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You are here: Home / Elections 2024 / Open Thread: Biden Live Campaign Event in WI

Open Thread: Biden Live Campaign Event in WI

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Interesting – yesterday CNN cut away from a rousing speech by the President, so if I’m around I’m going to post the YouTube links to his events.

Here’s what CNN decided they didn’t need to show – I’m assuming because it doesn’t fit their narrative:

I’m slogging through work, not feeling it, but it must be done. Here was poor Trixie last night. I didn’t even go out to see the drone show because she was not handling the noise well.

Open Thread: Biden Live Campaign Event in WI

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Reader Interactions

344Comments

  1. 1.

    eclare

    Open thread:  watching Euros.  Germany Spain free football!

    Let’s go Les Bleus!

  3. 3.

    delphinium

    @Baud: You can’t lead a horse to water.

    ETA: Tamara: thanks for showing those headlines in Adam’s post. I had forgotten just how ridiculous the media was about Hillary.

  4. 4.

    TBone

    Oh Trixie, I looked like that last night too 😆 but it was because of too much of everything – ribs, corn on the cob, roasted taters, all on top of too much real Champagne.  I still feel like hiding under a blankie today!

  7. 7.

    TBone

    George Stephanopoulis will help get the word out tonight, unless I miss my guess.  He stands with President Biden to defend democracy, not to tear it to shreds like most of his colleagues!

  10. 10.

    Josie

    In the last thread, I read that small donations help to convince large donors to stay in, so I just sent President Biden my very small donation. I guess every little bit helps.

  11. 11.

    Leto

    @eclare: this has been a really good game!

     

    Regarding CNN coverage: to be expected. When you wonder why the normies don’t see him like this, well there you go. They’re not honest, and they’re doing active harm. Same as it ever was.

  12. 12.

    Chris

    Remember the time CNN literally broadcast live video of an empty podium rather than broadcast a speech Hillary Clinton was doing at the same time?  The more things change.

  13. 13.

    delphinium

    @TaMara: Yeah, seeing that those headlines are pretty much identical to what is being pushed now shouldn’t leave anyone in doubt that a lot of the media has a huge thumb on the scale for Trump and wants to take this country down.

  17. 17.

    mrmoshpotato

    @Chris:

    Remember the time CNN literally broadcast live video of an empty podium rather than broadcast a speech Hillary Clinton was doing at the same time? The more things change. 

    Yes!  Fuck ’em!

  19. 19.

    Geoduck

    @delphinium: I don’t know if they consciously want to “take the country down” as much as keep eyeballs and clicks coming. The Shiatgibbon is good for business in the short term, and that’s all that matters.

  22. 22.

    mrmoshpotato

    Poor Trixie.  I hope things weren’t too crazy for too long.

    Had some booms north of Chicago, but nothing too close.  My sister’s pitbull didn’t seem to mind out on the deck.

    I didn’t even see any of the fireworks that were set off last night.

  23. 23.

    Jay

    Annnnnnnd,……LGM is back on the “Biden is Old” train with a remote diagnosis of Parkinsons.

    JFC on a cracker.

  26. 26.

    Jay

    @mrmoshpotato:

    On Canada Day here, there was one small display by one neighbor, we could see at a far distance the “Official” ones in Surrey, New Westminster and Vancouver, but they were short displays as well,

    unlike the warzone this was last year.

    Inflation must be out of control and the economy must suck.

  28. 28.

    Jay

    @Captain C:

    Campos.

    So where did the phrase JFC on a Cracker get it’s purpose as an epethet?

    I mean, that’s just a Communion Wafer.

  29. 29.

    comrade scotts agenda of rage

    @Jay:

    Thank goodness things have returned to “normal” over there.  //

    If it hadn’t, it would have meant the alien pod people had taken over signifying the start of the alien invasion of the planet.

    Oh wait, that might be a good thing.

  30. 30.

    Frequent- lurker

    This doesn’t really surprise me. Several years ago during the k e r r y campaign I saw if memory serves correctly there was an interview with someone associated with the campaign I believe but they started eventually becoming very passionate and their counter arguments towards whoever was interviewing them on CNN and I believe at least once they cut away from a person who was becoming too passionate I believe for their taste and I suspect that CNN did this more than once.

  34. 34.

    delphinium

    @Geoduck: Strictly my opinion but to me the ‘tells’ for unconscious vs conscious are: the continued attacks even after Biden has stated he is staying in, the extremely similar headlines across media for Hillary (per Tamara’s posted pic) now being used against Biden (over a debate performance!), ignoring Biden’s speeches while ‘cleaning up’ Trump’s, media shutting down comments or deleting texts they pushed to promote a false narrative, and of course basically ignoring the most recent SC rulings (not to mention Roe) that  greatly impact this country. Most people have moved on from the debate, while the media continues to harp on it so “eyeballs and clicks” doesn’t cut it for me. But then I’ve been disgusted with our media for quite some time now.

  35. 35.

    Eyeroller

    @Jay: ​Nice to know a lawyer also has a medical degree in neurology or gerontology. Why didn’t he ever tell us?

    Where the fuck does this come from? Because of a somewhat soft voice? Somewhat slowed-down walking?

    Thanks for reminding me why I never read LGM anymore.

  37. 37.

    Jay

    @dc:

    I think it is the blessing placed the cracker that transforms it from being a crappy, flavorless water cracker into a substantiation of the flesh of Jesus,

  39. 39.

    Eyeroller

    @delphinium: Oh, this is a fully coordinated attack.  It is not necessarily a full-blown conspiracy, but it’s been clear for some time that the elite media has always hated Biden and now they are just in a huge circle jerk where they are basically echoing each other.  As noted, they have done this before to candidates they don’t like, nearly all of whom have been Democrats.

  40. 40.

    Chris

    @Jay:

    Knew they would.  They’ve been getting too much pushback from their commenters, which means they have to double down.

  46. 46.

    rikyrah

     

    Uppity Black Faerie Gothmother of Metal 🖤 (@FountainPenDiva) posted at 0:29 PM on Fri, Jul 05, 2024:

    #mouthypolitics101

     

    The more I thought about Kevin Roberts not so veiled threat, the madder I became. That smug, self-righteous prick is trying to terrorize us into accepting his version of theocratic authoritarianism.

     

    Well, he can get FUCKED!!!

     

    Too many Black folks fought,

    bled and died for the basic human right to dignity, respect and equality, and I’m not about to let some arrogant chucklefuck with a god complex make a mockery of their sacrifices.

    I don’t negotiate with terrorists.

     

    (https://x.com/FountainPenDiva/status/1809278316668727749?t=om_6M-Q-S2xwMB5F71kdyg&s=03)

  47. 47.

    Chris

    @delphinium:

    Don’t forget “New York Times giving a soapbox and loudspeaker to a far-right monarchist and Republican activist so that he could tell the New York Times’ audience that he doesn’t vote (a quickly debunked lie) and that they shouldn’t either.  (No similar articles appearing anywhere in the National Review, the Wall Street Journal, or anywhere else where the readers being encouraged to not vote might be Trump supporters).”

    None of this is subtle.  An alien landing on Earth and perusing a few months’ worth of New York Times headlines would have no difficulty concluding “so, they really have their finger on the scale.”  But this is Earth, where we believe our media are crusading liberals, because we saw a movie with Robert Redford and Dustin Hoffman once.

  48. 48.

    Steve in the ATL

    @Eyeroller:
     

    he elite media has always hated Biden

    If I may be pedantic—and just try to stop me!*—the media liked him when he was the senator from MBNA; they didn’t hate him until he become a Democrat president.

    *yes, that’s right—it’s “try to” not “try and”. You’re welcome.

  50. 50.

    comrade scotts agenda of rage

    https://heartlandsignal.com/2024/07/03/opinion-the-biden-news-coverage-requires-less-hysteria-more-journalism/

    The Biden news coverage requires less hysteria, more journalism

    Media critic Jamison Foser nails it: “A lot of things are newsworthy; media companies do not “merely report the news,” they *decide what the news is.* And when it comes to Trump & Biden, the lack of proportionality speaks volumes.”

    Journalist Nikole Hannah-Jones of The New York Times adds this: “As media, we consistently proclaim that we are just reporting the news when in fact we are driving it. What we cover, how we cover it, determines often what Americans thinks is important and *how* they perceive these issues, yet we keep pretending it is not so. If Americans don’t recognize the crisis our democracy is facing, that’s not their fault, it is ours.”

    What’s happened to journalism since the last debate is entirely out of proportion and not in keeping with the responsibilities of a free press. “Feeding frenzy” doesn’t even come close to describing the news media coverage about Joe Biden’s debate performance.

  51. 51.

    Captain C

    @delphinium: In Pinch the Lesser’s case he’s just butthurt that Biden won’t give him an exclusive.  Also, he probably cares more about the lower taxes he’d get under TCFG and figures that he won’t be thrown in the camps with the rest of the “liberal” journalists.  What a sad little incompetent and needy nepo baby he is.

  53. 53.

    Steve in the ATL

    @Baud:
     

    I hope Biden puts ketchup on his hot dog

    I don’t really have a dog in this fight (ha!) but as a Chicago native I feel I have to pie you for this. You probably like the White Sox anyway!

  55. 55.

    rikyrah

     

    Jen “I dissent ” Rubin (@JRubinBlogger) posted at 8:36 AM on Fri, Jul 05, 2024:

     

    Issued by justices who have thrown impartiality and ethics overboard, the most stunning Supreme Court decision of my lifetime, and arguably ever, has changed the structure of our Constitution. The adage “no one is above the law” no longer applies to the president. In our constitutional system, the president was never intended to be a king. That was the entire rationale for the Revolutionary War. And yet, coming three days before July Fourth, the court granted sweeping immunity to the executive. The damage the court has wrought to the very fabric of our democracy is profound.

    wapo.st/3RU2ssC

     

    (https://x.com/JRubinBlogger/status/1809219880278986780?t=hepnqSG9sTj6wiHb3L99UQ&s=03)

  57. 57.

    Captain C

    @Chris:

    Don’t forget “New York Times giving a soapbox and loudspeaker to a far-right monarchist and Republican activist so that he could tell the New York Times’ audience that he doesn’t vote (a quickly debunked lie) and that they shouldn’t either.  (No similar articles appearing anywhere in the National Review, the Wall Street Journal, or anywhere else where the readers being encouraged to not vote might be Trump supporters).”

    I swear the National Enquirer has more journalistic ethics than the FTFNYT, and I say that knowing about the catch-and-kill to protect TCFG that they did.  Maybe they figure they’ll be the official Pravda under a TCFG notional second term.

  58. 58.

    Chris

    @Captain C:

    No.  He would’ve done it anyway.

    I’m sure he is pissed off at Biden for not giving him an interview.  In the same sense that a domestic abuser is pissed off every time somebody in his family doesn’t do what he tells them.  But he would’ve hit them either way.

    Recognizing this is why Biden hasn’t granted the interview, and still shouldn’t.

  60. 60.

    Eyeroller

    @Chris: I cannot, but I don’t want to make a blanket declaration because I’d pay more attention to what they do to Democrats. I do recall some ridicule of Poppy Bush, specifically about the laser scanner incident (which was blown out of proportion), though I don’t think that went as far as what they have done to Democrats.

  61. 61.

    Captain C

    @Chris:

    But this is Earth, where we believe our media are crusading liberals, because we saw a movie with Robert Redford and Dustin Hoffman once.

    A story that the FTFNYC missed and ignored until it became too big.

  62. 62.

    rikyrah

     

     

    Democrat, Environmentalist, & the establishment (@BlueSteelDC) posted at 8:16 AM on Fri, Jul 05, 2024:

    Steps to ensuring Trump 25

     

    1. Remove Pres Biden

    2. Delegitimize the replacement

    3. Utilize procedural tactics to remove the replacement from ballots

    4. Employ procedural tactics to block resources

    5. Conduct whisper campaign with racial undertones

    6. Block 270 electoral votes

    (https://x.com/BlueSteelDC/status/1809214813085618308?t=JscrGTs3rdDHqfwhbtyYMw&s=03)

  63. 63.

    Captain C

    @Chris: Agree 100%.  It’s pretext.  Pinch the Lesser is a bad faith actor with no journalistic ethics and probably few if any ethics in general.

  64. 64.

    Eyeroller

    @Chris: ​ Yep, they haven’t gotten an interview because it was already determined that they were hostile and unfair.

  67. 67.

    Jay

    @Baud:

     

    @Chris:

     

    @Steve in the ATL:

     

    The only dog I have in this fight is French’s Yellow Mustard.

    And the dog has to be grilled, not boiled or soaked in tepid hotdog juice for hours, or rotated in a 7-11 counter for days.

  68. 68.

    Leto

    @eclare: part of why I can’t stand them. It’s just “tikky tacky” for 90 mins. All of them are whiners. It’s irritating to watch. But you know’s fun to watch? M’bappe; that is some beautiful football.

  71. 71.

    delphinium

    @Chris: Oh, trust me, I could have gone on but didn’t want to take over this thread with my lists : ). I noted on a thread yesterday that a lot of the media is basically the “banana in the tailpipe of democracy”. And unfortunately there are still a lot of people who keep falling for that trick.

    ETA

  72. 72.

    Chris

    @Captain C:

    The Washington Post’s behavior was much less flattering than portrayed, too.  Not only did the entire thing amount to “the FBI used us as stenographers,” but the FBI first tried to give the story to the Washington Post’s political desk.  The political desk went straight to the Nixon White House, which assured them it was nothing.  They had to scrounge around for some reporters lower on the totem pole just to get their story out.

    Which speaks volumes about what absolute garbage political media is and always has been.

    People came away from Watergate with the idea that there were these hordes of hungry reporters in all the major newspapers cruising around high places looking for abuses of power to report.  When in reality, the media’s response seems to have largely been “oh cool, we can dine out on this for the next hundred years.

  75. 75.

    Bettencourt

    @Jay: LGM used to be my other main blog read, along with BJ, but I am largely staying away from it for the time being because of BS like this.

    My ongoing lack of respect for Loomis in particular was highlighted recently when one of his grave posts, on Walter Matthau, had the inexplicable error that Matthau appeared in the Mr. Peepers TV pilot under the name “Wally Cox.”

    It’s not just that anyone familiar with popular entertainment of the 50s and 60s knows that Walter Matthau and Wally Cox are to people impossible to mistake for the other, apart from having their names beginning with the first three letters.

    It’s that after multiple readers sent corrections on this truly embarrassing error, Loomis still neglected to correct his post (and this from a historian, no less). And it’s not like he doesn’t read the comment threads – he never hesitates to troll or even ban his readers.

    So I’d like to briefly emerge from decades of lurking to thank the BJ posters and readers for creating a less hysterical space.

  79. 79.

    Captain C

    @Leto: I’d like to see a Spain game with Premier League refs.  My over/under on how many Spanish players collect two yellow cards (and thus a red) for simulation in the game is 2.  I’d bet the over.  And hope for some audio of the PL refs lecturing the Spanish players in the style of Tony Jay.

  82. 82.

    M31

    I don’t know, man, Joe is shouting and being energetic, but it is too energetic? Let’s head to an Ohio diner and ask some GOP operatives what they think

  83. 83.

    mali muso

    Biden rattling off his accomplishments….was i too old to [insert awesome stat], etc.

  85. 85.

    Leto

    @Captain C: I will say that the ref in that game wasn’t having any of it. Lot of yellows, which most were appropriate. Lot of shots of him waving stuff off, calling captains over to tell their players to cut shit out. It was still a really physical, fast paced match which was good.

  88. 88.

    gwangung

    “Biden is too old” is unfalsifiable for many people. No matter what evidence is brought out, it’s always insufficient.

  89. 89.

    delphinium

    @M31: Gods, let’s hope he doesn’t have a ‘Dean Scream’ moment, for then we will surely be DOOMED!

  90. 90.

    schrodingers_cat

    I support Biden for his economic  and foreign policy stances. He does not get enough credit for that either from the left, the media or the Republicans.

  92. 92.

    Leto

    @raven: which is what I am with basketball. Basically every single foul looks ticky tacky to me. A gentle breeze? Two free throws. The shooter jumps into the defender? Two free throws. Defender tries to take the ball away? Two free throws. Game of make believe there.

  93. 93.

    RinaX

    Rick Wilson and Jennifer Rubin are two people I may be forced to eat crow on. I have a hard time trusting former Republicans,  but these two have really show their mettle over the past week. So, yeah.*

    *Contingent on who they support in 2028.

  98. 98.

    raven

    @Leto: I used to ask people to watch Knight’s IU teams off the ball. Crushing picks and never a call.

    eta

    I ran the intramural program here 40 years ago and the fouling got so bad that we instituted a two-free throws for EVERY foul rule. We figured that, with 20 minute running clock half’s, they’d have to decide whether they wanted to spend the whole game at the line it was ok with us. It worked while I was there.

  99. 99.

    Juju

    I didn’t know Trixie is a zebra.  I hope she’s settling down after her stressful day yesterday.

  100. 100.

    Chris

    @RinaX:

    I have a hard time trusting former Republicans,  but these two have really show their mettle over the past week.

    Remember, the last man anybody familiar with the 2000s blogosphere would’ve expected to ever see recanting his ideology and coming over to the light side was Charles Johnson of LGF.  There were lots of Keyboard Commandos, but his site was the bible of every islamophobe for an entire decade.  And yet somehow, the Gates of Vienna conference was too much for even him.

    Anybody can change… most people just don’t.

  105. 105.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    Posted by Kay downstairs:

    Matt Novak @paleofuture.bsky.social

    ·

    Sen. Mark Warner seeks to assemble group of Democratic senators to ask Biden to exit race

    This doesn’t sound good. Is there any confirmation this is true?

  106. 106.

    Bettencourt

    @raven: I suspect that even amidst the carnage and chaos of the Normandie landing, it would still be difficult to confuse Walter Matthau with Wally Cox.

    Unless you’re a labor historian, apparently.

  107. 107.

    comrade scotts agenda of rage

    @schrodingers_cat:

    Stuart Stevens too. He has called out his past buddies and admitted his own complicity.

    Yup.  I’m right up there with seeing lifetime GQP water carriers as nothing but an ally like Stalin was an ally in this campaign.  But Stevens, like Rubin, has been forthright, honest and articulate about their roles prior and what’s at stake now.

    They get it like the *base* of the party gets it.

  109. 109.

    JaySinWA

    @rikyrah: The more I thought about Kevin Roberts not so veiled threat, the madder I became. That smug, self-righteous prick is trying to terrorize us into accepting his version of theocratic authoritarianism.

    I had to look up Kevin to remember he’s heading Heritage in their 2025 plot to undo democracy.

    ETA undo the New Deal, democracy may be just be a means to that end.

  110. 110.

    Bettencourt

    @Geoduck: I saw that. I popped by only long enough to be reassured that a lot of the commenters were giving him grief about it.

    Still, recently may have been the first time (certainly one of the few) that I made a (admittedly small) financial contribution to LGM, and I’m already starting to regret it.

  111. 111.

    raven

    @Bettencourt: Damn, the google sez I’m wrong !

    During World War II, Matthau saw active service as a radioman-gunner on a Consolidated B-24 Liberator bomber in the U.S. Army Air Forces with the Eighth Air Force in England. He was with the same 453rd Bombardment Group as James Stewart. While based in England at RAF Old Buckenham, Norfolk he flew missions to continental Europe during the Battle of the Bulge. He ended the war with the rank of Staff Sergeant, and returned home to America for demobilization at the war’s end intent on pursuing a career as an actor.[10]

  112. 112.

    Trivia Man

    I went for a bike ride and camped out  by the runway to watch AF1land. Unfortunately he used the 757 so he didn’t use the runway near me and also came from the north instead of south.

    I scampered over to the intersection i knew he’d use and took a seat. Gave a big grin and a thumbs up / so if he shows a positive attitude in the speech you know why!

  114. 114.

    comrade scotts agenda of rage

    @Bettencourt:

    Still, recently may have been the first time (certainly one of the few) that I made a (admittedly small) financial contribution to LGM, and I’m already starting to regret it.

    Heh heh, atone for that sin by shoving some dough either here or for something like the Four Directions operation.

  117. 117.

    Eyeroller

    @MattM:  Because if anybody would do this it would be Mark Warner. Apparently a reasonably nice guy but utterly spineless.

  119. 119.

    Jay

    @raven:

    Back in the day, we “blew up” an Intermural Ball Hockey League here, over the reffing.

    League Championship Series, best of 5, mixed genders.

    They played dirty, even got physical with our women, in a no contact league, ref’s wouldn’t call them on it, called us on everything and anything.

    So at half time, we cleared the benches and beat the crap out of them and the refs.

    No Game 2, cops called, video footage, no charges, no League.

  120. 120.

    The Thin Black Duke

    “If the Democratic party won’t get behind Joe Biden, why in hell should we believe them when they tell us that they’ll support us when things go bad?”

    This will be the Narrative if the Democrats punk out.

  121. 121.

    Temp Decloaked Lurker

    Cancelled my NYT subscription today with “The Times political coverage is atrociously bad. Nepo baby A.G.’s snit over Biden denying the outlet an interview has lead to increasingly bad takes, even Pitchbot can’t keep up. A.G. and the others somehow think the leopard won’t eat _their_ faces.”

  122. 122.

    mali muso

    Just shot off a message to Warner’s office (I’m a constituent) that if those rumors are true, he can count on history judging him harshly.  Effing traitor quisling.

  123. 123.

    JWR

    @rikyrah:

    Trump: I don’t even know the people who drafted Project 2025!

    Photo caption: Trump’s hand upraised as he begins motion required to retrieve coffee cup from coffee boy. (Film at 11)

  124. 124.

    JaySinWA

    @Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): WAPO  has a story about it here 

    Talking about setting up a meeting Monday morning. Lot’s of claims of what they are going to say with lots of hedging. More claims of some Senators being part of this and backpedaling with a lot of Senators not supporting Biden withdrawing.

    Too much inference and not any clear statements.

  127. 127.

    Another Scott

    @Chris:

    FTFNYT wants us to forget that they vaunted Editorial Board had a long interview with Biden on December 16, 2019 and they published a big editorial about it in January 2020.

    Guess what the big important issue they first asked him about. Just guess.

    KK: We have a lot of questions to get through, so please excuse us in advance if we interrupt you. I want to start — you fought corruption in Ukraine. There is no indication that you or your son did anything wrong or were part of any corruption in Ukraine. But you still haven’t really answered the question of whether or not you think it’s proper for the son of a sitting vice president of the United States to serve on the board of a foreign company that’s being investigated for corruption.

    🤡

    Is it any wonder he hasn’t talked with them again??

    FTFNYT may think that nobody has a memory of anything that happened more than a month ago, but that’s not actually true…

    Grr…,
    Scott.

  128. 128.

    Jay

    @raven:

    Yes, and no. The USAAF had the highest casualty rate of all the US services in WWII. Most crewmen never lived long enough for their 25th mission “go home” card. The average was 9 missions until death.

  129. 129.

    schrodingers_cat

    @The Thin Black Duke:Oh I think I am loud enough. I have been told that I snipe and am just a bad commenter by the blogrunner not that long ago. If I feel that this has been a less than welcoming space for me. Its my own damn fault. It has nothing to do with anyone else.

  130. 130.

    MattM

    For some (and I include myself here), the parallels to 2016–Dem candidate with significant, pervasive negatives in the eyes of the general electorate that are written off by committed partisans as a) unfair, b) a creation of the media, c) not real (or some combination of the 3)—are frighteningly hard to overlook. Is going with Harris the right call? I genuinely don’t know and it’s keeping me up at night.

  131. 131.

    Elizabelle

    @mali muso:  Mark Warner can be questionable.  I never worry about Tim Kaine.

    Warner almost got pantsed 2 elections ago by reaching out too far to Republican voters.  Who went home to GOP candidate Ed Gillespie, who doesn’t scare children.

    Warner can be slow on the uptake.

  139. 139.

    SiubhanDuinne

    Oh, pooooor Trixie! Sweet thing. I hope she’s feeling safe and back to normal today.

  142. 142.

    EarthWindFire

    @Elizabelle: This fellow Virginian just emailed Senator Slow on the Uptake to let him know that he can forget about my vote in ‘26 if this is true. Stay in your lane, Senator.

  143. 143.

    zhena gogolia

    I just wrote to The Ethicist to ask if the behavior of the NYT reporters, opinion columnists, and editorial board has been ethical over the past week.

  144. 144.

    NutmegAgain

    Best doggie blanket styling ever. I am happy & relieved to report that Orion the brown clown has no issues what-so-ever with the scary boom crash idiot neighbors. You never know with a new rescue or foster what kinds of issues they bring with them, so every new setting or experience is an adventure of its own.

  147. 147.

    Juju

    @Eyeroller:  Someone should tell Campos to go watch the movie “The King’s Speech “. It’s a really good movie about stuttering and how to work around stuttering.  He could also look for the video of Biden helping a youngster who is a fellow stutterer and then the video of this same young man giving a speech at the Democratic National Convention in 2020.  It truly was one of the most touching things I’ve ever seen.  Campos needs to get a grip.

  149. 149.

    Eyeroller

    @Jay: Somebody on Twitter wrote (retweeted by Ragnarok Lobster):
    Mike Memoli just reported from WI Voters are angry at Dems. They didn’t see the debate as a big deal. They are MAD Dems are infighting & not focusing on Trump. same thing I heard 3 reports yesterday. @MSNBC is talking to @HouseDemocrats, they’re IGNORING voters. Big problem

    Memoli seems to be an NBC reporter.

  151. 151.

    Dorothy A. Winsor

    I just listened to the Wisconsin speech. Biden fumbled a couple or words but actually no more than Evers did. Some fumbling is normal, something I relearn every day as I try to record stuff for tiktok.

  152. 152.

    Juju

    @Eyeroller: The only reason they didn’t do it to Obama to the same extent is because they couldn’t do that without looking like huge racist assholes.

  153. 153.

    Geminid

    @Elizabelle: The notion that Warner almost lost  that election because he tried too hard to work with Republicans is taken as fact by other people as well.

    I have never seen any evidence that this was so. Everyone I’ve seen complain about this voted for him, and I think they project their own dislike for talk of bipartisanship onto other Democratic voters who do not exist.

  155. 155.

    Doc Sardonic

    @MattM: OK, let me explain…..No it is to much, let me sum up. If the Democratic pants pissers successfully force Joe Biden out, they will have handed the election to Trump.

  156. 156.

    Dorothy A. Winsor

    Also, this stuff re Parkinson’s is BS. Mr DAW was diagnosed with Parkinson’s about a year ago. I realize the disease presents differently in different people, but what I see every day and read about in an attempt educate myself, do not suggest Parkinson’s for Biden. These people are despicable.

  158. 158.

    Bupalos

    @gwangung: I don’t know what “evidence” you’d be looking for. The polls say between 55-72% of the electorate responds that Biden’s age makes him unfit for the next 4 year term of office. That number jumped immediately after the debate, from where about the same number of people said Trump and Biden were “unfit,” to where Biden’s got like a 15-20% deficit

    With all the caveats about us not really knowing what the rules are right now, it’s a little fucked up to try and run a candidate where that proportion of the electorate is identifying a disqualifying issue, and we just think we’re going to talk them out of it.

  159. 159.

    Dan B

    Poor Trixie!  My heart breaks for her.

    Our three kitties were, at most, annoyed.  BaBoo kept trying to sleep.  Milly only went outside once.  Wobbles kept trying to persuade His Hoomin to go to bed.

  160. 160.

    Leto

    @Jay: that’s only if you look at the Army as both ground and fliers. When you separate out the two, the ground component had significantly higher casualty rates. 318K for Army ground v 88K for Air Forces. USAAF led in that category until Normandy, for obvious reasons.

  161. 161.

    comrade scotts agenda of rage

    @Tony Jay:

    I’ll have you know I look like a fat Rik Mayall after six weeks tied up at the back of Steve Bannon’s wardrobe.

    I should pie you for putting that imagery into my head. //

  163. 163.

    TBone

    @comrade scotts agenda of rage: it’s unbelievable to me that people don’t know who JPie is or are just now finding out.  It’s like not knowing about Monty Python.

    After the conservative defeat, this morning (it is SO out of character for him to sing) 😆 I’ve been watching this all day!

    It’s a GREAT day for PIE! 💪😆🤣🤩🇬🇧

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=aYMy2qdNPF0

    From way back in 2022 at the NYT 😆 his State of the Nation interview:

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=m5aWtcx02ZI

    Even better, his first NYT Opinion piece:

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QS7kUqKeg_0

    That ☝️ is the BEST

  164. 164.

    Geminid

    @EarthWindFire: I don’t think Warner will run in 2026. He’ll more likely retire like Ben Cardin is doing this year. My guess is that Rep. Jennifer McClellan will be our nominee.

  169. 169.

    Eyeroller

    @3Sice: I’m a voter and I am pissed.  Democrats in general have a reputation for being weak and then they go and demonstrate why.

  171. 171.

    gwangung

    @Bupalos: I’d be careful with that datum. Those are perceptions of fitness and not fitness itself. And, of course, these perceptions can be gained.

    Why is looking at that instead of candidate behavior a measure of fitness?

  172. 172.

    Bupalos

    @Doc Sardonic: This will of course be the take. “We were cruising to victory, and hyperventilating ninnies frittered it away.”

    The campaign agreed to debates because they were in a bad place and had to change the dynamic. We were likely to lose before the debate without something good happening, and instead something very bad happened, something that transcended the usual impact a debate can have because it validated the opposition’s claims, is exactly what is expected from someone of this advanced age, and I’d venture to say went beyond the kind of incapacity the vast majority believes they have ever seen from a president. So clearly post debate without a word being said past “beat medicare” we were in a world of hurt.

    It’s fine to conjecture this was or is salvageable, that there was or is a kind of unity play to make that could ameliorate the damage and unring this bell. It’s really not fine to act like our easy win was just thrown away due to a kind of lack of character or conspiracy or whatever you’re talking about here.

  178. 178.

    Eyeroller

    @sab: A neurologist would be qualified to diagnose Parkinson’s (joke incoming: does he have a law degree too?) but few would be willing to do so without seeing the patient in person and conducting some tests.

  179. 179.

    Jackie

    @M31: I LOVE this Joe Biden!

    Was I too old to sign the bipartisan Infrastructure Act? Was I too old to pass the bipartisan CHIPS Act? Was I too bad old to get Big Pharma to lower the cost of insulin…

  180. 180.

    Geminid

    @Elizabelle: Jennifer McLellan would be Virginia’s first woman Senator ever.

    I think we’ll have two by decade’s end. Tim Kaine was hesitant about running this year and I think he won’t run in 2030. Abigail Spanberger should be finishing up a term as Governor that January and could ride the Governor-to-Senator pipeline like Kaine and Warner did.

  183. 183.

    Eyeroller

    @Elizabelle: Yeah but now I think I’m going to have to cancel my WaPo subscription as well, and I’ve had that (indirectly till fairly recently) for nearly 30 years.  Oh well, they are taking a bad turn under new management and their owner is delusional.

  184. 184.

    cmorenc

    All of us look on with disgusted astonishment at how the GOP and their constituencies firmly stick with Donald Trump, even as most of them below levels where spinning for the media will readily admit what a horrible person he is.  Especially evangelicals.

    It’s transactional – they see him as someone willing and able to fulfill their longtime goals for policy and fundamental federal government restructuring.  Dobbs and three key RW SCOTUS appointments are worth the cost to them of supporting such a venal, corrupt person like Trump to get them- and the RW business class sees Trump as their agent to dismantle the federal government back much closer to what it was before FDR’s New Deal, assisted by RW SCOTUS rulings like reversal of Chevron.  They realize and regret only that they have not yet figured out a politically viable way to eliminating social security anytime soon, but they do seem to be counting on frustrating any efforts to restore the program to indefinite viability before it crashes into an insolvency problem unable to continue paying adequate benefits.

    In short, they have adopted an amoral transactional view of Trump delivering the radical changes they crave.  Especially the evangelicals.

  186. 186.

    Bupalos

    @gwangung: To me, Joe Biden is FAR FAR FAR more fit to be president than Trump and that would be true if he were literally dead.

    That’s not what I’m talking about, I’m just saying electorally someone that gets that response from the electorate may not be the candidate you want to choose. I personally don’t see a way to overcome that. If Biden could suddenly start speaking like Buttigiege, then maybe 10 appearances like that would get him back to square. He never could speak like Buttigiege, he can’t even speak like 2020 Biden.

    These are all bad options. All I’m reacting to is the revisionist thing where you’re supposing if everyone pretended everything was fine, then we’d be killing it. That’s going to be divisive either way. I don’t want the folks who are rooting for him to step aside to do it either. We were probably going to lose and we are probably going to lose. For that not to happen something big needs to change, and none of us necessarily know what will do it.

  187. 187.

    The Thin Black Duke

    It pisses me off that Trump’s monstrousness is getting a hall pass, which I suppose is the intention. It isn’t often that Life Isn’t Complicated, but voting for Biden is absolutely a no-brainer. Why the fuck are people shoving this nothingburger down their collective throats?

    And how many times are we going to keep on doing this? Next.

  188. 188.

    Eolirin

    Biden getting angry and counterpunching the media is probably the best play here. Validates the base reaction, turns this into a war against the media that likely breaks in our favor. No one likes them to begin with. If they’re forced to defend themselves they usually end up looking even worse.

    Further accelerates the issue we have with media acceptance and trust, and the long term consequences of that are bad, but they’ve done that to themselves to a large degree, so we kind of need to live in the reality of that.

    I do want Biden to talk to people about his stutter more. Most people don’t really get how stutters work and improving education on that could help.

  189. 189.

    sab

    @M31: The old guys at my husband’s weekly coffee klatch in Ohio all said they saw the debate, Biden didn’t do so well that night, but none of them is even considering changing their vote.

    No reporters interviewed those guys in their Ohio diner.

  194. 194.

    Chris Johnson

    I would point out that one unavoidable factor for manufacturing consent for a coup of whatever nature, is selling the narrative that it was inevitable.

    This apparently means overcoming the personal failings of a multiple felon who turned everybody the fuck off in that same debate, and is even now playing defense on the Project 2025 thing, after having personally fucked up his narrative for the Roe V Wade thing, on camera, with everybody watching.

    Days ago Mousebumples posted a Bluesky thread by Stephen Webb about ‘here’s why I’d rather be Biden- yes, Biden- right now’. These reasons were already legit even before Trump’s fuckups this week, before the Epstein ties and latest reveals hit.

    found it! https://bsky.app/profile/stephenwebb.bsky.social/post/3kw6otp7opm2x

    Manufacturing consent for ‘woops, Biden actually lost’ is a heavy, heavy lift and that’s why it seems so insane and alarming.

  196. 196.

    Damien

    @Bupalos: You are exactly the kind of person we talk about when we talk about quislings. We were probably always gonna lose? That’s loser talk. Your constant harping about this is loser talk.

    Stop being a goddamn loser, Bupalos. Write the postcards, knock the doors, and get on the Biden Corvette, because he’s our nominee, he’s a phenomenal president, and I would think that you would rather talk about that than constantly whine about his age.

    You know how we change the story? We quit feeding into the media’s bullshit framing and fight for our candidate instead of whining and bitching while indulging ridiculous fantasies about replacing this EXCELLENT PRESIDENT with some rando.

    It’s over. We had the primaries, we had the fight, now stop quitting and start pulling in the same direction

  197. 197.

    Sis

    I’ve called my Dem Congresswoman, both Dem Senators, the DCCC and my state Democratic Party and emailed the DNC to express support for President Biden and opposition to replacing him on the ticket. I don’t know what else to do. I wish I knew of an organization that is opposing this madness, because I’d do whatever I could to help them. I’m so very frustrated, because it feels as though this drastic action is being imposed on ordinary Dems – who still support President Biden!!! I hate when people complain about “elites,” but in this instance, it feels as though top Dems and journalists are rushing this self-destructive action through without understanding what a horrible mistake it is and without consulting ordinary voters, much less the people who’ll be knocking on doors, phone banking, text banking and writing postcards this fall. 

  199. 199.

    Sis

    I’ve called my Dem Congresswoman, both Dem Senators, the DCCC and my state Democratic Party and emailed the DNC to express support for President Biden and opposition to replacing him on the ticket. I don’t know what else to do. I wish I knew of an organization that is opposing this madness, because I’d do whatever I could to help them. I’m so very frustrated, because it feels as though this drastic action is being imposed on ordinary Dems – who still support President Biden!!!

     

     

     

    . 

  200. 200.

    Elizabelle

    @Eolirin:  I like that idea. Play against the media.  They already act like Biden’s in the Witness Protection Program — it’s ALL TRUMP all the time, especially the FTF QNYTimes — and if readers and viewers don’t know of Biden’s accomplishments, that is in large part a media failing of failure to accurately report.  For “balance.”  And for their own balance sheets.

  203. 203.

    gwangung

    @Bupalos: I think we’re arguing at cross purposes here. I don’t think Biden is in an irrecoverable position. This is still a binary choice voters have.

    If a Trump can be competitive with his lawsuit defeats, his convictions, his Supreme Court (Dobbs AND the immunity decision), he cronies pushing Project 2025, then I do not see Biden as being uncompetitive.

  204. 204.

    Jackie

    @Eyeroller:

    Memoli seems to be an NBC reporter.

    Mike Memoli is assigned to the Biden campaign for election coverage.

    Vaughn Hillyard drew the short straw and gets to shadow TCFG.

  207. 207.

    Juju

    Apparently Trump is saying he doesn’t know of the Heritage Foundation   If that true he must have dementia.

  209. 209.

    BR

    Just called my senators and shouted at them about needing to support Biden. Also told them I don’t care what the New York Times has to say.

  212. 212.

    Tony Jay

    @comrade scotts agenda of rage:

    It’s like rubbing chilli on your mind’s eye.

    @The Thin Black Duke:

    Seriously. Honestly. The only thing to do is laugh contemptuously and talk about how Stench came across as an unhinged lunatic in that debate, just like the corporate media and the Legion of Connected Bedwetters very obviously don’t want anyone to.

    Bad people put in a position to do bad things will do bad things because they’re bad people. That’s who they are. Judge them for it, sure, but never let their failure to be decent people surprise or upset. It’s their failure, let them own it.

  216. 216.

    Elizabelle

    @Sis:  Yay you!!

    @Eyeroller:   Yep re the WaPost too.  I actually think dissatisfied readers should be pulling back on their Amazon purchases too, but who’s to say that anything — except having to pay his fair share of taxes (and pay/treat his workers better) — would get Bezos’ attention.

    Also, Eyeroller, I have really, really appreciated your comments here.  

  218. 218.

    Trivia Man

    @BR: I didn’t get an invitation (even though I was at THAT local office for the opening last week!) but I can attest that the sparse crowd at one intersection was very positive about Biden. He got a big smile and thumbs up from me so I hope that cheered him up.

  219. 219.

    delphinium

    @The Thin Black Duke: Because they are weak-willed ninnies who run to the closet anytime someone says boo? Or privileged people who have much less at stake so don’t care much about elections? Or folks who have zero self respect for themselves, let alone this country? Take your pick.

    I mean, Mark Warner isn’t even up for election this year-what the actual fuck?

  220. 220.

    Jackie

    @BR: Following each question, the crowd yelled a resounding NO!!!

    It was “fired up Joe,” and the crowd was fired up, too. 😊

  222. 222.

    Bupalos

    @Damien: I didn’t say we were always going to lose. I don’t say it now. I say it’s the most likely outcome now, and was then. I’m reacting to someone writing future history in the present from a point of view of recrimination. We need to stay together and stop that kind of thing win lose or draw because we aren’t done here and won’t be done in November either. This fight goes on.

    Also things are changing. Biden just used the “trying to force me out” phrase in this speech. In my opinion, that changes the calculus. He has made his decision. I think it’s a bad one, but he’s kind of announcing here that he’s convinced of his rightness to the extent that he’s willing to risk damage to a successor candidate. That changes the calculus for me and I won’t be visiting the issue anymore until and unless I think a Biden candidacy offers more damage than a hostile effort to push him out, which I find both unlikely and too depressing to think about.

    Let’s go Joe!

  223. 223.

    Chris Johnson

    @Juju: If that guy was really confident he would not need to disavow Project 2025 or the Heritage Foundation.

    I’ll give him this one thing: he knows the stakes though he views them only as ‘do I get to crush my enemies or not’, and he knows how fucked he is. If he didn’t have to take all the GOP’s money, if he didn’t have to split the GOP in bitter factional battles and brutally destroy GOP enemies to maintain loyalty, he wouldn’t be doing those things because they’re damaging and costly and he won’t stop doing them, and he’s not even done doing stuff like that.

    Next thing you know he’ll have a brain fart and passionately defend the manliness of raping 13 year olds. He’s not only evil, he’s losing touch with how to win over an electorate and is increasingly scaring them.

    THAT is why all this shit is going down. They have no choice because Trump is falling apart in every way, so fast that they are scared he won’t even make it to November. And that is why we’re living in meme hell right now.

  227. 227.

    Bupalos

    @Damien: I didn’t say we were always going to lose. I don’t say it now. I say it’s the most likely outcome now, and was then. I’m reacting to someone writing future history in the present from a point of view of recrimination. We need to stay together and stop that kind of thing win lose or draw because we aren’t done here and won’t be done in November either. This fight goes on.

    Also things are changing. Biden just used the “trying to force me out” phrase in this speech. In my opinion, that changes the calculus. He has made his decision. I think it’s a bad one, but he’s kind of announcing here that he’s convinced of his rightness to the extent that he’s willing to risk damage to a successor candidate. That changes the calculus for me and I won’t be visiting the issue anymore until and unless I think a Biden candidacy offers more damage than a hostile effort to push him out, which I find both unlikely and too depressing to think about. Not the set of risks I would have favored, but the set of risks we’re sailing with!

    Let’s go Joe!

    And I never was not going to be canvassing. I was never not going to be donating. I was never not going to be manning a table registering the college kids. Consider that people can have different opinions about the best way to win, maybe take that seriously and take a beat before you give in to your internet-mediated impulses.

  229. 229.

    Dangerman

    I don’t much care which horse gets saddled up. All I care about is that piece of shit nag gets sent to the poo factory.

  230. 230.

    Geminid

    @Juju: Someone made the point that if Trump is already distancing himself from Project 2025, Republicans have found that these initiatives poll badly.

  231. 231.

    Elizabelle

    @Geminid: that would be great!  Senators McClellan and Spanberger, the latter fresh off a successful term as Virginia governor.

  233. 233.

    sab

    @MattM: Yes. What was the point of all those primaries? Biden was only a few months younger back in March when I voted for him.

    Somebody in comments in an earlier thread linked to his latest medical report. Very detailed,  and he is much healthier than me and I’m 9 years younger and fairly healthy for my age.

    ETA Biden walks slowly and carefully because he has arthriitis aggravated by breaking something in his foot when he fell of his bicycle. His foot. Most people my age who fall off a bicycle land on their heads. But Joe didn’t.

  234. 234.

    BlueDWarrior

    @Geminid: the problem was putting the plan on paper to begin with. You know that Biden and Dem-aligned Super-PACs are filming and editing the ads as we speak.

  235. 235.

    BlueDWarrior

    @sab: If Biden was too old now he was too old in the aftermath of 2022 midterms. If you wanted to push him out because of old, that would have been the only time to do it.

    At this point, accept the only way he’s leaving is if the Good Lord calls him home all of a sudden; or if he, and he alone, decides to. No  one from the media or even the Outer Circle of the ‘official’ Democratic Party is going to move him.

     

    Sorry could have been more clear with language; should have use a more generic ‘you’ instead of implying you personally.

  237. 237.

    Chris Johnson

    @Geminid: Absolutely these initiatives poll badly! Beau of the Fifth Column says it’s the Republicans ‘catching the car’, like with Dobbs. Except now it’s Dobbs/Chevron/Immunity.

    These things are massive overreaches that get brutally punished at the polls. Dobbs is said to be a five to twenty point swing NATIONALLY, and there’s multiple stories just in recent days of states where abortion rights are on the ballot, where they have to be to drive turnout. This is happening. Happening in swing states. That’s just ONE issue of the many that Republicans have wildly overreached on.

  238. 238.

    Captain C

    @Chris Johnson:

    Next thing you know he’ll have a brain fart and passionately defend the manliness of raping 13 year olds.

    TCFG:  “That 13 year old wanted it!”

    FTFNYT:  “Trump boldly demonstrates his devotion to sexual consent and advancing women and teen girls.”

    CNN:  Cuts away and never mentions it again, erases the footage from its site.

    Us:  “A) EEEWWWW!!!  and B) What are you trying to tell us, Pinch the Lesser?”

  241. 241.

    Elizabelle

    Gawd.  Do you suppose the FTF NYTimes is doing this to shake loose its icky liberal readers, and going full steam ahead for the NPR/ David Brooks totebagger crowd, along with any NY Post types they can grab?  Plus, departing WaPost readers fleeing Murdoch, who’ve not realized they’re jumping from the pan into the fires of hell?

  242. 242.

    Leto

    @Geminid: doesn’t matter; hang that shit around their necks forever. Keep beating them with it, keep reminding everyone that they’re looking to implement authoritarian control with the shit weasel on top. Tie that to what SCROTUS is doing from now the end of time. “This is what happens when you give Republicans control. Every. Single. Time. “

  243. 243.

    Chris Johnson

    And while Trump doesn’t always know to run away from Dobbs, and while one division factor with Republicans is the far right not trusting him because they think he will betray them and weasel out of their desires, immunity is even more politically toxic to Americans than that.

    And Trump will not try to weasel out of having immunity. He utterly depends on not only that but exploiting it, so he’s gonna force American justice to whore itself out to him, and that’s gonna go over like a fart in church.

    Chevron sucks too, but he doesn’t understand it, so that one’s on the administrators to defend against. And it does mean that stealth wingnut bills to be interpreted by wingnuts, can’t be a thing anymore. So Chevron is a bit of an own goal.

    All bad for Trump.

  244. 244.

    Tony Jay

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    Pie has the bilious energy of a presenter on the epic Brass Eye from way back in the 90s. Chris Morris’ absolutely pitch perfect spoof of exactly what TV News would become over the next two decades.

    It must be on YouTube. The ‘cake’ special where they managed to convince ‘celebrities’ that there was a new drug out there that did increasingly bizarre and unbelievable things to its users is a stone classic, and as for the episode mocking the media obsession with purient paedophile stories, genius.

  245. 245.

    Captain C

    @Eyeroller:

    Impossible to believe that their readers are that obsessed with this story. Obviously there is an agenda.

    Somewhere on the Upper East Side, hopefully:

    Him:  “Darling, remember when the Times covered all the news and not just Pinch, jr.’s obsessions?”

    Her:  “Yes, dear.  It’s gross.  I’ll be sure to take them off the invite list for our grand dinner party next month.”

  247. 247.

    Jay

    @Geminid:

    @BlueDWarrior:

    It polls great with Shitgibbon’s cult,

    sucks donkey balls outside the cult,

    and the cult isn’t enough to win an election.

    it’s like his abortion stance, his position is always what he thinks his audience want’s to hear, with out offending the cult.

    Convenient lie de jour.

    It’s his project, and he’s not “backing away” from it, he is pretending that it’s not his project or he knows about it.

    And the MSM don’t care.

  248. 248.

    BlueDWarrior

    @Elizabelle: I wouldn’t doubt it at this point. I firmly believe that they think that it’s more fun to go after the politically mush-brained that can be whipped up into a frenzy. Plus they hate actually having to put forth effort pretending to be liberal. They want to be crap-stirrers of the highest order that also don’t have to pay taxes because taxes are always for losers.

  250. 250.

    BR

    Every senator and rep needs to be called and shouted at to support Biden. No value in them trying to create party disunity when Biden is quite forcefully saying he’s all in.

  251. 251.

    Juju

    @Chris Johnson: Thank you for the really nice and on point reply to my comment that was just a joke. You make some very valid points I hadn’t even considered when I made the comment. I do however believe that Trump has some sort of cognitive issue. It boggles my mind that he thinks acing the Montreal cognitive assessment is something to brag about. Generally one is give the assessment because they are past a certain age or showing signs of cognitive decline.  It seems weird to me.

  252. 252.

    Chris Johnson

    @Elizabelle: FTF NYTimes is run out of Russia. Probably from way back: they torpedoed Hillary, and at the time she didn’t know how deep the rot was, she only said publically that Trump was Putin’s puppet, and Hillary was right all the way back then.

    If she’d known, I don’t know if she would have acted differently, but I don’t think she knew the full scope of it.

    This is the unmasking that it’s Pravda-In-NYC. It’s so tightly controlled and on message. One thing you have to remember is that they don’t technically have to get Trump to win (that was always just a bonus), they have to get us fighting each other in the streets. One way to do that is manufacture from whole cloth the story that Joe is totally incapable and what’s more all the Dems hate him: a legitimacy story. They’re OK if Trump makes us ballistic. The chaos is the point.

  253. 253.

    Jeffro

    @Geminid:I think we’ll have two by decade’s end. Tim Kaine was hesitant about running this year and I think he won’t run in 2030. Abigail Spanberger should be finishing up a term as Governor that January and could ride the Governor-to-Senator pipeline like Kaine and Warner did.

    Have to agree (happily, I might add!)

    This would be a superb ‘changing of the guard’ for Virginia.  I love Kaine and like Warner, but Spanberger and McClellan are very, very worthy replacements/improvements.

  254. 254.

    Eolirin

    @Baud: That’s why I think this has a chance of backfiring really badly for the media, as long as Biden can get enough footage in front of people showing that he’s really okay. I think explaining how the stutter effects him and how that’s a lot of what people are seeing would also go a long way.

    It’ll be even worse if the media is made to look like they’re piling on over a speech impediment.

    If he continues to own his age, like he did with the rally the day after, and can get people to understand his speech disorder a little better, I think it’ll smooth out the normie reactions and his general likeability will carry through.

    The debate didn’t help. It would have been better if he hadn’t had that rough start. But even the immediate polling afterwards suggested that most people weren’t that freaked out by his performance. And with Dobbs and now this immunity ruling to run against, plus the whole convicted felon, sexual assaulter, and insurrectionist thing going on, that’s probably enough to get the undecideds to break for Biden near the election.

    We just need this narrative to stop so we can get back to talking about that. And the media isn’t going to make that easy. But beating up on the media may help get people to tune them out on it at least.

  255. 255.

    Juju

    @Jay: I’m glad I wasn’t drinking coffee when I read your comment. I’d still be cleaning up after my spit take.

  256. 256.

    Jeffro

    @Eolirin:Biden getting angry and counterpunching the media is probably the best play here.

    Have to agree.  “I represent Democratic VOTERS, not the pundit class” would be nice!

  259. 259.

    Jeffro

    @Chris Johnson:one division factor with Republicans is the far right not trusting him because they think he will betray them and weasel out of their desires,

    The GOP’s anti-abortion nuts are already mad about how team trump is trying to shut them up at the upcoming convention.  Him disavowing Project 2025 is just another great example of “trump only cares about himself”.

  260. 260.

    Emily B.

    @Chris Johnson: I do feel that many of the right’s most radical moves, like Project 2025, are a sign of weakness, not strength. They can’t persuade most Americans to follow their cultural agenda, so they try to impose it by force.

  261. 261.

    BlueDWarrior

    @Eolirin: Honestly, that’s the problem with being a Democrat in this media environment. You can’t ever make mistakes, you can’t ever have fuck ups. You have to be perfect, all the time, forever. The second you show yourself to be human, the wolf-pack comes for your flesh and bones.

    If anyone can be called a ‘fifth column’ for real, it’s places like the New York Times that just flat out lie about who and what they are.

  262. 262.

    Jeffro

    @Juju:

    If that’s true I’m going to guess that project 2025 only brought him coffee.

    THAT’S WHAT I PUT on my various social media posts about this! =)

    LOLOL

    One upside of having an opponent who is a lifelong fraud, liar, and obviously out for himself at all times is…well…everyone knows he’s a fraud, liar, and out for himself.

  264. 264.

    Tony Jay

    @Leto:

    I swear to Sauron I went into this game knowing it would end up goalless and Portugal going through on pens.

  265. 265.

    Chris Johnson

    @Jeffro: The great thing about this ‘Trump is treacherous’ narrative is it’s the literal truth. They’re suspecting the literal, obvious truth.

    He’s a crooked New York Democrat real estate guy who got sucked into the Russian mob as a butt monkey, ran with Epstein, loathes churches and soldiers… he is literally their Kryptonite and they got sold a bill of goods. He absolutely 1000% is betraying them every way he can.

    They are completely correct not to trust him. They should watch as he continues to weasel out of all the things they want him to stand for. He will sell them out completely so long as he can have his enemies, and this includes them if they cross him, killed!

    He is NOT their guy!

  266. 266.

    NotMax

    Haven’t checked above to see if this was noted. FYI

    How to watch President Biden’s first interview since the presidential debate
    [snip]
    The interview will be broadcast across ABC News platforms on Friday, July 5, at 8 p.m. EDT. A transcript of the unedited interview will be made available the same day, according to a press release from ABC News.

    A first look at the interview is scheduled to air on the Friday edition of “World News Tonight with David Muir,” which begins at 6:30 p.m. The interview is also set to air again Sunday on “This Week,” hosted by Stephanopoulos, with showtimes varying by local listings.

    Viewers can watch on the ABC app from smartphones and tablets (iOS and Android), computers on ABC.com, and connected devices such as Roku, Apple TV, and Amazon Fire TV. Source

  268. 268.

    cmorenc

    @Bupalos:

    Biden can’t say anything other than “in it to win it” at the moment, in order to have a chance to prove he can turn things around.  And most party leaders are not going to contradict him just yet.  And if he does pull it off, I will be happy to have been proven wrong – the goal we all share is to win in November.

    But he’s only likely to get a fairly short window of one to two weeks to prove it, or party leaders currently voicing public support will have a tough-love meeting with joe.

  269. 269.

    Leto

    @Tony Jay: Thought it would be a 1-0 affair, but also totally saw this going to PKs. Also fuck that stupid run up Whiner does. Hate that so much. So does my son.

  270. 270.

    cain

    @Eolirin:

    For that he needs to ditch the current set of advisors who got him into this situation.

    There needs to be some consequences.

  272. 272.

    Jeffro

    @Chris Johnson:

    The great thing about this ‘Trump is treacherous’ narrative is it’s the literal truth. They’re suspecting the literal, obvious truth.

    He’s a crooked New York Democrat real estate guy who got sucked into the Russian mob as a butt monkey, ran with Epstein, loathes churches and soldiers… he is literally their Kryptonite and they got sold a bill of goods. He absolutely 1000% is betraying them every way he can.

    Yup.

    Every time he does that weird ‘parable’ about the snake who bites the person who saves it, I’m shocked that no one in MAGA-land gets it, and no Dem or pundit seems to point it out: TRUMP. IS. THE SNAKE.

  275. 275.

    Jackie

    @Geminid:  Ali Velshi just showed back to back short clips of TCFG parroting Project 2025 initiatives, then Mark Roberts/Federal Society on MSNBC last Sunday threatening the same threats/promises almost verbatim.

    TCFG will be calling Roberts the coffee boy within days.

  276. 276.

    Bupalos

    @Eolirin: I think there are avenues open to Joe to kind of change the way he campaigns and be more effective than he has. He needs to consider his limits more carefully, and find what’s most effective for him now. Think more carefully about strengths and how to leverage them.  I’m 54. I don’t try to dunk anymore even though just 8 short years ago I pulled ONE rattle-dunk off, and I strongly suspect it’s not completely impossible. But it’s a terrible idea, and even considering it takes me away from what I can do. Biden needs to not dunk. I kind of think he tried to dunk in that debate.

  277. 277.

    Eolirin

    @Bupalos: None of us have any way to assess what is or isn’t likely to happen in an election that’s 5 months away. It’s a long time and the electorate doesn’t really engage until after labor day.

    We’re all operating from a place of extreme ignorance.

    And honestly, a lot of people are getting too fixated on the moment and not enough on the arc. Biden’s overperformed a ton, and gotten stuff done that people have thought was impossible, and it’s because he doesn’t do that. He’s always looking at the arc. Where he’s trying to go, how he’s trying to get there. And he’ll adapt and change and keep grinding away at things until he succeeds. That’s why he’s so effective.

    And maybe he won’t be able to pull it off this time. But you can’t have the slightest sense of how this will all end from just that debate performance five months out from the election. It’s literally impossible.

    Trump has plenty of time to do crazy ass shit that tanks him with voting blocs he needs. He did some this this exact same debate even. Set back any progress he’d been making on trying to get inroads with the black community, with Latinos, and with Arab Americans.

    Biden repeats this in the second debate though, we have a problem, unless we’ve already pulled decently far ahead by then. 

  280. 280.

    Tony Jay

    @Leto:

    Felix tried to mimic it, didn’t do it.

    Phew. Bye bye Portugal. I’d say Spain will rip this French team apart, but after the way Germany bullied and dominated them today… dunno.

    And tomorrow England embarrass themselves on the international scene again. Probably. Almost certainly.

  282. 282.

    Captain C

    @Geoduck: The thing is, assuming Biden stays in, this standing up to both the idiots in the MSM and the milquetoast members of his own party will likely, if anything, make him look stronger to the normies.

  283. 283.

    Chris Johnson

    @Geoduck: Watch to see who shows their ass, and mock them as simps and blindly trusting of trumped-up bullshit narratives.

  284. 284.

    Bupalos

    @cmorenc: No I think he escalated there. He made a move. He talked about people in the party trying to force him out. That makes withdrawing later have a subterranean toxicity we can’t invite.

    Obviously something major could happen, but it would have to be even starker than the debate I think for this to be an open question again. He’s made his move and stated a willingness to fight the party. That changes the equation for me drastically.

  285. 285.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @scav:

    Presumably Compos is his middle name.

    LOL. First name “Nos,” last name “Mentis,” I assume? Nicely done!

  286. 286.

    Eyeroller

    @Geoduck: ​I detected him wavering a while ago. His problem is he’s too intellectual, and I say that as somebody who has always been, or tried to be, very intellectual.
    This has been mystifying to me. Hillary would have very likely won without the Comey letter, despite having very comparable attacks thrown at her by the MSM. Maybe this is all PTSD from 2016 in the professional Democrat class? One poor theatrical (because that’s what it is) performance and we will ditch our candidate? Maybe Josh thinks Biden can’t withstand the NYT-led assault, but normies don’t read the NYT.​

  287. 287.

    chemiclord

    Getting myself banned from LGM has turned out to be one of the best moves I’ve ever made.

    Loomis, especially, has been nothing less than human garbage since that debate that he himself claimed didn’t matter until Biden did poorly. He’s spent the last week carrying the GOP’s water and banning anyone who started treating him like the sniveling troll he actually is.

  289. 289.

    Bupalos

    @Geoduck: Haha well since I just jumped off because it sounds like Biden is willing to take a pound of flesh out of the party… I’d be worried if I was you guys.

  290. 290.

    Jay

    @Tony Jay:

    And tomorrow England embarrass themselves on the international scene again. Probably. Almost certainly.

    Are you talking about footsball, or just in general?

  292. 292.

    Eolirin

    @Captain C: Exactly this, yes. And it’ll be energizing to the part of the base that rallied to his defense, because we’re all pissed off at the attacks. We see that in the fundraising numbers already.

  293. 293.

    Chris Johnson

    @Captain C: It’s also a little bit like Trump coming off as treacherous to the republicans, which he is.

    Biden CAN be stronger than this, because it requires a moral core and a sense of values beyond immediate expediency.

    Biden would know all that stuff like ‘a replacement doesn’t have access to the money raised for specifically you’. I think he knows how corrupt the NYT is, because he’s refusing to deal with them at all: they used to talk to FOX for fuck’s sake, just tease them! This is worse. Well, that’s accurately perceived, this IS worse.

    If Biden doesn’t survive, we run with Kamala and he is a martyr who fought for us. NOBODY on the other side wants him to die and be a martyr, so he’s quite safe.

    If he’s safe, he can run, and everybody can know this is just desperate attempts to implant Trump (for a second time) against the will of the voters. If it’s on Joe, he can refuse to bow to tyrants. That’s who _I_ voted for. The amount of bullying going on is surely just putting his back up. And mine.

    I trust Joe to stay clear on the real situation. There’s talk of a ceasefire from Israel. Do you think that’s coincidence, or Trump’s doing, or accident? I think Biden has been working on that, just as he has been working on the defense of Ukraine.

  296. 296.

    Bupalos

    @NotMax: Just reading tea leaves, maybe Biden escalating at the Wisconsin rally is a sign that his team feels the interview went very well.

  299. 299.

    Chris Johnson

    @Geoduck: Careful, when you ping these guys on a slip like that they can turn nasty. I got personally threatened after a similar exchange, though not from Bupalos.

    Pretty much what that meant was ‘he is still hammering the doomer narrative exactly the same as always, but claims he has flipped from refusing to support Biden, to supporting Biden while still insisting we’re all doomed and it’s a terrible mistake’.

    In other words, a day ending in Y :)

  302. 302.

    lowtechcyclist

    @Jay:

    The only dog I have in this fight is French’s Yellow Mustard.

    And the dog has to be grilled, not boiled or soaked in tepid hotdog juice for hours, or rotated in a 7-11 counter for days.

    My total lack of comprehension of the Hot Dog Purity Brigade continues unabated.

    This is a hot dog we’re talking about. Even if it’s a kosher all-beef hot dog, it’s the parts of the cow that weren’t good enough to be in the ground beef you buy for hamburger.  Esophagus, intestine, parts like that.

    But for some reason, there are people out there who treat it like it was freakin’ filet mignon, and it matters to them what condiments you put on these leftover bits that got shaped into a tube of meat. Ketchup? Oh heavens no! Where are my pearls, I gotta clutch them now.  How dare anyone desecrate these bits of mystery meat by putting ketchup on them! To the fainting couches!

    Yes, I find you all to be extremely ridiculous.

  303. 303.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Juju:

    The King’s Speech is right up there among my Top Ten movies. Terrific flick. And agreed about Biden’s mentorship of young stutterers. He’s spent time and resources on several such youngsters over his years in public life.

    It’s not a word from my own cultural tradition, but Joe Biden is a MENSCH.

  306. 306.

    Bupalos

    @Chris Johnson: Every now and then there’s a comment that makes me think how fucking weird this whole “online community” thing is. IRL this is utter babbling paranoia. “Ping ‘them’ on a ‘slip’ and they’ll threaten your life!!!” You hear yourself?

  310. 310.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Dorothy A. Winsor:

    I’ve recently been paying a great deal of attention to speech patterns, especially um, like, y’know, filler words. Everybody uses them. EV. RY. FUCKING. BODY. And people garble words, and their brains work faster than their mouths, and guess what? Nobody has a problem figuring out what they mean to say. Unless it’s the President of the United States, I guess.

    (A friend of mine, years ago, when he was less than coherent in conversation, would just say “Sorry. My tongue got in the way of my eye teeth, and I couldn’t see what I was saying.”)

  315. 315.

    Jay

    @lowtechcyclist:

    In some places in North America, a hotdog was the only street food you could, ( and in some places, can) buy.

    No samosa’s, no satay, you name it.

    You come out of the HomeDepot in Kamloops, hungry, well they closed the in-store Arby’s decades ago and turned it into Tool Rental.

    So, from snow melt to fresh snow, sometimes in the snow, there was a guy with a cart, a BBQ, and icebox and hot dogs, scratching out a living. 2 dogs, yellow mustard and a coke.

    The guy at Canadian Tire, could cook you a basic burger or cheeseburger, but you had to wait or order and pay, on your way in. Mostly, it was hotdogs.

    Canadians baseball game, back in the day, 2 dogs, pint of beer, Halloween bag of chips, $5. The Ridge Animation festival, hotdogs outside, popcorn, pop and candy inside.

    Now a days, The Ridge Animation festival, 14 food trucks outside, full catering inside, (truffels even), pop, juice, smoothies, wine, beer, deserts, and not just Nanimo Bars, fresh baked apple pie with ice cream, and you can eat in your theatre seats.

  316. 316.

    AWOL

    @Geoduck: LGM is unreadable vomit.

    The front pagers on LGM should step down and get some much-needed medication. They’re utter cowards and fools. Cosplay leftists.

    Former Balloon Juicer Cheryl Rofer is one of the few sane voices they have left.

  317. 317.

    Archon

    @Bupalos:

    I don’t know a single person who thought, “things were fine and we were killing it”. We’ve all been scared to fucking death for a year Trump could win.

  319. 319.

    different-church-lady

    A commenter at LGM says the most important thing that can be said to those cowards:

    Scott, one thing you and a bunch of the other FPers keep ignoring is your own options here. You can choose to be constructive or destructive. You can’t control whether or not Biden steps aside. You can control how you talk about that, how you boost or detract from him. You have a platform. You also have your personal lives where you can boost Democrats to your friends and family, colleagues and whoever else.

    Those are the real options. This is a moment in history you are living through, you are not some passive observer.

  320. 320.

    Bettencourt

    @different-church-lady:

    I just saw that – it’s like since the debate, LGM has been quickly taken over by trolls, except the trolls are the front-pagers and not the commenters.

    Between the “Biden was asleep” and the “Biden has Parkinson’s” columns, I really don’t understand what’s happened to my other favorite blog.

    (If it were all just Loomis, I wouldn’t be so shocked, but Lemieux always seemed the most reasonable one, at least of the men.)

    If Cheryl Rofer starts writing these kinds of posts too, that site is dead to me.

  321. 321.

    lowtechcyclist

    @Jay:

    In some places in North America, a hotdog was the only street food you could, ( and in some places, can) buy.

    No samosa’s, no satay, you name it.

    Yeah, I’ve spent most of my life in times and places like that.  Not sure that explains why people get all effete over a hot dog.

  322. 322.

    sab

    @Bupalos: Mostly I admire you. But you are off the rails today. Worried white guys don’t live in their actual world as it is.

  325. 325.

    sab

    @lowtechcyclist: Discussed this with my husband and he was horrified: when I was a kid in Florida in the 1960s, all hotdogs were dyed a very red color. There were no pale hotdogs. They were all bright red.  In school or at home, all very red.

    Also, all ground beef was packaged with a patty of butter on top.

  326. 326.

    piratedan

    @Geminid: I think they felt compelled to do so after the relative ineffectiveness of the first four years of DJT in dismantling the US Govmnt, i.e. they forgot what they were doing and everyone was pushing their own pet peeves.

  328. 328.

    Jay

    @lowtechcyclist:

    These days here, we have Japadogs. Never had one, never been to a hot dog restaurant.

    If you see me eating a hotdog, it’s because I am f’n hungry and I need something NOW!

    So we need it to be exactly the way we want it.

    It’s like ramen, tuna salad, egg salad, mac and cheese, potato salad, Philly cheesesteaks, etc, just much more low rent.

    When I order a burger, it’s beef, bun, lettuce, tomato, bacon, cheese and a touch of mayo, no onions, mustard, ketchup, pickles, etc.

    When I make a burger, it’s a whole different thing.

  329. 329.

    comrade scotts agenda of rage

    @AWOL: ​

    LGM is unreadable vomit. The front pagers on LGM should step down and get some much-needed medication. They’re utter cowards and fools. Cosplay leftists.

    Fauxgressives on this and plenty of economic issues.

    (If it were all just Loomis, I wouldn’t be so shocked, but Lemieux always seemed the most reasonable one, at least of the men.)

    See above.  He’s a neoliberal on certain econ issues which peel away his fauxgressive whiteness, worse than Gloomis actually.  But as mentioned, Gloomis has a host of his own issues.

  330. 330.

    MisterForkbeard

    @Geoduck: Sorta? Josh is more along the lines of “If Biden bows out it pretty much as to be Harris”, which I totally agree with.

    And I’m torn in general, because I think Biden has been a great president and I think he’s doing just fine – very capable. But I also know the media has its Republican-provided narrative on him and they’re just going to have article after article on Biden every damn day that’ll manufacture genuine concern and worry from the normies.

    They’ll manufacture something about Harris, but I’m honestly more worried that “Black female” will lose a lot of votes just because our country has a lot of POSes in it. On balance, would much prefer Biden stay in.

  331. 331.

    Miki

    @TaMara: First thought – she lost.

    Real thought – ya really think the “news” is “new”? Here – there’s a bridge for sale I think you might like ..

  334. 334.

    different-church-lady

    @chemiclord: I actually called him a troll yesterday. Yet I live to call him the same tomorrow. Maybe he didn’t see it.​

  335. 335.

    Sister Golden Bear

    @Goku (aka Amerikan Baka):

    “I can call the spirits from the vasty deep.

    Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
    But will they come, when you do call for them?”

    Warner’s office didn’t deny it, but as Old Will said, he or any pol can seek to assemble of a group of Democrats. However I’ve yet seen any reports that he actually got anyone to assemble.

  336. 336.

    Slightly_peeved

    does anyone know the fancy Latin term for when someone makes a bullshit argument, then when their argument is shown to be bullshit uses the fact people believed their bullshit as a defence of their original argument? It’s like Motte-and-Bailey but I’m not quite sure it fits.

    whatever the term for it is, screaming about Biden having dementia and then saying “well people believe he has dementia” when it becomes obvious he doesn’t have dementia takes some real hide.

  337. 337.

    Slightly_peeved

    @Bettencourt:

    long-time lurker there until now. What Campos just shat out on that blog is so ridiculous and arrogant that even Cheryl can’t save it. “I, a middling law professor, will diagnose Biden with a condition that is difficult to diagnose in person based on a small section of video footage that verifies my biases and an internet connection. No, I won’t use that connection to check if he’s already been checked by doctors for that condition, nor will I wait for the multiple planned interviews and events that will give me more data.” There’s some people there who are in dire need of testing for cognitive decline if you ask me.

  338. 338.

    lowtechcyclist

    @Jay:

    If you see me eating a hotdog, it’s because I am f’n hungry and I need something NOW!

    I’m totally with you on this.

    So we need it to be exactly the way we want it.

    But what’s the ‘we’ doing here? Who’s ‘we’?  If you’d said, “I need it to be exactly the way I want it,” well, so do I, I’m cool with that.

    But there’s a whiff of “we don’t smoke marijuana in Muskogee” here, only with ketchup on hot dogs instead.  Why do so many people have an issue with what other people put on their hot dogs?  Why in the world would anyone think to say that there was a right way and a wrong way to eat a hot dog – not just a right way and a wrong way for them personally, but across the board?

    That’s what boggles my mind.

  341. 341.

    chemiclord

    @Chris: The specific insult was that I accused him of running away from the keyboard to cry after someone called him out for his trolling bullshit.

    It was absolutely juvenile, but at that point I figured if he wanted to be an immature internet troll, I was going to treat him like an immature internet troll.

    Figured I’d go out in flames rather than just quietly walk away.

  342. 342.

    Misterpuff

     

    @Chris:

    But this is Earth, where we believe our media are crusading liberals, because we saw a movie with Robert Redford and Dustin Hoffman once.

    Thanks to Ben Bradlee and the crime beat, the Washington Post scooped the NYT, who did shit investigating Watergate. In retrospect, its remarkable that TFNYT broke the Pentagon Papers.

  343. 343.

    chemiclord

    @comrade scotts agenda of rage: Erik Loomis is a picture perfect example of a guy who thinks being an expert in one field somehow translates to expertise in any other field.

    I would listen to him for an hour speak on the history of labor and labor rights in America (and have).  On literally any other topic, however, his opinions are no more informed or enlightened than your typical layman; and his inability to accept or understand that tends to make him insufferable, especially when interacting with his readers, who he looks down on with naked contempt and trolling.

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