screen.
Liz Cheney ain’t the only one hoping to isolate Trump while protecting Trumpism.
WaterGirl
@gvg: I think it is more likely that it’s a case of the Jan 6 committee having to choose their battles. So they don’t have the time or the luxury of having been able to really look into that.
And I get that focusing too much on that might be used by the Rs to change the focus from all the pieces of Trump’s plan to thwart the peaceful transition of power.
Still, if the executive summary really says what a couple of folks on the Lawfare zoom said it did – making it sound like in the runup to Jan 6 all the agencies did their jobs, that’s either spin or coverup.
Someone needs to take a good look at Homeland, ICE, the FBI and the Secret Service.
Qrop Non Sequitur
I keep saying it, the only difference between the Cheneys and Trump is that the Cheneys think you should only abuse your legal authority to steal elections, not actually break the law
@Qrop Non Sequitur: “Measures” here was supposed to be “members.”
Paul in KY
@Mike in NC: ‘His legacy’ of being a wanna-be dictator asshat choad.
All that could be gone….
Starfish
@Aurona: You are right, but a strictly race-based analysis of Lawfare is superficial.
We definitely need more journalists and attorneys of color analyzing national issues. Imani Gandhi does good work when it comes to analysis of decisions related to reproductive rights, and Kimberly Atkins Stohr does a great job on the Sisters in Law podcast. We don’t have enough places where Black attorneys and journalists are breaking down legal issues for the public.
A lot of what we see being done for legal analysis for public consumption is done by white men, and that does need to change.
Lawfare was started by Benjamin Wittes, and he is very Republican adjacent, if not someone who was an actual Republican before they all lost their minds more than usual. Lawfare has been very focused on national security related issues.
The national security space consists of mostly white men due to numerous issues, including polygraphs for people to get security clearances running through a bunch of cantankerous white men who weird out their interviewees, so the people who can pass that stuff to get access to national security information are often white men.
zhena gogolia
@Narya: I’m in the middle of it. Having watched all the hearings twice, I’m not seeing much that I don’t know, but I am in awe at the way they’ve boiled it down.
Origuy
This morning’s earthquake in Humboldt County did a fair amount of damage. Two serious injuries, no deaths. Power out, some water lines broken, and a bridge across the Eel River is out.
WaterGirl
@Ceci n est pas mon nym: Yep.
With the House this close, every House special election matters.
If there are 8 more Rs than Ds in the House:
We flip one R seat to D, then there are only 6 more Rs.
We flip one more R seat to D, then there are only 4 more Rs.
We flip a third R seat to D, then there are only 2 more Rs.
We flip a fourth R seat to D, then it’s an even split.
We flip a fifth R seat to D, then we are are up by 2 D seats, and the majority is ours.
One reason why I hope we can focus on *every single special election in 2023.
*almost. Not sure about House races in hard red states.
Narya
@zhena gogolia: we listened in the car, and I was really impressed, as was the Normie other person
WaterGirl
@Matt McIrvin: Only Dems have agency, Part 8 million and one.
WaterGirl
@CaseyL: I think Chuck Rosenberg took a similar stance about Kavanaugh, or was it Bill Barr? Whichever one, apologies all around.
I think Lawfare probably leans
DR, but not nearly to the extent that you are suggesting.edit: corrected _ I mean to write leans R, not leans D!
mrmoshpotato
@Mike in NC:
Fire doesn’t deserve that.
Qrop Non Sequitur
@WaterGirl: Dems have agency. Republicans have agencies.
mrmoshpotato
@Paul in KY:
No. That’s forever. As is Dump’s sucking of Kremlin asshole since at least 1987.
Qrop Non Sequitur
Fire doesn’t discriminate, it just consumes. To fire, Trump is only meat.
StringOnAStick
@Hangö Kex: I seem to recall that you live in Finland; could I ask you to expand on how your fellow citizens are viewing this very obviously Putin approved provocation?
Hitchhiker
@CaseyL: Wittes also expounded in that speaking-in-full-paragraphs way he has about Bill Barr. According to him, Barr was definitely a tough, honest guy who would play by the rules.
Until he didn’t.
I think Wittes is like a Titanic engineer who will focus on the superior method of fastening rivets right up to the end.
On another subject, it helps every so often to remember that both the Republicans on this committee voted for Donald Trump in 2020. They certainly knew what he was by then, and they were okay with him destroying people as long as those people were Democrats.
They wanted another four years. I know this gives them a certain credibility, but jfc.
Another Scott
@Qrop Non Sequitur:
Obligatory, for the season… IamHappyToast on Mastodon.
Cheers,
Scott.
mrmoshpotato
@Qrop Non Sequitur:
Correction: Dump is mostly fat.
Geminid
@Hitchhiker: Are you sure Cheney and Kinzinger voted for Trump in 2020? Maybe they said so. But I have my doubts.
dm
@Matt McIrvin: it does look like a little opposition research at some point before the election might have turned up at least some of this stuff. And it’s not like it takes special insight to do a little opposition research, given the number of other stories about Republicans getting caught padding their resumes during this and previous election cycles.
But, yeah. Where was the Times Metro desk before the election?
But, this is a great lesson for other junior journalists (the ones who get assigned to the Metro section). You can get a story that gets national attention just with a few phone calls.
AM in NC
@Matt McIrvin: It is the Murckiest of Murc’s law examples, for sure. Just crazy-making!
Paul in KY
@mrmoshpotato: True. Was just riffing on what poor ole Hopey was lamenting.
Soprano2
@WaterGirl: I think it was Chuck Rosenburg on 1A this morning putting forth the thought experiment that if Biden would only pardon Trump for everything then he would finally go away. I posted on their FB page “NONONONONONONONONO Trump is a criminal. Have you paid attention to how he acts at all? He’s never admitted doing anything wrong, and if he gets a pardon he’ll use it to crow about how that proves it was all just a witch hunt!”. It’s as if he hasn’t paid any attention AT ALL to how TFG behaves!!! Makes me question everything he thinks about things.
Steeplejack
@Hitchhiker:
That’s where Wittes lost me. How could he ignore Barr’s first stint as attorney general, when he rubber-stamped the pardons for the Iran/contra crew?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Geminid: Kinzinger did in 2020, I’ve seen him make a version this twisted argument on TV. He had to vote for trump so he could credibly oppose him from within the party
Matt McIrvin
@dm: My impression is that Santos’s opponent did the oppo research, knew a lot of this and was trying to get someone to pay attention to it during the campaign, but there was little media traction.
Hitchhiker
@Geminid:
https://www.businessinsider.com/kinzinger-voted-trump-2020-election-republicans-dirty-feeling-2022-7
He felt dirty. Imagine that
ETA, I see I’m late with this. Also, yes — Liz Cheney did vote for Trump in 2020.
https://www.axios.com/2021/05/16/liz-cheney-trump-2020-capitol-attack
But she regrets it!
UncleEbeneezer
Wittes is disappointed that there wasn’t more new information presented at this meeting. I’m not sure that that was the point of the meeting. I thought the point was to give a summary of the final report (which will be released tomorrow), and to give a public justification and vote on major criminal referrals to DOJ.
Qrop Non Sequitur
@mrmoshpotato: Fair.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Oh my god, that’s disappointing
Geminid
@dm: This was actually Soto’s second run for that seat. He lost to Tom Suozzi by over ten points in 2020.
I think Newsday, a Long Island-centered newspaper, reported on discrepancies in Soto’s personal story during the campaign, and his opponent Mr. Zimmerman says he brought it up repeatedly. We’re only hearing about it now because the Times wrote it up.
National media typically does very little reporting on House races and if someone wants to know what’s going on with say, Sharice Davids’ Kansas 3rd CD race they have have to find out from local and state media. That’s readily available but one has to look it up.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Matt McIrvin: this is from an endorsement of Zimmerman by a local paper, the North Shore Leader, that per tweeter NYC Southpaw is “hard right”, published in October. Zimmerman’s campaign turned it into a mass mailing
Hangö Kex
@StringOnAStick: I don’t see much of a local reaction, really; the sledgehammer is probably too subtle a clue to the general public. (And, you are right about me being from Finland (although I’m currenty snowbirding in Spain :))
Qrop Non Sequitur
I have long wanted to develop my own news website. Crowdsourced, in a sense, and devoted to cultivating better writers and evaluating facts from within.
I wanted it to be a singular source where someone could find local reporting local reporting like that from anywhere. Regarding anything newsy, but better info on Reps was top of my list on reasons to do it.
Problem is once work’s over I have a hard time finding motivation and I’ve convinced myself my web design and programming skills will never be up to snuff. I’ve owned a domain for five years I’ve done literally nothing with.
catclub
@Emma from Miami:
So the Murragh federal building was not enough.
Qrop Non Sequitur
@catclub: Or the abortion clinics or the schools or the concerts, theatres….
@Another Scott: Hahaha, yikes.
Geminid
@Hitchhiker: Thank you for setting me straight. I guess they both thought they had a future in the party. They actually did until they joined 10 other Republican House members and voted to impeach Trump.
Of those ten, four retired and four lost their primaries. Two- Valadeo (CA) and Newhouse (WA)- will return to the next Congress, but they ran in jungle primary states.
Washington’s open primary system did not save Impeacher Jamie Herrera Butler though. She finished third, behind a radical Republican and Marie Glusenkamp Perez, the Democrat who won the seat last month.
Cmorenc
@CaseyL:
Liz Cheney isn’t about trying to preserve Trumpism without Trump. She is about trying to restore the GWB version of the GOP – with a seemingly comfortably reassuring moderate crust for public/electoral p.r. atop a filling of solidly conservative social and pro-big corporate interests beneath. Safe-enough appearing to win elections by 2 to 4 points to maintain controlling majorities.
Matt McIrvin
@Emma from Miami: I think many in law enforcement aren’t so much incapable of believing in a violent right, as they are supporters of a violent right and often members of right-wing terrorist groups themselves.
Though it varies. I’ve heard that cops in liberal cities are actually more likely to be sympathetic with right-wing militia groups than the cops in the places where they actually live–because in the cities, they know these people will show up, attack the people the cops already hate and then go away, whereas in Idaho or Montana they stick around and keep causing trouble.
Martin
Have our NorCal folks like HumboldtBlue checked in yet?
sab
@Emma from Miami: Oklahoma City Murragh Bldg didn’t change their minds, so I doubt this will. The left travels in packs and the far right are all lone wolves, even when the show up together by the thousands.
Geminid
@Qrop Non Sequitur: That’s not a bad idea. I think it would be more doable if you covered one subject well, for instance sitting Democratic Representatives. Members like Sharice Davids are very active but they don’t generate a lot of national and generally don’t try to, so you would meet a need.
Maybe 50 or so Democratic challengers could be covered also in election years.
Even with a fairly narrow scope this would take a lot of work time and effort, though. You could probably pull it off but you’d really have to want it, especially when you are not retired.
I think Watergirl has proposed something similar on a smaller scale, whereby some individual House members will be profiled here, including the ones she helped raise money for. Maybe she’ll write up her own new Reresentative; Nikki Budzinski seems like a very promising politician.
Starfish
@Hitchhiker: This is what I was trying to get at with my overly long response to @Aurona. You have to watch some of these Republican adjacent people to keep tabs on their thought processes.
Origuy
@Martin: HumboldtBlue checked into to the OTR thread early this morning. They’re ok assuming no damage visible by daylight.
Geminid
@Martin: Humboldt Blue checked in earlier this morning, right after the quake happened. He was ok, a little shook up.
Scout211
@Martin:
I hope he can check in again soon. Power was out and likely still out. He had a rough awakening at 2:30 this morning.
From the early morning thread:
WaterGirl
@Soprano2:
That’s the dumbest take I’ve ever heard. Did Chuck Rosenberg really say that? UGH
WaterGirl
@UncleEbeneezer: Yeah, I wasn’t impressed with most of what Wittes said today. I was happy to see other participants raising the opposing thoughts I was having in response to his comments.
I also thought the “they are Bill Barr-ing themselves by releasing a summary firs” comment was stupid. Sorry, but no they are not.
Not unless they are releasing a full of shit, full of lies, misleading and wholly inaccurate summary that contradicts everything they have done in this investigation.
I don’t love or agree with everything they said, but I think it was an interesting conversation.
Soprano2
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Yeah, just totally unrealistic viewpoint. I wanted to yell at my computer as I heard him saying it! I really miss when shows had callers; most of the ones I listen to did away with them, probably because they’re afraid of what people would say on the air.
WaterGirl
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Whoever said that, and I surely hope it wasn’t Rosenberg, obviously believes that Trump is the problem.
As opposed to Trump being the symptom and the representation of what most Rs want.
Soprano2
@WaterGirl: They spelled his last name Rosenberg, but yeah I’m pretty sure that’s who it was. I was just kind of half listening until I heard that bullshit. He was talking about parallels to Nixon and Ford, and said it wasn’t a perfect parallel but if only Biden would pardon TFG then maybe he would go away! Not exactly the wording he used, but close enough. It was a 20 minute segment if you want to try to find it and listen to it. They don’t always make everything available like that, though.
UncleEbeneezer
@WaterGirl: Yeah, there’s really no comparison to what 1/6 Com is doing here vs. what Barr did with the Mueller Report. Unless her point was that full report should always be released first but even then I don’t think it really matters in this case.
Geminid
@UncleEbeneezer: That full report will have so much in it that they needed to release a 160 page summary just so people won’t be overwhelmed. The summary should help reporters and the rest of us organize our reading.
Ksmiami
@mrmoshpotato: fat is delicious- Trump is gristle
Jim, Foolish Literalist
this is all I’m seeing on twitter from Rosenberg’s 1A appearance, and it’s not so different from what he’s been saying for a while, that proving something in a court with defense counsel and cross-examination and unpredictable juries is not the slam dunk so many people want it to be
To quote Saul Goodman, he only needs one
Soprano2
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Yeah, they didn’t mention it at all on Twitter, but he definitely said it. You can tell by the immediate comment I made about it on their FB topic!! You can listen here if you want. https://the1a.org/segments/the-house-jan-6-committee-refers-donald-trump-to-the-justice-department/
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Soprano2: Damn. That was hard to hear. I’ve been a fan of his.
UncleEbeneezer
@Geminid: Oh I totally get the reason for a summery, just not her implied argument that the full report should come out first. Barr rat-fucking the Mueller Report was probably gonna happen even if the full report had been released three weeks before his disingenuous memo.
dm
@Matt McIrvin: That’s different, then. It’s partly why I mentioned the Times Metro section — Queens and Long Island are local news to the Times.
Gin & Tonic
Coming in late and OT, but has commenter HumboldtBlue checked in? Big quake in that neck of the woods.
dm
@WaterGirl: The one thing Wittes said that I thought was worth hearing was “Pay attention to the footnotes, people!” That bit was interesting for what he found there.
Geminid
@UncleEbeneezer: Like the larger political pundit world, the legal pundit world is full of back seat drivers. And finding fault with the the person (or people) behind the wheel is the surest way of getting attention.
eclare
@Gin & Tonic: Yes. He checked in on this morning’s OTR.
WaterGirl
@UncleEbeneezer: I think it’s smart to do the Executive Summary first so the Committee can control the narrative.
SiubhanDuinne
@Gin & Tonic:
Yes. Scroll up to 102-104 in this thread.
rikyrah
This is crazy
NYC Council Member Erik Bottcher (@ebottcher) tweeted at 7:50 PM on Mon, Dec 19, 2022:
Tonight the Drag Story Hour protesters came to my apartment building and gained entry. My super called the cops and two of them were arrested for trespassing. This is pure hate, unmasked. If they think this is going to intimidate us, they’re mistaken. Our resolve is strengthened. https://t.co/i45eyGg1AS
(https://twitter.com/ebottcher/status/1605017815026638848?t=f1PMdESZ0QrPBfY40zsoXw&s=03)
zhena gogolia
@Gin & Tonic: See comment a few above yours, 104 or so.
rikyrah
THEE Side-Eye Pinkie Pie (@NYPoliticalMom) tweeted at 1:28 PM on Mon, Dec 19, 2022:
You know what I’m waiting for? All those pundits on the news every night screaming about how the Jan 6 Committee “HaZ tO sEnD cRiMiNuL rEfErRuLz RiGhT nOw!1!1!1?” backtracking on themselves on why it’s such a bad thing that the committee issued criminal referrals.
(https://twitter.com/NYPoliticalMom/status/1604921675174346772?t=6Love8ckIJ0-WqqbDDzD3g&s=03)
James E Powell
@laura:
I was against it as soon as I heard of it. Somehow the name of it triggers “Blood & Soil” in my mind. Not wild about the war eagle logo either.
It’s possible I’m just a paranoid who hates Jesus & the troops, but I wish it had never happened.
Geminid
@rikyrah: There is a real market out there for pessimistic takes. Some Democrats are never happy except when they are unhappy about Democratic leaders. The pundits @NYPoliticalMom is complaining about play to that crowd.
James E Powell
@Qrop Non Sequitur:
Go down the list, they aren’t any at all.
James E Powell
@Narya:
Most people won’t even do that.
trollhattan
@Scout211: Yee-haw! Not how I like being waken (no effects locally, but we’re 200+ miles away). I expect a lot of tchotchkes broke, hopefully nothing critical. Did feel the 7.0 they had in 1980.
Paul in KY
@Hitchhiker: I don’t regret any of mine, except for Anderson. He was a good guy, but I was 1/2 giving a vote to Reagan.
Paul in KY
@Soprano2: Pres. Nixon, for all he was, did have some couth. TFG wallows in uncouth.
James E Powell
@Matt McIrvin:
While I agree that we are seeing Murc’s Law in full operation, I also believe that the local Democratic Party & the Democratic candidate bear some of the responsibility. I sure hope they weren’t counting on that fucking newspaper to do the work for them.
James E Powell
@WaterGirl:
This is why I have advocated that we make little dolls of all the Rs in blue & purple districts and stick pins in them. Or something like that. I’m not up on the magic.
BenCisco 🇺🇸🎖️🖥️♦️
@laura: This is EXACTLY right! It SHOULD be broken up, all personnel re-vetted, and those that pass should be sent back to the original orgs.
Burnspbesq
@Aurona:
That’s remarkably short-sighted. The relevant expertise rests with the people that it rests with. If you know a way to conjure up deeply experienced national security professionals of color out of thin air, please share.
Ruckus
@Another Scott:
I think it is also advisable to remember that this was about 2 things.
1. Overriding the will of the people by overthrowing an election.
2. A public insurrection called for by the dipshit that wanted to stay in power by overthrowing said election.
And neither of these things had been seen before since day one of this United States. Yes we had the civil war but in reality that was somewhat different. Different situation, different result desired. The south wanted to leave, here the racists wanted to steal the entire country.
Gin & Tonic
@eclare: Thanks.
Ruckus
@Mai Naem mobile:
“Sounds very wwII era Germany.”
I worked in pro sports at the time the US airport gestapo was formed and flew a lot. Like 8-9 months a year week in week out a lot. Top 5% of Hertz renters a lot. The stewardesses on a flight I took regularly knew me a lot. The gate inspection gestapo was pure shit. I saw people that I’d bet had never had a thought of hurting a fly in their lives, want to literally kill, in the goriest way possible, every one involved. I won’t list here my ideas how…. Life for me – and everyone else, became far more than just a pain in the ass. I used to sometimes have to carry back sums of cash to the office. I once carried approximately $33,000. in my carry on. I won’t go through the entire story where the inspector looked in my bag and yelled out as loud as she could, “It’s full of cash, his bag is full of cash!” And when her supervisor told her to shut up she yelled “But his bag is full of cash!” That was a good time. I use to like flying. I got over it.
Ruckus
@Qrop Non Sequitur:
Fire doesn’t discriminate, it just consumes. To fire, Trump is only Shitty meat.
Fixed it for you.
UncleEbeneezer
@rikyrah: A lot of pundits and the public are woefully misinformed about what referrals to DOJ actually do/don’t accomplish. The 1/6 Report (and all its’ transcripts, interviews etc.) will be helpful for DOJ are a tool to cross-check their own investigations rather than as something to “piggy-back” on as many suggest. DOJ already has Meadows, Eastman, Clark, Perry’s phones, so clearly they are already pretty deep into investigating them. And they mention Trump repeatedly in the subpoenas and have interviewed his closest advisors and attorneys, so it’s not like he isn’t already at the center of their several investigations. The attempted witness tampering and obstruction of 1/6 Committee however will give DOJ some good leverage for using perjury charges to possibly get some people to flip on Trump but it isn’t going to kick-start anything new.
Formerly disgruntled in Oregon
@Ruckus: I think it was more similar than that.
The south wanted to “steal the entire country” too, and when Lincoln’s election made it clear that democracy wouldn’t deliver their desired results, they began to violently take over parts of the country (i.e. “secession”).
Ruckus
@UncleEbeneezer:
Exactly.
Captain C
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
And yet enough of them still seem to have voted for him. “Well, my choices are the criminal who will screw me over, or the nice competent person who might also be nice to people I don’t like, even though that won’t affect me. Gee, this is such a hard choice…”
Another Scott
@Ruckus:
Heh.
Yeah, there was a time when flying was actually kinda pleasant. So very long ago…
My J and her twin flew Aeroflot to Ireland in the before times and has stories about the drunk Russian businessmen and the “non-smoking section” – Stewardess: “Your two seats are the non-smoking section.” :-/
On their trip back, they flew into Dulles and her sister had to make a connection at BWI to fly home to Texas. As scheduled, there was plenty of time, but of course it took an hour longer than it should have to get the drunk Russians on the plane to depart from Ireland… I brought the car to Dulles. We had to race up to BWI after clearing customs at Dulles, J driving. They grabbed her bags as I stayed with the car, and they ran through the airport screaming “Wait, wait! She’s here!!” and got to the gate just before they closed the door.
Americans who have only flown post 9/11 would think that was some sort of fantasy story…
Part of the problems with the TSA at airports is the pay and working conditions. Biden and Thompson tried to fix it, but it didn’t make the NDAA this year:
Cheers,
Scott.