The vice president has entered one of the most consequential moments of her political career, as pressure mounts for President Biden to step aside.
➡️ Our Big Take on how she's handling this stretch w/ @JenniferJJacobs @AmandaGordon: https://t.co/29NmBRplNz
— Akayla Gardner (@gardnerakayla) July 3, 2024
Months of scouring twitter, looking for Vice-President Harris news, and suddenly Our Very Serious Mainstream Media has discovered her! One could hope for a less fraught ‘introduction’ for the normies, but I’m confident Kamala can stand up to scrutiny… From what I can tell, this is Bloomberg (the business wing of the permanent government) announcing they’ve made their peace with the concept of President Harris:
Vice President Kamala Harris has long been written off by many fellow Democrats, with her struggles as the second-in-command seeming to dim her prospects of one day becoming president. But as pressure mounts on President Joe Biden to step aside, party members are suddenly seeing her in a new light.
Democrats who are hellbent on keeping Donald Trump from returning to the White House have taken notice of polls released following Biden’s debate collapse showing Harris performing better against the Republican than the incumbent.
As the sitting vice president, she would face fewer practical hurdles than other potential replacements if she becomes the party’s nominee — most importantly, she’d have the ability to tap the sizable war chest Biden has already raised. She’s also been visible on the world stage, most recently representing the White House at a Ukraine peace summit in Switzerland…
Biden and his allies have steadfastly insisted he plans to continue his campaign, though the president told an ally that he might need to reconsider if he couldn’t improve public opinion with a series of upcoming political events, the New York Times reported Wednesday. White House Press Secretary Karine Jean-Pierre said Biden is “absolutely not” considering dropping out. In a New York Times/Siena College poll released Wednesday, Biden trailed Trump by 6 percentage points among likely voters.
There is disbelief within the vice president’s circle that Biden would actually step aside, according to a person familiar with the matter.
Instead, Harris and her team are moving full speed ahead with their efforts to support the president’s reelection — a posture that allows her to avoid accusations of being disloyal as Biden grapples with the worst crisis of his campaign. In the days following the debate, Harris has acted as a loyal foot soldier, defending Biden in television interviews and speeches to donors and campaign staff. Biden and Harris jointly called in to an all-hands meeting of Biden’s campaign on Wednesday, according to a person familiar with the call.
“Joe Biden is our nominee. We beat Trump once and we’re going to beat him again,” Harris told CBS News outside a San Francisco fundraiser on Tuesday when asked about calls on Biden to quit.
Asked if she is ready to lead the country if necessary, Harris replied, “I am proud to be Joe Biden’s running mate.”…
On Wall Street, a group of early supporters of Harris’s presidential run in the 2020 election say they’re waiting for the process to play out — but are ready to jump in and fundraise aggressively should she be tapped as the nominee.
One such loyalist, who spoke on condition of anonymity, said passing up someone who has already been through the wringer of a presidential primary would be a mistake, and that Republicans would have an opportunity to define a lesser-known governor before they can introduce themselves on a national stage.
“Without question she’s capable of beating Trump,” said Ray McGuire, president of Lazard Inc. and one of the most prominent Wall Street executives to back her run for president several years ago. “She can galvanize the American voter, the woman voter, the Black voter, the religious voter.”…
Harris has helped improve her standing in the White House over the last year with her role speaking out against restrictions on abortion and gun violence, while her staff has stabilized. She has traveled the country to speak to constituencies that Biden is struggling with, including voters of color. Harris is scheduled to address Alpha Kappa Alpha Sorority Inc., her college sorority that is a predominantly Black women’s organization, later this month.
South Carolina Democratic Representative Jim Clyburn, one of Biden’s most prominent Black allies and a supporter of Harris, said Wednesday on CNN that he would support an open process to decide a replacement if Biden exits the race. But Clyburn expressed confidence that “Kamala Harris would acquit herself well” in that situation…
Harris would have a unique advantage if the incumbent drops out: The vice president would have legal access to most of the $240 million Biden’s political operation has on hand. A new candidate wouldn’t have immediate access to all of Biden’s campaign cash, and could start with a balance of zero. Donors who already gave the maximum amount to Biden under US campaign finance law would be allowed to contribute to a new nominee — which could allow a replacement other than Harris to quickly fill their coffers.
Biden has previously indicated he would be supportive of Harris one day running for the Oval Office. In his May commencement address at the historically Black Morehouse College, Biden referred to Harris’s alma mater, Howard University, and her sorority.
“No doubt that a Morehouse man will be president one day, just after an AKA from Howard,” he said.
===========
If we can replace Biden with Harris ASAP we would have a much easier time pushing the media to focus on Trump’s scandals, his lack of touch with reality, and threats against the country. https://t.co/KND8bM8sSL
— Dean Baker (@DeanBaker13) July 5, 2024
Yes, but as @joshtpm writes today, the only way this works is if Dems of all stripes (and, yes, the left) go all in for Harris. https://t.co/JaVAwMKeY8 https://t.co/waBYdCb3VR
— Clean Observer (@Hammbear2024) July 5, 2024
… One good thing I think we’ve seen over the last 72 hours is an increasing realization that, if Biden does step aside, the new candidate really has to be Kamala Harris. I’ve explained before the risks and challenges of throwing the nomination to what editorial boards now routinely call an as-yet-to-be-explained “process” by which a group of people with no clear legitimacy to make any decision beyond nominating Joe Biden will make this decision on behalf of half of the country over a period of a few weeks.
There’s a different, though related, point that hasn’t been sufficiently aired: legitimacy. Joe Biden ran for President in 2020 and, in selecting him, the American people decided that if anything happened to Joe Biden, Kamala Harris would become President. Joe Biden was just renominated with millions of votes. We’re now talking about simply tossing all that out the window. Of course, if Biden steps down a big part of it will go out the window. What has angered me about a lot of the columnists demanding Biden step aside is their almost unanimously deciding that Kamala Harris simply doesn’t exist. There will be some “process,” a choice will be made and all Democrats will unite and say Kumbaya. If you think you can toss the incumbent President and just go full write-your-own-adventure process, I really doubt you fully appreciate the gravity of the step one of the process you’re calling for.
I’ve already noted that I think that optimistic vision is a pipe dream and that tossing aside the black woman Vice President will split the party. But this process simply has no legitimacy. And what angers me about these columnists is just the lack of humility. What are they talking about? On what basis and with what legitimacy or authority are they coming up with this fantasy process? We’re way, way off the rails of democratic legitimacy here. In a case like this it behooves us, both politically and far more substantively, to search for sources of legitimacy where we can and make our choices accordingly. And the obvious and clear ones all point to Kamala Harris. The American people chose her as Biden’s replacement in 2020. And while she wasn’t technically nominated for VP during this year’s primary process, in effect she was since Democrats chose Biden again fully knowing she was part of the package. Her name is literally in the name of the campaign.
Over recent days others have noted the pretty critical fact that only Harris can inherit the mountain of money the Biden-Harris campaign has raised. Anyone else probably can’t. Or at least the Trump campaign can tie it up in the courts, which is functionally the same thing.
Frankly, if Biden does step aside and Harris replaces him I think he should seriously consider resigning from office altogether. Yes, it’s really hard for me to believe I’m writing those words. But the truth is that everything currently under consideration is simply absurd by any normal reckoning. I’ve seen some argue that if Biden isn’t up to running a campaign then he’s not up to being President either. I’m not sure that’s really factually true, though it does have a certain conceptual unity and coherence. More significantly, we come back to the question of democratic legitimacy. If we’re really going to throw out the votes of millions of people and hot swap the presidential candidate, it can’t just be that we think the new person would run a marginally better campaign or make us more comfortable watching the September debate. It can’t be a close call. And if it isn’t, that’s actually a real reason for him to consider stepping down…
Becoming President makes you the President. And no, it’s not as obvious as it sounds. In the U.S. system, becoming President imbues the occupant with a cloak of power and gravity. That is unquestionably an electoral advantage. But we also know what the campaign against Harris will be: that this black woman is a secret far-left radical and if she becomes President she’ll order the forced castration of all white men over 50 and make Cardi-B Secretary of State. You may think that’s hyperbole or funny. But seriously, who are we kidding? The best way to deflate the bogeyman of what Kamala Harris would do as President is to make it no longer theoretical. Make her President.
===========
And now, for something completely different…
There are a good many Democrats who saw/ see this as an opportunity to derail Kamala Harris before the convention, in hopes she’ll never become president. 1/x
— G O L D I E. (@goldietaylor) July 4, 2024
Fear of a Black president? (Here’s Goldie Taylor’s Wikipedia page, for what that’s worth.)
They’re looking back to Barack Obama, blaming him for the rise in white Christian nationalism. They believe Harris would do the same. These are Democrats, mind you.
Rather than see her as a strong, capable leader who has been thoroughly vetted, they see her as someone who would energize the right.
No matter what they tell you, Trump’s camp believes that too. Even so, should she replace Biden, they will fight like hell to keep her off the ballot.
It isn’t Biden they want to stop. It’s Harris. It’s the racism. That’s the through-line.
A Harris presidency ends their fondest hopes and wishes for the white Christian nationalist nation.
Should the Biden/ Harris ticket win, it will save the republic, preserve rule of law, and walk back this horrific SCOTUS era.
Those are the stakes. /fin
Told y’all. https://t.co/jR56GqHVCr
— G O L D I E. (@goldietaylor) July 4, 2024
Jonathan Martin really misses the glorious media fireworks of the TFG error era…
NEW: Dem governors to congressional Dems: Drop Dead
Last night’s show of support outside at the WH enraged Hill Dems
On the differing messages and incentive structures of the two constituencies
My column on a 4th full of fireworks 🇺🇸🇺🇸https://t.co/qwQazCnZTv
— Jonathan Martin (@jmart) July 4, 2024
We Appear to Have a Deal! Hamas Has Indicated They Accept the Terms of the Truce/Ceasefire Proposal
K-Mo
Wait, Balloon Juicers are walking up to reality and ready to stop railing about everyone they disagree with being moronic, ignorant, panicking bed-wetters who are working in bad faith?
just trying to keep up here
Jay
https://www.jefftiedrich.com/p/this-is-getting-fucking-ridiculous
Biden and Harris are in it to win it.
Suzanne
She’s fantastic. I’m in. #TeamBlueNoMatterWho.
I ordered postcards. I have new pens. Don’t fuck with me, my cursive is perfect.
Kelly
Do the political geniuses in the elite press and rich centerist donors not understand that it’s too late to switch out Biden? It’s like telling me to turn around on the way to the airport so they can repack their bags. Gonna miss that flight. Private jet mentality?
cain
We aren’t replacing Biden.
We can save democracy and keep the most successful modern day president in charge.
Even if he is old it’s why we have a goddam vice president. This whole thing is more about Kamala than Biden.
Slightly_peeved
Will someone explain to Dean Baker how the US media works?
The press go easy on Trump because their bosses want Trump as President. If Biden resigns, they’ll find something to criticise Harris about, just like they found something to criticise Clinton about back in the day. Remember all the conniptions about her having pneumonia?
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@Jay:
Good piece. Tiedrich’s always a good read.
“Donny Convict” (from Tiedrich). Good one that I’ll need to add to my lexicon.
scav
I am so fucking tired of the media. Can we just lock them all in a small room with each other and let them opine at each other unto death? Huis Clos for opinion writers.
kindness
MAGA has already cranked up ‘she’s black!’ and ‘she’s a woman!’. I get that. Republicans are a party of grievance and hating others. I really get angry when I see those same notions coming from inside the Democratic Party and liberal intelligencia. They are no different than Democrats For Trump.
rikyrah
Aaron Rupar (@atrupar) posted at 10:45 AM on Fri, Jul 05, 2024:
North Carolina GOP gov nominee Mark Robinson endorses political violence in June 30 video surfaced by @newrepublic: “Kill them! Some liberal somewhere is gonna say that sounds awful. Too bad! … Some folks need killing! It’s time for somebody to say it.” https://t.co/GVKCE7QvVV https://t.co/AjfAxo08xE
(https://x.com/atrupar/status/1809252225354469731?t=K6rUtV4RuytQ-rd0szp3Bw&s=03)
Captain C
So, abuser enablers then.
rk
I have a colleague who I’m fairly close to. After the so called debate debacle I asked her if she has any idea what would be the reaction in the black community (she is black) if Kamala Harris is bypassed and a white man replaces Biden. Usually I resent such questions if anyone asks about my community, but we’re close enough that I can ask her. She said it would be pretty bad, if Kamla was bypassed and there’s be a lot of resentment. I told her that I think it should be a white guy. Becasue that’s the country we live in and no use pretending we don’t. One friend (a white woman) cried for a week after the 2016 and just sobbed that we need a white man to run the next time (she was very excited about Hillary). As a woman it’s very disheatening to know that majority of men will never vote for a woman.
H.E.Wolf
@Suzanne:
Yeah. I’m doing the work, along with you (and countless others). Got no time for the folks who like to fart in elevators to see what other people’s reactions are.
For anyone who hasn’t seen it yet, the current fundraising post has a remarkable poem by niquaeli torres, forwarded by the BJ angel who is leading off the matching donations today.
JoeyJoeJoe
It’s increasingly clear to me that this whole thing is being driven by the media to kneecap Biden and help his predecessor, whose name I won’t even use. I actually had thought that Biden shouldn’t run again, given his age. I thought it would be perfectly fine for him to say that he was just going to serve one term. The more the media pushes this narrative, the more strongly I feel in support of Biden.
I remember what the media did to Hillary, and to Gore too. I’m not going to let them do the same to Biden if I can help it. Fuck’em, I believe is the correct term here
RinaX
This post crystallizes why I can’t get behind the freakout. If something happens to Joe, Kamala is right there. That’s true now, that will be true two years from now, and it’s been true for the past three and a half years. The frenzy does not make sense to me. Well, it didn’t until I realized this is about kneecapping Kamala as well. Simply put, there’s no way there would be a smooth transition.
If you think the fallout is bad now, imagine what the press will do if Democrats are dumb enough to fall into that trap.
Fair Economist
The are totally full of it imagining a movement in Congress wanting to replace Biden with Harris. There are two flakes calling to “have a conversation” and that’s it. Dems in Congress aren’t that dumb.
DougL
I find myself evolving as this continues to play out. The country is in a political torpor lulled into complacent derision toward the idea of either Trump or Biden. But the fingers are all on the scale for Trump now. And the problem is every single day Biden gets older. There is no solution to that problem. I know there will be a host of problems regardless of which direction we choose, so I’m increasingly of the mind that’s it time to upend the board by having Joe resign and making MVP president. Then she nominates Whitmer for VP and in the year of Dobbs we go all in with a female ticket. Imagine the excitement versus the dread we’re all feeling right now. I say it’s time to hasten the contradictions and lean into the fight by making it Harris-Whitmer (or Buttigedge just because he’s that good of a communicator). Let’s run TO the fight not away from it. It’s time.
ETA: I will proceed to duck and cover now.
ETA 2: I’ve reached this conclusion because all the normies I know are turning on Joe. It is a tsunami. My arguments against make no difference. Most will still vote for him (some just won’t vote – I know!) but you cannot win an election with such a dispirited electorate. You. Just. Can’t.
delphinium
Perfectly describes a lot of the media (and I’d include “completely unprofessional” as well). All because deep down they know Trump is a horrible candidate and are trying so, so desperately to push him over the line by continuing to bash Biden and stir up shit amongst our voters.
Suzanne
@H.E.Wolf: I haven’t really started working yet this year. I wrapped up the work projects that I had been on for the last three years in March (100% construction documents), and then changed jobs and instantly got thrown onto another project in which we’re supposed to have documents completed next spring. Holy cats. Looking at the schedule, postcard-writing will be the most I can do this year.
Mike E
@cain: cue our resident shiv caucus!
“Oh, so you think Joe can win? Let me adjust this gas lamp a little…”
slybrarian
I’m really ambivalent about the idea of Biden resigning if he decides to step aside. I feel like Marcy Wheeler is right and that doing so would almost guarantee a concerted effort to kill Harris and install Mike Johnson, who will never in a million years allow Harris to appoint a Vice President. It would also potentially cause problems in the Senate without her being able to cast tie breaking votes, possibly even causing control over the chamber to change due to the defections of Sinemanchin. It seems like a lot of risk to take on just to call her the incumbent.
Fair Economist
@Slightly_peeved: If Biden resigns the media will spend the entire campaign saying he should have resigned sooner and accusing rhe administration of a coverup. It would be WAY worse than running with Joe would be even if he *were* having cognitive problems. Which he isn’t.
rikyrah
Renee (@PettyLupone) posted at 11:40 AM on Fri, Jul 05, 2024:
trump put out a statement denying knowledge of the Heritage Foundation’s plans but 70 of their prev employees went to work for his admin and he does their organization’s bidding.
If we still have a working media, they’ll refute his new claims.
Source: https://t.co/74mLY7D2F9 https://t.co/XpCkVp9uAj
(https://x.com/PettyLupone/status/1809266140839092539?t=h6nb2I-f9NY8W6H0bmS0ng&s=03)
rikyrah
Magdi Jacobs (@magi_jay) posted at 10:48 AM on Fri, Jul 05, 2024:
There is no evidence that Biden is experiencing cognitive decline. There is no evidence that people in the WH are engaged in a “conspiracy of silence.” The American media has made up a false premise & is now positing a nefarious response to this premise. Shocking behavior.
(https://x.com/magi_jay/status/1809252962935419034?t=oe7H3APXscwn5u6ggo90Gw&s=03)
Fair Economist
What it really boils down to is that Biden is a good man doing a great job as President. If we don’t stand with him we are unreliable allies. And that’s not how to win an election.
Splitting Image
@Fair Economist:
Exactly. The take-away from the news media freakout over Joe Biden isn’t that we all need to scrutiinize Joe Biden more carefully. It’s that we all need to scrutinize the news media more carefully.
The quislings at the Times have made their allegiance known.
Tony Jay
I didn’t watch the debate, but Trump must have been horrifyingly bad for the corporate media go after Biden this hard over what was probably just a bad reaction to his top-secret anti-Dementia medicine.
Baud
I’m confident you guys will figure this out.
Elizabelle
I am riding with Joe. And Kamala.
Josie
@DougL:
That’s a nice fantasy, and, as a woman, I would love to see it. It’s not politically viable, however. As a long time, as in 60 years, of being an observer and participant in politics, I can tell you that it just isn’t going to happen.
Too many things are in place at this point to change the direction of the campaign now. The best thing we can do is buckle down and figure out what each of us can do to make sure Biden wins.
Mousebumples
@DougL: if Biden resigns, we won’t have a VP before the election. The House won’t confirm anyone. A new VP would need to be confirmed by both chambers of Congress.
If we swap Biden for Harris, I don’t trust red states to put her on the November ballot. I’d hope the USSC would require it, but… *points at recent decisions*
I’ve heard normies around me in Wisconsin whinging about Biden’s age – but they said the same thing 4 years ago and when I press, they say they’ll still vote for him.
Where are you located? Have you asked if these normies will still vote for Biden?
Elizabelle
@Splitting Image: Thank you! It’s
The Fuck the Fucking Quisling New York Times.
emmyelle
@Kelly: I don’t want to speak for anyone other than myself but one could also imagine that the “geniuses” position is “This is far from optimal but it’s the best choice right now”. Engage with that argument rather than shooting it down.
Harris is not guaranteed to win. Biden is not guaranteed to lose. But I’m becoming increasingly enthusiastic about betting on President Harris and increasingly terrified about Biden. I say this as a staunch defender, and perhaps that’s partly why I am so pissed off at Biden’s inner circle. They are fucking with us. Not on purpose, but because of their genuine love and loyalty to Biden. Same way my mom and aunts were reluctant to face the truth about my grandma when her incidents started to look more like a condition. No one benefits from this.
trollhattan
@Mousebumples:
What happens to that senate tie breaking vote?
The Thin Black Duke
Let’s get real.
White people don’t want to acknowledge how racist White America is.
When push comes to shove, if Biden stepped down and was replaced by Harris, she would lose in November because just enough white people would manufacture reasons not to vote for her.
To pretend otherwise is dangerously naive.
BR
@rikyrah:
I dislike it when supposedly allies frame it this way. It just reinforces “cognitive decline” whether or not you say “no” in front of it. It’s political framing 101 — say the positive statement instead: “Joe Biden is clear eyed and determined to save America, and can tell you step by step how he has been doing it and how he will continue to do it.” etc.
Subsole
@Kelly: They absolutely realize that. They want Trump back.
Mousebumples
@trollhattan: No VP, no one to break the tie, as I understand it.
Another reason I’m riding with Biden.
If he wants to resign next year, after winning in November, totally his call. Especially if we take back the House and keep the Senate.
I’d prefer 2+ more years of President Biden so President Harris can run as an incumbent twice…
Josie
@Josie:
ETA: By “it” I mean two women in the White House, not Harris replacing Biden. I am for Biden all the way.
Jay
President Joe Biden isn’t resigning.
Vice President Kamala Harris has his back.
That is all anybody needs to know. Let the Media go back to smoking their crack pipes through out the silly season and just ignore them. Don’t give them the clicks.
The ruZZian’s in their wildest dreams, could not have imagined having this much success with a disinfo op,
and here this one is home grown by the US MSM.
Mousebumples
@The Thin Black Duke: as a white person in Wisconsin, I agree.
I remember 2022. Evers was reelected (old, white guy)… So was Sen. Johnson with historically bad approval ratings. He beat an amazing Black man, who I wish was my junior Senator.
Midwest states will be an uphill climb if we swap in Harris. Not that we couldn’t win, but I think Biden is the safer choice atop the ticket in Wisconsin, at least.
Subsole
@Slightly_peeved:
Yep. That’s what they’re teeing up now. Every sigh, stutter and cough will be a sign that he’s on life-support.
Meanwhile, Trump has Epstein on speed dial and was sexually assaulting twelve year olds. How much coverage does that merit? Not a bit, per the networks.
These people aren’t frightened, or incompetent, or beaten down by Republican intransigence.
They are fellow-travellers.
206inKY
Yes to all of this! Kamala will exceed all expectations! I suspect that even people who didn’t like her for stupid reasons like personality in 2020 will be blown away by how great it will be to have a calm, competent communicator at the wheel as we approach the most consequential election of our lifetimes (I’m putting aside the sexist/racist fools who aren’t reachable in the first place).
Ballot access is a non-issue—the convention hasn’t even happened yet, and no blue or purple state will fight on this. More important is that she can unquestionably inherit the campaign accounts.
Mike E
@Tony Jay: it’s not only just that, it’s also internal polling showing Mafia Don getting his ass handed to him. What’s surprising is the (early) timing which tells me Putin is getting ready to try something a bit more desperate than what we’ve seen so far. IMO.
emmyelle
Not a fan of Jonathan Martin, to say the least. But I have to admit that when I read the article about the Democratic governors “Nothin to see here, folks”, my response (and facebook post) was, “Great, the people most likely to benefit from there never being a President Harris just told us nothing to assuage our concerns”.
I know no one knows me here, so you don’t have any reason to not tell me to STFU. And if you want me to, I will. I’be been Ridin with Biden since he was the last man standing against that gadfly from Vermont back in 2020. I not only didn’t watch the debate but i didn’t let my husband talk about it in my presence for four days. But since about Monday or so, I’ve been stunned by the lack of anything like assurance or even acknowledgement of the reality here. They are just circling wagons. Harris has her faults (name a serious candidate who does not) but they are 100% addressable and her profound strengths are not being acknowledged.
Pittsburgh Mike
“Sue, has the President called?”
BR
@Mousebumples:
Yeah, my question is how will the white Dem union guy vote in the midwest be affected by a switch from Biden to Harris. Historically Biden has been really tight with the unions and to the extent that union guys are still voting Dem in some places, a change might put that at risk.
JPL
@emmyelle: Biden is doing a spectacular job and I hope that he is healthy enough to continue. Biden/Harris make a great team, but if it end up being Harris/???? I’ll walk over hot coals to vote for them.
gwangung
@DougL: I’m just pissed that I’m being steamrollered and gaslit by arrogant assholes out of touch with the majority of Democratic voters.
Chris Johnson
@Elizabelle: “Russia Today” is shorter.
BR
@206inKY:
I dunno, she’s not that much of a better communicator than Biden. They are both about the same in my book — pretty good, but no Obama. Her voice is stronger than Biden’s now, so that might be a plus, but there are men who are sexist who might be turned off no matter what, so that’s a minus. It’s a wash.
jowriter
@The Thin Black Duke: Truth. Look at recent history here. Kamala is already there if something should happen. I want the ones that brought me to this dance. It’s Biden/Harris for me. Neither was ever my first choice but they have won me over bigtime. The media is salivating to take MVP apart should their fantasy of her ascension come to pass. They’ve spent the better part of three and a half years dissing everything about her. We already need a VP with a tiebreaker vote in the Senate. Mike Johnson, anyone? I. don’t. think. so. GOP convention in two weeks. Let’s hang on a bit, shall we, and wait for that public shitshow. Why the hell not? Let’s be nice to our fellow/actual Democrat worriers, but let’s not roll over for them. Courage!
Mike E
@The Thin Black Duke: in NC we had a terrific candidate for senate, Cheri Beasley, supreme court justice and far better alternative to the canned ham (R) who won it due to the 3-5% headwind any woman of color has to overcome here in the Old Confederacy. It’s shitty but that’s where we are.
emmyelle
@206inKY: I’m with you!
There is so much focus on Harris’ totally addressable weaknesses, and an underappreciation of her great strengths. She can rightfully own and vigorously defend the Biden administration’s record. She runs circles around Biden when talking about Roe. She’s a friggin mixed race prosecutor who will not only clobber a convicted felon but will also clobber the narrative of woke libs soft on crime. She has no weakness that Biden does not have and she has strengths he does not have.
And she’s not 80 years old.
I’ve been a staunch defender of Biden from mid-2020. What is happening to him saddens me. What his inner circle has allowed to happen TO US infuriates me.
I’m with Nancy Pelosi.
Lapassionara
Meanwhile, more Epstein documents have been released and TFG’s name is all over them. Where are the front page stories about this information?
VFX Lurker
These are the times that pie men’s souls.
I just sent another unfamiliar nym to the pie filter. I’m here to donate to Balloon-Juice fundraisers and write Postcards to Voters. I have no time for nonsense in these threads.
Jay
@emmyelle:
https://www.jefftiedrich.com/p/this-is-getting-fucking-ridiculous
Clutch your pearls harder, maybe take to the fainting couch, or take up day drinking again.
Baud
@emmyelle:
What did Pelosi say?
Jackie
@Suzanne:
I hope you’re mailing your postcards to voters 25 years old on up! Your perfect cursive handwriting will be a foreign language to the yoots. //
delphinium
@Tony Jay: Ha Ha! But yeah, the more the media continues their hysterics, the more desperate they appear and makes me support Biden/Harris even more.
I mean damn, besides Trump’s actual record, he couldn’t even answer a debate question. And his unhinged rants are only appealing to a smaller and smaller audience.
emmyelle
@BR: My hope is that the white midwest union guy gets some assurance from Biden that Harris is his gal, too and she will continue to fight for them.
If there is any ugliness here, any sense that this was forced on Biden. that will be a steeper hill to climb. Biden’s agency is essential here.
Mike E
So, like her you’ll be supporting the president hahaha no you won’t.
wjca
Call me cynical. But I’m guessing that they’ve figured out that pushing for her is their only chance for getting Biden out of the race.
Much as they might prefer an exciting circular firing squad of a contested convention, at least taking Biden off the field would provide much more excitement than just watching him beat Trump. Again. So, any port in a storm — push Harris.
emmyelle
@Jay: That’s my cue to leave.
I think I have been respectful here.
Baud
@Suzanne:
I’m jealous. My handwriting is terrible.
Spanky
@Tony Jay: Hey, congrats on the Torxit thing.
BR
The other thing nobody is factoring in is that Harris would have to choose a VP nominee and that would be highly contentious (since she wasn’t the one who one the nomination directly — but indirectly as Biden’s VP) and the media will focus on the negatives of any Dem elevated to the national stage. Showing weakness to the media just invites more attacks.
Jay
@Baud:
That President Joe Biden had a bad debate performance.
Mousebumples
@BR: I think unions would still support Harris. My concern is more over the white male conservative (anti/never Trump) vote. I could see them talking themselves into supporting Biden. I’d like to think they’d support Harris… But then I remember the very racist ads against Mandela Barnes in 2022 or sexist/misogynist messaging against Hillary in 2016… And it makes me nervous, when the stakes are this high.
emmyelle
@Baud: Pelosi is one of the few top Dems to say “I think it’s a legitimate question to say, ‘Is this an episode, or is this a condition?’ And so when people ask that question, it’s completely legitimate.”
Baud
@Jay:
I think that’s uncontroversial. Didn’t Biden say that himself?
Spanky
@The Thin Black Duke:
Oh, the generic “white people” won’t need to. The MSM will be working overtime on that.
Baud
@emmyelle:
Did she then express her opinion on that topic?
emmyelle
@Mike E: I’ll vote for your dog if they are the democratic nominee. I’ll be pissed about it, and pissed when your dog, predictably loses. But, yes, I will vote for Biden if it comes to that. GenZ maybe not so much. They’ll stay home.
Geoduck
CNN.com is also riding hard on the “Dems switching to Harris” train, with a lot of anonymous quotes about people talking about it.
emmyelle
@Baud: She reminded us that she is not a doctor, while talking about the importance of having some real information, which we do not have.
gwangung
@emmyelle: It’s a legitimate question to ask.
It’s not legitimate to not wait for an answer and go full-bore toward replacing him.
Nor is it legitimate to discuss replacement with Harris without an assessment of downsides (particularly when her very purpose is to be a replacement if Biden falls).
Mike E
@emmyelle: bullshit. Thanks for playing though!
Jay
@Baud:
Nope, just that it was a legitimate question.
One would think that a politician with her experience would have avoided the trap, but nope.
cain
@scav:
We need to start a Democratic “Divestment” movement. Stop all subscriptions to these people and reward agencies that are actually doing actual news. We need to use market forces – they aren’t listening to us because the controversy itself brings eyeballs in it. You’re walling in dirt with them and like pigs they enjoy it.
Stop getting into the mud, go find a garden and hang out there – have a picnic.
I’ve ranted on this top 500 blog site for years talking about how 24 hour news is killing journalism.
emmyelle
@gwangung: I fuylly agreee that Harris’ downsides need to be discussed, so they can be addressed. Lots of people are doing this.
Sooner is better here. The longer we let the GOP define hHarris, the harder it will be for her to define herslef.
West of the Rockies
@Jay:
Today’s WP lead story is full-on Biden is Decrepit. Fuck them.
Baud
@Jay:
Probably accommodating the nervous Dems.
satby
@VFX Lurker: donate to the Biden-Harris campaign (too). Small donors continuing to support Biden is a huge signifier of support and reassures larger donors.
Ain’t gonna be nothing to organize if we blow up our own ticket.
Baud
@emmyelle:
You don’t agree with Pelosi since you’re already on the replace train.
206inKY
@DougL: Yes x 10000
cain
@rk:
That’s because the older generations still have problems with women in charge for some reason. We still haven’t flipped over to the younger generations where acceptance is so much more.
This entire switch to fascism is to stop the fact that the demographics are no longer being in their favor.
Bex
Lots of trolls here today, along with “concern” types. Do they really think there will be an election in 2028 if Trump gets into office? Could it be that’s what they want?
emmyelle
@Baud: I’ve always respected your comments. So I will let this pass, and be on my way.
Eyeroller
@Jay: In my experience, Democrats, especially older ones who grew up in the Walter Cronkite type era, seem to assume a good-faith media that can be placated. They have never really adapted to the media landscape of the past 20-25 years.
Eyeroller
@West of the Rockies: Guess it’s time for me to cancel that subscription also. I’m supposed to be getting a paper copy on Sundays and haven’t for several weeks anyway, so clearly they are going downhill under the new management.
Jay
@Baud:
Nope, Pelosi is,……….OLD.
A key rule, is you don’t answer the hypotheticals.
Baud
@emmyelle:
Much appreciated.
cain
@DougL:
Yeah, sorry – doing that will be political suicide. The people panicking are going to vote for Joe regardless or htey won’t vote at all and that’s one dumb thing.
The media is homing in for the kill and we got to push back. Remember, it’s the media that is driving the freak out followed by some former Bernie lovers and what not. It’s the same old tricks. Don’t be fooled.
Tony Jay
@Mike E:
Rumour has it his Only Fans page is going to be lit like the Rockefeller Centre Christmas Tree.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@Spanky: Don’t forget the misogynists
gwangung
@emmyelle: I still don’t see an honest gaming out of what would happen with a replacement, let alone whether it’s less than if we let things go forward as is. Right now what I get is that the perception of inability is stronger than any reality of infirmity and that trumps all. I do not accept that.
VFX Lurker
Agreed.
I’ve been sending $46/month to the Biden-Harris campaign since January. After I saw a few Juicers panic over the debate last month, I sent an extra $100 that night before I went to bed. I wanted the narrative to be: “Biden has record fundraising after debate.”
Will see if I can send extra this month, too.
JPL
Someone did a count of NYT’s coverage of Biden’s debate. 192 articles in total with 50 of those opinion pieces. Yup in the tank for the fascists regime, but in other words nothing new.
Subsole
@Lapassionara: Yeah. The fact that Mr. “I overturned Roe for Jesus and the children” was sexually assaulting 12 year olds doesn’t merit more strident media coverage is…illuminating.
Really lets you see who the press sympathizes with. Who they consider worthy of protecting. What sort of behavior they think is normal.
Very odd set of priorities on display.
delphinium
@cain: Boy is that the truth! My uncle wouldn’t vote for Hillary because he didn’t think a woman should be in charge so instead voted Trump. When I asked him how voting for someone who didn’t have a clue how the government worked was better, no response. At least he voted for Biden in 2020.
Subsole
@wjca:
Yeah.
They want KHive to shiv Joe, get us fighting each other.
Which just shows these folks fundamentally don’t understand KHive.
K-Mo
@Jay:
So your interpretation of Nancy’s statement is that she is making a fundamental mistake of political messaging befitting a neophyte?
Any other possible interpretations come to mind?
Jay
@Eyeroller:
How many decades has Pelosi been attacked in the MSM?
The answer to the question is, “That’s a stupid fucking question. President Joe Biden had a bad first 20 minutes in the “Not A Real Debate”, and then rallied and finished strong. I work with the President every day and he is always on top of it, etc.”
MisterForkbeard
@K-Mo: No, not everyone. Just you, dear.
cain
@Lapassionara:
Trump fucking gang raped a 13 year old girl with Epstein. We’re still talking about Joe now?
As Trump’s personal baggage gets worse, the media is going to keep trying to go for Joe.
We need to start talking to any local Dem politician calling for Biden’s head and ask them some questions in regards to Trump. Call up your local congressperson and ask them wtf they are going to do about Trump – NOT biden.
We can’t allow Dem politicians to freak out over what the media is doing.
Kay
Mike E
@Tony Jay: heh, nice to see Torxit and the Londongrad denizens fully anglicized by a steady diet of Page 3 😉
Tim in SF
If we line up behind Harris, the right wing mob (followed shortly after by a supplicant press) will be all Willie Brown, all the time. Remember what they are doing to Fani Willis for having an in-office romance? It will be so much worse. SO MUCH.
MinuteMan
The naivete in that quote is breathtaking. If Biden were to drop out in favor of Harris the press won’t suddenly start talking about Felonius Gunk because his flaws aren’t novel (well, maybe someone will give space to the Epstein files that dropped recently). Instead the stories will be about
Dems desperately in disarray
Anonymous but prominent (take their word for it) Dems worried that Harris isn’t up to the task.
Various of Harris’s minor flaws, faux pas, and even bogus but plausible lies about her, etc., will become juicy scoops. Her pathetic presidential campaign did not last long enough for the press to really unload on her and the media doesn’t really care about a VP unless they are Agnew-like over the line.
Tony Jay
@delphinium:
They know how unappealing Stench is to most swing voters and to a chunky bunch of GOP voters, and that terrifies them. This is all just about muddying up Biden and giving them something they can cover that isn’t “the Republican nominee is a mould-brained racist sex-offending felon who plans to dismantle the Constitution and seek off the country for parts”.
That might sell more newspapers, but anyone who ran that story wouldn’t be working at one for long.
K-Mo
@emmyelle: (translation: bless your heart)
cain
@emmyelle:
People are reacting to the fact you’ve taken a position that ultimately is unworkable but also your position is feeding trauma here. Hence the responses. Please extend some grace. You might feel like you are respectful but you can see how intense the thread has become because our people are traumatized.
Eyeroller
@Jay: I know. She should have just replied (without the profanity) “Joe had a bad night, it can happen to anybody.” She never should have even slightly validated the premise that there was a problem.
VFX Lurker
Some of them could be trolls living outside of the United States. Others could be privileged, upper-caste Americans who think they’ll be fine, no matter what happens.
DougL
@emmyelle:
I’m not on the replace train (as I suspect you aren’t) but I am on the train passing all these stations that are blinking red saying we have a big problem ahead. I’ve wanted to ignore them and in terms of my own voting it matters not (broken glass etc for the Dem) but the noise is getting so loud regular people can hear. And to be honest with myself, it is a rumble I’ve heard for awhile. Biden is old. Perhaps too old. The debate (which I know is not an actual thing a president does in the job) reinforced that in spades. It is the story now. Maybe we can hunker down and Trump will do something so outrageous it won’t get swept away that it will become the story. Maybe that happens but right now the election is about Biden. We lose that election I fear.
artem1s
exactly. why on earth would dems voters even be discussing the obvious weaknesses of the GOP continuing to support TCFG as their candidate when they can spend the next 100 days whinging about why the Dems didn’t find a perfect candidate for them?
any serious challenger had 4 years to make their case that Dem voters should ditch Biden and no one stepped up to make the case or raise the funds or put together a team to get them on the primary ballots. there is a process. the voters (even in NH where he wasn’t on the ballot) have been speaking. they are not going to change their minds because the FYNYT and sad sack loser Tim Ryan still have a sad that we wanted Biden/Harris in 2020 and we want them again in 2024.
I’m done with these post for the foreseeable future until the misinformation campaign has left the BJ building. Biden is ahead in the polls in WI. that is a post debate poll. I’ll concentrate on the ‘non-Wilmer’ posts raising GOTV from here on out.
MinuteMan
@Tony Jay: The PTB are starting to worry that a Biden second term, combined with the potential capture of Congress, might usher in many of the things that they’ve always feared: return to Eisenhower-era income tax brackets, a wealth tax, medicare for all, easy ability to unionize, prosecution of C-suite for business crimes, reform of the Supreme Guardian Council/Court, etc.
K-Mo
@MisterForkbeard: ok I’ll keep checking, sweetheart.
cain
@Tony Jay: Waiting for the front page summary of Toriexit. Fucking clowns.
I can’t wait we do that here. If the one thing I will say – at least, UK will not decide to do fascism and upturn their entire govt unlike us.
Goddam, I had no idea how fragile this country’s apparatus is.
rikyrah
Jen “I dissent ” Rubin (@JRubinBlogger) posted at 8:37 AM on Fri, Jul 05, 2024:
Those who rushed to call for him to step down without poll evidence to substantiate their predictions of disaster and without affording him the chance to course correct acted irresponsibly and arguably only made the dilemma worse. Pundits’ arrogant effort to boot out a party’s democratically selected nominee with no care for the chaos it might unleash or the relative merits of dumping the advantage of incumbency didn’t help. Such overreach coupled with the media’s ongoing effort to normalize Trump (despite his obvious mental liabilities, personality defects and tyrannical plans) naturally pushed Biden to dig in his heels.
(https://x.com/JRubinBlogger/status/1809220168431935654?t=ZUb0AfQA8i1k4A5QVAWxJw&s=03)
Jay
@Eyeroller: I always go with profanity, it acts as punctuation and in conversation is as effective as a baseball bat in a bar fight. It stuns the stupid out of most people.
cain
@artem1s:
I’m with you, these posts are unhelpful.
But for those feeling angry and want to do something – start canceling your subscriptions. Unfollow assholes. Make some goddam apple or cherry pie.
Watch Beverly Hills Cop 4.
rikyrah
Thread
President Kamala’s Hand (Again) (@myronjclifton) posted at 6:32 PM on Thu, Jul 04, 2024:
The miscalculation so many in media & *some dems are making is not understanding the loyalty of Black women In general & specifically w/regard to VP Harris to Biden
And the racial aspect of paying it forward from Biden standing by Obama 8 years.
VP won’t backstab Pres Biden.
(https://x.com/myronjclifton/status/1809007428241097000?t=0kUZpTwqTZE9uBTxOKq53w&s=03)
Eyeroller
@Jay: Sure, but Nancy can’t do that. Imagine the hurt feelings of the press. How uncivil!
cmorenc
An enormous mis-assumption is being made by many commenters in this thread, that Biden would need to resign as President for Harris to take his place as the D nominee. There is NO such requirement – Biden can announce he is stepping aside as the candidate while still finishing the remaining 6 months of his term.
Second, public concern over Biden’s age isn’t merely a media creation, though they have given it an assist. It’s because of what millions of the public saw with their own eyes last Thur night – Biden often unable to put together a coherent sentence or thought in precisely the fashion they already associate with seniors in their own circles who are losing their mental acuity. Yes, what they saw may also have been Biden struggling against a cold while and being poorly prepped by his debate team to deal with Trump’s Gish Gallop of lies, but that explanation fails to override the overwhelming public take of Joe coming across as a declining elderly dude, even if in fact it was a one-off bad night.
Baud
When is Joe’s rally in Madison?
Mousebumples
Enjoy pie liberally. I see trolls and agitators among us, rooting for injuries.
Not all newbies are arguing in bad faith. But some might be.
rikyrah
@rikyrah:
President Kamala’s Hand (Again) (@myronjclifton) posted at 6:36 PM on Thu, Jul 04, 2024:
They don’t know what to make of her loyalty to him because they know in the same position they’d be cutting back room deals and undermining him at every turn.
That is the way of corporate and political arenas. That’s why they hated Obama and why they hate VP Harris (one reason)
(https://x.com/myronjclifton/status/1809008399209935196?t=D2NoA2oZS0UbrOioXAOW-g&s=03)
Lapassionara
@MinuteMan: This! I have seen this pattern so many times over the years. The press is NEVER satisfied if they succeed in getting a politician to do whatever it is they say they want him or her to do. NEVER. They will just find something else to natter on about.
the fact that the Epstein files have made barely a ripple is all the proof we need.
rikyrah
@rikyrah:
President Kamala’s Hand (Again) (@myronjclifton) posted at 6:39 PM on Thu, Jul 04, 2024:
You won’t have a friend if they won’t tell why you’re wrong and you owe an apology. VP Harris called out Pres Biden at that debate with truth and respect.
That unvarnished truth telling isn’t unique to Black women but.. something different abt Black & brown women in that way
(https://x.com/myronjclifton/status/1809009174661247443?t=6zbiJQ3NCLVzRMQF9UB1Fg&s=03)
rikyrah
@rikyrah:
President Kamala’s Hand (Again) (@myronjclifton) posted at 6:42 PM on Thu, Jul 04, 2024:
We can’t even know how many media losers are calling VP Harris staff to get dirt
But we know they ain’t getting sh*t because nothing is coming out so they’re making up stuff about him using unnamed low level & ex staffers.
They’re going low but VP Harris is staying high. Huh.
(https://x.com/myronjclifton/status/1809009978038235360?t=UN-pCVUbpPuFD2JWKtXfHQ&s=03)
Jay
@Mousebumples:
It’s not just the newbies, there are many old nyms shitting their pants in public.
rikyrah
@rikyrah:
President Kamala’s Hand (Again) (@myronjclifton) posted at 6:49 PM on Thu, Jul 04, 2024:
All the lies, rumors, made up Jake Tapper crap, and New York Times attempt to “Hillary” Biden are being debunked in real time, thankfully.
And when they pivot (back) to attacks on VP Harris they won’t have disloyal backstabbing lies to rely on.
VP Harris ain’t like them.
End
(https://x.com/myronjclifton/status/1809011627746046282?t=h42MvRx1EuNEe_WVpDR5Sw&s=03)
Tony Jay
@Spanky:
On the one hand, it’s hilarious and very, very overdue, on the other hand it’s almost entirely down to Reform splitting the righty vote in a low participation election that saw fewer people vote Labour than in 2019.
Once the euphoria of No More Tories dies down, people are going to look at the nuts and bolts of this election and see that it’s a prelude to something very dark indeed on the horizon.
Mousebumples
@cmorenc: Biden doesn’t need to resign to step aside as nominee. True.
But if you think the media won’t grab his scalp as Dems In Disarray! and that the reporting will get better – that seems to be assuming facts not in evidence.
rikyrah
@Tony Jay:
Can’t wait for your post on the recent elections.
Tell it all👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾
Mousebumples
@Jay: that is true. However, I am more skeptical of newbies being from a Russian troll farm vs being a long standing commenter who is just getting nervous given the stakes.
trollhattan
@Tony Jay: I do appreciate a process that gets right to it.
Mousebumples
They want Trump. Doesn’t matter who we run. They will be shitty at media things.
I vote run the old White guy vs the old White guy.
gene108
@Fair Economist:
We aren’t the issue. The last two times I saw Democrats this fractured over a candidate was in 2000 and 2016. Just enough possible Democratic voters in a few states either stayed home or voted third party to let the Republican win the EC.
This race, like 2016 and 2020, is coming down to a few tens of thousands of votes in a handful of states.
Can Biden pull these voters, in like he did in 2020, after his debate performance and this pile on? I doubt it.
Could Harris replacing him end the bad coverage? I doubt it. The media will have their knives out for Harris immediately.
I think Biden blew this election by wanting to (1) debate trump which trump was not calling for, and (2) fucking it up so badly.
I’ll do what I can turn out voters, but I’m not sure how much it matters.
As I believe lamh36 pointed out after the 2016 election, the minority vote cannot defeat the vote. If enough white voters are turned off by Biden, then we’re fucked. It doesn’t matter how much black people are mad about the “Black jobs” remark. White people are the majority.
Kay
Long line for Biden event in Madison – saw pix on Instagram
looks like he’ll have a good crowd
Captain C
@Subsole:
Were any of them on the Epstein flights also?
Baud
@Kay:
👍
Jay
@Tony Jay:
On the bright side, Nigel got shit on at his acceptance speech, and now has to report his income and sources of funding,
Oh, and last week, Tommy Robinson got arrested in Calgary, and had his “Irish” passport seized. Funny that, an Irishman and EU resident leading the Brexit Charge and the Jackboot Party of Britain.
Baud
@gene108:
A guaranteed loss suggests we shouldn’t change the ticket.
Kay
@gene108:
I think them needing a debate was an acknowledgment they were behind. No one suggests a debate unless they’re behind. It just blew up, which happens with plans sometimes.
Mousebumples
@Kay: thanks for the report!
I’m still excited that the WI Supreme Court said drop boxes are legal again! Yay!
DougL
@Mousebumples:
please count me among the latter even tho I don’t comment all the time. But if we can’t even discuss this issue on this here top 10k blog without being accused of fifth column behavior I don’t even know how to respond.
JPL
@Baud: Do you have any idea how to stream Biden’s rally?
Geminid
@Subsole: It’s the Apple of Discord tactic, outsiders tossing apples among Democrats in hopes they’ll fight over them.
This debate controversy has been like a cluster bomb loaded with crabapples of discord. People are rehearsing all their old gripes against different party factions– those dam’ Blue Dogs! those stinkin’ Bernie Bros!– and creating new ones. Some are even giving their spice racks the side-eye!
Baud
@JPL:
I do not.
Mike in NC
@Mike E: In the ex-Confederacy any mediocre white male the GOP runs for office is automatically halfway to getting elected.
Kay
@Mousebumples:
That is great. Wisconsin Dems have an admirable thoroughness – they pull every lever
Mike E
lol wut
I’m sure you’ll come up with something.
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@Fair Economist:
That summarizes how the base of the party looks at the collective freak out and the continued-justification-for-the-freak-out by white liberals.
Chris
@RinaX:
I mean, a lot of this is just people being terrible at civics. We don’t elect presidents, we elect governments. Roosevelt died in office and Reagan was almost certainly mentally affected at the end of his term, and in both cases the result was… absolutely nothing: the government moved right on as before. Reagan did a lot more damage to the country out of sound mind and body than he ever did out of dementia, sad to say! So yeah: if Biden dies or becomes incapacitated in office, the government keeps right on ticking.
But of course you can’t say that out loud anywhere but a place like this. (Even though the media knows full well that it’s true: they helped cover up how sick both Roosevelt and Reagan were, and probably JFK as well. They also almost certainly allowed George W. Bush to do an entire debate while listening on an earpiece, be damned to the concerns that should have raised about his state of mental capacity).
Baud
@Geminid:
There things always turn into “my prediction of doom is better than your prediction of doom.”
satby
@cain: uh, excuse me. Lots of us old boomers here are women, and have been working elections and voting for women, including a woman for president, for a very long time.
Elizabelle
@Fair Economist: Agreed.
Jay
@gene108:
Gaslight are you?
TCFG challenged Biden to debate him, way back in March, not the other way around.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-68497838
I am remote diagnosing you with late stage dementia, hand in your drivers license and report to extended care immediately.
Captain C
@Tony Jay: Pictures of his face badly photoshopped onto Fabio romance novel covers?
satby
@VFX Lurker: appreciate you!
Mr. Bemused Senior
Perhaps some apple cobbler is in order.
cain
@satby:
That’s doesn’t invalidate what I said. We’re talking about voter patterns not who is working on the campaigns. I’m quite aware that older women run a lot of the campaigns and are an enthusiastic part of any Democratic campaign.
wjca
Yes. But you are cheerfully ignoring the detail that they weren’t concerned by Trump’s performance. “Horrified” would be closer.
Ksmiami
@Mike in NC: and that’s why their actual quality of life metrics are so bad. Idiocracy and corruption means death and disease.
cain
@rikyrah:
My wife was telling me that on TikTok some folks are saying that there are rumors that _Obama_ was telling Biden that he might need to not run. I was like BULLSHIT.
Those two know exactly what the media landscape is like. The Dem freakout is always ridiculous and we need to stay the course.
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@Jackie:
True story: friend retired from the Post Office maybe 4 years ago. After 3 of years of retirement, he got bored so last year applied to be a school bus driver.
He filled out the application. Before they interviewed him, they came back into the office and said “we can’t read your application.” Why? Cursive.
And yes, the people in the hiring process were all of a certain age. After walking them thru what he’d written, he then talked to them about 401(k)s.
cmorenc
@Mousebumples: So all of us who are not smoking Hopium about Biden’s debate performance and recognized how indelible that impression is with too many normie non-MAGA voters are trolls? Trump is beatable, but likely not by Biden post-Thur night. To overcome the impression Biden made thur night, we are asking the public to watch and believe this demo he’s putting on rather than their lying eyes and eaers. Far fewer outside Biden’s committed base are going to watch Stephanipolis’s interview with Biden, compared to those who watched the debate.
Kay
I;ve been riding a bicycle lately, which I loved as a kid but stopped doing for 30 years because I was busy.
I’m up in Michigan, near the Lake and so I’ve been doing a lot of riding around crowds of vacationers. Last night I passed this young family and the mother in the group made eye contact with me and gave me this indulgent smile that I recognized – it’s how I used to smile at older ladies. Like “isn’t she cute on her bike, ambulatory and all”. I was “oh, my GOD, I’m the older lady!” Funny.
satby
@comrade scotts agenda of rage: totally sums up how I, an old white lady, and my millennial kids feel too. They know what the choices are, and they aren’t freaked out. They’re voting for Biden/Harris.
Baud
I’m just happy we’re debating something real instead of whether a great economy is shitty.
BeautifulPlumage
@cmorenc:
Assumes facts not even close to being in evidence. Now, if you had said “…too many maga pundits and other journalists/opinion-havers with a column…” I might be able to agree.
delphinium
@gene108: Honest questions: Do you think Trump’s worse debate performance has any sway? Post-debate polls showed more people thought Trump did worse and had more unfavorable views. Do you think the overturning of Roe and the more recent Supreme Court decisions make any difference?
The media, because they are desperate and it’s their go-to-play in election years (see Tamara’s comment #3 in the last post for headline examples) are going full bore on this because they know otherwise Trump has lower chance of winning. I honestly don’t think the majority of the public is asking for/nor wants these continued Biden stories.
I understand the concern because our elections are won on the margins and it doesn’t take much to change outcomes in the swing states. But I don’t think (hope) that a bad debate performance overshadows everything else, especially if we do our part to support Dems and push back on the media hysteria.
Geoduck
@DougL: And if Biden drops out, the media will make the election about that, redoubled. We won’t hear the Shiatgibbon’s name until election day.
I will note that at least Lawyers Guns and Money have forced themselves to move on to new topics.
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@trollhattan:
Continuity per Larry the Cat:
https://twitter.com/Number10cat/status/1809165908545347823
satby
This you? Looks like a pretty broad brush.
Baud
@Geoduck:
This genuinely surprises me.
Mousebumples
@cmorenc: it’s not about Biden’s debate performance – though from reporting I’ve read of opinions of minorities and normies, Biden won the debate.
It’s about the racism and misogyny in our media and political landscape.
Biden’s old? Surprise, we knew that 4 years ago. Trump is old too, and even more mentally unstable.
If Biden was running against Nikki Haley, I’d want to flip for Harris atop the ticket. I prefer Biden vs Trump.
Mike E
@satby: misogyny is a goddam road grader.
satby
@Baud: yeah, but it’s just tedious at this point. No one IRL that I know had a change of voting heart after the debate, including my sons and their friends who I saw this weekend. They’re not enthused about the geriatric tickets offered to them, but I was told in no uncertain terms that there was “no fucking way” they were voting for the traitor.
Jay
@cmorenc:
Yup.
According to post debate polls and focus groups, normies don’t give a shit about President Joe Biden’s performance, and are horrified about what Convicted Child Rapist was spewing.
The next day, they went back to worrying about somebody bringing potato salad with raisins to the July 4th BBQ.
Is Sultzburger paying you?
rikyrah
@gene108:
Willard Romney got the SAME PERCENTAGE OF THE WHITE VOTE IN 2012 that the Orange Menace got in 2016. The difference was the non -White vote in 2012 vs 2016.
satby
@Mike E: IF you believe that, then misogynoir is worse and people should quit pretending otherwise.
Mike E
@satby: we are in complete agreement. Black women are the backbone of the Democratic party.
Chris
Off topic, but once you scroll a little bit down from the top of the New York Times website, you get this headline:
“Labour Won A U.K. Landslide. Why Doesn’t It Feel Like That?”
The NYT considers it their job to tell left-wing voters how to feel and that everything is a disaster for them. Apparently a lot of left-wing voters are happy to indulge them. How this can possibly end well, I don’t know.
mrmoshpotato
@Jay: Jeff yelled about the press’s anti-Biden bullshit much better than I could, because I read any of this anti-Biden, he-should-drop-out bullshit, and I ask if it’s too early to start drinking.
EarthWindFire
@cmorenc: Except all of them were in the position of seeing his next day rally in NC and either couldn’t be bothered or chose to ignore it. Pro tip: if someone’s fine the next day, he had a off night. This isn’t hard. We Democrats are making it hard and keeping Donald Trump’s utter lack of fitness out of the spotlight it belongs under.
Baud
@Chris:
Pitchbot -UK edition
stacib
@The Thin Black Duke: Said much better than I had written which was so angry, I deleted it before posting. Biden had one bad half hour, and the quickness with which the calls for him to leave the race have just pissed me off. If this were a pattern, hell, if he had another episode prior and since, I could at least see where this shit is coming from, but holy hell, we’re supposed to be the supporters, and we were the first ones off the flippin’ boat. With friends like these…
Adding, folks who believe the Kamala Harris has a chance in hell of being president if she replaces Biden is just fuckin’ delusional to the realities of this country.
Suzanne
@cain:
FWIW, I think this is a lot of why people say they have an issue with Biden’s age. It feels a bit like he caters to the aesthetic preferences of an older electorate. Like we can only have center-left politics if an older white guy is the leader.
God. This is all so exhausting. I promised myself I was only going to think about the UK and France.
Chris Johnson
@Geoduck: That’s kind of what I look for. I figure there are bad actors (emphatically including outlets like the New York Times, who’ve absolutely gone mask-off as if there was ever any doubt) and there are perfectly sound people who, when asked ‘If everybody was jumping off a cliff would you take desperate measures to stop this cliff-jumping?’ would take that ‘if’ in good faith and go, why yes, what’s all this then? Everybody was what now?
And that’s the vulnerability being used and abused. Not everyone is as cynical as us politics junkies. Some people expect good faith. Even from the NYT… or Donald Trump.
I watch for whether the people STICK to the bad take like glue no matter what happens, and tirelessly keep repeating it like their paycheck depends on it. ‘cos there are those for whom that’s true, and there are those who get swept up in the narrative.
I particularly love it when people carry on how Trump is clearly this dominant force who doesn’t need to resort to desperate chip-cashings like this, when entire RNC offices are literally broke and bankrupt, because Trump literally took all their money for himself and his bullshit legal bills.
Suuuuure, that guy’s got alll the power. Right. Totally doesn’t need desperate scramblings to somehow kneecap his sure-and-steady opposition.
Soprano2
@The Thin Black Duke: ITA, that’s where “I’ll vote for a black person, just not this one” or “I’ll vote for a woman, but not that one” came from. Obama was the rare person who could overcome this. Look at what happened in WI in 2022 – the white Democratic governor candidate won, the black senatorial candidate lost with the same electorate. Anyone who thinks a sudden Harris presidential run wouldn’t be a bloodbath is fooling themselves.
Jay
@mrmoshpotato:
It’s after 5pm somewhere,………
stacib
@emmyelle: You left off part of the quote:
“I think it’s a legitimate question to say, is this an episode, or is this a condition? And so when people ask that question, it’s completely legitimate — of both candidates,” Pelosi, still a prominent member of the House Democratic Caucus, said in an interview on MSNBC’s “Andrea Mitchell Reports.”
“Both candidates owe whatever test you want to put them to, in terms of their mental acuity and their health — both of them,” she added.
Steve in the ATL
Now that is some quality trolling!
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@Mike E:
When I refer to the base of the Democratic Party, that’s who I’m referring to.
Chris
@Geoduck:
… you mean the guys who just posted “medical experts say Biden needs to be examined for Parkinsons?”
Yeah, I noticed they’d let up shortly, but I didn’t think it would last. They’ve gotten a lot of pushback from commenters and now it’s a matter of honor and they need to keep doubling down.
cmorenc
@BeautifulPlumage:
Polling indicates that 3/4 of the public think that after Thur night.
Suzanne
@Jackie:
Never fear. I can also do the stupid millennial wedding script, architectural block lettering, and pointed pen.
Handwriting is a bit of a hobby of mine. I took a class in Spencerian script a couple of years ago. Fantastic stress reliever, BTW.
Jay
@cmorenc:
Cite
Considering you can’t even remember who challenged whom to a debate, “anytime, anywhere”,…….
cmorenc
@EarthWindFire: The general voting public is not paying studied attention to Biden’s condition at rallies, except as a tiny handful of very brief sound bytes in news reports. Nor will most normie voters spend time on the Friday evening of a four-day holiday weekend watching the Stephanopoulos interview. Most were last Thursday night, and there won’t be another widely viewed side-by-side event with Trump until later on in September
cmorenc
@Jay:
Post-debate CBS poll
Gvg
Sigh, I am naturally a non depressed upbeat sort of person who just never finds the media all that smart. So I have not freaked out. However, I did not think Trump would beat Hillary. Thought he was a bad joke. Am very annoyed by this freak out. Did not watch the debate because I never do. TV mostly goes too slow for me and I prefer reading plus I judge by actions and results. Anyway my more normy parents and sister at the family 4th are totally freaked out and citing polls that do actually show about a 3% drop in support etc, and say Biden was bad. Good lord. My dad is the same age as Biden and doing very well in investing and writing papers on programming AI. They are reliable democrats and it’s pretty upsetting they actually think Biden can be and should be replaced. It’s stupid. I couldn’t get them to listen. Got interrupted etc.
Jay
@cmorenc:
LMFAO,
I mean a real poll, with stats and methodology, conducted by a real polling company. And the actual polling data.
Not some news network that has been making shit up for years now.
Jay
@Gvg:
get them to read this,
https://www.wonkette.com/p/the-terrible-bad-do-not-do-this-no
Then ask them why they want the 34 Felonies Child Molester to be President.
Bupalos
@cmorenc: Just to establish that there is also diversity in the “I think biden should step off the ticket” crowd….
I think we’re more likely to lose than win the presidency no matter what we do here, and I acknowledge all the options at this point are bad. But I think a different ticket and a more forceful communicator can potentially shake the race up, marginally improve our bad odds, and have a positive effect down ballot.
The thing I think people are most missing is the yawning chasm the party falls in to if we insist Joe is IT, raise all the stakes with this “last election in history” stuff, and then Joe not only can’t reverse the narrative but goes and confirms it some more. I can’t be the only one here who has a hard time watching Biden footage because it feels so precarious.
And I really don’t KNOW. I’m being honest about uncertainty and embracing uncertainty here, and I think we all should. We don’t know the rules here.
EarthWindFire
@cmorenc: They would if their nightly news were showing it. See new thread above. You obviously disagree but I truly think there’s an agenda being played out in our media and consulting classes and taking their advice doesn’t favor the democrats. I trust no one, especially any pollsters/news outlets that were predicting Red Wave ‘22.
delphinium
@Gvg: Just wondering, what did they say about Trump’s performance? That actually matters too (as does his horrible record) eventhough the media and a few folks here keep ignoring it. Or was that not discussed at all? Hopefully in a bit, you can talk to them again and show them some of Biden’s post-debate speeches, not to mention discuss his actual performance as president which might allay some of their fears.
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@Jay:
To own the libs!
Cleek’s Law!
//
lowtechcyclist
Much as I respect Dean Baker, is he fucking kidding us?? The JMarts and Peter Bakers of the world would be delighted to have a new chew toy to gnaw on, and that’s what she would be to them. Trump would disappear from their storylines even more than he already has over the past week. Every least thing about her would be news (and they’d get to play them all up as potential liabilities). That would be good for weeks of coverage that barely mentioned Trump.
Certainly if Biden were to step aside, she’s the only one to consider. But best to keep ridin’ with Biden right through November 5.
Bupalos
@Tony Jay: That’s been my takeaway from your little shitshow over there. There are going to be some victories for us amidst the destabilization of a turn to post-truth right wing authoritarianism. Those victories will be important and maybe help us preserve some things for when the winds shift. But you don’t have to zoom out too far to see that election as falling well within the disturbing global pattern. As “conservatism” is discredited, your conservatives are breaking radical right, not moderate left. It opens up a space right now, but it also foreshadows ugly things to come.
K-Mo
@Jay:
It’s OK if you want to say, yes the polls indicate a drop in support for Biden, but we know this will be a temporary phenomenon, or, yeah the polls are bad but Biden is still the best bet. Those are reasonable takes.
Demanding the facts and then sniffing at them is not.
https://www.electoral-vote.com/evp2024/Items/Jul04-2.html
Gretchen
Peter Baker has a column in the NYT today maddeningly saying, isn’t it interesting how Dems are considering replacing their guy while Rs are holding firm? It couldn’t have anything to do with the dozens and dozens of articles we’ve published about Biden’s failings, while ignoring the felonies, treason, lies, and Epstein-related revelations about Trump? Nah, that couldn’t be it. We’re just reporters.
Gretchen
@K-Mo: those variations are all within the margin of error. There’s no big drop there.
EarthWindFire
@K-Mo: I’d go one step further, and say that the drop Biden rallying cries have driven the bad polling. Polls are snapshots in time and the immediate post-debate polls were higher in favor of dumping him. Suggests that one possibility is that a number of Democrats have calmed down and more would if we weren’t beating ourselves with worry.
K-Mo
@Bupalos: Thanks for chipping in.
My feeling is, I think switching to Kamala would be smart and I think she would win. But I’m with you on the uncertainty. I don’t know what will happen and I acknowledge I could be wrong. But the belligerent unwillingness that some have to even think about the issue is problematic to me. I’m much more certain about that.
EarthWindFire
@Gretchen: Thank you for reminding me of one of my few wise life decisions: ignore the NYT. They are not your friends.
Jay
@Bupalos:
here are some of the rules:
https://www.wonkette.com/p/the-terrible-bad-do-not-do-this-no
So yeah, no, with out Biden/Harris, 34 Felonies Child molester will get 538 electoral votes.
Toss in the Supine Court’s ruling and your little short lived experiment with democracy is over for good. You won’t even have real Republic, you will be right there with the NORKS.
Another Scott
@MinuteMan: Dean Baker is great in cutting to the chase on economics reporting, but I agree that he doesn’t get the politics of this.
Disappointing, but lots and lots of economists have this failing. IMHO.
Cheers,
Scott.
K-Mo
@EarthWindFire: that’s a reasonable take. I think the gist is akin to what my first example of a reasonable take was. I’m not sure what to say about the effect of the media. Do you want to remove the effect of the media on your polling, and if so, why? We can complain about unfair coverage but unless we expect that to change, I think it is baked. It’s one of the reasons Biden couldn’t afford to trip up the way he did.
Bupalos
@Jay: That doesn’t appear to be an argument against Biden withdrawing, but rather and argument against a brokered convention.
I don’t really fully accept even that case, though I acknowledge it present even more negatives.
Also Dems absolute floor is about 200 electoral votes.
Kay
Matt Novak @paleofuture.bsky.social
·
Sen. Mark Warner seeks to assemble group of Democratic senators to ask Biden to exit race
K-Mo
@Gretchen:
As a statistician, I think the way you want think about this, is the polls show a drop off a few pct. points but there’s a high degree of error around that estimated effect. So there’s a range of true effects that we’re estimating, but most of that range is negative for Biden.
Jay
@K-Mo:
All of the reputable polls showing a drop, have the drop within the margin of error of the poll, not a 25% to 34% drop in support.
And we know three things,
Polling is broken,
The MSM has their thumb on the scale,
and Polling this far out, is useless.
EarthWindFire
@K-Mo: I’m unwilling to think about it for three reasons; you’re allowed to think they’re belligerent if you want.
First, Kamala Harris ran a bad campaign in 2020, even with racism and misogyny as her head winds. Make the case that she’s gotten better but I’ve never been sold on the idea that she would assume the presidency with her own campaign.
My second reason: replace with who has largely been addressed by the focus on Harris, who is the only logical choice to pull this off with.
My third, and most important, reason: by going through this whole Dump Biden fiasco, we’ve basically taken a gigantic dump on our party’s brand. Aren’t the democrats supposed to be the party of second chances and stability, as oppose to the GOP’s instant judgment and chaos? I thought we were. Well, we’re sure not acting like it.
And I am very afraid that impression will remain long after this debate has been forgotten. How are normies going to believe we’ll have their backs when we don’t even have our president’s? Party of the people, my ass.
EarthWindFire
@K-Mo: We could have not fed the media trolls. Instead, our consulting class ran right to them with the Dump Biden story and too many democrats followed.
Captain C
@Chris:
I’m half-surprised Loomis hasn’t just banned all comments because of this.
Captain C
@Gretchen: New from Peter Baker: “Why does my bed smell like piss?” after four straight columns of “I piss my bed every night and I love it!”
K-Mo
@EarthWindFire: None if your takes are belligerent. The insistence by many on here (not you) that anyone who disagrees is a sellout or a dummy or emotionally frail, however, is.
Regarding your third point: I think our brand is, we are introspective and reasonable. If we put a candidate up, you can be sure that we’ve vetted him objectively. We’re trustworthy and reliable. IOW, the opposite of what the GOP has done with Trump. Those who reflexively deny Biden’s f-up or insist on pretending it doesn’t matter are diminishing that brand.
Jay
@Bupalos:
If Biden withdraws, Harris isn’t on the ballot, other than as VP.
Only Biden and Harris can spend their campaign funds.
Harris would have to get on the Ballot in all States as the Democratic Party nominee in under 3 months,
and we know how well that is going for the Brainworm Party.
If Biden were to step aside( he isn’t), the knives, inside and outside would come out against Harris.
The Democratic Party Ticket in November will be Biden/Harris.
Any arguments other wise or hypotheticals are just an intellectual wankfest.
And I am sure, that any day now, the Middle Eastern Bureau’s of your vaunted MSM will find Saddam’s chemical weapons in Iraq, or Syria, or somewhere.
SomeRandomGuy
“If we tell the Republicans they were right about Biden all along,
they’ll stop at Poland,I mean, ha ha, of course they’re not *literal* Nazis, I mean, if I called them Nazis, I would lose my job for being so mean.”Remember: these guys made up a scandal out of a former President stopping to chat up an old friend, as if this was some kind of conspiracy of the painfully stupid. What, Clinton and Rice never heard of PGP e-mail, as ex-POTUS and current AG? They wouldn’t use those untraceable methods, rather than an accidental shared tarmac?
EarthWindFire
@K-Mo: You can think Biden’s f-up matters and believe it was one without calling to dump him overboard. We do that with people, including presidential candidates, all the time. But because we’re afraid of a Trump second term, apparently Joe Biden has to be perfect. That isn’t reasonable for anyone at any age. So it diminishes that brand too, imo.
gene108
@Baud:
I think we’re damned if we keep Biden and damned if we don’t keep Biden.
This level of party disunity is rarely overcome. There’s no one on the Democratic side that can get the support needed to get Democrats united and excited.
I don’t know what to do.
K-Mo
@EarthWindFire: Agreed.
Chris Johnson
@gene108: Apart from just say shit with no basis in reality, making YOU the ‘people are saying’ who are apparently saying?
If you don’t want to look like enemy action, you might not want to be glued to ‘concern troll’ narrative. That job does not require you to have useful suggestions, it requires you to never STFU about how concerned you are, make up lots of angst, and not know what to do., You’re nailing it. The message is DOOOOOOOOM and there is no plan B, because that IS the plan.
SomeRandomGuy
@gene108: I think you’re an idiot. We’re blessed to have Biden, and blessed to have Harris, and, we’re dealing with an orange fartcloud who, if he ever eats a tic-tac, will double his total cognitive capacity, which exists of roughly the same amount of Adderall, and all the vile, vulgar, venality it’s possible to cram into one person.
Y’all are saying, “TRUMP IS INVINCIBLE! He’ll never make up some dumbass story about a sinking electric boat, and a shark, visibly waiting for him. Fucking moron forgot it was a *crocodile* that swallowed the alarm clock, and, OH YEAH, IT WAS PETER PAN YOU MORON!
Y’all are saying that. And I’m saying, no, there must be some Republicans who believe in the rule of law, just, none who currently hold elected federal office, and there are a lot of non-Rs who have seen Trump as the pathetic, whiny, loser he is. They see him as the guy who struck at swinging at a ball in the dirt, and insisting they took his home run, the furthest home run ever hit, they were going to give him *four runs* for it, even though no one was on base, because of the distance, and, and, and IT WAS PETER PAN YOU DEVELOPMENTALLY DISABLED IDIOT!
Oh, was he remembering Pinocchio this time? No wonder he looks and acts like a child who turned himself into a jackass, and decided never to change
Anyway: I think we’re blessed to have Biden who doesn’t do stuff like that, and who actually pays attention to objective reality, like Trump is a moron, a convicted felon, and a multiple-rapist, assuming we can trust women’s stories told under oath. Oh: but it might not *quite* meet the legal standards of rape in some jurisdictions.
And I think you’re an idiot to think we need someone else.
Since we’re just sharing thoughts.
SomeRandomGuy
@K-Mo: when people panic unduly over something that doesn’t merit panic, calling them emotionally frail isn’t kind, but, among adults trying to do serious work, it’s necessary.
When people immediately call for something entirely unprecedented by a party (shitcanning Biden – and do not try to suggest a kinder word is merited), for any price (even if it’s to calm their fears), the words “sellout” and “coward” were invented, though this is hardly their *only* valid use.
Are you an adult? If so, you can’t expect people to treat you with kindness. Some people will, and cherish such people. But if you think you can come to a public forum, and get any kindness, you can’t. Hell, sometimes the POTUS can’t get acknowledgement he has a stutter from friendly public forums – you think you’ll do better?
(I’m not trying to be unkind – I would prefer that the world be such that you could expect kindness.)
But here’s what you *can* do.
Do you understand why I said people shouldn’t panic? Think about yourself – it’s okay to be *afraid* but it’s not good to *panic*. How can you sound concerned, but not in “OMG it’s time to shitcan Biden!” mode?
Do you understand why some people – who surely whined, and whined, and WHINED that there wasn’t a “real” Democratic primary, are coming in and screaming “TOLD YOU SO TOLD YOU SO SHITCAN BIDEN!” who are appropriately described as “sellouts” – they should be putting their weight behind Biden, not indulging in “told you so”.
Do you understand that the desire to ditch Biden, driven by fear, is the precise definition of cowardice, letting fear cause you to do something wrong or stupid?
If you understand those things, then, you can sharpen your tools (your voice) *against* that understanding. You can speak as someone who doesn’t look cowardly, panicked, or like a sellout.
You’ll still have people who want to shit on you, especially if you’re different or weird (like me). That’s life, and if there’s a way to change that, I haven’t figured it out.
But you’ll also be putting all of your thoughts and emotional energies in a better place for you to accomplish things. And, once you realize you can use reasoning to help understand other’s emotions, you might become more effective still.
The fact of the matter is, the Republicans have a year’s worth of “WHAT DID HARRIS KNOW AND WHEN DID SHE KNOW IT?” if Biden steps down, and that will all come out in the first week Biden steps down – they’ll insist he was completely gone, staggering and drooling, and SHE LEFT THE COUNTRY IN DANGER.
Face it: there’s one safe-for-Democrats way for Biden to leave the race, and that’s if he leaves it while lying in state.
gene108
@rikyrah:
Biden got more white votes, especially white men, than Hillary did. It offset whatever drop in votes Democrats received from Hispanic voters.
sab
Dean Baker can be so naive when it’s not economics.
In the minds of the MSM Kamala Harris is a first and foremost a brown woman.
She successfully ran a huge agency full of lawyers for years. She has travelled the globe for three years meeting with foreign leaders. She had one of the best zinger comebacks against Biden in 2002 Democrstic debates and Joe decided she’d be his best choice for VP.
But for three years none of that mattered. MSM ignored her.
Quadrillipede
This had crossed my mind as well.
AWOL
@K-Mo: fuck off
gene108
@SomeRandomGuy:
You might be the first person I ever pie here.
SomeRandomFellow
Kayla Rudbek
@Captain C: I would bet my monthly craft money on it
K-Mo
@SomeRandomGuy:
That’s some seriously unhinged shit.
The truth is, adults have to deal with good news and bad news all the time. Successful adults adjust to that good and bad news thoughtfully and appropriately. Panicky ones do a bunch of unproductive things including, for example, walling themselves off from reality, insisting on living inside their own bubbles, and raging against the normies who insist on processing the real world as it exists, in all its suckitude.
K-Mo
@AWOL: Now we see the violence inherent in the system!
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ZtYU87QNjPw
dnfree
@emmyelle: You have been respectful. I appreciate your viewpoint. There are a few here who take any expression of concern as being disloyal.