Busy week working, and I am back at it today, but I took one minute to check in on my buddy, the (fake) jack Smith.
This week:
Taraji P. Henson calls out Project 2025.
More people google it and are alarmed by Trump’s plans to institutionalize tyranny.
Trump pretends he doesn’t know about it.
The Heritage Foundation, Trump’s think tank, chalks it off as locker room talk.
Takeaway: stand up…
— Jack E. Smith ⚖️ (@7Veritas4) July 6, 2024
Let’s model Taraji’s behavior, shall we? We are not famous, but what if each one of us shared Project 2025 information with just one person this weekend. What would the ripples be?
And if you didn’t catch the awesome poem by niqaeli torres in yesterday’s thread, go check it out.
She is right. All there is is what we do now. This fight is for everything. Get up and fight.
Open thread.
UncleEbeneezer
The only “conversation” we should all be pushing is about Dobbs, Project 25, SCOTUS and the necessity of re-electing Joe Biden. Period. Full stop.
Leto
Star Wars parody of the Trumpov quote. You know, I can believe that shit for brains doesn’t know the title “Project2025”. That’s an inconsequential detail to him. All that he knows and cares about is: can I do anything I want, without interference? This will let me do that? That sounds good, let’s do that. We’re already seeing that plan of action play out with the courts, this is the Executive branch playbook.
Fair Economist
I am thankful that somebody with a platform like Taraja Henson is focusing on what really matters.
UncleEbeneezer
Barbara
I realized yesterday that “debate” is to 2024 as “but her emails” was to 2016. Bad faith, journalistic masturbatory speculation. Imagine the next media “noteworthy ” who raises it looking at a nude picture and wanking. Sorry to be crude, but it strikes me as a totally appropriate analogy. Tune it out and keep working. Mark Warner is going to get a piece of my mind — hoping to call when I can actually encounter a live human being.
Chris
@Leto:
You know, I had a second before I realized it was parody when I thought Republicans had actually gone and called something “Project Stardust” in honor of the movies. Yes, that would, in fact, be 100% in character. (Heck, there’s a right-wing data company literally named “Palantir.”)
Raoul Paste
I was shocked to see how many “Biden should drop out“ diaries that were posted on Daily kos. They had one thing in common— virtually no recommendations from those who had read them.
Rank speculation on my part, but if there is an army of Russian trolls attacking this country, they sure know where the targets are
prostratedragon
A reminder:
Mike E
Hi WG, feel free to post this reaction to George The Remora’s interview (AL too).
And, for the love of Pete Buttigieg, stop being assholes with the replying to ridiculously obvious trolls, y’all are making this site a complete waste of time.
Chris Johnson
@Leto: I love that he has to deny that, has to deny Dobbs.
It’s a massive weakness that should not be undersold, because it cuts two ways and both ways hurt Donald Trump very badly.
On the one hand, bringing Project 2025 and Dobbs to peoples’ attention causes them to revolt and not want Donald anymore, even as a joke or a ‘hold-the-nose’ vote. These are not things to please independents and mushy-moderates. They’re hardline as fuck. He’s GOT to run from them.
The other horn of the dilemma is even sharper and I am a bad enough man to enjoy that very much.
The people who badly want Project 2025 are also hardline as fuck. They’ve managed to bully the whole Republican Party into apparent submission. To them, it looks like they’re inches from Heaven. And they are pissed, pissed, pissed that Trump seems to be betraying them… which he IS. He’s stealing from them, he’s betraying them, he absolutely is biting them like the snake in the story he tells. That’s what he is. It’s the truth. They’re being asked to lean on this weak, weak fuckin’ reed. Even if he WON he would still betray them, and very likely try to have ’em killed for having crossed him over their silly ‘principles’.
And they’re the stochastic terrorists that have been groomed all this time to hurt Democrats, yet here’s a guy who has literally betrayed them and is ruining everything.
I would not be in Donald Trump’s position for a trillion dollars, not for five minutes. The contradictions of his position are horrifying. All the media shield in the world can’t protect him from the way he must betray the most dangerous hardliners on HIS SIDE. I’m absolutely not sorry for him, he’s a monster. I just think he would be safer if he just said fuck it, and ran as a hardliner and 2025 nightmare. He’d lose against a head of lettuce, but he might be safer that way.
Geminid
@Barbara: A couple Virginia Jackals said they called Warner’s office yesterday, as soon as they heard. I expect Warner’s getting a flood of Democrats asking, “WTF?”
Chris Johnson
@prostratedragon: Shocked. Shocked, I am.
Mike E
@prostratedragon: nice catch, thanks. Warner is another troll.
Josie
@Mike E:
“And, for the love of Pete Buttigieg, stop being assholes with the replying to ridiculously obvious trolls, y’all are making this site a complete waste of time.”
This. I just tried to catch up on threads I had missed last night, and gave up in disgust. Arguing with trolls ruins the threads and achieves nothing.
Another Scott
+$100 to the Four Directions – Wisconsin thermometer.
$81 to JoeBiden.com
Eyes on the prizes.
Cheers,
Scott.
Snarki, child of Loki
Project 2025:
A Trump, a plan, a fascism, (chaos words)!
delphinium
@Barbara:
Yeah, I’m thinking a lot of pundits have a poster up on their bedroom ceiling. My apologies for that image.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@Mike E: I’ve been getting lots of tasty looking pastries.
Another Scott
@Josie: The pastries are very good on a lazy Sunday morning.
Cheers,
Scott.
Geminid
@Chris Johnson: I stumbled into some “Groyper” Twitter last night. They were in conflict over Trump’s disavowal of Project 25. Some said this showed he has been captured by the Republican business elite, and the hell with him! Others said, not so fast, Trump’s just lying and still intends to implement the Plan. Apparently Plan 25 has been watched closely in those circles.
TBone
Saturday morning cartoon with cantaloupe ❤️
https://archive.org/details/rikkitikkitavi_201701
Please don’t ruin it for me by explaining colonialist racism. It is a beloved childhood classic (the book first, of course). Of course I identify with Rikki!
WaterGirl
@Mike E: I listen to Beau every night – I already have that planned for a post this weekend. :-)
BR
For those of you who have written postcards for prior elections, do you think it’s effective? Is it better to do voter registration postcards or GOTV or persuasion or what?
delphinium
@prostratedragon: Thanks for this-didn’t know but can’t say I’m really surprised.
Leto
@Chris: “Wait, the Empire are the baddies?” – conservatives since 1976
@Chris Johnson: yup, lot to agree with here.
WaterGirl
@Josie: Yes.
New rotating tag:
WaterGirl
@Another Scott: You made me look at the day of the week on my computer.
July 4 being on a Thursday really messed me up.
Another Scott
@WaterGirl: D’Oh!
Cheers,
Scott.
Leto
@BR: yes; yes; any positive actions help.
@Geminid:
That is the alpha and omega with him. If the lips are moving, thats all it is.
NeenerNeener
If Trump gets back into the Oval Office his administration will be wall-to-wall Heritage Foundation a$$holes and he will sign anything they put in front of him, without even reading it. What he says publicly is rarely what he does because he lies constantly. And if he doesn’t win this time we have to worry about the next Republican a$$hole who manages to slither in because the “project” plan will remain the same. The only thing that will change is the year number in the title.
Mike E
@Another Scott: Yes! Use. The. Pie. Filter.
“I don’t pie anyone, I’m pure that way.”
With Pie deployed, you* can always click “toggle” to see what you’re missing. WG and AL have plenty/too much to do for this site, that you purportedly love, for you to abrogate your responsibility to keep our shared experience on a useable level.
*everyone… just fucking do it
ETA I’d also point out how some of our supposed regulars agree with and welcome these troll droppings, there’s another slice of pie for you to dole out (cmorenc oldgold et al)
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@UncleEbeneezer: Alternative narrative; G W Bush put the GOP up for sale to the billionaires. Now Trump did a hostile take over of the GOP, the billionaires who lost to Trump see the Democratic Party as another opportunity to create their own personal political fiefdom.
Ken
Seen on bluesky: “The world’s most widespread holiday is celebrating independence from the British.”
prostratedragon
@Chris Johnson:
@Mike E:
Could he have thought no one would notice (tee-hee)?
Mike E
@Ken: Guy Fawkes day will be ours, soon.
Ken
Oh thank goodness, I am not alone.
Speaking of support groups, some friends and I were discussing our large book collections, and pondering whether we should form a “bookaholics anonymous” chapter. But we decided every meeting would just turn into a book discussion.
BarcaChicago
For those who post on social media, here is a transcription site with the frightening and comical nonsense that comes out of Trump’s mouth, updated daily. Nice to post quotes on corporate media threads :-)
https://www.rev.com/blog/transcripts/trump-holds-first-post-debate-rally-in-virginia
UncleEbeneezer
@BR: They work pretty well. I wanna say research has shown them helping as much as a couple percentage points. On GOTV vs. Persuasion, that totally depends on the race, the district, the candidate etc. I did hear years ago on the Swing Left Podcast the claim that “down-ballot voting” is very unreliable. The better approach is to use “up-ballot” strategies: convince voter to vote for Dem in local, state race and they will be more likely to vote for Dem (Biden) at the top of the ticket. Just FYI.
BeautifulPlumage
@Chris Johnson:
I appreciate your comment here and on the previous thread. Thank you for pointing out the A/B testing by the trolls, it clarifies the inconsistencies.
The Heritage foundation is making a lot of threats and I think this needs to be amplified. Why do they think they can control the narcissist when it’s already backfired for so many others?
Rileys Enabler
Pie filter question (iPhone/safari) – since the most recent update, the filter gives a short list of 15 or so nyms to pick from to pie- none of whom match the pie target I have in mind. Is there a workaround or update that I can deploy in order to enjoy delicious pie again?
Chris Johnson
@Josie: I dunno. It brought some new insight!
I coin the term ‘Trollster’, check it out :)
You can (and we did!) get pairs of trolls with the following characteristics:
-instead of trying to persuade, they’re hammering narratives very unappealingly. It’s brazen, annoying.
-the narratives may have a common factor (Biden bad) but will outline OPPOSITE positions. Trump stronk/weak, Kamala Prez/dumped, like that.
-the trolls WILL NOT intersect. Strictly one thread for the one, one thread for the other. If invited they will not intersect, though they seemingly have opposite takes.
-If discovered they can retreat or one will drop out so the other can troll normally.
The purpose of Trollstering is to get information back about the subjects that have opposite takes. They, or somebody, is taking note of how they’re argued against and what sticks. The reason they will not intersect even when invited, is because it’s actively a rule for them not to do, and the reason for that is it’d ruin the data! They can’t argue with each other, they’re strictly gathering data on YOU. I would bet money there’s an actual rule against them posting in each others’ threads.
So, if the trollage seems unusually obnoxious and it really seems to be picking fights, check to see if you’re being Trollstered. Is there a nearby thread with a whole other troll, who is being just as obnoxious but over literally opposite points?
Getting normally trolled requires getting some sympathy, but getting Trollstered can be way more adversarial, because you’re being watched on how you respond to the side-issues. They’ll be incredibly on-message, but there’ll be another one where the message has a contradictory aspect. It’s a poll
Here’s the usefulness: it’s a window into what narrative might get pushed next, and it reveals weakness. If the narrative is going perfect they don’t need to do this.
Eyeroller
@Rileys Enabler: Try the Search Commenters box at the top. It may be case sensitive so type in the exact nym you want to pie.
Steeplejack
@Rileys Enabler:
Just below “Commenters” and above the suggested list is a field called “Search commenters.” Guess what you can do there to enjoy delicious pie.
RaflW
@UncleEbeneezer: THIS.
Our easily bored media people are just itching for a Chicago ’68 remake. Incumbent on us to not give them that. In no small part because out bored media people are wondering what it will feel like to report on Trump’s dictatorship.
I’d suggest it’s not boring to report, now, on what is known about his plans to f*ck 90% of the populace over, but that requires getting off one’s ass at least occasionally, and our bored media people are also our lazy media people.
Mike E
@Rileys Enabler: go to a particularly active (long) thread and click that pie icon there, the list will be more to your intended outcome of identifying more trolls.
rikyrah
Good Morning, Everyone 😊 😊 😊
Captain C
@Leto: He’s not even competent enough to be a proper bullshitter, as that would require knowing when to salt the mines with the truth once in awhile.
Chris Johnson
@RaflW: I’ll go a step farther. ‘Trump weak’ is closer to the truth than ‘Trump stronk’. Nobody believes his bullshit rationalizing and sugarcoating anymore. It’s strictly, are you fash or ain’tcha?
For that reason, if the media is indeed working to directly elect Trump, they’ve got very heavy lifting to sell that decompensating asshole to the public.
So they MUST HAVE a change to the Dem candidates. It’s not that they want to, they have to! There’s no chance otherwise, and apparently they’re not being given the option to just nope out of there and cover golf. Nope, they gotta push the orange dumpster over the finish line somehow, or they’re toast.
Hence the state of things. They MUST manufacture a Dem collapse, or simply insist it exists in the face of all evidence to the contrary.
Sandia Blanca
@Mike E: Yes, the list of commenters does not show everyone who’s ever commented on B-J (would be massive), it only shows people who are on that thread.
RaflW
@NeenerNeener: We will absolutely have to watch the next Republican candidates very closely and beat them back too. No doubt.
But I think something as odious as Project 2025 needs a charismatic p.o.s. like Trump to trojan horse it. No amount of fleece vests will get much of that agenda passed if it’s being pushed by Glen Younkin or Brian Kemp.
No one else gets the base riled up yet catatonicaly unquestioning of content quite like Donny Dazzlecrap.
comrade scotts agenda of rage
Thank you to the base of the Democratic Party, ie., black folks. We were saying this exact same thing a week ago:
White liberals (including some here) channeling their best imitation of C3PO: “We’re doomed.”
Black folks:
Fuck that bum. Go get em, Joe!
I hope every black Dem in VA has literally burned up Mark Fucking Warner’s phone lines by now.
Juju
@UncleEbeneezer: works for me.
Josie
@Chris Johnson:
This is an interesting point. But the question I have is whether we want to be points in someone’s research or have an interesting/informative discussion. I guess this is just too much inside baseball for me. I have always come to BJ for a higher level of discourse than other sites, and it seems to me that arguing with trolls takes away from that.
stacib
I talked to a young man (black, 29 or 30 years of age) at work about Project 2025. At first, he kinda humored me – AND THEN, he got interested. His group of friends do actually seem to be leaning towards trump because Tik Tok has told them they are on a plantation if they vote Democratic. There is so much bullshit to wade through for the folks that get their “news” from social media, that if there is any fear, it’s all the misinformation and how easily some can be convinced what they hear / read is “real” because a lot of people are repeating the same nonsense. In the end, he asked me to send him a link, and he actually read it and decided he needs to start paying attention. One down, many to go. :-)
RaflW
@Chris Johnson: Interesting, innit, that after adding just one mym I was served up dozens of slices of pie in the last thread, and yet see none in this one.
comrade scotts agenda of rage
Two items from this morning, each concerning my normie wife who does listen to some Totebagger Radio most mornings.
Fucking NPR was doing it’s usual, in-effect “Biden Is Senile” piece and the reporter noted how Biden hadn’t taken a cognitive test but that Trump had and had passed with flying colors.
My wife damn near reached thru the radio to drag the reporter out and beat them to a bleeding pulp because, as she pointed out, at no point did the “reporter” say that Trumps “tests” had ever been released to the public. I’m sure the Totebagger people felt that minor point wasn’t really important for the overall point of the piece. Fucking assholes.
That then led into talk about the Dems thus far, like Mark Fucking Warner, who have called for Biden to step down. I told her of my new, latest, fav casual slur, this one from Odie Hugh Manatee:
Tanya Harding Dems.
She spit take her coffee on that one.
Juju
@Another Scott: was the angel match completed?
Chris Johnson
@Josie: Well, once you spot ’em, it’s even MORE obvious that it’s even worse than just a waste of time.
I’m happy to have spotted an interesting dirty trick in the wild, and ways to identify it. Kind of like Donald Trump, they can’t change some of the hallmarks of it without ruining the whole point of their exercise. But if you do spot trollsters, parallel-opposing-non-intersecting trolls?
You will only get your hands twice as dirty if you play with them.
Figure out what weakness they are exposing by doing it (in this case, the initial narrative isn’t working enough) and then drop ’em.
Josie
@Chris Johnson:
OK, that makes sense.
prostratedragon
I saw this quoted elsewhere and convinced myself it was Pitchbot. Lorrrrd-duh!
Another Scott
@Juju: Dunno for sure, but I don’t think so.
WG cited a number sometime this morning.
Cheers,
Scott.
Kristine
@Another Scott:
Nice. 👍🏼
Mike E
@Chris Johnson: when somebody you don’t know suddenly contacts you and starts trying to convince you to do something like send them money and telling you it’s an emergency, and you have to do it right now, no no don’t think, just act, just you’ve got to do this right now… It’s a fucking scam.
That is exactly how each and every one of these fucking long knives “Democrats” sounds. We must act right now to avert catastrophe! Okay but what about… No, there’s no time for that, has to happen right now! Yeah but what happens after we… why aren’t you listening, worry about that later!
Ad infinitum
wil
There is a lot of getting high on your own supply going on in this site’s comment section.
wil
@Mike E: So if Biden cannot beat Trump and we need to change candidates, how long in your estimation should Dems wait to do that?
Chris
@Mike E:
It would be nice if they were occasionally just banned, particularly after they’ve straight up admitted that they’re just trolling for their own amusement.
Tony Jay
@comrade scotts agenda of rage:
Sometimes all an English gentleman of breeding can do is avert his eyes and order more claret. Loudly.
Renie
If you are doing postcards to help, be aware all postage rates are going up July 14th. So go either to the post office or online to get the stamps you need now.
Mike E
@comrade scotts agenda of rage: Friends don’t let friends/loved ones listen to NPR/watch CNN. I know, some of their content is terrific but at least have them eschew Morning Edition and ATC, it’s poison
Eyeroller
@comrade scotts agenda of rage: As many others have pointed out, the cognitive test Trump allegedly took and “passed with flying colors” is not given to people who may have a touch of normal age-related cognitive slowing. It is a diagnostic test used specifically to screen for dementia.
And he lies about everything anyway and he had a doctor who lied for him, so who knows what actually happened.
SteveinPHX
Every time somebody says to me that we need someone new, I ask the same question, “Who you gonna call?” I haven’t gotten a coherent reply yet. Not even a name.
Mike in NC
We lived in Virginia when Mark Warner was governor and thought he was pretty good. How wrong we were!
Chris
@Leto:
I think it’s more recent than that. The old line was that of course the Rebels were good and the Empire was bad, and the Rebels were clearly rugged individualists with guns fighting for their FREEDUMB, and the Empire was the tyranny of big government. I remember still seeing lines to that effect in the 2000s when wingnuts made pop culture reference.
It’s mainly in the last ten years that I’ve seen more and more of the “BUT did you know that Luke Skywalker, a religious fanatic raised on a desert planet, was a terrorist actually? And why isn’t Alderaan a legitimate target when it’s funding terrorism?” hot takes out of online wingnuts. Which I take to be part of the general way the party ripped off the mask after Dubya (but before Trump) and decided that fuck it, we’re not even going to pretend to be anything other than pain-inflicting nihilists. They see a massive military machine run by sadists who wiped out an entire planet as an act of trolling, and their first instinct is “yep, that’s what we want to be.”
Mike E
@prostratedragon: DougJ is legend but I would certainly hope he is refraining from doing his thing here on BJ, or he’s now wil, I don’t know…all I’m seeing is cakes cookies candy and pet food anymore
wil
@SteveinPHX:
It would have to be Kamala Harris. The campaign finance laws (what’s left of them) are such that she is the only candidate who could deploy the hundreds of millions sitting in the Biden/Harris warchest.
One reason of many, but it would have to be Harris.
Kristine
@BeautifulPlumage: @Chris Johnson:
I went back and looked up that comment—veeery interesting.
Folks who send out newsletters can take classes in A/B testing. Nice to see a live example and the differences explained.
Waiting for my Postcards to Swing States package to arrive. But now, I will finish my coffee and go out and slay some weeds. Practice for the next few months.
UncleEbeneezer
Eolirin
@UncleEbeneezer: Yep. And this is a reason to feel a little better about things, given that there’s a lot of strength in polling for every other Democratic candidate right now. Some people may opt to just leave the top line blank, and some, like Brown, will get people who vote split, but when it’s election day and it’s Biden vs Trump, if people are turning out because they’re against Republicans that’ll be good enough for most of them to come home.
Chris
@Ken:
One of my favorite moments from hosting foreign exchange students. A year or so ago, one of them was a girl from India, and one evening we decided to show them the Pirates of the Caribbean movies. Soon enough in the second one, she recognizes that the bad guys are the East India Trading Company, and instantly goes “oh my God, them! We learned about them in school! They were the WORST!!!” At which point I cheerfully tell her all about the EIC’s monopolistic practices and how they sort-of low-key ended up causing the American Revolution.
If shared national pride against British corporate imperialism isn’t a sound basis for friendship, I don’t know what is.
Mike E
@Chris: meh, we can all do our part, they’ve got more than they can handle
Kristine
@Chris Johnson: Thank you for this. Peek behind the curtain—cool.
wil
@UncleEbeneezer: A 22-minute interview doesn’t undo a 90-minute debate if the candidate looks nearly as weak and feeble in the interview as in the debate.
Glidwrith
@BR: There’s actually research showing postcarding is more effective than door knocking. Safer and less strenuous too!
prostratedragon
@Mike E: I think that one is real.
UncleEbeneezer
@Mike E: DougJ is funny, Wil is not.
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@Eyeroller:
All of which fucking NPR left out. My wife knew about the general nature of Hair Furor’s claims, knows he’s a lying sack of shit about everything and was livid that fucking NPR didn’t see fit to add even 1 sentence to the effect of “But he’s never released to results of the tests he’s claimed to have taken”.
Fuck NPR.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@comrade scotts agenda of rage: The guy impressed himself by remembering 5 words
Another Scott
This is my shocked, shocked face.
(via Fritschner)
Cheers,
Scott.
Eolirin
@Dorothy A. Winsor: Hell, given what those five words were, I’m suspicious they were really part of the test.
wil
Are you Bidenphiles here familiar with Josh Marshall of TalkingPointsMemo?
Is he a good guy or bad guy in your silo?
He thinks Dems will replace Biden. Read:
UncleEbeneezer
DougJ is killing it!
The best part is that this quote could just as easily come from Very Online Progressives as it could from Russian Trolls and Centrist Pundits.
schrodingers_cat
@BR: Its supposed to be more persuasive than phonecalls and texts according to campaigns that track this sort of a thing.
Chris
@Chris Johnson:
I think there’s another aspect to it.
Some time after 2016, it occurred to me that if the media simply went into campaign mode all the time, not just during an election year like in 2000 or 2016 but constantly, they might be able to make it effectively impossible for a Democratic president to govern, or at least impossible for him to be seen and credited for governing. If they ever slipped up and a Democratic president got through, they could effectively turn every Democratic presidency into a Carter presidency, restoring the balance to their favorite candidate by the next election.
Not too long into the Biden presidency, looking at the media’s coverage, I figured that the same thing had occurred to them, and that they were going to be using this presidency to test the hypothesis. Which sure enough is exactly what they’ve done since, and that leads us to where we are now.
Lapassionara
@Chris Johnson: Thank you. I’m so old I remember the 2016 election and the fabulous brinks trucks. There was a 3 letter nym, and the 3 letters stood for “right to rise,” if I’m not mistaken.
good times!
Eyeroller
@Chris: They’re not that smart. They just hated him for beating their favorite President. Then he took their remaining war away from them. Their coverage has been relentlessly negative, including on the economy, from the beginning but especially after the Afghanistan withdrawal
3Sice
I’ll just suggest furiously typing at at AI algorithms isn’t a very productive use of anyone’s time. Which is the whole point of flooding the zone with shit posts.
moonbat
@Chris Johnson: Thanks a lot for this. Recognizing that pattern has allowed me to get some emotional distance from the discourse on here. This is one of my go-to political sites and the comments sections have been well nigh unbearable for the last week or so.
jowriter
@Mike E: Great analogy.
Another Scott
@Eolirin: Made me look…
JAMANetwork.com:
MoCA v 7.3 (1 page .pdf)
It lists 5 different words. ;-)
Who knows what test he was given, if he was given a real one at all. (I haven’t tried to find out.)
[eta:] Oh, and I see one gets 0 points for successfully recalling the words 5 minutes later.Whoops, I misread the scoring.Cheers,
Scott.
Gvg
@Chris: no, almost from the beginning, conservative types were identifying with the empire. It was already a joke by the 80’s when I was in high school.
Ken
And then in the interview, didn’t remember the test words and came up with the infamous “man woman camera person TV” line.
Still, that led to possibly the largest burst of job creation during his term, when several dozen people started selling T-shirts with that line.
Eolirin
@Eyeroller: Constant drumbeat of a recession that never came, scary increases in crime that are unsupported by data, phantom red waves, Biden being old. No this is deliberate and coordinated on some level.
I do think the groupthink that exists in the media, the monocultre of mainstream outlets, makes it all worse. But someone started the throughlines that everyone’s been running with. And they did so without any actual investigation and continued them long past the point where they made sense to be pushing
The worst part is that even they turn out to be wrong, especially very wrong, they just drop it and move on. There’s never a reckoning.
wil
@moonbat: Or maybe there are just a lot of Democrats legitimately worried, and it’s not some big conspiracy after all.
That seems far more likely.
Mike E
@Eyeroller: they want people to die, fucking “free press” ghouls.
@3Sice: PIE FILTER or GTFO
@jowriter: I’m a Nigerian prince, please send me money!
Geminid
Counting down to the Euro Quarterfinal game between Turkiye and the Netherlands, 3pm Eastern.
Turkish defender Merih Demiral is out with a two day suspension for flashing the Grey Wolf sign during the match with Austria Tuesday, and Turks are pretty chafed about that. Istanbul Mayor Imamoglu said, “we have been deprived of our rights, but we will win our rights on the field.”
WaterGirl
@Rileys Enabler: Yes, you can SEARCH for a nym.
When I click on the cherry pie / cherry tart to open the pie filter, this is the window I get”
Just below Commenters and just above Baud is a search window. If you ant to pie me, start typing WaterGirl and it will bring up matches you can select from.
stacib
@Dorothy A. Winsor: Do we have any idea whether or not those five words are the same one he was requested to “remember”, or did he just make that up on the spot? LOL
Eolirin
@stacib: Someone just brought proof that they were almost certainly something he made up on the spot.
Eyeroller
@stacib: He pretty clearly made those up on the spot, since he was looking around the room and those were some of the contents, but I am pretty sure he had taken the test once before (and didn’t talk about the words).
Ken
I wonder what a week with Captcha turned on might reveal.
(Recent meme: Picture of a captcha with “Prove you’re a robot” and text “9 ÷ 3 = ____”. The correct robot answer is 3.000000000000627.)
Jess
@wil: Yes, I’ve been reading him for years. He’s great. Very thoughtful, realistic, willing to consider matters from different perspectives. He doesn’t pretend to have all the answers, but he does have a great sense of context and history.
Rileys Enabler
@Mike E: thanks, MikeE and others- that worked. Apparently the only names that show up are the ones in that thread.
Problem solved, pie is yummy. Thanks much!
Jackie
@WaterGirl:
Yes, after three Fridays, it’s finally SATURDAY!
Jess
@Eolirin: This is a really great point. Hope you don’t mind, but I’m copying and pasting your comment to another discussion (with credit to you, natch).
I’m really struggling not to sink below the waves. I’m glad you all are here to share the fight.
WaterGirl
@Mike E: oh, that’s a good strategy!
wil
@Jess: Thank you for answering.
What do you think of Josh Marshall (of TalkingPointMemo)’s opinion that Dems will replace Biden with Harris? He says it’s more of a ‘when’ than an ‘if’
Most people on this site seem so all-in on Biden they refuse to even acknowledge that Democrats are in this situation at all.
Mike in NC
@Another Scott: Mark Robinson calls himself “Black Trump” which many of us take to mean a stupid, loud mouthed sociopath.
stacib
@Rileys Enabler: Until this past week, I had never pied anybody, no matter how much I disagreed with them, but holy cow, now my laptop looks like a bakery. :-)
Glidwrith
@Eolirin: I’ve been on a clinical trial analyzing results for a Parkinson’s treatment, and no, that’s not part of the test.
WaterGirl
@RaflW: Just want to say that I appreciate your Angel Match. We are just over halfway to your $1,000.
I see now that I left the W off your nym when I have been talking about the angel match. I will go fix that now.
Eyeroller
@stacib: I switched devices and just discovered that it’s specific to the device, so probably it’s a local Web cookie. So you’ll have to do it for every device you use to read BJ.
Mike E
@WaterGirl: yep, and when a nym you might not have seen much or ever starts interacting with said troll then you have another pie recipient. It’s easy! Thanks for all you do here.
E.
@BR: This is an excellent question that our party cannot answer. I try to avoid criticism of the party but this is information that could be obtained and either has not been or is being kept quiet. I would really like to know the answer. Postcards are time consuming.
Harrison Wesley
@Dorothy A. Winsor: Yeah, I remember that! “Man. Woman. Birth. Death. Infinity.”
Oh, shit – how could I confuse Ben Casey with King Swino the Orange?
Tony Jay
It’s almost like the corporate media and other affiliated coalition partners, outlets and hired hands in the Campaign to Re-elect that Awful Prick are really, really worried that Stench won’t be able to handle even a modicum of normal coverage and are going all out to sow havoc in the Democratic Party as a distraction technique.
And by almost I mean definitely and obviously. It’s what I’d do in their position. The focus group responses from that debate must have terrified them. Flooding the zone with bullshit and trollbile to dishearten and unsettle is an easy move to pull off when you’ve got literally nothing else in your arsenal.
Would I Lie?
Layer8Problem
Back to the important topics. Over on LGM, where calm political rumination usually rules the day, Loomis does his grave visit today, this time visiting Dom DeLuise. And for the second time in two weeks he misidentifies someone’s role. Walter Matthau was never Wally Cox in Mr. Peepers and now we have this.
Dom DeLuise was NOT a nervous airline passenger in Fail Safe, Dom DeLuise was an Air Force electronics technician. I literally have the image of him in the same Strategic Air Command room as Fritz Weaver and Sorrell Booke and a bunch of others in my head.
Look, mistakes happen, I know. Loomis’ grave visits is one thing I actually kinda like of his at LGM, that and his “This Day in Labor History”, but I’m beginning to think this is a cry for help and he’s being held hostage somewhere and this is his signal that he’s under duress.
So, how’s everyone doing with the new troll?
Starfish
@Mike E: It is an EMERGENCY. Please send me a gift card to my local grocery store. All this talk of pie has made me hungry.
Jess
@Tony Jay: Hahaha! Good one!
UncleEbeneezer
Yesterday we took the bus to Santa Monica beach to get away from our 100 degree heat and enjoy some cool 79 degrees. It was mostly gloomy with marine-layer until 2 pm. But we got the most amazing people-watching experience with dual photo-shoots happening right in front of us. To our right was about ten people dressed in CosPlay outfits for an anime/manga called One Piece. You can get an idea of the costumes here. To our left was another photo shoot of three bikini models. Only in Los Angeles!
Tony Jay
@Jess:
This one gets it.
Nelle
In the last week, I’ve mostly been off of sites to protect mental health. So I may be off kilter here – certainly not monitoring the crowd movements.
But I just walked around the block – usually about an 8 minute walk. It took over an hour because neighbors who were out wanted to talk. Pretty much in agreement – we’re disgusted with all the circus. We’re not voting between individuals, but between democracy and facism, and it is that clear. So several folks out working on carpentry projects, washing their car, and walking their dogs are purposeful and tuning out the bizarre beat down on Biden. Not a quantitative report, I know, but heartening.
E.
@Glidwrith: Show me this evidence! This is the exact opposite of the conventional wisdom, which I also don’t trust.
Jackie
@Another Scott: Mark Robertson: “Don’t kill by abortion; kill after birth.”
Isn’t that exactly what TCFG and Keith Roberts/Heritage Foundation accuse the Dems of advocating?🤔
the pollyanna from hell
@Tony Jay: Thanks, tj. Would I lie? Just asking questions.
3Sice
WaterGirl
@Josie:
Absolutely!
In their A/B testing, what we want trolls to learn on Balloon Juice is that they don’t get a response.
Trolls, go knock on some other door! aka go troll some other site where you get engagement.
To pick up on just this part of what you wrote:
Somewhat related, maybe at least a first cousin? … I also worry that the recent over-use of emojis on BJ also takes away from the (usual) higher level of discourse on Balloon Juice.
I hope it doesn’t get to the point where Cole will want me to tell the developers to block emojis. I love the we have the ability to use emojis, but I think they are like cilantro or parsley or mustard. They aren’t the main course! :-)
edit: Or maybe it’s just me? And everyone else loves them?
Leto
@Chris: I’m very glad that I haven’t seen that take. Also glad that I basically don’t interact with the SW fan base at all. Not surprised that they’ll twist a narrative to fit their pretzel logic.
Chris
@Gvg:
Did not know that. My memories are mostly from seeing conservatives talk about it in the early 2000s, when it was well integrated enough in the pop culture landscape that a lot of people accepted it as generic (and therefore conservative) Americana.
Was there a “Star Wars sucks because it’s woke” movement in the eighties too?
Ken
Walter Matthau, Dom DeLuise – he’s somewhere in Maryland!
Mike E
@Leto: HAN SHOT FRIST
zhena gogolia
@Tony Jay: 😂😄💜
zhena gogolia
@Layer8Problem: I LOVE FRITZ WEAVER
WaterGirl
@Mike E: If DougJ had enough time to be trolling with sock puppets on Balloon Juice, I’m pretty sure that he would be writing posts instead.
Full time job, check. Family, check, Young child, check. Being the pitchbot, check.
Nah, DougJ is not trolling here.
Starfish
@Layer8Problem:
I can’t tell if you were being serious or funny with this line. Can you clarify?
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@Mike in NC:
Until he can get convicted on at least 34 felonies and have strong ties to a pedophile pimp, he’s really just a “Black Trump Wannabe”.
wil
@WaterGirl: As someone who’s been coming to this site since at least 2006, but rarely bothered with the comment section, I don’t see any ‘higher level of discourse’ here.
I see insular commenters siloed off into their own point of view, unwilling to listen to views they don’t like, and angrily trying to get rid of any dissenting views or commenters.
Not exactly what ‘higher discourse’ is generally known for. 😁
WaterGirl
@UncleEbeneezer:
I love that. I hope a million BJ peeps post that on their social media.
Citizen Alan
where is the pie filter on Android?
zhena gogolia
@Ken: Wasn’t it Richard Crenna that he confused with Wally Cox? Just as funny.
We’re watching Zero Hour!, the source for Airplane!, and it’s a damn fine film! My husband keeps saying, “Dana Andrews is really good.” You just noticed?
zhena gogolia
@WaterGirl: Plus they’re not funny enough. Whoever said they’re AI is probably right.
SoupCatcher
@Tony Jay: I want to thank you for a comment you made a while ago. I haven’t been able to find it, but the gist was that ownership of media was an early step in the fascist playbook, and we are well past that point.
Something clicked when I read your comment, and it has been very freeing. It has helped me stop wasting energy wondering why the press isn’t doing a better job.
It’s not that the millionaire media personalities who work for billionaires naively think they will be safe if Biden loses. Rather, they’re auditioning to be the next Leni Riefenstahl.
Starfish
@wil: This happens online every time when we are close to an election.
schrodingers_cat
@wil: Josh Marshall of TPM has become a Beltway Wanker. He used to be good during the Bush era. He is just showing his true colors. I have never been a fan. His platforming John Judis says a lot about him among other things.
wjca
In short, Heritage has grabbed Trump by the p*ssy. He’s trying to deny it, but unconvincingly.
Naturally, even his partisans feel free to point out that he’s lying about this.
schrodingers_cat
@Starfish: He is a known troll. I have had run-ins with him before. I have responded to one comment and will mute him now.
wil
@WaterGirl:
Not much logic there, though, right?
Really depends on the quality of the debate and interview, not just that they happened.
Chris
@Leto:
It’s basically impossible to engage with any fanbase on any of the major social media sites (Facebook, Twitter), because the comments section is pretty universally drowned in “they wokeified it, now it sucks” trolling. Star Wars, Marvel, DC, James Bond, Indiana Jones, you name it. It usually starts preemptively months or even years before the product is even out and then never lets up (heh, sound familiar?) Basically all of it is where IMDb comments sections were towards the end, but with much more overt politicking instead of generic trolling.
Unless the franchise is Harry Potter. Then it’s “J. K. Rowling is a hero and Daniel Radcliffe is a soy boy beta cuck!” If you’d told me circa 2000 when evangelicals’ “Harry Potter preaches sorcery and anti-Christian themes!” narrative was in full force that they’d up making this franchise the hill they’d die on…
Tony Jay
@the pollyanna from hell:
Mmmmmmnnnnn. I don’t know. Let’s do the test.
Layer8Problem
@Starfish: Absolument, dear boy/girl/human. Sarcasm, nothing but sarcasm.
Leto
@E.: DO MY WORK FOR ME! LET ME COPY YOUR ANSWERS! I DEMAND YOU PROVE ME WRONG!
@Mike E: you sob….
WaterGirl
@Harrison Wesley: All I remember about Ben Casey is that I saw something recently and his face was HUGE. I mean, they must have had a mini-camera inside his nostrils.
schrodingers_cat
My 2cents: Biden-Harris should run hard against the media. It has been very successful for Rs. These wankers (especially the opinionmakers, op-ed columnists and TV talking heads are) are lazy and hating Ds is in their institutional DNA.
zhena gogolia
By the way, I subscribed to the Cleveland Plain Dealer on the basis of one anti-Trump editorial. Big mistake. This morning my in-box had a message from the same guy about how “both sides” are really upset about what might happen to the nation. What is the big fear on the other side? The capitalization of the word “Black” and the use of they/them pronouns. Oh, yeah, that’s really the same thing as the death of democracy.
Eolirin
@Jess: No issues from me :)
Also, not to you specifically, but to everyone.
I just want to say, it is deeply fucking infuriating to me that we are in a political crisis for what is the effective equivalent of the press going “Don’t you think she looks tired?”
Even our new ditch Biden advocate isn’t complaining about a cognitive issue, they’re complaining that he looks and sounds feeble. At least some of the commentary post debate was about him struggling to finish sentences and losing his train of thought in that first 20 minutes, which can lead to some good faith questions about his ability to do the job. But the events and the interview show that that’s not actually an issue.
He’s not showing signs of dementia or cognitive failure. And people (who aren’t right wing propagandists) aren’t pushing that anymore. So now it’s all, well he’s still old and he looks old and that’s disqualifying. We’ve got his opponent over here going off into bizarre tangents about sharks and electrocution from batteries, inbetween saying racist ass shit and promising to round up millions of brown people, and seek vengeance against everyone who’s wronged him and we’ve got people obsessing about whether someone seems feeble nevermind what they’re capable of actually doing, and this is getting enough oxygen that it feels like it has some chance of getting Biden to step aside, at least enough that he’s having to come out to say that he isn’t, over and over again? What the fucking fuck is wrong with everyone?
And so we’re moving through a political crisis because of that, that could help hand an election to a fascist with an explicit set of plans and now a preemptive okay from the supreme court to remake our government into a dictatorship.
And we’re not taking about that. Because we’re too busy being concerned about how feeble his opponent might seem. Not that he has health problems. Not that there’s an actual issue with his ability to carry out his responsibilities. Pure fucking optics. You can’t fucking fix it because there’s nothing objective to disprove, and the goal posts on “old” are super simple to move around.
This is 100% the same as the crooked smear on Hillary. Since there were no crimes anyone could ever actually point to there was no way to refute it. No one’s actually concerned with any kind of specific on how Biden’s visible age might affect his ability to do this job, so there’s no way to refute that it’s an issue. You show how one specific isn’t a problem, people will move to another hypothetical and then it’s some future thing or vauge vibes and there’s nothing you can do with that. Especially when no one is willing to accept the pivot back to, THE FELON IS PROMISING TO GO FULL NAZI AND ROUND UP PEOPLE TO PUT IN CAMPS IF ELECTED, WHY DOES THIS EVEN MATTER?
This entire moment is a fucking indictment of not just our media, which is by far the worst offender, but also of our entire fucking society for being this fucking shallow and this fucking stupid, to the point that we may be literally too fucking stupid to continue to exist as a country or as a species.
I cannot fucking even.
wjca
If he’s still alive in 2028, they’ll be stuck with this repeated loser again. His cult will ensure it. Buy popcorn futures.
And if he’s not, they’re looking at a circular firing squad as everybody and anybody vies to be his successor. Definitely buy popcorn futures.
All we have to do is make it thru this election cycle.
the pollyanna from hell
Bj is all wrong. Would I lie? All you new folks should flee. I didn’t ask a lot of questions this time, but you can see how reasonable I am.
Leto
@WaterGirl: it’s a generational divide, like everything else. Or to be more precise: look at who does the “not to be a pedant/*anything involving pedant*”. It’s basically a one way direction, which also happens to coincide to emoji usage.
Starfish
@Layer8Problem: Oh good! That was really funny in this “everybody panic” thread.
wil
@Eolirin: Sorry bud, but people on the other side of the keep/dump Biden debate as you are just as sincere about wanting to keep Trump out.
We have all the same fears you do, are just as rational, and are just as sincere.
Maybe stop pretending you know more than you do and acknowledge that.
Tony Jay
@SoupCatcher:
You’re very welcome. Every successful coup or revolution in history took control of the TV studios and newspaper presses on day one. Why would this one be any different?
Every time you hear anyone on our side bemoaning that we don’t have a whole range of media organs pumping out our propaganda 24/7, remember that the very, very rich asked themselves that question years ago and opened their cheque books.
Because that’s what they do to make problems go away.
WaterGirl
@Citizen Alan: The pie filer is in the same place on every device.
Hopefully this screen capture helps – it’s the little cherry pie / tart that has the word Filter underneath it. Right about the circle with the # of comments in it.
E.
@Leto: I have a lot of skin in this game and have put a good deal of work into trying to answer the questions posed. There is a lot riding on it and I have found virtually no information. So forgive me for asking for the source of proffered information stated as fact.
3Sice
Iran’s new president:
He looks old.
wil
Yeah it’s the Post, but that’s what the visitor logs show.
A top Washington D.C. neurologist had a meeting with President Biden’s personal doctor at the White House earlier this year.
WaterGirl
@zhena gogolia: Maybe we need to mass unsubscribe to the Cleveland Plains Dealer?
FEEDBACK works both ways. I have already unsubscribed.
the pollyanna from hell
Also I am sincere and I am valid and everything is equal on both sides.
mali muso
@Eolirin: Standing ovation here for all that. Pretty much mirrors how I have been feeling all week.
Living in Virginia, I have done my civic duty of calling jellyfish Mark Warner’s office and intend to call again every day next week. Politics is a team sport.
Layer8Problem
I’m sorry, so Even the Liberal New York Post has turned on Biden? What hope is left?
Geminid
@3Sice: That was a very low turnout election. Many Iranians have given up on the Islamic Republic.
Plus, a lot of power is now concentrated in the Office of the Supreme Leader, Ayatollah Khameini, and the Iranian Revolutionary Guard Corps. This President won’t have much influence.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
Yes, this.
And if it Harris, it’s “her laugh is too irritating”
If it’s Buttigieg, it’s “he spends to much time with his family”
If it’s Newson, it’s “well, he’s just to slick”
and on and on through every Dem one can name. This is so fucking predictable.
UncleEbeneezer
@Eolirin: Every. Fucking. Word. No notes.
This should be a FP post, imo.
Layer8Problem
@the pollyanna from hell: Real Soon Now the troll will proclaim the only winning move is not to vote. “That’s what all the cool kids are not doing!”
Captain C
@Jackie:
Every accusation by them is a confession.
Leto
@E.: here, I’ll pose this: is there any downside to writing to people and letting them know of the oncoming fascist/totalitarian/authoritarian onslaught headed our way with a Trumpov 2 presidency? If the answer is yes, then identify what it is. “People might not read what I say and chose to vote Trumpov!” Yeah, that’s a possibility. Ofc the other side is similar to stacib’s comment: those people didn’t know what’s going on and now have some info. Hell the message on most of the cards is: please remember to vote!
For a lot of people, doing something like that is a hell of a lot more therapeutic than asking to see “evidence” on a top 100k blog. They can say, “I know it was something small, but at least I tried. At least I did something.” Every bit helps, even if it’s not absolutely scrutinized to death. Basically the Fitbit of bare minimal democracy.
Captain C
@Ken:
Walter…Dom…in a Dominatrix’s house near Walter Reed Hospital!
the pollyanna from hell
@Layer8Problem: I am really concerned about phrenology. Is that kidneys or bumps on the skull?
Captain C
@Tony Jay:
“Because I’m enjoying this!”
“Good, you’re definitely a human!”
SteveinPHX
@WaterGirl: Emojis?
Words R better!
Mike E
@schrodingers_cat: I believe I heard the president say to that effect, “You’ve voted and they want to take away that vote” so the pivot to calling out media’s antidemocratic campaign has begun… we’ll see if it’s a permanent refrain.
Starfish
@3Sice: Oh, that is awesome! Yay.
Pezeshk means physician, so being a doctor was his only option in life. I don’t make the rules.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@Leto: The last time round it was Trump
playing golfdeep into executive time during national emergencies. One doesn’t need anything more that Trump I to show how Trump II will suck ass for the nation.Leto
@Captain C: the mango was saying the same thing during the debate. That Dems want/perform abortion after birth. Every accusation…
Starfish
@the pollyanna from hell: Some people like pie, but other people prefer turnovers.
WaterGirl
@mali muso:
Yes, I am hoping Eolirin will let me front-page that as “promoted from the comments”.
edit:
@UncleEbeneezer: The above reply was written before seeing your comment. Yeah, this is not the first time I have tried to promote something from Eolirin, hopefully this time will be a go.
Captain C
@Geminid: Take away the Islam and Iran has become very similar to Russia, with a supreme leader backed by what’s essentialy an omnipresent mafia.
Starfish
@Captain C: Truly the great nefarious axis of countries that use samovars
wjca
Finally got thru all the comments on this thread. What’s particularly noticable is that we’re down to just a single troll. And he’s being (mostly) ignored. A definite improvement to the ambiance.
schrodingers_cat
@Mike E: I hope so. As a Biden primary voter I feel disrespected by the media. They are telling me that only votes and feelings of white people count. The media mavens despise our multiethnic coalition. They will do everything to undermine Democrats no matter who is at the top of our ticket.
DougJ on Twitter
wjca
Although it seems like the Iranians remain far more willing than the Russians to demonstrate against their regime. Possible because they have cultural memories of at least occasional non-autocratic governments.
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@mali muso:
Thank you!
WaterGirl
@schrodingers_cat: I looked for that and couldn’t find it on DougJ’s twitter. What day and time was that posted? With a little more info, I will look again.
Chris
@Tony Jay:
The “become Dan Rather’s boss” campaign was all the way back in the eighties. It’s been a long time coming.
Layer8Problem
@the pollyanna from hell: Geez, I don’t know, I’m a Sagittarius. I don’t believe in anything.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
The disturbing thought I have is, rather than some cynical rat fucking campaign, this is how our Elite Media Betters really think is the standards our elected officials should be messured by. After all, it was their predecessors that denounced Lincoln as the “original ape”
E.
@Leto: I am not telling anyone not to send postcards! I do it myself! But this is an environment that is so rich with unused data. We could track and learn the answers to fairly fine-grained questions if we wanted, but we don’t. Simple example: You have enough money to reach 20 percent of your potential voters by postcard. Which 20 percent do you pick.
Skippy-san
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: Don’t forget the gay bashing that will come with Buttigieg. However, I think he is best equipped to deal with Trump’s nastiness.
Chris
@Captain C:
Yep. I’ve expressed the worry before that a regime collapse in Iran might ultimately end up just like the Soviet one – the official leaders and ideology of the old regime would be gone, but the securocrat mafia would simply infiltrate every part of the new society and in a few years end up running the place even more firmly than in the old regime days. (Basically, ex-IRGC doing what the ex-KGB did in Russia and several other republics).
Of course, this is a silly concern. There’s no need for the regime to collapse at all to lead to that outcome. The way things are headed, the IRGC will probably end up with all the levers of power they don’t already have soon enough.
Ken
Why, it’s completely obvious when you step through it!
Gloria DryGarden
@the pollyanna from hell: who is equal to what? Now I have to find your antecedent, figure out which way this sarcasm is aimed.
Captain C
@wjca: Hell, if Eisenhower had just told the British to fuck off and take the same deal we got from the Saudis around then, Iran would probably have a democracy right now.
Skippy-san
@UncleEbeneezer: Agreed.
Eolirin
@wil: Okay, I’ll try to make my point with fewer words because it flew over your head:
Even if Biden is forced to step down here, even if he chooses to do that, even if it’s the right thing for him to do, everything about this is fucking stupid.
To the extent that there is a real issue here it’s that the American people can’t be trusted to make decisions based on substance, even in matters that are existentially threatening to them.
That’s all I said.
And I’ll note, that’s also your thesis in wanting Harris. Substance is irrelevant, truth doesn’t matter, Biden looks too old and feeble to be able to beat Trump, Trump’s negatives, despite being what they are aren’t similarly disqualifying, so if this doesn’t happen Trump will win, and if it’s Harris, we may have a better chance. That’s the argument for Harris. It’s the only good faith one. I’m going to grant you that you’re operating under it. That is me being kind.
I’m not going to say if it’s reasonable or not, because I don’t think it matters. Biden has to choose to step down for it to happen. And I think elected Democratic officials publicly calling on him to do that aren’t helping the overall cause of beating Trump. But Biden can do that if he feels he should, and if people want to lobby him in private, that’s fine. Shrug.
But still, the core of that line of reasoning, the thing that makes it make and sense, is an assumption that the American people are fucking shallow, stupid halfwits who can’t see Hitler coming when he’s standing there with a megaphone going “It’s me Hitler!”
That’s as much of a indictment of the fucking electorate, our media, and our country, as what you’re taking issue with me saying. You’re even more forcefully making my point just by holding your position.
And still, everything about this is fucking stupid.
Chris
@wjca:
Iran made a real effort at democracy in the early twentieth century, and then again in the mid twentieth century. Even the 1979 revolution involved a lot of liberals and socialists at first, before they were outmaneuvered by the islamists.
I’d like to believe there’s enough of that sentiment left that it might be able to win out some day.
TBone
@Ken: I sent out Stones tongues painted with stars & stripes yesterday to accompany the 7/5/24 Jonathan Pie video made after the conservative loss on July Fourth to my friends and family who love JPie and the Stones. My brother messaged back that he took my young, barely teenaged nephew to see his first concert recently – the Stones of course!
Once more, for good measure!
It’s still a GREAT day for PIE! 💪😆🤣🤩🇬🇧
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=aYMy2qdNPF0
Chris
@Captain C:
Yep. Remains one of the greatest missed opportunities of the twentieth century.
Note that this is exactly what Truman did: the British tried to convince him to save their empire and he told them to go fuck themselves. Would the British have been able to wear him down eventually? Maybe, but as it stands, this is a textbook case of “Republicans took over, and immediately made things much worse.”
the pollyanna from hell
@Gloria DryGarden: Sorry. Can’t answer without naming a troll. Would I lie?
Gloria DryGarden
Poem by n. Torres
link?
which yesterday’s thread?
please help. Need to read poem without an hour of scrolling
(fall down rabbit hole, never get other things done)
need time for garden, and to enter world of postcard writing. Oh man
Eolirin
@WaterGirl: Feel free!
UncleEbeneezer
@schrodingers_cat: Agreed. I voted for Biden so that HE can beat Trump in November. I picked him for a damn reason and he won, fair and square. I’ll support Any Dem, but I didn’t pull the lever for Any Dem, I did it for Joe Biden!
KRK
@Gloria DryGarden:
It was the Four Directions fundraising thread
Gloria DryGarden
@the pollyanna from hell: no, don’t lie to me. I’ll find out another way.
thinking of the next 10 options for a preposition, pronoun choices, maybe I’ll get a poem if I squeeze my brain hard enough
TBone
@Gloria DryGarden: it’s linked up at the top of this page.
Gloria DryGarden
@KRK: gracias, I shall go look
UncleEbeneezer
Gloria DryGarden
@TBone: no, no es un link, sólo,
just the name in italics, not blue
222! auspicious # though.
Citizen Alan
@WaterGirl: Thanks. I’m an idiot. I knew exactly where it was on my laptop but shrink it to 1/4 size and it becomes invisible. :)
Chris Johnson
@Eolirin: Slow your roll <3
One of the most undermining parts of this sort of trollage-as-warfare, whether it’s on a blog or on the nightly news, is that a lot of effort is made to just insist… without evidence… ‘everybody believes this’.
You don’t want to be NOT LIKE ‘everybody’, do you?
It really is possible to be saddled with a situation where you’re trying to do this, but it’s pushing a rope. Or no, better: pushing a dead snake! Trump’s the dead snake in this analogy (I’m aware some will pretend to need this clarification ;) )
Just because someone is willing to pretend they are effortlessly convincing all the people in their audience you can’t see, doesn’t mean they are succeeding. If they’re able to sway anybody, it might be like pushing a dead snake. It might not stick.
I’m always extra wary of trolls leaning hard on ‘everyone knows’ or including stuff in their arguments that’s very much ‘citation fucking needed!’. Because it’s all obvious or subtle ways of selling a narrative, and some narratives are harder to sell than others.
What we have here is a really coordinated attempt to sell ‘Biden shouldn’t be President, because the President is a GOD and does all the things! Therefore whichever guy is noisier has to prevail! Everything else will surely work out all right, and be good TV!’
Citation FUCKING needed, okay?
‘cos yeah, Biden should be President for another four years, but even the Supreme Court going nuts doesn’t make him a God! Debators suck at policymaking when they’re too up their own butts. These narrative guys have it all backwards and inside out. Not by accident.
Don’t be swayed by arguments insisting that everyone has been swayed. Be SUSPICIOUS of arguments that everyone has been swayed. Remember, everybody likes to believe that everyone is an idiot BUT them. There’s a billion not-idiots out there. You’re one of the not-idiots… because to a greater or lesser extent everyone is a not-idiot, believing their neighbors are hapless fools.
Such is the human condition. But the imagined ballots your imagined neighbors file… aren’t real. The secret ballot the real people file after looking at the real choices we’re looking at… is.
schrodingers_cat
@WaterGirl: It is from July 3rd
I just quote tweeted it again
Link here
SoupCatcher
@Gloria DryGarden:
https://balloon-juice.com/2024/07/05/four-directions-wisconsin-we-have-angels-and-poetry/
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@Skippy-san: That’s why I mentioned Pete’s family, they will just have make that “gay man in a happy, monogamous relationship” out to be something evil.
Elizabelle
@Eolirin: Excellent comment.
WaterGirl
@Gloria DryGarden: There’s a link to the thread right below where I mention the poem.
Here’s a screen capture.
Eolirin
@Elizabelle: Thank you
stinger
@Another Scott: Love the $81 idea! I just donated that amount! I hope somebody is tracking amounts and notices that (and that thousands of others do the same). Thanks, Another!
stinger
@Eolirin:
They weren’t! He was just naming things that were in his view at that moment. Because he’d already forgotten the 5 words in the actual test.
Dark Patriot
@WaterGirl: i want to thank you for explaining the pie filter
Ksmiami
@Leto: I’ve changed the postcard verbiage to explain the stakes…
WaterGirl
@Dark Patriot: happy to do it. If one person asks a question, there are probably a hundred who are wondering the same thing.
Chris T.
@Snarki, child of Loki: I tried to palindromate (is that a verb?) what you wrote and got this far:
a trump a plan a fascism … msics af anal pap murta
I’m not sure what to do with that, but “anal pap murta” seems correct!
whatsleft
@Eolirin: they are not. Those 5 words Trump cited were literally things/people he was looking at AT THE TIME of the interview. I’ve had 2 family members take that test with me in the room – my teenage daughter after a car accident and traumatic brain injury, and my husband recently, at his request, and it was 3 words (he could only remember 2 sadly).