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You are here: Home / 2024 Elections / Cold Grey Dawn Open Thread: TFG, Spiraling

Cold Grey Dawn Open Thread: TFG, Spiraling

by Anne Laurie|  March 26, 20245:02 am| 202 Comments

This post is in: 2024 Elections, C.R.E.A.M., Grifters Gonna Grift, Open Threads, Republicans in Disarray!, Trumpery, Schadenfreude

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Cold Grey Dawn Open Thread:  TFG, Spiraling

(Jack Ohman via GoComics.com)

I think there’s a non trivial chance Trump won’t be able to make the $175M bond either. So apparent victory will actly mean ten more days of begging, stories about his precarious finances, speculation about bankruptcy, all leading up to failing to get the smaller amount either.

— Josh Marshall (@joshtpm) March 26, 2024

A.B. Stoddard, at the Bulwark — “Trump’s Legal Fee Scam Is Just the Start, and Republicans Know It”:

REPUBLICANS KNEW MAKING HISTORY by nominating a four-time-indicted individual for the presidency would be, well, a little complicated. They knew they would have to explain away an insurrection and the theft of national secrets. They knew they would have to vouch for him against “racist” prosecutors in New York and Georgia, and a “weaponized” Department of Justice for bringing “fake” charges against him.

Fortunately they were assured that Donald Trump could, and would, pay for millions upon millions of dollars in legal bills, and—after anemic fundraising and an uninterrupted string of defeats—the GOP was getting its act together and preparing to win everywhere in this critical election year.

And then last week, Trump’s legal fee scam came to light when the Associated Press noticed the fine print on an invitation to a megadonor event next month:

Donations to the Trump 47 Committee will first be used to give the maximum amount allowed under federal law to Trump’s campaign. Anything left over from the donation next goes toward a maximum contribution to Save America, and then anything left from there goes to the RNC and then to state political parties.

… So at massive-dollar events, most of the money will still go to the RNC, but at smaller fundraising events, much of it will go to Trump. The arrangement allows Trump “to tap funds from larger donors for his legal matters without the money ever passing through the RNC,” the New York Times wrote…

In a normal political party a guy who is bragging that he has “ALMOST FIVE HUNDRED MILLION DOLLARS IN CASH, A SUBSTANTIAL AMOUNT OF WHICH I INTENDED TO USE IN MY CAMPAIGN FOR PRESIDENT,” wouldn’t be diverting money from the party coffers to pay for his criminal habit…

It’s not just Trump’s party now—because he secured a third nomination and he forced McConnell to give up his job as Senate leader—but it’s his party no matter what happens this November. The RNC will be socking away money now for the next steal, in case Biden wins. That’s far more important to Lara and Trump than downballot races.

Should Trump win, does anyone expect the RNC, in a second Trump term, to raise money for a future Republican primary, let alone nominee? They may pretend to, for a while, but donors know that money will find its way to a Don Jr. candidacy, or to his father’s pockets. No questions asked…

All Trump cares about is attention and money. Imagining donor dollars will go to anything but his needs—from here on out—is lunacy.

If Republicans are paying his legal bills now just imagine what they will rationalize, because of what he will demand, even a year from now.

Fortunately for Republicans, they deserve all of this. And so much more.

Trump insists he’s “allowed” to take foreign money to pay his bond pic.twitter.com/Ocf9zb9uW2

— Biden-Harris HQ (@BidenHQ) March 25, 2024

#DonPoorleone is the GOP nominee! pic.twitter.com/cFkog1aQsJ

— Holly Lee (@LeeHolly81) March 24, 2024

Horserace-tout pundits hardest hit…

I think we are all due an article from an independent like you on how Trump should drop out since he cant run a normal campaign not to mention someone with those many charges shouldnt be running in the first place. RNS should replace him

— Jack Rack 🇺🇸 (@jackisjake) March 25, 2024

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    202Comments

    1. 1.

      Baud

      March 26, 2024 at 5:04 am

      Nate Silver should retire if he can’t stop being a douche.

      Reply
    2. 2.

      Melancholy Jaques

      March 26, 2024 at 5:10 am

      @Baud:

      I get the impression that he will spend the rest of his career attacking and demeaning Democrats. He gives off a very strong ex-boyfriend vibe.

      Reply
    3. 3.

      AxelFoley

      March 26, 2024 at 5:12 am

      Francis Scott Key Bridge in Baltimore collapses after being hit by a ship:

      https://youtu.be/zFGGuUQtjok?si=_ud_Wo27ei8NRw6

      https://youtu.be/b4w2KGg1ydU?si=Z1cS2GRkFNsVCEjb

      Damn…

      Reply
    4. 4.

      The Kropenhagen Interpretation

      March 26, 2024 at 5:13 am

      Was there some day last where where everyone Nate Silver forgot how disingenuous implications work?

      Reply
    5. 5.

      Baud

      March 26, 2024 at 5:15 am

      @AxelFoley:

      That just does not happen. Captain and company are going to be in a world of hurt.

      Reply
    6. 6.

      Baud

      March 26, 2024 at 5:16 am

      @Melancholy Jaques:

      Hack deficit grows.

      Reply
    7. 7.

      Baud

      March 26, 2024 at 5:18 am

      @The Kropenhagen Interpretation:

      Pay day.

      Reply
    8. 8.

      eclare

      March 26, 2024 at 5:19 am

      Happy to report that there was a one minute Biden ad in The Bachelor finale last night.  The audience skews young and female, and the ad mentioned choice, among other things.

      And yes, I watch The Bachelor, it’s harmless drama, as opposed to election drama.

      Reply
    9. 9.

      The Kropenhagen Interpretation

      March 26, 2024 at 5:19 am

      @Baud: Cheeky.

      Reply
    10. 10.

      piratedan

      March 26, 2024 at 5:20 am

      tbf, I can understand Nate’s POV, I really can.  IF Biden can’t run a normal campaign, yet the evidence over the last two weeks shows that he can, so why push the article?  Why run the clickbait?

      He could have just as easily flipped that script and wrote that if DJT’s legal issues alone will prevent him from running a “normal” campaign, he should step aside without even speaking about his noted cognitive decline in the few campaign stops he has made.

      I’m tired of the concern trolling posing as journalism.

      Reply
    11. 11.

      eclare

      March 26, 2024 at 5:21 am

      @AxelFoley:

      The video of the collapse is unreal.

      Reply
    12. 12.

      The Kropenhagen Interpretation

      March 26, 2024 at 5:22 am

      @piratedan: IF Biden can’t run a normal campaign, yet the evidence over the last two weeks shows that he can

      Why, if you were paying consistent attention, as one expects a political journalist might…

      Reply
    13. 13.

      Baud

      March 26, 2024 at 5:23 am

      @eclare:

      Good to see you again.

      Reply
    14. 14.

      TBone

      March 26, 2024 at 5:24 am

      Jon Stewart skewered the “victimlessness” of his fraud criming.  I don’t watch him, but this seems pretty good.  I know I feel victimized.

      Jon Stewart showed that Trump’s fraud, and the fraud committed by other wealthy people is far from a victimless crime. Stewart said, “How is he not this mad about overvaluations in the real world? Because they’re not victimless crimes. First, the banks got paid back at lower interest rates. Although, let’s be honest, who gives a shit? But second, money isn’t infinite. A loan that goes to the liar doesn’t go to someone giving a more honest evaluation, so the system becomes incentivized for corruption. And this is part of a different Trump fraud case, but avoiding taxes hurts all of us. Donald Trump’s shenanigans cost the city of New York.  And to be honest, let’s be frank here, that is money the city of New York could have used to build more Walgreens. Later Stewart hit on an important double standard, “The [bleep] Entitled arrogance. I don’t know if you know this, but most people just can’t commit fraud and expect to face no repercussions, even if everyone’s doing it. Try getting a car loan by saying you have ten times as much money as you really do. Or claim 20 dependents when you have no children. Or say you make slightly less money to qualify for food assistance. I will guarantee you, there are not just financial consequences for those lies, but criminal ones. But don’t tell that to the investment community. Because in their minds, in pursuit of profit, there is no rule that cannot be bent, there is no principle that cannot be undercut, as long as you and your [bleep] friends make money. And the only immoral practice –apparently, the only immoral practice in the capitalist system is to use that money for people who may need it.”

      Reply
    15. 15.

      TBone

      March 26, 2024 at 5:31 am

      I am shocked and very sad about the bridge collapse nightmare.  I wonder why the entire thing went down so quickly, instead of a section.  I don’t know engineering and don’t need to know why, because it’s already happened, but damn that thing went down so completely and so fast.  Ugh. I’ve had an irrational fear of bridges since childhood.

      Reply
    16. 16.

      Baud

      March 26, 2024 at 5:33 am

      @Baud:

      According to Reddit sleuths,  the video suggests a mechanical failure on the ship. So the captain may not be at fault.

      Reply
    17. 17.

      JoyceH

      March 26, 2024 at 5:34 am

      Did anyone see Trump speaking yesterday? Caught a clip on the news and he looked bad! His hair looked like straw and his lips were white. Maybe a bad hair day and overdoing the bronzer but it seemed like something more. I remember the brief and highly unattractive white lipstick craze back in the ‘60s and that’s what immediately came to mind.  Of course he sounded crazy as always but he also looked sick.

      Reply
    18. 18.

      Soprano2

      March 26, 2024 at 5:36 am

      So we’re still in the ER. The doctor says hubby is severely dehydrated, which caused his creatine and potassium to be high. They’re going to admit him. I’m going to have to figure out something different to do, because this can’t keep happening. It all goes back to the kidney stone removal. I’m amazed I make sense, I’ve been up almost 24 hours.

      Reply
    19. 19.

      TBone

      March 26, 2024 at 5:36 am

      Everything he touches dies, and it’s all designed to demoralize us normal people so we’ll tune out.  Not doing that.  I still have hope for justice and will not be turned cynic.  The Supremacist Court is walking into a firestorm if they think they’re going to do away with medication abortion.  They will lose the election today if they outlaw it.

      Reply
    20. 20.

      Baud

      March 26, 2024 at 5:37 am

      @Soprano2: 🤞

       

       

      @TBone: 👍

      Reply
    21. 21.

      The Kropenhagen Interpretation

      March 26, 2024 at 5:38 am

      @Soprano2: Best of luck

      Reply
    22. 22.

      eclare

      March 26, 2024 at 5:40 am

      @Soprano2:

      Oh I’m so sorry, the stress you are under has been unrelenting.  Hugs.

      Reply
    23. 23.

      JoyceH

      March 26, 2024 at 5:43 am

      @TBone: The Supremes need to imagine the same farfetched rationale being applied to Viagra – guys would storm the court if they tried to do that.

      Reply
    24. 24.

      Splitting Image

      March 26, 2024 at 5:46 am

      The decline of Nate Silver has indeed been something to behold.

      To be fair, I suppose, the decline of accurate polling has made it impossible for a site like 538 to function in the way it did in 2008. Moving on to punditry was probably a good career choice for Silver.

      Reply
    25. 25.

      Baud

      March 26, 2024 at 5:46 am

      @JoyceH:

      Men would vote GOP, even more than they do. They’re trying to convince women to act differently when it comes to voting for their interests.

      Reply
    26. 26.

      The Kropenhagen Interpretation

      March 26, 2024 at 5:47 am

      @JoyceH: The Supremes need to imagine the same farfetched rationale being applied to Viagra

      Viagra isn’t a threat to the patriarchy. It won’t be.

      Reply
    27. 27.

      TBone

      March 26, 2024 at 5:47 am

      @JoyceH: exactly.  I’ve said that mandatory vasectomy should be performed on every male who wants a driver’s license (ejaculation is responsible for 100% of abortions).  It can be reversed if the male has a permission note signed by a responsible female partner, a doctor, and an attorney.  Let’s see responsibility placed squarely where it belongs, hahahahaha.

      Reply
    28. 28.

      TBone

      March 26, 2024 at 5:49 am

      Mood 🎶

      https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=umopTKfas5g

      Perseverance:  Let your hook always be cast.  In the pool where you least expect it, will be a fish.

      Reply
    29. 29.

      Jay

      March 26, 2024 at 5:53 am

      @Soprano2:

      So sorry, love to you and you hubby.

      Reply
    30. 30.

      Central Planning

      March 26, 2024 at 5:59 am

      @piratedan: Nobody is going to threaten Nate’s life over an article about Biden.

      Reply
    31. 31.

      TBone

      March 26, 2024 at 6:04 am

      Women have power.  We’ve got half the money and ALL of the p***y. This power can be used for good if we’re not scorned and burned for it, and the patriarchy better hope that is the outcome, for their own good.

      Reply
    32. 32.

      Jay

      March 26, 2024 at 6:05 am

      @Central Planning:

      unless he is too positive,………

      Reply
    33. 33.

      Central Planning

      March 26, 2024 at 6:09 am

      @Jay: He is a pundit. Of course he is too positive…. Frequently wrong but never in doubt.

      Reply
    34. 34.

      p.a.

      March 26, 2024 at 6:11 am

      @Soprano2: Sending positive thoughts.

      Reply
    35. 35.

      Jay

      March 26, 2024 at 6:13 am

      @Central Planning:

      I meant, positive about the Harris/Biden ticket,….

      Reply
    36. 36.

      scribbler

      March 26, 2024 at 6:14 am

      @Soprano2:  So sorry this is happening to you both.  Hopefully you can at least get some rest once he has been admitted.

      Reply
    37. 37.

      Ramalama

      March 26, 2024 at 6:21 am

      @Soprano2: does your state or municipality offer any kind of facility for your husband to stay for the day? I know California has adult day care places (which my uncle refused to stay in because his level of dementia caused severe aggression). Can you qualify for some kind of state funding to hire a helper come stay with your husband at your home…giving you some reprieve? Maybe some of us keyboard warriors can look that stuff up for you.

      Reply
    38. 38.

      Soprano2

      March 26, 2024 at 6:23 am

      Thanks guys. The worst thing now is that there is no comfortable chair or sofa for me to lay on. We’re waiting for a room, it could be five minutes or five hours.

      Reply
    39. 39.

      Princess

      March 26, 2024 at 6:24 am

      @Melancholy Jaques: my theory is he thinks Democrats ruined his sex life somehow. Something something lockdowns mask mandates, I don’t know. It fits with the ex-boyfriend vibes.

      Reply
    40. 40.

      Baud

      March 26, 2024 at 6:25 am

      @Soprano2:

      At least you have us. In the old days, you’d be forced to sit their with nothing to do.

      Reply
    41. 41.

      David 🌈 ☘The Establishment☘🌈 Koch

      March 26, 2024 at 6:27 am

      @AxelFoley: Would of been funny if it was hit by a rocket’s red glare

      Reply
    42. 42.

      Soprano2

      March 26, 2024 at 6:27 am

      @Ramalama: I’m going to talk to the social worker at the hospital or his doctor’s office. I have lists of home health care companies from the local office on aging, as well as  lists of adult daycares. I was waiting until his doctor’s appointment, which was supposed to be tomorrow. In order to get benefits from his health plan the doctor has to order it. My manager at the bar told me he would help me with putting cameras in the house.

      Reply
    43. 43.

      mrmoshpotato

      March 26, 2024 at 6:28 am

      @Baud: You’re being nice.

      Reply
    44. 44.

      Soprano2

      March 26, 2024 at 6:29 am

      @Baud: That’s true, I might have had some old magazines.

      Reply
    45. 45.

      David 🌈 ☘The Establishment☘🌈 Koch

      March 26, 2024 at 6:30 am

      @Melancholy Jaques:

      He gives off a very strong ex-boyfriend vibe.

      He even posted quasi revenge porn of Biden (link)

      Reply
    46. 46.

      David 🌈 ☘The Establishment☘🌈 Koch

      March 26, 2024 at 6:36 am

      @Baud: She’s sitting with us – hasnt she suffered enough?

      Reply
    47. 47.

      lowtechcyclist

      March 26, 2024 at 6:36 am

      @AxelFoley: ​
       

      Holy shit…I hope they were able to rescue those poor people who were driving on the bridge when it collapsed.

      But my WAG is that a lot of them were killed by the force of the impact when their cars hit the water.

      Holy shit, those poor people.

      Reply
    48. 48.

      raven

      March 26, 2024 at 6:40 am

      @Soprano2: I suppose you have looked into the VA?

      Reply
    49. 49.

      Princess

      March 26, 2024 at 6:43 am

      @David 🌈 ☘The Establishment☘🌈 Koch: Oooo, that’s bitter.

      Reply
    50. 50.

      lowtechcyclist

      March 26, 2024 at 6:51 am

      @Soprano2: So sorry to hear about this latest turn of events!  All I can say is good luck, and my thoughts are with you and your husband.

      Reply
    51. 51.

      catclub

      March 26, 2024 at 6:52 am

      @piratedan: yet the evidence over the last two weeks shows that he can, so why push the article?

       

      Because it was dated nov 2023 but pushed now as clickbait for people like you and me.

      Reply
    52. 52.

      Baud

      March 26, 2024 at 6:53 am

      @catclub:

      Happens a lot with social media.

      Reply
    53. 53.

      catclub

      March 26, 2024 at 7:00 am

      @Baud: Speaking of social media. CNN is laughing at Trump’s latest claims about the NYSE.

      Claimed that he did not list his new stock on the NYSE because it is in New York, which is terrible for business.  But his stock is listed on the NASDAQ, which is also in New York.

       

      And there was a sad top man at NYSE  begging him to list there. All the top people now at NYSE are women.

      Reply
    54. 54.

      lowtechcyclist

      March 26, 2024 at 7:00 am

      @piratedan: ​
       

      tbf, I can understand Nate’s POV, I really can. IF Biden can’t run a normal campaign, yet the evidence over the last two weeks shows that he can, so why push the article? Why run the clickbait?

      I can’t. Even before the past two weeks, there was approximately zero reason to believe that Biden couldn’t run a normal campaign, other than chuffing on all his media buddies’ “Biden is old” fumes.

      It’s always been a hell of a lot more likely that Trump, just 3.5 years younger than Biden but in far worse shape physically (and apparently mentally), would be the one to be unable to conduct a normal campaign.

      Nate Silver should just go away and disappear. Unfortunately, once somebody’s become a member of the Major Media Pundits Club, it’s nearly impossible to dislodge them. It’s like having tenure.

      Reply
    55. 55.

      Nina

      March 26, 2024 at 7:03 am

      I used to take that bridge to work every day. We’ve been ordered back into the office as of 2 weeks from today, and my commute just got longer.

      My quick amateur economic impact analysis – ships won’t be able to enter or leave the bay from the inner harbor, Port of Baltimore, or Curtis Bay Coast Guard yard for some time to come. They can still get in and out from Sparrows Point, but getting things south from there will be annoying. We may see some of the Port traffic shifting to empty space at Sparrows. Any truck traffic too tall or hazardous for either harbor tunnel will have to route around the west side of the Baltimore beltway, adding perhaps an hour or more to their trip (additional traffic will make rush hours more extreme). Ideal traffic conditions 35 minutes, but there will never again be ideal traffic conditions for the beltway. Bottom line, things in Washington DC from overseas or from north of Baltimore are going to cost more and take longer to get there. Things in the Northeast from south of Baltimore will cost more and take longer to get there.

      Reply
    56. 56.

      Chris T.

      March 26, 2024 at 7:06 am

      @catclub: Well, there’s a technical sense in which NYSE is “in” NY and NASDAQ is “not in” NY, but it’s only true if you look at it in one particular squinty way. Both systems trade all over the place electronically, and both have NYC offices. It’s just that the traditional NYSE trading floor still exists (see https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/09/traders-floor-exchange.asp).

      Don Poorleone is of course lying though.

      Reply
    57. 57.

      Soprano2

      March 26, 2024 at 7:08 am

      @raven: Not yet, but I will be for sure.

      Reply
    58. 58.

      Ramalama

      March 26, 2024 at 7:11 am

      @TBone: Jon Stewart is really good when it comes to skewering the financial sector / Wall Street. He did a lot of that brilliantly in his first go-round on the Daily Show.

      Reply
    59. 59.

      Old Dan and Little Ann

      March 26, 2024 at 7:13 am

      That bridge collapse is scary.  I can’t imagine watching the video knowing your car beat the collapse by seconds.  The poor people who didn not, though.  Ugh.

      Reply
    60. 60.

      MomSense

      March 26, 2024 at 7:13 am

      @Soprano2:

      Hugs coming your way.  Really sorry you are going through all this.

      Reply
    61. 61.

      Ramalama

      March 26, 2024 at 7:14 am

      @Soprano2: Will you be sure to send up an SOS if you ever need help researching / investigating (online or over the phone) options options to keep you and hubby safe? I’m online all the time (work) but would be happy to mix things up to help out. If that’s at all useful to you.

      Reply
    62. 62.

      pat

      March 26, 2024 at 7:15 am

      @Soprano2:

      Someone might have mentioned this in another thread, but I believe you should be looking for a Memory Care facility.

      My sister went through the same thing, kept him at home as long as she could, cleaned up after he peed on the floor, tried to get him to shower and change his clothes, and finally found a place close enough that she can visit every day.  And since she is a nurse, she can keep track of his meds, which seems to be very important.

      Wishing both of you some relief soon…

      Reply
    63. 63.

      Matt McIrvin

      March 26, 2024 at 7:19 am

      The thing that kind of blunts Digby’s warning about coming fascism from the other thread is that I heard all of those same warnings in 2016-2017 too–Masha Gessen and Sarah Kendzior were basically telling us that American democracy as we knew it was already over and was never coming back; the US was going to be a personalist autocracy similar to a post-Soviet republic from now on–and while there was a lot of damage, we did, to some degree, come back. (Kendzior seems to have adjusted to the failure of these predictions by arguing that, in fact, it did not come back, and the Democrats are secretly all part of the Trumpist autocracy. But few people believe this.)

      Now, you know and I know that they’re planning to go way harder this time, and there’s reason to believe Trump could do things in a second term that he didn’t dare, or was prevented from doing, in the first. (The military was NOT keen on being his personal totalitarian enforcement arm, in particular. But he’s going to try to purge the brass and replace them with loyalists until they will–how successful will he be? I don’t know, but do you want to roll the dice?)

      But will the general public understand that?

      Reply
    64. 64.

      Baud

      March 26, 2024 at 7:24 am

      @Matt McIrvin:

      White people who tell you the fight is over want to help the GOP preserve white racial status. If you’re going to engage in that, at least follow non-white people.

      Reply
    65. 65.

      EarthWindFire

      March 26, 2024 at 7:27 am

      @Soprano2: I’m so sorry. You’ve been through so much.

      Reply
    66. 66.

      comrade scotts agenda of rage

      March 26, 2024 at 7:32 am

      @piratedan:

      I’m tired of the concern trolling posing as journalism.

      That’s been national political “journalism” basically since Al Gore ran for president and an argument could be made it had it’s origins during the Clinton years.

      Practically every national political “journalist” that I’ve seen come up since 2000 has either started out as a douche or turned into one ala Silver.

      Reply
    67. 67.

      Matt McIrvin

      March 26, 2024 at 7:33 am

      What the Baltimore disaster is reminding me of is the 1982 Air Florida crash in Washington DC, when a plane trying to take off with with ice-laden wings scraped a bunch of vehicles off the 14th Street Bridge and went into the river. The bridge didn’t go down, but the loss of life was greater because of the airliner crash.

      Reply
    68. 68.

      Scout211

      March 26, 2024 at 7:33 am

      @Soprano2: I’m so sorry.  I hope today is a better day for both of you.  Sending strength your way.

      Reply
    69. 69.

      JPL

      March 26, 2024 at 7:34 am

      @Soprano2: I’m so sorry and hopefully you both find relief soon.

      Reply
    70. 70.

      OzarkHillbilly

      March 26, 2024 at 7:37 am

      @Soprano2: Shit.

      Reply
    71. 71.

      comrade scotts agenda of rage

      March 26, 2024 at 7:37 am

      @lowtechcyclist:

      Unfortunately, once somebody’s become a member of the Major Media Pundits Club, it’s nearly impossible to dislodge them. It’s like having tenure.

      Or an untreatable venereal disease. I consider clowns like Silver, Little Ezra plus the Usual Suspects like David Fucking Brooks, George Fucking Will, Chuck Fucking Todd, et. al. to be an STD on a already highly diseased media environment.

      Reply
    72. 72.

      Betty Cracker

      March 26, 2024 at 7:38 am

      The FSK Bridge collapse in Balmer sounds similar to the Skyway Bridge collapse in Tampa Bay, which happened when I was in 9th or 10th grade. A tanker hit that bridge during a storm. It was surreal.

      @Soprano2: What a hellish situation. I hope they get y’all squared away soon. I hate hospitals, but sometimes getting admitted can be a catalyst for a better care plan. I hope it shakes out that way for you.

      Reply
    73. 73.

      Ken

      March 26, 2024 at 7:39 am

      Wikipedia has already updated the Francis Scott Key Bridge article to say it “was” a steel arch, “was” the third longest span, etc., and they’ve added an article on the collapse.  There are times those volunteers terrify me with their efficiency — the most recent being when Queen Elizabeth died, and hundreds of articles were updated within hours to refer to King Charles.

      @Matt McIrvin, @Betty Cracker: The article on the collapse has links to similar incidents, including the Skyway.

      Reply
    74. 74.

      Suzanne

      March 26, 2024 at 7:39 am

      @Baud:

      White people who tell you the fight is over want to help the GOP preserve white racial status. 

      I don’t believe that.

      What I do believe is that there’s, like, an intensity bias. A drama bias, if you will. A tendency to believe the things that are the most extreme possible versions of the narrative. It’s like a social version of Main Character Syndrome.

      Reply
    75. 75.

      Scout211

      March 26, 2024 at 7:39 am

      @lowtechcyclist: I can’t. Even before the past two weeks, there was approximately zero reason to believe that Biden couldn’t run a normal campaign, other than chuffing on all his media buddies’ “Biden is old” fumes.

      I agree.  Especially since four years ago, due to COVID restrictions, Biden did not run a “normal” campaign, and he won.  Trump ran close to a normal campaign, with rallies and appearances all over the country.  And he lost.

      So Nate Silver seems to forgetting history while predicting the future.

      Reply
    76. 76.

      Manyakitty

      March 26, 2024 at 7:39 am

      @Soprano2: so much to worry about. Stay strong and remember you’re not alone. Sending love.

      Reply
    77. 77.

      comrade scotts agenda of rage

      March 26, 2024 at 7:40 am

      @Soprano2:

      I’m amazed I make sense, I’ve been up almost 24 hours.

      Hopefully you can power nap, chair or no chair.  It’s amazing what even 20-30 minutes can do.

      Good luck.

      Reply
    78. 78.

      The Thin Black Duke

      March 26, 2024 at 7:41 am

      @Baud: I’m sorry.

      Reply
    79. 79.

      Scout211

      March 26, 2024 at 7:43 am

      Update, two people have been rescued from the water.

      Reply
    80. 80.

      Betty Cracker

      March 26, 2024 at 7:45 am

      Video of the bridge collapse. Damn!

      Reply
    81. 81.

      kalakal

      March 26, 2024 at 7:46 am

      @TBone: It was a continuous truss bridge – each section is rigidly connected – remove one and the entire structure is liable to go.

      The pictures are horrifying, I see it happened at about 1:30 am. Does anyone know how busy the bridge is at that time? The poor people crossing it I fear had little chance

      Reply
    82. 82.

      opiejeanne

      March 26, 2024 at 7:46 am

      @Scout211: One is in critical condition, the other refused treatment and is thought to be uninjured.

      Reply
    83. 83.

      Baud

      March 26, 2024 at 7:46 am

      @Suzanne:

      IM unscientific, anecdotal HO, I think negative intensity has a racial bias that disproportionately affects white people. Much of it is probably subconscious, but I believe it stems from the same societal changes that affect MAGA.

      Reply
    84. 84.

      opiejeanne

      March 26, 2024 at 7:48 am

      @kalakal: They’re looking for seven individuals, and one vehicle may have been a semi.

      Reply
    85. 85.

      Baud

      March 26, 2024 at 7:53 am

      @opiejeanne:

      That’s amazing.

      Reply
    86. 86.

      Baud

      March 26, 2024 at 7:53 am

      Not sure if this crash would have happened in the daytime, but the tragedy would have been far worse if it did.

      Reply
    87. 87.

      Soprano2

      March 26, 2024 at 7:54 am

      @pat: I’m going to talk to the elder law attorney about that on Thursday. I’ve been told I should get on the list for any place I might want since sometimes it takes a year or more to get a spot. I’ve been thinking about it, him being safe and taken care of is the most important thing. He’ll do things for other people that he won’t do for me.

      Reply
    88. 88.

      kalakal

      March 26, 2024 at 7:55 am

      @Matt McIrvin: If he tried to use the military to gun down protesters it would collapse. Some would do it willingly, some would be ‘only following orders’, many would refuse. They’d be carrying out war crimes and it would be filmed and shown around the world. Also he may change the top commanders but has he looked at the composition of the US military lately,?

      Nearly all military coups are not carried out by the senior commanders who he’d want to replace, it’s the middle ranks, the majors and colonels who are the drivers

      Reply
    89. 89.

      Enhanced Voting Techniques

      March 26, 2024 at 7:56 am

      @Baud:That just does not happen. Captain and company are going to be in a world of hurt.

      The ship would have been under the orders of a pilot from the port who is supposed to know the harbor so these things don’t happen.

      Reply
    90. 90.

      Matt McIrvin

      March 26, 2024 at 7:56 am

      @Suzanne: But then, on the other side, there are all the normies who basically believe none of this matters much and the future will be like the past, and most of them are white too. The Cult of the Savvy attitude you see in pundit shows and newspaper op-eds.

      That attitude reigned supreme in 2016, with all the confident predictions that either Trump’s campaign was going to crap out somehow, or that as President he’d be a showy figurehead with some sage eminence grise really running the show. And I see it in all the horserace punditry about 2024 that still, after all this time, treats Donald Trump as if he were a normal presidential candidate rather than an obvious would-be autocrat.

      Reply
    91. 91.

      kalakal

      March 26, 2024 at 7:57 am

      @opiejeanne: thank you, that’s awful but much lower than I feared

      Reply
    92. 92.

      eclare

      March 26, 2024 at 7:59 am

      @Baud:

      CNN is now reporting that lights on the ship flickered several times before it hit the bridge, and there was black smoke, reinforcing what you wrote earlier that Reddit had been saying about possible mechanical problems.

      Reply
    93. 93.

      Soprano2

      March 26, 2024 at 8:00 am

      @Betty Cracker: My mouth fell open watching that. Even as tired as I am that was horrifying. It looked like something you’d see in a movie.

      Reply
    94. 94.

      Betty

      March 26, 2024 at 8:00 am

      @Soprano2: Joining the others here in sending good wishes and prayers for the situation to improve. Going from having a partner to help you with daily living to having a partner with significant needs is incredibly stressful. Hoping you are able to find a good solution for both of you..

      Reply
    95. 95.

      SiubhanDuinne

      March 26, 2024 at 8:03 am

      @JoyceH:

      I remember the brief and highly unattractive white lipstick craze back in the ‘60s and that’s what immediately came to mind.

      Yes!! That’s exactly what I thought too. What a bizarre, if harmless, fad that was.

      Reply
    96. 96.

      JML

      March 26, 2024 at 8:04 am

      That bridge collapse is giving me flashbacks to the I-35 bridge collapse in Minneapolis from 2007. I drove across that bridge twice a day for my work commute and could have easily been on it when it went down. When a bridge goes, it goes fast and scary.

      Reply
    97. 97.

      Enhanced Voting Techniques

      March 26, 2024 at 8:05 am

      @Matt McIrvin: the US was going to be a personalist autocracy similar to a post-Soviet republic from now on

      Because the Soviet Union Republics where are fully functioning democracies previous to the 90s and not just regional administrative units staffed by central committee favorites as personal fiefdoms?

      Reply
    98. 98.

      Kay

      March 26, 2024 at 8:05 am

      There would have been a (Baltimore) harbor pilot, right? That person knows why the ship hit the bridge.

      Reply
    99. 99.

      pat

      March 26, 2024 at 8:05 am

      I just looked at the track the ship took, and it veered suddenly and headed straight for the post. Looks like sudden loss of control.  And it sits there now with a bridge lying on its deck… Not going anywhere for a while, I bet.

      I think I saw those at WaPo.

      And to think of what might have happened during the rush hour.  Yikes.  Remember the (much smaller) bridge collapse years ago in Minneapolis?

      eta:JML got there first.

      Reply
    100. 100.

      Spanky

      March 26, 2024 at 8:06 am

      The FSK bridge is part of Baltimore’s loop, and thankfully its about the least traveled part. Through traffic is handled by 95 and 895, thankfully.

      Current air temp 40 miles south of there is 39F, and I doubt the water temps are much higher. I can’t believe they found anyone alive.

      Reply
    101. 101.

      Ken

      March 26, 2024 at 8:06 am

      @Soprano2: Oh lord. I hadn’t thought of what the conspiracy-minded types might do with this. “The collapse footage is CGI, and the people that were ‘rescued’ are crisis actors” is probably the saner end of the spectrum.

      Reply
    102. 102.

      Kay

      March 26, 2024 at 8:07 am

      @Soprano2:

      So sorry you’re in this and hope they get him a bed soon.

      Reply
    103. 103.

      opiejeanne

      March 26, 2024 at 8:07 am

      @Soprano2: I’m so sorry you’re going through this. We’ve been there with parents and it’s just so draining. Please take care of yourself.

      Reply
    104. 104.

      Spanky

      March 26, 2024 at 8:08 am

      @Kay: Reports say 2 pilots on board.

      Reply
    105. 105.

      TBone

      March 26, 2024 at 8:08 am

      In the “Know Your PA Criminals” Department:

      https://www.inquirer.com/politics/election/jeff-yass-pennsylvania-billionaire-susquehanna-international-group-tiktok-investor-20240325.html

      Reply
    106. 106.

      SiubhanDuinne

      March 26, 2024 at 8:08 am

      @Soprano2:

      OMG, I can’t even fathom what you must be going through right now. I’m so sorry. I hope they can get your hub stabilised, and I hope before long you’re able to get some quality sleep. Thinking of you. Hugs.

      Reply
    107. 107.

      narya

      March 26, 2024 at 8:12 am

      @Soprano2: Hope this doesn’t sound weird, but I’m glad you continue to update us. I’ve been thinking of you and hoping you and your husband get the respite and care you need.

      Reply
    108. 108.

      kalakal

      March 26, 2024 at 8:13 am

      @Soprano2: So sorry to hear this. My best wishes and hopes to you both

      Reply
    109. 109.

      trnc

      March 26, 2024 at 8:14 am

      Great Stoddard article, but it seems like a stretch to claim in March that DT drove McConnell to agree to drop his leadership post after the election.

      Reply
    110. 110.

      Dorothy A. Winsor

      March 26, 2024 at 8:14 am

      @Soprano2: I’m so sorry. I hope you can at least get some sleep soon.

      As you may know, I live in an over-55 condo bldg. There’s an assisted living/memory care building attached, and I see people like your husband moving there when it’s no longer safe or feasible for them to live in this bldg. It’s a hard decision, but in the long run, you just can’t leave things going on the way they are.

      Reply
    111. 111.

      SFAW

      March 26, 2024 at 8:16 am

      @David 🌈 ☘The Establishment☘🌈 Koch:

      No, it wouldn’t. And, yes, it’s too fucking soon for that shit.

      Reply
    112. 112.

      catclub

      March 26, 2024 at 8:16 am

      @Ken: “The collapse footage is CGI, and the people that were ‘rescued’ are crisis actors” is probably the saner end of the spectrum.

       

      So Biden did this to emphasize that he is in charge and terrible things happen on his watch. Makes perfect sense in the QA world.

      Reply
    113. 113.

      Matt McIrvin

      March 26, 2024 at 8:17 am

      @Enhanced Voting Techniques: To be fair, large chunks of the United States at the state level are not fully functioning democracies, and this affects national politics. But we do have different expectations.

      Reply
    114. 114.

      SFAW

      March 26, 2024 at 8:17 am

      @Soprano2: Keeping my fingers crossed for you and Mr. Soprano2.

      Reply
    115. 115.

      trnc

      March 26, 2024 at 8:18 am

      @Soprano2: Wow! Sending positive vibes your way.

      Reply
    116. 116.

      Kay

      March 26, 2024 at 8:18 am

      The two NBC executives who made the decision to hire Ronna McDaniel came from the NYTimes and Politico.

      Perfect.

      Reply
    117. 117.

      a thousand flouncing lurkers (was fidelio)

      March 26, 2024 at 8:19 am

      @Betty Cracker:

      This Wikipedia entry is for the ship that hit the Sunshine Skyway, rather than the bridge itself; it gets to the accident quicker.

      At least there wasn’t a bus on the bridge this time.

      Reply
    118. 118.

      catclub

      March 26, 2024 at 8:19 am

      @Chris T.: ​
        I would assume they are both Delaware corporations. Everything is.

      Reply
    119. 119.

      Barbara

      March 26, 2024 at 8:22 am

      @TBone: Indeed, tell it to Marilyn Moseby, the former DA of Baltimore who stretched the truth to get pandemic related benefits and was duly convicted of federal offenses in the last month.  Sums involved were in the 10s of thousands, not millions.

      Reply
    120. 120.

      SFAW

      March 26, 2024 at 8:22 am

      @catclub: ​
       

      I would assume they are both Delaware corporations.

      Biden’s Deep State goes even deeper than originally imagined.

      Reply
    121. 121.

      catclub

      March 26, 2024 at 8:22 am

      @trnc: I think McConnell is dropping out of leadership because fundraising has changed under Trump. If the GOP moneybags are all in on Trump, there is no place for McConnell – who is Minority leader because he is the biggest fundraiser.

       

      Also because he is old and possibly sick.

      Reply
    122. 122.

      a thousand flouncing lurkers (was fidelio)

      March 26, 2024 at 8:23 am

      @Soprano2: I’m so sorry; I know this is awful for both of you.

      Reply
    123. 123.

      Barbara

      March 26, 2024 at 8:24 am

      @Soprano2: Thinking of you.

      Reply
    124. 124.

      trnc

      March 26, 2024 at 8:26 am

      Was there some day last week when everyone forgot how conditional statements work? It’s good that Biden’s been more active and done more media and that seems consistent with the thesis of this post?

      Silver doesn’t get it. Where is his post demanding that DT should drop out? On top of that, after planting the idea that Biden can’t run a “normal” campaign, we get a diatribe about how campaigning in general needs to change.

      Reply
    125. 125.

      Kay

      March 26, 2024 at 8:27 am

      @catclub:

      The MAGAS – rank and file – really hate McDonnell. They think “the establishment” shackled Trump and kept many of his most vicious and mean spirited ideas from coming to fruition. They’re probably right about that. As bad as Republicans were it will be 10X worse the second round. They’ll know he can’t be stopped this time. What are we going to do? Threaten impeachment? Tell them he’ll be prosecuted maybe sometime in the next decade? They don’t give a shit.

      He can’t win. It’s catastrophic if he does.

      Reply
    126. 126.

      catclub

      March 26, 2024 at 8:27 am

      @catclub: yes. I checked. both delaware corporations.

      Reply
    127. 127.

      Brit in Chicago

      March 26, 2024 at 8:28 am

      @Baud: There will be lawyers.

      Reply
    128. 128.

      Geo Wilcox

      March 26, 2024 at 8:28 am

      @Baud: If you watch the video carefully there were two power outages as the ship was approaching the bridge. That may have had something to do with it looking like it lost its steering ability.

      Reply
    129. 129.

      Barbara

      March 26, 2024 at 8:29 am

      @Splitting Image: ​I think Nate aspired to being more than a numbers cruncher and is one of those people who got so used to being the smartest person in the room he never understood the limits of his talent. A lot of people are like that.

      Reply
    130. 130.

      schrodingers_cat

      March 26, 2024 at 8:29 am

      @Soprano2: Being a caregiver is hard, please take care of yourself.

      Reply
    131. 131.

      catclub

      March 26, 2024 at 8:30 am

      @trnc: Please note that Silver’s quote  was from november, 2023 was pulled by someone looking for click bait and outrage generation. It worked.

       

      I have no idea if Biden’s campaigning in Nov 2023 was conventional.

      Reply
    132. 132.

      artem1s

      March 26, 2024 at 8:30 am

      And then last week, Trump’s legal fee scam came to light

      Last week? How does the saying go? Only a dishonest man can get conned? The GOP got conned because at their core they aren’t honest. They knew he’d been scraping off campaign money since 2015. They knew he was getting money from foreign donors since 2015. They figured he’d take the fall and they would still have the power of the WH to run their own grifts. I think Darth Cheney and Karl Rove was doing this back as far as 2000. Last week my ass.

      Reply
    133. 133.

      comrade scotts agenda of rage

      March 26, 2024 at 8:30 am

      @Kay: ​
       

      The two NBC executives who made the decision to hire Ronna McDaniel came from the NYTimes and Politico.

      That could be a Pitchbot headline. Once again, satire can’t keep up with reality.

      Reply
    134. 134.

      NotMax

      March 26, 2024 at 8:31 am

      @pat

      When the ship hits the span….

      Reply
    135. 135.

      Kay

      March 26, 2024 at 8:31 am

      @catclub:

      It’s the serfdom aspect that kills me. How we’ll have to rely on the whims of Trump’s wealthy backers to rein him in. That pleading sound of media and institutionalists when they’re watching these lunatics act like maniacs and just hoping they don’t decide to take the country down. We’ll all be beggars, including the Trump voters. I can’t bear it.

      Reply
    136. 136.

      OzarkHillbilly

      March 26, 2024 at 8:32 am

      @Brit in Chicago: The company lawyers are already hard at work to limit their liability.

      Reply
    137. 137.

      skerry

      March 26, 2024 at 8:33 am

      @Spanky: While it’s  true that the tunnels take most of the traffic north/south, the Key bridge was vital for semi traffic. Semis having to divert west/north around the loop will mess up traffic for everyone.

      Reply
    138. 138.

      Kay

      March 26, 2024 at 8:33 am

      @Brit in Chicago:

      I looked up the ship’s managers – there’s an owner too but the owner would pay the manager for operations, staffing, repairs, etc. They’re out of Singapore with “a strong safety culture” at their org. Hmmm.

      Reply
    139. 139.

      OzarkHillbilly

      March 26, 2024 at 8:34 am

      @NotMax: Ooooooofff….

      Reply
    140. 140.

      rikyrah

      March 26, 2024 at 8:35 am

      Good Morning Everyone 😊😊😊

      Reply
    141. 141.

      Matt McIrvin

      March 26, 2024 at 8:35 am

      @catclub: I think that late last year there was a lot of “where is Biden?” going on because he was doing his job and his reelection campaign hadn’t kicked into high gear yet. I don’t think Biden saw the primary challenges to him as a serious threat, and they weren’t.

      Reply
    142. 142.

      SFAW

      March 26, 2024 at 8:36 am

      @skerry:

      I read somewhere that a lot of hazmat truck traffic used it, because they’re not allowed in the tunnels.

      Reply
    143. 143.

      Soprano2

      March 26, 2024 at 8:36 am

      @Kay: I saw a post on Facebook from a friend who is a TFG supporter. It was about how it was good that the Russians beat the people that were arrested for the attack this week, why don’t we do that to felons we arrest? They can’t wait for TFG to start hurting people they don’t like.

      Reply
    144. 144.

      pat

      March 26, 2024 at 8:37 am

      @skerry:

      And hazardous loads are not allowed in the tunnel.

      Reply
    145. 145.

      trnc

      March 26, 2024 at 8:38 am

      @catclub: Yeah, I’m going with old and sick. He’ll be lucky to get through the rest of the current term without more serious public glitches, so there’s no way he could imagine another 6 year term. When you consider the very real possibility that Biden wins but repubs take the senate, I don’t think MM would turn down that opportunity to continue sticking it to dems if it weren’t for his health.

      Reply
    146. 146.

      Soprano2

      March 26, 2024 at 8:38 am

      @Kay: No one will be able to rein him in if he gets elected again.

      Reply
    147. 147.

      SFAW

      March 26, 2024 at 8:39 am

      @Soprano2: ​

      Excellent idea, maybe. Let’s start by having police beat TFG supporters, to extract confessions about their insurrection-supporting activity.
      Or maybe have leopards do it?
      ETA: Not serious of course, but maybe you could suggest that scenario to your friend.

      Reply
    148. 148.

      Ken

      March 26, 2024 at 8:40 am

      @NotMax: Boo, hiss. Won’t keep me from stealing it, of course.

      Reply
    149. 149.

      Soprano2

      March 26, 2024 at 8:40 am

      @SFAW: They never think that kind of thing will be directed against them.

      Reply
    150. 150.

      Another Scott

      March 26, 2024 at 8:41 am

      @Soprano2: It can be hard to keep oldsters juicy enough.  ☹️. I’m glad you are able to get some help.  Best of luck, and keep us informed.

      Rest

      Best wishes,
      Scott.

      Reply
    151. 151.

      trnc

      March 26, 2024 at 8:42 am

      @catclub: Please note that Silver’s quote was from november, 2023 was pulled by someone looking for click bait and outrage generation. It worked.

      Yes, but Silver responded to it yesterday, so it’s fair to note that he’s still letting the Biden slag hang out there without making a similar demand that DT step aside. In fact, it should be even easier today for him to update that idea, given what we’ve seen from DT in the last 5 months.

      Reply
    152. 152.

      trnc

      March 26, 2024 at 8:43 am

      @NotMax: Oh, snap!

      Reply
    153. 153.

      Kay

      March 26, 2024 at 8:46 am

      @Soprano2:

      They were super excited when they thought Trump was bringing in the military to attack AA protestors in DC. That was sort of the institutional GOP too though, I guess. Remember Tom Cotton wanted to shut down BLM protests by sending in the military to attack them? Authoritarian NUTJOBS.

      I don’t think the military will attack us but I guarantee county and city law enforcement will.

      Reply
    154. 154.

      kalakal

      March 26, 2024 at 8:46 am

      @Soprano2: Exactly, they always see themselves as wearing the jackboots

      Reply
    155. 155.

      JML

      March 26, 2024 at 8:48 am

      @catclub: It doesn’t change the fact that Silver hasn’t produced anything of note in years and has fallen into bog-standard political punditry. As it relates to politics, he had one good idea (poll aggregation to get more reliable/likely results) and since then 538 really hasn’t done much that’s particularly noteworthy and Silver isn’t even there any longer, so how much of his social media is just about him trying to stay relevant? (I’d say it’s a LOT)

      Bet he plays more poker these days than trying to build mathematical models to explain political trends…

      Reply
    156. 156.

      Baud

      March 26, 2024 at 8:48 am

      @rikyrah:

      Good morning.

      Reply
    157. 157.

      Kay

      March 26, 2024 at 8:51 am

      @trnc:

      I used to defend Nate Silver but then Me Too and BLM and Covid happened and, like many white middle aged male pundits and essayists, he broke. These people aren’t resilient. They can’t handle change or challenges. Why is he so bitter? My God, he rode adding up numbers and taking an average for a decade. What does he want? Is he entitled to something he isn’t getting?

      Reply
    158. 158.

      Matt McIrvin

      March 26, 2024 at 8:52 am

      @JML: The state-poll aggregation wasn’t even his idea–Sam Wang and Andrew Tannenbaum had been doing versions of it before him, and doing it better.

      And it also turned out that the technique’s skill at predicting presidential elections was more a small-number run of luck than an actual inherent property. It just happened that the first several elections the idea was applied to were well-suited to it.

      Reply
    159. 159.

      Miss Bianca

      March 26, 2024 at 9:06 am

      @Soprano2: I’m so sorry to hear this. Somehow I missed the news that hubby was back in the hospital. :(

      Reply
    160. 160.

      Soprano2

      March 26, 2024 at 9:07 am

      @Miss Bianca: It just happened last night. We’re still waiting for a room.

      Reply
    161. 161.

      TBone

      March 26, 2024 at 9:08 am

      @Barbara: grrrrrrrr

      Reply
    162. 162.

      Matt McIrvin

      March 26, 2024 at 9:24 am

      @Kay:

      I don’t think the military will attack us but I guarantee county and city law enforcement will.

      Trump had his versions of the “little green men” too, paramilitary forces who are hard to identify and that seem to come out of nowhere–remember the ones in DC during the George Floyd protests who turned out to be Texas prison guards?

      Reply
    163. 163.

      artem1s

      March 26, 2024 at 9:25 am

      @Enhanced Voting Techniques: ​
       

      @Baud:That just does not happen. Captain and company are going to be in a world of hurt.

      The ship would have been under the orders of a pilot from the port who is supposed to know the harbor so these things don’t happen.

      The deep water channels in these ports of entry are marked well too. They are set up so the captains/pilots know exactly where the channel is. If it’s not mechanical failure, it’s negligence. That ship ran right into the middle of pylon. It wasn’t in the channel at all.

      Reply
    164. 164.

      evodevo

      March 26, 2024 at 9:27 am

      @Matt McIrvin:  yeah…I still remember the video of that woman in the freezing water with all the bystanders yelling advice, until finally one guy jumped in to rescue her when she looked like she was going down the last time…awful…

      Reply
    165. 165.

      Matt McIrvin

      March 26, 2024 at 9:30 am

      @evodevo: That was a terrible day–I remember the schools closing early from the ice, but still having a hard time getting home from school, and then hearing about the plane crash. There was a fatal Metro crash on the same day, completely unrelated and it got kind of overshadowed in the local news.

      Reply
    166. 166.

      Paul in KY

      March 26, 2024 at 9:35 am

      @Baud: Was the ship blasting its air horns to alert traffic? it’s going slow I assume, so there might have been 30 secs or so from ‘malfunction’ to impact. Just a horrible thing!

      Reply
    167. 167.

      Paul in KY

      March 26, 2024 at 9:36 am

      @Soprano2: It’s a bitch, but you just have to be on him about drinking. One good thing might be that if he can’t remember drinking previously, he’ll just think this is 1st one and won’t complain.

      Reply
    168. 168.

      Paul in KY

      March 26, 2024 at 9:37 am

      @TBone: Good point.

      Reply
    169. 169.

      Miss Bianca

      March 26, 2024 at 9:43 am

      @Soprano2: Oh, no! On top of everything else, the waiting is excruciating. Well, we will do our best to divert you.

      Reply
    170. 170.

      Paul in KY

      March 26, 2024 at 9:45 am

      @pat: I wonder if it was some kind of criminal action? Needs to be checked out (as I’m sure it will be).

      Reply
    171. 171.

      Paul in KY

      March 26, 2024 at 9:49 am

      @Another Scott: My mother is 98+ and it’s a chore to keep her hydrated. She hates water and drinks tea mostly. We give her juice at all 3 meals. She balks at drinking it from time to time and we have to insist. Gets very tiring.

      Reply
    172. 172.

      Paul in KY

      March 26, 2024 at 9:51 am

      @evodevo: That guy was a real hero.

      Reply
    173. 173.

      a thousand flouncing lurkers (was fidelio)

      March 26, 2024 at 9:52 am

      @Geo Wilcox: The tide was still going out at that point, too—I checked online tide tables and low tide was around 1:50 AM and the collision around 1:35 AM. If they lost way for some reason they were vulnerable to the currents.

      Reply
    174. 174.

      catclub

      March 26, 2024 at 9:53 am

      @JML: he had one good idea (poll aggregation to get more reliable/likely results) and since then 538 really hasn’t done much that’s particularly noteworthy\

       

      One good idea is a lot!  They said about the same thing about Einstein after general relativity.

      Reply
    175. 175.

      Betty Cracker

      March 26, 2024 at 9:54 am

      @a thousand flouncing lurkers (was fidelio): We used to fish under that bridge a lot during the aughties and 2010s. The massive concrete bumpers installed around the piers of the new bridge looked like they could keep any ship off. Maybe all major bridges with lots of ship traffic should have those.

      Reply
    176. 176.

      Ramalama

      March 26, 2024 at 9:57 am

      @Kay: It’s almost as if he’s an only child and never had someone close to his age slap him upside the head and call him a dumbass. Not like me and my sibs. Not at all.

      Reply
    177. 177.

      Edmund dantes

      March 26, 2024 at 9:57 am

      @TBone: cantilever design. Once the support is gone the cantilever collapses.

      Reply
    178. 178.

      evodevo

      March 26, 2024 at 10:03 am

      @Paul in KY: I’m 78 and the same…I don’t like drinking out of a water bottle…I load my glass of water up with ice and a squeeze from a fresh lemon slice…makes it much easier to drink up.  Also, I can’t do a lot of water all at once, so I just keep the glass topped up all day.​
      ​
      ​

      Reply
    179. 179.

      JML

      March 26, 2024 at 10:12 am

      @catclub: sure, but a) it wasn’t that original (as noted above), and b) he used it to try and set himself up as the only person who actually understood data as it applied to politics and campaigns (while refusing to actually spend any time learning what people actually did on a campaign).

      He was around and an important part of data analytics moving into the mainstream in sports and his initial work at 538 was good overall and helpful…but it’s been over 10 years since they’ve been anything more than a mediocre pundit shop, stocked with people who all think they’re the smartest person in the room. It shouldn’t be a surprise that ABC non-renewed his contract last year and moved on.

      Reply
    180. 180.

      Uncle Cosmo

      March 26, 2024 at 10:14 am

      I was about to finish a long discourse on the Key Bridge, but my FUCKING COMPUTER ATE IT, so fuckit.

      Reply
    181. 181.

      Eyeroller

      March 26, 2024 at 10:20 am

      @catclub: Einstein had more good ideas than relativity (special and general). He technically won the Nobel Prize for explaining the photoelectric effect, and he also had an important paper on Brownian motion.

      Reply
    182. 182.

      Nina

      March 26, 2024 at 10:22 am

      There were 7 people working on repaving the bridge.  The repaving job has been going on for months, with lane closures at night and on weekends.  Two of those people were pulled from the water.  One is in a local hospital.  The other one ‘refused medical help’.  He can’t be OK after surviving a span collapse and even a few minutes in 47 degree water.  My husband believes he is an undocumented worker who is afraid to go to the hospital because they might check his papers.

      Reply
    183. 183.

      Uncle Cosmo

      March 26, 2024 at 10:24 am

      @SFAW: …a lot of hazmat truck traffic used [the bridge], because they’re not allowed in the tunnels.

      The Key Bridge (no one here ever calls it anything else) has had other occasional issues – in high winds speed limits would be reduced, and in very high winds semis would not even be allowed to traverse it.

      Reply
    184. 184.

      Old School

      March 26, 2024 at 10:25 am

      @Soprano2: Hopefully the doctors can get everything straightened out and that you can get some sleep.

      Reply
    185. 185.

      Queen of Lurkers

      March 26, 2024 at 10:25 am

      @Ramalama: Jon Stewart’s older brother is in finance. I imagine he understands the inner workings of high finance quite well.

      Reply
    186. 186.

      Uncle Cosmo

      March 26, 2024 at 10:47 am

      @JML: I think the classic definition of economists

      People who like to work with numbers but aren’t personable enough to be accountants

      applies even more to statisticians, most of whom can calculate sample sizes and run fancy multivariate tests til the cows come home but have only the barest understanding that

      1) Behind every analysis are a whole passle of preconditions that might not even be verifiable (or falsifiable),
      2) “Statistical significance” and actual significance are often loosely related at best, and
      3) Any analysis may produce results, often not even quantifiable, that imply important real-world consequences for real-life people but cannot be seen when the analyst is too deep into the numbers
      In the first session I used to tell my Stat 101 students** something like –

      No one but a few sick puppies like me does this stuff for fun – we do it as the best (and often the only) way to make some sort of sense out of this imperfect (and often capricious) world we inhabit.

      ** One section per semester, community college, for a few years to relieve the rolling boredom of my well-paying day job.​​

      Reply
    187. 187.

      stinger

      March 26, 2024 at 10:48 am

      @SiubhanDuinne: ​
       

      What a bizarre, if harmless, fad that was.

      It was supposed to make your eyes look bigger (since they’d be the only visible features, I guess). The eye makeup trends of the time added to that.

      Reply
    188. 188.

      a thousand flouncing lurkers (was fidelio)

      March 26, 2024 at 10:55 am

      @Betty Cracker: That sounds like a good idea. I’m sure they’re not cheap, but I’ll bet they’re cheaper than a new bridge that wasn’t in the budget.

      Reply
    189. 189.

      worn

      March 26, 2024 at 11:11 am

      @Soprano2: I am so sorry you are having to go through this. About 3 weeks ago my 80 y.o. father had a fall, which ultimately necessitated taking him to the emergency room. It took 13 hours to get him into a real room in the observation ward, 8 of which were spent in what I can only describe as a storage closet repurposed as a place to stash 8 or 9 gurneyed (sp) patients. It was a nice little taste of hell, albeit at one of the better hospitals here.

      What we learned as a result of the testing done while at OSHU have thrown mine & my siblings lives into the well of disarray.

      Best wishes that you & your husband have a better time of it. Stay strong; it’s can be difficult, especially on a real surfeit of sleep.

      Reply
    190. 190.

      catclub

      March 26, 2024 at 11:20 am

      @Eyeroller: really! I never would have guessed.

       

      Note that I wrote AFTER general relativity.

      Reply
    191. 191.

      schrodingers_cat

      March 26, 2024 at 11:50 am

      @Baud: Bingo!

      Reply
    192. 192.

      dnfree

      March 26, 2024 at 11:59 am

      @Baud: Yes.  Whenever I see an article or comment suggesting that things have to get worse before they can get better (about for instance voting third-party), I generally think it’s a person who doesn’t think things will actually get worse FOR THEM personally.  I think most of those people are probably white males.

      Reply
    193. 193.

      Paul in KY

      March 26, 2024 at 12:04 pm

      @evodevo: My mom doesn’t like water at all. In any form. Think it was from growing up in a place in her childhood where you didn’t drink the tap water.

      Great idea about the water you are drinking. Best wishes to you.

      Reply
    194. 194.

      Paul in KY

      March 26, 2024 at 12:07 pm

      @worn: Best wishes on your father’s recovery and to you and your siblings as you navigate being caretenders. IMO, need all the siblings (in local area) to chip in and physically help.

      Reply
    195. 195.

      Matt McIrvin

      March 26, 2024 at 12:13 pm

      @Eyeroller: Yes, but most of that was before general relativity, and he spent his late career thinking physics had taken a wrong turn and promoting ideas that didn’t quite pan out.

      That said, some of his later collaborations were important, particularly in the 1930s–the “EPR paradox” didn’t overturn quantum mechanics but it did lead to a lot of significant thought about nonlocal correlations and the measurement problem. He also co-wrote one of the earlier major papers on wormholes.

      But that’s a common pattern in theoretical physics–it seems to be a young person’s game.

      Reply
    196. 196.

      Matt McIrvin

      March 26, 2024 at 12:18 pm

      @Uncle Cosmo: There’s also a Francis Scott Key Bridge (“Key Bridge”) in DC, which used to be the most common way my family got downtown, so a lot of this discussion is odd to me for that reason.

      Reply
    197. 197.

      Matt McIrvin

      March 26, 2024 at 12:19 pm

      @Uncle Cosmo: And if you don’t like numbers you can always become a mathematician.

      Reply
    198. 198.

      worn

      March 26, 2024 at 4:10 pm

      @Paul in KY: Many thanks, Paul. We are very much in the maelstrom at the moment. Luckily all of my siblings are indeed here, attempting to conquer & divide within the vagaries of the U.S. medical system.

      There will be no recovery. We are all internalizing his prognosis right now.

      ETA: probably posting into the ether ; demands of my father’s care has my usual dips into BJ happening more sporadically than usual.

      Reply
    199. 199.

      Paul in KY

      March 26, 2024 at 5:18 pm

      @worn: Sure glad to hear that your siblings are all there and willing to help! Just take it one day at a time.

      Reply
    200. 200.

      Ramona

      March 26, 2024 at 7:55 pm

      @Paul in KY: My late friend hated drinking water too but she thought I had a brilliant idea when I started to offer her shot glasses of water. The small quantity didn’t intimidate her as much.

      Reply
    201. 201.

      Ruckus

      March 26, 2024 at 10:38 pm

      @Soprano2:

      I’m trying to remember what paperwork the VA needs and it’s been a long enough time for me that I can’t remember. But really if you don’t know their location near you or he is not already a member the info can be found on line. There are phone numbers to call for assistance. If you have his military records that will help. Once in the service is pretty good, I use the VA and I am pretty happy about the care, the people and what they can do for you.

      All the best for both of you.

      There are a number of vets on BJ, some of us use the VA so do not be afraid to ask, I’ll help guide you as I imagine others will as well.

      Best of luck.

      Reply
    202. 202.

      Paul in KY

      March 27, 2024 at 9:46 am

      @Ramona: That’s a good idea.  Thanks!

      Reply

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