Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Nothing says ‘pro-life’ like letting children go hungry.

Pessimism assures that nothing of any importance will change.

… pundit janitors mopping up after the gop

I’m just a talker, trying to find a channel!

If you tweet it in all caps, that makes it true!

Everyone is in a bubble, but some bubbles model reality far better than others!

Relentless negativity is not a sign that you are more realistic.

The rest of the comments were smacking Boebert like she was a piñata.

You come for women, you’re gonna get your ass kicked.

There are more Russians standing up to Putin than Republicans.

A snarling mass of vitriolic jackals

The worst democrat is better than the best republican.

The lights are all blinking red.

Imperialist aggressors must be defeated, or the whole world loses.

Donald Jessica Trump found guilty as fuck – May 30, 2024!

Let’s delete this post and never speak of this again.

Republicans don’t lie to be believed, they lie to be repeated.

I am pretty sure Katy Tur wasn’t always such a bootlicking sycophant.

At some point, the ability to learn is a factor of character, not IQ.

It’s all just conspiracy shit beamed down from the mothership.

Just because you believe it, that doesn’t make it true.

Republicans choose power over democracy, every day.

There are consequences to being an arrogant, sullen prick.

You don’t get to peddle hatred on saturday and offer condolences on sunday.

You are here: Home / John Cole Presents "This Fucking Old House" / Sunday Night Open Thread

Reader Interactions

279Comments

  2. 2.

    NeenerNeener

    It looks like all the women gymnasts are wearing leotards covered in glitter. I wonder how much time they spend cleaning up the shed glitter between events.

  3. 3.

    NaijaGal

    On the Win With Black Women call for Kamala Harris. Organizing coalition call tomorrow.

    P.S. Sorry that it’s off topic but I couldn’t see where else to put it.

  4. 4.

    Martin

    I liked the opening ceremony. Yeah it rained, that sucked. They went for a very large stage, which is ambitious and it struggled at times, but credit for the ambition. But I liked that they went for it on everything else. I know we just had a debate on how political violence is never justified and then the French enter the chat and remind you on the worlds largest stage that they cut off the heads of their political leaders and they’re really fucking proud of it.

  5. 5.

    sixthdoctor

    Oh HELL YES!

    BREAKING: Mark Hamill has announced he will join the White Dudes for Kamala call. Let’s go.
    — Kamala’s Wins (@harris_wins) July 29, 2024

  11. 11.

    Trivia Man

    Steph Curry is an ass and a poor winner. No reason at all to scramble for a loose ball and launch a wild 3 (it went in! cause he is awesome, that is not the issue) with 5 seconds left on a 20 point blowout. Too bad it isnt baseball because next at bat he would 100% deserve the bean ball.

  14. 14.

    Trivia Man

    That French swimmer in the IM medley is awesome. So happy for him to do that in front of his home crowd.

     

    (I assume spoiler blackout is lifted because it has aired ‘plausibly live’ on NBC? Hint for those trying to avoid spoilers, if you find a poster has spoiled something, just PIE them and you won’t see any future scores from them.

  15. 15.

    Trivia Man

    @raven: Why? Is that good sportsmanship? I saw your reply in that dead thread and I can’t figure out why you say bullshit.

  16. 16.

    Eyeroller

    I didn’t watch any of the opening ceremonies or any such thing, but I saw some pictures of the “drag show” boat and read the whining of the oppressed and insulted Christians, and though I do understand how profoundly ignorant they are of well, just about everything, I still marveled at how they arrived at “Last Supper.”  Is every group around a table a Last Supper depiction?  Jesus was blue and covered with grapevines?  A seder would feature a huge pile of extravagant foods?  I didn’t immediately recognize it as a festival of Dionysus but it was pretty obviously some classical reference.

    But apparently they’ve apologized.

  17. 17.

    Trivia Man

    @Eyeroller: And the outraged I SAW A TESTICLE crowd owes them an apology. Zooming in we see it was not a dangling oyster but rather a run in his stocking that got bigger in each subsequent picture.

  19. 19.

    Trivia Man

    Overall I greatly enjoyed most of that opening montage. I am a purist who thinks less of pre-recorded bits posing as live but I accept sometimes it is necessary for flow. Using so many historic locations was beautiful. As was the nods to so many different aspects of French culture and history. I didn’t see it all so I assume I missed a bit on french wine, or maybe that was considered part of the sumptuous feast. I also learned the blue guy is a well known funny french singer so they were totally expecting something like that. Maybe the French Weird Al?

    I also enjoyed the library bit.

  21. 21.

    Flanders Other Neighbor

    A few weeks ago I got back from a Berkeley – Sturgeon Bay, WI – Berkeley tour via motorcycle to visit my aging father who ended up in the hospital/nursing care due to another lost battle with gravity.  This country is so big and has so much incredible beauty that it’s hard to convey just how beautiful.  And everywhere I went, people were generally very nice.  I stayed in Mankato MN on the way return trip, and this Walz fella, if he was really VP material, surely would have done something about the mosquitos.  Must be the area flooding they are experiencing – I didn’t notice them anywhere but MN, and to the point where I’d get gas helmet on and shield down.  Thank dog I live out west where it’s dry.  Not a fan of the mozzies or humidity.

  25. 25.

    Lapassionara

    @Martin: I’m so glad you liked it too. I thought it was great, actually. I was not great at picking up all the references, but I didnt think that was the program’s problem. It was my lack of knowledge. I thought using the bridges for the different acts of the drama were very clever. And the boats, like the duo playing “Imagine” on a barge made of what? inner tubes? And the flaming piano? seriously, I could watch it again from beginning to end and still be entranced.

  26. 26.

    UncleEbeneezer

    He Confirmed Russia Meddled in 2016 to Help Trump. Now, He’s Speaking Out
    IT WAS THE summer of 2016 when a manager at the Central Intelligence Agency pulled him into a conference room, sat him down at a table, and asked him to read the intelligence they had brought.

    Van Landingham wasn’t naive about what the Kremlin was capable of. His work as an intelligence analyst for the CIA had given him a front row seat to the destruction that Russia’s spy services had wrought in places like Syria and Ukraine.

    But this wasn’t about what Russia was doing in some far away country.

    Inside a room wrapped in a vault in the bowels of the Central Intelligence Agency’s headquarters, he read the intelligence showing that Moscow was trying to disrupt the 2016 U.S. presidential election.

    “I think for the first time in my professional life, I felt physically ill reading something,” he says.

    That was only the beginning of a long, strange journey that would place van Landingham right at the center of the 2016 campaign’s biggest story. Months later, the Agency assigned him the job of writing the first draft of the intelligence community’s 2017 assessment about Russian election meddling that concluded what many had suspected: Vladimir Putin did it. And he did it to help Donald Trump.

  28. 28.

    planetjanet

    I am having a bit of a pout.  I have tickets for part of the women’s rugby for tomorrow, but can’t go.  Long story, but my mother became ill and I decided I could not travel.  I put them up for resale last week, but they did not sell.  The resale platform cancels unsold tickets 12 hours before the event.  If I knew someone who could use them, I would just transfer them.

  29. 29.

    BR

    Someone needs to get Joe to call uncle Bernie and tell him to STFU and that he needs to retire himself just like Joe did. He’s going to be saying stupid things that do not help from now until election day unless someone gives him a stern talking to.

  30. 30.

    Geminid

    @BR: I wonder if Bernie Sanders matters anymore. Sanders certainly doesn’t matter like he thinks he does.

  31. 31.

    KatKapCC

    @BR: Anything specific behind this? I’ve been avoiding the news for a couple of days just to let my brain rest.

  32. 32.

    EmbraceYourInnerCrone

    Cats and Dogs Unite for Harris Zoom call on Tuesday 30 July at 830 pm Eastern

    Cats and Dogs Unite for Harris Zoom

    Co-sponsors: DemCast USA, The Democratic Coalition, Field Team Six, Network NOVA, Volunteer Blue, Women for Harris and the Women of Color Coalition.

    I don t know how many people showed up for today’s Veterans and Military families for Harris Zoom as I had family commitments and couldn’t attend. I hope it was well attended. Hope everyone had a good day. Got to see my toddler granddaughter and show her the beach. Amazing day.

  33. 33.

    Quinerly

    @BR: has he done something today?

    I was getting pretty fed up with Bernie last week…especially Thurs and Fri. I thought he had settled down and endorsed Harris.

  34. 34.

    NaijaGal

    @KatKapCC: I loved that bit as well. He also said “ethnicity itself is not enough – we would not be gathering in this way let’s say for Usha Vance or Nikki Haley.”  He talks about the joyful way in which the conversation has changed with Kamala’s candidacy and that joy is evident in all the calls I’ve seen.

  36. 36.

    twbrandt

    I’d love to be on the white dudes for Kamala call tomorrow, but I have a conflict and can’t make it. I’ll donate in any case.

  38. 38.

    Slightly_peeved

    @Trivia Man:

    points difference matters in case of equal win/loss numbers, so running up the score is reasonable and expected. Also, not kicking the ass of the other professional team is a weird American conceit that doesn’t appear that often in real world championships.

    I’m pretty sure that if a US team offered to go easy on an Australian team the response would be, “alternatively, how about you go fuck yourselves?”

  43. 43.

    Quinerly

    @KatKapCC: the key to this is getting under Trump’s skin. I think calling him and Vance weird, strange, odd will turn out to be a good strategy. You are right about calling him a criminal and dangerous. He thinks that’s cool. Plus, he expects that line of attack.

  44. 44.

    Ohio Mom

    @Eyeroller: The Passover Seder borrowed from Greco-Roman banquets — participants reclining on pillows, a set sequence of small plates and dips, stories and songs, philosophical discussions, and drinking (four cups of wine at the Seder).

    But the Seder as we know it did not exist in Biblical times — there were no Four Questions in Jesus’s time. It was not developed until around two hundred years later.

    I didn’t see the Opening Ceremony but it sounds like a hoot. Easily offended people are going to be easily offended.

  45. 45.

    BR

    @KatKapCC: ​
    Bernie went on MSNBC talking about how most of the working class supports Republicans. He’s been doing this forever, because it supports his talking point that Democrats have sold the working class out. He means white male working class just like GOPers do, but he, like them, doesn’t say it out loud. But he was good about it with Biden as the nominee and didn’t do it much, but gave up any pretense that he’s on the same team with Harris almost immediately.

  46. 46.

    Trivia Man

    @Archon: That does explain it, I stand corrected. I am not always opposed to running up a score, teams should not stop trying on either side. I do think it is poor sportsmanship to do things like go for two in football when you have a 6 score lead in the 4th quarter (but sometimes it is a deserved insult). This was a much more helpful reply than “bullshit”. I suspect it will not matter in advancing to the next round but I now understand why they would do it.

  48. 48.

    Chet Murthy

    @BR: I’m glad he endorsed Harris, and will refrain from bitching about the [nono, I’m not gonna go there, he endorsed Harris] [grrrr, still angry for Hillary]

  50. 50.

    KatKapCC

    @Ohio Mom:

    But the Seder as we know it did not exist in Biblical times — there were no Four Questions in Jesus’s time.

    There was a good post from a Jewish shop owner/content creator about the abomination of “Christian seders” and how offensive the whole concept is for numerous reasons. But she also noted that when these Christians try to claim that they’re just “getting in touch with the Jewish roots of Christianity” or whatever, even putting aside the moral wrongness of that notion, it’s also just factually stupid, since Jesus never would have had a seder that looks anything like the ones we have today. And she added that if they really want to connect with Jesus, they should go outside and sacrifice a goat, because that would be more accurate.

  51. 51.

    KatKapCC

    @BR: Ugh. He has never ever ever been willing to do even the tiniest amount of self-education regarding race. He’s been a one-note pony his whole life and I don’t understand why people aren’t tired of it yet.

  52. 52.

    Quinerly

    @BR: I saw the interview. Not helpful. Pretty sure it was Fri. He has now since endorsed.

    Now if someone will stick a sock in Carville’s mouth I will be happy. He’s knocking the enthusiasm for Harris.

  54. 54.

    Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    @BR:

    I wonder how Sanders would react if somebody called him on that:

    “Y’know, Bernie, you do realize that white guys aren’t the entire working class, right? How do you explain black men and women being the backbone of the Democratic Party? Remember them? You couldn’t win their trust both times you ran in the primaries.”

  58. 58.

    Suzanne

    @KatKapCC: I think people are tired of it. Bernie has a cadre of diehards, but they’re not numerous at all. There is a horseshoe left, and they are annoying, but they also have zero influence. The progressive wing of the party is better represented by AOC, Warren, Lee, Jayapal, etc., IMO.

  61. 61.

    BR

    @karen marie: ​
    I remember Warren saying Bernie told her flat out that a woman can’t win. Warren doesn’t make stuff up like that, so I believe her. He probably saw it as a cold fact and not a product of his upbringing.

    Anyway, there’s a whole old guard that needs to retire — lots of great talent in the subsequent generations.

  64. 64.

    FastEdD

    @Lapassionara: I really wanted to see the flaming piano completely burn up at the end of the song and fall apart into the river. That would have been cool.

  67. 67.

    Maxim

    I saw a video several years back — must have been during the 2016 campaign — that included several clips of Bernie being a jerk to women. It’s been beyond me for ages what anyone but incels sees in him.

  68. 68.

    3Sice

    Oh boy. Steve Kornwacky.

    NBC’s celebritzation of everything on the prime time broadcast is…. something.

  71. 71.

    Chacal Charles Calthrop

    @NeenerNeener: it’s not glitter, it’s a whole lot of Swarovski crystals very carefully sewn or heat laminated into very expensive leotards:https://www.marieclaire.com/fashion/team-usa-olympic-gymnastics-leotards-swarovski-crystals

     

    @Sister Golden Bear: I remember an explanation of the Covid virus that went something like this: in a preschool, a dozen kids are sitting around a table, making projects, showing them off to each other, and sharing supplies. One of the projects involves glitter. How many of the projects are going to have traces of glitter? The Covid virus is like this glitter.

  72. 72.

    Suzanne

    @Maxim: I think, for a while, he was really the only outspoken progressive in a high-profile elected role. So he got positive attention from the people who have similar politics; he was the only plausible standard-bearer. But the progressives have many more and better people in government roles now. So I think his influence is diluted.

    Fun fact: Pittsburgh is represented in Congress by Summer Lee. The city also elected its first black mayor, Ed Gainey, who is also progressive. The progressive wing does not need old white guys speaking for it.

  73. 73.

    frosty

    @Flanders Other Neighbor: …surely would have done something about the mosquitos. Must be the area flooding they are experiencing – I didn’t notice them anywhere but MN,…

    It’s not just MN. We went through Michigan UP, Wisconsin, and Minnesota in mid-June. I’ve never been swarmed by skeeters the way I was at our campsite in Wisconsin. The locals said it was the worst they’d seen. Apparently last winter was a little too mild to kill them all off.​
     

    ETA Oops, this is an Olympics thread. Carry on.

  75. 75.

    Jess

    I’m watching the Simone Biles documentary on Netflix. It’s really good. You really get a sense of her as a person and how hard she works. She is such a heroic person.

  77. 77.

    Jess

    @frosty: I grew up in Wisconsin. Yeah, the skeeters were an issue… that was the price for living by Lake Wingra and its lagoons in Madison. Such a great neighborhood.

  78. 78.

    Villago Delenda Est

    @BR: ​
     He’s wholly invested in the MSM’s utterly bogus “economic anxiety” narrative when the actual answer is racism, sexism, and xenophobia.

  82. 82.

    Chacal Charles Calthrop

    @KatKapCC: she’s a really beautiful woman, isn’t she? In addition to her ability to do incredible feats far above the ground.

  86. 86.

    Maxim

    @Suzanne: I think Bernie did help move the Overton window, and I give him credit for that. He’s a good gadfly on his narrow band of issues. But he would make an absolutely terrible president, and would have even when he was younger.

  87. 87.

    KatKapCC

    @Chacal Charles Calthrop: She is! And I love seeing her experiencing joy. Especially after all the cruelty she’s endured after stepping back during Tokyo. She’s not letting that crap get to her and it’s wonderful.

  88. 88.

    Villago Delenda Est

    @Maxim: His aspirations I can relate to and support.  It’s his utter inability to do the actual work required to bring them to fruition.

  89. 89.

    Villago Delenda Est

    @3Sice: Just love that guy.  He’ll make for a great speaker in the tradition of Nancy Smash come January.

  90. 90.

    tam1MI

    I watched the Qualifying Rounds for Womens Gymnastics today.  It just wouldn’t be Olympic gymnastics unless Simone Biles scared the hell out of everybody and so it was that while warming up for her floor exercise she injured her calf.  But she powered straight through it and led her team into the Finals in first place.  Brazil showed itself as a team to watch with the only athlete that looks fair to challenge Biles in Rebeca Andrade.  France had a heartbreaker day, falling apart at the seams at the worst possible time.  They failed to qualify for Teams, All Around, or Individual Events.  Ouch.

  91. 91.

    Bupalos

    @Chet Murthy: seems to me Bernie and the Progs made some kind of deal with Biden to prop him up. Maybe the court reform plank? And now they’re kinda left holding a bag o nuthin.

    it was pretty weird they were the only dems doing the “Biden will be the nominee now stop talking about it” thing. I mean the only elected Dems- obviously a good half or 3/4ths of the commenters here were too.

  92. 92.

    lamh47

    @Quinerly: Carville along with his lackey Ari Melber was running that bullshit “dont’ be so elated” last week.

    I posted Symone Sanders Townsend response to him.

    Basically “weren’t you the one who said Biden was not excited.  that the Dems needed someone to root for.  Don’t be jealous the one YOU wanted isn’t the one that was chosen”

    and that’s truly ALL the reason why Carville is harping on that bullshit.

    He wanted to get rid of Joe and replace him with HIS chosen candidate.  But Joe put a wrench in that plan by endorsing Harris at the same time he announced his stepping back from relection.

  94. 94.

    Chet Murthy

    @Bupalos: wut?  It was the other way around.  A bunch of other candidates withdrew before/after the SC primary, endorsing Biden, which is what led to him beating Bernie.  He got basically the entire not-Bernie lane endorsement.  What you’re remembering is that Bernie endorsed Biden earlier in the process than he’d done with Hillary, and the speculation was that he did so b/c the two had a personal relationship.  Two old fart guys, getting along.  Sexism, in short.

  95. 95.

    HumboldtBlue

    This is Hindenburg territory at this point.

    Ohio Sen. JD Vance’s national introduction as former President Donald Trump’s running mate has been less than ideal.

    Vance, known for his best-selling memoir, “Hillbilly Elegy,” was elected to office less than two years ago. Many Republicans have long viewed him as a future face of the party, given his Midwestern background and his appeal to many MAGA adherents.

    But on the heels of a CNN analysis that showed Vance was the least-liked non-incumbent vice-presidential nominee in at least 44 years, the network also revealed that the GOP lawmaker has a double-digit unfavorable rating with voters across the Midwest.

    According to CNN, Vance had a 28% favorable rating and a 44% unfavorable rating — or a minus 16-point favorability rating — among voters surveyed in Illinois, Indiana, Michigan, Ohio, and Wisconsin in July.

    For Republicans banking on Vance to help boost the party across the Midwest, his standing is far below where he’ll need to be in order to win over swing voters in key states like Michigan and Wisconsin.

    CNN data reporter Harry Enten during an appearance last week also pointed to data showing that Vance had a minus 5-point favorability rating after the Republican National Convention in Milwaukee.

    “The people who know him best, the region that knows him best, they like him even less than America likes him,” he told the network’s Erin Burnett.

     

  96. 96.

    BR

    @lamh47:

    I have to be honest that a decade ago I never thought that ex-GOPer Morning Joe and perennial DC insider Mika would be all on board for Harris and Ari Melber and Keith Olbermann’s ex would not be.

  97. 97.

    Ken

    @BR: Hah, and more stories about how Graham and others tried to get Trump to pick someone other than Vance:

    One of Colbert’s recent shows had a clip (warning: TFG) showing why that was never going to happen: TFG saying “he liked me maybe more than anybody liked me.

    There’s also this, quoted by Humboldt Blue above: “Vance had a 28% favorable rating and a 44% unfavorable rating — or a minus 16-point favorability rating”.  If you think of that as Trump picking someone who wouldn’t be more popular than him….

    (Aw, who are we kidding? Thiel’s check cleared, that’s the only reason Vance is on the ticket.)

  98. 98.

    Suzanne

    @Maxim: Agree. I just think the amount of attention he gets here and elsewhere is really weird. Like, who cares what he thinks about anything? Especially because the progressive wing is much less problematic in terms of their votes than the right side of our coalition. (Manchin, Sinema, this stink-eye is for you…..got elected with party resources and then defect. Get bent.)

  99. 99.

    lamh47

    @tam1MI: OMG…RIGHT!

    Today was not a great day for any teams it seems.  Like jeez…the US came out on top cause of the fact they had higher difficulty in their perspective aparatus, but not sure is ANYONE had a perfect routine…I guess JC came close (if I did feel bad for anyone it was her.  she was like .01 or somthing like that off from making the all around because they only allow 2 per country, which I don’t think that’s fair, but oh well).

    Some teams def had it worse than others, some did ok.

  100. 100.

    Villago Delenda Est

    @HumboldtBlue: ​
     In other late breaking news, Emperor Hirohito address the Japanese people and admits that the war is not going in Japan’s favor.

  101. 101.

    Villago Delenda Est

    @Ken: (Aw, who are we kidding? Thiel’s check cleared, that’s the only reason Vance is on the ticket.)

    DING DING DING DING DING!

  102. 102.

    Bupalos

    @Chet Murthy: Not talking about 2020, I mean two weeks ago. AOC and Bernie and a couple Progs were the only ones saying “it’s over, Biden will be the nominee” as the rest of the party was still escalating and refusing to say he would be the nominee, only that he was currently the nominee.

    Then Biden came out for SC reform which he’s specifically and pretty forcefully rejected in the past.
    I think that was horse trading.

    now Bernie is maybe mad or maybe angling for Kamala to make that a major plank.

  103. 103.

    Jay

    @Villago Delenda Est:

    Here in the High Country, we have Timberline mosquito’s. They can lay eggs in a drop of water, can mass in millions, and most people react very badly to their bites, our friend Vicki, got bit by one once, on her cheek, and her entire face swole up to the point she couldn’t see.

    Only time I never went fishing. High alpine lake, still in the tree line. Parked the truck, got out , swatted mosquitoes, climbed into my waders, swatted mosquitoes, strung my rod, swatted mosquitoes, put my flippers on, swatted mosquitoes, grabbed my belly boat, swatted mosquitoes, started walking the 20 years to the water, swatted mosquitoes, got 5 yards in and I guess the word had gotten out,……… walked back to the truck, swatted mosquitoes, put my rod away, swatted mosquitoes, put my belly boat away, swatted mosquitoes, took my flippers off, swatted mosquitoes, climbed into the truck in my waders, swatted mosquitoes, started the truck, swatted mosquitoes,  drove down to the nearest town with a grocery store, cleaned their shelves of Bite Stop. When I got home, and got my clothes off, it looked like I had the worst case of chicken pox ever, if chicken pox spots were golfball sized and angry red.

    I was itchy for a week, everywhere.

  104. 104.

    BR

    @Suzanne: ​
    I think the reason I care about what Bernie says is because Manchin and Sinema don’t stump for Dems. Bernie does, but does it in a weird passive aggressive way that is sometimes counterproductive.

    But TBH, I’m pretty much done with Bernie pro or con. I feel this wind that is a changing of the guard happening right now, and I’m all about it in a way I didn’t expect to be.

  105. 105.

    3Sice

    @lamh47:

    I get the prime time show is a highlights reel, but NBC is skipping over building any competition drama and just cramming in maximum celebrity bull.

  106. 106.

    Chet Murthy

    @Bupalos: -Biden- is still pushing for SCOTUS reform.  I would think that Harris isn’t going to deviate from such a major Biden position.

  107. 107.

    Chet Murthy

    @BR:

    I feel this wind that is a changing of the guard happening right now, and I’m all about it in a way I didn’t expect to be.

    I have to say, I’m beginning to agree with this sentiment.  100% in detail.  I was a hard-core Biden Remainer, and I’m starting to feel more than OK with the changeover to Harris.

    ETA: I was either “Harris then Warren” or “Warren then Harris” in 2020.  So I was always happy with Harris as the candidate.  I just didn’t think the Dems could pull it off without massive, massive, massive chaos.  Happy to be wrong about that.

  108. 108.

    SomeRandomGuy

    @Martin: re: French pride in executions, honestly, *IF* there’s going to be a death penalty, then I don’t see why a political leader should be exempt. So, that’s one argument for no death penalty, I guess.

    The people of Flint MI were deliberately poisoned. I can’t say any person deserves to face the death penalty for that, but, that’s *another* argument for no death penalty.

    I do say that there should be a list of people who should be in jail, all the way up the chain of command, unless they show they did all they could to sound the alarm. If we don’t have that list, if we don’t have the specific laws needed to prosecute such a deliberate causing of harm, WTF are we waiting for? We can’t say we didn’t have fair warning that the laws were needed.

    This *is* a time when you can be like a raging right-winger: “No election exceptions for CRIME!”

    I’m not sure if you’d want to be like a raging right winger, but, then, I’m some weirdo you met on the internet. Don’t think for a moment I forgot that, and thought we met in that coffee shop on the east side of Philadelphia, during the Legionnaire’s outbreak, our eyes linking from across the  room, with every sense suddenly becoming electrified, and the song – you REMEMBER the song, because it became YOUR song, and you needed it to be OURS.

    No, we met on the internet. Don’t forget that cover story. Because it never happened, that thing that would need a cover story, if it happened.

    Which it totally didn’t.

  112. 112.

    tam1MI

    @lamh47:OMG…RIGHT!

    Today was not a great day for any teams it seems.

    France’s team was especially painful to watch.  They were considered to be hot contenders for Silver coming in to this and to just completely wash out the way they did…

  113. 113.

    BR

    @Doc Sardonic: ​
    I meant Melber and Tur. A decade ago I would have never guessed that they’d be in line to replace Andrea Mitchell’s concern trolly bothsides-ism but they seem to be.

  114. 114.

    Chet Murthy

    @SomeRandomGuy: I have always been angered by the way that leaders can escape command responsibility, both in government and -especially- in business.  The CEO should be responsible for what his company does.  If he didn’t know, he should have known.

  116. 116.

    thruppence

    I’m excited to be on the call tomorrow night, but they’re also promoting “White Dudes” ball caps and … take some of those donations and hire some graphic designers. We’ve got the majority of creatives, right? We need something to show for it.

  117. 117.

    SomeRandomGuy

    @Jay: OMG that sounds like hell on earth.

    It also prompts my “I had itchies too” discussion, and if you don’t think a few flea bites can make you feel like you want the bus to run you over, RIGHT NOW, even though you’re in your cubicle – never mind.

    Sometimes – be very careful! – a lot of heat can end an itch for a while. When my home had fleas, I used a mug of hot coffee to “burn” a ring around my bitten ankles. Professionals will note that I picked something with a small surface area, so the burn didn’t jolt me too much; and, of course, if it’s too hot now, wait a minute or two. (Seriously: use a timer, if you need the heat!)

    I guess that wouldn’t have helped you, Jay – unless you found a hot tub was hot enough, and I’m betting the new fangled ones wouldn’t be.

    I also tested, and heard, If you have intact skin, capsaicin might work, as a counter-irritant. It’s the same principle as the heat – overload the pain sensors to the point they wear out for a bit. Capsaicin overloaded *my* pain sensors, before it beat the itch, but, it was a *really* bad day, and you *do not* want hot flashes with capsaicin on your skin. Well, I didn’t, and it does seem like it would be an unusual taste, one kinda hard to acquire.

  118. 118.

    Soprano2

    @Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): I think Bernie is stuck in the 1980’s when it comes to his conception of the working class. Does he talk about Reagan Democrats? I heard someone say that a few days ago and thought “Aren’t most of them dead now?” I wish someone would challenge him on who he thinks the working class is now.

  119. 119.

    thruppence

    I’m excited to be on the call tomorrow night, but they’re also hawking “White Dudes” ball caps and … take some of those donations and hire some graphic designers. All for memorabilia, but make it memorable.

  122. 122.

    Geoduck

    @Ken: Maybe the Post story covers this, but there are reports that the Shaitgibbon was leaning towards Burgum right up until the last minute and only got talked around to Vance by his sons.

  123. 123.

    divF

    @Chacal Charles Calthrop: I once spent a spring visiting the University of Minnesota in Minneapolis. I came back to my apartment one evening and turned on the TV just as the local weather report came on (yes, this was a long time ago – 1985). The weatherman reported three items: (1) it was May 17, the Norwegian National Holiday, so in honor of that he gave the weather report for Norway; (2) Walleye season had just opened, to disappointing results – only the governor had caught the limit; and (3) mosquito hatching (which proceeds west to east) had reached the center of the state, and would probably reach Minneapolis by early next week.

  124. 124.

    hueyplong

    @Geoduck: Hard to imagine a worse thing for Vance than a bunch of stories trying to pick people to throw under the bus for picking him.

    Because it has to remain a coincidence that Dear Leader is something like 0 for 98 in hiring choices.

  125. 125.

    Martin

    @SomeRandomGuy: I think the argument that political violence is never justified is bullshit. I think in our current environment it’s not justifiable, but I’m not about to say that the 20 July plot to kill Hitler wasn’t justified.

    Political violence is supposed to be the threat that backstops democracy. Embrace and defend democracy because when the people determine that their agency has been taken, they will take justice into their own hands. America kind of buries that – we defend democracy because the founders said it was important, not because of the resulting bloodshed. France is like – we’ll make beheading politicians part of our national identity just to make sure nobody forgets the stakes here.

    It’s why I say that it’s not contradictory to oppose the death penalty and say that fascists get the wall. And I think that’s a better distinction than what we use in this country. Don’t kill people for committing crimes, kill them for destroying the system. Because we know if you let them come back and try again, they will.

  127. 127.

    Kent

    @BR:But TBH, I’m pretty much done with Bernie pro or con. I feel this wind that is a changing of the guard happening right now, and I’m all about it in a way I didn’t expect to be.

    I never really cared that much about Bernie one way or the other.

    It was his followers that I couldn’t stand.

  129. 129.

    Kent

    @Geoduck:@Ken: Maybe the Post story covers this, but there are reports that the Shaitgibbon was leaning towards Burgum right up until the last minute and only got talked around to Vance by his sons.

    I was actually expecting him to pick Nikki Haley.

    It would have been a real Trump “power move” to get her to bend the knee and kiss the ring so to speak.

  130. 130.

    Kent

    @Soprano2:

    @Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): I think Bernie is stuck in the 1980’s when it comes to his conception of the working class. Does he talk about Reagan Democrats? I heard someone say that a few days ago and thought “Aren’t most of them dead now?” I wish someone would challenge him on who he thinks the working class is now.

    A “Reagan Democrat” who was 35 in 1980 would be 80 today.

    Most of the Reagan Democrats were older than 35.  They had to be old enough to be Democrats first and then eventually switch to Reagan when they got older and more “economically anxious” (i.e. bigoted)

  132. 132.

    Maxim

    @Suzanne: Bernie is very good at being an irritant, so I’m not too surprised that folks sometimes get irritated. But I don’t think about him unless someone else brings him up.

  136. 136.

    Jay

    @Kent:

    the problem is that Nikki Haley is apparently a female, and we know how 34 Felonies (so far) Rapist Pedo guy feels about women.

    He didn’t even have to pick her to have her bend the knee.

    I love how her election PAC is all in on MVP Kamala Harris and told Nikki Haley to take a hike when she tried to move the money over to Shit For Brains.

  137. 137.

    ColoradoGuy

    My thought on the Paris Olympics Marie Antoinette segment was that it was a hell of a warning to the billionaires of today. Push the 99.99% far enough, and that is what could happen to you.

    It’s not like the economy needs them, and if they persist in their hobby of trying to create a worldwide techno-feudal society, the resentment will only grow.

  141. 141.

    hitchhiker

    @rikyrah: thanks for that.

    I heard someone this morning talking about a similarity between Obama and Harris — saying that both of them are the children of black men who were not from the USA, and suggesting that this placed them in a unique position.

    I’m white, so wtf do I know, but it made sense to me, especially when this person mentioned that both of them found ways to put themselves into a more standard black experience. Obama joined that congregational church in Chicago. Harris went to Howard University and joined the most prominent sorority when she got there.

    This guy’s point (sorry, his name went by before I even knew what I was listening to) was that for both of them, those choices mattered precisely because they were choices. They may not have grown up with the expected black experience, but they sort of staked their claim in that culture by occupying those spaces.

    Anyway, I had to pause over all that because it felt true. And it connects to this tiktok dude describing the way whole herds of people now sense an openness about the Harris campaign that was there with Obama but not with HRC. Something about the way they are in the world feels like an invitation: you can be part of whatever you want to be part of.

  142. 142.

    Chet Murthy

    @hitchhiker: I think it was here that I read somebody citing Obama, who apparently said that if he were going to run for President, it would be early in his career (e.g 2008) and not much later, b/c he didn’t want to give the Rs a chance to define him, to accumulate a long history they could use against him.  He wanted to be new and fresh, so they’d have trouble pigeonholing him.  And this somebody observed that thru the luck (oof) of this process of Biden withdrawing, and the singular focus on Biden during his campaign and term in office, Harris had been mostly ignored, so they didn’t have that head-start on defining her unfairly that they often get with long-standing Dem pols.  It was a mistake the Rs made, but maybe  it’ll be our luck.

    Dunno if this is true or not.  It was interesting to think about.

  143. 143.

    Chet Murthy

    @Martin: Martin, re: political violence, have you seen this?

    https://archive.is/WqUeM

    The Cynic And The Two Nations

    It’s been twenty years since then–state senator Obama assured us there was not a liberal America and a conservative America. In that time, a new country has been building with fearful momentum. Can anything be done to stop it?

    Charlie Pierce’s ruminations on the divide in our country.

  145. 145.

    NotMax

    @Doc Sardonic

    FWIW, at the end of the Soundtrack thread fixed the link you pointed out was the wrong one. Thanks for the alert, BYW.

    Five hour nap that overtook me this afternoon delayed a more timely correction.

  147. 147.

    AWJ

    Also on the topic of political violence, in the Venezuela election Maduro is unsurprisingly doing a Lukashenko.

  148. 148.

    Citizen Alan

    @Kent:  At one point, I was such a Bernie stan, I was literally in the parking lot of my polling place trying to decide who to vote for in the 2016 Dem primary (I voted for Hillary). Within 3 weeks, I was cursing his name for how he was hanging on despite the mathematical impossibility of him winning and for the fact that he surrounded himself with people like Sirota and Nina Turner and Brie whatsername who were clearly in it to damage the Democratic Party. I will never forgive him for packing his convention delegates with Green supporters who consistently booed our nominee every time her name was mentioned.

  149. 149.

    prostratedragon

    @Eyeroller:  That amazed me too. Gives some heft to the rag on them being cultural blockheads. Were the organizers I might have provided a polite explanation of what was intended, but in no way apologized because, you know, it was NOT the Last Supper or meant to be.

  150. 150.

    opiejeanne

    @NeenerNeener: Someone else will probably answer this before I do, but that’s not glitter on the leotards, it’s either rhinestones or beads. Probably beads. Probably Swarovski. I sewed several hundred onto a skater’s dress when I lived near SF. The skater brought me one of Kristi Yamaguchi’s costumes and wanted a copy, which I wouldn’t do, but I gave her something just as nice of our own design, sat down with her and we drew it out together. Stretch velvet is an awesome medium, and matching stretch fine nylon mesh is equally good. Midnight blue for all of it, Aurora Borealis beads from Swarovski. I wish I had a photo of her wearing it when it was finished.

  154. 154.

    JWR

    @UncleEbeneezer:

    He Confirmed Russia Meddled in 2016 to Help Trump. Now, He’s Speaking Out

    Back in 2016, at one of those noisy stadium rallies, I seem to remember an interview with Don Jr. during which he’s asked something about Russia, and he replies that “Hell yeah, we’ve got a sh*t-ton of money pouring in from Russia, or similar, but he seemed quite proud of the fact. Does anyone remember that, or is it just my imagination?

    ETA edited for clarity.

  156. 156.

    John Revolta

    @JWR:

    President Trump’s son, Eric, once told a golf writer that funding for Trump golf courses come from Russia, that writer recounted in a new interview.

    James Dodson during an interview Friday with Boston’s WBUR described meeting Donald Trump in 2014 and being invited to play golf at the Trump National Golf Club Charlotte.

    He said asked Donald Trump how he was paying for his courses, and the now-president “sort of tossed off that he had access to $100 million,” Dodson said in the interview.

    Dodson said he then questioned Eric Trump, who was along for the day.

    {mosads}”I said, ‘Eric, who’s funding? I know no banks — because of the recession, the Great Recession — have touched a golf course. You know, no one’s funding any kind of golf construction. It’s dead in the water the last four or five years,’”  the writers told WBUR.

    “And this is what he said. He said, ‘Well, we don’t rely on American banks. We have all the funding we need out of Russia.’ I said, ‘Really?’ And he said, ‘Oh, yeah. We’ve got some guys that really, really love golf, and they’re really invested in our programs. We just go there all the time.’”

    https://thehill.com/homenews/news/332270-eric-trump-in-2014-we-dont-rely-on-american-banks-we-have-all-the-funding-we/

  159. 159.

    Martin

    @Chet Murthy: Yeah, that’s where I am.

    I don’t see any reconciliation between the two groups possible. My view is that demographics will inevitably choke out the white christian nationalists to the point that their ability to wield power democratically is simply unfeasible nationally. They’ll retreat to states, and then to counties.

    But I don’t think they’ll go so quietly. They’ve ruled the nation for 400 years since the first settlements here, genocided countless peoples, launched a civil war, maintained apartheid. It’s not going to be so easy as just counting to 270 and taking the W, as we saw on Jan 6.

    I don’t know if we are accelerating to the conflict or delaying it. I don’t know if Trump is a true agent of those forces or just using them to get out of trouble. If the former, his “you won’t need to vote again” means he’s got plans to rework the electorate in some way. If the latter, we probably just kick the can down the road 4 years and see if he goes for the 3rd term.

    But either way, I don’t see how we avoid the conflict. At some point their democratic path gets cut off and they’ll pick violence of some form. I can’t envision a path that avoids that.

  160. 160.

    piratedan

    @Martin: me either so it has to be a long slow war of attrition to where the rules get followed until they break them and then we jail and prosecute them.

    First step is to 1) fix the SCOTUS and then 2) tax the fuck out of them

    also be nice if we actually enforced the laws about political churches, that would remove the cannon fodder from being used to spread stochatic terrorism so easily.  Perhaps make the FBI pay fucking attention to these people.

  161. 161.

    JWR

    @John Revolta:
    @Jay:

    So it was Eric, and I wasn’t imagining it at all? Thank you, you’ve set my mind ill at ease! ;) But I could have sworn it was at a rally, in a stadium, and both Q and A were shouted. So no one remembers Don Jr. saying, or shouting, something similar? Yeah, I’m sure he did. It’s a very Trumpian thing about which to brag.

  162. 162.

    Jay

    @JWR:

    It was just the first result of a quick google search, I am sure that all the Family has boasted at times about ruZZian money and not needing banks, other than Deutch Bank to launder the funds.

     

    cough, cough, cough Kennedy Father and Son.

  163. 163.

    Martin

    @piratedan: I don’t think it’s going to be slow. White christians are declining nearly 1% per year. It’s shockingly fast.

    Now, they can bolster their numbers by recruiting other groups – Jews, Latinos, etc. and that may work. Losing women really undercuts that though.

    Right now they believe they still have an electoral path with Trump. Soon they won’t. Not sure how they respond to that, but I don’t think they’ll take it well.

  164. 164.

    Jackie

    @KatKapCC:

    I want all elected Dems to keep calling Trump et al weird

    It’s kinda funny that Dubya was the first to use “weird” pertaining to TCFG’s inauguration speech. “That was some weird shit.”

  165. 165.

    Anne Laurie

    @Chacal Charles Calthrop: I was told one can identify the Michigan mosquito by the two-inch white spot between its eyes.

    After my first summer in Michigan, I totally believed that!

    Not to mention the old joke:  Guy gets captured by two Michigan mosquitos who fly away with him.  One asks the other Should we eat him now, or save him for later?  His friend says Better eat him here — if we take him home, the *big* guys will take him away from us!

  167. 167.

    raven

    @Trivia Man: Because he’s a baller and every point counts in the Olympic basketball competition.

     

    Rank
    Team
    Record
    Point Differential

    1.
    USA
    1-0
    +26

    2.
    South Sudan
    1-0
    +11

    3.
    Puerto Rico
    0-1
    -11

    4.
    Serbia
    0-1
    -26

  171. 171.

    Baud

    @raven:

    Except soccer is a low scoring sport.  I think hockey does it as well, but it’s also a low scoring sport.

    ETA: I guess if you have four teams in a round robin, you have to break ties somehow.

  173. 173.

    WereBear

    @Cheryl from Maryland: It was all fun and games until they got “professional” and actually had a platform.

    Recent events make me feel we don’t have a floor setting on Trump… but the current Trump ticket does have a ceiling.

    And they might have hit it this week. No bump from a Convention AND an assassination attempt? When someone died and two more are still in bad shape?

    Trump isn’t fun anymore. He’s also not seen as that super-businessman from the reality show… which is how he squeaked out a win with a lot — a LOT — of cheating and interference.

    But J6 galvanized his FLOOR. He’s never broken out that “not enough to win” and it took the Electoral College.

    Hang that around his neck, and we might get right of THAT, too. It forces us to pander to the least useful ideas and attitudes, diluting our own message of hope and truth.

  174. 174.

    WereBear

    @Liminal Owl: What amazes me about rugby players is how many of them go commando.

    It’s a local sport with tournaments: someone at the paper has to go on “weenie watch” but it does happen 🤣

  176. 176.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    Apparently the Red Hats are trying to convince themselves it was a white liberal woman with a handgun that took a shot at Trump.  And apparently they are also upset that the LGTBs hate the Red Hats just because the Red Hats want to kill the LGTBs.  “Weirdos” is about right.

  177. 177.

    Baud

    I guess Geminid is watching Turkey’s women’s volleyball team go to the fifth set against the Netherlands.

  178. 178.

    What Have The Romans Ever Done for Us?

    @Chacal Charles Calthrop: They make that same joke about Maine and Michigan (I grew up in Michigan) in addition to MN, and probably WI too. It’s an international phenomenon – or at least I can confirm from personal experience that the situation is just as bad in Ontario. Pretty much the entire Northern tier of States that border Canada from MN East all have the same summer mosquito problem.

  180. 180.

    Geminid

    @Baud: Volleyball also.

    Speaking of which, the group stage in the women’s volleyball competition began this morning. Turkiye’s Sultans of the Net won their match against the Netherlands, 3-2. Ed. Turkiye is led by Melissa Vargas. The 24 year old “opposite” was born in Cienfuego, Cuba.

    Three pools of 4 teams each play a round robin, with the top 2 in each advancing to the knockout round. The two top 3rd place teams will also advance. Their point differential could determine their status.

  181. 181.

    What Have The Romans Ever Done for Us?

    @Bupalos: It’s just that Biden is an old white dude whose always talked about lunch pail working class Joe stuff his entire career. So they see him as a fellow traveler.

  182. 182.

    Soprano2

    @Martin: They think they can make the US be like pre-Mandela South Africa, where white people are in charge of everything even though they’re a minority of the population. They can see what’s happening with demographics and are trying to head out off now.

  183. 183.

    raven

    @Baud: uh, I think I know that. The point still stands, the dude has a bee in his bonnet about Steph and I ain’t buying it.

  184. 184.

    Liminal Owl

    @karen marie: There were reports that women on his staff complained about sexual harassment from menin the group, and he told them to STFU.

  186. 186.

    Geminid

    @Baud: I would like to but I have to rely of reports. No TV, no streaming, I’ll probably check out YouTube after they play Italy next Sunday.  Italy is ranked #1 in international play while Turkiye is #3. The Sultans of the Net held the top spot for most of last year.

  187. 187.

    Princess

    @What Have The Romans Ever Done for Us?: I think Sanders was a boring grumpy lonely anti-social dude among the senators who also smells bad (according to a woman I know who did some work with him) and Biden is that nice guy who talks in the lunchroom to that person every other kid hates. I think it’s as simple as that.

  191. 191.

    Liminal Owl

    @Sister Golden Bear: Probably the same way I know. Years ago, I bought several glittery items of clothing.  I was working part-time; the coworker who had my office on alternate days complained to management about glitter on the rug.

    (I assumed the leotards were bedazzled with Swarovski crystals rather than glitter.  Prettier, and far more durable.)

  192. 192.

    Princess

    @Baud: Yeah, no knocks on Harris but we’re going to have a much harder time getting bills passed, even assuming we win all three houses. Which in my darker moments I assume is the reason the right of the party (Warner, Carville, Schiff etc) all dove in to knife Biden with such glee. Why yes, I am still bitter.

  193. 193.

    Barbara

    @HumboldtBlue: I’d like to know what sources they consulted when they considered Vance to be an asset in the Midwest. The locus of his adult life has been the Bay Area — and it is well-known that he underperformed in Ohio relative to other statewide Republican candidates. His wife and kids have never even moved to Ohio.

  195. 195.

    Geminid

    @Baud: It sounds like an exciting match. Turkiye was down 0-2 but won sets 3 and 4 and then the last one 15-13.

  196. 196.

    Barry

    @Kent: ”

    I was actually expecting him to pick Nikki Haley.

    It would have been a real Trump “power move” to get her to bend the knee and kiss the ring so to speak.l

     

    IMHO, she was his opponent in what was supposed to be a smooth ride of a coronation.

  197. 197.

    What Have The Romans Ever Done for Us?

    @Baud: Yeah point differential is a thing but is the US team really worried about needing point differential to advance from the group stage? Minor sportsmanship infraction from Curry but he’s teammates with Draymond Green so probably a little rubbed off.

  198. 198.

    Barbara

    @Geminid: Women’s volleyball is awesome.  The men’s game can be entertaining as well but at the highest levels it can suffer from the need to serve aggressively, with too many points coming from service errors.  Last time around I watched a men’s game where the Americans practically gave the game away with service errors.

  200. 200.

    Jay

    @Barry: She kissed the ring with out ever being considered for the VP slot, she tried to sue her own PAC, because her PAC went all in for MVP Kamala Harris.

  202. 202.

    What Have The Romans Ever Done for Us?

    @Baud: IDK about international basketball but in college basketball the convention is to just dribble the ball and not try to score in that situation because it’s considered poor sportsmanship. But it may be different here.

  203. 203.

    Ken

    @Baud: Biden’s strength is working with people, especially in Congress. Kamala will likely be a downgrade in that front, as anyone else would.

    On the other hand, she’ll be the first President to try out the new “it’s an official act” superpowers that the Supreme Court found hidden in a previously-unsuspected part of the Constitution,

  206. 206.

    Geminid

    @Barry: Many hard core Trump followers hate Nikki Haley. One reason: she’s an Internationalist, and not “America First.”

  207. 207.

    Matt McIrvin

    @Martin: There was no nonviolent way out of the Ancien Régime, which was a living nightmare. However, it’s also sobering to remember that it was something like seventy years from the Revolution to a stable democratic republic, and in the meantime they had a tyrannical revolutionary government that slaughtered many of its own, multiple restorations of the monarchy, several additional revolutions, and two periods of Empire one of which involved a pan-European war of conquest. It’s a hard road. The United States’ experience of violent revolution was actually relatively gentle, and we had our own spasm of violent refactoring eighty-odd years later.

  209. 209.

    Raven

    @Baud: They don’t, just wins. In college football “style points ” are taken into account in the rankings.

  211. 211.

    Matt McIrvin

    @Ken:

    On the other hand, she’ll be the first President to try out the new “it’s an official act” superpowers that the Supreme Court found hidden in a previously-unsuspected part of the Constitution,

    People keep dreaming about Democrats exploiting this ruling but really, it’s useless unless you’re a complete thug. What they said is “if you’re the President and you commit crimes under official cover, you personally cannot be prosecuted for them”. But they didn’t immunize anyone who’s working for you, and they didn’t make these acts actually legal. Promising to abuse power seems like a loser with our support base too.

  212. 212.

    Gvg

    @Villago Delenda Est: Economic anxiety can make people vulnerable  to being manipulated into blaming the wrong causes, such as racism, etc. It’s called scapegoating. Leaders have used it on peons for thousands of years and it doesn’t even have to be invoked. It seems to happen by itself pretty easily. I think people just don’t accept that sometimes they are powerless and just things can just happen. That the economy of the US cannot be perfect for them all the time forever no matter who they elect. Minorities have had more realities slapped into them, but even they have some who want simple answers too much.

  213. 213.

    hueyplong

    @Trivia Man: That’s a lot of anger over someone launching a shot that took the overall FG attempts in the game from 139 to 140.  They call it “garbage time” for a reason.  If you want a reason to be upset, maybe it should be over the fact that an asset as valuable as Curry was on the floor during the last minute of a game that was in hand.

  216. 216.

    hueyplong

    @Matt McIrvin: … along with an eat-your-own during and after being occupied by the Prussians.  The path wasn’t a delicate one and, as you say, it’s difficult to see how it could have been.  Even the stable republic had its periods of dangerous polarization, such as the seemingly endless Dreyfus period and then the 1930s, when their version of Trumpers literally sloganed “Better Hitler than Blum,” a grotesque position I would call a “watch what you ask for” except that they really did prefer it, well into the Occupation.

    I get extra nervous every time le Pen gets close to winning office.  Thankfully, so do a majority of the voting French.  We Americans could have taken a cue from them in 2016, but we didn’t.  Think of those “I’d Rather Be a Russian Than a Democrat” t-shirts for more than a second and you hear echos of “Better Hitler Than Blum.”  And even the French Right didn’t think of “Real Men Wear Diapers.”

  218. 218.

    lowtechcyclist

    @Matt McIrvin: ​
     

    People keep dreaming about Democrats exploiting this ruling but really, it’s useless unless you’re a complete thug. What they said is “if you’re the President and you commit crimes under official cover, you personally cannot be prosecuted for them”. But they didn’t immunize anyone who’s working for you, and they didn’t make these acts actually legal. Promising to abuse power seems like a loser with our support base too.

    I wouldn’t expect Harris to use this power at all, but there are non-thuggish ways to use it. Congress refuses to appropriate money for X, Y, and Z? The President could just have her Administration spend that money anyway (and ignore the debt limit if it comes into play), and pre-emptively pardon everyone involved in the doing of it. Official act, all the way!

    I would love it if a Dem President used this new immunity in a manner like this, just once, to illustrate how the Supreme Court’s decision has undercut democracy, how we (for now) as a result vote for kings, and how this decision must be undone to restore democracy.

  219. 219.

    Layer8Problem

    @Baud:  Harris gets elected, some challenge to the election for Reasons will work its way up to the Supreme Court, where we’ll find out the Constitution has no provision for some girly-girl female woman winning the Presidency, because, duh, guys were what they were talking about.  And none of that Abigail Adams stuff about “remembering the ladies”.

  220. 220.

    TBone

    @lowtechcyclist: Dark Brandon might be outta fucks to give and use this new power for good things.  We’ll see…if he does, I hope he uses it against the Supremacists Court.

  222. 222.

    TBone

    Off to the beach at the lake in the mountains with a delicious picnic basket, floppy sun hat, bucket for picking huckleberries on the way, and money for the lady who sells honey on a back country road on the mountain.  Play nice today, kids!

  223. 223.

    BellyCat

    @Martin:But either way, I don’t see how we avoid the conflict. At some point their democratic path gets cut off and they’ll pick violence of some form. I can’t envision a path that avoids that.

    Optimistically, the X-tian fundies could simply age out, with insufficient numbers among their offspring (who have not rejected fundamentalism) to carry the torches.

  225. 225.

    Layer8Problem

    @Baud:  This is why god invented Unitary Executive Theory, so we could get this sort of outside the envelope solution to our problems.

  226. 226.

    WereBear

    @BellyCat: Optimistically, the X-tian fundies could simply age out, with insufficient numbers among their offspring (who have not rejected fundamentalism) to carry the torches.

     

    The Evangelicals are not retaining their young.

  227. 227.

    Kay

    Sahil Kapur

    @sahilkapur

    19

    Pete Buttigieg goes on Fox News Sunday and says Trump is lying when he disavows a national abortion ban if elected president. “He’s disavowed a lot of things. I don’t believe him because he lies all the time.” Buttigieg predicts it’d be a broken promise.

    Sahil Kapur

    @sahilkapur

    The debate around a “national abortion ban” needs to include a key nuance. There’s zero chance Congress fully outlaws abortion. The open question is federal restrictions that override states — like 20 or 15 weeks — which Republicans routinely attempt when they have majorities.

    This is incorrect and is becoming one of the problems with the poor quality national media coverage of reproductive rights – they are not well informed. They haven’t covered the issue so haven’t given it any thought. It is now 100% certain that Republicans could effectively ban abortion with any one of a number of executive orders – that is the POINT, that is what Roe protected. Roe is now GONE – executive orders banning abortion are now absolutely ON the table.
    They could inform themselves if they would be willing to read (the women) who have been researching and writing on this for two years, but those women don’t work for the NYTimes and aren’t published on that platform, so they don’t.
    I can’t believe they’re doing this again – women who are experts on the issue are telling them this and they are ignoring it. Again.

  228. 228.

    Anyway

    @TBone: Have fun at the lake-beach!

    Do you know who’s behind the anti-Shapiro ad that’s going around? Calls him out by name — he isn’t running for anything, right? Is this a preemptive strike against a VP nom – that sounds too inside-baseball

  229. 229.

    Matt McIrvin

    @BellyCat: I think that it’s going to be nearly impossible to avoid another period of Republican trifecta in the next decade or two, and when that happens we could have the successful self-coup and transition to a dictatorship to forestall further demographic rot in their support. If it doesn’t happen in 2024, it’ll be in 2028 or 2032. We can win some elections but we can’t win them forever. People will get tired of the Democrats because they always do sooner or later, and a lot of them imagine strongman rule wouldn’t be so bad. The right-wing minority could get less bad but I don’t see the mechanism.

  230. 230.

    Layer8Problem

    @WereBear:

    “The Evangelicals are not retaining their young.”

    Well, raising the age of majority to 35 should solve that.  It’s probably in Project 2025 somewhere.

  231. 231.

    Kay

    I mean, whether media like Pete Buttigieg or not they should be familiar enough with him now to know he’s not on Fox News saying things that are incorrect. They may disagree with him on reproductive rights but I don’t think there is a single time they have caught him not doing his homework before he speaks. This is not what he’s known for- poor preparation or ignorance on a subject he chooses to raise. Find a softer target for this “actually…” nonsense.

  232. 232.

    Shalimar

    @What Have The Romans Ever Done for Us?: If you don’t know about international basketball, why are you commenting on the etiquette?  Curry is considered one of the classiest people in sports.  It seems pretty silly to criticize him for continuing to play hard when he didn’t have to.

  233. 233.

    hueyplong

    @Kay: “Ignore” is an awfully polite way to say they’re deliberately making sure their platform isn’t used to get that word out.

    It’s up to the Dems to really highlight Dobbs and its effects at the convention and then throughout the campaign in a way that tests the border that separates “ignoring” from “suppressing” in what used to be our flagship media.  It’s both the right thing to do and the most politically effective.  If the issue “worked” in Kansas, it should work in all those swing states we were supposed to be losing.

  234. 234.

    3Sice

    Post-game, LeBron noted that there is a whole lot of FIBA and IOC experience on the team. Know the rules and don’t eliminate yourselves seem like coaching points of emphasis that would come from Steve Kerr.

  236. 236.

    Kay

    @hueyplong:

    I worked on the Ohio referendum and this is a conflation/comparison I don’t agree with:

     If the issue “worked” in Kansas, it should work in all those swing states we were supposed to be losing.

    But otherwise agree. We were able to effectively educate women on reproductive rights and restrictions for the referendums. Whether that “works” for a national Presidential candidate (if by works you mean elects her) is not shown by Kansas or Ohio.
    But agree that we can educate women on the real risks of a nationwide ban in any state, including swing states and that may help VP Harris and (to a greater extent) our Congressional candidates.

  237. 237.

    BellyCat

    @Matt McIrvin:  You are right about a possible GOP trifecta in the future. Whether the evangelicals can maintain their hold on the party by such time is an open question.

    But a smarter, subtler, more palatable fundie for President ( such as Mike Johnson) in the near future seems more likely, and almost equally dangerous, than a trifecta.

  238. 238.

    hueyplong

    @Kay: Yes, it’s picking an issue to prioritize in her campaign rather than a vote on the issue as a standalone topic, and success in the latter doesn’t mean success in the former, but it certainly points toward leaning on it, and educating on a winning topic is only a bad thing when the topic has been kind of fraudulently used (see, immigration).

  239. 239.

    Kay

    @hueyplong:

    The Ohio reproductive rights constitutional amendment passed by 58%

    Do you think VP Harris will carry Ohio? It’s just not apples/apples.

  240. 240.

    Trivia Man

    @raven: you tried to shout me down, twice, with the single word Bullshit. A two word response Point Differential would have been much more helpful.

    In a normal game doing that would have been considered poor sportsmanship. Add that to the well earned reputation the US bball team has for hubris and cockiness and it set me on edge.

    I stand corrected in this case. I still hope south sudan gets revenge for that squeaker last week but i assume they will get beat by 40.

  241. 241.

    Anyway

    @Kay: I wish Harris and other Ds would point out that these bans restrict the care that doctors and hospitals are able to provide to women. It’s more than just “control over your bodies”.

  242. 242.

    Kay

    @hueyplong:

    Agreed. I just think we were losing swing states and we are now tied up in swing states so I wouldn’t attribute that to reproductive rights. That’s our basic disagreement/different frame of reference.

    I think ordinary women have been essential to the success of the referendums – women sort of outside the politics space. I have an Instagram account for gardening and travel and I started seeing ordinary women producing pro choice content immediately after Roe was overturned, so much so that there was a counter effort by professional anti choice orgs who put up very clearly professionally produced anti choice content. I would get both because of the IG feed. Just fascinating to watch.

  243. 243.

    Trivia Man

    @hueyplong: that’s part of my reaction. He was limping a few minutes earlier and then makes a risky dangerous (to him) play for the sake of… 3 more points towards an unlikely tie breaker.

  244. 244.

    Baud

    Biden rolls out plan to overhaul the Supreme Court

    President Joe Biden unveiled a set of reform proposals to overhaul the Supreme Court including term limits for justices and a more binding ethics code.
    Biden is also calling for a constitutional amendment declaring that presidents do not have immunity from criminal prosecution for any crimes committed while in office, following the Supreme Court’s July ruling granting Donald Trump immunity for “official acts” he committed as president.
    With just under six months of his presidency left, Biden said that overhauling the Supreme Court will be a priority.

  245. 245.

    hueyplong

    @Kay: No, I don’t think she will win Ohio, and I didn’t say she would or, at least, I didn’t mean to imply that. (I’m not always articulate.)  I thought I applied it only to the swing states, where a 58% (in Ohio) edge on a “forefront” issue seems like a really good thing and one that ought to carry the day if it is emphasized in such a tossup state.

    I’m trying to agree with you and hope I get there.

  246. 246.

    Kay

    @Anyway:

    I thik Harris’ broad message is perfect. The top of the ticket shouldn’t be the policy details person. Hence- surrogates like Mayor Pete who take it one step further in specificity. We do not need to drag them to the information. We need a clear, bold statement at the top and they’ll fill in the details by reading, asking people they trust, thinking it over, etc. When we were organizing for the Ohio referendum we did not do legal seminars at doors. What we did is say plainly why we were there and listen to the women who answered. They took it from there.

  248. 248.

    hueyplong

    @Trivia Man: I attended an absurd percentage of Curry’s college games and I can assure you there weren’t many in which he didn’t limp at one point or another.  Steve Kerr has been there in person for a heck of a lot more Curry games than I have.

    Your concern should have been shared by Kerr as a standard late-game benching move, but a temporary Curry limp is best kind of ignored or else, as Auntie Em said, you’ll worry yourself into anemia.

  252. 252.

    Kay

    Sometimes the Right really helps you because they have so many grifters/solo flyers trying to make a name for themselves in far Right circles and they’re sort of dumb and not polished.

    We heard about the attacks on the physician who assisted the 10 year old girl who was raped in Ohio a lot on doors in Ohio. They heard about that on Fox news. Gross overreach. Women, even Right leaning women, were just appalled that they set far Right law enforcement on the physician. I think every woman in the country thought either “that could be my ten year old girl” or “that could be me” (the physician who blew the whistle).

  253. 253.

    hueyplong

    @Kay: I’m sorry to say that it’s really looking like the Dems shot their messenger and even sorrier to say that their messenger was in fact the problem.  I was a Biden dead-ender (fear of chaos) but I think the polling bump is pretty much purely the switch from 24/7 sleazed Biden to fresh/younger/likeable/unslimed (so far) Harris.

    The question is what puts Harris out front instead of merely tied/caught up, and we agree that Dobbs should be at the forefront because it’s important and because it’s (happily) a winner.

  254. 254.

    TBone

    @Anyway: the pro-vouchers Super PAC billionaires here in PA are vicious (Yass and Greenberg).  Spreading half truths and some outright lies, of course.  Even Jay-Z is in on it now.

    https://whyy.org/articles/jeff-yass-the-richest-man-in-pa-is-single-handedly-keeping-school-choice-pacs-flush/

    https://whyy.org/articles/jayz-pennsylvania-legislature-private-school-vouchers-jeff-yass/

    Governor Shapiro has unequivocally stated that school choice is only viable if it does not include taking public funds away from public schools.  Shapiro has had to fight like hell to get a Budget passed despite the rethug-controlled legislature.

    There is a long backstory regarding the recent Commonwealth Court ruling that our PA school funding system is unconstitutional as well.  Rethugs are refusing to honor the ruling using weasel word language.

    Thanks for everyone’s well wishes, picnic basket is packed, bathing suit donned, and off we go for a glorious day at the lake in the mountains!

  255. 255.

    Soprano2

    @Gvg: I think people just don’t accept that sometimes they are powerless and just things can just happen. That the economy of the US cannot be perfect for them all the time forever no matter who they elect.

    I think this applies to the people who say they’re voting for TCFG because of inflation. I think they honestly believe that he can roll prices back to 2019 levels somehow. They can’t accept that inflation during/after Covid was a worldwide phenomenon that the U.S. recovered from better than pretty much any other country. If TCFG is elected (*shudder*) these same people will probably tell pollsters they’re better off and things are cheaper even if they aren’t!

  257. 257.

    Kay

    @hueyplong:

    During the Ohio referendum I wrote here that I thought it would mitigate some of the alarm among women in Ohio because we protected abortion rights. That’s a terrible thing to say -that from a cold political analysis we needed to not address it until 24 – but it’s also true. Ideally we would have put it on the ballot in ’24 to drive turnout for Sherrod. I think the test will be Florida and that won’t show in polling because the pro choice issue will drive turnout for us. But she’s have to be w/in 1 or 2 or something in FL for that to “work”.

    I was pro Harris replacement and she is better than I anticpated as a candidate. She deserves credit for this – she’s talented. All of the other factors – an exhausted electorate who were desperate for some joy, peoples real concerns about Biden’s decline, wouldn’t matter unless Kamala Harris was a political talent. She is. That piece is necessary if not sufficient.

  259. 259.

    Soprano2

    @Kay:  I can’t believe they’re doing this again – women who are experts on the issue are telling them this and they are ignoring it. Again.

    I can, because it’s just those icky women who are saying it, what do they know. *rolleyes* Women were telling them for decades that Roe was at risk, and they pooh-poohed that too. Now, women are telling them that the exceptions are irrelevant because they never seem to apply, and that TCFG could issue an executive order banning abortion pills under the Comstock Act and basically ban abortion nationwide for most women. That’s just one reason this election is so important. I wish Democrats would start campaigning on repealing the Comstock Act if they have both the House and Senate, because that weapon needs to be taken out of the Republican’s arsenal.

  260. 260.

    hueyplong

    @Kay: Yes on Harris.  She was my first choice in 2020.  I’ve always been a fan.

    I see the calculation in waiting for 2024 to protect reproductive rights in Ohio, but there should be at least a small bump in 2024 from having a track record of doing something good in 2022.  Gotta start somewhere when trying to build an allegiance that wasn’t there before.  Maybe what you all did two years ago was the first step in a conversion process.  I mean, Ohio is a tough sell, but it’s not quite West Virginia.

  261. 261.

    Another Scott

    @Baud: I saw an NPR story about that.  Decent common sense proposals.  Buried down near the bottom it said:

    The proposals are a long shot because a constitutional amendment or congressional action — two routes that would likely be needed — are next to impossible in the current political climate.

    The framing, the framing!! Nobody has agency! Folks in the opposition in Congress are all innocent bystanders! It’s all “the political climate”!!1

    Grr… :-/

    Changes are needed. People can argue about the details (I continue to think that 18 years is too long, and that we need 15 Justices), but changes must be made because the lying, unelected, unaccountable reactionaries on the SCOTUS have decided to grab as much power as they can for themselves. The transition will be messy, unless Democrats have 12+ years of huge majorities in the House and Senate (which would be amazing, and is something we should work to realize), but that mustn’t deter us.

    Forward!!

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  262. 262.

    Soprano2

    I listened to the Maher show right after the debate this weekend. He’s been saying for months now that Biden should step aside. Predictably, though he and the panel (Tulsi Gabbard and some other man, I can’t remember his name) weren’t enthusiastic about Harris at all, in fact they seemed to completely dismiss her as a factor. That’s not surprising to me, because Maher wouldn’t be happy about any woman at the top of the ticket.

  263. 263.

    Kay

    @Soprano2:

    Your one sentence recitation is perfect.

    We did doors in Ohio where the woman who answered the door would just hold up her hand after we told her why we there and say “where do I sign, what do I do”. I love those women. They’re busy and they don’t want to waste our time either. Ya know, decisive people :)

  265. 265.

    Kay

    @Soprano2:

    He’s so full of shit how he sets up these stacked panels. He thought Tulsi Gabbard was on the fence? Please.

    Just a complete phony. He also loves the sound of his own voice. When he speaks you can hear him listening to himself and just loving it. True of Donald Trump and Newt Gingrich too. It’s not an attractive trait.

  266. 266.

    Kay

    @Soprano2:

    Such a set up. He’s made it so he’s the only liberal on his show. And he’s not a liberal. The whole fucking premise is dishonest. He did that because he’s incapable of listening to liberals who might know more than him. He has to be the smartest.

  267. 267.

    Soprano2

    @Geminid: Oh yeah, but Maher pushed back on her some. She said that Hillary did exactly the same thing TCFG did in denying election results, he pushed back on that hard and basically called her ridiculous. That’s the problem with him, he’s not always wrong. He did a segment at the end lecturing young men who complain they can’t get dates about how to change that, and I found I was mostly agreeing with him – take a shower and clean up, wear nice decent clothes, get a hobby that doesn’t involve dragons, that kind of thing. LOL

  268. 268.

    Peale

    @Soprano2: Honestly, I’ve decided that those ghouls who post up photos of what gas prices were like the last month of Trump and what they are under Biden just won’t come out and admit that they are ghouls and would gladly live with 20% unemployment and starvation on a massive scale if they could drive their gas guzzlers cheaply.  They did the same for Obama. Both times in the last 30 years when gas prices fell like that, tens of millions of people were suddenly out of work.  They seem to want that. It makes them happy.

  269. 269.

    Soprano2

    @Kay: Oh I agree, although I guess he had Pete on last week and got eviscerated. I haven’t listened to that one yet. He claims to be a truthteller who isn’t afraid to be challenged, yet he rarely has on anyone who would disagree with him about Democrats being too “woke” or that the TERF’s can be terrible people. He also thinks young people should still be laughing at his old jokes.

  270. 270.

    Soprano2

    @Peale: I ask them, when they post pics of gas prices under $2 when TCFG was president, if they also want the pandemic back, because that’s what would cause prices to drop like that. Strangely enough I never get a response.

    I noticed more “price drop” signs in WalMart this week. They’re there, but people don’t seem to see them.

  271. 271.

    bluefoot

    @KatKapCC: ​
      People aren’t tired of it because Bernie affirms that white people and their interests and concerns are the most important. Some people will respond to that, consciously or no.

  272. 272.

    bluefoot

    @Chacal Charles Calthrop: ​
      I was wondering how they get the crystals to stay. On the subject of leotards, I LOVE the Brazilian women’s gymnastic leotards.

    BTW: Your analogy of COVID as glitter is excellent and I am going to have to share it with my siblings who are schoolteachers.

  274. 274.

    Villago Delenda Est

    @Soprano2: The inflation of the COVID period was driven by market forces and insatiable corporate greed, not necessarily in that order.

  277. 277.

    Ruckus

    @UncleEbeneezer:

    Well if you were a foreign power and trying to ruin or at least disrupt your major opponent wouldn’t you want them to “elect” a leader that had zero concept of helping one soul on earth other than himself, and who has the mental ability of a stack of pancakes? A rather short stack….

  278. 278.

    Ruckus

    @BR:

    You think uncle bernie would understand what STFU would actually mean and why someone might tell him that?

  279. 279.

    satisfiedguy43

    @Trivia Man: isn’t it strategy? in case of tie, points against are counted. this build up might be useful if they loose a future game.

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