According to CNN, 26 reps voted against Emmer in a closed-door vote and Emmer is standing around with a mic trying to change their minds one by one in what sounds like the most hellish karaoke session ever. Nehls of TX said the House is back to square one and that he voted “present.”
Johnson of SD said, “I tell you I think he’s moving the room.” Or maybe the room is spinning. It’s unclear. The latest is that the meeting adjourned until 4 PM ET.
***
A TPM reader made a great point over at Josh Marshall’s place about the Cheese-Bro, the Kraken lady and now Jenna Ellis copping pleas in Trump’s racketeering indictment in Georgia:
Three of Trump’s key people are now admitting that they lied to try to steal the election. That’s never happened before. I know everyone is fatigued here and that we’ve become normalized to all this, but this should be a moment when the press attacks, and makes abundantly clear what the three of these flips together mean and asking hard questions of key Republicans. “Now that three of Trump’s inner circle have flipped – said under oath that their stolen election claims are fraudulent – do you continue to stand by former President Trump? Do you continue to assert that the election was stolen?”
That’s the question that should be asked of every Repub, over and over, from now until the end of time. Most elected Repubs dabble in election denial to varying degrees, from the weaselly “we must respect voter concerns” end of the spectrum to the “hell yeah, we had to do a coup to save America” pole.
It corrodes democracy. It has to stop, or at least stop being a view that is acceptable among large groups of people with serious government power. The press has a role to play here. They should do their jobs.
Open thread.
HumboldtBlue
We are fucking doomed.
Edmund dantes
This has gotten further than I ever dreamed it would. Trying to not get my hopes up, but the GA case is shaping up nicely. Also the other cases all seem to be proceeding well (barring the one with the human delay machine sitting on the bench).
Soprano2
They don’t understand, being Speaker is a real job with real responsibilities. TFG doesn’t want anything to do with something like that.
Urza
You might want to come back from that fantasy of the press actually doing their job. Its more likely they let it go and prop up the horse race as much as possible till at least September before all piling on at the same time for ratings, or just letting the fascists win and selling books after about all the things they hid.
HumboldtBlue
Yanked from downstairs, if you wish to watch Jenna Ellis plead guilty, here ya go.
The Kropenhagen Interpretation
Jobs? Responsibilities? What’s that? We need someone to schedule our made-for social media rants.
MattF
@HumboldtBlue:
Don’t know if this link to Charlie Pierce will work, but Pierce makes the case that TFG’s mental state is fading fast. Putting that on public display would probably… be a bad idea.
ETA: I guess that if Trump’s name was actually proposed on the floor of the House, R reps would find it hard to vote ‘no’.
OzarkHillbilly
@MattF: Worked for me.
Betty Cracker
@Urza: Maybe you can tell me where I lapsed into fantasyland here — I thought I was expressing a fairly obvious point about what the press should do, not what they would do.
@HumboldtBlue: “So help me die”? Is that really an oath people take?
C Stars
It’s an interesting parallel, right? In the House, the divide is between those who are and aren’t sufficiently obsequious to Trump’s claim that the election was stolen, while in the Courts, Trump’s premise is being demolished (more so than it already has been–quantum level now) by all these Trump election folks pleading that they knew they were lying.
HumboldtBlue
@MattF:
This should be the lede for any article written about Trump.
WaterGirl
If I read this one one more time, in one more place, I think I will scream. Latest culprit: The Hill.
insert scream emoji here
dmsilev
@HumboldtBlue: Look, at least it will mean a short commute for him for all of those DC court appearances.
HumboldtBlue
@Betty Cracker:
“So help me die”? Is that really an oath people take?
With these folks? Who knows? Fits with the perverted “I’m a victim” cloak these falsely pious assholes don whenever the real world comes a-calling.
Frankensteinbeck
@MattF:
Those quotes all sound coherent to me. Stupid, wrong on a basic fact he should know, sure, but coherent racism consistent with his long-time obsessions. For Trump, this is a high level of cognitive function.
teezyskeezy
@Edmund dantes: You chose the path of a family-friendly description of a certain judge. I admire your restraint.
balconesfault
What percentage of the GOP gerrymandered House districts out there can a non-election denier hope to win his primary?
20% maybe? Maybe 30% thanks to some long incumbency Reps?
These guys know the base they’ve cultivated, and they fear them much more than they fear history or the media.
dmsilev
@Soprano2:
We …used to think that was true of the Presidency as well.
balconesfault
@WaterGirl: “Tuesday marked exactly three weeks since eight Republicans banded with Democrats to oust former Speaker Kevin McCarthy (R-Calif.) from his post.”
Aaargh indeed.
Dems did not propose a motion to vacate.
And they didn’t vote to oust McCarthy. They voted that they’d prefer Jeffries – which is how it’s supposed to work.
WaterGirl
@Betty Cracker: Maybe if you don’t want to say “so help me god.”?
(what is the correct punctuation in that sentence?)
Also, Betty, I think WordPress dropped a word in this sentence.
Either fucking or goddamn would work. :-)
scav
@HumboldtBlue: How classically seasonal! Rep. Troy Nehls in a field, waiting and wishing for the Great Pumpkin.
Ramalama
Jenna Ellis pleading guilty, as shown on YouTube, has her looking and sounding surprisingly chipper. Maybe she’s relieved that, if the court allows (though they kept threatening her with the maximum 5 years prison), she’s not gonna do time.
But it’s pretty daunting that so many of her rights – like those of other people imprisoned – like getting a job, holding a passport, or voting – are possibly in jeopardy. I know this. But to hear it was a little unsettling for me.
teezyskeezy
@Frankensteinbeck: I would argue that Trump’s words make sense only if your theory of mind for him is a very pathological one. If you assume he is one of the worst narcissistic, delusional psychos to ever be given too much money, then yeah, I guess his rantings comport. But if a random someone in the grocery store started ranting like that, you’d think they had lost their mind.
HumboldtBlue
@dmsilev:
Nah, there’s no comparison, being president allowed to him steal openly, there is no way to do that as Speaker. Trump was fine with being president because he was top dog, as Speaker he’s no longer top dog, just the head bitch in a clown show, he ain’t gonna accept being behind Biden and Harris.
MattF
@WaterGirl: Several words, IMO:
Another Scott
The House press should just go on vacation until Monday November 13. Nothing is going to happen until that week.
Why would the bomb-throwers give up their threats before they have to? When has a modern political crisis been solved before the drop-dead date? It doesn’t make sense for anything to happen before the deadline.
Keeping these bozos (with apologies to Bozo) in the news is what they want. It takes attention away from all the good that Biden is doing, attention away from Dobbs, attention away from the important work being done to get more Democrats in office in Virginia, attention away from the Ohio referendum, etc., etc.
We’ll see.
Cheers,
Scott.
artem1s
@MattF:
No it won’t. They’ll ignore it just like they ignored the 8-9 times it was put on the floor during McCarthy’s election. Nehls is a do-something hack who is grasping at straws lest he have to, you know, stand up, do something, and solve the problem himself.
C Stars
@balconesfault: Exactly. Checks and balances are the GOP’s mortal enemy. The party will die if the rules are not created to benefit them. You can see why this speakership is such a big deal. They have to chose someone who they are 100% sure will continue to lie and cheat and obfuscate, without letting ethics or reality or democratic tendencies get in the way. But those pesky voters in purple districts care about Democracy.
Geminid
@HumboldtBlue: I don’t think Trump could get 217 votes even if he wanted the job.
Fair Economist
Can you even *imagine* the uproar if three of Hillary’s associates had sworn under oath she had committed multiple felonies? Even the Israel- Hamas war would be a half column on page 13 in the NYT because everything else would be about that.
Your liberal media at work, part 1073.
sdhays
@Another Scott: Yep.
WaterGirl
@Ramalama: I would sound pretty chipper, too, if I had just signed a plea deal that kept me out of prison!
Ramalama
@Another Scott: Aw poor Bozo. He was the subject of my very first nightmare as a wee little kid. While I slept, Bozo, Cookie, and cast of thousands chased me. A marching band with bass drum pounding like the one played on the ending of each show of Bozo, followed Bozo, following me. The pounding of the drum mirroring the rhythm of my heartbeat.
sdhays
@Geminid: Agreed. There’s no one alive (or dead) that 217 House Republicans can agree on right now.
HumboldtBlue
@Geminid:
True
Suzanne
Yes, but apparently that’s embarrassing, and it makes dumb people feel bad about themselves for being dumb. So we can’t do it.
mrmoshpotato
Sad. Just sad.
Emmy, recover the dignity that you don’t have, and go home.
WaterGirl
@MattF: Well, far be it from me (normally) to propose changing a single word of what Betty Cracker writes, but even though I am not catholic anymore, the nuns in my head won’t let me say “Jesus Christ!” as a swear word, or “goddamn”.
So I count on Betty to use those in a way I can’t. That just seemed like a missed opportunity! :-)
Barbara
@Soprano2:
No doubt they will accept Jared as his duly authorized delegate.
WaterGirl
@mrmoshpotato: Steve Scalise is the only one coming out of this with his dignity intact.
J
@Betty Cracker:
I took your point, but while we’re–cue music from Man of La Mancha–dreaming the impossible dream, they–the press–would, at the risk of seeming ‘liberal’ or ‘pushy’, have not only to put the question, but to follow it up by challenging the waffle Republican would muster in reply.
Ramalama
@WaterGirl:
I was actually eating popcorn while watching the Jenna Ellis confession hour (Smartfood). Something I almost never eat (kernals bother my teeth).
What’s the over/under for witness to flip who…has to serve time even while cooperating? At some point Fani Willis is going to run out of those Monopoly gift cards
PS Over/under: that’s like telling people to take a bet or lay out some odds, right? It sounded good when I first typed it.
Punchy
I’d love to know what “outsiders” Sessions has in mind for this. I thought being Speaker requires a modicum of procedural knowledge, a passing understanding of fundraising and campaigns, and an ability to add and subtract. What universally beloved GOP outsider has these traits? They gunna ask John Boehner to sober up and come back for a few months?
Barbara
@Another Scott: Yes, but meanwhile they can’t lob investigations and subpoenas at Hunter Biden or try to launch a phony impeachment process — all the things that they were planning to do for the sake of burnishing their reputation as the most MAGA among them. Even if they loathe Kevin McCarthy, he was a useful idiot for them. This all seems pointless even by their abysmally low standards.
Betty Cracker
It will be hilarious if Repubs actually elect Emmer after this diatribe from the orange fart cloud:
Bill Arnold
Yep, Mr. D.J. Trump, 77 YO self-styled belligerent alpha male, still does not know how to make a fist. Starting at about 8 seconds in the fifth video at the link (about “punching” Joe Biden). Mr. DJT would damage his hand. (In high school DJT was friendly with an actual bully-type. That guy became CEO of AIG (insurance) for a (brief) while.)
Donald Trump Had A Good Day Yesterday And His Brain Is Just Fine – Spoiler. (EVAN HURST, OCT 24, 2023, Wonkette)
For reference,
More here, with pictures: How to Make a Fist (wikiHow)
The first segment of the thumb needs to be tight against the second segment of the index and middle fingers.
The line from the index finger and middle finger knuckles needs to be close to the line of the bones in the forearm, so that the hand does not turn and get sprained when it hits.
ETA the Charles Pierce link from above has a higher-resolution “fists” picture.
HumboldtBlue
Cohen’s testimony:
Craig
@balconesfault: that’s not true. It was a year, or nay vote on the motion to vacate McCarthy’s Speakership. But that framing is still bullshit. Republicans got rid McCarthy. Democrats chose not to save him.
Frankensteinbeck
@teezyskeezy:
Sure. I do, and he is. He has been for decades. Everything in that speech is bugfuck nuts.
The issue here is cognitive decline. This speech doesn’t show it. It’s as coherent as his 2016 performances, even.
I think he has gotten less coherent, but this is a high point for him, not a low point.
Geminid
@sdhays: I think they still might find someone who could get to 217. But that does look more and more doubtful. What a mess!
Maybe Tom Cole will make history as our first Chickasaw Speaker.
Barbara
@Ramalama: The gift cards don’t really run out per se, they just become less valuable, with higher penalties for agreeing to plead later. I think the importance of Powell, Ellis and Cheseboro is that they link Trump to the scheme. They were all in his circle, communicating with him to one degree or another. This is really a series of overlapping conspiracies — it’s the people whose evidence links one to the other that are really important.
Tinare
One of the knocks on Emmer within the Repub caucus is that he voted to certify the election, so even if the press did its job, it probably won’t result in any Republican shame.
pat
@WaterGirl: not to mention the fees for the lawyers. I thought she sounded relieved. Bet she will do a bit of celebrating tonight. I would!
dmsilev
@Betty Cracker: “Globalist RINO”, huh?
One reason why sane people should be nervous about Emmer, by the way, is that apparently he’s one of the biggest fans/proponents of cryptocurrency in the House.
Barbara
@dmsilev: Well, with Sam Bankman-Fried on trial, and interest rates up from basically zero at reputable institutions, the case for crypto is fairly weak right now. He could tank legislation, assuming that was ever in the cards to begin with, which I greatly doubt.
dmsilev
@Punchy: Why would Boehner have to sober up first? I’d think dealing with today’s GOP practically requires mood-altering substances.
Ramalama
@Barbara: Yeah, OK. Wouldn’t you hate it if you (I mean Rudy) finally agreed to cooperate and … the sweet sweet (required) letters of contrition, community service requirements, and 5 thousand dollar fine get bumped up to something much more heinous? Like, he succumbed much too late? Wonder when it’s going to start getting dire.
Barbara
@Ramalama: There may be people she will not settle with. That’s not uncommon. I would not assume that everyone can settle even if they want to. Or they would basically have to settle by pleading guilty to everything they were charged with.
HumboldtBlue
@Barbara:
Also, these cooperation deals mean just that: they have to cooperate fully and truthfully, or the deal is rescinded and they face prison time.
john (not mccain)
“I haven’t been accurate but I have been optimistic.”
-Ken Buck clutching straws on CNN just now.
teezyskeezy
@Frankensteinbeck: Local maximum then. I don’t think it’s equal to 2016 in one regard: he is not able to hide his brazen delusionality as well. Yeah, he’s always been known to just say obviously false things, but there was a little veneer on it before that seems stripped away now. It might be just the reality for him now is *so* bad that his coping mechanisms no longer have any cover of ambiguity, but holy hell he’s just saying he hasn’t actually been indicted because that word ‘indicted’ doesn’t register with his brain. He isn’t just saying the indictments are unfair, he’s denying it happened and explicitly admitting he feels that way because his brain can’t register it. That’s a decline. He can’t put a blur or fuzzy glow on his delusions anymore.
HumboldtBlue
@Bill Arnold:
Here’s another story from Wonkette.
Ruckus
@WaterGirl:
Use JFC. You don’t say or type the words but everyone knows what it means….
I went to an all boys, catholic trade school for HS freshman year. (I’m not catholic) One of the priests was a good human, several of them were neutral and one won the Major Asshole of Humanity award. Several times. I could and still can, after that year, 60 yrs later, say any swear word with conviction and using all caps. I don’t recommend this learning curve but it really, really did enhance my ability to swear.
MattF
@dmsilev: Yeah, I kinda tripped over ‘globalist’ there. But I’m sensitive to that.
ETA: And re: crypto, I just assume a large amount of money suddenly appeared and then Emmer suddenly knew all he needed to know about crypto.
Ramalama
@WaterGirl: Oopsie. Toward the end of the sentence/hearing Ellis read a statement, voice shaking, that caused her to cry. The moment she described herself as a Christian the waterworks came down.
Watching a Zoom hearing via YouTube…yes I am avoiding doing my own work. Thanks for asking.
The Kropenhagen Interpretation
Just so we’re clear, no candidate for Speaker who would not work to overthrow our government can be elected with Republican votes alone while Republicans are in the majority.
Punchy
So if (when?) Emmer is bounced (or auto-bounces himself)….then what? These goobers did all this pre-voting, all this culling of the weakest, only to find out the strongest is still unable to get enough support?
Is it hyperbolic to say that a Speaker simply cannot be selected, full stop?
cain
@HumboldtBlue: Imagine having that asshole behind you when giving the state of the union.
catclub
CNN headlines:
very quick! Jordan lasted like 3 days.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
One of the few times trump surprised me was when he didn’t take the Speakership long enough to sit behind Biden at the SOTU, then resign
Jeffro
I posted about this a few threads ago (as did a couple other folks, after that): the GOP can’t elect a Speaker because there isn’t one GOP…there’s two. One of which won’t settle for anything less than wrecking the economy in order to protect trump.
Danielle Allen: Hakeem Jeffries would be Speaker of the House if our system actually functioned
*and most especially, as long as the Freedom Caucus insists that protecting trump/sabotaging America to sabotage President Biden is its highest priority
Ruckus
@Ramalama:
Fani Willis is laying the ground work for them to accept that they screwed the pooch and did it badly. And the first to go always gets the sweetest deal. SFB will never give in because he’s SFB and is better than any other human. Just ask him. Oh wait you don’t have to ask, he gets a microphone stuffed in his face on a regular basis. Of course he’s such a bag of crap that he continues to prove what he really is and only people that absolutely refuse to admit what he proves every single time he opens his gigantically shitty mouth will stay with him.
catclub
@teezyskeezy: ON the Mandela bit. Can we throw him in an island prison for 18 years to prove his bona fides.
Yes I learned bona fides from ‘O, Brother’
dmsilev
@catclub: So what do they do next? Anyone who was vaguely interested in the job put in their name over the weekend, the caucus had half a dozen rounds of voting today, and if they still can’t agree, where do they go from here?
Not that I expect any of us to have the answers.
cain
@Ramalama: She is also persona non-grata with the MAGA and conservative circles. She won’t be able to show up anywhere there ever again.
Paul in KY
@HumboldtBlue: Afraid to have him so close to the Presidency.
WaterGirl
@Ramalama: I had seen the waterworks clip this morning. It didn’t change my mind a bit.
My cocker spaniel was incorrigible. She would get in the garbage, even learned how to open the fridge. (I had to duct tape it shut after that.)
When I would yell at her, or punish her, I promise you – she was very sorry. Very sorry that I was yelling at her! Not at all sorry about having gotten into the garbage. (Or the fridge!)
That’s how I saw Ellis today. She was VERY SORRY that she was having to stand up in public and grovel like that.
That’s what the tears were about.
I stand by my she is surely giddy with relief to know that she doesn’t have to go to prison.
raven
@HumboldtBlue: n 2003, Ellis enrolled at Cedarville University. While there, she received a “significant financial award” from a civil case related to her being a victim of a violent crime at age 16. She used the funds to set up a scholarship to benefit future Cedarville students. “I wanted the money to mean something more,” said Ellis. “Starting a scholarship endowment was a way for me to heed that call to minister to others, and ultimately, further the Gospel of Christ through others’ ministries.”
Tough shit
Brachiator
The maddening thing is that there are two parallel worlds. In one, the rational world, honest investigations and the courts have definitively refuted all claims that the election was stolen, and there are ongoing prosecutions of people who conspired to help Trump steal the presidency or damage democracy.
In the other, crazy ass world, Republicans continue to back Trump, enable his politically destructive behavior, and pretend that there are still some unanswered questions about the election. I think that they are trying to redo Watergate. Back then, Republicans did the honorable thing and chose the best interests of the country over narrow partisan issues, and forced Nixon’s resignation. As a result, Republicans lost power for a while, and had to work with Democrats.
But now a fanatic core of Republicans have learned from Watergate that they must defend Trump no matter what and are dedicated to pushing the lie that the GOP is the sole legitimate political party, and that only they can protect and preserve a 1950s vision of what America should be.
West of the Rockies
I hope the three (four total?) flippers bring down Trump and Meadows. They can both still cause a lot of damage to Democracy.
Rudy is a badly-aging 79. I’m not really worried about him causing much future damage.
I’d love to see Bannon (who goes to trial next May) and Roger Stone take hard falls.
Hawley, Gaetz, MTG, Boebert… love to see them crash and burn.
trollhattan
@Betty Cracker: “Let me tell you all about the failings of this person, who I do not know well” is very on-brand.
Ruckus
@Frankensteinbeck:
I’ve watched the decline of several older people from the front lines and this is often what it looks like. I have been a trained mental health counselor. It starts out slowly, actually barely noticeable, but it always follows relatively close to the same pattern. Their dominate personality stays in front, but the one they have at least attempted to hide starts to show. Words they may never have publicly used no longer have a solid block. Emotions get stronger. Bad, even hidden personality traits can move to the front. What is happening is that the controls they put upon themselves fade away. And they get scared because they hear themselves and can no longer control the crap they have been hiding. This is of course not the path that everyone takes, but it is a path that many do take, especially if life is not going as they think it should. SFB is a prime candidate for this. He’s a public figure who thinks he’s numero uno and like much of the rest of their life, people like this are often wrong. And often very wrong.
cain
@Punchy: Essentially, they are not going to be able to find one.
Still no calls from the media to force them to consider a Democrat. It’s always seems to be the Dems should capitulate.
The deadline is coming – the chaos is going to keep happening. By the time they are done this Israeli thing is going to be finished and so nothing to capitalize on.
trollhattan
@West of the Rockies: Roger Stone separated from his drugs dealer would last maybe a fortnight, at the longest. Bannon separated from his bartender–perhaps similar.
andy
We really dodged a bullet when Dayton beat Emmer to be governor of Minnesota. We would have been just another Republican People’s Republic like Wisconsin. He laid the groundwork for the progressive gains we’ve accomplished in this session.
Jesse
@MattF: Trump was nominated — I think just one or two times — back in the January rodeo.
teezyskeezy
@catclub: You are a genius. You made me feel stupid by saying random references I’m sure mean nothing…but am I sure? Am I really? No. I’m not sure. Maybe you are a genius.
teezyskeezy
@catclub: But yes, we should, legally, through the justice system, prove his bona fides that way.
Karen S.
Trump scared Emmer off
Frank Wilhoit
@teezyskeezy: Trump’s words are not language. They have no grammar, and therefore they have no semantics. They do have connotations and associations; they function as talismans. Except when reading off a teleprompter, he has always sounded (to my ear) pretty much like this. It has always been possible to pick the least grammatical bits of any impromptu speech and find things that make no “sense”, which is only to say that if you are trying to figure out whether/how his speech “works”, how it resonates with his audience, the grammatical/semantic filter is not the right one to apply.
Frank Wilhoit
@Punchy: No, it’s all performance.
dmsilev
One more clown down. Onwards to the next clown.
Frank Wilhoit
@Ramalama: She thought she was reading from the right script all these years, and is utterly bewildered and helpless to be told that she was not.
H-Bob
The press asking hard questions of key Republicans — they can’t since they are too busy informing the public that Biden is old 🧐
Another Scott
@Betty Cracker: I see Emmer has dropped out. Maybe he wants the conference to come begging the way they (supposedly) did for Granny Starver.
Dropping out was a good idea. In a sane caucus it, and TIFG’s statement, would force them to make a choice. Do the sane ones want a Speaker or not? Are they going to let an insane, fascist, soon-to-be convicted felon lead them around or are they going to do their jobs?
I figure they’ll keep fumbling around for another few weeks…
Cheers,
Scott.
Ken
@The Kropenhagen Interpretation: I think you can simplify that:
Just so we’re clear, no candidate for Speaker
who would not work to overthrow our governmentcan be elected with Republican votes alonewhile Republicans are in the majority.pluky
@trollhattan: Bannon for sure. A chronic alcoholic is more likely to die from acute withdrawal than overdose.
UncleEbeneezer
Ryan Goodman on Xitter:
Scout211
The clown show goes on. The GOP conference doesn’t seem to have a clue how to do this. Link
teezyskeezy
@Frank Wilhoit: I still say it’s different. It’s now about just denying obvious reality, rather than obfusicating it cleverly. He *was* good as obfusication. Now he is not. Still just as shitty and just as much a liar, but less adept at blurring it.