Two quick things for this open thread.
First. Biden cancels his speech (scheduled for Sunday) because there is a strike, with picket lines, and we all know that Joe Biden will not be crossing a picket line. h/t Chris Johnson
You know what the media will say, you know what social media trolls will say; now you know what the real deal is in advance. Forewarned is forearmed.
Second. An interesting take on troll behavior, from Chris Johnson the comments. I’ll be interested in hearing your thoughts on these thoughts!
I coin the term ‘Trollster’, check it out :)
You can (and we did!) get pairs of trolls with the following characteristics:
- Instead of trying to persuade, they’re hammering narratives very unappealingly. It’s brazen, annoying.
- The narratives may have a common factor (Biden bad) but will outline OPPOSITE positions. Trump stronk/weak, Kamala Prez/dumped, like that.
- The trolls WILL NOT intersect. Strictly one thread for the one, one thread for the other. If invited they will not intersect, though they seemingly have opposite takes.
- If discovered they can retreat or one will drop out so the other can troll normally.
The purpose of Trollstering is to get information back about the subjects that have opposite takes. They, or somebody, is taking note of how they’re argued against and what sticks. The reason they will not intersect even when invited, is because it’s actively a rule for them not to do, and the reason for that is it’d ruin the data! They can’t argue with each other, they’re strictly gathering data on YOU. I would bet money there’s an actual rule against them posting in each others’ threads.
So, if the trollage seems unusually obnoxious and it really seems to be picking fights, check to see if you’re being Trollstered. Is there a nearby thread with a whole other troll, who is being just as obnoxious but over literally opposite points?
Getting normally trolled requires getting some sympathy, but getting Trollstered can be way more adversarial, because you’re being watched on how you respond to the side-issues. They’ll be incredibly on-message, but there’ll be another one where the message has a contradictory aspect. It’s a poll
Here’s the usefulness: it’s a window into what narrative might get pushed next, and it reveals weakness. If the narrative is going perfect they don’t need to do this.
If anyone has questions about how the pie filter works, we have answers. Just ask!
Open thread.
Odie Hugh Manatee
I just heard an asshole on the radio nooz saying that Democrats are worried that they could lose the House and Senate if Biden doesn’t drop out. I wish I could see one of these fuckers so I could kick them in the nuts.
The fucking courtier media is hard at work trying to deliver results for Felonious D and his MAGAt party. Democrats are fools of the fall for this shit that is being pulled on them. After this election we really need to reevaluate our news services because they are not working to inform people.
They are being used to mislead us and it has to stop.
ETA: Dropped my wife off at a baby shower a bit ago and as we were passing the UPS depot we saw that someone had drawn large hearts in the grime on the rear doors of their trucks and wrote BIDEN under them! Random as hell but uplifting to see!
WaterGirl
I haven’t been able to listen to my roundup of political podcasts for 2-3 weeks now. I just can’t. With one exception: Beau of the Fifth Column. I would describe him as “steady as she goes” and it’s a welcome relief from all the hair on fire since the media and dirty tricksters are fanning the flames of the political wildfires, which are definitely out of control.
Beau acknowledges how bad things are, and with the Supreme Court immunity ruling he says that no matter how bad you think it is, it’s even worse. But there’s no “oh my god, Biden!” so I can listen to his quick takes.
Tony Jay
Nice work there by Chris. Very nice.
When in doubt, check.
When in no doubt, laugh and poke fun at their genitals. I mean really go for it. Graphic stuff, borderline filth. Do it constantly, to every one of their comments. Imagine you’re in a job interview for a post you really don’t want and let ‘er rip. Empty those smut filters all over their virtual faces.
How do you like that data, trollfarmers?
On reflection, this approach may not work for everyone. Fortunately other approaches are available.
Trivia Man
Pie question: i ALWAYS have brilliant takes* but often hear nothing but crickets to my point in the comments. Can i tell if i have been pied for sone reason? If i have, does it ever wear off?
* opinions may differ
Urza
Did I miss some troll commenters here or is this just a general thing? Can’t say i’ve seen it for sure but I don’t read alot of comments outside Balloon Juice.
dc
What is “pied” on this blog? Can we block people? Is that what it is?
raven
@dc: Not block, you just don’t see their comments.
Mike E
@Trivia Man: you’re good here, and my pantry is brimming.
Poe Larity
They’re AI bots.
And now we have AI ammo vending machines:
https://gizmodo.com/oklahoma-alabama-now-have-ai-powered-vending-machines-that-sell-bullets-2000377093
Urza
@dc: Commenters you don’t like get replaced with a pie. The pie at the top of the comments has a list of commenters in the thread if you click it. It carries over to other threads.
Parfigliano
Pied? What that?
Gretchen
I think Chris is on to something. I hadn’t used the pie filter in so long I’d forgotten how to use it. I have suddenly been using is several times a day the last few days. I have noticed that I pied some regular commenters who were arguing with the trolls.
Geminid
@Trivia Man: There’s no telling. I don’t think very many people here pie many others despite the recent pie fights.
I suggest you do what I do when I put up a comment and nobody responds. I tell myself the comment was so good there was nothing left to say!
Trivia Man
@Mike E: ‘Im a real boy!
thanks 👏🏽 For confirming i exist OUTSIDE my own head. Even a solipsist needs some external reality occasionally.
trollhattan
@Poe Larity: Ain’t that America.
Trivia Man
@Geminid: What an excellent point you make… and i am willing to say that out loud so you can see it. usually I console myself that it’s because im often late to the party.
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@Trivia Man:
I doubt it unless you’re deliberately trolling or, if a recognizable nym and equivocating message-wise (recently) about Biden, his age, fitness for office, etc.
Mike E
@Parfigliano: the cherry tart icon just above the #1 comment, click it and add nyms who vex you and/or others so that their field of text becomes a picture. Anybody responding to them also get represented as a picture (but are not permanently “pied”).
You can keep nyms in this penalty box until you choose to release them by clicking the cherry pie.
Another Scott
@dc: Back in the ancient mists of time, a wizard named “Cleek” wrote some (javascript?) code for this site that one could download from his site. When you added a person’s posting “handle” here to a list, it converted your view their comment into some text like “We don’t talk about pie enough here.” Every comment by them was changed to something about pie.
Brilliant stuff.
The current version is built-in to the Balloon-Juice code shows drawings of various pastries, candies, etc. Also brilliant.
HTH!
Cheers,
Scott.
Scout211
You haven’t pied the regular commenter, you just pied the comment that was a reply to the pied person. You can use the toggle button to read the comment if you are interested in reading how the commenter replied to the pied person.
Leto
@Parfigliano:
the opposite of cake. What psychopaths like to eat after dinner. Or before dinner. Really, any time of the day. Crazy bastards. The true monsters add ice cream…. ICE CREAM!!!!
Gretchen
@WaterGirl: I have been boycotting all political podcasts too, except the Professional Left, who repeat the mantra “chop wood, carry water” . Meaning we can get discouraged but continuing to do the work helps.
To replace the podcasts, I bought Stephen Fry reading The Complète Sherlock Holmes. It lasts 58 hours so I hope that will take me past this nonsense.
trollhattan
Pro tip for hobby miners: take confined space training and for fuck’s sake, monitor for methane. The life you save may be your own.
WaterGirl
@Trivia Man: There is no way to know if someone has pied you unless you are at their computer or on your phone. The info is kept in cookies (or something similar on some devices).
I am 99.99% certain that most people do not have you pied.
I nod in response to a lot of your comments, but I surely don’t always reply.
Urza
@Another Scott: I didn’t realize THE Cleek used to hang out here.
Urza
@trollhattan: WTF is a hobby miner? Can’t think of many places mining without regulations other than the border. Bet those guys aren’t stupid about it.
WaterGirl
@dc: What does being “pied” mean?
If I go into the pie filter and add you, then instead of seeing your comment at #5, I would see:
It only affects what I see – anyone who doesn’t have you pied sees your comment.
Let’s say that I have you pied, but John Cole replies to you. In that case, I see a piece of dessert, too. Because if someone replies to a person I have pied, then I don’t see their reply, either.
But if Cole posts another comment – either a fresh comment or replies to someone I DO NOT have pied, then I see John’s comments.
*Also, if you do see someone as dessert, there is a toggle button so you can see what has been written there if you want. And if you toggle again, you are back to seeing dessert for that comment.
Does that help?
Leto
@trollhattan: from my hometown back in SC:
Summerville man dies after setting off firework on his head at block party
Here’s everyone’s rebuttal for why we have to have warnings on literally everything.
TaMara
Hmmmm, too bad the pie filter doesn’t work in the OP
I haven’t forgotten Chris Johnson’s unprovoked attack on Adam in a Ukraine thread, that take Adam a considerable amount of time and personal angst to write.
lowtechcyclist
[Argument clinic]No you’re not.[/AC]
You only exist in my head, you see, so when I’m out of my head (which is most of the time), I don’t see you and can’t respond to your comments. The ones I see are pretty good though.
BR
I just saw this headline (can’t read the article):
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/audio/2024-07-06/biden-gains-in-swing-states-texas-braces-for-beryl-more
WaterGirl
@Parfigliano: Is that’s a real question i will gladly answer, but it may be a joke?
trollhattan
@Urza: The California gold country–this is a few miles from Sutter’s Mill for reference–has tens of thousands of mines and anybody who buys acreage up there will likely inherit mine shafts. Some will get the bug and start digging.
Was thankful my in-laws who bought 35 acres near Georgetown were too old to investigate the ones on that property. Ten years earlier wild horses could not have kept my FIL out of them.
Snarki, child of Loki
Why bother using the pie filter on a troll, when you can add them to the Global Killfile?
And for AI trolls, need to figure out what to feed them to poison their input data.
Suzanne
Is anyone seeing yard signs yet? I went running this morning and saw my first Biden-Harris of the year. Also saw one house with three TFG signs and “Let’s Go Brandon”. Stay classy, Pittsburgh. It’s gonna be a long time to November.
trollhattan
@Leto: What the what?!?
Festive!
WaterGirl
@Gretchen:
I suspect you haven’t pied the regular commenters. But if someone who IS NOT PIED replies to someone you do have pied, then that comment also shows as dessert. But their other comments that are not replies to someone you have pied – those show up as usual.
Miki
@WaterGirl: So how are nyms added to the Commenters list? Have those people been pied by someone in the post?
ETA I don’t pie people so that might explain why I don’t understand it.
Steeplejack
@Trivia Man:
Instead of being paranoid about pie, you have to get used to the fact that quite often readers will appreciate, agree with and maybe even love your comments without feeling the need to respond. Just remind yourself that you’re not commenting into a void. I once had a commenter thank me for something I wrote several months previously!
Odie Hugh Manatee
@Trivia Man:
I don’t pie so I have to suffer through everything. Don’t worry though, you haven’t made me think of pie once with your comments! :)
Eyeroller
@Miki: In a given thread, the pie filter will show just the commenters in the thread to that point, but you can use the Search box to find any commenter you wish to pie as long as you know the nym.
Once you pie a commenter, not only that person’s comments, but any responses, will show cakes and pies and candies and sealion chow.
Starfish
@Trivia Man: No. People ignore most comments. I comment a lot, and most of the time people just ignore what I am saying which is fine.
CaseyL
@Leto:
It’s also liability insurance. Maybe even primarily liability insurance. Someone who injures themselves doing something so dumb a gerbil would know better (no offense to gerbils) can’t turn around and say they didn’t know any better, and sue the owner/manufacturer of whatever they injured themselves with.
I once saw, in an office kitchen, an Ikea-style pictograph giving step by step instructions on how to use the microwave. In a kitchen at an office.
JWR
Meanwhile, TFG’s favorite judge strikes again. From NBC:
One of the guys in the accompanying video mentions just how quickly she can make a ruling when it favors her favorite guy.
lowtechcyclist
@BR: Some details:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2024-07-06/biden-narrows-trump-s-election-lead-in-key-states-after-debate-poll
Steeplejack
@Starfish:
I think “ignore” is too harsh. As I said at #38, it’s more likely that people are reading but just feeling the need to respond.
Poe Larity
@Urza: This was a top 10,000 blog back in the day.
Even Biden quotes our most famous troll.
Dan B
@Leto: We had the same in Redmond, home of Microsoft. Some guy was showing off to two kids at 2:30 AM, in a co-op grocery parking lot. He was East Indian, probably tech worker.
Elizabelle
@Mike E: “Vex” is such a good word.
WaterGirl
@Miki: The list of available nyms to pie in the pie filter comes from the post you are in when you click on the pie filter.
So if you click the pie filter in an On the Road post, you will just get a list of 25- 35 nyms at most. But if you click on a really active post, you will see tons of nyms to choose from. At some point in a busy post, all the nyms aren’t in the list. But you can use the search field in the pie filter – if you wanted to pie me, start typing “water…” and it will bring up everyone in the post that starts with those letters. Then you would click on WaterGirl to pie me.
I took a screen capture and added it in the comments of my earlier post today, if you want to go find that. Oh, hell, I’ll just add it again here.
lowtechcyclist
@Odie Hugh Manatee:
Oh, the humanity! ;-)
Steeplejack
@Urza:
People keep missing that the pie-filter box also has a field where you can search for a commenter by name. Much easier than going through the limited list of 15 or so explicit choices that are listed.
Elizabelle
@Leto: Closed casket on that one. Sheesh. Although: maybe later we’ll find out the wife did it.
BlueDWarrior
@lowtechcyclist: basically, the polls are in saying a big fat ‘meh’ in so far as they are affecting the numbers in the race.
This is going to be about turnout, and if I were Biden, I’d spend the next 4 months saying the media wants to run the election for you before you have the chance to even early vote. Along with pounding the table on Project 2025.
Eyeroller
@lowtechcyclist: Other polls (though I think before the debate) have shown him tied or ahead in Pennsylvania. The point, though, is that normies didn’t care about the fucking debate and they are probably mystified by the press freakout if they even notice it. So his polling is no reason to dump him.
We occasionally have Josh Marshall’s opinion thrown at us. Josh is a good guy but I think his political instincts are pretty bad. In 2012 he was treading very close to the “replace Obama” movement, which was real for those who don’t remember. He was at least a Nervous Nelly. After this he admitted that “well the polling isn’t a reason to replace Biden.” Well then what reason would there be, Josh? The press would be nicer to the next person, who realistically would have to be Harris? Come on.
Ohio Mom
@Suzanne: I’m seeing a few signs for the Republican running for Congress against the one-term incumbent Democrat. Nothing else yet.
I live in a cut-de-sac in the middle of a subdivision; the only audience for my signs are my seven (mostly Republican) neighbors and the garbage men. I’m still itching to put up a Biden sign, I think it will cheer me.
ETA: and a Sherrod Brown sign
Odie Hugh Manatee
@lowtechcyclist:
You rang? Oh…
;)
Starfish
@Miki: Pieing can be a useful tool.
I have pied people briefly, usually during election season.
I would imagine eversor is someone who gets pied by a lot of people. In recent threads, a lot of people were pieing wil.
It is too early in the season for me to be pieing anyone.
BlueDWarrior
@Eyeroller: I’m starting to believe that White, supposedly liberal, men really are the weak link in our coalition; at least beyond the voting base.
Almost everyone that has their hair on fire, on camera, is a White man; and this Black man finds that curious.
Yutsano
@Elizabelle: As long as the insurance pays* that’s all that matters.
*Assuming he had life insurance outside his employer. Because if it’s only through work she may never see a dime on it because the employer is listed as the only beneficiary.
Elizabelle
@Trivia Man: Aren’t you the one who was going to be bicycling nude? Trust me, a lot of us read and remember that comment.
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@Urza:
Cleek’s Law was formulated here:
https://balloon-juice.com/2010/07/17/just-another-failed-ideology/#comment-1893941
BR
@lowtechcyclist:
Thanks. I imagine polls like this are ignored because they do not fit the narrative whereas bad polls for Biden are going to continue to be flogged.
Starfish
@Elizabelle: Are we requesting a second Balloon Juice calendar consisting of naked cycling, naked bathtub mopping and so on?
(This comment will definitely get me pied.)
Bill Arnold
@Trivia Man:
Not really. Your intuition might notice odd gaps in the semantic flows. This is one of the issues with commenter blockers like the pie filter. They are a form of shunning that can be difficult to detect. Re duration, for the user, filters tend to be obvious, e.g. the pie filter shows pies, and on other sites, the comment is(can be) blank, so people generally prune their block lists occasionally.
I just don’t worry about it. One positive twist is that this site has a lot of lurkers.
sab
@Trivia Man: I pie a lot, mostly to keep myself from either feeding trolls or hurting the feelings of commenters I admire.
The toggle switch is amazing. I toggle the jackals I like so even in the pie safe I mostly read them. Trolls and obnoxious jackals get toggled for a while until I am reminded that I pied them because I think they are idiots or trolls.
Steeplejack
@Steeplejack:
D’oh! “Just not feeling the need to respond.”
Elizabelle
@BlueDWarrior: Yep. The MSM lemmings served themselves up for that. Run against the “ malefactors” in the press. Remind voters JRB is a political heir to FDR, and all the improvements he delivered for average Americans. (You might get some wag who says “what, is he gonna die in office too?” Great opportunity to segue to Kamala and her strengths.)
besides which, now that so many of us have canceled our newspaper subscriptions and are doing a news blackout, We have a lot more time to postcard and canvas and do things in real life.
I’m not canvassing yet. Heat index of 105 today and way humid. But we will!
zhena gogolia
@Trivia Man: I don’t have you pied.
pat
@BlueDWarrior: But he may not be on the ballot!
go read anything in the FTFNYT and it is all about “he’s got to quit!!””
Leto
@Elizabelle: knowing what spouses have done to each other, in that state…
@Suzanne: @Ohio Mom: haven’t seen any yet, but on the way to the hospital a few weeks back I saw a Trumpov painted Hummvee H2. Ugliest f’ing thing I’ve seen in a while.
Elizabelle
@Starfish: Please! Think of the demographics here!
pat
Also, I guess I don’t understand this pie thing.
How about just, you know, skipping over and not reading the dreck?
Gloria DryGarden
@WaterGirl: excellent explanation, very helpful..
I have not tried the pie yet.
Suzanne
@Ohio Mom: So I looked at that NYT tool some years ago in which you enter your zip code and it tells you the voter registration mix of your neighbors. My neighborhood is 75% Dem/25% GOP. But some of that 25% are O B N O X I O U S with their signage.
Last cycle, one neighbor had a gigantic sign, maybe 10’ wide, that read “TRUMP 2020 MAKE THE LIBERALS CRY AGAIN”. The day after the election, but before it was called, I walked down the street to take a middle-finger selfie with it….. but they had taken it down. Didn’t even wait for the election to be called. Weak.
sab
@Gretchen: If you pie the troll, the comments directly (using the reply button) replying to the troll are also pied. Your other comments are not pied, just the reply to pied troll.
Elizabelle
@Yutsano: The employer! Now she has to go load up on more fireworks.
trollhattan
Loose Cannon continues earning her paycheck–the actual one and all the others.
Fascinating, in the horrific sense, how she’s completely transparent with doing Trump’s bidding with her every motion.
Eyeroller
@BlueDWarrior: You’re by no means the only one thinking that.
There are some white women (of course) and a few people of color, mostly journos who are enmeshed in that culture, but it does seem to be driven largely by middle-aged to older white male supposed liberals. (Disclosure: I am an older white woman.)
There is little doubt that white males are the weakest link in our coalition. Somebody noted that white Democrats in general are a minority in their cohort. I’ve seen some very supposedly liberal (generally male) whites, in a smaller cohort (academia, they supposedly don’t care much about hoi polloi) express some very right-wing views on certain topics.
Mike E
@Leto: sure, blame No Labels
Ohio Mom
@Leto: I grew up in New York, where fireworks are illegal and sparklers are only barely legal (I seem to remember they are illegal in NYC but permissible in the rest of the state).
That isn’t to say that everyone obeys the laws of course but I was gobsmacked after I moved to Ohio and fireworks were for sale all over. I triggered a little chauvinism in me, I was from a more civilized place where selling finger-removers was not allowed.
Anyway, I hope the fellow who blew his head off did not have any children who witnessed this stunt. Bad enough for his wife and the other adult guests.
Bill Arnold
@comrade scotts agenda of rage:
So was Wilhoit’s law. It was prototyped here (2016, maybe elsewhere, ask him) and then he posted it in the form that people cite on Crooked Timber.
sab
My husband is so excited. Out and about today he saw an actual cybertruck. His first sighting. He says its ugliness did not disappoint. Much much worse than he expected.
BR
I like the idea of running against the media in a real way. Not a Trumpian anti journalistic way. But instead say something like:
“I think real journalism is essential. It’s what made America possible. We need thousands more real media outlets, with real journalism, worker owned, union shops.
But a bunch of billionaires and millionaires who buy up TV stations and newspapers don’t represent America and don’t produce good journalism that matters to Americans. Wealthy families that pass down ownership of media outlets to their heirs. They don’t represent Americans. These billionaires don’t get to decide. They only represent themselves and their interests. They put their bags of money on the scale and hope we don’t notice how they are tilting their coverage.”
Mike E
@pat: it creates a shitty comment thread when a troll sea lions all over it… besides, who doesn’t like pictures of delicious pie?
zhena gogolia
@Suzanne: I’ve seen a few Trump flags. (in deep-blue CT) But it’s heartening that you saw a Biden-Harris sign, because we sane people tend not to put them out until closer to the election, so it’s a sign of special support, I think.
NotMax
I simply ignore them and move on. YMMV.
BR
@sab:
I got my first sighting of a cybertruck this week. From the side I thought, ok, looks like a video game truck. I can imagine someone liking it. Then I was stuck behind it in traffic, and it was truly hideous, like a trash truck that was assembled using duplo legos.
Eyeroller
@pat: I’ve read this blog for nearly two decades and never pied anybody, but one commenter was so persistent and prolific I just didn’t want to deal with it, so pied him (I am pretty sure it’s a “he.”)
sab
@Geminid: That is usually the case. Your comments are so well researched. I slink off with my tail between my legs when you disagree with me.
zhena gogolia
@Eyeroller: I have no use for Josh Marshall, pace a lot of people here.
zhena gogolia
@Elizabelle: Oh, yeah, that was great.
lowtechcyclist
@BlueDWarrior:
That particular set of polls suggests that the race is basically tied in terms of the Electoral College. If all the non-swing states go the way we assume they’ll go, then ahead in 2 swing states, behind in 1, and statistically tied in the other 4 isn’t a bad place to be at this point.
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@BR:
https://flic.kr/p/2pV8x8Z
https://flic.kr/p/2pVebgs
It’s interesting to see one next to pretty much the total opposite EV, in this case a 2023 Bolt.
And yeah, it’s godawful-looking from the rear.
zhena gogolia
@Suzanne: 😂
gene108
@JWR:
From the perspective of conducting a fair trial Cannon is awful. For positioning herself to try and replace one of the septuagenarians on the court, should Trump win, she’s knocking out of the park.
hrprogressive
Feels relevant, and I will admit my n=1 so, YMMV.
But on a Reddit thread, someone claimed “Normal people don’t like to hear ‘Trump will be a dictator'” as a reason why Biden needed to drop out.
Like, apparently, the very real Fascist threat to this country wasn’t “good enough reason” to support Biden/vote against Trump.
I’m not sure if that person was real, or a bot, or was engaging in some sort of subterfuge but I thought it was interesting.
It was such an out of left field response that it stuck with me.
Mike E
Colombia re-annexes Panama in under 15 minutes, 2-0 in Copa America
Suzanne
@zhena gogolia: Yeah, I felt good seeing it. It was in Mt. Lebanon, which is the bougie, classy suburb next to my neighborhood. Heavily white and historically a kind of country-club Republican place. Conor Lamb is from there, Chris DeLuzio is now their rep. Very NPR-totebagger (I see the Mt. Lebanon Dems out at the farmers’ market!) but absolutely the kind of place we need to make inroads.
Starfish
@pat: It’s hard because some people will sealion, “a type of trolling or harassment that consists of pursuing people with relentless requests for evidence, often tangential or previously addressed, while maintaining a pretense of civility and sincerity, and feigning ignorance of the subject matter” and take over a lot of a thread.
SpaceUnit
There were a whole bunch of trolls in last night’s wee hours post. Lots of nyms that I’d never seen before.
Maybe it’s better to ignore them, but I think we need to push back against the bullshit. Anyone here telling us we need to panic and replace Biden deserves to get flamed. IMO.
ETA: And I’ll take my pie as it comes.
NotMax
@NotMax
Further, I can’t make use of the pie filter even if I wanted to because of my preferred browser settings. Again, YMMV.
zhena gogolia
@NotMax: I tend to find the pie more annoying than the comments.
Another Scott
@Starfish:
Obligatory Wondermark #1062 – The Terrible Sea Lion
Cheers,
Scott.
Steeplejack
@zhena gogolia:
Good to see you in the comments. As part of my “stay away from the anti-Biden craziness on the Internet” mental-health plan, I have been watching and rewatching a lot of stuff on my streaming services. I thought of you because currently I’m going back through Endeavour on PBS Passport.
I missed the last few seasons when they first came out. I tried to dip in at what I thought was my last contact point, but I had forgotten (or never saw) too much. So I restarted on Season 1, and I have been enjoying it. (I even got a trial subscription to PBS on Amazon Prime so I could see the pilot episode—not available anywhere else—and then canceled it after I watched that. My Passport subscription is through WETA, my local PBS mega-station.)
Some of the plots I don’t remember at all. Others I do, but it’s interesting to watch the episodes to catch various details and to appreciate the acting and period-specific mise en scène. One thing I’ve noticed is that the actors all look plausibly mid-’60s British. Okay, not enough bad teeth, but still . . .
This has even gotten me thinking about rewatching Inspector Morse (BritBox), which I haven’t seen in years.
sab
@Ohio Mom: I am a sixth or seventh generation Ohioan, and my great grandfather blew out one of his eyes with a firecracker type thing when he was a teenager. So he didn’t get to go to college because his aunts thought too much reading might hurt the other eye.
Ohio really hasn’t changed much over the decades. People are just noticing.
On the other hand, I just heard on Spectrum that in the Civil War we were number two in Union states with Black soldiers.
Miki
@WaterGirl: Thank you. That’s kind of what I thought.
IIUC, the reason I don’t see pie/pie iterations is because I don’t do pie.
Gotta say – not being able to see if I’ve been pied is a good thing. Pie is for thee, not me.
Lapassionara
I see where Nate Silver has added his wisdom. SNARK.
This election is about who will appoint the replacements for Justices Thomas and Alito. This election is about whether we will continue to fight global climate change. This election is about whether we will continue to stand by our allies. This election is about whether we allow an asset of the Russian government to have access to our national security secrets.
Biden is on the right side of these issues, and TFG is not.
dc
@raven: How does that work? What does one need to do, or is it just, voluntarily ignoring on the reader’s part?
NotMax
@Another Scott
Wouldn’t happen to have a link to the Wondermark with Red Riding Hood and the wolf in bed together? Always chuckled over that one and long ago misplaced the link.
wil
I thought Trumpers were the ones suckered into conspiracy theories.
Apparently not just them.
dc
@Another Scott: Thank you for the explanation. I will check it out.
Steeplejack
@pat:
Your choice. Different strokes for different folks.
comrade scotts agenda of rage
@Steeplejack:
A couple of months ago, we finished a similar viewing project. Started with ‘Morse’ from the beginning (the production values in the first 2 season are *very* sparse). Then transitioned into ‘Lewis’. Then watched all of ‘Endeavor’.
We don’t binge-watch so it took about a year given our viewing habits.
Have fun!
sab
Deleted. I did too hit post.
NotMax
@zhena gogolia
Come sit by me. I’ve got chips and dips.
;)
schrodingers_cat
@zhena gogolia: Come and sit by me. He used to be good when W was the President. Now he is a part of the MediaBorg.
Most BJers did not agree with my assessment. When you are not the default, you see things that default demographic can miss.
schrodingers_cat
@zhena gogolia: I pie depending on the thread. I only started doing that recently. Gaza sealioning was too tiresome to read first thing in the morning.
SuzieC
@Lapassionara: I’m going to copy and save this post.
Jay
@pat:
In yesterdays and todays dreck, there was a lot of skipping required. At times I had to engage the fast down scroll.
JCJ
@lowtechcyclist:
Nicely done!
Another Scott
@NotMax: #256 I think?
:-)
Cheers,
Scott.
Mike E
@dc: see comment nos. 10 18 27 40 49 among others in this thread for the “how to” and “what for”
zhena gogolia
@Steeplejack: Oh, it’s always fun to rewatch Inspector Morse. We may be about to do that.
The pilot episode of Endeavour is the one with the opera singer? I love that one. The one that’s a remake of Gatsby is also rewatchable. Roger Allam is stellar all through.
Grantchester is on their third vicar now. He’s cute. The mysteries are pitiful, but Robson Green still brings it.
Lyrebird
@BlueDWarrior: Curious indeed.
I can’t stand to watch the talking heads, so I don’t know. I heard about one exception – don’t worry, I heard you say “almost” and I agree – to the rule being Van Jones, but iirc he has played a contrarian role before.
I am a pale pink suburbanite with no insider info. Sure seems like all of “Biden is old, don’t you know?” and wishcasting that we would abandon the Prez does just boil down to, “but VP is Black!” ..and smart, and a woman, and all.
Usually I disagree with Mistermix on approach, but his response the other day captured all I can imagine to say to these supposed members of the coalition who propagate this crap about throwing our ticket overboard: WTF is wrong with u? (“u” is not you reading this)
Geminid
@Starfish:
The “It’s After Dark Somewhere” Calendar.
Scout211
Chaos agents aren’t really interested in the argument per se, they are arguing and “just asking questions” in order to stir things up and cause chaos and conflict among the commentariat.
IMHO, that seemed to have happened in the overnight thread. Regular commenters’ fears were stirred up and then what ensued were disagreements over who is looking at Biden’s candidacy the right way and who is doing it wrong.
I’m not here to censor, but I would hope you see that “pushing back the bullshit” is exactly what the chaos agent is intending you to do.
But I do get why you feel like you need to respond. Just maybe think about the trolls as chaos agents. It’s super hard to ignore them but that is the only way to reduce their power to cause chaos.
Steeplejack
@Starfish:
Sea lion simplified.
ETA: And Another Scott in ahead of me.
Lapassionara
@SuzieC: Thank you.!
wil
@Scout211: In fact it’s just club behavior. Your ‘regular commenters’ are just enforcing in-group-out-group rules and saying “you’re not part of the club!” to anyone new who isn’t in lockstep agreement on Club Rules when it comes to opinion.
vokeda
@Tony Jay: ok
SpaceUnit
Y’all can have this one. I’m coming off the night shift.
Geminid
@sab: You don’t need to slink anywhere. I think your comments are as valuable as mine.
Have you talked with the young people in Richmond lately? I think this is their first Summer in Virginia. I hope they’re doing alright.
gene108
@BlueDWarrior:
My take, white people have a lot more MAGA relatives than black people, and know more uncommitted voters who could vote for Trump.
The whole discussion on how to handle your MAGA uncle at Thanksgiving was pretty much a white people problem.
Steeplejack
@NotMax:
Red Riding Hood.
Chris Johnson
I know of one other leftwing youtuber who’s… no, wait, I bet there’s two.
I’ve been paying attention to Vaush, Beau, Sam Seder, Xanderhal, Dylan Burns, and Shark3ozero, typically without following them (they all post MANY videos and would swamp my feed. I have already ‘pied’ Cenk Uygur and TYT, because they are very obviously as dirty as the NYT and have been doing a ‘turn MAGA arc’ for some time. The joke about them is that there is a gas leak, but they’re also where we got Jimmy Dore and a bunch of other fascists and Putin-puppets, so I figure they’ve been sus all along.
Cenk is the uncle of noted ‘leftist’ Hasanabi, who’s been fiercely defending Russia since they invaded, so pie to all of ’em.
Vaush’s nerve broke over the debate. He’s now 100% a concern troll, except he probably sincerely thinks the world is ending. He’s taking it out on his chat, and getting teased that the TYT gas leak has spread to him. I’m teasing him that he is on his Cenk arc. It’s possible he’ll come around, but for now he’s making a big mess.
Beau is sound, and hasn’t been fooled for a moment. He is actually a very extreme leftist, but he understands optics very well and is a good resource on influencing people. For whatever reason, that guy really knows his stuff.
Sam Seder’s been drifting into concern troll territory, and some of his people came from TYT. Matt Binder, who’s on the Sam Seder channel, is smart and has been good. He’s on Bluesky, and I think he’s got his head screwed on right.
Xanderhal’s a good kid! He’s an abuse survivor and is very good about intersectionality, very woke. He started out leaning alt-right but made a video on how a youtube debate snapped him out of it. He got attacked by a fake leftist, guy named DJMuel, and defended himself so well (and the attack was so bad faith) that there’s a giant compilation video of all of LeftTube uniting in dunking on DJMuel. It’s a fun video for schadenfreude and righteous indignation, as Muel absolutely clowns himself in horrifying, disgraceful ways while trying to do a character assasination.
Dylan Burns is a leftist journalist actually in Ukraine. He gets knocked off YouTube and Twitch a lot for posting Russian atrocities that break content restrictions, because there are people following him just to report him for violations. I don’t know what he makes of US domestic politics, but he’s very solid on Ukraine: he’s literally there. He’s also an amateur boxer and has shut up the occasional pushy MAGA by going “Okay! I’ll fight you. Where and when?” and meaning it.
Shark3ozero is a black youtuber, a funny guy who’s a lot smaller than for instance Sam Seder, and as young as Xanderhal (Sam’s our age, as is Beau, Vaush is somewhat younger but not as young as Xan and Shark). I think he’s good. I checked on his debate reaction video, and he reacted just like we did: his takeaway was that it obviously wasn’t a big deal, that he didn’t know why Joe started poorly, and that Trump was a trainwreck.
I also check out DemonMama who’s a trans politics/drama youtuber, but I’m not sure she’s got our perspective: she might be more shook than Xan and Shark were, by the threat of this giant manufactured narrative. I hope she’s doing OK.
I avoid the hell out of ThoughtSlime because he looks like totally bad faith to me, and he tried to attack Xanderhal over made-up drama. ThoughtSlime is for edgelord ‘leftists’ that want to be crybullies and woke-police. He’s like Central Casting for russian ‘hello fellow kids!’ right down to the curiously good production values. Sometimes that’s a tell.
Second Thought is straight up fighting Ukraine for his Russian masters, not much ambiguity there. Noah Samsen is like DJMuel Lite: trying to fight other leftists who aren’t supporting Russia’s aims, but not as direct. Caleb Maupin is the Spanky Tankie, who is literally in the audience as, recently, literal Russia had former BernieBro Jackson Hinkle (now a fascist) addressing an empty room with propaganda bullshit. Maupin literally worked for RT. Sometimes you accuse these people of having Russian masters, but then sometimes they literally work for RT (Caleb Maupin: he got laid off) or they’re sitting there giving Russian talking points at the UN (Jackson Hinkle, and I watched Dylan Burns react to the video)
Ain’t we got fun?
Let’s just say my ideas don’t come from abstract theory. I worked for Bernie in NH and saw suspicious crap going on. It’s nice to be able to turn this experience and observation to some use <3
zhena gogolia
Black people will save democracy once a-fuckin-gain.
sab
@Mike E: I had completely forgotten there is a very sad Eeyore in the piesafe. A pied troll got a candycane heart (seemed inappropriate) but the replier got a frosted holiday cookie that said “JOY”
ETA They have been back twice for holidays. Fortunately VA is not far from Ohio.
BR
@comrade scotts agenda of rage:
I liked this post about the cybertruck:
https://mastodon.social/@VeroniqueB99/112741927996643217
Steeplejack
@zhena gogolia:
I am trying to change my voter registration from “Democrat” to “Black Woman” and not having much success so far.
Chris Johnson
I’ve been paying attention to Vaush, Beau, Sam Seder, Xanderhal, Dylan Burns, and Shark3ozero, typically without following them (they all post MANY videos and would swamp my feed. I have already ‘pied’ Cenk Uygur and TYT, because they are very obviously as dirty as the NYT and have been doing a ‘turn MAGA arc’ for some time. The joke about them is that there is a gas leak, but they’re also where we got Jimmy Dore and a bunch of other fascists and Putin-puppets, so I figure they’ve been sus all along.
sab
@Geminid: They are fine, but both a bit homesick without family. But otherwise okay.
zhena gogolia
@Steeplejack: 😂
gene108
@Eyeroller:
In any given election, on a national basis, between 3/5’s to 2/3’ of white men vote for Republicans.
President Biden did better with white men than any Democratic candidate in a while. Held Trump to only 58% of the white male vote.
The white male vote is the backbone of the Republican Party.
Suzanne
@gene108:
Agree with this. I think everyone is really just doing the best the can based on their lived experience, their social cohort, their neighborhood, what have you.
Tony Jay
Genitals, everyone. Tiny, shrivelled genitals, discoloured and malformed like James Woods in a hot tub, cupped in the paw of a puzzled orangutan called Pete, who pokes at them idly, hoping they may contain nuts.
Would I Lie?
ETA – Or we could just ignore it. Different approaches.
wil
@Lyrebird:
It really doesn’t. It boils down to people honestly thinking that Biden can’t win, and believing that replacing Biden with a candidate that can win, who would have to be Harris for campaign finance reasons, must happen sooner rather than later before all is lost.
The enforced groupthink at this site just refuses to acknowledge what is obvious to everybody else.
Ben Cisco
@BlueDWarrior: These ones are as liberal as their options.
3Sice
@Lapassionara:
He didn’t understand the value was in the 538 brand and not him. Ouch.
In 2008 the Obama analytics folks were spoon feeding him.
Steeplejack
@zhena gogolia:
Yes, the pilot is the opera diva with whom Morse is smitten. And, yes, Roger Allam as Fred Thursday is stellar. So is Anton Lesser as Chief Inspector Bright, in a “fingernails on chalkboard” way. Although he gets somewhat rehabilitated later in the series, if memory serves. And Sean Rigby is very plausible as young Jim Strange.
Don’t think I’ve hit the Gatsby one yet.
The biggest thing that got me to go back to Season 1 was that I couldn’t for the life of me remember how Morse got screwed on his sergeant’s exam, and it kept being referred to. That and the status of Morse’s tortured relationship with Joan Thursday.
ETA: I also need to catch up on Grantchester!
wil
@Tony Jay: Keep enforcing the groupthink, bro. You’re doing well with your tiny shriveled balls.
zhena gogolia
@Steeplejack: I remember more of the latter than the former.
ANTON LESSER IS A GOD
Chris Johnson
@Tony Jay: At least that one can’t ban ya :)
zhena gogolia
When will they send us some better trolls? This must be the substandard knockoff of ChatGPT.
kalakal
@Scout211:
The great thing about everyone ignoring trolls is watching their increasingly desperate attempts to get someone to engage with them. Moral indignation, emotional blackmail, provocative abuse, kitchen sink and all, they’re persistent little gits I’ll give them that
It’s amusing to see their increasing frustration , Would I Lie?
Now if only they’d take the hint and get lost
kalakal
@zhena gogolia:
Truth!
Bright is a fantastic character
Steeplejack
@zhena gogolia:
Be thankful for your hazy memory. Bright is a complete dick in the first couple of seasons.
O. Felix Culpa
Has anyone watched The Last Detective with Peter Davison? Worth seeing?
wil
@kalakal: Nothing ‘increasingly desperate’ about simply responding.
The enforced groupthink at this site is hilarious.
Honestly you are worse than the Trumpers in the groupthink department.
And no, I’m not planning to get lost, so there is no ‘hint’ to take.
You only want to hear from those who agree with you, and that’s sad and not very liberal.
3Sice
@zhena gogolia:
Maybe we should reply with random alpha numeric strings?
NotMax
@Another Scott – @Steeplejack
Thank you profusely.
@zhena gogolia
Speaking of Robson Green, noting that seasons 1, 2 & 3 of Touching Evil and (strangely) only seasons 2 & 6 of Wire in the Street are available with Prime
kalakal
@O. Felix Culpa: I enjoy it, the characters are engaging and humour works for me. If you want dark, grim, and gritty it won’t be for you
wil
@3Sice: Let’s reply by pretending we’re not really replying, but just responding to the new guy by talking to each other, and being quietly excited when we know he’s read our clever post that’s totally-not-responding-to-him!
You guys are so smart….lol
Tony Jay
@kalakal:
I know. It’s textbook stage two. First they try to ignore the persistent at-one-remove jabbing to concentrate on the innocent summer-children who are at least attempting to engage with their nonsense. Then, when the fishing dries up, they start lashing out, hoping to spark a long-running back and forth that draws in others.
I’d maybe give it a spin, if I were bored enough, but those days are over. And anyway, I’d just keep on thinking about their weird ball-in-a-cup genital arrangement and end up feeling sorry for them.
Would I Lie
ETA – See? It hates it. No one gets paid for this level of non-engagement. Well, outside of certain niche bars in Hamburg they don’t.
trnc
@comrade scotts agenda of rage:
Ah, for the simpler days of yore.
stinger
@Trivia Man: Pies? Your comments don’t need no stinkin’ pies!
kalakal
Another thing about increasingly desperate ignored trolls is they’re so predictable. Like trout rising to a fly
Another Scott
Meanwhile, …
Clever. I like this a lot. If we want people to walk more and bike more and drive less, then roads and paths should give priority to walking and biking.
Cheers,
Scott.
wil
@Tony Jay: You totally didn’t respond to me while you responded-to-me-in-code.
Good job, tiny balls in cup dude!
NotMax
@O. Felix Culpa
Personally would say it’s worth it. Even went so far as to recommend it to Mom.
wil
In the outside world:
“People are worried that Biden can’t beat Trump and are increasingly pressuring him to admit it and step down.”
Here in the locked silo of the BJ commentariat:
“None of that is happening, and anyone saying it is happening is just a troll or something, and in any case I can’t hear anything when I put my fingers in my ears and go LALALALALALALALA”
trnc
@trollhattan:
Frankly, I’m surprised she didn’t just throw out the case after the immunity ruling. After all, taking classified docs was completely official at the time that he took them.
Trivia Man
@WaterGirl: And thats ok! I dont comment for street cred or that sweet Soros cash. But im glad if i can contribute a crumb for thought here and there.
WaterGirl
@zhena gogolia: There are three options in the pie filter:
Dessert images is the default. To change to a different option, click the pie filter and click on settings.
O. Felix Culpa
@kalakal: Oh, I prefer the opposite of grim and gritty. Thanks!
@NotMax: Good to know it’s worth a recommendation to mom! :)
WaterGirl
@zhena gogolia: What? Will is gone?
WaterGirl
@sab: Oops, I have been remiss in updating the images based on time of year and holiday status.
Odie Hugh Manatee
@wil:
You are free to say whatever your heart desires and we’re allowed to laugh at it. Do you really think you have some right to be taken seriously or something? Say what you want and we’ll say what we want.
Freedom, baby!
delphinium
@NotMax: Good to know. I liked Touching Evil (also starring the wonderful Nicola Walker) and was wondering if it would come to a streaming service since it was from back in the late 90s.
wil
“American allies fear Biden is finished and can’t beat Trump”
Totally not happening, right?
Fingers in ears….”LALALALALALALALALA-I-CANT-HEAR-YOU-LALALALALLALA”
Juju
@Urza: there was a commenter here a few days ago, and I can’t remember the name, who said they wanted and honest opinion about something, as in why do you feel that way. I hadn’t seen the name before, and I didn’t commit it to memory, because why bother, but it made me go hmm at the time. I try not engage trolls, or contrary for the sake of being contrary people. I did that once and was sorry. Now I just ignore or pie. But if anyone else remembers that person, he or she may be an example. Also, I think there might be a possum in the basement. In other words, I probably don’t know squat. 😉
Trivia Man
@Steeplejack: Thanks, that was my assumption. Side note: i get bored with 10 identical “I agree!” Comments. Ive been a lurker for so long i did shots with blogfather. Regular commenting a year or so, ive been content with my engagement.
But since this was advertised as a Pie Q&A i took advantage.
wil
@Odie Hugh Manatee: Thanks. And I’m allowed to laugh at you and your attempts to enforce your groupthink.
Never claimed that I did, so you came up with that all on your own. Maybe you think you have such a right.
Freedom, baby!
Don’t worry, I’ll never take you seriously.
Trivia Man
@Elizabelle: Why yes, it was me. Ive had a couple bring that up recently so i know i am not completely! invisible.
I do hope i contribute more than a stray mental image here…. But i take what i can get.
Tony Jay
Like Karl Malden’s nose peeking out of a ball of shredded bunting. I mean, how do you even pee with that equipment? Can you arrange some tiny straps like mice use to fix their bib and braces?
Anyhoo. The frenzied media pile-on will continue until events intervene. Said events almost certainly consisting of Stench boiling over with rage that even his own people think he’s so toxic that his entire campaign relies upon him staying off the front page so a bunch of prissy nerd nobodies can deal with Joe Biden for him.
How long do all y’all reckon that state of affairs is going to hold? It’s been a week already.
kalakal
@O. Felix Culpa: You should like it then
Odie Hugh Manatee
@wil:
I ain’t enforcing shit, dumbfuck. Don’t tell me what I’m doing and I won’t tell you to shove a rusty chainsaw up your ass and fire it up.
I have other suggestions if that bores you.
wil
@Tony Jay: Are you talking to me, tiny balls dude?
It will depend on whether Biden improves his public performances or whether he continues to flail and look feeble and weak.
Is “Stench” your codeword for Trump? You nobodies are so deep in your groupthink you’ve got your own code language.
He’s not going to implode, he must be beaten. Thinking Trump will implode of his own accord has not worked in ten years and will not work now, TBD.
O. Felix Culpa
@Odie Hugh Manatee: Engage not. You’re helping it meet its quota.
UncleEbeneezer
@trnc: In the immunity ruling, Clarence signaled at least he is willing to consider the complete bullshit notion that Jack Smith wasn’t legally appointed. There was no doubt that Cannon would take up that offer.
And of course all of this proves that Garland could’ve indicted Trump on the first day of his term and Trump-friendly judges and SCOTUS could drag things out to make sure the trials wouldn’t happen before the election. All that hand-wringing over Garland’s action/inaction looks even dumber now.
lowtechcyclist
@schrodingers_cat:
I devoutly wish I routinely saw commentary like this in the MSM. Please let me know where you do your reading.
UncleEbeneezer
I pie quite liberally. It makes BJ such a better experience.
NotMax
My goof-up in #157.
Wire in the Street = Wire in the Blood.
Odie Hugh Manatee
@O. Felix Culpa:
I was bored and wanted to fire up the rat for a few. I had already decided that I’m done and wil let it fume. Trolling me is a complete waste of time because I’m impervious to that shit.
I know, think of the kids…
wil
@Odie Hugh Manatee: You’re trying to enforce the groupthink, dumbfuck.
That’s exactly what you’re doing and I’ll tell you whatever I feel like telling you.
You can shove a rusty chainsaw up your ass too.
Wow, tough talking on a website. You’re hilarious, dudette.
UncleEbeneezer
@schrodingers_cat: Best pie decision I ever made. Also reduced the amount of TERF bullshit I have to see.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
Ah, now I understand.
How very 4 chan of them.
unrelatedwaffle
@WaterGirl: The Professional Left with Driftglass and Bluegal is my mainstay podcast these days. Always love to support the blog roll veterans.
wil
@lowtechcyclist: Josh Marshall of TPM believes Democrats will replace Biden.
But don’t tell the BJ-ers here. They don’t want to hear it.
Tony Jay
It’s not the colour. It’s not even the weird texture, like a plantain left at the back of the fridge for too long. It’s the pulsing holes down the sides and the little peeps of gas that escape them when it gets turgid.
I’ve been to Catholic school, so I’ve seen a lot of unsettling pipe, but that’s just weird. Like, Belgian weird.
Would I Lie?
zhena gogolia
@Steeplejack: That doesn’t mean Lesser isn’t a brilliant actor in those seasons as well.
zhena gogolia
@WaterGirl: Yes. Now it’s Alphy.
Odie Hugh Manatee
@wil:
One more time, with feeling! Come on kid, you can do better than this lame stuff! I’m not going to even bother to insult you any further because you’re that pathetic. Now come back with what you think is a killer response that will bait me into coming back.
I won’t and you can walk away feeling smug and satisfied, k? Good boy!
wil
@Tony Jay: You’re spending a lot of time trying to be clever, Tiny Balls Dude.
Doesn’t really suit you.
NotMax
@Tony Jay
No, nut you might waffle a mite.
;)
Steeplejack
@zhena gogolia:
I think Lesser is a great actor, but I took your “I remember more of the latter than the former” to be a comment on the character—good Bright vs. bad Bright.
Tony Jay
@Enhanced Voting Techniques:
Very. It’s getting pissy and frustrated now. Trying to get a hit by lashing out.
Funny, because it’s got genitals like a cat o’ nine tails crossed with the suckers on an overcooked octopus tentacle. That’s probably what drove it into trollery. All those bad high-school memories, then the come hither episodes when visiting the aquarium. Sad.
Bill Arnold
@wil:
If you actually believe this[1], then you are gullible and captured by an echo chamber[2]. (That’s a backatcha insult in good fun, to be clear.)
Was poking at my memories of the 1984 election, where (as I remembered it) Reagan was visibly confused and inarticulate (especially for an actor (memorization skills) with no stutter) compared to 1980. Reagan, degraded by actual early-stage Alzheimer’s disease, with memory failures, won in 1984 with 525 electoral votes. In his second term, he surrounded himself with competent (arguably evil) people.
Ronald Reagan had Alzheimer’s while president, says son – Son Ron Reagan’s claim that Ronald Reagan had Alzheimer’s while in office leads to war of words with half brother Michael (Ed Pilkington, Mon 17 Jan 2011)
[1] That Biden can’t win and that Harris can, and that anyone who believes otherwise or says that they do not know is a lemming. Apologies in advance if this is a miss-characterization.
[2] Echo chambers and epistemic bubbles (C. Thi Nguyen, Episteme 17 (2):141-161 (2020)) (pdf download button at link.)
UncleEbeneezer
@unrelatedwaffle: I also put all politics podcasts on hold for now (maybe forever?). I don’t need all the drama. I’d much rather listen to extremely smart, black comedians talk about politics. They’ve been mocking the shit out of the whole Biden Debate Panic.
Timill
@trnc: Fortunately, taking them isn’t what he’s charged with. Retaining them after no longer President is the charge, not that that would deter Cannon from some bullshit ruling.
kalakal
@Tony Jay:
You’re starting to scare me now, you’re going to say Chocolate Beer is a good thing any moment now
UncleEbeneezer
Just got back from seeing the movie Maxxxine and it was really dark, twisted and fun. More of a thriller with some gore, rather than horror. I think it was a fitting finale to the X trilogy and it had really great costumes, looks, music etc. from the 1980’s.
Honestly, it’s hard for me to decide which of the three films would even be my fave, they were all so different and great in different ways. X had the 70’s slasher film vibe, Pearl had the mid-century technicolor dream vibe and Maxxxine has the gritty, noir crime drama vibe. Might be the best horror trilogy I’ve seen.
Anyways, Mia Goth is the absolute queen of modern/current horror, bringing an unusually high level of acting chops and Ti West makes some of the most artistic/interesting/creative films in the genre.
TBone
@sab:
@Ohio Mom:
Our NotMax posted this wonderful, nostalgic celebration of dynamite for the recent holiday. It’s by the guy who wrote A Christmas Story (the movie).
I played it on my boom box that morning in anticipation.
It was an hour well spent, the prose, the humor, the suspense! If you like the movie, you’ll recognize the author instantly.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=orvtrV15IWM
Thank you, NotMax!
UncleEbeneezer
@Timill: She can still limit motive evidence from his time in office, which is a big handout to Trump. Though I don’t think even that will be enough to end the documents case altogether. I think he still (eventually) gets felony convicted on the documents, as long as we re-elect Biden.
NotMax
@kalakal
You prefer maybe peanut butter?
:)
Trivia Man
@Starfish: I volunteer as tribute
WaterGirl
@zhena gogolia: I had to google. Interesting!
I have the recordings on my Tivo box but I haven’t watched any of this season yet. I hope Will had a happy ending. I still miss Vicar #1, but hopefully Alphy will help me get over that.
We had a women’s volleyball coach here named Alphy, who was very nice and charming, and this Alphy looks a lot like him! So I already kind of like the new guy, just from the intro video I just watched.
wil
@Odie Hugh Manatee: Glad to hear you’re ‘impervious to this shit’
LOL
NotMax
@TBone
Aw, shucks. ‘Tweren’t nothing.
Glad you enjoyed it.
TBone
@NotMax: thank you for the Fourth of July treat (I hope you saw comment #209 and not a dessert item). 😁
Tony Jay
@kalakal:
Like, a decent chocolate porter? Room temperature?
You’re not going to like where this could go. Dark places.
TBone
@NotMax: great balls of dung smoked whale!
Freemark
@comrade scotts agenda of rage: I’ve been coming here since the aughts and somehow I never knew this.
zhena gogolia
@Steeplejack: No, I meant more about Joanie and less about the sergeant’s exam.
TBone
@NotMax: 💜
zhena gogolia
@WaterGirl: He’s fine. Nobody can compare to Sidney (James Norton). Will has a happy ending, if that’s not a spoiler.
wil
@Bill Arnold: The groupthink at this site is severe.
Nobody is worried about Biden governing during a second term.
It’s all about whether Biden can beat Trump or whether he can’t.
Those who believe he can’t are not part of some conspiracy.
They are just legitimately worried that with Biden we are going to get a second Trump term.
You are correct….we do not know that Biden can’t win. OTOH, those who refuse to consider that maybe he can’t ALSO don’t know that he can win.
JaySinWA
@Leto: It’s important to use your head when working with fireworks.
No, not that way!
TBone
This is my kinda pie 🤡🎶
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=iZGKNlI8zRQ
TBone
@JaySinWA: 😆
Aaaand and the Darwin Award for 7/4/24 goes to …
kalakal
@NotMax: You sir, are evil
JaySinWA
@Dan B: Apparently the Redmond head case was not from wearing the fireworks, but a mortar shell that hit his head (the back of his head? Maybe he was walking away.)
evodevo
@sab: Might be because a lot of runaway slaves crossed into Ohio over the Ohio River, from Mason Co KY to a refuge of the Underground Railroad on a hill overlooking Ripley OH. Our local historians made sure we all toured the spots when I was in school there. I imagine them or their descendants were more than happy to help out the Union.
TEL
@BR: I like your thinking and would happily subscribe to your substack! (Note I don’t actually subscribe to any substacks but it seems to be what people are doing these days)
kalakal
@Tony Jay:
A Tale for which the World is not yet ready, eh?
Bill Arnold
@wil:
OK. That’s progress. Pretty much no-one here thinks that the Democratic ticket (Biden/Harris, ATM) has the election in the bag. The election is in play. I strongly suggest honing and using your attacks on convicted felon Donald J. Trump’s intellectual and character deficiencies; the evidence for them is strong and ugly – the public attacks (especially in the press) on Biden mean that the attacks on Trump (and the GOP) will need to be a lot more ruthless.
See digby The Media’s Feefees Are Hurt ( digby on July 6, 2024); I largely agree with her about the current USA press. (She’s an excellent observer, and has been for decades.)
evodevo
@O. Felix Culpa: Yes, definitely. It stars the actor who portrayed Siegfried’s younger brother on the first All Creatures. An entertaining series.
wjca
The thing is, she can’t dismiss it with prejudice at this point. Which means it can get refiled, and likely get a different judge.
No One of Consequence
To Whomever created the Pie Filter:
Bless You.
And may I say, you’ve done quite a bit to tip the karma balances in your favor, and it is my sincere hope you are experiencing some of that kindliness returning to you in spades.
To the trolls attempting to sew discord: Go nuts you twat-waffles. For the savvy, you are merely making us hungry or shouting into the void. This isn’t the UseNet of old, where one could derail a good discussion with a single shit-post, extolling the opinion that pee tastes better than it smells. Fuck off and get a real job in a phishing call center somewhere that would better suit your lack of talents and limited character. Just some friendly advice,
-NOoC
geg6
@Suzanne:
Mark Cuban’s home town. But he was not bougie at all. Dad was a car upholsterer. Mt. Lebo is is somewhat bougie but not nearly so as, say, Upper St. Clair. My niece’s boyfriend is Upper St. Clair. Very wealthy, but apparently not a MAGA family.
Steeplejack
@zhena gogolia:
Okay, got it now. A lot of stuff you could have been referring to.
WaterGirl
@zhena gogolia: Thank you! He’s been a bit angst-y lately, I’m glad to know there’s a happy ending. These days, uncertain endings aren’t my thing. :-)
Gretchen
@wil: Is Chris on to your game. Drat, I thought I pied you yesterday. My bad.
PJ
@wil: We know Biden can win because he beat Trump’s ass before. Given that a lot of older people will have died in the last four years, and Biden’s support among under-40s is much stronger than Trump’s, I think it’s safe to say that Trump will not have more people voting for him this time than in 2020.
People are angry about Dobbs, angry about the presidential immunity decision, angry about the prospect of four more years of Trump, and they will be angry about Project 2025 – I think that’s going to motivate a lot more people to turn out for Biden than did in 2020. No matter how much the media repeats that Biden is old and “raises questions” between now and election day, I don’t think anybody who was already going to vote for Biden is going to decide to stay at home when the time comes.
Would any other Democrat fare better than Biden? I highly doubt it. Were Biden to stop running, the media would tear into them as much or more as they have Biden – “Democrats in Disarray” for the next five months – and Trump would use it to harp that the Democrats are weak and afraid. And based on the likes of you, he would be right.
Will Biden win in November? I don’t have a crystal ball, and neither do you, but based on the facts as we have them, I think he will, and I think he would do a damn sight better than anyone else.
sdhays
@Starfish: But you’re just asking questions!
SomeRandomGuy
@wil: The irony meter just tilted for me, even if you’re a long time poster that everyone knows well. You seriously managed to hit the description from the main post effortlessly.
That’s not a “you are trolling” accusation. The reason trolls get bites on the bait they drag is, it looks real. It sounds like someone, perhaps deserving of some kindness and a bit of time explaining things.
LanceThruster
@Odie Hugh Manatee: – Dems win by turnout being high as a general rule. Enthusiasm boosts turnout more than fear traditionally. Low turnout/lack of enthusiasm hurts down ballot races rather predictably.
Confidence/optimism is good unless it fosters a done deal mentality where voters think staying home will not matter. The opposite can also result in a similar mindset.
A valid question vs concern trolling seem to hinge on the perception of who posed it as much as anything. Tough but fair questions are considered ploys by default, posed solely to help the opposition, and it’s rare to see those treated as part of a good faith discussions.
Even in blogs I’m relegated to lurker status only, it was interesting to see battle lines being drawn as fluffers condemned defeatists, and realists condemn hopium as a campaign strategy.
Fluffers insist you must only express yourself in terms of “when the great pumpkin appears” and never “if.” Defeatists pointing out realities that are less than optimal is bad enough, but offering options that involve anything other than stay the course risks their defeatism spreading widely enough to result in defeat.
Staying the course is thought of as the strategy best to result in victory. A stay the course strategy that doesn’t result in victory is only be abuse not enough people listened to them to stay the course. Listening to them means you voted the way they wanted you to vote.
In fact, in every instance, it boils down to “We would have won but we didn’t get the votes.” That seems to place the responsibility squarely on their shoulders.
The candidate in that scenario cannot fail, but can only be failed. So many factors ultimately decide elections. It’s a game theory exercise where everyone thinks their own metrics is the most valid and if applied properly, would yield the same conclusion from anyone else. Winner take all, 50%+1 is an interesting system because in addition to voting for what you want, and backing those who support the issues important to you, you must also handicap your selections like a horse race, and the chance a candidate has of winning has to be factored in at almost every step along the way.
The analogy that elections are more like a bus route than a taxi (or however that goes) so vote what will get you closest to your destination. Being condemned as a purist for any indication of withholding one’s vote is just another way to say your issues are not important enough to care about right now, and askong as that remains effective, the right time never comes.
I don’t want the Senate to flip but I won’t vote for Adam Schiff for Senator because of his boosterism for Zionist apartheid (there’s no such animal as “liberal” Zionism, or “democratic” apartheid), and though he gets much praise from the base where Russiagate is involved, my response is just the opposite. Steve Garvey (R) is at least as bad on Israel if not worse. But know that because of CA’s open primary, Schiff supporters pumped money into Garvey’s campaign so that the field was cleared of any competition that might be preferred to Schiff. That’s certainly never backfired (cough). Some call that smart tactics, other’s ratfvcking. The ultimate goal is to limit the available choices enough that they become the only option available even if just the least worst choice.
Having unexpectedly come back from lifetime ban, I just presume I’m still in everyone’s pie filter. I check back for indications of a response, though not always by opening the thread itself anymore because there doesn’t seem to be. What seems like hit and run is not, but just my two cents. Even before my ban, I tried to respond to every reply. IIRC, the cause was linking a Craig Murray article, seen as no different from citing Alex Jones.
I consider most everyone here as pretty savvy across the board. There’s sometimes a “smartest people in the room” vibe, and a core belief homogeny is often expected. Berners were seen as having the greatest responsibility for Hillary’s loss to Trump, irrespective of him being elevated to pied piper status by the DNC in the first place (part of the “butterymails” derision).
My takeaway from that was if one side said they were committed to VBNMW and were being truthful, and the other vowed not supporting the other under any circumstances, they ultimately got the handicapping backwards, particularly when factoring in enthusiasm and how peaking closer to the election can be a significant force multiplier.
I was ready to be part of Team K-hive seeing that as the most prudent best worst option. The spin from the Biden camp at this point reminds me of Belushi confronting Carrie Fisher in the sewer in Blues Brothers. Pick one.
Biden closing the deal involves blocks that previously supported him now in question, and the impact the acuity question will have regardlessof its validity. Was it going to be a cakewalk before this issue arose? Doubtful. Will this be a tipping point by damage done at margins that were tight anyway, and/or would a last minute substitution help/hurt/not matter at this point. So many variables (I struggle at basic math) that I doubt hindset will be 20/20. A win will certainly be seen as dodging a bullet, no matter how arrived at (barring unforseen circumstances the matter is said to be settled). That outcome too terrible to ponder will be unlikely to shed much light in the after action report, though there will be a few who could be said to have earned an “I told you so!” Ultimately, it’s those damn voters to blame thinking their vote is their own, for the reasons they choose, in the face of those who had calculated they were obligated to vote other than they did because [reasons] even if the selling of [reasons] was unsuccessful.
50%+1, winner take all (as long as the Electoral College gets to play). Tally ho!
“The battle may not always go to the strongest nor the race to the swiftest, but that’s the way to bet.”
LanceThruster
@LanceThruster: Not Coke or Pepsi.
LanceThruster
@LanceThruster: I like this with a few qualifiers.
Steeplejack
@LanceThruster:
What is “VBNMW”?
LanceThruster
@LanceThruster: Success!
David Collier-Brown
@Gretchen: Off-topic: my wife once subscribed to a site that “disemvowled” people who broke the rules.
For example: m wf ne sbscrbd to st that “dsmvwld” ppl wh brk th rls.
it was funnier than pieing, but you still saw their posts, just translated to lower-canal martian (;-))
TerryC
@wil: You are making shit up. I spent hours recently at LG&M reading people I disagree with. And here I am, reading you, with whom I disagree. Who is your trollster partner? Do you both know that people here actually check facts?
partner?
SteverinoCT
@Starfish: I don’t commonly reply because I am so far behind in my reading that you will never see it. Like this response :)