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You are here: Home / Elections 2024 / Veepstakes Open Thread: Tim Walz

Veepstakes Open Thread: Tim Walz

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It is seriously awesome that we Democrats have such a deep bench of potential vice-presidential candidates. (As always in such discussions, remember the old political wisdom: Those who know don’t talk, and those who talk don’t know.)

I’d like to do a post for each of the top contenders, but the one I’m seeing the most news about at the moment is this guy, possibly because he’s being promoted as The Progressives’ Favorite:

Believe me: ‘Minnesota Nice‘ means he’ll carve you up with a smile, and then (sincerely!) ask if you need a ride to the ER…

Reader Interactions

254Comments

  1. 1.

    Omnes Omnibus

    I loved the the exchange about vegetarianism and turkey in the last video. This is the king of thing that plays well in the Upper Midwest, mostly because is natural coming from him.

  2. 2.

    Scout211

    What a nice compilation! Thanks, AL.

    Being from California, Walz has flown under the radar, at least for me and everyone that I know.  He really is looking good for the VP nominee.  In my mind, the top choice.

  4. 4.

    NotMax

    Rampant speculation, rumors and trial balloons.B lech.

    Can’t people show a little patience and wait for an announcement?

  6. 6.

    A Man for All Seasonings (formerly Geeno)

    I wasn’t sure about the older guy on the ticket visual after all the agita this campaign, but he doesn’t come off as old when you see him in action or hear him speak. He’s growing on me.

  10. 10.

    Math Guy

    Maybe I’m just betting my heart for the Home state favorite, but I’m putting my money on Walz. When we decided to move from Missouri to Minnesota, and I was meeting with a real estate agent up here and talking about what we were looking for, she just smiled and said “You also wanted to move to a blue state didn’t you?“ She was right.

  11. 11.

    Ocotillo

    @NotMax:  No, no they can’t.

    And that is a good thing.  Every second of our MSM playing the parlor game of who’s it gonna be is less time for the convicted felon to get free press.

  12. 12.

    oldster

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    That’s exactly the detail I was going to comment on. Someone who’s willing to joke about turkey being vegetarian is going to reassure voters that they won’t get their head bitten off for not knowing the latest lefty jargon.

  13. 13.

    rikyrah

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    I thought that was too cute myself.

    With what has been passed and signed, you would think that the Democratic majority in MN was huge, instead of so slim. The way they have passed good stuff like they have a “mandate”

    👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾

  16. 16.

    M31

    want:

    1. progressive bona fides
    2. government experience with actual accomplishments
    3. proven ability to beat Republicans
    4. ready and willing to call Trump & friends freaks
    5. able to be serious but also show joy

    so far Walz looks good, but not counting anyone else out, just observing for now

    but seriously “OK, turkey dogs then” is hilarious

  17. 17.

    Kent

    In the past week I’ve definitely become a Walz fan.  Not withstanding the astronaut, he frankly has the most interesting and impressive bio.  He is also (like Harris) the only one who has served in leadership at BOTH the Federal and State level as a congressman and Governor.

    • Small town humble rural origins
    • Teacher in rural and Indian reservation schools
    • Highest-ranking enlisted soldier to ever have served in Congress
    • Has gotten amazing shit done in MN without making a lot of fuss.

    He is also not nearly as old has he looks.  He was born in 1964 so like me is 60.  The grey hair and balding makes him frankly look older than he really is.

    By comparison, I’m nervous about robbing the Senate.  There is no guarantee that Democrats would hold the AZ Senate seat past 2026 if Kelly is elevated to the VP slot.  That could be immensely important if we have SCOTUS nominations or are just trying to get anything done.

    In contrast to Walz, Shapiro has a much thinner resume.  And his previous support for private school vouchers raises my hackles as a public school teacher.  We don’t need an unaccountable public welfare program for private religious schools that bleeds money away from public schools. Which is what vouchers are.  And the last thing we need is another Arne Duncan close to the seat of power.

  19. 19.

    KatKapCC

    @NotMax: From the post:

    I’d like to do a post for each of the top contenders

    This is just about making sure we know who they are, what they’ve done, etc. Information. What’s wrong with that?

  20. 20.

    MagdaInBlack

    @Omnes Omnibus: That little exchange really stuck with me too. I was already favoring him (as if my opinion matters) but for some reason that simple little quip hit home 😊

  23. 23.

    Tony Jay

    Jesus, that list of accomplishments by the Minnesota Dems would get you instantly suspended as a member from and banned for life from ever appearing on a candidate list for the newnewlabourinc corporate franchise opportunity if you even suggested copying it. Absolutely stunning.

  24. 24.

    RepubAnon

    I’m an indirect vegetarian: I eat either vegetables, or things that ate vegetables…

    ;-)

  25. 25.

    Sean

    @NotMax:

    Getting people familiar with potential candidates is good, especially when most average voters have little to no idea who these folks are.  (I doubt the final 3 framing though).

    Having them go out as surrogates and raising their profile while trashing Trump in the process is also a solid for Kamala and dems in general.

  26. 26.

    Kent

    @A Man for All Seasonings (formerly Geeno):I wasn’t sure about the older guy on the ticket visual after all the agita this campaign, but he doesn’t come off as old when you see him in action or hear him speak. He’s growing on me.

    Walz was born on April 6, 1964, which means he recently turned 60 and is only 6 months older than Harris.  Because he is balding and has grey hair he looks much older than he really is.

    Mark Kelly by the way is also 60 and Josh Shapiro is 51.  JD Vance by contrast is 39.

  27. 27.

    RandomMonster

    I honestly never had heard of Walz. But my family roots are in MN and my mom would be thrilled!

  32. 32.

    Suzanne

    Some anecdata that I find interesting: my BIL, who is a bit of a Bernie stan and honestly kind of annoying about it, moved to Minnesota a couple of years ago, and he feels really positively about Walz. I will note that my BIL did vote for Biden in 2020 and HRC in 2016, but was pretty vocal about hating it.

    If there’s someone who can appeal simultaneously to the lefty wing of the party as well as the midwestern union normies….. fantastic. I am not super-familiar with him, but he seems great.

  33. 33.

    Kent

    1964 was a very good year:

    Kamala Harris, Tim Walz, Mark Kelly, Keanu Reeves, Michelle Obama, and….me.

  34. 34.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @oldster: It also reminds me of the way my brother interacts with my niece (who is not a vegetarian, not that there is anything wrong with that).

  35. 35.

    schrodingers_cat

    The usual suspects, you know the ones who are not totally antisemitic and only protesting because their heart bleeds for Gaza hate Shapiro.

    KH should choose someone she is most comfortable with and can step in as the President if the need arises. I have no favorites

    Walz seems funny and down to earth in his interviews

    But beware the lookist and ageist Ds and the media talking heads.

  36. 36.

    TBone

    @comrade scotts agenda of rage: there is a much longer story to this vouchers issue here in PA involving the Commonwealth Court ruling and the rethuglican-controlled legislature but, since I don’t have a dog in this fight and trust the team, I won’t get into it.

  37. 37.

    oldster

    @Kent:

    I’m glad that he’s basically the same age as Harris. I’m a little worried about his cardiovascular health, but some people are just ruddy like that and have good BP nonetheless.
    His accomplishments and his quick wit are enough to put me in his camp.
    I still hope Pete will get the nod in future years, but for this year Pete is a riskier choice. Walz looks great.

  38. 38.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @RepubAnon: I was once at an army function where the dinner was delayed by some problems.  When we were finally served our salads, one of by friends loudly stated, “This isn’t food!  This is what food eats!” I am not sure how sober he was at this particular moment.

  41. 41.

    Jeffg166

    Walz is ideal for the old white voter that Biden brought to the coalition he and Harris put together.

    That isn’t my idea I got it from Heather Cox Richardson. Makes sense.

    Plus I love his labeling the GQP the WEIRDOS they are.

  43. 43.

    Winter Wren

    Had never really heard of Walz. He seems very principled, relatable and accomplished. What a great video of him at the fair with his daughter!

  45. 45.

    Mousebumples

    I’m also a fan of Walz based on what little I’ve heard.

    However, I’m voting for Harris/VP, no matter who she picks. It needs to be someone she’s comfortable with and that she can work with.

    Walz seems great to me and could appeal to lots of normie Midwestern types. But I trust Kamala Harris. 

  46. 46.

    Chris Johnson

    @Omnes Omnibus: I like hearing from the ones who I’ve never heard of and who are unexpectedly awesome.

    I didn’t have on my bingo card, ‘the Minnesota guy taking a one vote margin and then going full blast with progressive legislation turns out to be a billionaire and a VP consideration’.

    But then I wouldn’t have assumed Mark Cuban would take personal glee in crapping all over drug company prices either, yet here we are.

    I feel like there’s some percent, maybe the famed 27%, of hyper-wealthy people, for whom it is indeed just about keeping score and they figure out OTHER WAYS to keep score. Like doing social good. And then they turn their competitiveness to crapping all over their ‘peers’ and you love to see it.

    I’m just waiting for one of these guys to be like ‘AHAHAHA! WEALTH TAX! Take it all, fuck it! Take mine too! I’ll go make more because I’m not a FAKE LOSER GUY like these assholes and cowards! Do it, I want to see the look on their faces!’

    Could happen. Seems like ‘crazification factor’ for billionaires can lead to some very interesting places, where they are not acting in their class interests.

  48. 48.

    cain

    @A Man for All Seasonings (formerly Geeno):

    I’m about 4 years younger than Kamala and that guy looks 10 years older than me! Do we really want to have a ticket with another old guy? My wife loves him.

    I don’t care in the end as long as we are not weakening any beachhead on a purple or swing state. That’s why mark Kelly should be out.

  52. 52.

    M31

    @oldster: yeah, they better not have had the corn dogs before the ride!

    (or the ‘vegetarian’ corn dogs, aka turkey dogs hahahahaha)

  53. 53.

    Eyeroller

    @schrodingers_cat: I really hope it’s not Shapiro and that has absolutely nothing to do with his religion.  It’s mostly the school-vouchers issue others have mentioned, and I’ve also read he is wobbly on environmental issues.  Both positions seem to be due to heavy donor influence and given all that happened, that could be a bad look now.

  56. 56.

    Jackie

    @NotMax:

    Can’t people show a little patience and wait for an announcement?

    😂 Did you forget who you’re talking to? 🤣

    To be fair, I agree… but this is BALLOON-JUICE! 🤷🏼‍♀️

  59. 59.

    TF79

    Walz is great. He represented the congressional district where I’m from in southern MN, and he was proceeded and followed by republicans in that seat. My home county is like a 70-30 trumper place. It’s not exactly rural or a poverty stricken area (lots of 10k-40k farm towns with decent manufacturing bases), but there’s a lot of cultural antagonism toward “The Cities”.  I suspect it looks like a lot of areas in WI/MI/PA and Walz’ authenticity seems to connect well. (I played tennis and not football, otherwise I could have played against the football teams he coached at Mankato West)

  61. 61.

    TBone

    @comrade scotts agenda of rage: I lied about not getting into it about my Governor.  As I replied to you recently, he vetoed school vouchers.  As well, he is playing chess while the rethugs play checkers:

    spotlightpa.org/news/2023/07/pennsylvania-budget-josh-shapiro-education-school-vouchers-deal/

    Education makes everyone smarter.

    PA Rethugs are trying to get around this using a weasel word technicality:

    pubintlaw.org/cases-and-projects/pennsylvanias-school-funding-system-declared-unconstitutional-in-hi…

    As of July 26:

    spotlightpa.org/news/2024/07/josh-shapiro-vice-president-school-choice-voucher/

    It’s like the debt ceiling fight and the fiscal cliff bullshit in a PA microcosm.

  62. 62.

    gwangung

    @cain: I think we gain a little bit from appearances from white folks spooked by POCs. We lose a little enthusiasm from younger voters…but might gain a little bit of It back when they hear what he’s done.

    Appearances count…but so do accomplishments.

  64. 64.

    TheOtherHank

    Since we’re talking about Minnesota, I’ve got to mention the greatest series of videos that get to the soul of the state: The Minnesota All Hockey Hair Team. The high school state hockey tournament is a big deal. And hockey hair is a thing to the point that some dude started making videos highlighting the awesome hair on display at the tournament. Here’s a random video from the series: 2019 All Hockey Hair Team

    In addition to hockey, the walleye fishing opener is such a big deal that the local news shows cover the governor going fishing

  68. 68.

    Jackie

    @Baud:

    I hope we thoroughly vet their position on carnal relations with furniture.

    Also, does Walz have a cat or two??? That’s the determining factor IMO 😻

  70. 70.

    RaflW

    @A Man for All Seasonings (formerly Geeno): Walz is the same age (give or take 6 mo.) as MVP Harris.

    Walz is 60.
    Shapiro is 51.
    Kelly is 60.

    Of the three, I’m now on Team Walz. I’m not saying he wouldn’t eventually throw his hat in to be Potus, but of the three, he seems the least likely to want the top job later.

    I think that positions Shapiro well to run in future cycles for Potus. Kelly? I dunno. I get that he’s probably the ‘safest’ choice, and people like my brother and his wife might feel more comfortable voting Harris if Kelly is understudy, but I worry about what pulling him out of AZ does for Dem senate majority chances.

  72. 72.

    Eyeroller

    @RaflW: It should be fine for 2 years since I think the replacement (who by law would have to be a D) would serve the rest of the term.  The worry is who could hold the seat then (assuming they’d win).

    From all I’ve seen I am definitely on Team Walz.

  74. 74.

    bbleh

    Walz is REALLY good at OTHER-ing Republicans, which is not just overdue and well deserved but also a refreshing switch and an antidote to what is going to be a FEROCIOUS and UGLY Republican campaign to Other-ize Harris.  And he’s really mediagenic, which would help immensely, and he can actually speak small-town, which Couch Boy just can’t do, as hard as he tries.

    I’m nervous about Shapiro being (1) a little less tested and (2) Jewish — speaking of Other-ing.  And Kelly for all his astronaut cred just isn’t nearly as good on camera, which might suggest uncomfortable parallels with Biden.

  75. 75.

    The Kropenhagen Interpretation

    I know Jack and Shit about this dude’s record, but the affability is certainly infectious.

  76. 76.

    japa21

    The video with his daughter is great, but what is really endearing about it is how he thanked his daughter for going along with being videoed knowing it would be seen all over the place.
    As to his looking older than Kamala, I don’t see that turning off younger voters, They are all in for Kamala. They aren’t going to be concerned about who her VP is.
    He may do some good reassuring some white voters, but , on the whole, he’s a “do no harm” selection.

  78. 78.

    lowtechcyclist

    Make America Normal Again (MANA).

    Or to steal from Firesign Theatre:

    Kamala for President: Not Insane!

  82. 82.

    hitchhiker

    All I can say is Tim Walz looks exactly like my favorite extended family member, also from MN. Sounds like him, too.

    Walz is the midwestern guy JD Vance is trying to pretend he is — down to earth, family-friendly, normal, and competent.

  86. 86.

    hueyplong

    @rikyrah: No Senators x1000.  I’m horrified that they’re even considering the idea of removing a toss-up Senate seat and exposing it to not one but 2 elections in the short term.

    I’m for Walz.  Much as I hate playing defense, he provides the smallest target for the usual GOP bullshit, and the VP spot, as so many have noted, tends to have as its first rule, “do no harm” to the campaign.

  89. 89.

    The Kropenhagen Interpretation

    @Baud: The ability to get a lot done with slim margins does speak well to him. I’m sure the MN leg works different than the US, but I read here he has experience in Congress as well.

  91. 91.

    oldster

    @hitchhiker:

    Walz definitely has an authenticity that Vance will never have: Walz is comfortable in his skin, whereas Vance yearns for Naugahyde.

  93. 93.

    lowtechcyclist

    @KatKapCC: ​
     

    60 is not old. Just because he looks older doesn’t mean he actually is.

    I’m 70 and I’m not old, so I reckon Walz can be 60 and not be old.

    Certainly Kamala Harris isn’t old, and she turns 60 in seven and a half weeks.

  96. 96.

    RaflW

    Another reason for me as a Minnesotan to be excited for Walz as VP: “If Walz stepped down from the governor’s office to become vice president, Lt. Gov. Peggy Flanagan would succeed him and become Minnesota’s first female and Native American governor.” (StarTribune)

  99. 99.

    The Kropenhagen Interpretation

    @lowtechcyclist: On the other hand, I’ve seen people at 50 who were feckin OLD. Don’t know how or why it happens.

    I do purposefully avoid sun and alcohol just to be safe.

  100. 100.

    Sure Lurkalot

    Walz would be my pick of the 3 mentioned. Good contrast with Vance, who may be a couple of decades younger but whose policy goals belong in a previous century. Sunny and easy going contrasted with angry and arrogant.

  102. 102.

    SatanicPanic

    I don’t know any of these people well enough to care. I’m sure Kamala Harris will pick someone good

  103. 103.

    Mousebumples

    @hueyplong: I’m hoping inclusion of Kelly is a hat tip to his excellence, to get ideas from him (+Giffords) for how to win in AZ (and maybe gun control solutions), and maybe get more positive press on AZ.

    In a vacuum, I think Kelly could make a great VP. I agree, not worth risking the a Senate seat.

    I’m thinking of this similar to pro sports coach interviews. Some interviews are favors, some are Serious Candidates Under Consideration, and others are I Want To Know More.

    I also don’t fully trust reporting on this. Who’s leaking? Where is the info coming from? Is that also being tested by the Harris campaign?

  105. 105.

    KatKapCC

    @lowtechcyclist: Of course, she has the benefit of looking much younger. As I’ve said, she’s going on 60 and looks like she’s going on 50

    Although for women, sometimes looking young is not a good thing, because it brings on the condescension. But in this scenario, it could redound to her benefit.

  109. 109.

    RaflW

    @oldster: Yup. Vance is an obvious striver. Pure will to power.

    Walz, with his military career and schoolteacher past is clearly someone who gets the ‘service’ part of public service.

    Vance thinks the public (and maybe the furniture) is there to serve him.

  110. 110.

    TheOtherHank

    @oldster: ​
      I currently live in the SF Bay Area and similar to the deer season opener in Minnesota, most of the school districts have the whole week of Presidents’ Day off school. This is univerally referred to as Ski Week. I guess they got tired of dribs and drabs of kids being out all winter so they said, “Fine, everybody go skiing now.”

  112. 112.

    Baud

    @Sure Lurkalot:

    Good contrast with Vance, who may be a couple of decades younger

    Could be a positive if people actually realize Trump is old and could die, despite the NYT’s attempt to make people believe that was a uniquely Biden problem.

  113. 113.

    KatKapCC

    @Baud: But wait, I’ve been informed by Race Scholars™ on the right that she’s totally not Black. Maybe that weirdo was right and she really is a witch!!

  114. 114.

    Jackie

    @schrodingers_cat:

    But beware the lookist and ageist Ds and the media talking heads.

    A seasoned and politically EXPERIENCED 60 yr old VP is MUCH BETTER than a 39 yr old, who’s wet behind the ears with only 16 MONTHS of experience IMO!

  115. 115.

    lowtechcyclist

    @Kent: ​
     

    1964 was a very good year:

    Kamala Harris, Tim Walz, Mark Kelly, Keanu Reeves, Michelle Obama, and….me.

    And my wife!

    October 20, 1964 was a very good day all by itself.

  116. 116.

    oldster

    I just signed up for the “White Dudes for Harris” zoom tomorrow night. Will I make it? Not if I’m already asleep, or I can’t get my computer to work. But I won’t be there if I don’t sign up. So, one step at a time.
    I mean, c’mon my fellow white dudes — the gals hit 150k, and the dudes are only at 10k??? We can do better than that.

  117. 117.

    cmorenc

    I read NC outgoing governor Cooper was among those still being considered – and as a longtime NC resident, would affirm that in more normal times, he would have been an excellent choice to help deliver NC in a Presidential election.  However, in the context of the 2024 election, it seems Waltz is more likely to help deliver the upper Midwest (Minn, Wisc, Mich, Penn) than Cooper is NC, let along any additional southern states.  Kelley has a much better chance of helping deliver Arizona than Cooper does NC, but does he really improve Ds chances of picking up any additional sunbelt states (other than perhaps helping with Nevada) we aren’t already likely to carry, maybe not by any landslide but by enough?

  118. 118.

    Baud

    I bet the Blacks for Trump people will be surprised that White Dudes for Harris will actually be white dudes.

  120. 120.

    trollhattan

    Did not know who Walz was a week ago and soundbite/video clip Walz seems like a good dude with keen political instincts.

    If he’s the one, I hope he has Klobuchar’s “Minnesota nice” instincts and ability to put in the shiv while saying “Well, isn’t that nice.”

    His teen daughter will be there to keep dad grounded. The state fair video is adorable.

  122. 122.

    The Kropenhagen Interpretation

    @KatKapCC: Sometimes I reflect JD Vance being a year younger than I am, then I thank god for the blessings it has provided me.

    ETA: As far as DeSantis, I think his body is cracked by evil thoughts directed toward his extended range of neighbors.

  123. 123.

    Scout211

    @Gary K: Huh?

    ME being from California.  Sorry, that wasn’t clear.

    ETA:  Now I see that question was answered by many.  Thanks jackals!  I should have been more clear, though.

  124. 124.

    Mousebumples

    @hueyplong: I love these discussions! And I agree with not naming a sitting Senator from a swing state!

    But I trust Harris & Co. And I’ve loved these sorts of posts about the Veep stakes. Tell me more about who’s on our bench!

  128. 128.

    RaflW

    @hueyplong: “I’m for Walz.  Much as I hate playing defense, he provides the smallest target for the usual GOP bullshit”

    The GOP will get savage about George Floyd & the aftermath. Now, that doesn’t at all mean that there’s not a good path for Dems to counter all that, but I think it’s probably Walz’s biggest liability.

    That he signed trans-refuge and abortion haven legislation is not a liability, it stakes out our ground really well. I’d guess any risks from his past would have otherwise have been mined by GOP challengers for his House and Gov races.

  129. 129.

    hueyplong

    @Mousebumples: Agree.  When 5 or so were originally talked about, my knee-jerk reaction was to hope that they’re all on the team, with one as vp and the other 4 going on tv every day in support of the campaign.

  131. 131.

    piratedan

    speaking to the AZ Senate concerns if Kelly was chosen.

    Governor Hobbs has a decent bench of potential replacements:

    Congressman Stanton

    Fmr Congressman O’Halleran

    Phx Mayor Gallego (Ruben’s ex)

    Tuc Mayor Romero

    AG Kris Mayes

    Whomever the Harris braintrust selects, I am totes okay with it.  First part is to get elected and whomever they feel the most comfortable with to help improve the ticket is their judgement to make.

  132. 132.

    Chris Johnson

    @RaflW: I think him and his Lieutenant Governor coming out the next day demanding justice for George Floyd speaks really well for him, actually. I do not give a flying fuck if the GOP want to be racist about it. High time we had a referendum on that, oh wait, that’s exactly what we are having.

    Also, highest ranking enlisted man ever elected to Congress? That seems good. Probably has something to do with how he cannot be bullied away from what he knows is right.

  133. 133.

    WereBear

    @Chris Johnson: you’ve hit an important point.

    The actually self-made are confident and often more liberal, while the ones who grow up pressured to make more money for mommy and daddy can get very anxious.

  135. 135.

    Mousebumples

    @hueyplong: having candidates from swing states on the “short list” seems smart!

    Get free local media talking about how Harris is considering Local Gov/Senator for Veep. Include clips of said local politico on media hits. Seems good!

  136. 136.

    Eyeroller

    @RaflW: There’s always going to be something.  We can’t stay in a defensive crouch, might as well go with the overall best pick.

  137. 137.

    Mousebumples

    @TBone: could Barack be VP? (I don’t think he wants to job, but since he’s already been a 2 term president… I was wondering, hypothetically)

  142. 142.

    trollhattan

    @Mousebumples:

    Hmmm.

    “Now, hear me out sir. He wouldn’t be much help campaigning but you’ve got that all by yourself. He won’t say anything to embarrass the campaign, not even a little!”

    “Deal. Make this happen!”

    Thus, Trump-Dead Guy began its meteoric ascent while JD Vance sat at a Cleveland bus stop bench, pondering where it all went wrong..

  143. 143.

    FastEdD

    It just occurred to me that MVP Harris wasn’t born yet when JFK was assassinated. Probably will be the first President we’ve had that wasn’t. Not terribly important. I’m firmly in Camp TBD. Whoever they pick will be fine. I’m sure they will do their homework.

    OTOH I went to college in Minnesota, just got back from a visit. Walleye makes me salivate just thinking about it. A good hot dish is always my comfort food. Lutefisk for everybody!

  146. 146.

    grubert

    Don’t even talk about Walz leaving my state. We’ve had some real stinkers here til he came along.

    Minnesota needs to keep him.

  147. 147.

    WereBear

    It will be Walz because the other two have the capacity to damage. And he sincerely apologized to the cat people back when.

    in fact I think Walz is the perfect one to keep hammering on JD Vance and his attitudes towards childless cat ladies because he was hilarious talking about, “What were you thinking? Those cat people are very passionate. They’re gonna come after you now.”

    I was laughing so hard he gets a vote for that.

  149. 149.

    Timill

    @Eyeroller: The VP should be able to serve as President, but the 22nd Amendment is all about elections and says nothing about serving. So Obama would be eligible to be VP in my opinion.

  152. 152.

    Mousebumples

    @Eyeroller: I think he could serve 2 more years. (eg if a VP becomes President via 25th amendment they could run for reelection twice, if they served under 2 years prior to election as president, as I understand it)

    AMENDMENT XXII – Passed by Congress March 21, 1947. Ratified February 27, 1951.

    Section 1.
    No person shall be elected to the office of the President more than twice, and no person who has held the office of President, or acted as President, for more than two years of a term to which some other person was elected President shall be elected to the office of President more than once. But this Article shall not apply to any person holding the office of President when this Article was proposed by Congress, and shall not prevent any person who may be holding the office of President, or acting as President, during the term within which this Article becomes operative from holding the office of President or acting as President during the remainder of such term.

    Section 2.
    This article shall be inoperative unless it shall have been ratified as an amendment to the Constitution by the legislatures of three-fourths of the several States within seven years from the date of its submission to the States by the Congress.

    Reading that, I think Barack could be VP? But IANAL.

  153. 153.

    grubert

    @Mousebumples:

    could Barack be VP? 

    My understanding is no. The amendment limiting prez terms interpreted that way.

    Cause veep could become prez in theory, so no.

  156. 156.

    Mousebumples

    @trollhattan: and Trump wouldn’t have to worry about any plots to invoke the 25th Amendment to make the other guy President instead. Especially if Dems take the House!

  159. 159.

    KatKapCC

    @Timill: Not sure about that. The last line of the 12th Amendment says:

    But no person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States.

    A two-term president is ineligible to be president again.

    Also, folks I get that most of this is kidding, but can we please leave the Obamas alone? They aren’t wizards who will magically fix anything and everything by being part of it, and they are both very clearly done with being directly involved in electoral politics.

  160. 160.

    Mousebumples

    @WereBear: haha, I know. I don’t think either of them want to go back to active politics. I’m just curious as a mental exercise.

    Honestly, if we can clean up the USSC, I wonder if Obama would want to follow in Taft’s footsteps…

  162. 162.

    Eyeroller

    @Timill: According the amendment as posted, that sounds right, he could serve if something happened to her, but he could not run for election no matter how long he’d been in the office.

    Edit: it may be open to interpretation.  Want to throw it to this SC?  Also why?  I am not sure it would actually help all that much.

  166. 166.

    Geminid

    @hueyplong: Walz might be considered a “defensve” choice in some respects. But offensive skills also matter and I like Walz’s game.

  167. 167.

    M31

    I want Harris to float Michelle’s name, just to see the racist choads froth at the mouth and lose their shit

    oh wait, they’re doing it already

  170. 170.

    M31

    If it’s Walz, he’ll announce he has to vote by mail just so he doesn’t miss the first day of ice fishing season, and BAM he sews up the upper midwest

  171. 171.

    RaflW

    @Eyeroller: Yeah, I just wanted to point out that Walz ins’t without negatives.

    I actually think he managed the aftermath of a City of Minneapolis cop killing an unarmed Black man about as well as one can when a whole area is primed to powder-keg from previous metro-area murders by cop.

    But if Walz is picked, expect the GOP to go really shitty on how Minneapolis is still a smoking ruin (it’s not, of course), and all that jazz. They’ll find some b.s. from any VP pick, even astronaut Kelly wouldn’t escape the puke funnel unscathed.

  172. 172.

    The Kropenhagen Interpretation

    @WereBear: I appreciate your sense of compromise. Mushy centrists who didn’t really understand the stakes probably would have suggested shorts or something.

    I’ll consider your offer.

  176. 176.

    The Kropenhagen Interpretation

    I know JD Vance is a fool, but can we get some love for dogs in here too?

  177. 177.

    UncleEbeneezer

    @oldster: 10K + 1.  Just signed up.  Though I will likely have to cut out early to head to work.  Spreading the word though.

  180. 180.

    RaflW

    @WereBear: I am hopeful that Harris’s advisors (and her own, earned instincts) are clear that the decades of ‘pivot to the center’ are not what will work in a turnout election.

    Trump is not moderating one iota, so she and her eventual VP nominee don’t need to race to the center, and that past efforts to do so sometimes backfire badly in terms of keeping the Dem base energized.

  183. 183.

    artem1s

    @Eyeroller: ​ 

    I really hope it’s not Shapiro

    probably not fair and definitely based on fee-fees, but I’m getting Rahm Emanuel vibes off both Shapiro and Pritzger. I just can’t see either of them taking second position in the way a VP needs to in public. Both look like chaos waiting to happen.
    I like both Walz and Cooper because they have experience building coalitions and have had to overcome being the minority party in the state legislature. By a narrow margin I prefer Cooper (as long as his vetting doesn’t turn up anything ugly) because he’s termed out and could put NC in play. But honestly I think Walz has an edge because of his age. His demeanor and directness reminds me of Joe twenty years ago. And I don’t get that he’s all about the power and attention. I’d trust him to back up Harris no matter what. I don’t see him kneecapping her so he can grab the top spot in 4 years. I think he’d be a fearless, NFLTG advocate if Dems in Congress started any ratfucking her agenda.
    I’m honestly surprised Kelly is still on the short list. Being an astronaut doesn’t qualify anyone for the WH and we need that Senate seat.

  184. 184.

    The Kropenhagen Interpretation

    @trollhattan: Both such beautiful dogs. Labs are such great company and Huskies are just so playful and have the most beautiful eyes.

  185. 185.

    The Kropenhagen Interpretation

    @WereBear: I apologize, I may feed into anti-cat bigotry. I remain convinced the only thing stopping housecats from eating their owners is their small size.

  188. 188.

    The Kropenhagen Interpretation

    @MagdaInBlack: Such a sweet puppy and, as predicted, a labrador.

    Also this 60 year old man having a kid in middle -school is giving me hope it isn’t too late.

  190. 190.

    Eyeroller

    @artem1s: I’ve also heard suggestions/rumors that Shapiro wouldn’t be a good secondary player.  I think the only thing he’d bring to the table would be shoring up PA and Walz might do that nearly as well.  Not clear Pritzker is still in consideration.

    More have tried, but only five sitting VPs have ever won the top spot.  So it may not be a good position for somebody with major Presidential ambitions.  I suppose they all think they can overcome that–presumably Kamala did.  But she may be in a rather uniquely good position right now.  If Biden/Harris had won this year, in 2028 she’d probably be facing some more “conventional” Republican like my Governor Fleece Vest and I’m betting she’d lose that contest.

  191. 191.

    Hoodie

    I’d prefer to see a governor picked as the VP. A proven record as an executive is a plus and you’re not hurting us in Senate, which is already stacked in favor of Republicans.  I’m fine with Walz, seems like a genuine, down to earth guy with progressive credentials who could appeal to suburbanites in the midwest and a lot of other places.

  193. 193.

    scav

    I’d hope they’d spin out the choice as long as possible highlighting the accomplishments of as many candidates — also actual people actually doing actual things elsewhere — as possible.  Surf the attention, but almost as much for getting the non-picks into the media spotlight (practice, practice, immediate benefit, look at how many here didn’t know about Walz before?) as for keeping the spotlight on the presidential end of things.

  195. 195.

    Eyeroller

    @The Kropenhagen Interpretation: They wouldn’t generally eat us (unless starving) but I have a cat that gets angry at me (he was a semi-feral kitten) and swipes at me and he usually has sharp claws, and sometimes he attacks.  And I shudder to think how much damage that would do if he weighed 100 lbs rather than 10.

  197. 197.

    The Kropenhagen Interpretation

    @WereBear: You’re darn right I’m afraid of cats. It isn’t just that they’re born and bred hunters; if one scratches me, my whole sinus passage closes off.

    @Eyeroller: The notion of “what would this cat be like at 100 lb” keeps me up at night whenever I visit a cat owner.

  200. 200.

    Citizen Alan

    @Omnes Omnibus: I have used that line many times over the years. I will eat salad. But it better have a lot of protein and a lot of blue cheese dressing.

  201. 201.

    Jay C

    Just IMO: I think the most important consideration in a VP pick this time around is going to have to be their campaigning chops: getting the D ticket elected, and regardless of other accomplishments (though those are important), Kamala needs to have the most vigorous and articulate running-mate possible out there pitching the ticket. The Dems have been handed a golden opportunity this year (media hostility notwithstanding); keeping up the energy – and pushing a tough, no-apologies campaign to get that W. And “W” as in “Walz” will do just fine.

    And another thing: sadly/disgracefully/unfortunately, the Senate map does not look all that promising for Democrats this year: IMO, the best-case scenario (which, oddly, might also be the worse-case scenario) is a 50-50 tie, so a D VP as tie-breaker, like Kamala has been, is of even more importance.

  202. 202.

    oldgold

    My first consideration in selecting a VP is electoral votes.

    Minnesota is now safely in D column.  That  limits Walz’s value.

    Arizona is leaning R.  Kelly would help, but would not guarantee a win.

    Pennsylvania is a toss up.  Practically speaking, we can’t win without it.  Shapiro is hugely popular.  Probably, as VP nominee, he takes it off the table. As such, he is the pick.

  203. 203.

    Eyeroller

    @The Kropenhagen Interpretation: My google search finally found that Hope is 23 and son Gus is 17, so both well out of middle school.  But born late in life (the Walz married in 1994) due to infertility–they have been completely upfront about their struggles with IVF.

  205. 205.

    The Kropenhagen Interpretation

    @KatKapCC: Eyeroller: Well I’m about 40 now, so Gov. Walz is definitely modeling that I can make something work. I’m in my first stable, self-sustained living situation ever. So I could be on track. 

    My fall back plan was fostering when the opportunity presented.

  206. 206.

    Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony

    @artem1s: Absolutely not fair. I don’t know Shapiro, but JB is a fantastic governor.  He will be president some day.

  207. 207.

    wjca

    @Chris Johnson: Seems like ‘crazification factor’ for billionaires can lead to some very interesting places, where they are not acting in their class interests.

    Until you realize that their real class interests include things like personal survival.  A lot of their (financially only) peers don’t quite realize how narrow and crumbling is the ledge they are standing on.

  211. 211.

    Mousebumples

    @Eyeroller: I didn’t know about that. Thanks for sharing. Whether Walz is the Veep choice or not, I think his family could be great surrogates to speak on IVF and the challenges felt by individuals and couples dealing with infertility.

  213. 213.

    Eyeroller

    @oldgold: That’s the conventional wisdom but I’d like to see some studies/data on whether it actually works in practice.

  218. 218.

    Martin

    So:

    1. Electorally, he doesn’t really change the map. We likely have Minnesota locked down already.
    2. Does he reach undecided/swing voters. I think he does a bit. One of the other crises in the country right now is the school board/book ban/trans kids in school dynamic, and teachers usually play really well with voters. They are generally seen as selfless public servants, which softens the skepticism voters have for politicians (particularly those who were lawyers who are seen as career politicians). And I think that would give him an ability to speak to that side of the current moment in a way that would be hard for Harris with no direct experience in teaching/schools. I haven’t really seen anyone speak to that, but I think it would really help. This doesn’t show up very high in people’s rank of what they care about, in part because it’s generally a local not national issue, but one of the better ways to get voters to change their views is throw their kid into a political firestorm. That tends to shift their priorities. It also speaks to the ‘people are tired of all the anger and drama’. I can see him being a measured voice here. So, maybe moves the needle a bit here. Like most of the others, he doesn’t give off California vibes which will comfort some voters. I still think youth is the winning energy of this campaign, and he runs counter to that. For all the people fired up and volunteering, Walz doesn’t look like the future they are fired up for.
    3. I don’t see him firing up the base. Maybe we don’t need more of that energy, but I think that should be as broad as possible. It’s hard for black women to carry that load alone. I’d still like to see Latinos excited about a candidate, or the LGBTQ community fired up. We haven’t delivered for either of those, and this feels like the right time to.

    Again, if the electoral map is the thing you think matters most, it’s Shapiro. He’s the only guy that works in the theory that voters will put aside party affiliation to vote for a local. I don’t think that theory works nearly as well as it did 30 years ago. Put another way, I don’t think Harris provides any boost to downticket Dems in California – my district is going to be a drag out fight to replace Porter. That’s just not how politics works any more. I think policywise he’s a better pick than Shapiro and Kelly, I think presentation to voters, apart from him looking like another old white guy (and this is the ONE election we are particularly sensitive to that given how we are planning on attacking Trump), he’s really good. I don’t think he gets anyone off their sofa though. He’s fine, but he’s not symbolic of a country moving forward.

    One of the analysts said that Democrats have a lot of ‘B’ options for VP, and not many ‘A’ options. I think he’s another ‘B’. He’s fine – he won’t hurt the campaign – he’s safe. Not sure he’ll help it much though. I don’t think Democrats should risk a safe path, given that we’ve already done this incredibly unsafe thing of changing nominee, and changing it to woman of color. Audentes fortuna iuvat.

  220. 220.

    trollhattan

    @Martin: ​
    Is there a reliable record of VP candidates delivering their competitive home states? Hillary did win Virginia while losing most of the Confederacy, so that’s one. And it’s not like California was ever voting for Trump so presumably Biden did not need her to close that deal.

  222. 222.

    gwangung

    @RaflW:

    But if Walz is picked, expect the GOP to go really shitty on how Minneapolis is still a smoking ruin (it’s not, of course), and all that jazz. They’ll find some b.s. from any VP pick, even astronaut Kelly wouldn’t escape the puke funnel unscathed.

    I’ll take that option. “Don’t throw me in the briar patch!”

  223. 223.

    Starfish

    @japa21: I didn’t know anything about Walz before I started seeing the clips online. Visually, he gives off Bernie Sanders vibes, so low-information Bernie Sanders voters may vote for him based on that.

    When I saw the video of him with his daughter at the faire, he looked a lot more personable than Bernie ever appeared, so he may be better at connecting with actual humans.

  225. 225.

    jefft452

    “Corndog?”

    “I’m Vegitarian”

    “OK, turkey then”

    “Turkey is meat”

    “Not in Minnesota its not”

    Cracked me up

  229. 229.

    pajaro

    @trollhattan:

    The only example of a VP choice making a difference that I can recall is 1960, where LBJ’s Texas connections were thought to make the difference in a very close win for Kennedy in 1960.

    I am willing to trust the research and political chops of the campaign to be able to figure out whether, for example, Shapiro’s views on vouchers is a net negative in the seven states that are going to decide the election.  What I do hope is that the campaign nominates the person whom it believes has the best chance of helping Harris win.  A Trump victory must be avoided at all costs, and that absolutely includes, in my mind, choosing a Senator, if it believes  that the Senator would be more helpful than the other candidates.

  230. 230.

    Kent

    @pajaro:The only example of a VP choice making a difference that I can recall is 1960, where LBJ’s Texas connections were thought to make the difference in a very close win for Kennedy in 1960.

    Some would argue that the Sara Palin pick made a difference in 2008.  Albeit in the negative.

  231. 231.

    schrodingers_cat

    @Gretchen: Several people, mostly Dalit and Muslim have been lynched for transporting meat suspected to be beef. They have also banned beef in many of the states they rule. Plus there are temporary bans during some festivals. This never happened when BJP was not in power.

  232. 232.

    Devore

    All that should matter is picking the person that best helps Kamala win.  Period

  233. 233.

    Hoodie

    @Martin: The best “A” option I can identify is Whitmer, as so much of the energy of this campaign is coming from women and Whitmer has the added benefit of helping in the midwest and counterbalancing the California thing for normies in the midwest and south. She’s a solid, twice elected executive and it might be time for a “let the women take over, the guys have fucked everything up” type of campaign.  It’s a shame that she’s not interested.  I don’t think you want to go the Mayor Pete route.  I like the guy and there is no doubt he’s talented, but his ability to talk kind of signals that there’s just too much explaining required.  The mushy middle of the body politic tends to think heuristically, they don’t get into complicated explanations.

  234. 234.

    Eyeroller

    @pajaro: From what I’ve been seeing lately, the current conventional wisdom among political scientists is that the VP rarely helps (perhaps even in the home state) but can hurt (Palin, probably Vance).

    Someone mentioned Hillary winning Virginia in 2016 but that isn’t really an argument for a home-state advantage from the VP because Virginia had been trending purple/blue for several years by that point.  I think the Kaine pick was more to represent a reassuring, moderate white guy.

  236. 236.

    Eyeroller

    @Hoodie: An all-female ticket would be extremely risky IMHO.  I’m able to believe we will elect a woman at the top of the ticket this time but I am not keen on tempting fate.

  239. 239.

    Geminid

    @Eyeroller: I agree that the Kaine pick wasn’t about taking Virginia. I thought the rationale was adding strength to the ticket nationwide.

    The biggest problem with Kaine was that the ticket lost. The margin was razor thin though; if Clinton had won our 20/20 hindsight would tell us Kaine was an excellent pick .

  240. 240.

    Emmyelle

    Nice to see all the Kamala Joy here. I’m still licking the wounds you all gave me but I am happy for you, and happy that so many have come over to where many of us were. Welcome.

  241. 241.

    zhena gogolia

    @Emmyelle: Those of us who wanted to keep Biden as the candidate were not against Harris. She wasn’t the sitting president. If Biden had to be pushed out, I think the vast majority of us wanted Harris to be the candidate, since at least she was on the ticket we voted for.

    ETA: And a lot of wounds were inflicted on both sides. There are several people who are no longer here for that reason. I hope they come back.

  242. 242.

    Eyeroller

    @zhena gogolia: She had a lot of other advantages in the scenario that ended up playing out.  She was known.  She had access to the money and staff.  She could immediately start to campaign so we didn’t waste any more time.

    The media wanted a thunderdome convention for the spectacle so fsck them.  Certain “senior Democrats” wanted it because they wanted to clear out the administration and “move past this era” because Biden was unpopular, so they assumed that would attach to Harris.  Which it did until she started campaigning on her own and then it vanished.

    Anything but consolidating immediately behind her would have almost guaranteed a loss.  We’d already lost three weeks while Biden’s campaign was all but paralyzed.  Losing another month and possibly ballot access to Ohio (because why trust those mofos) would have been catastrophic, and we’d have ended up with a campaign by somebody with much less name recognition who’d have had to start from scratch with about two months left.

    And apparently Biden was very aware of all of this.

  243. 243.

    Dan B

    @hueyplong: Walz is a storyteller.  It means he’s a natural at ‘narrative’.   It’s essential for communication, especially in mass media.  It allows you to bring people along, to identify with the similarities or differences in your experience and to ground your opinion in those experiences.  Its been essential in advancing civil rights for all minorities.  Gay Liberation had a speakers bureau.  I told my story of feeling completely alone until I finally found gay people.  It countered the belief in the 50’s and 60’s that gay guys were just in it for sex.

  244. 244.

    Eyeroller

    @Geminid: You weren’t the one who thought that Kaine was about taking Virginia.  It might be argued that a slightly bolder choice might have helped Hillary, though probably not since the problems in her campaign were the FTFNYT, misogyny, and Comey.

  245. 245.

    Dan B

    @Martin: Walz was the teacher for the Gay Straight Alliance in Mankato.  He has the message pared down to, “It needed to be the football coach and the military guy.”  It’s a great message about the vulnerability of LGBTQ youth and how to be an ally.  It seems that every time there’s a question about his being a Straight white guy he’s got a record of doing the right thing.

  246. 246.

    schrodingers_cat

    @Gretchen: You are welcome and they also get rid of eggs in the free meal schemes that many states have for school children as soon as the ascend to power in a state.

    All this goes back to the outdated notions of purity and caste. They are retrograde and divisive just like our RWNJs.

  248. 248.

    sab

    @Dan B: I was trying to be all “I trust Kamala Harris. Whoever she picks is okay.” But I really am cheering for Walz.

  249. 249.

    columbusqueen

    Walz is the best pick by far. Shapiro is too high risk, especially with the story he swept a sexual harassment scandal in his office under the rug.

  250. 250.

    Geminid

    @columbusqueen: Walz is good on TV too. Resume and rhetorical ability will not count so much in a hundred day campaign, and he has a good resume anyway. Many people will only know Walz from his TV interviews, and he is a very capable communicator in that context.

  251. 251.

    Motoran

    @oldgold:

    Shapiro is too genocide adjacent. He would kill Harris’s momentum especially with young voters. That whole saying state stuff is overrated anyway, I think.

  253. 253.

    andy

    @RaflW: an excellent point she’s awesome. Walz is great too. retired from the national guard, veteran teacher, former congressman, governor of Minnesota who pushed a lot of stuff that’s good for ordinary Minnesotans.  He knows how to talk and lead and deliver.

     

    of course, i’m from Minnesota too. I think it’s between Walz and  Beshear.

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