Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

We’ve had enough carrots to last a lifetime. break out the sticks.

Reality always lies in wait for … Democrats.

Republicans in disarray!

Despite his magical powers, I don’t think Trump is thinking this through, to be honest.

Take hopelessness and turn it into resilience.

This really is a full service blog.

Nothing worth doing is easy.

It’s the corruption, stupid.

The words do not have to be perfect.

Accused of treason; bitches about the ratings. I am in awe.

Wow, I can’t imagine what it was like to comment in morse code.

Some judge needs to shut this circus down soon.

When I decide to be condescending, you won’t have to dream up a fantasy about it.

If you’re pissed about Biden’s speech, he was talking about you.

Battle won, war still ongoing.

You don’t get to peddle hatred on saturday and offer condolences on sunday.

He really is that stupid.

If you are still in the GOP, you are an extremist.

The GOP couldn’t organize an orgy in a whorehouse with a fist full of 50s.

Their freedom requires your slavery.

Bad news for Ron DeSantis is great news for America.

Is it irresponsible to speculate? It is irresponsible not to.

Conservatism: there are some people the law protects but does not bind and others who the law binds but does not protect.

This has so much WTF written all over it that it is hard to comprehend.

You are here: Home / Politics / Republican Stupidity / GOP Plaints Open Thread: Peasants Service Workers Are Insufficiently Deferential

GOP Plaints Open Thread: Peasants Service Workers Are Insufficiently Deferential

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MTG her own self chips in!

Aaannnnd… another Very Serious Employer heard from:

Reader Interactions

162Comments

  2. 2.

    bbleh

    As previously and extensively noted, large portions of our society — notably businesses and other institutions — select for sociopathic traits, including but not limited to lack of empathy, and often at least some degree of narcissism.

    I suppose “we” “ought” to expect better, but realistically, nah.

  6. 6.

    zhena gogolia

    Chloe Fineman’s SNL parodies are getting just too over the top.

    That “boom” at the end is just . . .

  10. 10.

    sdhays

    The standard contract at my company apparently provides for certain compensation by “bonus”, which means that it’s structured for people to consider it as part of their expected income rather than “extra”. Well, last quarter, we didn’t hit our numbers and a lot of people were upset and surprised. Enough people were upset that they eventually paid out the bonuses anyway, with the warning that it was a one time thing. For various reasons, I was on a different contract, so I didn’t personally notice.

    If you don’t want people to complain about not getting bonuses, don’t make bonuses part of their promised compensation. It’s accounting flimflammery that allows the company to cut your pay without admitting it.

  12. 12.

    RSA

    Instead of writing an entire column of cringe and lobbying against a living wage in response to – shockingly – being asked to repeat his Starbucks order, this guy could have just ordered ahead on the app like everyone else who doesn’t want to speak their order

    Yeah, it’s a dumb complaint, but this “solution” is Brave New World clueless. “Talking to people is so passe–just use an app!” An app developed by Starbucks to collect your data, approved with minimal oversight by Apple/Google, to be downloaded on your Apple/Android phone.

    I mean, in general it’s the way the world works today, but corporate exploitation goes beyond the figure on a worker’s paycheck.

  13. 13.

    p.a.

    When I got a job that was kinda dangerous under normal conditions I kept my legal and illegal (at the time) mind-altering hobbies limited to off days.  (No, not every off day, you jerks).  Maybe the Post will next advocate installing rotating knives and swinging blades to workplaces as employee incentives.

  15. 15.

    Chetan Murthy

    @RSA: I gotta say: if you want better service at your coffeeshop, all ya’ gotta do is *tip*.  Leave a *buck* in the tip jar regularly, and they’ll know your order by heart lickety-split.  It ain’t like the people workin’ there are getting paid a king’s ransom, after all.

  19. 19.

    Suzanne

    If there is any business whose CEO should not be getting a bonus right now, it’s MillerKnoll. Office furniture is not a performing market right now!

    Good Lord.

  20. 20.

    Geminid

    Today 9 Congressional Republicans sponsored a reception for Ron DeSantis at the Heritage Foundation’s DC headquarters. A Politico reporter was able to speak to attendees on their way out and found that few of the sponsors were actually endorsing DeSantis. One of them, Senator Mike Lee of Utah, emphasized that he would happily sponsor similar events for the other candidates.

    There did not seem to be a big groundswell of support among the other attendees either. One Congressman stopped outside to tell reporters that he was endorsing Donald Trump and then fired off a tweet to that effect. A couple others said they came by because DeSantis is a former colleague and they wanted to say hello.

  25. 25.

    John S.

    Freedom is just another word for nothin’ left to smoke

    Nothin’, don’t mean nothin’ hon’ if it ain’t free, no-no

    And feelin’ good was easy, Lord, when we smoked those trees

    You know feelin’ good was good enough for me

    Good enough for me and my Bobby McGee

  26. 26.

    Ghost of Joe Liebling´s Dog

    CEOs, in my limited experience, are pretty sure that they fully deserve bonuses, even if (sometimes, especially if) other ppl don’t.

    They seem to be the only ones who need a monetary incentive to do their very best; at most what anyone else needs is a vague, collective “thank you” and the occasional still-warm slice of pizza.  In their view.

    Apologies – I appear to have mucked up my nym.

  31. 31.

    bbleh

    @RSA: @Chetan Murthy: wait, what? Treat these people as though they’re human? Show appreciation?!?  What’s next, recognizing them and asking them how they’re doing, as though they were … [draws deep breath] … as though they were … equals?!?

    I’m pretty sure the root of narcissism is a lack of self-esteem.  Treating service people like dirt is a way for those people to try to feel better about themselves.

  34. 34.

    Chetan Murthy

    @bbleh: Trudat.  It said (with good reason) that if you want to see into a colleague’s/superior’s soul, pay attention to how they treat administrative assistants and other working-class staff.

  35. 35.

    raven

    Spanky

     

    Ho hummmm (big yawn)

    Up in the morning, just about 4,
    I put on my shoes and I’m out the door.
    Life is such a terrible bore….I’m a garbageman.

    Ridin on the garbage truck with my friend, Lou,
    He says “Say, baby, you lookin kinda blue!”
    “yeah, man, don’t this job ever get to you?
    I mean all this garbage!”

    (Oh no baby!)

    He said “Hold on Jim, I got just the thing you need!
    Here, baby, take a puff of this funny lookin’ little weed.
    Go on, man, smoke it, the first one’s free!”

    Oh well thank you!

    Well the sun was risin, shinin in the sky
    Garbage truck was drawin flies
    I didn’t care, I was ridin high
    I was out of it, stoned, swino, wasted

    Well, everything’s cool now, nothing’s wrong.
    Garbage stinks, but I float along
    Singing this happy, happy song –
    Pot’s too good to be just for the young!

  36. 36.

    Jay

    Funny thing is when I was working at both the Orange Menace and the Raider, I relied on Tims and Starbucks to start my day. Never used the app, never had an issue. Waited in line, said good morning, gave my order, sometimes had to repeat my order, addressed the staff by name, thanked them, told them I hoped they had a good day. Never got overcharged, got free coffees sometimes, never had anybody spit in my food, once got a bacon, egg, sausage, english muffin for free, because the over rushed “sandwich assembler” screwed up slightly, (line rush, drive through window rush),……..

    When I was working a gig job in between the Orange and the Raider, out in Poco walked into the Starbucks there, I was greeted with a squeal of my name, as the manager Trina, came rushing out from behind the counter to give me a hug. She used to manage the Starbucks by Orange, but had transferred out to Poco, (closer to home), and I hadn’t seen her in 6 months,……..

  38. 38.

    Old Dan and Little Ann

    Did I read about Dangerman  here or on Twitter?  He recently had cops raid his house and they found nothing.  It was all on his home camera and he wrote an entire album about the situation.  Hysterical. This one made him famous.  https://youtu.be/WeYsTmIzjkw

  40. 40.

    Poe Larity

    The dialectic between properly high and caffeinated population sets is interesting.

    What happens when the espresso tech can’t concentrate on the Mastrena servicing? Society could all go tilt very quickly.

  41. 41.

    kindness

    Management treating their people like serfs has been a thing for thousands of years.  Funny how management types now are shocked when the serfs complain.  Why in the old days…..

  44. 44.

    Geminid

    I’m just glad the NFL lightened up on testing for cannabis a couple years ago. Those players are some of the ones who really need it.

  45. 45.

    Anyway

    About 5 years ago I remember a RW Econ prof friend gleefully passing around an article where fast food chains thought they had found some “automagic” contraption that would reduce the number of employees they’d need. This was around the time of the fight for Fifteen dollar wage and his argument was that workers fighting for higher wages would push employers to automate jobs and cut down on employees. He was convinced employees would regret pushing for higher wages when their jobs would be cut… I’ve thought of Steve often during the pandemic years as restaurants, fast food chains fought for workers. Funny how that worked out.

  46. 46.

    NotMax

    Dunno whether or not any chemicals were involved but one time a friend and I tried out a nice Indian restaurant here. Very good food; sad to say the place lasted maybe eight months before folding.

    Anyhoo, while enjoying after dinner coffee, the waitress approached the table and proceeded to plop herself down in an empty chair, going into a whole laundry list of whining about life in general and how hard she was working tonight, especially when the place was “so slammed” with diners. We looked around.

    It was peak time for dinner rush and besides the two of us there were three other people in the joint and at least two dozen empty tables.

    (Not the first time similar happened to us. We were like therapy magnets for waitstaff to bare their souls while, unbidden, either standing tableside or sitting.)

  48. 48.

    Tony G

    The real problem is that Those People are being paid at all.  In the natural order of things, they would serve their masters with no more compensation than a bowl of gruel at the end of their twelve-hour day.

  49. 49.

    sab

    @Josie: 40 years ago when I worked in western Michigan area, their annual bonus was about 30% of their pay.  They planned their whole financial lives around getting that bonus.

  50. 50.

    Mr. Bemused Senior

    @Josie:  ah, MillerKnoll.  As in Herman Miller.  As in the inventors of office cubicles.

    Well, at least it’s consistent.

  51. 51.

    Tony G

    @NotMax: Sounds like one of my jobs a few years ago, when I pretended to supervise a group of disgruntled I.T. people while serving as a bargain-basement psychotherapist for them.  I loved that job!

  52. 52.

    siddhartha

    When a WOC tells a WW that saying x, y, or z is racist, even keeping aside that these issues are this WOC’s areas of expertise, one listens and does the work to understand why. One doesn’t mock.

    Unless one is racist. And thinks oneself as equal in knowledge to that WOC who has actual expertise, which, again, is racist. (I’m still reeling from the breathtaking caucasity of saying that one KNOWS all about intersectionality from taking an elective in law school).

    And the predominant ethos in the comments makes it clear that this is a friendly “white” club, which will be reinforced when shit gets real.

    Funny how no one even dares to suggest that they can speak of Florida matters like BC, or national security/war matters like AS, or healthcare matters like DA.

    But this one…  nope.

    I wonder why.

  53. 53.

    sab

    @Anyway: In tax prep a few years back they were trying to automate input by have the computer scan it. The results were hilarious. Commas were read as ones, so that a five figure income was read as six figure, etc.

    We spent more time proofreading and correcting than we had spent before just typing.

  55. 55.

    zhena gogolia

    @siddhartha: What are you referring to?

    No need to reply, I’m going to bed. I just scanned the comments to try to figure out what this was about, and I have no idea.

  56. 56.

    Suzanne

    @sab: I know some people who work there, too, all in sales. It is a fairly common career path for interior designers to leave project work at design firms and then go over to the sales side of the industry. The base pay is really — really — bad, so commissions and bonuses are how they make their money.

    Office furniture is, uhhhhhh, not a good business right now. (I will note that Knoll does a bit more in the hospitality market than Herman Miller.) I’m sure the salespeople are really suffering right now, with so many companies looking to reduce their physical space. The CEO getting a bonus while the employees do not is reprehensible.

  59. 59.

    Mr. Bemused Senior

    @oatler:  Bemused Senior (Mrs.) lost respect for and eventually came to regard NPR with hostility.  She would berate me for listening.  At this point I limit myself to Weekend Edition Sunday.  I like the puzzle.

  60. 60.

    divF

    @Chetan Murthy: I go to the original Peet’s coffee every morning, have coffee, and sit and work for a while on my laptop. The simple expedients of (1) leaving a decent tip, and (2) looking the baristas in the eye, smiling, and generally making human contact, makes everyone know my order (and my name). I have been told by baristas that (2) is, in fact, real important.

  62. 62.

    NotMax

    @Suzanne

    Acquaintance who works at Office Max here estimated office furniture accounts for over 60% of that location’s sales.

  63. 63.

    Chetan Murthy

    @divF: I’m sure #2 helps a shit-ton.   But I have trouble making eye contact even with people I know, and I found that the (incredibly paltry)  consistent $1 tip was enough so that if there was a line, then by the time I got to the front, my order was just about ready.

  64. 64.

    OverTwistWillie

    My trips to the coffeehaus don’t involve the ingestion of an addictive drug. Nope, no siree…..

  65. 65.

    laura

    Andi Owen should get a low tumbrel number. I’m so old, I remember business leaders who would pay their workers first and share the burdens and benefits to ensure the business remained an ongoing concern. But then, the Shareholder emerged and here we are.

  66. 66.

    Chetan Murthy

    @Chetan Murthy: And yeah, I spent a year working 30mi away, and when I quit that job and returned to my previous location, the people there remembered me like some sort of long-lost friend.  It was sorta guilt-inducing, what such a paltry sum can extract from people: it shows you how poorly they’re paid to begin with.

  68. 68.

    El Muneco

    @Chetan Murthy: During the early days of COVID, I was sincerely worried that some of the take-out places I like to go to wouldn’t survive, so I started tipping 100% (which is easier to do than you’d think when there’s one occupied table at a place that was turning people away).

    Even now, they treat me like a rock star. They even tell new hires about me.

  70. 70.

    Chetan Murthy

    @El Muneco: Heh, there’s *one* coffeeshop I still patronize, b/c (well, sure, the espresso’s OK) the owner still insists on masks, and no indoor dining — only takeout.  When the pandemic is *actually* over, I want that place to still be around, so I can hang out there.  So yeah, same thing: 100% or greater tips.  But I don’t go anyplace else, b/c FFS, they’re all unmasked, yadda yadda yadda.

  71. 71.

    OverTwistWillie

    Dusting off the Golden oldies. What’s next, going after Judas Priest?

    If they can make it 1983 again, I won’t be old no more…. right?

  72. 72.

    coin operated

    @Chetan Murthy:

    I gotta say: if you want better service at your coffeeshop, all ya’ gotta do is *tip*.  Leave a *buck* in the tip jar regularly, and they’ll know your order by heart lickety-split.  It ain’t like the people workin’ there are getting paid a king’s ransom, after all.

    I want to like, +1, and upding this comment.  Tip well, and you will be rewarded.  Wife and I go to Fremont Street in Las Vegas all the time.  Line would be 5-deep to get a drink, but the bartenders there know what I drink and that I tip well…never waited more than a minute for a beverage.

  73. 73.

    Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism

    @Chetan Murthy: ​

    I regularly see people complain about what terrible tippers foreign tourists are. Other countries don’t have the tipping culture we do because they pay their wait staff a living wage instead of expecting them to live off of their tips.

  76. 76.

    Cameron

    @laura: I read a story about George Romney (Willard’s dad) when he headed American Motors.  The board wanted to give him a raise, and he turned it down because he felt he already made far too much more than the workers.

  77. 77.

    Odie Hugh Manatee

    For those who like to keep track of how selective law enforcement is about enforcing the law, I present:

    Attorneys for St. Luke’s Health System have asked the Idaho Supreme Court to weigh in after an Idaho sheriff said his office will no longer serve far-right activist Ammon Bundy with legal papers, citing concerns over safety.

    This is from the state that isn’t fearful of telling women and liberals what to do. The head cop claims that he is in fear for himself and his employees and thus he refuses to do his job and serve him with papers.

    Fucking worthless pigs…

  78. 78.

    Ohio Mom

    @twbrandt: As I understand it, the Gap has been in a long term slump, I wonder if Andi Owen had a hand in that.

    Watching that video I was taken aback at first because she doesn’t look like my idea of a big corporate CEO, that is, an older white man in a suit. She looks more like she just stepped out of an art gallery. But the Gap and MillerKnoll are both hip happening brands so she fits.

    My favorite part is her loudly berating her staff to be kind.

  79. 79.

    Chetan Murthy

    @coin operated: Friend told me a story from when he was a kid.  He accompanies his dad to work at a bank: they leave the car in the valet parking garage, go to work.  After work, they come out, there’s a whole line of men waiting for their cars, while the valets scramble back-and-forth fetching them.  But soomehow, my friend’s dad’s car emerges lickety-split.  My friend asks his dad as they drive away, how that happened, when there were so many men ahead of him in line.  He answered: “Son, all those men tip $1, $2.  But Mr Edwards, he tips $5.”

     

    @Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism: You’re 100% right.  It’s the country we live in, and the culture we live in.  I feel a little guilty that these people are willing to learn my name, memorize my order, be friendly to me, all and only because I leave $1 (a single buck!  OK, it’s been a while, so if I start frequenting coffeeshops again post-pandemic, it’ll probably be $2) each time I order a drink.  It’s embarrassing.  It is also reality.

  80. 80.

    UncleEbeneezer

    @coin operated: Also…BE NICE!!  I went into a local coffee shop today and they were kind of slammed with orders and people standing there impatiently.  They had a spill behind the counter and the girl apologized to me and offered to let me look.  I was like “No worries. You’re safety is more important” and she was “that’s SO NICE!”  To be fair, we’ve chatted about Horror movies and Death Metal before so we had a bit of established report already, but it was kinda crazy how much she appreciated my just not being an asshole and letting them get their shit together before taking my order.  It really reminded me of just how much people shit on service sector employees.

  81. 81.

    HumboldtBlue

    As fucked up and out of touch as this shitty column and the mindset behind it are, can I take a moment to say fuck your apps?

    Fuck your apps, fuck your codes or whatever the fuck they are, I don’t want to download your fucking apps, I don’t want to be constantly under fucking surveillance with my every step, every tap into my phone, every fucking simple search noted, logged, compiled, collated and then fed to a fucking digital corporate miasma that sends it back to me in unwanted fucking ads and suggestions and prompts and emails and alerts.

    Fuck your digital menus and your digital fucking tickets and your digital fucking passes, I don’t want every fucking thing I do reliant upon a fucking internet service provider or a fucking cloud or a digital fucking wallet. I don’t use my phone for anything other than texting and making phone calls, you know why? Because it’s none of your fucking business, that’s fucking why.

    Sure, I’m yelling at the fucking clouds and standing on top of the digital fucking train steaming into the fucking future screaming futilely like a deranged grandad on a digital fucking lawn while digital fucking kids and their digital fucking bikes exist in an unreal digital fucking world, because fuck you, that’s why.

    My future only has another decade or two to go, and I don’t want it directed and suggested and managed and downloaded and uploaded and cloud-served, I want a fucking menu when I got to a fucking restaurant. I want to buy a ticket and rip the fucking thing in half when I am admitted to a ballgame or a concert or to use some actual fucking money, cash fucking money so that next Tuesday I don’t wake up to an email inbox filled with digital fucking coupons and digital fucking suggestions about the new fucking fusion Mex-Thai-Mongolian-fucking-barbecue that you can only if you have downloaded the fucking app and redeemed the digital fucking secret code.

    Fuck your apps, and get the fuck off my fucking lawn, you tedious motherfuckers, and take your fucking clouds and wallets and cookies and whatever the fuck else you use to track my fucking life and fuck the fuck off.

  83. 83.

    UncleEbeneezer

    @divF: Amazing what a difference treating people like people actually makes.  I worked in a college convenience store, bussed tables, ran a super-market deli etc., so I always just try to remember how shitty service industry jobs are and give workers a whole lot of respect and grace, especially if they are trainees or making mistakes etc.  I’ve been there, and there is nothing meaner than the older person who gets all pissy when you are still learning and under a lot of pressure.

  86. 86.

    Ken

    @Chetan Murthy: You remind me of the parody book The Way Things Really Work. The section on “How an Engine Works” was a two-page spread. On the left, the traditional exploded view with several hundred numbered parts. On the right, an illustration  captioned “Give generous tip to competent mechanic”.

  87. 87.

    mrmoshpotato

    @OverTwistWillie:

    Dusting off the Golden oldies. What’s next, going after Judas Priest? 

    If they can make it 1983 again, I won’t be old no more…. right?

    Time to investigate the Powerball and MegaMillions histories and wait! 💰

  88. 88.

    sab

    @HumboldtBlue: Luddite here and you speak for me. My husband laughs that I still love my flip phone. I never pocket/butt dial anyone. My family does that all the time. I once had a twenty minute call in Chinese from my sister because her phone dialed me while she was out to dinner with friends. That is not okay.

    I don’t want to download apps onto my phone.

  89. 89.

    Cameron

    @UncleEbeneezer: I try to do the same thing with anybody serving me, whether in the supermarket or doctor’s office or what have you.  I figure there are enough other old farts like me who will make their lives miserable.

  91. 91.

    Chetan Murthy

    @Ken:

    On the right, an illustration  captioned “Give generous tip to competent mechanic”.

    When I owned a (4th-hand, hence cheeeeep) BMW Z3, I took it to a mechanic with a one-man shop.  He’d send me a coupon every Christmas for 10% off the next service, but I never bothered using it: I figured: one way or the other, he’d charge me what he thought he should get paid, and I was fine with paying it  It helped that the car was sooooo cheap to buy in the first place.

  94. 94.

    sab

    @twbrandt: Or the struggling company hires a woman because no man wants the job and competent woman don’t either. How Carly Fiorina got ahead in life.

  95. 95.

    Ohio Mom

    @HumboldtBlue: And those fucking apps screw up and don’t work. Ask me how I know. The one time I tried an app, for Michaels’ crafts stores, it wouldn’t work. I just gave up and paid full price because there was a line behind and the cashier was no help.

    It probably has been something of a boon for lots of stores. They aren’t putting coupons in the Sunday paper or mailing them anymore, that’s savings right there.

    Add to that people who never went into one of their stores without a coupon (for me, Michael’s, JoAnn’s, Bed, Bath and Beyond, and sometimes Ace Hardware) who are now paying full price.

  97. 97.

    twbrandt

    @sab: In a previous life I ran a company that was a Hewlett-Packard value-added reseller – we sold our software bundled with HP hardware. It worked out well for both HP and us, until Carly ran into HP into the ground with utterly clueless management. She’s been on my personal shit list ever since.

  98. 98.

    sab

    Ohio Mom

    Are you near Cincinnati or Columbus? I want an Ohio meetup but that idea disappeared when debbie disappeared.

    I am sort of near but sourh of Cleveland. Our jackals don’t seem to want to meet, which seems a shame because I like them, but whatever.

  99. 99.

    Mr. Bemused Senior

    @twbrandt:  HP is one sad example in a long list of originally engineering-based companies that succumbed to management by incompetent executives.  Why do such people get to be in charge?  [rhetorical question]

  101. 101.

    sab

    @twbrandt: I had an HP printer that was shockingly expensive to run. And she wanted to sell that part of the business because it didn’t make enough money even as awful as it was.

  103. 103.

    Poe Larity

    My, er, Jamaican Barista started calling me by another name. Her kid might be high, but she’s a rock at 8am.

    It’s a fine name, one of the few alts I wouldn’t mind. But what happens if someone else corrects her? Do I say something or just go with it? Is she calling someone else my name? If so, they must be going with it but who knows?

  104. 104.

    sab

    @twbrandt: I have brand loyalty. Texas Instruments calculator fucked me in exams in 1985 (battery died) and I hate it. HP calculator has been great and I replaced it once. Forty plus years with their products.

  105. 105.

    Ohio Mom

    @sab: I am in Cincinnati. The Ohio meet-up got way-laid by Covid, then debbi disappeared…

    But this summer, I think we could finally do it. There are Juicers all over Ohio, I still think Columbus could work. We just need a restaurant with a big open patio.

    Maybe we should have Anne Laurie put up a post? Maybe there is s lurker in Columbus who could help identify a location. The restaurants Ohio Family frequent when we take day trips to Columbus are all too small.

  106. 106.

    sab

    @sab: Fortunately, it blew itself up, so I had to replace it. My new Epson has been a reliable and inexpensive tank to run.

  111. 111.

    TriassicSands

    OK, all you whiners, just shut up about the bonuses you aren’t going to get. I’m getting the bonus because I have to put up with all you sniveling PsOS. Just be thankful I pay you at all. Whatever you make, rest assured you’re not worth it and I should be getting 10, 20, 100 times more than I am.

    Have a great day.

    Wow, what a charmer.

  113. 113.

    Mr. Bemused Senior

    @sab:  HP calculators (stack based, operator last).  But I’m also thinking of RCN (Lt. Leary).  Free association, my mind just works that way.

  116. 116.

    Odie Hugh Manatee

    @mrmoshpotato:

    He’s been harassing the local hospital and posting false/defamatory bullshit about it. They are trying to sue him and the cops are helping to protect Bundy by claiming that they feel unsafe in dealing with him. The worthless fucking sheriff would have the state troopers and National Guard there if this was a black citizen’s rights group that made him fearful. As it is I would bet that the sheriff would gladly go to battle with such a group just so he could bask in the glory afterward.

    But since it’s ‘his kind of people’ his lack of action is defending, he just refuses to do his job (with a nod and a wink, of course).

  118. 118.

    sab

    @Ohio Mom: Did you know Scotland is smaller than Ohio?  Meetups here aren’t actually next door.

    I want to meet you, and I know you are not close.

    I want a NE Ohio meetup also, but none of us mention one so we probably don’t want one.

  123. 123.

    sab

    @Jay: Thanks

    I do that all the time on my calculator. Little handheld calculators are not 10 keys (big office calculators.). They work differently.  I always knew that. I did not know there was language for the difference.

  124. 124.

    Freemark

    @twbrandt: ​
      Mine too. Nine years old and the replacement toner I bought 2 years ago because it said it was almost out is still in its packaging. I’ve been through a couple hundred pages since.

  125. 125.

    sab

    @Freemark: My toner never seems to go down. Has it stained the surface of the container or is it just thrifty?

    My printer sends me periodic notices, but the level seems the same.

  126. 126.

    Ohio Mom

    @sab: Who is in northeast Ohio besides you and Goku? I am trying to remember who else is in Ohio. Kay (for a short time more at least), Bruce from Ohio, and now my mind goes blank. It’s my bedtime.

  128. 128.

    sab

    @Ohio Mom: We have some jackals up here but they don’t  seem to want  to meet. Manyakitty and Professor bigfoot. Kitty is in Fairlawn (suburban Akron)  and the Prof is in Canton

    Kay is in western Ohio miles and hours away.

  130. 130.

    UncleEbeneezer

    @Omnes Omnibus: I think they (sorry, I’m not sure of Siddhartha’s gender) is just venting some pent-up frustration over the White Feminist™ passive-aggression, gatekeeping, tone-policing and making the environment unwelcoming to WoC and Trans/Non-Binary people that has been evident at BJ in recent weeks.  Can’t say that I blame Siddhartha in the least.  It was a depressing display of exactly the sort of thing that chased away ABL (Imani Gandy) and I fear may chase away PlanetEddie and other Trans/NB members of the Balloon Juice community.  It was especially gross considering the relentless, daily attacks of the GOP on Trans/NB people happening right now all across America.

    On a related note, I just happened to watch this excellent interview with Kyla Schuller, an academic expert on Feminism and Racism and author of The Trouble With White Women.  She is interviewed by Brittany Cooper (tenured professor of Women and Gender Studies, author, professor, activist, and cultural critic) and the whole, hour-long interview is really superb and very relevant to events at BJ recently, imo.  People should watch it, listen and learn.  There’s tons of good and brutally honest stuff in it and neither woman pulls any punches.

  131. 131.

    sab

    @Ohio Mom: Is Bruce in Ohio or just from Ohio?

    John Legend ( from Ohio)  jokes that his wife Chrissie Teighan jokes that everyone  in America is actually from Ohio.

    That is my experience but my parents and grandparents were from here.

  133. 133.

    Fair Economist

    @Cameron:

    I read a story about George Romney (Willard’s dad) when he headed American Motors. The board wanted to give him a raise, and he turned it down because he felt he already made far too much more than the workers.

    Man, that apple fell so far from the tree it went into orbit.

  134. 134.

    Odie Hugh Manatee

    @Chetan Murthy:

    Yup. If I was the hospital I would threaten to shut the place down if they are unable to be protected from the religious zealot and his crazed followers. Seriously, how in the hell can you offer medical services to people who are threatening to kill you?

    Let them pray to their god for healing and see how far that gets them.

  135. 135.

    livewyre

    @UncleEbeneezer: Need to thank you for keeping on this. I had to learn the hard way how fiercely even the most respected advocates on an issue can defend their own leverage over it, even at the expense of those most affected. At some point we end up listening to authority rather than experience and everyone loses. Just some more immediately than others. Whatever keeps the peace, I guess.

  136. 136.

    Ruckus

    @UncleEbeneezer:

    It doesn’t have to be this way. I’m an old fart and I don’t treat people like that but I do see some people of all ages that do. The more people get fucked over in their lives the more they really begin to lose sight of the times it isn’t all crap around them. This isn’t all that new an issue it is that we now live in a time when there are more of us, far more.

    The US is 3rd in population per country behind China and India at around 1/3 of them and the next down from us is Indonesia with 60 million less than us. I live in LA county and we have a population larger than 40 of our states. Even if the rate of population growth is lessening we still have a lot of people per livable square mile. That means that while the percent of assholes may or may not be growing, the numbers are.

    I use the LA Metro system trains quite a lot, and it works well. It’s not always the cleanest or nicest place to sit for 20-30 minutes, it is far easier and often faster to get around LA than driving. Cheaper as well. It is, in my opinion a safer place. Now nothing in this world is all candy and roses and if we expect that we will always be disappointed. But over all, all things considered It seems OK to me. Could it be better? What couldn’t? Could we get rid of conservatives and then be able to build nirvana? I seriously doubt that, because well, humans.

  138. 138.

    HumboldtBlue

    @prostratedragon: ​ 

    What flashbacks, how surprising that I could sight-read and follow that the whole way through. 12 years of daily music lessons, practice, band and chorus certainly left a mark.

  139. 139.

    Hildebrand

    I love the TrenItalia app – whilst hoofing it to various train stations I can get every piece of info I need about platforms and delays and then purchase tickets while walking straight to the train.

    Saved myself two longish delays just yesterday, because even with the automated kiosks I would have missed trains.

  140. 140.

    J R in WV

    Regarding those who have problems with helping children with problems or doubts about their gender, whether those adults are female,  male, or anywhere on any gender spectrum,  they are fascist haters, and should keep their hate inside,  invisible to their surroundings!

    They should have  nothing to do with health policy, other than to pay just like everyone else. They should be kept away from all kids regardless of those kid’s genders just because those adults are evil bad people!

    Wife’s mom was stone narssist,  no one else existed in her tiny world. She turned hernice husband into a binge drunk, was such a nice guy when sober, could fix anything in no time, engineer…

    Enough  for now,  back to bed. ..love you guys!

  141. 141.

    J R in WV

    Regarding those who have problems with helping children with problems or doubts about their gender, whether those adults are female,  male, or anywhere on any gender spectrum,  they are fascist haters, and should keep their hate inside,  invisible to their surroundings!

    They should have  nothing to do with health policy, other than to pay just like everyone else. They should be kept away from all kids regardless of those kid’s genders just because those adults are evil bad people!

    Wife’s mom was stone narssist,  no one else existed in her tiny world. She turned hernice husband into a binge drunk, was such a nice guy when sober, could fix anything in no time, engineer…

    Enough  for now,  back to bed. ..love you guys!

  146. 146.

    Kay

    @UncleEbeneezer:

    I disagree with your global, theoretical take on white feminists so citing experts who also agree with you probably won’t change my mind.

    I do not, however, “disagree” with you or anyone else’s negative experiences with white feminists and I accept it.

    My view, for example, is that abortion bans are grounded in misogny and attempts to control women. I am aware there is another view that abortion bans are grounded in racism. I don’t object to that view being stated or promoted on Balloon Juice but I don’t agree with it. But just as I post my opinions (although people don’t agree with me) I expect others to ALSO post theirs (and they do- you keep telling me I am silencing people yet people continue to disagree with me and I’m fine with it).

    You have to make up your mind. If you’re appealing to authority (this group of feminist experts who agree with me say this) then you can’t tell me I’m somehow silencing people’s personal experiences. If you’re talking about individual white feminists then you can’t also create a category to blame: White Feminists without my questioning the category and who it is intended to include.

  147. 147.

    evodevo

    @Ken: ​
      Or if they’re an independent…pay in cash at the time of billing lol – our mechanics are both small businesses who willingly keep our old cars running if they can. Cash talks…

  149. 149.

    E.

    Former bakery owner here. One of the best things you can do for any small business is pay in cash. My credit card processing fees were as much as my rent. Somebody has to pay for those “free” miles and it isn’t the airlines or the banks. It’s the guy working very long hours trying to make a living selling hand made croissants.

  150. 150.

    Kay

    @UncleEbeneezer:

    As to your constant invocation of ABL- I was a poster and commenter here when ABL posted. We share an interest in voting rights and abortion rights. We emailed back and forth on those things. I sometimes disagreed with her – once, for example, she wrote that the Romney campaign in Ohio were up to something based on what the Greens put out. The Greens in Ohio are full of shit and no one should rely on them- I said that . She never, not once, insisted that my disagreeing with her was somehow an attempt to silence her. Now maybe she secretly thought this, but that isn’t what we heard at the time- what we heard at the time was that John had to delete tons of vile racist comments – surely you’re not equating that with my disagreeing with you and eddie and the others.

  151. 151.

    UncleEbeneezer

    @livewyre:

    At some point we end up listening to authority rather than experience and everyone loses.

    You’re very welcome and this nails it ^^^^.  

    The very first step for all of us to being better allies for marginalized groups is to recognize that they are the experts on their own oppression.  To listen to them.  Like really listen to them without knee-jerk defensiveness, excuses, pushback etc., and then go sit with their words until we get it (which can take time). Read more, listen more. Really be open to what they are telling us.  It’s especially important when they tell us there is a problem (even ones that we can’t see) and that we may be contributing to that problem. When we fail to do that, every space will revert to White Supremacy/Patriarchy and become very unwelcome for everyone else. Unfortunately nobody can take that first step until they are ready to do so.

  152. 152.

    UncleEbeneezer

    @Kay: Did you ever discuss Intersectional Feminism with Imani?  I bring her up all the time because she is one of the people who helped popularize the phrase “If your Feminism isn’t Intersectional, your Feminism is BULLSHIT!”  She talked about White Feminists: refusing to listen to WoC, not really understanding Intersectional Feminism and dismissing it because they simply disagree with it, all the time on TWiB, and how exhausting and problematic that behavior is. It drove her “bananas” to use her own words, and it was one of the reasons she explained that she avoids White Feminist™ spaces, in general. She is very much not a fan of white women being dismissive of Intersectional Feminism and does not consider those who do so to be good allies.

    Dr. Mary McAuliffe: What’s something that feels like feminism, but *isn’t* actually feminism?

    Imani Gandy: white feminism

    And her sentiment is EXTREMELY COMMON among Black Feminists. That really should tell us all we need to know. We should listen to them (and other WoC, Trans Women and NB people etc) and the Academics that show us decades of historical evidence that back up and provide crucial context for those perspectives.

  153. 153.

    Miss Bianca

    @siddhartha: The food here is terrible, and the portions are so small. Yep, got it.

    What I *don’t* get is, if you’re just so damned disgusted with us all, why you keep coming back to eat at this particular joint.

  154. 154.

    Kay

    @UncleEbeneezer:

    I reject your demand that I agree with you on feminism. I don’t know how to explain to this to you any more clearly. You may certainly continue to put forward your views on intersectional feminism – be my guest- but I really don’t have to agree with you. That’s not required.

    I think it’s ridiculous to participate in a political blog and expect everyone to agree all the time and if someone doesn’t agree to insist that somehow means I am silencing a huge group of people.

    Go ahead and opine away on white feminists and abortion. I’m not stopping you. However- I am not required to applaud your opinions or agree with them.

  155. 155.

    Kay

    @UncleEbeneezer:

    That really should tell us all we need to know.

    So I am permitted to discuss womens rights and abortion ONLY within the bounds you have set out? I may question none of it?

    No. I don’t accept your demand. I’ll discuss feminism and abortion any way I please and you, of course, may do the same.

  156. 156.

    Kay

    @UncleEbeneezer:

    Why don’t you tell us who is permitted to discuss abortion and womens rights on this blog. I mean, do you hear yourself? You’re now the manager of women and how they may discuss their own rights?

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