Sorry I didn’t get this up earlier.
ETA:
Biden now taking Qs.
In his first question, he called Kamala Harris "Vice President Trump."
— Jennifer Bendery (@jbendery) July 11, 2024
Jennifer Bendary, for HuffPost:
Biden laughs off mixing up Zelenskyy with Putin earlier at NATO.
“How many times did you hear in that conference … other leaders, heads of state, thanking me, saying the reason we’re together is because of Biden?”
Third Q.
Biden asked about calls from some Dems for him to step down and about his legacy.
“I’m not in this for my legacy,” he says. “I’m in this to complete the job I started.”
Q: Why do you say Kamala Harris is ready to serve as president on day one?
Biden immediately praises the way Harris has addressed women’s reproductive rights.
“I wouldn’t have picked her unless she was qualified to be president.”
“That’s not true,” Biden says of reports that he has to go to bed early to function.
He said the reality is he’s trying to ease up on his work hours instead of working every day from 7am to midnight.
“I just gotta pace myself a little bit more.”
Q: Do you think Trump would weaken NATO and leave Europe on its own?
Biden: “I think — how can I can say this without sounding too self-serving — I’m not hearing any of my European allies saying, ‘Joe, don’t run.’ What I’m hearing is, ‘You gotta win.”
“Foreign policy has never been his strong point,” Biden says of Trump. “And he seems to have an affinity to people who are authoritarian.”
Q: Would you have done anything differently re: Israel and Palestinians?
Biden talks about his long record with Israel, say it has “the most conservative war cabinet” its had.
“A lot of things in retrospect I wish I could have convinced the Israelis to do.”
Q: What changed from when, in 2020, you called yourself a bridge candidate for the next generation of presidential candidates?
Biden: “The gravity of the situation I inherited, in terms of the economy, foreign policy and domestic division.”
Q: What do you say to concerned Democratic lawmakers concerned about you running?
“I’m determined to run, but I think it’s important I allay fears,” Biden says. “Let them see me out there.”
Biden says his health is good, he does regular exams with neurologists and they say his health is solid, though his left foot is a little messed up.
“I broke my foot and didn’t wear the boot,” Biden says. “But I’m good.”
Q: If Democratic delegates have second thoughts, are they free to vote their conscience?
Biden: “They’re free to do whatever they want, but I get overwhelming support … in the primary.”
“That’s the democratic process,” he adds. “It’s not gonna happen.”
LOL. Shouted Q to Biden: Trump is on social media mocking your age and memory for referring to VP Kamala Harris as VP Trump at the start of this press conference. How do you respond to that?
Biden: “Listen to him.”
M31
Time for Joe to go all CornPop on these losers
hells littlest angel
He’s in fine fucking fettle!
NickM
It’s time to wrap up.
M31
lol last question was 1) a Ukraine striking within Russia question that we already had and 2) will you allow the delegates at the convention to vote their conscious.
supremely dumb
Mapaginagsik
He could stand there and flip off the camera and I’d be there to vote for him
BlueDWarrior
Like I’ve said before, if anyone knows where a Unicorn is they can point it out to me. Otherwise I’ll go with the best Donkey in the stable.
Another Scott
+$81 to JoeBiden.com
Eyes on the prizes.
Cheers,
Scott.
zhena gogolia
@BlueDWarrior: 😂😄💜
Odie Hugh Manatee
@M31:
If you are waiting for our media to ask smart questions then prepare for old age and possibly death before you see it happen.
Elizabelle
I have not watched a minute, but will. Did he take many questions from international journalists?
zhena gogolia
@Another Scott: I’m going to double my monthly contribution tomorrow. And I didn’t even watch the press conference, just read what you guys had to say about it.
Elizabelle
@Another Scott: Yay you! That has to make the campaign smile.
SiubhanDuinne
That was a great answer to the “Vice President Trump” question at the end.
Carolina Dave
Not bad appearance for Biden in front of a much more rabid group of jackals than those here.
Jackie
Press torture over.
Joe did great IMO.
SteverinoCT
“Listen to him.” Ha!
M31
time for the undignified shouting time
lol someone gets in a last question where Joe had some slip where he said something like “VP Trump” instead of “VP Harris” and “trump is already using that to question your mental fitness, how do you counter that”
and joe says “Listen to him, haahhaha” and walks off
hahahaha Trump talking about mental fitness, THAT’S THE JOKE
RinaX
I’m glad I watched. Not doing the post-commentary thing.
M31
@Odie Hugh Manatee: lol I’m not holding my breath.
One or two of the international/Ukraine q’s were mainstream OK as opposed to moronic flapgum
Elizabelle
“Control guns, not girls.”
first time I have looked at the New York Times in days. And, it seems that they are covering the press conference fairly. Of course, the headline says that five more Democrats have asked him to drop out, but the updates make clear that Biden did very well handling questions.
hrprogressive
Didn’t have the bandwidth to watch, don’t have energy to get angry at idiots or talking heads.
Saw a few folks at ye ol GOS that suggested he was doing a bang-up job, and also a few dumbass comments about a “contested convention”, so.
I am guessing reactions will come in here over the next day or three, so.
The entire conversation should be about stopping Project 2025 and Der Fuhrer Trump, not about the obvious fact that Joe Biden isn’t a spring chicken anymore.
BenInNM
@Another Scott: I like that idea – I’ll join you! $81 to Biden.
Also have my yard signs up that I ordered last week in a fit of rage. I could never decide whether to have the sign parallel or perpendicular to the street so I solved it by ordering two.
Michael Bersin
Headlines tomorrow:
“Joe Biden bests old media at press conference, time for him to step down so Donald Trump can plan his coronation”
Or some variation.
Odie Hugh Manatee
Meow! Just tossed $100 in the Biden/Harris kitty at their site.
Ridin’ with Biden!
@BenInNM:
I have my Dark Brandon 2024 sign out front but nothing notable for responses yet (heavy MAGAt county). I’ll turn on the flashing eyes as the sun is setting…lol!
It’s Day 1 for the yard sign and I’m not leaving it out unattended.
MagdaInBlack
@SiubhanDuinne: Made me snort 😄
Chris Johnson
I just like the idea that he’s needling the journalists like “You know, over in Russia, the journalists have to just suck it up and put across the narratives of a tyrant, because he’s got something on them and they have to live in fear that he will have them killed. Don’t you think that must just SUCK? Aren’t you glad you live in America where you can be jackasses all you want but you’re your own bosses and free men, not running around doing the bidding of a petty dictator? Wouldn’t that be embarrassing, if you had to do that? HMMMM?”
(thinks: fuck you all. I’ve got detailed receipts. tread carefully, jackasses…)
zhena gogolia
@BenInNM: Good!
M31
New York Times Pitchbot
@DougJBalloon
·
8m
Joe Biden has provided detailed, cogent answers at his NATO press conference. Here’s why that’s bad news for Joe Biden.
zhena gogolia
@Chris Johnson: I hope he literally said that, but I assume it was more polite?
moonbat
These deeply embarrassing displays of journalistic malpractice have me casting about for any reliable outlet and lo and behold in my own hometown it turns out that The Philadelphia Inquirer is actually owned by a foundation dedicated to (*gasp*) journalistic ethics. About The Philadelphia Inquirer
I had always assumed that it was owned by some millionaire/billionaire as a vanity project. But not so!
I began my subscription today. I cannot vouch for the quality of their puzzles because I have not looked, but they WERE the first national newspaper post-debate to point out that it is Trump who is unfit to hold the highest office in the land.
zhena gogolia
@M31: HAHAHA!
zhena gogolia
@moonbat: I subscribed as soon as that editorial appeared. Sadly, I haven’t been able to find any puzzles there, just cartoons.
Bill Arnold
I laughed out loud when Biden, in an aside, said that [convicted felon] Trump cheats at golf.
different-church-lady
It has now been over an hour since Biden last held a press conference. Why is he hiding from the press?
zhena gogolia
I couldn’t watch the press conference because those assholes literally make me sick to my stomach. Yeah, I’d like to see them all get a one-way ticket to Ekaterinburg.
Chris Johnson
@zhena gogolia: I heard he had some kind of reference to the press in Russia. I’m being hyperbolic but would love for him to just needle the fuck out of them. I’m convinced he knows a bunch of them are obeying and taking rapid narrative directions from Putin. I think he’s just seething, but is such a good politician that it doesn’t show. I’m hoping the rage emboldens him: I’m suffering rage over all this, myself. I’d like him to be cool as a cucumber, but I’m not, and it wouldn’t help if he was. He’s gotta be honest and authentic. Honest might mean calling out some of this crap once it’s obvious enough that the mainstream can digest it.
3Sice
Big media’s response: Look, Joe did great and all, but we have to kill his campaign and American freedom because you don’t consume enough of our product..
zhena gogolia
@different-church-lady: 😂😂💜
Archon
This “Biden must drop out” the past couple weeks have felt like a giant conspiracy to me and I’m not prone to conspiracy theories.
Sally
If y’all can forgive me for being a bit vain, reposting my comment at the end of the previous thread.
I say to my my “concerned” friends: There’s not a Democrat alive who doesn’t wish Pres. Biden were fifteen years younger. In this maelstrom of international crises we are currently swimming in, which fifteen years of his life experiences would you scrub? His direct knowledge of people, of events, his chairmanships of important Senate committees, of access to top secret information, and of world leaders is unsurpassed by anyone. Just how valuable do you think that is to his decision making, both nationally and on the world stage?
zhena gogolia
@Sally: It’s a great comment! Post it in every thread!
bbleh
@Mapaginagsik: if he stood there and flipped off the PRESS and said something to the effect of “you all are a bunch of moronic children who shouldn’t even be allowed to call yourselves journalists,” I’d be even MORE behind him, and I’m already 100%
(I admit I’m starting to sound like a MAGAt at those rallies where the Felon penned the press up in cages and encouraged people to abuse them, but omg. The WaPo’s “live coverage” was execrable, and CNN has taken over from the NYT trying to out-Fox Fox.)
Bill Arnold
I liked how at the third time he was asked the same question (“you are old, please comment”) he segued into a set of long involved policy paragraphs.
There is no way that (stupid, narcissistic, manipulative, psychopathic) convicted felon Donald J. Trump could have given any of those answers.
eclare
I just sent an email to the campaign website saying hang in there, don’t let the backstabbers and media take our primary votes away, we have your back, etc.
And I made a small donation.
Ben Cisco
I watched the whole thing. I’m good.
Go Team Biden/Harris.
FUCK PUTIN
FUCK THE GOP
FUCK THE PRESS CORPSE
(No, not like that)
LET’S. FUCKING. GO!
BenInNM
@Odie Hugh Manatee: Good for you – hope it all goes well. I live in a pretty liberal area so I don’t have to worry about that (plus they’re just the standard Biden/Harris sign) but I think it’s worthwhile to just make the statement.
Eyeroller
@Archon: Same. Definitely an op and there may be more than one group that do not necessarily interact directly with one another but have a similar goal (e.g. Russians and Oboys feeding into a pro-Trump media). And I really hate conspiratorial thinking.
moonbat
@zhena gogolia: Cartoons are good!
satby
some press reaction:
Jen “I dissent ” Rubin @JRubinBlogger. 13m
It is time for the press to honestly report Biden is on top of things in a way Trump is not and will never be. “No matter what I did you wouldn’t be satisfied. “ He should do more of these
M31
@Chris Johnson: he did! First Biden talked about the failure of the early war in Ukraine, then the staggering amount of casualties, and that the advantage Putin has is the total control over internal sources of information within Russia
he didn’t say ‘their press is lickspittles and lackies’ but didn’t have to
eclare
@SiubhanDuinne:
Bravo!
Eyeroller
@satby: I see Jen has gotten over her panic so I guess that’s good, perhaps a harbinger.
NotMax
@hells littlest angel
Put the fettle to the metal and go, go, go on to victory.
SiubhanDuinne
@different-church-lady:
LOL 😂
satby
John Fugelsang @JohnFugelsang. 2h
Wait – Joe Biden, who just ran the NATO Summit, accidentally said “President Putin,” before quickly catching himself? Oooh, that’s bad. I guess I’m gonna have to vote for the guy publicly performing fellatio on Putin instead
Dorothy A. Winsor
I’m back from the Polynesian dancers and it sounds like Joe did well and the Press Corps did badly. Joe 1, Press Corps 0
tam1MI
@BenInNM: I like that idea – I’ll join you! $81 to Biden.
Count me in as well! :)
Elizabelle
@Archon: Me too. Elites aided by Russia. I just hope we get a Harvard Business School module on how the FTF New York Times and other media sharks tanked their business. I think they lost a lot of subscribers. And page views.
Percysowner
Just threw $65 on the 500% match for Biden. I’m riding for Biden.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
Yes, but from who or what? Russia is the obvious choice but when the MSM started obviously making shit it up and started to fall apparent it make me think it’s a bunch of stoned out their mind billionaires.
Harrison Wesley
@moonbat: I was definitely an Inquirer fan when I lived in Philly. Glad to see they’re going strong, even if they had to lay off a few of my friends who worked there.
Jackie
@bbleh:
TCFG says that to the media almost daily – and they still love him.
Eyeroller
@Percysowner: Where’s that? I sent a pretty big donation through Act Blue.
eclare
@Sally:
That’s a great perspective. Joe can call any leader in the world, and they’ll pick up because Joe has 81 years of experience.
me
I just hope that this gives the congresspeople who are intending on calling for him to leave pause. That would at least cause the press to get bored with the chew toy if nothing is happening.
Al Rennick
Rep. Jim Himes Connecticut 4th
Jim Himes @jahimes
https://twitter.com/jahimes/status/1811558379661185359
BQuimby
@Odie Hugh Manatee: You are sooooooooo right!
Nikole Hannah-Jones put it: “As media we consistently proclaim that we are just reporting the news when in fact we are driving it. What we cover, how we cover it, determines often what Americans think is important and how they perceive these issues yet we keep pretending it’s not so.” They are not reporting that he is a loser; they are making him one.
Percysowner
@Eyeroller:
Here Stop Trump, through Act Blue
NotMax
@hells littlest angel
Put the fettle to the metal and go, go, go on to victory.
@zhena gogolia
Quaker legacy is thin on puzzles.
;)
hrprogressive
@Archon:
It’s no conspiracy theory to say that the coordinated effort among the corprofascist shareholders of all of our mass media outlets trying to Make Fascism Happen is happening, because it very transparently is.
There might be a number of individual reporters who are “Just Asking Questions” to stroke their own egos, but the guys at the top are purposefully doing this for their own benefit, the citizens of this country be damned.
TBone
I think his dig about Dotard not having any recorded notes at his meeting with Pooty was *chef’s kiss!
Elizabelle
Joe did well. OK jackals. BREATHE.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
True, one can’t make a misstatement when one’s mouth is full of dick.
eclare
@satby:
Hahaha…
TBone
Il trollio strikes out again.
Eyeroller
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: In the case of the FTFNYT in particular, it’s their fascist-curious ownership, which is tragic since it’s a Jewish family. They have a long history, over 100 years, of trying to fit into WASP high society in NYC, from what I’ve read, and I guess the current generation is the worst yet.
moonbat
Every time these “journalist” bozos have pissed me off over the past two weeks I kick another $25 to Joe’s campaign and they have been pissing me off a lot! And here they went and did it again. Oh well…
My Postcards to Swing States are due to arrive Saturday along with a big roll of stamps. It’s a good thing these aren’t the stamps you have to lick anymore.
BlueDWarrior
All I have to say to the Democrats trying to shove him out the in door. Go for it, put a name up – let’s see how wide your influence is.
BQuimby
@Odie Hugh Manatee:Nikole Hannah-Jones put it: “As media we consistently proclaim that we are just reporting the news when in fact we are driving it. What we cover, how we cover it, determines often what Americans think is important and how they perceive these issues yet we keep pretending it’s not so.” They are not reporting that he is a loser; they are making him one.
sixthdoctor
@Al Rennick: Yeah, saw that. What a jerk.
I hope Biden stays in, but if he does decide to drop out or is forced out, I’d be happy for him just because he won’t have to deal with this crap.
But if Democrats give him, say 70-80% of the support the other party is giving to a felon, rapist, and traitor, I think we’ll win.
Omnes Omnibus
@Al Rennick: This technique is not going to work. Try a different trolling method.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@Eyeroller: Now that makes sense and fits nicely into my own theory on why the NYT turned on Trump too; they want to be kingmaker.
eclare
This never gets old. Colbert goes off on TCFG and calls him Putin’s cock-something. I can’t remember exactly so I’m watching again.
https://youtu.be/HaHwlSTqA7s?si=zB_OPCPJNFyyx4g8
Eyeroller
@sixthdoctor: I’d heard there were going to be more elected Dems backstabbing Joe today and tomorrow but so far it is still a trickle. I hope his performance tonight tamps down some of that.
The ones in safe Dem districts need primaries next time.
Archon
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: The most plausible conspiracy to me is that some very wealthy and influential donors saw on opening after the debate to put their person on the ticket. And that person is NOT Kamala Harris. This is about pushing a open convention where the ticket is decided behind closed doors.
Conspiracy or not anyone who thinks the media and/or donors is would allow a smooth handoff from Biden to Harris is lying to themselves.
BQuimby
Nikole Hannah-Jones put it: “As media we consistently proclaim that we are just reporting the news when in fact we are driving it. What we cover, how we cover it, determines often what Americans think is important and how they perceive these issues yet we keep pretending it’s not so.” They are not reporting that he is a loser; they are making him one.
@Archon:
Mike E
the sound of one troll fapping
@sixthdoctor: @Omnes Omnibus: you had to go and catch it …eww
Josie
@Archon:
Do you have a theory as to who they might prefer on the ticket?
ETA: For what it’s worth, I think you might be onto something.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@Archon: That’s quite possible, but considering we are talking about a bunch of billionaires and their egos (am I right George Cloony?) they all can’t agree on their magical savior replacement candidate.
And try this one on for size; we’ve seen the GOP primary turn in collection of billionaire surrogates. Now that Trump shut them out, these same billionaires want to play their games on the Democrats.
Peter Thel perhaps? This all feels as dumb as the crap he wanted to do here in California until he gave up.
zhena gogolia
@Eyeroller: Yeah, fuck Jim Himes, the preening asshole. Go make mead full time, asshole.
Eyeroller
@Josie: Best we can tell, they want some insane game-show type system. It varies somewhat based on who is proposing it, but the general outlines are that 6-8 “popular” Democrats, usually governors who have mostly already been a hard “no” on running against Biden-Harris, would compete in townhalls with voters around the country, perhaps moderated by “cultural icons” like Michelle Obama, Oprah, and Taylor Swift. They would then go to the convention and present their cases to the delegates. I am very sorry to say that I am not making this up.
SiubhanDuinne
@Eyeroller: ETA: SORRY, MEANT FOR @ECLARE
I love Colbert, and the clip you shared is classic, but I’ve been scared to death to watch him at all this week. Pretty sure I’d throw something heavy and hard at the TV the second Stephen launched into one of his “Joe is Old” bits — and it’s not my television.
Eyeroller
@zhena gogolia: A certain commenter will probably pop in to tell us how his polls are really bad and it’s Joe’s fault.
SiubhanDuinne
@zhena gogolia:
Right? What an arrogant bastard.
sixthdoctor
@Eyeroller: I hope this stops the bleeding too. I’m hoping the big guns like Pelosi or Jeffries come out tomorrow with a show of support.
I’m also hoping the feeding frenzy begins to turn on Trump; there were opinions in the LA Times and even the FTFNYT. There is nothing he can do to help himself because he’s an insane idiot and the convention next week will be a putrid spectacle that puts Salo to shame.
bbleh
Another $25 for Joe/Kamala. Mostly out of spite for the media dogs.
Mo MacArbie
My father’s getting old, and he sometimes says the name of the street he used to live by when he means the one he lives by now. He doesn’t get lost when he can’t find the store on the corner by the old place. There’s a difference.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Eyeroller:
@SiubhanDuinne:
@zhena gogolia:
What I don’t understand is, if there’s such tremendous pushback against these people from Dem voters, why are they continuing to hold to this?
bbleh
@Omnes Omnibus: Lol. “I would advise heavy use of the Supreme Argument, to wit, ‘neener neener,’ and also copious reference to what’s gonna happen at recess when teacher isn’t looking.”
Eyeroller
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): THE POLLS ARE BAD AND IT’S JOE’S FAULT.
trollhattan
It is motherfucking hot as a motherfucker.
Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
guachi
This press conference was the worst of all possible worlds. It wasn’t good enough to switch enough minds. Biden will probably stay in and limp to the convention and then get blown out.
Steiner’s divisions aren’t showing up to save Biden.
3Sice
@Eyeroller:
Blunt admission that the ratings and clicks are down. Everything Trump touches turns to shit.
3Sice
@Eyeroller:
👍
MisterForkbeard
The responses I’m seeing on twitter are basically “Biden said Trump instead of Harris at the very beginning, and nailed the rest of the questions with good, off-the-cuff detailed answers but he accidentally used the wrong name at one point so really who knows?”
Biden’s obviously still got it where it counts, but he’s also dealing with such a ridiculous media environment. There was a hot take out earlier which was “If Biden is only really good, that’s really bad” that made me want to punch a wall. Or, more appropriately, stop ever reading politics news
ETA: I see there’s literally people in this thread saying the same thing. Nice.
Josie
@Mo MacArbie: I’m only a year younger than Joe Biden. I do have trouble sometimes with word retrieval, but if I just relax and move on, it comes to me within minutes. I have occasionally forgotten to turn off the oven, but I self published a 60,000 word book last year and am currently working on a sequel. I walk every other day, lift light weights and am in excellent physical condition. It amazes me that people consider 80 a time to be put out to pasture.
Omnes Omnibus
@guachi: Some of you navy boys seem to give up really easily. Did you forget about John Paul Jones?
Eyeroller
@MisterForkbeard: See comment above. Not good enough. Nothing will be good enough for some.
I stumble over names and words sometimes and I’m 15 years younger and don’t have a stutter. Jeesuz.
Edit: Some of these people never like Biden to begin with. The media for sure doesn’t like him.
me
I saw someone on MSNBC say that it showed a command of the issues but he didn’t know if it was good enough to make a case against Trump. I don’t even know what that means. I don’t think that there’s anything he can do to satisfy that type. Apparently the narrative needs to be fed.
Elizabelle
@guachi: please stop embarrassing yourself
Eyeroller
@me: I just want to say “kill me now” but that’s a bit facile. Biden has a command of the issues. Trump will sell us out to Russia. What to do, what do to? For whom should I vote?
Michael Bersin
It’s fascinating watching old media talking heads’ pearl clutching post press conference who are offended by Joe Biden’s (D) “defiance” that they perceive he directed at them.
Tells us all we need to know.
No matter what or how Joe Biden does they will continue their current narrative.
satby
For the Kamala will win where Biden can’t crowd, here’s a Tweet that includes a video of what they said about her on NewsMax. It’s just a taste of what will happen to Harris (and he says much more than that):
Victoria Brownworth @VABVO Jul 10
Yikes. Last night on NEWSMAX Sebastian Gorka said of VP Kamala Harris “she’s colored, right?”
guachi
@Omnes Omnibus: JPJ died at the age of 45. I doubt JPJ had 85% of his crew believing he was too old to be Captain.
@satby: Being racist towards Harris is something I can argue against. Saying Biden is too old is something I really can’t. Nor is it an indication of a morale failing of the person who thinks it.
Lapassionara
@Archon: Me too. I keep recalling the immediate reaction to his lame responses to the early questions at the debate. “He must drop out,” said by almost every commentator. Really? Your first response is essentially the “off with your head” of the Red Queen’s response. Someone is trying to orchestrate this, not sure who.
Archon
@guachi: When you’re analogy compares Biden’s dilemma to Hitler in his bunker it might be a good idea to take a couple days off from going online.
MisterForkbeard
@me: What always seems nuts is that it takes next to no effort for a reporter/commentator to just say “Yeah, he obviously knew what he was talking about and he’s all there.”
That’s it. But they’re not willing to say that
@Michael Bersin: They used this same frame on Hillary when they were Emailzing her. Lots of “defiance” when she defended herself. And when she finally gave in after months and apologized, they went on a bunch of victory laps and started talking about how it weakened her and maybe she’d be arrested for it.
Really awful to see happening again.
Michael Bersin
@me:
“…I saw someone on MSNBC say that it showed a command of the issues but he didn’t know if it was good enough to make a case against Trump…”
They are the problem.
oldgold
Biden was clearly better tonight. Much better than the debate and measurably better than the ABC interview.
Is the media going to give a fair holistic review or focus on the Putin/ Trump gaffes?
Mr. Bemused Senior
Since it’s an open thread, FYI fellow jackals.
Eolirin
@MisterForkbeard: Dude has a motherfucking stutter.
guachi
@Archon: When Biden supporters have something other than “the polls are wrong!!!!” as their rallying cry, as I see all over social media, that’s when I’ll change my tune. It’s full of people railing against whites backstabbing Biden but no real explanation on how Biden actually wins.
85% of Americans now believe Biden is too old. That’s not changing. Time is an arrow.
eclare
@SiubhanDuinne:
This was his first week back from vacation, so it was his first since the debate. There were some cringey jokes on Monday, but less so each following night.
Another commenter said the same about Meyers. And they both had bits on P2025. My personal theory? All the late night hosts are friends IRL, and they finally realized that if TCFG wins and is in charge of the FBI, he could throw them in jail.
In fact, Kimmel made a crass and hilarious joke a while back, and immediately after said yeah, if TCFG wins, I’m going to have to move to Canada. Jimmy is on vacation, but I bet if he were doing his show, it also would lighten up on Joe jokes and start talking more about P2025.
Another Scott
@zhena gogolia: https://www.inquirer.com/puzzles/ doesn’t get you there? (I don’t have an account so I don’t know what is actually shown there behind the “Subscribe!” banner.)
I hope I didn’t direct you there on false pretenses when you asked at the time!
Cheers,
Scott.
BlueGuitarist
from @jamisonfoser on twitter
Did this happen at the press conference tonight?
different-church-lady
Have any of the reporters who are suspicious of Biden’s mental acuity gotten around to asking Trump why he repeatedly praises a fictional cannibal?
Eyeroller
@guachi: Yeah, he died of a complication of some unknown infection that attacked his kidneys. (Or perhaps a reaction to some folk medicine of the time that was toxic to the kidneys.) What does that have to do with Biden?
Michael Bersin
That maroon Jim Himes (CT) on MSNBC, when asked about tonight’s press conference, “it’s not about tonight…”
Fool.
Omnes Omnibus
@guachi: I’ll just leave you there on your ledge then.
Jay
https://www.jefftiedrich.com/p/top-ny-times-editor-covering-the
BR
I hate the argument guachi made but they are right in a narrow sense. The press conference itself (I didn’t watch) is just part of a reset. The other part is for Biden and other party leadership to use carrots and sticks to get the elected officials jumping ship to stop. If they can’t do that, this won’t stop because the media is going to keep feeding it.
MisterForkbeard
@Eolirin: No kidding :/
@guachi: Biden’s had two weeks of incredible awfulness and it barely shows up in the polls at all so far. But turn that around: there’s no viable explanation for how a non-Biden wins. The only possible replacement candidate is Kamala and she doesn’t seem interested – and she’d be attacked like crazy AND get the racists and sexists even more out in front than they are now.
Biden, though? Biden just has to campaign and start talking about what Trump actually wants to do. And that will work if the media will let him do it, but I don’t see any other candidate having an easier time or consolidating Dem support.
eclare
@Mo MacArbie:
I’m in my 50’s and sometimes I have to stop myself from calling my current dog by my previous dog’s name. It’s only been a couple of years.
guachi
@Omnes Omnibus: The only people on a ledge are those “ridin’ with Biden” right over the cliff to a second Trump term.
BlueDWarrior
@me: No, that’s the long and the short of it. This is going to be an endurance test until Chicago.
The only way this changes is if every single person saying Biden should drop out proceed to immediately, and with full throat endorse Kamala Harris being on top of the ticket instead.
That is literally the only way this works for the anti-Joe caucus, anything else is basically demanding the party commit seppuku at the Convention.
M31
hahaha just read someone’s quip, that Joe should have said “ugh my memory must be going I’m feeling like I heard this question 3 times already”
lol
different-church-lady
Quick reminder: neurotic people will not stop until they get validation for their neurosis. And if they have to make everyone around them neurotic to get it, that’s what they’ll do.
zhena gogolia
@Another Scott: Oh, thanks — I couldn’t find it via their own website.
mrmoshpotato
@3Sice:
My response: Eat up mainshitstream media! 🍆🍆🍆🍆🍆🍆🍆🍆🍆🍆🍆🍆🍆💦💦💦💦💦💦💦💦💦💦💦💦💦💦
Eyeroller
@guachi: He’s tied with Trump in the polls despite the two-week onslaught that is the worst many political pros have ever seen. Does that enter into your thinking? What do you imagine would happen if he is forced out?
Odie Hugh Manatee
@Eyeroller:
Yup, it’s way past time to start ejecting these Tonya Harding Democrats. If they can’t stay on message and kneecap our party then they need to be booted.
Be a team player or GTFO.
satby
So, the Heritage Foundation had a data hack, and some interesting stuff in the Signal blog data:
Jackie Singh @HackingButLegal
Here’s an example of the fun we can have here: Match suspicious comments to suspicious IP addresses. Here we have “Clint” who asks, “I am not sure who told you that ‘Space-based interceptors present the best option for a boost-phase missile defense.’ Can you point me to a technical study? This Air Force (ex-AF) officer says the opposite is true: that space based missile defense is not feasible [links] So I am confused — it seems space based missile defense is not the most sensible thing to do. If you have any other information to share on this issue that would be good. Thanks.” “Clint” made this particular comment from an IP address originating from Kathmandu, Nepal.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@guachi: Reductio ad Hitlerum (Latin for “reduction to Hitler”), also known as playing the Nazi card,[1][2] is an attempt to invalidate someone else’s argument on the basis that the same idea was promoted or practiced by Adolf Hitler or the Nazi Party.
You just did that against during an argument in your own head.
Bill Arnold
@guachi:
I suggest focusing on tuning and using your anti-Trump rhetoric, against convicted felon Donald J. Trump.
Lawrence O’Donnell: That [slight pause] lying psychopath
Xantar
@guachi: the way Biden wins is he makes Trump’s policies into a bigger liabilities than Biden’s age in the minds of voters. Yes, the majority of Americans think Biden is too old and that’s not changing. Also, the vast majority of people think Trump is unsuitable for office, and that’s before they even learn about his actual policy proposals.
It’s going to be ugly and negative and people won’t like it, but at the end of the day one of them will win. My bet is that enough people realize what’s at stake. A reluctant vote against Trump and for Biden counts just as much as an enthusiastic one.
Eolirin
@BlueDWarrior: The delegates are voting before the convention because of concerns about Ohio’s law I thought. So like… In two weeks.
BR
@Odie Hugh Manatee:
I think Schumer has it in him. He needs to sit down Bennett and a couple other wavering senators. I don’t think Jeffries has been there long enough to pull it off in the house, so it’d have to be someone else like Obama or Pelosi.
I think they get three options: go get an ice cream cone with Joe, shut up and stay that way, or have every amendment they propose crushed by leadership.
guachi
@MisterForkbeard:
The awful polling is why D electeds are telling Biden to drop out. They see terrible polling. If they didn’t they wouldn’t be asking Biden to withdraw.
By not being so old that 85% of Americans think you shouldn’t even be running.
This is meaningless. Of course she can’t say she that.
Okay? I’d rather be able to say Harris’s opponents are racist and sexist and, therefore, terrible people than 85% of Americans saying Biden is too old. I agree with them.
Biden has been on the airwaves for months with little opposition. It is having no effect. Why, at the debate, did Biden not mention Project 2025 AT ALL? Why? Biden’s debate failure is why we are where we are.
Then we’re screwed no matter what we do.
Odie Hugh Manatee
@guachi:
Since you’re predicting things do you have the next Powerball numbers?
I want to know which numbers to avoid.
Elizabelle
@Mr. Bemused Senior: good on you for canceling. Suspect you were more genteel than most in explaining why.
FTF Vichy NY Times.
different-church-lady
@guachi:
Ah, you’re finally starting to get it.
eclare
@Mr. Bemused Senior:
Bravo! Today’s op-ed about TCFG was too little, too late.
BR
@guachi:
This election is, as it was, going to come down to us. Not Biden or someone else. It’s on us. The forces of autocracy are all aligned, and this is the final showdown. There are going to be crazy October surprises from the usual suspects. What wins the election was always going to be the volunteer forces all coming together, from progressives to moderates to never Trumpers.
Central Planning
@eclare: I have 5 kids, and I’m pretty sure I always have to say all their names to get to the one I want.
Xantar
@guachi: “Then we’re screwed no matter what we do.”
The nice thing about this argument is it totally lets you off the hook. The future is already predetermined and baked in, so you shouldn’t waste your time trying to persuade people or going out to volunteer or any of that. You can just sit back and tell people you’re right.
It doesn’t really showcase the good sides of your character, though.
Juju.
@Mo MacArbie: My mother is old and at least five times a day she asks when we are going home. She wants to go to the house she lived in 50 years ago. Not only a different street, but also a different state. She has lived in her current house since 1981. There is a difference.
TaMara
Just catching up with the news and seeing the DougJ summed it up best on twitter.
Also, LOVING the $81 contributions to Joe. I’ll have to dig deep after paying the petsitter, but I think it can be done.
dc
@M31: He should have asked the reporter if they had trouble recalling the very recent past?
guachi
@Bill Arnold:
This is what you have to do when there is no positive case left for Biden. “Not worse than Trump” is really weak tea.
Tony G
I listened to it but didn’t watch it. Biden sounded like an intelligent, elderly man. Trump, in contrast, was an idiot when he was in his twenties. In a logical world that should end this obsession by American “journalists” — but, empirically, the corporations that they work for want Trump to win. (Meanwhile — since I’m a masochist — earlier today I was listening to the “leftist” New York City radio station WBAI, where some clowns were blathering about how they wanted Jill Stein or RFK Junior to become president.)
eversor
@Lapassionara:
Robert Reich said it’s a Democratic big money donor revolt. That they are putting the screws to other elected Democrats as well. Political parties are basically fund raising machines. So if the big money puts it foot down that not only will it not fund the top of the ticket it won’t fund the down ticket as well you’ll get this result.
Which is true. If the big money stops completely the party gets wiped out. And I fully realize voters only matter to allow the political system a facade of legitimacy. If the big donors decide they are willing to blow things up to get what they want, it’s over they get what they want.
NotMax
Turns out it’s a good things Dolt 45’s sentencing was pushed back from today. Otherwise that’s all the MSM would be on about.
guachi
If it’s on us then Biden doesn’t need to be the candidate. He can withdraw. It can be Harris. I’m pretty sure the % of Americans who think Harris is too old is about 0%.
wjca
Sadly, the heat death of the universe may not be more distant than the next intelligent question.
Slightly_peeved
@guachi:
I’m not entirely familiar with the American election system, but I’m pretty sure it isn’t a yes/no “Is the president too old?”
Odie Hugh Manatee
@Mr. Bemused Senior:
Old habits are hard to give up but are much easier to quit when they turn from good to bad. The New York Times is fucking horrible.
Bill Arnold
@satby:
Yeah. Here’s a threadreader for a twitter thread.
Fun stuff from my notes:
Gay furries have hacked The Heritage Foundation
https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1811194988601942470.html
Jackie
@BlueGuitarist:
Every question asked by the reporters were read off from their phones, or notepads.
But THAT’s “different.” 😡
Michael Bersin
@Enhanced Voting Techniques:
Godwin’s Law was suspended in 2018 by Godwin.
There is a possible Godwin’s Second Law.
BR
@guachi:
Oh yeah, I forgot, the press never creates some new litmus test for Dems and is always perfectly fair to the candidate of your choice. They will say “oh, this candidate is not old, now we’ll report perfectly fairly and focus on Trump”.
p.a.
Am I too cynical in thinking that much of the (assumed) Biden animus among large donors is because Joe & his admin has been the best for working people and the middle class since FDR? (Yes, I know the New Deal was mainly white-only but work with me here…)
gwangung
@eclare: Pathetic. A better troll isn’t so obvious in editing the poll they’re using.
Do better.
NotMax
@guachi
TAFFOARD. Repeatedly.
(Tried to continue to restrain my ire. But enough is too much.)
satby
Not a fan of Chris Matthews, but his conclusion is right here:
Chris Matthews: “In life, he lost his wife and daughter, and he found Jill. Now, who’s he going to listen to, Jill or George Clooney? He’s got poor people, minorities, Hispanics, labor, he’s going to hold that base of the Democratic Party which he will need in November. 1/3
And I’m telling you, people are going to end up rooting for him in October. Chris Matthews: This elite-fashioned attack on him, they’re going to pay for it. But in the end, they’re going to end voting for him. 2/3
So I think Biden will be the Democrat is this race, the true Democrat. And he’s going to get people to turn for him in October. It’s going to be stunning. He is not quitting. He is not built to quit.”
Soprano2
@Eyeroller: That’s kind of like what the OBoys proposed, only theirs would happen at the convention. I wish I were making that up.
Belafon
@guachi: what are you going to do?
moonbat
@Another Scott: Dude! Thank you! I was poking around the website but couldn’t find a link for the puzzles. Joy!
Geminid
Well, now that Joe Biden has set a standard it’s time for Donald Trump to toe the line. Let’s see that tinhorn answer questions from the press for an hour.
Another Scott
Music video summary of the press feeding frenzy – DJ Cummerbund – Through the Flaming Hotels of California (6:22).
Cheers,
Scott.
Juju.
@me: I can’t even think of Trump having command of information with that kind of detail on any subject matter, let alone foreign policy and NATO. I did hear that Trump didn’t know what NATO was, but mastered what it was in less than two minutes. I think a reporter should ask him what he knows about NATO, and show your work. I bet he couldn’t answer.
guachi
@Xantar:
Yes. For those who think Biden or Harris will both lose so just stick with Biden.
I do not think that. I think Harris has a non-zero chance of winning but Biden has exactly a 0% chance of winning.
The Supreme Court decision guaranteed Trump will never see the inside of a jail cell. Saying “Trump is a convicted felon” will blow up in Ds faces in September. Biden can’t make the case against Trump. Someone else must.
Belafon
@satby: where did you get those?
Odie Hugh Manatee
@guachi: “Then we’re screwed no matter what we do.”
JUMP! Fucking just jump already, Tonya. And fuck you and the quivering mess you are.
You are aiding the Republicans and helping Putin.
3Sice
@p.a.:
The Connecticut delegation carrying water for the Big Money? Perish the thought.
Belafon
@guachi: But what are you going to do?
moonbat
@Jay: Okay, now I’m on a mission to make as many people I know who still have FTFNYT subscriptions drop them. We as a nation don’t need legacy media if this is how they are going to operate.
eclare
@NotMax:
Huh. You’re right, hadn’t thought of that.
guachi
If the press wants to say Harris is too Black or too female then I will attack them for being racist and sexist. If they claim Biden is too old I, along with 85% of America, agree with them.
Claiming someone is too old to do a job is not a moral failing. Claiming they are because of the color of their skin or their sex is.
Lapassionara
@eversor: thank you. That makes some sense. Any ideas what we do about it? Asking for a friend.
Jackie
@eclare: A NYT editor was on Morning Joe this morning and said that anti Trump editorial was in the works MONTHS AGO and wasn’t “ready until now.” I don’t think anyone believed her – as the editorial board managed to shoot out multiple “Joe must goes” editorials starting the day after the debate. I got the impression she didn’t believe her own words as she spoke.
Bill Arnold
@guachi:
I’ll be blunter, then. The media anti-Biden lemming stampede has done a lot of damage to the Democratic party. The outcome of the election, including House/Senate control, now depends in large part on the vigor and creativity and and ruthlessness of the attacks on Trump.
(Best Presidency in my lifetime. Best economy in my lifetime, excepting perhaps a year or two in the late 1990s, when anyone with sense knew that the bubble would pop and a recession would result. Sure, there are a few sectors hurting; there always are.)
satby
@Belafon: He was on Joy Reid’s show. There’s a longer clip, this distilled his main points.
eclare
@gwangung:
I have no idea what you are talking about. My comment talked about late night hosts.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@BlueGuitarist: ROLF Was the question “When you will stop answering questions…from..(pardon, what is that word?) a …teleprompter and show the American …pu..blic,…your command of the issues.”
Xantar
@guachi: “I think Harris has a non-zero chance of winning but Biden has exactly a 0% chance of winning.”
Back in 2016, I thought Trump had exactly 0% chance of winning. I was dead certain about that. Now, I have a lot more humility about predicting the future.
So I’m going to repeat Belafon’s question to you: what are you actually going to do?
Belafon
@satby: thanks.
guachi
@Belafon:
I’ve visited offices of my Senators (Coons & Carper) and Representative (Blunt Rochester) and told staffers that I think Biden should withdraw. Sooner rather than later.
There is no way that Biden can overcome 85% thinking he’s too old. Trump isn’t going to jail. Rate cuts will come too late. Economic sentiment won’t improve fast enough. Biden isn’t capable of making the case against Trump.
If Biden is the nominee I’ll give up on the Presidential race. Maybe I’ll be wrong. But I can no longer make a positive case for Biden.
Skippy-san
Biden showed he understands the more significant issues and that consistency matters. Trump will never understand that. Trump’s failure to understand how NATO works is just one example of many.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@Michael Bersin: Well, then I stand corrected; people are free to call their opponent a Nazi when they are arguing with themselves.
I would suppose they know best.
West of the Rockies
Remember Overton Windows… ah, such an innocent time when we thought the right could always move further right.
Eyeroller
Looking at Xhitter (via Nitter) I see chyrons that “Obama and Pelosi are huddled as Democrats look to steer Biden out of 2024 race.” Another xeet(?) “Obama and Pelosi have spoken privately about Biden and the future of his 2024 campaign. Both the former president and ex-speaker expressed concerns. Neither is quite sure what to do.” Wonder whether they talked to Ezra Klein?
Maybe they could fuck off? This sort of validates the rumors that Obama was orchestrating the media onslaught (via his surrogates) in private while publicly supporting Joe. I will withhold judgement till I hear more evidence, but this makes me very suspicious.
eclare
@Jackie:
I didn’t see her today, but I know who you’re talking about. Mika dragged her over the coals a while back for the never-ending “Is Joe Senile?” reporting while saying nothing about a guy who constantly talks about a fictional cannibal. Her response was pathetic. And of course that op-ed was not in the works for months.
TaMara
Dang, lots of pie here tonight.
eversor
@Lapassionara:
Nothing you can do. You will vote for what the donors want or you are supporting fascists and to blame when fascists win. Just as liberals have done left the big money donors are now doing liberals. That is how the Democratic party has worked for decades now. It’s just liberals getting a taste of it now.
We’re stuck now.
satby
And though most of you like to comment that Twitter isn’t real life (and of course it isn’t), it’s real life to pundits and media players. So it’s useful to be on it to: see where they’re going, to argue with them when they’re wrong, and to boost the signal of the good analysis. Plus get informed on things like Project 2025. So I hope these snippets help.
guachi
@Odie Hugh Manatee:
You have poor reading comprehension. Very poor. I do not believe we are screwed no matter what we do.
Al Rennick
h/t https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/4766982-biden-news-conference-live-coverage/#195725
NotMax
@West of the Rockies
Right off the map of basic human decency.
Xantar
@satby: wait I’m confused. Chris Matthews is saying that Obama didn’t endorse Biden and instead backed Hillary. As I recall, Biden didn’t run in 2016. His son had just died. What is Chris talking about?
Enhanced Voting Techniques
So you understand why this upsets many people and make them suspect Biden is suffering from dementia.
This go back to the “which candidate would you like vomit beer over?” question, no one likes a smarty pants.
Elie
I’m thrilled and proud. Yay!!! He looked great and sounded himself praise be.
buck2202
@moonbat: my subscription was down to $1/week after the last “please don’t go” offer I got the last time I clicked cancel (which was when they decided to triple the student rate a few months ago)
cancelled today. too much
Jay
@guachi:
and another Trump voter joins the chorus.
Belafon
@guachi: it is when 1) it only gets applied to one of the two contenders, and 2) when it doesn’t properly described the skills needed for the job. The president doesn’t need to be able to bench press 100 lbs, and he doesn’t need to be able to solve the closed form solution of the Schrodinger’s Equation of the state’s of hydrogen. Biden has shown over and over again that he can still do the job, so in this case is ageist.
eclare
@Eyeroller:
Same, it’s suspicious and weird.
Eyeroller
@guachi: Oh, you’ll condemn their racism and sexism. That’ll work.
Aussie Sheila
@p.a.:
This has been my belief all along. They don’t mind smooth ‘liberals’ who share their general outlook, but one thing elite and prestige media will not stand for is a party or candidate who supports an organised working class. That is what is going on here in my opinion.
Eyes on the prize.
This will be buried once the Republican convention starts next week.
I look forward to another four years of a very good U.S. administration led by the Biden/Harris team.
Al Rennick
h/t https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/4766982-biden-news-conference-live-coverage/#195725
guachi
@Bill Arnold:
Maybe so. But Biden picked, promoted, and prepared for a debate he completely bombed. The response of “just a cold. Won’t change a thing” was laughably stupid.
I, my mom, my dad, my two sisters all eagerly watched the debate independent of one another. None of us needed the media to tell us Biden did terrible. I, my mom, and my dad all came to the conclusion Biden should drop out. I have not talked with my sisters. We didn’t need the media to tell us what to think.
Eyeroller
@Xantar: There have been some rumors (take it for what it’s worth) that Joe wanted to run but Obama pushed him aside for Hillary, so the grief over Beau, while a genuine issue, was the public explanation.
Geminid
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: Trump understands how Nato works. That’s why he tried to undermine it throughout his Presidency, and evades questions about it now. This is not a matter of ignorance; it’s his fealty to Putin.
NotMax
@Xantar
Tweety in a nutshell:
“Never forget Tip O’Neill and Reagan clinked highball glasses together.”
Percysowner
@guachi:
Wow! You and another poster I usually pie are here tonight. I’m on my IPad and my pies don’t transfer. Much to my surprise I’m pieing you and leaving them alone. Good job on being obnoxious! Also at trolling!
satby
@Eyeroller: don’t assume that it’s real, what was the source? I haven’t seen anything CREDITABLE like that, and I’ve been all over it today because I needed to talk several lower info folks off the ledge.
Every election; this one is more vicious because they have their court and can really attempt to remake society. And our own side is sabotaging us worse than anything NewsMax or Fox could do to hurt us.
Archon
@guachi: Is their a ‘“If Biden is the nominee we’re doomed!” statue of limitations or are you gonna be telling us this every day on these threads between now and November?
Asking for a friend.
eclare
@Xantar:
Chris was on Morning Joe, and yes, that’s what he said. I remember Joe saying he was too grief stricken too. Maybe they worked out Joe’s reasoning as an excuse/cover so that Hillary could run, maybe it’s the truth. Who knows.
Elie
We are going to have to leave room for folks to get back under the tent who got too far over their skies Big tent folks. Big tent. Have to forgive for now
satby
@NotMax: Yeah, he’s a relic. But he’s not wrong about Biden’s resolve.
Westyny
@TaMara: Agree.
gwangung
@eclare: Eep. I have no idea how that happened. That was meant for the loser who’s been whining for 100+ comments.
Accept my apologies for hitting the comment button on the wrong post.
BlueGuitarist
@Jackie:
Thanks!
guachi
@Jay:
85% of Americans believe Biden is too old. Are they all Trump voters? If so Biden is going to get smashed in November
I’m one of the few people that can claim to be such a hardcore Democrat I actually voted for a dead guy for governor over the popular Republican incumbent.
Trump voter? lol
Princess
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: I’m voting for the stoned out of their mind billionaires. I think a lot of this has to do with the expiring personal tax cuts in the rich.
guachi
@Eyeroller:
If it doesn’t work as you believe then you must believe that the Democratic party can only nominate white men for president from now until the end of time.
moonbat
The last two weeks have convinced me that some folks just like the ledge.
Maybe it’s the breeze in your face, the rush of adrenaline, the view. But I think mostly it’s the attention from those sincere people down on the street/thread holding the trampoline that is supposed to catch you.
“Hey, everyone, look at me! I’m panicking! And I won’t accept any of your evidence-based, well reasoned arguments to dissuade me from my dearly held panic because that would mean the show’s over and I won’t get any more attention by derailing every thread I come into contact with.”
At this point, I’m like, “Enjoy the view. The window’s unlocked. Come back in when you’re ready.”
satby
It’s an article of faith among the mopes in the media, many of them Berniebros, that Obama discouraged Joe in favor of Hillary. Joe had just lost his son Beau, and was deeply grieving. Joe himself said he wasn’t up to running under those circumstances. But Matthews has his own animus against the elites who forced him out of his show, he’s projecting.
Eyeroller
@satby: All I can say is it was a chyron on a screenshot from CNN in a — xeet? The corresponding article is credited to Edward-Isaac Dovere of CNN.
If Robert Reich is on the right track (via eversor) it’s about big donors and from what I’ve read the problem the big donors have is Kamala Harris.
Ithink
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): Liberals, at least American-raised & born ones and those working in close proximity to our courtier mainstream press, just need constant affirmation of their worldview in a way their right-wing counterparts don’t; they’re constantly noodling for it but are so content w/ creating an alternate reality these days they don’t even bother honestly in good faith to make new ideological converts; everybody that disagrees even slightly is a sworn devil or demon spawn!
eclare
@gwangung:
Sure, no worries.
satby
@guachi: so, reliable dem voter, you’ll just sabotage from within. Makes sense.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@moonbat: Yes, been noticing that too. Along with the way they start screaming when the conversation turns away from jumping off the ledge.
O. Felix Culpa
@different-church-lady:
QFT. Thank you for that observation…and warning.
moonbat
@buck2202: Good!
guachi
@Belafon:
Biden’s job is to get more electoral votes than the other guy. He needs the skills to do that. I do not believe Biden possesses them.
I further believe Biden is too old to be President for 4 more years. The presidency is not a charity program or participation trophy.
I believe Biden possesses the skills to adequately do his current job for six more months.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@Eyeroller: It’s CNN, come on, a little healthy skepticism in order. How many times have these MSM outfits been caught quot mining people?
guachi
@Percysowner:
If you are not full onboard with Biden you are a troll. I do not believe this is an effective way to convince people who don’t believe Biden is up to the task.
“Shut up, shut up, shut up” is magical thinking.
schrodingers_cat
@guachi: If you can predict the future what are you doing hanging out on Balloon Juice?
p.a.
I keep hearing “completely bombed the debate”. This is a tRump frame so must be a lie.
Rough start yes. Bad voice because of a fucking cold. Goddam why didn’t someone just come forward and say “I messed up and gave Joe Nyquil instead of Dayquil!”???
BlueDWarrior
@Eyeroller: now let’s ask the follow up question: why would the big money donor base have a problem with Kamala Harris?
I have quite a few theories and none of them make said donor base look good.
guachi
@satby:
This is the bizarre line I’m seeing from hardcore Biden supporters. It’s “sabotage” if you think Biden can’t win and we should pick someone who can.
Fine, I accuse you of “sabotage” because you want to sabotage from within by demanding we keep Biden.
satby
@Eyeroller: god, if anyone buys the myth that Harris would do better than Biden in an election in this misogynistic, racist country they’re crazy. That’s why black folks are united behind Biden, they’re not that naive. This is an attempt to knock them both out, Biden first, then destroy Harris’ political career when she’s defeated because white people, a lot of them even on our side, aren’t really committed to democracy. Their taxes and egos are more important.
And I know I probably just did the Beetlejuicex3 call. Sorry.
tam1MI
Spoiler alert, asshole: Nobody here cares what you believe. Go vote for Trump like you are obviously itching to do. Better yet, make the world a better place and die.
HinTN
@p.a.: No, you are not too cynical, nor are you wrong. SATSQ
Eyeroller
@BlueDWarrior: Oh, we know why the big donors don’t want Kamala.
I really do not know what to make of this new information. I cannot assess its reliability but it does fit with some recent evidence and a few rumors. I suppose we’ll have to wait and see.
Scout2116
@satby: They may be referring to an “exclusive” news story at CNN:
Obama, Pelosi privately expressed concerns over Biden
I read the whole thing and as far as I can tell, no one has gone on record.
They then game out how Pelosi and Obama may be thinking, may be saying, may be doing but it’s just anonymous sources reading the tea leaves.
Until we get an official statement on record from Obama or Pelosi or any of these more than dozen people whispering in CNN’s ears, I won’t be taking any of this as fact.
Eyeroller
@satby: Yep, the big donors want her gone. From what it seems, they don’t think Biden will live through another term and they are terrified that Kamala will become President. So basically these “Democratic” donors would rather have Trump.
I’ll also note that the chryon was on a video (that I have not watched) about voters in Michigan watching the presser who were impressed and wondered why anybody wanted to force Biden out.
Scout211
Help! I’m in moderation for an errant number added to my nym..
satby
@guachi: Biden is in, the majority of our elected are behind him, his base is behind him. The damage now is from people supposedly on the Democratic team stabbing him in the back. The disunity has always caused the party involved to lose elections when it occurs, see 1968 and 1980. So sabotage is what you’re doing.
Finis to all the quislings.
moonbat
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: Jeez, it’s exhausting, which for some of them I assume is the objective.
Joe’s done all the events, taken questions (such as they were) from the press, held an international summit, been re-endorsed by the nation’s largest union, and affirmed that he’s not quitting this race.
That’s the reality. Folks need to wean themselves from the drama of the last couple of weeks, cancel their subscription to the FTFNYT and get to work electing our ticket.
satby
@Eyeroller: they want lower taxes and less regulation and the editor at the NYT said so.
guachi
@satby:
This is utterly bizarre. “If you don’t think Biden can win then you hate democracy”. What kind of nonsense is this?
The pro-Biden arguments are so out there that the more I read them the more convinced I am that Biden is toast because his supporters can’t make effective arguments.
I’ve also seen over and over “people who want Harris because they think she win are racist because Black voters are standing with Biden”. That’s utterly crazy. Not only does it make no sense it’s not true since a majority of Black voters want Biden to withdraw.
Jay
@eversor:
up $264 million dollars plus for the Biden/Harris Campaign alone in the first 10 days of July,
hummmmmmm, big donors are fleeing,……
allegedly, or are they making shit up again?
Hum, that’s quizzer.
Eyeroller
@satby: Sure, but these are traditionally “Democratic” donors. Hollywood types etc. They know that lower taxes for them aren’t a Democratic priority. There is something else going on here.
japa21
@guachi:
85% may say he’s too old, but that doesn’t mean they won’t vote for him. I understand your concern, but he isn’t running against a 45 year old genius. Almost the same percent think Trump is too old.
wjca
Perhaps that’s why they sympathize with TCFG, who spent a lifetime trying to get accepted by NYC society. And failing utterly.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
And turn off the TV. I think video and voice are far more insidious than writing because it’s one way conversation.
guachi
@tam1MI:
Is this seriously what this place has become? Full of Biden cultists who wish death on others because they think, like 3/4 of America, that Biden should withdraw?
I’ll give you my address if you want. Come and kill me.
My god, get a grip.
Elie
@BlueDWarrior:
I dunno
Her hubby made his fortune in finance. I don’t think we know all the details. Last I heard her she was on fire. He will need her. She is a warrior. Things aren’t always what they seem. Let’s give all the players room to execute the battle plan in a changing situation. I know I dont know all the players or the resources they have. For sure. But I know this is complicated and I can respect that
satby
it’s late, I’m out. same shit, different day. I’m sure tomorrow it will be more of the same with every massaged to fit the narrative news quote.
moonbat
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: You are probably right. It’s just that now I have developed a particular animus against the FTFNYT. lol CNN is just as bad now and MSNBC has shown a taste for drama lately as well.
guachi
@satby:
Another one wishing death upon me. Shall I give you my address, too? You can come and kill me and my mom. We both believe Biden should drop out.
Aussie Sheila
@guachi:
Once he’s elected, if he can’t do the job or drops off the perch, there’s an endorsed, competent and energetic VP to become the 48th President.
Instead of kvetching in ways which mirror the elite Press and billionaire donors, why don’t you log off and volunteer to do some phone banking or door knocking?
pajaro
@eversor:
I’m interested that you see no difference between a decision made that upholds the choice made by the majority of voters, and a decision that thwarts the will of the majority of voters (as expressed by their actual votes). If Biden steps down, it will mark the first time since 1968. that the choice of democratic primary voters didn’t decide the nominee.
Eolirin
@pajaro: I don’t think we should count 1968 anyway. Bobby Kennedy could hardly accept the nomination he was on track to win that year.
Jay
@moonbat:
As was said last night in somebody else’s comment,
You can’t talk them of the ledge,
You can push them off.
Another Scott
@eversor: OTOH…
Blog.ActBlue.com (from April 25):
(Emphasis added.)
Biden (like other earlier Democrats) has a joint fundraising committee, so donors have a one-stop-shop to support the top of the ticket and state candidates, etc. (especially if someone has given the limit to a particular campaign).
Google tells me that there are 7.4 million millionaires, and around 750 billionaires, in the USA. 2-3-5 or whatever making noises in FTFNYT is nothing.
Also, big donors know how things work. They’re not going to sit on the sidelines and not have a way in to get their views heard. They want to schmooze, and maybe have someone put in a good word to they can be considered to be an ambassador or be on some board or something.
We’re not doomed. Eyes on the prizes.
Cheers,
Scott.
Damien
@guachi: Well, since Biden isn’t listening to you or your mom and is in the race, what are you going to do to try to move this 0% needle you’re so convinced of?
Let’s assume for the moment that whining to your reps and wishcasting on the Internet don’t count.
I’m handwriting 500 postcards and donating, what are you DOING NOW?
Belafon
@Damien:
Awesome.
Princess
@satby: This is 100% correct. They’re salivating at the prospect of knocking both Biden and Harris out in one blow.
I’m getting angrier and angrier.
Also too, I recall guachi’s nym on here over the years ranting about this and that and I don’t think he’s ever been correct about anything. So it’s probably good he’s against us.
Belafon
@guachi: You had better understand the word quisling before you make comments like this.
YY_Sima Qian
Trying to game out whether Biden or Harris or some other alternative gives Dems the better chance in Nov. is a fools errand, because none of us are privy to the full set of information to meaningfully make that assessment, because none of us have true visibility to the central critical factor – whether Biden still has the physical stamina & mental acuity to perform through the campaign & at least for a while in office. Assuming Biden is competent enough to perform through the campaign & early in office, then clearly he is by far the better choice, & Harris only if Biden is not competent or deteriorates very rapidly, & there is really no other alternative for 2024.
& Biden only really needs to perform through the campaign & win the election. Whatever happens after that, we have the 25th Amendment & the VP.
BTW, we are going to [rightly] decry thinly sourced MSM rumormongering that senior Dems are becoming more skeptical of Biden’s chances, & then turn around to jump on thinly sourced MSM rumors claiming Obama & Pelosi are trying to take stock & assess what they should do in this situation, & then expand the CT further to speculating one of them being Ezra Klein’s source? Seriously?
I mean, if either Obama or Pelosi or both are seriously concerned about Biden’s viability as a candidate, we have to consider that perhaps Biden no longer has the physical stamina & mental acuity required for a candidate & a President. I cannot countenance either believing that Trump & the R’s Project 2025 do not represent clear & present dangers to the Republic, & thus the Nov. election is not a do or die moment, which is what Klein is claiming his top Democrat source said. We either trust in the basic human decency, core civic values & fundamental political (at least domestic politics) judgment of the Dem leaders who have long proven themselves in these respects, or we don’t. If we don’t, we might as well give up & its every person for him-/herself, because there currently does not exist another vessel to invest the anti-Fascist coalition in.
Belafon
Or better, I will summarize it for you: A quisling was someone in the book WWZ who, due to the shock of the zombies, started acting and behaving like one. Many times people actually tried to help them snap out of it, but to no avail. Instead, the zombies knew that they weren’t actual zombies and attacked them.
You seem to not be able to snap out of whatever you’re under.
rb
Wtf is wrong with you? It’s ok to have the opinion that Biden isn’t our best option any more. The speed with which comments on here have gone from rude to outright unhinged is embarrassing. A few of you could stand to grow the fuck up a little.
What will be will be. Personally I would rather Biden remain but put the odds of him withdrawing at something like 1/1. Whatever happens, we’ll all have to buck up and get behind it. There’s absolutely no call for saying vile shit like the above in the meantime.
Belafon
@YY_Sima Qian:
Bobby Thomson
@guachi: St. Petersburg is too far from here.
Slightly_peeved
@Eyeroller:
If there’s no exact quotes I’d assume it’s bullshit.
Damien
@rb: strong agree with everything you just said. We’re all on the same team hypothetically.
However, 1/1 is 100%, and I just don’t think the odds of Biden stepping aside are that high 😅
Bobby Thomson
@Eyeroller: Misogynoir
Fair Economist
@Jay:
Another quarter billion nobody can use besides Biden or Harris. In 10 days.
The whole idea of replacing Biden is just so insane. Nobody else but him or Harris can use all that money, nor is there any way anybody else could build a campaign fast enough to compete. Any other candidate will be broke, unsupported, and crushed.
The idea of having Harris replace Biden is that she polls 1 or 2 percent better vs. Trump. All the chaos of a last minute replacement for 1% in the polls? Equally insane.
guachi
@Damien:
If I have to I’ll go back to my Senators and Congressmen and tell them again to ask Biden to withdraw.
As for my mom, Biden’s terrible debate performance caused her to become depressed about the future and stop watching or reading any news. She just knits now. She’s given up.
I don’t think threatening to kill people who think Biden should drop out is the best way to convince my mother that she should work for Biden’s reelection.
gwangung
I hear echoes of “You’re the puppet! You’re the puppet” on this thread.
guachi
@Belafon:
WTF are you talking about?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quisling
Eolirin
@YY_Sima Qian: Except we have a bunch of campaign events an interview, and now this press conference, and he seems… Fine?
So we’d have to assume that there’s some lingering health issue that is being covered up to jump to a rapid decline scenario. There doesn’t seem to be any evidence of one
At what point do we move on?
YY_Sima Qian
@Belafon: Media reporting is irrelevant at some level. I doubt the likes of Obama & Pelosi are swayed by MSM narratives in forming their opinions.
rb
Haha, by 1/1 I mean odds not probability, as in “3 to 2 against” or in this case “1 to 1.”
But yes, agreed. What I am saying is that I think it’s a coinflip’s chance he stays and an equal chance he goes.
Belafon
@guachi: Odd, you’re going to do nothing to help Democrats win, just stroke your ego, huh?
What you could do is do things to get more people out to vote. But, nope, the rest of the party isn’t buckling under pressure and it’s killing you.
BlueDWarrior
@Elie: The thing I’m most sick of (other than people constantly stirring the pot) is when people make suggestions that are logistically unfeasible and then expect everyone to move heaven and earth to make it… work out somehow.
Like, I can completely understand why a certain group of Democrats and Democrat-Adjacents are trying to figure out if there is another permutation that can get a decisive edge on Trump. I am thoroughly unconvinced you can find one at this stage in the game, but ok, let’s carry thought out.
But see that is where some problems crop up. Most of the alternatives have not made a single public statement saying they’d be ready to jump if Biden can’t get to the finish line; or that they would be a clearly better choice. There are some obvious reasons for that, but that in and of itself is telling.
You can’t replace something with nothing in electioneering: either there is a clear alternative candidate that delegates have to consider or there isn’t. And the anti-Biden caucus has 3 weeks counting down to figure that out. And at this point, I say go right ahead; if you are that dead set on doing it, then please, by all means share with the rest of the class how that is going to work.
Slightly_peeved
@YY_Sima Qian:
we do know, though. Biden is clearly competent, and everyone who says otherwise is bullshitting.
If he had dementia, he could not have done the press conference he just did. No teleprompter. Consistent, coherent answers. People are flailing around to justify a false narrative rather than considering evidence for and against.
(or we get the meta-argument “I think he’s competent but uninformed voters won’t”, which is tea leaf reading).
Geminid
@rb: It could be the two commenters are tag-teaming, and this was for show.
moonbat
@Jay: Yeah, I was trying to be nice. lol
tam1MI
I wish to apologize to the board in general to guachi in person for my intemperate remarks upthread. I had allowed myself to give in to despair and was lashing out. This is an explanation, not an excuse.
Anyway, here’s a small breath of hope – the headline to the story about the press conference in the New York Times: At High-Stakes News Conference, Biden Vows to ‘Finish the Job’.
If even the FTFNYT has to admit that that it was an okay press conference, things might not be as bleak as some people are saying.
Cacti
Hmmm…
Accusations of bad faith for any criticism of the leader, eliminationist rhetoric, attacks on California, actors, their families.
Getting hard to tell the BJ comment section from Breitbart these days.
BlueDWarrior
@rb: math nerd in me speaking: you’d use a colon and then clearly define the order of the ratio. So that’d write as “1:1 (even) odds he stays or goes.”
I personally think it’s more 9:1 he stays. He’s not fully foreclosed but he is unconvinced to the current hour he has to relinquish the nomination.
guachi
@Bobby Thomson:
I live in Dover, DE. You want my address, too? So far that’s three of you who want to come and kill me.
It’s 527 woodsedge road
Dover, DE 19904
My phone is 240-425-3227
Come on over.
wjca
Riiiight. Obama thinks Biden should go. That’s why every time I go on YouTube the ad I get first is Obama calling for donations to Biden’s campaign. Because that’s what you do when you want someone to drop out: try to boost their donations.
Oy vey!
Eolirin
@Slightly_peeved: It’s worse than tea leaf reading when the media does it, or the adjacent, we’re not saying if any of the things we’re reporting on are actual issues for Biden’s ability to run the country, they just raise questions about it, because they have a duty to inform. They’re the ones who can answer those questions. It’s their job to do that.
Fair Economist
No way are the odds 1:1 for Biden withdrawing. He is clearly competent to run, and is as aware as anybody of the chaos that would result from him withdrawing, *especially* now, when there’s no good reason for it (anti-Democratic bias in the media is not a reason; it’s a constant.) He wants the job, he can do the job, and anybody else stepping in at this point would face insurmountable difficulties. I’d say the chance of him withdrawing is 5%, tops.
YY_Sima Qian
@Eolirin: The Stephanopolous interview was significantly better than the debate, but whether it was a “fine” performance is in the eye of the beholder. There were a number of comments on foreign policy that were fairly unhinged & disconnected from reality, which I doubt allayed concerns in foreign capitals. Then again, that maybe because there are many very problematic aspects to Biden’s foreign policies, & the cringeworthy rhetorical flourishes are just Biden being Biden when he “leans in” on any subject.
YY_Sima Qian
@Belafon: Hey! Another WW Z fan! Although I think the vision in the book of how a zombie apocalypse might play out around the world is very much colored by an early ’00s perspective, & feels very dated now. Except Russia, it seems to be pretty on target.
BlueDWarrior
@wjca: I can imagine Obama being thoroughly frustrated that elected Democrats apparently can’t get their shit together in a very critical time before the home stretch of this election. But I think that’s because Trump is such a warping locus of gravity on our politics that a lot of people in an almost blind panic trying to ensure he can’t get back into the office. For good reasons mind you, but that means they are trying to overturn every pebble trying to find anything that increases the odds of a Democratic win, no matter how insane or counterintuitive it sounds.
Eolirin
@guachi: Delete this ffs. No one here is going to do anything stupid like that but you really don’t want that getting picked up by a bot and fed into god knows what.
Damien
@guachi: I agree with you about the threats, as I said in my concurrence with rb; I don’t remember threatening you?
However, when I asked what you’re going to do that DOESN’T involve whining to your reps for Biden to drop out your response was…you’re going to go whine to your reps?
How about making some phone calls? Writing some postcards? Knocking on some doors?
Do something PROACTIVE to help where things are, or honestly shut the fuck up. The conversation has been had, the decision is what it is, and you can start working to win or go sit in the corner with your hobby horse and, not to repeat myself, shut the entire fuck up.
Seriously.
Mousebumples
@tam1MI: I recommend the pie filter. You can still toggle if you want to see the trolls but easier to resist feeding them.
l3000
@guachi:
Don’t ever comment. But I have to say I was sympathetic to your argument in that you speak for people who really think Biden is too old. I don’t think so, but it’s your point of view and it’s valid.
But when you keep repeating a statistic of 85% that may or may not be valid, it’s not really a good argument. You have no way of knowing if 85% would decide not to vote for him even if they think he is too old. If you say, I think Biden is too old and I don’t want to vote for him, fine. But if you were really a hardcore Dem voter, you would say, I’d like Biden to step down and I will advocate for that. But if he doesn’t, even though I think he may lose, I’ll still vote for the Dem because the alternative is Trump.
So when you say, I’ll give up on the presidential election (paraphrasing bec I’m too lazy to go find it), do you mean you will vote 3rd party (trump vote) or not vote at all? Because a hardcore Dem would not do either when the stakes are this high. I’m actually curious what your course of action would be if Biden continues to be on the ballot in Nov, as a hardcore Dem that is.
eclare
@Eolirin:
Plus the NATO summit, plus all of the normal presidentin’ stuff
Kayla Rudbek
@Eyeroller: Jesus Haploid Fucking Christ, what kind of crack are these people smoking? Haven’t any of them considered the legality and logistics of this? Remind me tomorrow at my lunch break to go donate to the Biden-Harris campaign and to go call Senator Warner about being a spineless lily livered pantywaisted shill for Putin. Maybe not in that precise language, I am supposed to be a professional with words after all…
Eolirin
@YY_Sima Qian: We’re talking cognitive decline here right? Not tone?
We’re certainly not going to compare the kind of unhinged you’re meaning there with anything Trump says, right?
The question is whether he understood the question, was able to coherently respond to it without drifting off, etc.
And the press conference was even better. He’s also demonstrated the stamina to be doing multiple events a day for like two weeks.
So what more needs to be done before we can accept that he’s physically capable of doing what he needs to do?
eclare
@Mousebumples:
Before today I only had one pie, now I have seven! Much better thread experience.
wjca
From which we conclude that all that money must be from small donations. I.e. voters, and lots of them.
Hmmmmmmm, indeed.
YY_Sima Qian
@Slightly_peeved: Why, then, is the leadership of the UAW wavering? Biden has really gone to bat for the unions, & the UAW specifically.
We should keep in mind that the Biden is we see on TV is merely glimpses in the grand scheme of things, & most of them heavily managed appearances at that.
What I am saying is that it is a waste of time to argue w/ each other whether Biden is competent or not, & whether Biden has a better chance in Nov. or someone else (which depends on Biden’s competence). We are not in a real position to know, & there is unlikely to be any hard evidence available to the public any time soon to settle the debate. The far more productive actions are making the case against the Trumps & the Rs to anyone & everyone persuadable, & mobilize everyone in the Anti-Fascist coalition out to vote against the reactionaries.
All of these arguments are more fodder for “Dems in disarray”.
tam1MI
@Mousebumples: Pie filter activated.
Blood pressure lowering… :)
Thanks for the tip! :)
BR
I don’t get how it’s possible that Chris Matthews is the voice of wisdom here, but, well there it is.
Jay
@guachi:
Jump already, jump, jump, jump.
Hold you mom’s hand while you do.
tam1MI
@YY_Sima Qian:Why, then, is the leadership of the UAW wavering?
“Sources say”.
I’ve come to the point where my mind translates “sources say” as “the article is lying”.
Jay
@Eolirin:
guachi is just trying to swat a neighbor he doesn’t like, or his Mom, so he can get the inheritance,
he can’t tell the difference between us and the MaGGots,
Juju
@Geminid: I think it’s his fealty to Putin that leads to some of his deliberate ignorance about NATO, he doesn’t need to know details because he does whatever Putin wants him to do, but I also think he’s not capable of grasping the ins and outs of the minutia of what NATO does. He’s wasn’t that smart to begin with, and age and cognitive issues have set in.
Eolirin
@YY_Sima Qian: That reporting is kind of garbage, so it’s hard to draw anything from it.
Feels a lot like that MSNBC tweet that suggested Blumenthal had concerns about Biden, when the full context of the remark was concerns about the election because it was so important, and that he was 100% behind Biden. We have no idea if the options UAW are looking at are to try to get someone else or if they’re how best to organize their membership to push back on this attack line.
Unless UAW actually rescinds their endorsement there’s no story there.
Kayla Rudbek
@guachi: but I am absolutely sure that the percentage of voters who think that she’s too Black and too female is at least 40%…
VFX Lurker
Thank you for this great idea! I just did the same — an additional $81 to Biden-Harris.
Jay
@wjca:
Or like usual, the MSM “pundits” are making shit up.
YY_Sima Qian
@Eolirin: Unhinged from a policy perspective, not from a mental stability perspective. When the elder statespeople (Clinton, Obama, Pelosi, etc.) of the Dem party come out to shut down the talk of “Biden withdraw”, & get everyone to fall in line, then I take that as strong evidence that they believe Biden is competent enough to campaign & win the election. & that is good enough for me, because they are in the position to know, & I have to trust their political judgment, & basic commitment to anti-Fascism. They need to stop hedging in any manner in their answers & publicly refute MSM reporting to the contrary. Otherwise, I take that as a sign that there is indeed a concern there.
Damien
@tam1MI: Frankly, it seems to me that these stories about “some say,” “conversations are happening,” etc. etc. comes down to this, and it’s why I don’t even listen anymore:
NYT reports news MAY happen, but as of now has not.
Xavier
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: “Now that makes sense and fits nicely into my own theory on why the NYT turned on Trump too; they want to be kingmaker.”
Overly impressed with their own importance.
YY_Sima Qian
@tam1MI:
@Eolirin:
It is certainly possible that the MSM is making things up whole cloth. In that case, the UAW should come out strongly & clearly to refute the reporting, & not let it simmer. If nothing else, they owe Biden this much at least.
West of the Rockies
@Al Rennick:
Al Pendick.
Mousebumples
@eclare: makes me hungry though…
Mousebumples
@YY_Sima Qian: I don’t trust MSM – including Reuters. AFL-CIO voted unanimously yesterday to back Biden, but some media said they were wavering.
Given that Biden walked a picket line with UAW, I’m calling bullshit or taking quotes of it context.
Mousebumples
@tam1MI: you’re welcome. You seemed more on edge than usual recently, so hope it helps.
Also when I get anxious/2016 PTSD, I like to do something for Biden/Harris. Make a donation. Write a postcard. Tell a friend to Google Trump’s Project 2025. I’m going to be that pebble that starts the avalanche in favor of Biden/Harris.
Geminid
@Juju: Oh yeah, Trump can’t assimilate details about Nato like he can’t assimilste details in general. He’s basically a lazy bum. But he was given instructions on Nato by someone who contols him, and that was Vladimir Putin.
Mousebumples
👆 I 100% agree.
Mousebumples
@YY_Sima Qian: or we owe Biden to not presume the media is acting in good faith. Who you going to believe, the media or your own lying eyes?
If they’re making shit up, why should the UAW be expected to have a statement in response immediately?
Give me an on the record source, and I’ll agree with you. Otherwise, it could be someone who works near a UAW shop heard 2 people who might be union members say UAW shouldn’t back Biden.
LNNVA
@moonbat: Thank you for this.
Juju
@Fair Economist: And he’s running against Donald Trump, one of the most repugnant, offensive, vile, ignorant, incompetent, psychopaths to waste space and oxygen, on this planet. He probably also has dementia.
Aussie Sheila
@Juju:
Except he does know and did know about NATO and Putin well before he was elected. He’s lying and misdirecting. Again.
SoupCatcher
This feels like a big donor flex and multiple influence operations to get rid of Biden and Harris.
As a Californian, I’m really tired of the MOTU and their move fast and break things stupidity.
Donated $100 to the Biden/Harris campaign and will contact my rep.
Soprano2
@Juju.: Yep, that’s common with people who have dementia. Joe doesn’t have dementia.
tam1MI
Slate has the usual click-baity headline about the press conference, but actual bulk of the article was a somewhat grudging acknowledgment that Biden did a good job. I take that as a pretty good sign, they were right behind the NYT when it came to flooding the zone with “Biden Must Go” bullshit.
Eolirin
I am going to be so pissed if we lose this election because of cold meds and American stupidity.
Elie
@Elie:
Meant skiis
Juju
@Soprano2: I know. I’ve been dealing with it since mid 2019. My mother watched the press conference and asked a number of times if I knew what NATO is .
I really believe Trump is in early stage dementia. His behavior mirrors that of my mother when we were trying to figure out what was going on.
Jackie
Micro polling, but maybe an inkling of voters elsewhere?
As I said, a micro poll, but a hopeful sign in a Battleground state of WOMEN voters.
Women and minorities are going to decide the presidency. I think most support Joe.
edited to remove duplicate link.
prostratedragon
“Your Ultimate Guide to Lake Como” (youtube short)
Captain C
@Jackie:
If we analyze her blinking patterns will they turn out to be morse code for “I have to say this BS or I lose my job”?
Slightly_peeved
@YY_Sima Qian:
i don’t care.
He. Could. Not. Do. That. Press. Conference. If. He. Had. Dementia.
Barring actual footage of him actively suffering dementia symptoms, like completely losing track of what building he’s in or who Jill is, I don’t care what people’s “concerns” are. Because I have evidence, as do you.
Eolirin
@Jackie: I think this has less weight in terms of any kind of predictive power, but is hugely valuble as a turning point for the media narrative. CNN is going to have to be talking about this conference as a point of confidence boosting in Biden’s candidacy now. Other places are also talking about it as having gone well, even if begrudgingly. It’s a counterpoint to the drum beat, so it should create some space where the narrative is forced to be reevaluated.
As long as Biden continues to have good performances it’ll start pushing the debate story into the background.
He just can’t have another major slip up that reopens questions about his mental capacity.
Belafon
What Harris will face: https://x.com/SethAbramson/status/1811593108900995522
Seth Abramson (the tweeter): “If you start a new Twitter account right now, one of the first posts Elon will feed you is the one below. Those who think Biden can be replaced by someone who won’t be skewered have no understanding of the nation we’ve become since Trump. Look at the RT count of the tweet below.”
In it there’s a screenshot of a tweet from a guy named Matt Wallace. It shows a younger picture of Harris, and the text on the tweet says “Here is a picture of Kamala Harris in 1996 when she was working as a prostitute to elderly politicians in order to advance her ‘career’.”
SoupCatcher
Sent the following to my House Rep, Jimmy Panetta of the Fighting 19th.
WheatBoy56
@guachi: I agree with you that President Biden is likely to lose if he continues as our nominee. I believe that his polling numbers in the swing states are significantly worse today than they were four years ago and he is four years older with a broad consensus in the electorate that he is too old. I had hoped that he would turn in an excellent debate performance and help move those numbers in the right direction. But his appearance and actions at the debate were shockingly bad, and he did the exact thing that it was imperative for him not to do: he made his age, frailty and cognitive status the primary media focus of the campaign. If the Democratic leaders and swing-district members of the House and Senate think Harris is a better bet, that’s fine with me. For all that he’s done legislatively since being elected President, I have never seen him as ‘the indispensable man’ who should never step aside.
Jackie
@Captain C: I almost included “while blinking her eyes rapidly” in my post!😂
Slightly_peeved
@Eolirin:
not disagreeing with the general point, but the whole “What if he has another slip” thing is dumb.
he’s clearly able to act as president. He clearly has neither dementia nor Parkinson’s. If he slips, it’s just a slip. It’s not like if you make 10 slip-ups it evolves into dementia.
The goal’s not just moving, there’s a bunch of people strapped to the goal running away from Biden.
Eolirin
@Slightly_peeved: I was talking in the context of the media firestorm. It would start again. If he doesn’t give them that, it’ll stay at a low simmer
And I mean major, like the debate was. Not like calling Harris Trump or Zelenskyy Putin accidentally.
Jackie
@Slightly_peeved: 👍🏻
Slightly_peeved
@Eolirin:
the debate one is also dumb, because someone who was actually sundowning wouldn’t get better as the debate went on. But assuming that, yes, the media will start making more shit up if he does it again.
Eolirin
@Slightly_peeved: I have commented at length how dumb everything about this is, so no argument from me there.
Just looking at the media dynamic.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
We were talking about that last night, sample size of three.
Cheap ass discount garbage pollsFast Moving, real time measurement Polls.Enhanced Voting Techniques
Looks over at Elon Musk there.
Yep.
Belafon
@WheatBoy56: And this is what drives us here absolutely nuts. One debate performance by a man that has not only done pretty darn well at his job, but has shown the first 20 minutes to be an anomaly. Especially when you compare it to Trump, which has shown that he will be at least as bad the second time around as the first.
“Oh, but you shouldn’t compare Biden to Trump.” No, we’re in an election. That’s exactly what you’re supposed to do.
Jackie
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: I missed that discussion – probably due to pie overload. Once the thread has more pie and pastries than posts, I bail.
Eolirin
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: That’s not a poll, that’s a focus group. Very different things.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
Well, consider this; look at the awesome ideas being toss around here as a fix. Are the rich that different from us? Looks pretty constant with what we are seeing here, just done by people with more money so they get listened too.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@Eolirin: Yes, it had seven people, instead of just three people polled, like the so called “serious” ones.
Eolirin
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: What makes it different is that it’s not collecting data about a population, it’s collecting specific people’s thoughts about an event. Where they can be asked questions before during and after the event. They serve completely different purposes.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@Jackie: Executive summery: polls now are every penny paid for them.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@Eolirin: Actually, this particular case, you are correct, that focus group is useful, assuming the people in the group are actually what they claiming they are, and not just bunch of interns ordered to stand there and look serious for the camera.
Geminid
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: We don’t know about the big donors who are standing with Biden. And I saw that at least one of the people described as a big donor wasn’t a Biden donor, or even a big donor to other candidates, but a middling donor. Evidently, they knew a reporter who wanted a scoop.
Eolirin
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: I mean, sure, I’m assuming they’re being set up and run correctly here. I doubt CNN would be having their interns faking this stuff and going pro Biden with it though.
Sally
@Central Planning: Ha, me too. I have abbreviated all three of my sons’ names into one. None of them ever answers anyway !!
Eolirin
@Geminid: Man, if it’s just “Big donors” without any specific reference to which party they donate to that can be a neat trick.
Top political donor Peter Thiel thinks Biden should step down!
Enhanced Voting Techniques
ROFL, the reporter made it up? I am shocked to learn of this.
And yes, I was considering that, but thank you for pointing this out, because a lot of people here need to learn how to be more patient and skeptical about the news these days.
Still, I can easily see the big donors pestering the Dems with their fears and the Dems having to patiently go through it with them.
Eolirin
We do know that George Clooney is one of these donors, as he’s both called for Biden to step down and proposed a truly stupid way to replace him.
So there’s at least one.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
I know, what is true in this age of bullshit? But I do hope focus group you have mentioned is right. Hmm come to think of it, likely, they have to do this a lot to see what their audience likes.
Sally
@Geminid: I agree that it is fealty to Putin, but I don’t agree trump knows how NATO works, or anything else about it for that matter.
different-church-lady
@guachi: So, repetition is kind of your thing, huh?
Gretchen
@guachi: Ok, since you’re doing all that thinking, what happens after Biden drops out? Who has better polling against Trump? Name names. Does this person have universal name recognition? Average voters don’t know who JB Pritzger, Gretchen Whitmer, Josh Shapiro are. How will they pay for the campaign? Can they get on all the ballots while the Heritage Foundation is already preparing to challenge anyone but Biden? Please, tell us how this plan works. Everyone else has the Underpants Gnome explanation: ditch Biden-???-Victory! Political plans based on a cartoon probably won’t work.
Gretchen
@WheatBoy56: Bill Clinton was coming in third, after Bush and Perot, at this point in the race, and the party considered swapping him out. Good thing they didn’t, isn’t it?
Geminid
@Sally: If Trump had known more about Nato he might have done a better job undermining it. He tried, but this is one area where McConnell and other Republican Senators joined with Democrats to block him. I’m thinking here of Trump’s attempt to draw down US forces in Germany in his final months. Congress acted quickly to prohibit that.
This is one area where Trump is at odds with a section of his party. There are Republicans and conservative Independents who see Nato and support for Ukraine as highly important. They provided a lot of the energy for Nikki Haley’s campaign.
Many have reverted to Trump, but some see these as paramount issues and will defect. There may not be many, but these are otherwise reliable Republican voters and Trump can’t afford to lose many voters at all.
LanceThruster
@Chris Johnson:
Assange spent years confined and tortured with nary a mention by the supposed champions of press freedom, while the late Daniel Ellsberg supported him understanding the significance of the actions against him particularly in the message it sends to others.
As far as the danger to those doing actual reporting, we bankroll the ones killing them.
NaijaGal
Interesting article with some nuance: ageism is making it impossible to fairly judge Joe Biden.
Odie Hugh Manatee
@LanceThruster:
I enjoy the fact that Assange imprisoned himself for all those years…lol! I guess he showed everyone!
Fuck Russia and fuck you.
mrmoshpotato
I can’t watch this yet. However…
“Go fuck yourselves, you Dump-humping piles of shit. He’ll shoot you in the head first. You assholes who think I’m too OOOOOoOzozooozozozLLlLLLlLDFDDDD! Enjoy your families’ early retirement – in death.”
brantl
@Sally: Like you get to pick, and choose? Biden wins in the orimaries, in 2020 were directly due to the breadth of his experience, policy positions, and competence.
brantl
@BenInNM: i am off. For sick leave, would people like me to figure out a kit of electronic parts for Dark Brandon signs? I’m brantlamb1 at gmail dot com.
For people that have porch cameras they could prosecute vandals in time for the election, too, :)
Citizen Dave
@NaijaGal: Excellent piece–thank you!
Barry
@Archon: “This “Biden must drop out” the past couple weeks have felt like a giant conspiracy to me and I’m not prone to conspiracy theories.”
It is. The rich people fear a Dem President. Their managers get the hint. The reporters get the hint, or the sack (those who are just not plain evil).
brantl
@Percysowner: So Joe’s 130, now?
brantl
@Al Rennick: That either needs more commas, ir he’s telling Joe to quit?
Bill Arnold
@LanceThruster:
Assange was/is not press; his (literal, written) philosophy was to leak everything, without any redactions to protect innocents from mortal threats. For USA politics leaks, the releases were timed carefully to do the most damage to people he personally disliked, like Hillary Clinton, as a favor to certain others.
I despise him. (There is a personal element to that, BTW.)
E.g. his efforts to elect [now convicted felon] Donald J. Trump mean that he is responsible in part for hundreds of millions of human deaths in the fullness of time, due to reversals in global heating mitigation that the USA led while DJT was POTUS.